Competition for bike mounted GPS?

[Thomas Martin]

I searched last night for new handheld mappable GPS units and found some interesting results.  My ideal road bike mounted GPS features are listed below in order of preference: 1. Lightweight and vibration resistant unit with sturdy, lightweight handlebar mount. 2. Long battery life with use of standard size replaceable or rechargeable batteries (AA). 3. Weatherproof/water resistant. 4. Properly functioning bike mode that would auto-navigate a route that a cyclist would likely choose between destinations (not like Garmin’s faulty bike mode). 5. Sensitive satellite antenna (for riding through forests, deep valleys or between tall buildings and to give accurate elevation data) 6. Large screen with energy saving features (minimal or no display between intersections unless one presses a button to turn the screen on briefly) 7. Able to handle bike trails by either integrating them into routes. 8. Affordable maps that aren’t locked to one GPS unit with affordable, yearly updates.   To date, the only units that come close in my mind are the Garmin 605/705 units. I don’t think that there is any real competition at this time. The main draw backs of the Garmin 605/705 units (2.2 inch, 176 x 220-pixel screen) are a short battery life and non swappable battery, a poorly functioning bike mode, inability to incorporate bike paths into routes, and expensive maps that are permanently locked to one GPS. While the Garmin eTrex units have replaceable batteries and are only a slightly heavier, the connection between the circuit board and battery panel is easily destroyed by road vibrations. Magellan markets several units which they claim are durable and weather proof but I am reluctant to try because of their size. If they met all of my other criteria, I would be interested but I am still waiting for someone else to report on their use for a brevet series.   The ASUS R300 is an inexpensive, small, lightweight (140 g) GPS with a 3.5-inch, 320 x 240-pixel screen and a handlebar mount accessory. The R300 has a bicycle mode, swappable rechargeable Li-Ion battery (1300 mAh), and a bluetooth and phone interface which allow you to listen to navigation instructions on a bluetooth earpiece and the GPS screen will transiently display caller ID, SMS messages received and act as a large number pad for touch screen dialing. A review in French (translated by Google) said that the device crashed several times while navigating a route and would not automatically recalculate the route if you went off track. The kiss of death is that it must be “protected from rain”, which makes is of little use on our bikes. However, this model and the Lowrance's XOG model demonstrates that the technology is almost there if they ever make a waterproof models!

[sfuller]

On Dec 30, 1:55 pm, Thomas Martin <tgm_u...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> 4. Properly functioning bike mode that would auto-navigate a route that a cyclist would likely choose between destinations (not like Garmin’s faulty bike mode).

I'd be curious what faults you've found with Garmin's bike mode.

Steve

[prestonjb]

I TOO am curious about this faluty bike mode.... Plus I would like to
know why the etrex units are not talked about...

The 605/705 suffer from a lot more problems than this supposed faulty
bike mode.

The etrex and gpsmap 60 and 76 are more "naigation" oriented than the
605/705.

The 605/705 take several minutes to calculate a vectored route and
thus are a pain in the butt to use on a brevet. The other units will
calculate the same route in under a minute down to a handfull of
seconds.

The 605/705 cannot move the cursor around the map and then press FIND
and locate gas stations or hotels or other points of interest AT
CURSOR POSITION... But the others can!!! It is kinda stupid to look
for a gas station within only your current position if you want to
know if there is a place to stop 20 miles from where you are (and
along the route you wish to travel!)

The 605/705 does not have context sensitive menus. That means that
they only have the stupid simple main menu and not a seperate more
detailed menu for each of the main screens (odometer, map, barometer,
routes, tracks, etc all have their own dedicated menus with tons of
sub menus/features that are not avaiable on the same screens of the
605/705!!

And the etrex, gpsmap 60 and 76 all run on AA batteries and also can
be externally powered (the gpsmap 60/76 use nice waterproof connectors
while the etrex uses a USB conector)..

My vote would be (based on size) that the etrex would be first ...
The brain-damanged 605/705s would follow the gpsmap 60 and then I'd
almost still say I'd take the larger gpsmap 76 over the 605/705 simply
because they are braindead for navigation...

[prestonjb]

oops... missed the etrex bone rattle comments... well not sure that
I've seen that...

I know that the GPSmaps dont have this problem... I've had two of them
(original CS and new CSx) and the CSx I've dropped so many times that
I've cracked the case and had to fill it with epoxy and it is still
ticking!!!

Also there is no comment about the delorme PN40....

IMHO my comfort says GPSMAP 60CSx is the way to go...

[Duncan Watson]

At this time if I were to get a new GPS I would most likely get a
Delorme PN40 and the bike mount for same. The open maps, ability to
add trails and modify maps, cheap map subscription, etc all would sway
my purchase away from Garmin toward Delorme.

--
Duncan Watson
Duncan....@gmail.com

[Jim Bronson]

Product information pages on the Delorme web site do not work for me, that is not confidence inspiring.  I own a 305 anyways, but still.  That doesn't make me want to switch.

--
having a blood clot is a sticky situation

[erp4599]

Thomas,

I have used a Garmin Etrex VistaCx for almost three years now and find
that it meets most of your criteria with the following comments:

4. Having a bike mode, e.g. avoid certain types of roads (or choose
certain types of roads) would be a nice feature. As a workaround, if
you create a route on a PC it's pretty easy in my experience to force
the GPS to follow the route that you want if you create the right set
of waypoints.
In addition there is now at least one website (bike route toaster)
that allows you to create a route that gets converted into a GPX track
(not a set of waypoints).
You can follow such a track on your GPS pretty easily. Granted it does
not provide instructions as to upcoming turns but that is a small
price to pay. I often turn that feature off for routes anyway as it
can get pretty annoying at times.
Bike route toaster is here: http://www.bikeroutetoaster.com/Default.aspx

5. The newer version of the Garmin etrex products (e.g. etrex Vista
HCx) have improved reception that has gotten rave reviews for its
sensitivity and speed in locking on to satellites.

7. See comments above concerning bike route toaster.

8. This is a major complaint that I have with the Garmin products.

When you say: "the connection between the circuit board and battery
panel is easily destroyed by road vibrations" do you mean that there
is physical degradation of the product components, or an interruption
of the battery current to the device?
My present unit has been immune to road vibration. The two units that
I had before did have problems shutting off sometimes when hitting
major road bumps, e.g. rough RR-crossings. The first two units (which
I returned to REI) were "VistaC" models and the most recent unit
(which I bought in March.2006) is the "VistaCx" model. I don't know if
I got lucky with the third unit or Garmin fixed a design issue with
the VistaCx.

I should mention my primary use of a GPS device is for planning routes
(including brevets) as well as recording data on rides. I don't count
on it as my sole means of navigation, only as a useful assist for
checking that I'm where I should be, where I will be going, and
collecting data. I have no interest in Bluetooth capability or SMS
messaging.

Best,
Eric Peterson

On Dec 30, 1:55 pm, Thomas Martin <tgm_u...@yahoo.com> wrote:

[Tom]

> When you say: "the connection between the circuit board and battery
> panel is easily destroyed by road vibrations" do you mean that there
> is physical degradation of the product components, or an interruption
> of the battery current to the device?
> My present unit has been immune to road vibration. The two units that
> I had before did have problems shutting off sometimes when hitting
> major road bumps, e.g. rough RR-crossings. The first two units (which
> I returned to REI) were "VistaC" models and the most recent unit
> (which I bought in March.2006) is the "VistaCx" model. I don't know if
> I got lucky with the third unit or Garmin fixed a design issue with
> the VistaCx.

The answer to why my 4 eTrex and 4 GPSMap 60 CSx (yes 8 total) units
failed, which was given to me from a highly placed person at Garmin is
physical degradation of the contact spot between the battery panel and
the circuit board due to vibration. Some of the early signs of this
degredation result from extremely brief losses of power. A more
advanced sign of this problem is the unit shutting off unexpectedly
during operation. The contact site is destroyed beyound use when you
can not turn it back on. At that point metal has been rubbed of the
contact site on the circuit board leaving the composite base, which
obviously can't conduct current. Early signs of brief power failure
are navigation errors that start occuring while riding on the road but
not when you plotted the route on Mapsource or on your gps unit before
the ride. The year when I went through a total of 8 eTrex and 60 CSx
models, I was riding an aluminum frame bike with Bontrager hard case
race lite tires. These units usually lasted less than 50 miles on PNW
chipseal! When I road smooth pavement near my home, they worked fine.
I seemed to kill these units much faster than my riding friends.
However, theirs eventually started developing the same problems. If
your unit is showing any of these signs, you are probably on the path
to complete failure. Some avoid the vibration problem by riding with
their gps unit in their pocket or bike pack but that eliminates its
use as a navigation aid. I tried mounting the larger size handlebar
mount over my gel tape which overlaid a portion of gel pad on my
handlebars and then inserting another layer of cushing beneath the
mount but to no avail. I also built a special padded cradle type mount
which allowed my last eTrex to last around 850 Km of a 1000 Km ride.
At that point the navigation errors started to occur and then
unexpected shut offs. I was told that the way that Garmin fixed the
vibration problem was the development of the 605/705 model. Maybe you
can get away with using an eTrex or 60 CSx model on a steel bike with
fat tires but I have no experiece with that.

On all of my Garmin units, using the bike mode in navigating routes
led to many more errors. When plotting a route on Mapsource in the
bike mode one not infrequently encounters undesired turns onto side
roads which end in a U turn back where you began. I also had a hard
time getting the Garmin gps units in the bike mode to choose the right
type of road when there were several options between waypoints. I
found that the car mode with a selection of intermediate sized roads
worked best for me to eliminate these maddening detours and make it
more likely that both Mapsource and the GPS unit would pick the right
road to connect 2 waypoints in the first place.

I agree that the 605/705 software is more limited than that which came
with the eTrex & 60 CSx units. I used a battery pack to circumvent the
short battery life. Others carry the charger in their drop bag and
recharge when ever possible. Many of the deficiencies of the 605/705
units could probably be quickly fixed by Garmin if there was any real
competition in this small market niche. For the reasons that I have
given above, I don't think that there is any real competition at this
point.
Tom

[Alan Johnson]

I have been using the Delorme PN 20 since it came out several years ago
and have not had any problems with it. I set up the bike routes on my
computer and transfer them to the GPS but it did take a while to figure
out how to do the route so it would give me the right instructions. You
have to add the via points (waypoints) just after the turn on the map
otherwise you may put it on the wrong side and be told to turn left
instead of right. It is waterproof and rugged. I dropped it while riding
one time with no problems. My only complaint has been with the battery
life. They normally last 12 to 14 hours.

Alan Johnson

[prestonjb]

I was a big fan of the street-atlas, topo USA and XMAP sw prior to
getting the Garmin GPSMAP 76CSx...

If I didn't already have the inestment in the garmin I'd probably give
the delorme PN40 a try.

I'm still reading about it and considering it as a possible
replacement for the GPSMAP...

I need a bit more info so I won't make a mistake like I nearly did
with the Edge 705...

But actually the only thing I'm really missing with garmin (as
attested with all of the fine brevets I've done) is the routing over
non-road (trails) which I was able to draw in when doing planning on
the laptop and the delorme sw...

I just wish the PN40 had a larger display...


I'm also a bit confused about the "travel kit" or how to externally
power the device... Can it run while the battery is being charged...
can it run if externally powered at all? Can it be externally
powered.. It almost looks like the travel kit is designed to charge an
lion battery OUTSIDE the unit... Unclear...

At least it uses AA batts... But would be nice to know that I could
provide an external power source as I do for the garmin units...

On Dec 30, 9:49 pm, "Duncan Watson" <duncan.j.wat...@gmail.com> wrote:
> At this time if I were to get a new GPS I would most likely get a
> Delorme PN40 and the bike mount for same.  The open maps, ability to
> add trails and modify maps, cheap map subscription, etc all would sway
> my purchase away from Garmin toward Delorme.

You may want to look at the RAM mount that I think is already out for
the PN40...

[prestonjb]

>
> The answer to why my 4 eTrex and 4 GPSMap 60 CSx (yes 8 total) units
> failed, which was given to me from a highly placed person at Garmin is
> physical degradation of the contact spot between the battery panel and
> the circuit board due to vibration. Some of the early signs of this
> degredation result from extremely brief losses of power. A more
> advanced sign of this problem is the unit shutting off unexpectedly
> during operation. The contact site is destroyed beyound use when you

Really? My problem was that NmHi batteries tend to be shorter than
Alkalin types and they would thus lose connection to the contact pad
(but the pad was not breaking off the circuit board).

My solution was to place a bit of folded up paper or a piece of
plastic behind the battery contact pad and since then (2004) I've not
had a problem with the two units I own...

Of course there may be some mechanical advantage of the GPSMAP 76CSx
units over the GPSMAP 60 as the former is designed for marine (and
aircraft) use whereas the etrex and 60 are designed for handheld
use...

> use as a navigation aid. I tried mounting the larger size handlebar
> mount over my gel tape which overlaid a portion of gel pad on my
> handlebars and then inserting another layer of cushing beneath the
> mount but to no avail. I also built a special padded cradle type mount
> which allowed my last eTrex to last around 850 Km of a 1000 Km ride.

I also gave up on the garmin bike mount and use the RAM motorcycle
mount..
That mount has a bit more "flexbility" or vibration damping with the
rubberised ball joints and such (perhaps).

> On all of my Garmin units, using the bike mode in navigating routes
> led to many more errors. When plotting a route on Mapsource in the
> bike mode one not infrequently encounters  undesired turns onto side
> roads which end in a U turn back where you began. I also had a hard
> time getting the Garmin gps units in the bike mode to choose the right
> type of road when there were several options between waypoints. I
> found that the car mode with a selection of intermediate sized roads
> worked best for me to eliminate these maddening detours and make it
> more likely that both Mapsource and the GPS unit would pick the right
> road to connect 2 waypoints in the first place.

I think this is more of a problem with mapsource than the GPS. I
notice that different versions of firmware and units and versions of
mapsource route differently even in car mode!!!

The solution is that if you plot on the PC then you should download
and use DEMO MODE to test to see if it routed the way you like...

After using that method my GPS has always routed exactly the way I
want...

>
> I agree that the 605/705 software is more limited than that which came
> with the eTrex & 60 CSx units. I used a battery pack to circumvent the
> short battery life. Others carry the charger in their drop bag and
> recharge when ever possible. Many of the deficiencies of the 605/705
> units could probably be quickly fixed by Garmin if there was any real
> competition in this small market niche. For the reasons that I have
> given above, I don't think that there is any real competition at this
>

Perhaps (no competition)... I like the Delorme being out there but
not sure it is the "right stuff" yet... (for me anyway)..

[Tom]

> Really?  My problem was that NmHi batteries tend to be shorter than
> Alkalin types and they would thus lose connection to the contact pad
> (but the pad was not breaking off the circuit board).
>
> My solution was to place a bit of folded up paper or a piece of
> plastic behind the battery contact pad and since then (2004) I've not
> had a problem with the two units I own...

For a while Garmin support staff were giving the possible smaller size
battery as the reason why the units start shutting off unexpectedly.
They would unofficially suggest a variety of solutions thought to fix
the small battery problem that but these solutions worked because they
increased the pressure between the battery panel and the circuit
board. Yes, that did work as a temporary solution but as you would
expect, it actually accelerated the degradation of the contact spot
and shortened the time to complete failure. Garmin engineers
determined the cause of the failures by analyzing the 7 units that I
sent back that had failed completely. I didn't wait for my last eTrex
to fail completely, I returned it to REI in exchange for a 605. If
your unit is starting to turn off unexpectedly, it is on the road to
complete failure! I suggest that you try to return it to the place
where you bought it or see if Garmin is willing to exchange it for
you.

The Garmin staff also recommended the RAM mount but that appeared to
be way too heavy to mount on a bike that I was trying to shave weight
off for long, mountainous rides. I don't mean to bash the PN40. I have
never tried it and I really like its supposed ability to incorporate
segments of point to point navigation for bike paths. The PN40 looks
very similar to the 60 CSx so I expect that it may be susceptible to
the same vibration problem.

I talked to someone in the Garmin forum who said that they soldered
wires to connect the battery panel to the circuit board and the
vibration induced failures stopped. Too bad Garmin engineers didn't
adopt that change because the limited battery life is a major short
coming of the 605/705.

[Bill Gibson]

On Tue, Dec 30, 2008 at 12:55 PM, Thomas Martin <tgm_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I searched last night for new handheld mappable GPS units and found some
> interesting results.
>

> 1. Lightweight and vibration resistant unit with sturdy, lightweight
> handlebar mount.
>

>
>
>...While the Garmin

> eTrex units have replaceable batteries and are only a slightly heavier, the
> connection between the circuit board and battery panel is easily destroyed
> by road vibrations.

I was given an etrex Vista Hcx for Christmas and certainly don't want
to destroy it with road vibrations!

Where did you learn about the problem with using a handlebar mount,
and how many cases did you find? I'm imagining a fix, and may just
keep it in the handlebar bag when the sun and heat reach seasonal
norms anyway, using the electronics to support and not replace my
superb skills with a map and cue sheet (hah hah hah).

--
Bill Gibson
Tempe, Arizona, USA

[Rando Rider]

Tom, I have used the GPS 705 quite a bit and can say I am now pleased
with it. I must admit that I almost never use Routes, instead relying
on Courses. Using Courses ensures that I stay on the official Brevet r
Permanent route - something one should never expect with a routing
feature. With a course there is no problem with bike trails (I use
Bike Route Toaster to set them up). In terms of improvements - a
swapable battery would be high on my list (I currently have a
recharger that works on the road, but is not ideal), as would cheaper
map updates. The first several months after it came out it was very
frustrating to use, but the problems it was having that affected me
have been resolved with the Garmin firmware updates.

[jake Kassen]

Bill Gibson wrote:

> I was given an etrex Vista Hcx for Christmas and certainly don't want
> to destroy it with road vibrations!
>

I really hate to get into yet another GPS discussion (flame war?) but my
answer might be helpful to others who have also recently revived a HCx.

I have mine mounted using the Garmin bike mount on a "Nub" sticking off
my stem. Either the Nub absorbs all the shocks or my GPS is immune to
the shock problem. To date I've had absolutely no problems with it
turning off and I've ridden two SR series and one 1200k. Here is a link
to a photo of my setup:

http://www.jkassen.org/C1200photos08/pages/P6280060.htm

I'm very happy with the GPS and would recommend to others without
hesitation. The "Bike Mode" is a bit too focused on minor roads for my
tastes so I leave it set to car mode and I do fine. Just don't blindly
trust it.

Unlike others, I don't often pre-program the GPS for a brevet. Rather I
leave it on so I can double-check myself if I think I'm off course and I
have interesting data to use after the ride. The cue sheet is still my
primary source for directions.

Jake

[Joe Gross]

On Thu, Jan 01, 2009 at 04:24:56PM -0500, jake Kassen wrote:
>
> I have mine mounted using the Garmin bike mount on a "Nub" sticking off
> my stem. Either the Nub absorbs all the shocks or my GPS is immune to
> the shock problem. To date I've had absolutely no problems with it
> turning off and I've ridden two SR series and one 1200k. Here is a link
> to a photo of my setup:
>
> http://www.jkassen.org/C1200photos08/pages/P6280060.htm

Your next post, of course, is to describe the neat double-stem
contraption you have, right? :)

Joe

[CRWG...@comcast.net]

I looked that the specs for the PN20 and PN40. There seem to be no bike specific features in the PN40 and it appears to have a much shorter battery life (only based on spec data). Beyond that there is no 'nice' bike mount for either. I would say the same about half the garmin models out there also.

 

unless something better comes along soon the PN20 is my next purchase.

> If I didn't already have the inestment in the garmin I'd probably give
> the delorme PN40 a try.

bad mounting, bad product support, overpriced low functionality mapware, and messed up routing features are all good reasons to un-vest your garmin baggage.

 

Has anyone tried a touch screen style (nuvo, etc.) in wet / cold conditions?

 

Paul a NER

[jake Kassen]

Joe Gross wrote:

> Your next post, of course, is to describe the neat double-stem
> contraption you have, right? :)
>

It's two "Oval" stems bolted together. Oval brand stems are ideal for
this since the faceplate bolts go in from the reverse but you can just
drill out the threads and do this with most steams. It's not the
lightest solution but works fine.

I did this because I needed a way of mounting my light and cue sheet
without taking up any additional room on my bars, which are already
cluttered with cross levers. I want my hands to have plenty of gripping
area on the tops of the bars. Here is a photo with the cue sheet holder
attached:

http://www.jkassen.org/C1200photos08/pages/P6280049.htm

Jake "Posted this before" Kassen

[Joe Gross]

On Thu, Jan 01, 2009 at 05:02:39PM -0500, jake Kassen wrote:
>
> It's two "Oval" stems bolted together. Oval brand stems are ideal for
> this since the faceplate bolts go in from the reverse but you can just
> drill out the threads and do this with most steams. It's not the
> lightest solution but works fine.

All the weight weanies on this list will miss out, then. :)

> I did this because I needed a way of mounting my light and cue sheet
> without taking up any additional room on my bars, which are already
> cluttered with cross levers. I want my hands to have plenty of gripping
> area on the tops of the bars. Here is a photo with the cue sheet holder
> attached:

I dig the dash setup. Do you find it gets squirrely or blows around on
the descents?

>
> http://www.jkassen.org/C1200photos08/pages/P6280049.htm
>
> Jake "Posted this before" Kassen

Ahh. I see that in my archives. I *really* do read every post. :)

Joe

[erp4599]

I had the same thought as Jake that the method of mounting the GPS to
the handlebar may mitigate the vibration.
On my bike I use a Minoura space grip and the GPS attaches to that.
I must say I am now a bit nervous about the longevity of my Garmin
VistaCx given Tom's post, but I've been using it on a weekly basis for
almost three years with no problems (so far).

Concerning the Minoura space grip, this is *not* the "Swing Grip"
version but the earlier model, which can be a bit hard to find:
http://www.calhouncycle.com/ProductCart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=0&idproduct=835
The newer Swing Grip model is unstable in my opinion.

Eric Peterson

[prestonjb]

>If
> your unit is starting to turn off unexpectedly, it is on the road to
> complete failure! I suggest that you try to return it to the place
> where you bought it or see if Garmin is willing to exchange it for
> you.

Interesting about the contact failures...


Perhaps mine did not fail because the unit is a GPSMAP 76CSx and also
perhaps because I placed a small piece of plastic behind (inside) the
contact thus making the contact to flex out (it is actually tough to
put in regular Alkaline AAs)

At any rate one unit is going on 5 years old and the other unit has a
large crack that I filled with epoxy when I had the GPS mount break
(before switching to RAM mount).

Also on one unit the actual battery tab broke into two parts because
of the flexing with paper before going to plastic and I actually re-
built it myself and perhaps that also has saved it from failure...

>
> The Garmin staff also recommended the RAM mount but that appeared to
> be way too heavy to mount on a bike that I was trying to shave weight
> off for long, mountainous rides.

:) I have actually decided that extra weight is OK (personally) for
PBP I was running a 35 pound rig with fenders and hub generator, GPS
with RAM mount and an external battery pack made of 8 AA batteries

And in all honesty it is not really that much if you look at the gash
in the case made from the cheaper lighter mount and the fact that I
can pickup the entire bike and shake it around by the RAM mount !!!!!

Currently my bike weighs in around 28 pounds which is about as good as
it will get with the fact that I carry spare parts, spare tires and 4
bottle cages... (actually has a mount for a 5th one but I don't use
that often.

Realize this depends upon preference but I managed 81 hours in PBP
with the 35 pound ride and it woulda been less if I (A) didn't sleep,
(B) didn't break a wheel I probably shoulda replaced before the ride
and had to wait to get a new one...

I don't mean to bash the PN40. I have
> never tried it and I really like its supposed ability to incorporate
> segments of point to point navigation for bike paths. The PN40 looks
> very similar to the 60 CSx so I expect that it may be susceptible to
> the same vibration problem.
>

Could be.... They do have specific instructions on how to use it
mountain biking... But with the use of AAs it could also have that
problem...

> I talked to someone in the Garmin forum who said that they soldered
> wires to connect the battery panel to the circuit board and the
> vibration induced failures stopped. Too bad Garmin engineers didn't
> adopt that change because the limited battery life is a major short
> coming of the 605/705.

The repair I did was not this but to simly beef up the connector
itself but if it ripped up the power trace at the board itself that
would be my solution.

[prestonjb]

I'd recommend looking into the RAM mount for the etrex. It will
guarantee that you won't see the unit bouncing down the road and
(perhaps) with the rubberized ball joints in the mount it may (for me
perhaps) be providing the needed shock-proofing

I have to admit I've not seen a etrex or other unit fail doe to
vibrations.. But I've seen an etrex run over/crushed by a truck when
the original bicycle mount failed.

[prestonjb]

That is a very unique solution... I can now see that you used a longer
bolt w nut to make this work...

I didn't need the 'cross brakes and I mount my RAM gps mount on my
aerobars.. .And my lights are mounted to a combo-brake-booster-space-
bar but that's because I have canti brakes :)

But I will have to think about this should I need even more places to
attach stuff...

So you have a stem adapter of some sort going out the bottom of the
second stem with some way to mount the E3?

JBP

[prestonjb]

The swing grip is junk...

The space grip is also avaiable as an ODM from performance bike as the
spacebar

http://www.performancebike.com/shop/Profile.cfm?SKU=22874&item=40-3582&slitrk=search&slisearch=true

On Jan 1, 6:15 pm, erp4599 <erp4...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> I had the same thought as Jake that the method of mounting the GPS to
> the handlebar may mitigate the vibration.
> On my bike I use a Minoura space grip and the GPS attaches to that.
> I must say I am now a bit nervous about the longevity of my Garmin
> VistaCx given Tom's post, but I've been using it on a weekly basis for
> almost three years with no problems (so far).
>
> Concerning the Minoura space grip, this is *not* the "Swing Grip"

> version but the earlier model, which can be a bit hard to find:http://www.calhouncycle.com/ProductCart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=0&i...

[Dark Horse]

On Jan 1, 7:08 pm, prestonjb <j...@johnandjuliet.com> wrote:
> The swing grip is junk...

Definitely,

There are all sorts of GPS/etc mounting possibilities available here:
http://www.touratech-usa.com/index.html?-session=touratech:981F115F2FA8CF0F4C0264F6E96D9BD0

And here:
http://www.aerostich.com/home.php?cat=491&xid=19854ea3ab776f6056f6ae9fd9cdb7b8

Aerostich and Touratech are very well thought of in the endurance-
motorcycling community. The sort of whackjobs who look at this:
http://news.motorbiker.org/blogs.nsf/dx/06252004085859MWEA7X.htm
and think " I can beat that".

Be sure to check out the T-shirts at Aerostich.

Dark Horse

[NickBull]

My eTrex Vista Cx is now 13,500 miles and 2-1/2 years old and seems to
be going fine. I just have it mounted on the Garmin bracket right on
the handlebars. I loop the lanyard around the bars and put the GPS
through the loop so that it has a better chance of surviving an
accidental release (though it's only fallen off once, and that's
because I was careless in attaching it).

I don't like Garmin's "one GPS one mapset" policy any better than
anyone else, but one way to think about it is that I have no fixed
investment in Garmin. When this GPS fails (which I assume it will
eventually do, like all electronic or bicycle products) then I will be
looking hard at the Delorme PN-40 (or its successor). I'm not locked
in to Garmin because their maps can't be used on another Garmin.
How's that for a stupid product and marketing design!

Nick

[Neal Becker]

I have a vista CX, but recently got a new bike with non-round carbon bars. No
way to put the bike mount on that. Suggestions?

[Dark Horse]

Most of the flattops I've seen (like mine), have a little bit of round
space next to the stem. I put a computer on one side and the light on
the other.
Other than that, I saw some things at Touratech and RAM that I could
adapt to hold a GPS on a non-round bar.
Like this:
http://products.ram-mount.com/rammount/productdetail.aspx?partnumber=RAM-B-231Z-2

Cateye also makes some very solid computer mounts that you could add
a plate to easily enough. If you can't put a standard mount right next
to the stem, then look here:
http://www.cateye.com/store/parts.php?cid=2_24

533-8589
533-8825
533-8730
The spacer raises your mount point enough to clear the stem, and is
quite solid. Adding a plate onto 533-8730 is extremely simple.

Last resort: If there is enough room under your stem, you can run a
second stem underneath with a short section of 26mm tubing and use
that for a mount. Not lovely, but highly effective.

Dark Horse