for me it is not so much the weight of the bike itself but what I carry and how much of it, that is the big concern. I actually replaced my rear bag and rack about 5 hours before the 90 hour start out of concern for too much carried weight. I was glad I did.
Can you tell us what you carried on the bike? And what kind of bag setup you have?
On 8/29/07, jan heine <hein...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> People have been speculating whether I could have ridden faster in > PBP on a modern bike. The answer is no. I have ridden plenty of > those, yet chose my Singer for its performance. I had no problems > keeping up on the hills with the modern carbon bikes, because my bike > works in sync with me, what we have termed "planing". That is more > important than a few pounds.
> I got dropped from the main group at the first control when I > unsuccessfully tried to get some water. I caught back up on the next > long climb, only to have a crash all around me open a gap. I was > tired of the poor bike handling and realized that if I chased on > again, I'd use up energy I'd still need for the 950 km remaining. So > I rode by myself, stopped for water, then joined the second group as > they caught up from behind. We were 4 minutes down and catching up > when I had a flat in the rain. From then, I rode by myself, or with > one or two riders, which was nice and rather pleasant in the rain. > The crosswinds were tougher than the rain for me, and so I set myself > a goal of beating 50 hours, which meant I had to speed up > significantly on the last 250 km. This made the time go by faster.
> However, I was not unsupported - my parents joined me at some of the > controls starting in Fougeres on the way out.
> Far from retro, my Singer was probably one of the better-suited bikes > for the event. I wish I had tires wider than 30 mm on the rough > roads, but that will have to wait for 2011. I certainly had more > gears than I needed, and my modern SON lights were brighter than most.
> Jan Heine > Editor > Bicycle Quarterly > 140 Lakeside Ave. #C > Seattle WA 98122 > www.bikequarterly.com
-- Follow me while I ride Paris-Brest-Paris 2007, August 20-24th 2007!
On 8/29/07, jan heine <hein...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> People have been speculating whether I could have ridden faster in > PBP on a modern bike. The answer is no. I have ridden plenty of > those, yet chose my Singer for its performance. I had no problems > keeping up on the hills with the modern carbon bikes, because my bike > works in sync with me, what we have termed "planing". That is more > important than a few pounds.
Also, let us never lose sight of the fact that the heaviest and most performance-critical component of any bicycle is the person sitting on it. I'm always bemused by middle-aged men 30 lbs overweight who spend thousands of dollars more to get a bicycle that's a half-pound lighter.
Always remember that it's the *total* weight of bike+rider+luggage that matters.
Chip (locally famous for riding a 40-lb bike)
-- Charles M. Coldwell "Turn on, log in, tune out" Somerville, Massachusetts, New England
Along similar lines, I'm curious what other people ended up carrying on the bike, what they were glad they had, what they figured they could have left behind, and how much it all weighed. I used a handlebar bag and a saddlebag (Carradice-style knockoff), plus two bottle cages, spare tire strapped under the cages, and two LED headlights. My handlebar bag contained the battery pack for the PrincetonTec light (which has 8AA batteries; the other light uses four), chapstick, an assortment of bars, gu, and a ziploc bag of pickles. At various times it had a sandwich, baguette, or croissant living on top of the bag under the map case. My saddlebag had two spare tubes, patch kit, pump, "Alien" (multi-tool), spare 5mm and 6mm allen wrenches, lightweight space blanket-type bivvy sack, sunscreen, a little more bike food, full set of batteries for all lights, sunglasses case with alternate pair (dark for day, clear for night), a few spare velcro straps and zip ties, and whatever combination of the following clothing items I wasn't wearing: vest, rain jacket, l/s jersey, arm warmers, leg warmers, reflective sash, and probably one or two odds and ends I'm forgetting. I mounted the saddlebag on a Carradice SQR mount. Jake and I shared two drop bags, so we had clean clothes and fresh shoes and a bit more bike food. The clean clothes in the drop bags were nice, but could have been dispensed with without adding all that much to what I carried on the bike. I saw lots of riders who had tons more gear than I did, and and riders who had about as much on them as I'd carry for 50 mi on the weekend. Much as I was annoyed every time I lifted my bike and felt how heavy it was, I was satisfied with my choices of what to bring and how to carry it. And the extra weight probably didn't matter as much as it might have on a ride with steeper hills.
Anyone have any thoughts on how much weight is appropriate and what to leave behind?
> -------Original Message------- > From: Charles Coldwell <coldw...@gmail.com> > Subject: [Randon] Re: Jan Heine's bike choice for PBP > Sent: 28 Aug '07 23:48
> On 8/29/07, jan heine <hein...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> > People have been speculating whether I could have ridden faster in > > PBP on a modern bike. The answer is no. I have ridden plenty of > > those, yet chose my Singer for its performance. I had no problems > > keeping up on the hills with the modern carbon bikes, because my bike > > works in sync with me, what we have termed "planing". That is more > > important than a few pounds.
> Also, let us never lose sight of the fact that the heaviest and most > performance-critical component of any bicycle is the person sitting on > it. I'm always bemused by middle-aged men 30 lbs overweight who spend > thousands of dollars more to get a bicycle that's a half-pound > lighter.
> Always remember that it's the *total* weight of bike+rider+luggage that matters.
> Chip (locally famous for riding a 40-lb bike)
> -- > Charles M. Coldwell > "Turn on, log in, tune out" > Somerville, Massachusetts, New England
Emily O'Brien wrote: > I used a handlebar bag and a saddlebag (Carradice-style knockoff), plus two bottle cages, spare tire strapped under the cages, and two LED headlights.
If you took your handmade bag, I'd hardly call it a 'knock off'.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Emily O'Brien" <emilyonwhe...@emilysdomain.org> Subject: [Randon] Re: Jan Heine's bike choice for PBP
> Along similar lines, I'm curious what other people ended up carrying
on the bike, what they were glad they had, what they figured they could have left behind, and how much it all weighed.
Blimey! What a lot to carry. I had a small rack-pack containing a change of clothes, cold & wet weather gear (ie. cape, pertex,and arm/knee warmers), tools and tubes. My lights were dynamo. I was unsupported.
Hi Jan....it sounds like you had an incredible ride...50 hours in that weather is astounding. Congratulations.
I second the request to see what you carried along and in what bags (I assume you at least had your Berthoud bag on the front rack). This year's PBP was about the most extreme conditions in terms of what needed to be carried along from the need for extra clothes, rain gear, etc to extra food and water due to the lack of shops open at night and fewer people out along the route.
How about a list of what you carried along and how you stored it? it would be quite useful to everyone.
Again, Congratulations on a terrific ride.
Joel
On Aug 29, 11:35 am, jan heine <hein...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> The bike dates from about 1973, 700C x 30 mm tires (Grand Bois), > 6-speed freewheel on Maxi-Car hub, SON lights, Honjo fenders. Custom > Singer front rack with handlebar bag. Total bike weight including two > bottles (full), lights, racks, pump, food, spare clothes at the start > of PBP was 15.5 kg (34.1 lbs.). Most others in the lead group had > very lightweight carbon bikes with no luggage (but lights).
> >>Far from retro, my Singer was probably one of the better-suited > >>bikes for the event. I wish I had tires wider than 30 mm on the > >>rough roads, but that will have to wait for 2011. I certainly had > >>more gears than I needed, and my modern SON lights were brighter > >>than most.
> >I believe you have more than one - which one was this? Some folks > >counted sprockets in the photo of you at the ride start and decided > >it was a 6 speed; there was further speculation (not all on the > >randon list, some elsewhere) whether that was a 6-spd cassette or a > >freewheel on a MaxiCar hub.
> >I hope we get to see a more complete ride report sometime in BQ.
> >-- > >Steve Palincsar > >palin...@his.com > >Alexandria, VA, USA- Hide quoted text -
I think Jan had an article in BQ that discussed exactly this--photos of his bag, the contents, and a description of all his supplies and clothing. I think it was in the last year...
Dave
On 8/29/07, jvo...@pobox.com <jvo...@pobox.com> wrote:
> Hi Jan....it sounds like you had an incredible ride...50 hours in that > weather is astounding. Congratulations.
> I second the request to see what you carried along and in what bags (I > assume you at least had your Berthoud bag on the front rack). This > year's PBP was about the most extreme conditions in terms of what > needed to be carried along from the need for extra clothes, rain gear, > etc to extra food and water due to the lack of shops open at night and > fewer people out along the route.
> How about a list of what you carried along and how you stored it? it > would be quite useful to everyone.
My load was remarkably similar to Emily's: a small-ish saddle bag holding spare tire (I rode tubulars) and a few tools (multitool, pliers with wire cutter, small screwdriver for derailleur adjustment, spoke wrench), and a handlebar bag which held assorted bike food for emergencies, space blanket, medications/ointments, spare parts (zip ties, crank bolt, cleat bolt, etc.). One of my biggest challenges is eating enough during a ride, and the handlebar bag doubled as a feedbag, keeping snacks at hand. (Bento boxes don't work for me due to occasional knee rubs when climbing out of the saddle.)
I also carried a thin wool balaclava and some spare velcro straps (in case a pedal cleat broke). In my jersey pockets I carried a spare water bottle, pair of rain tights, long fingered gloves and rain jacket... at least for the first couple of hours before I put the tights and jacket on. Then I replaced the knee warmers I had been wearing at the start with the tights. The rain jacket I ended up tying across my torso sling-style by tying the sleeves together; this allowed the jacket to "dry" between really damp spells and keep it accessible when I needed to put it on. It also saved me the time and effort of rolling it up to stuff it back in my jersey pocket. I'm not sure I ever saw "dry" road during the ride, there were simply varying degrees of dampness -- including slugs and toads crossing the road -- so I was putting it on and taking it off fairly regularly.
Some of the clothes I wore the entire time: cycling cap (which proved indispensable in keeping rain out of my eyes), toe warmers, thermal undershirt, wool jersey. I changed shorts in Loudeac, both outbound and inbound, and I also changed batteries in my LED headlamps both times. I used the first stop to change from my original wool socks to waterproof socks. These ended up not really being waterproof, but they kept my toes and feet quite warm. With the thermal undershirt and wool jersey I found I only wore my rain jacket about half the time. When it was merely "misting" I was plenty warm, at least until I stopped (when uncontrollable shivering would set in!). I didn't worry about clean or dry clothes, other than my shorts, because they would be neither within 5 minutes of leaving Loudeac. I also found it much more comfortable to ride without gloves, but most of my pre-PBP training was done glove-less because I find wet gloves more irritating than no gloves at all. (I wore gloves from the start to Mortagne in case of accident. I also carried a Camelback for this first leg so I wouldn't have to stop for water and I could hang in with the group, not really stopping until Villanes; after that I relied on 3 water bottles, 2 in bottle cages and one in my jersey pocket. The Camelback was an old one and I left it in Mortagne.)
I used two Cateye LEDs for headlights (not sure of model #), very adequate but very dull compared to the setups of some others, two LED taillights... running one at a time so I never had to replace batteries, though I did have spares. I also had a small Princeton Tec headlamp that clipped onto the brim of my cycling cap. This was perfect for spotting arrows, helping my buddy with roadside repairs (and my own if I had needed to), and checking my 'puter for distance when I started to look forward to the next control (yes, that happened once or twice ;-).
I did not use fenders (mudguards), nor did I miss them. I have some mounted on another bike, so I know the protection they can provide. In my case my feet were adequately protected from the constant splashing, and my shins/backside were covered by the rain tights. Fenders would not have helped me at all, and I never found the temperature too harsh except when I stopped.
If I had to leave anything out for the future, I would probably pack less "bike food" as the controls were very adequate. On the other hand, there is nothing I needed or wished I had brought along.
I would love to know more about what worked, or didn't work, for others. Thanks.
This clothing kept me comfortable throughout the ride: polypro undershirt, S/S wool jersey, arm / leg warmers, vest, polypro gloves, wool socks - 2 pair, rain jacket, skull cap, cycling cap, sandals.
Similar gear (less spare tire, batteries, sunglasses, chapstick, pickles) plus spare E6 bulbs, spare derailleur cable, small pliers, small crescent wrench, TP, spare Super-Links, spare SPD cleats, advil, butt lubes / antiseptic, spare spokes, IXON light (bracket broke during ride), bandana, handi-wipes, toothbrush + paste, tire boot, carried in a rack trunk + handlebar bag.
Stuff stashed along the way: camelback, rain legs, wool arm warmers, TP.
I saw one guy at the 9:30 start wearing only a cycling jersey and shorts, no hat, helmet, or any additional gear - just a tiny seatbag. Wonder how far he got?
Eric
On Aug 28, 8:01 pm, "Emily O'Brien" <emilyonwhe...@emilysdomain.org> wrote:
> Along similar lines, I'm curious what other people ended up carrying on the bike, what they were glad they had, what they figured they could have left behind, and how much it all weighed. > I used a handlebar bag and a saddlebag (Carradice-style knockoff), plus two bottle cages, spare tire strapped under the cages, and two LED headlights. My handlebar bag contained the battery pack for the PrincetonTec light (which has 8AA batteries; the other light uses four), chapstick, an assortment of bars, gu, and a ziploc bag of pickles. At various times it had a sandwich, baguette, or croissant living on top of the bag under the map case. > My saddlebag had two spare tubes, patch kit, pump, "Alien" (multi-tool), spare 5mm and 6mm allen wrenches, lightweight space blanket-type bivvy sack, sunscreen, a little more bike food, full set of batteries for all lights, sunglasses case with alternate pair (dark for day, clear for night), a few spare velcro straps and zip ties, and whatever combination of the following clothing items I wasn't wearing: vest, rain jacket, l/s jersey, arm warmers, leg warmers, reflective sash, and probably one or two odds and ends I'm forgetting. I mounted the saddlebag on a Carradice SQR mount. > Jake and I shared two drop bags, so we had clean clothes and fresh shoes and a bit more bike food. The clean clothes in the drop bags were nice, but could have been dispensed with without adding all that much to what I carried on the bike. > I saw lots of riders who had tons more gear than I did, and and riders who had about as much on them as I'd carry for 50 mi on the weekend. Much as I was annoyed every time I lifted my bike and felt how heavy it was, I was satisfied with my choices of what to bring and how to carry it. > And the extra weight probably didn't matter as much as it might have on a ride with steeper hills.
> Anyone have any thoughts on how much weight is appropriate and what to leave behind?
> Emily
> > -------Original Message------- > > From: Charles Coldwell <coldw...@gmail.com> > > Subject: [Randon] Re: Jan Heine's bike choice for PBP > > Sent: 28 Aug '07 23:48
> > On 8/29/07, jan heine <hein...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> > > People have been speculating whether I could have ridden faster in > > > PBP on a modern bike. The answer is no. I have ridden plenty of > > > those, yet chose my Singer for its performance. I had no problems > > > keeping up on the hills with the modern carbon bikes, because my bike > > > works in sync with me, what we have termed "planing". That is more > > > important than a few pounds.
> > Also, let us never lose sight of the fact that the heaviest and most > > performance-critical component of any bicycle is the person sitting on > > it. I'm always bemused by middle-aged men 30 lbs overweight who spend > > thousands of dollars more to get a bicycle that's a half-pound > > lighter.
> > Always remember that it's the *total* weight of bike+rider+luggage that matters.
> > Chip (locally famous for riding a 40-lb bike)
> > -- > > Charles M. Coldwell > > "Turn on, log in, tune out" > > Somerville, Massachusetts, New England
>Along similar lines, I'm curious what other people ended up carrying >on the bike, what they were glad they had, what they figured they >could have left behind, and how much it all weighed.
My barbag was mainly filled with my photo equipment, DSLR, two primes, loads of cards and spare batteries. Rack pack filled with a modest (for my level) set of tools&spares, full set of spare clothes and elaborate rain gear. I started out with 3 0,5l. bottles of coke, replenishing on the go. A relatively moderate amound of food since that's readily available at the controls. In all not much more weight as during any 400 or 600. I had the advantage though of a support van in Loudeac so I had the luxury of using 6 different shorts during the whole event.
