Fw: [pttfgen:4041] Busbay plan trials a success (at Ranade Inst. bus stop on FC road)

[Prashant Inamdar]

 

 

We had proposed this solution (bus stop in parking bay) long back and a few bus stops had also been shifted accordingly. Even in the concept dwg for present busbay plan it is stated in the 'Notes' that recommended location of bus stop is in the parking bay. (See attached final dwg submitted)

However after observing trials of the busbay plan on FC road, we are of the opinion that this plan would work better (than bus stop in parking bay) on congested roads with high bus frequency. Footpath needs to be sufficiently wide in this case as bus shelter will be on footpath.

 

- Prashant

----- Original Message -----

From: Jayant Joshi

To: ptt...@googlegroups.com

Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2012 4:38 PM

Subject: Re: [pttfgen:4041] Busbay plan trials a success (at Ranade Inst. bus stop on FC road)

Instead of creating bus bays, if the bus stop is pulled ahead into the "parking lane", the bus will not have to pull in and out, passengers won't have to move forward to be able to see the incoming bus from a distance, parking - autorickshaws specifically - can be allowed almost to the edge of the bus stop and the footpath / cycle track remains unobstructed. All it does it take away about 2 cars worth of parking (assuming the bus stop will cater to two buses simultaneously - exactly the number that is being proposed in the new BRT designs). In fact, if the parking boxes are painted according to rules, no parking is taken away as there is already 15m supposedly free on either side of the bus stop. No barricades are needed. The only downside - if it can be called that - is that private vehicles have to wait behind the stopped bus. But that is probably a good thing and can almost give a quasi-bus-lane without demarcating. And in any case, it isn't any worse than today.

- Jayant

On Wed, Jul 18, 2012 at 4:25 PM, Dr Adhiraj Joglekar <adhiraj....@googlemail.com> wrote:

This initiative is helpful first step, but as Harshad points out, it
has to become rooted in the psyche and become a habit. The barriers
ought to be present mentally with minimal physical grade separation
(these metal barriers are a serious hazard) - usually this is done by
applying red tarmac to bays and bus lanes.

The other thing which we on this group understand but not the lot out
there is that this design can't be scaled to all roads because the
width is insufficient. There is a common fantasy that in the West
every bus stop has a bus bay and this allows rest of the traffic to
flow smoothly - the extension of this in India is - buses should not
be used on roads where a bus bay can't be introduced and the attitude
is ''do what you want, just don't let the bus obstruct me when I am
behind it (i.e. we serve the motorised vehicles). Thus, unless this
leads to next logical step of introducing bus lanes the exercise will
have limited value on enhancing PT per se, as by it self, the
impression is that the red box has been kicked out of my way.

A

On 18/07/2012, Harshad Abhyankar <a_ha...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> A query:  Do the cops remove the barricades and put them back every day?
>  Because barricade-based improvements, esp when cops/ PMC staff has to spend
> some manpower every day (by design) have never sustained in Pune - the Laxmi
> Rd ped plaza is an example.
>
> Of course, I will be glad if they do what they are doing tirelessly, till
> people get in the habit :)
>
> regards,
>
> - Harshad.
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>  From: Prashant Inamdar <prashan...@vsnl.net>
> To: PTTF General <ptt...@googlegroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, 16 July 2012 9:11 PM
> Subject: Re: [pttfgen:4035] Busbay plan trials a success (at Ranade Inst.
> bus stop on FC road)
>
>
>
>
>
> Yes the plan is working well and we have got
> very positive feedback both from Traffic Police and PMPML. Intend to
> replicate
> it at some other critical locations.
>
> Regards
> Prashant Inamdar
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>>From: Amit  Paranjape
>>To: ptt...@googlegroups.com
>>Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 2:36 PM
>>Subject: Re: [pttfgen:4031] Busbay plan  trials a success (at Ranade Inst.
>> bus stop on FC road)
>>
>>Prashant,
>>
>>
>>I saw this first hand yesterday at FC Road. Looked great!
>>
>>
>>Amit
>>
>>
>>On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 11:53 AM, Prashant Inamdar
>> <prashan...@vsnl.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Dear All,
>>>Subject : Busbay  plan
>>>
>>>This is to inform about successful  trials of busbay plan at Ranade
>>> Institute bus stop on FC road.
>>> It is a common sight that buses do  not halt adjacent to curbside bus
>>> stops but on the road itself. This  causes considerable inconvenience and
>>> serious safety problems for  commuters boarding the bus or getting down.
>>> Traffic on road is also  obstructed. We had submitted a proposal with
>>> layout  drawings to PMC and Traffic Police for creating a busbay on main
>>> roads  with roadside parking. During discussions we had proposed that the
>>> plan  be tried out at a prominent location where serious problems are
>>> being faced  and had suggested Ranade Institute bus stop of Fergusson
>>> College road.   We are pleased to inform that the busbay plan trials have
>>> begun on 12th July  morning with the cooperation and active participation
>>> of all agencies  concerned - Traffic Police, PMPML, PMC - and have
>>> yielded good results as  under -
>>>
>>>Earlier scenario -
>>>1) Buses halting on road as clear access to bus stop not  available
>>>2) Parking adjacent to bus stop
>>>3) Driver indiscipline with buses moving in lanes  away from bus stop
>>>4) Commuters standing on the road for boarding the  bus
>>>5) Commuters getting down on the road and walking to  the road side
>>>6) Highly unsafe condtions for commuters as traffic  moving close by
>>>7) Buses halting on road obstructing traffic flow
>>>
>>>With busbay plan -
>>>1) Clear access to buses up to bus stop
>>>2) Bus exit from busbay is smooth without interfering  with the main
>>> traffic flow.
>>>3) Parking not possible in the vicinity of bus stop due  to physical
>>> barrier in parking bay
>>>4) Better driver discipline as buses have to compulsarily  move in the
>>> left half of the road to access the busbay
>>>5) Better commuter discipline and safety as commuters do  not have to wait
>>> on road and required to stand at the bus stop
>>>6) Buses dock very close to the bus stop making boarding  very convenient
>>> and safe even for senior citizens
>>>7) Buses halting in the bus bay leave a clean  carriageway
>>>8) Smooth flow of traffic irrespective of bus movement in  the bus bay
>>>(Preferably there should be 2-wheeler parking prior to  busbay)
>>>
>>>Attaching concept plan for busbay and some pictures  (before trials and
>>> during trails).
>>>
>>>It is for the first time that a  segregated bus bay has been created on
>>> normal road without any change  in bus stop position or existing
>>> carriageway lanes. Physical separators  (barricades) have been so placed
>>> before and after the bus stop that not  only has a busbay been created
>>> but any parking in the busbay  zone is  also not possible. Thus area in
>>> the bus approach and exit path remains free  of waiting rickshaws or
>>> other vehicles which used to obstruct access to bus  stop. Even if any
>>> rickshaw or vehicle does halt in the busbay, it has  to exit
>>> immediately when bus aligns for entering the busbay.  Frequency of buses
>>> being very high, vehicles do not have opportunity to  wait in the busbay
>>> area. The entire busbay length including entry path, bus  stop and exit
>>>  path is 50 metres. Two buses can comfortably halt at the  bus stop with
>>> one entering and another leaving. Thus total four  buses can be in the
>>> busbay area at the same time which is
>  quite sufficient  for smooth bus movement even during peak periods.
> Prominent busbay signage  and permanent bollards now need to be installed in
> place of barricades  to demarcate the busbay.
>>>
>>>We have actively participated in the design  and implementation of the
>>> busbay plan and have been observing  the trials for the past four days.
>>> In our opinion the busbay plan  has been a success. We consider it a good
>>> example of  team  work by citizen group, Traffic Police, PMPML and PMC.
>>>
>>>
>>>We have requested that the model be replicated at  major bus stops on
>>> arterial roads and progressively thereafter for other bus  stops.
>>>
>>>RegardsPrashant Inamdar
>>>Convenor
>>>Pedestrians FIRST--
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[Ranjit Gadgil]

The reason why bus bays have fallen into disrepute in cities like London and Singapore is because of the exiting for the bay problem. Essentially the bus has to merge back into the flowing traffic and this delays the bus. Singapore tried to remedy this problem by installing a traffic light that would turn red when the bus was about to pull out, stopping traffic behind it, so that the bus could exit w/o any delay. That did not really work.

Also the issue of "get the bus out of my way" needs to be addressed - as others in this post have already mentioned.

So overall, I still prefer the solution which pushed the bus platform into the parking lane so that the bus does not have to turn into the bus bay and exit again.

All this having been said, the issues on our streets are way too complex, so this experiment is certainly worthwhile as it also addresses issues related to safety, driver behavior, commuter behavior, motorist behavior, parking encroachment etc, which are presumably not issues in Singapore or London.

======

From the Accessible Bus Stop Design Guidance published by Transport for London (http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloads/accessibile_bus_stop_design_guidance.pdf)

8. Bus bays

Bus bays (or lay-bys) present inherent operational problems for buses and they should not be used unless there are compelling safety or capacity reasons. The Mayor’s Transport Strategy lends further weight to this view in that priority should be given, wherever possible, to efficient 'people movers' such as buses.

-- Ranjit

[Sumita Kale]

Just to update that this morning at 715am on FC Road the system was working well. I saw three buses line up properly one after the other. Though the barricades had not been put up yet, they were well within the yellow lines. There was also nobody standing there monitoring their movements, but they moved very smoothly into the lane.

Thanks

Sumita Kale

On Wednesday, July 18, 2012 7:31:30 PM UTC+5:30, Prashant Inamdar wrote:

 

 

We had proposed this solution (bus stop in parking bay) long back and a few bus stops had also been shifted accordingly. Even in the concept dwg for present busbay plan it is stated in the 'Notes' that recommended location of bus stop is in the parking bay. (See attached final dwg submitted)

However after observing trials of the busbay plan on FC road, we are of the opinion that this plan would work better (than bus stop in parking bay) on congested roads with high bus frequency. Footpath needs to be sufficiently wide in this case as bus shelter will be on footpath.

 

- Prashant

----- Original Message -----

From: Jayant Joshi

To: ptt...@googlegroups.com

Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2012 4:38 PM

Subject: Re: [pttfgen:4041] Busbay plan trials a success (at Ranade Inst. bus stop on FC road)

Instead of creating bus bays, if the bus stop is pulled ahead into the "parking lane", the bus will not have to pull in and out, passengers won't have to move forward to be able to see the incoming bus from a distance, parking - autorickshaws specifically - can be allowed almost to the edge of the bus stop and the footpath / cycle track remains unobstructed. All it does it take away about 2 cars worth of parking (assuming the bus stop will cater to two buses simultaneously - exactly the number that is being proposed in the new BRT designs). In fact, if the parking boxes are painted according to rules, no parking is taken away as there is already 15m supposedly free on either side of the bus stop. No barricades are needed. The only downside - if it can be called that - is that private vehicles have to wait behind the stopped bus. But that is probably a good thing and can almost give a quasi-bus-lane without demarcating. And in any case, it isn't any worse than today.

- Jayant

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[Prashant Inamdar]

 

Thanks for  this update abt early morning status. Good to know that buses were following busbay discipline even when barricades were not in place and supervising person was also not on duty. Shows that a proper infrastructure and a simple convenient easy to follow system brings about better road discipline. Unfortunately this is absent at most places which is one of the primary reasons for traffic indiscipline.

[Sumita Kale]

Pictures from this morning..Again, no barricades in the middle of the road and no personnel waiting to guide the buses..Will keep my fingers crossed that this stays this way but looks like the yellow markings help a lot.

Thanks

Sumita

On Wednesday, July 18, 2012 7:31:30 PM UTC+5:30, Prashant Inamdar wrote:

 

 

We had proposed this solution (bus stop in parking bay) long back and a few bus stops had also been shifted accordingly. Even in the concept dwg for present busbay plan it is stated in the 'Notes' that recommended location of bus stop is in the parking bay. (See attached final dwg submitted)

However after observing trials of the busbay plan on FC road, we are of the opinion that this plan would work better (than bus stop in parking bay) on congested roads with high bus frequency. Footpath needs to be sufficiently wide in this case as bus shelter will be on footpath.

 

- Prashant

----- Original Message -----

From: Jayant Joshi

To: ptt...@googlegroups.com

Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2012 4:38 PM

Subject: Re: [pttfgen:4041] Busbay plan trials a success (at Ranade Inst. bus stop on FC road)

Instead of creating bus bays, if the bus stop is pulled ahead into the "parking lane", the bus will not have to pull in and out, passengers won't have to move forward to be able to see the incoming bus from a distance, parking - autorickshaws specifically - can be allowed almost to the edge of the bus stop and the footpath / cycle track remains unobstructed. All it does it take away about 2 cars worth of parking (assuming the bus stop will cater to two buses simultaneously - exactly the number that is being proposed in the new BRT designs). In fact, if the parking boxes are painted according to rules, no parking is taken away as there is already 15m supposedly free on either side of the bus stop. No barricades are needed. The only downside - if it can be called that - is that private vehicles have to wait behind the stopped bus. But that is probably a good thing and can almost give a quasi-bus-lane without demarcating. And in any case, it isn't any worse than today.

- Jayant

>     group, send email to pttfgen+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.

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