Thanks for the plug for this community hack-something-useful-together tingy we did at tek, but I rather take point in this as a voice from the community. As Evert says, I listen a lot and make an opinion when I've heard all sides of a story and I think the voice of the community is a valuable asset that can be used.
@Evert, I appreciate the kind words you said here. I feel the same as you, but it were Cal Evans and Paul Jones who said I should become part in this standards group as I know what's going on within the community, the folks that use the tools and frameworks you all are working on. They express their desires and frustrations to me and other community leaders and we have no other means to deliver it upstream except the mailing list of each project. With this mailing list I can filter all these "community feelings" and suggest them once a certain topic needs decision upon. Consider my voice to be the balance in the force of project owners and project users.
Again, I'm not a community Godfather as Cal is, but I've got a tight relation with user group organizers and we share our member's feelings a lot and I believe I can provide good feedback in certain matters.
Hope this clarifies things why I requested membership.
> On Fri, Jun 1, 2012 at 2:14 PM, Evert Pot <evert...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hey Michelangelo,
> I know you a little bit, so I know we'd have a good guy on our hands who listens before speaking, and ask questions before giving an opinion.
> but.. out of principal I would probably vote -1. I strongly feel that you should be a voice for the community first before being a vote. In your specific case I happen to know you, but there have been many before that.
> Although they have the internet credentials (after some googling), it's very hard to determine the value of their contribution if their first message(s) on the mailing list is a membership request.
> On May 29, 2012, at 4:08 PM, Michelangelo van Dam wrote:
> > Dear list,
> > During TEK in Chicago last week, Paul Jones suggested me to request a membership to this group since I represent a large PHP community as president of PHPBenelux user group and involved with many professional development agencies and communities. Even though I cannot match the level of Cal Evans (nobody can match his status), I do believe I can cast a voice for many PHP professionals on an international level (Belgium, the Netherlands and Luxembourg for starters).
> > I've been following this group as silent listener, but I think time is to step up a notch and become a voice for PHP developers who are not (directly) tied to a particular framework or organization.
> > Best regards,
> > Michelangelo
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For some reason I created a storm in a glass of water, which was not my intention and way beyond my feeling towards this group and the cause this group serves. I hereby revoke my request to become a voting member and participate solely as a community voice. This way I can show this group my devotion and earn my seat at the table in a later stage. I don't seek popularism nor want to become a disturbance in this group.
So dear group, don't let my membership request distract you from your important work bringing interoperability amongst the frameworks and projects as it's no longer an issue. Go and be awesome!
> To be honest, until users participate actively in discussions, I don't see why they should be considered for membership at all. One needs not only to see they represent a community, but that they are willing to actively participate and not simply sleep until such time as a vote comes along ad then disappear again. We need to aim for quality and not quantity. This kind of slower approach also allows one to see the personality and character of potential members.
> Drak
> On 2 June 2012 09:13, Hari K T <kthar...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi ,
> First of all its a good discussion whether we need more people representing community or with projects .
> Teamphp is a collaborative communication tool that allows a group of people to share a single twitter account for broadcasting messages.
> So I feel he can open with a new member vote representing TeamPHP ?
> But the discussion should go on, for we should think whether adding more community members will bring standards or just talks. ( I am not talking about anyone over here, but more people can come say we are community members ).
> I also agree with Cal Evans "you MUST represent a project to be eligible to vote and you CAN ONLY vote once, no matter how many projects you work on."
> But Cal can continue for Michelangelo can continue for TeamPHP .
> But may be others who don't have a project can't vote , but can voice their opinion as the group is open .
> For a person to communicate in a thread there is no need of a vote :-) . At some point if we think , he is good enough we can make him also a representative from community . But without voicing on any thread we may not know anyone ( Not just saying the case of Michelangelo , I am talking in general ) .
> So concluding :
> 1 ) "you MUST represent a project to be eligible to vote and you CAN ONLY vote once, no matter how many projects you work on."
> 2 ) And if the person is active and has been contributing enough for the well doing of group , at some point lets take him also to board.
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> For some reason I created a storm in a glass of water, which was not my
> intention and way beyond my feeling towards this group and the cause this
> group serves. I hereby revoke my request to become a voting member and
> participate solely as a community voice. This way I can show this group my
> devotion and earn my seat at the table in a later stage. I don't seek
> popularism nor want to become a disturbance in this group.
> So dear group, don't let my membership request distract you from your
> important work bringing interoperability amongst the frameworks and
> projects as it's no longer an issue. Go and be awesome!
> Michelangelo
> On 02 Jun 2012, at 05:42, Drak wrote:
> To be honest, until users participate actively in discussions, I don't see
> why they should be considered for membership at all. One needs not only to
> see they represent a community, but that they are willing to actively
> participate and not simply sleep until such time as a vote comes along ad
> then disappear again. We need to aim for quality and not quantity. This
> kind of slower approach also allows one to see the personality and
> character of potential members.
> Drak
> On 2 June 2012 09:13, Hari K T <kthar...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi ,
>> First of all its a good discussion whether we need more people
>> representing community or with projects .
>> Teamphp is a collaborative communication tool that allows a group of
>> people to share a single twitter account for broadcasting messages.
>> So I feel he can open with a new member vote representing TeamPHP ?
>> But the discussion should go on, for we should think whether adding more
>> community members will bring standards or just talks. ( I am not talking
>> about anyone over here, but more people can come say we are community
>> members ).
>> I also agree with Cal Evans "you MUST represent a project to
>> be eligible to vote and you CAN ONLY vote once, no matter how many projects
>> you work on."
>> But Cal can continue for Michelangelo can continue for TeamPHP .
>> But may be others who don't have a project can't vote , but can voice
>> their opinion as the group is open .
>> For a person to communicate in a thread there is no need of a vote :-) .
>> At some point if we think , he is good enough we can make him also a
>> representative from community . But without voicing on any thread we may
>> not know anyone ( Not just saying the case of Michelangelo , I am talking
>> in general ) .
>> So concluding :
>> 1 ) "you MUST represent a project to be eligible to vote and you CAN ONLY
>> vote once, no matter how many projects you work on."
>> 2 ) And if the person is active and has been contributing enough for the
>> well doing of group , at some point lets take him also to board.
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "PHP Standards Working Group" group.
>> To post to this group, send email to php-standards@googlegroups.com.
>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>> php-standards+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>> For more options, visit this group at
>> http://groups.google.com/group/php-standards?hl=en.
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