So when is the big Library Summit?

Iain

hey iain,
 
confirmed with lisa the library summit is at 7pm at Rhizome on the 9th of may...bring all your friends as would be nice to have between 8-12 people...
 
we had a good GA yesterday and guess what we talked about...
 
see you soon  

gareth
--- On Thu, 5/3/12, iain <iain.mjba...@gmail.com> wrote:

From: iain <iain.mjba...@gmail.com>
Subject: [OVLib] Next meeting with Lisa at Rhizome?
To: "ovpeopleslibrary" <ovpeopleslibrary@googlegroups.com>
Received: Thursday, May 3, 2012, 5:47 PM

Hey guys,

So when is the big Library Summit?

Iain

--
ATTENTION LIBRARIANS!

If replying to a message sent from someone outside the group, please copy-paste their name into the "TO" field of your email client, and put "ovpeopleslibrary@googlegroups.com in the "CC" field.

Why? It's a gerry-rigged system, until we build an email system that's designed for flat organizations.

as  Gareth & Iain have mentioned we have confirmed May 9th at 7pm at
Rhizome for a library summit/meeting.   Please come if you can!  The
intent is to gather together people who have either participated in the
library in the past or would like to in the future.  We've done a lot of
work with limited resources over the last months and it would be great
to connect with folks and see where people are at and explore where we
might go from here.  We're also inviting people from some local
bookstores and other organizations.

Rhizome is a great cafe dedicated to social justice issues, and thanks
to Gareth we recently installed a bookshelf there.  This will be our
official branch 'opening'! It should be a good time :)

hope to see you all there,
Manuel

On 12-05-03 05:46 PM, gareth davies wrote:

hey lovely librarians working on a piece of process re: the ga and consensus model
any input appreciated.
 
“Unceded Coast Salish Territories”
If propaganda is defined in Oxford as:
information , especially of a biased or misleading nature,                                                                  used to promote a political cause or point of view…
(page 1410 Oxford Dictionary of English 2nd Edition Revised)
then the using the title “Unceded Coast Salish Territories”
implies native groups have taken a stand on this issue
While in fact I have only used this title to draw attention to a tactic.
 ___________________________________________________________________________ ______
“Not taking a stand in a situation with power dynamics immediately and by definition provides more power to the privileged party…neutrality =complicity”
from a brochure handed out on May day and read twice at a rally in Vancouver BC.
 
I help with the Occupy Vancouver Library and no for a fact this pamphlet was not endorsed by the community.
There haven’t been enough members for a quorum so nothing has been agreed to.
-----------------------------------------------------------*****----------- ------------------------------------------------------------
Being an individual who deeply believes in personal freedoms                                                                                          I am offended when people make decisions for me.                                                                                                                            I do not know either of the members personally                                                                                                                        and I do not know the particulars of this situation.
And I only make informed descions on important issues.
 _______________________________**************------------------------------ ----------
A person has de facto been banned from the Occupy Movement by a group who says they are acting on behalf and in the best interests of the Occupy move.    
They have not used the democratic method of consensus but have unilaterally appointed themselves to the post and have made a decision.  
This is not what democracy looks like…
The community should decisions
that affects everyone   
as banning a member does.  
 
The pamphlet states
“as a community we are thrilled                                                                                                                                                             we are dealing with these issues autonomously                                                                                                                                          and without state intervention.”
Personally I am not thrilled about the autonomous part.
“The group is not only dealing with one isolated problematic and dangerous situation but is providing a framework which we can look to the future when more problems arise. And they will arise.”
Granted problems will arise but again the beauty of Occupy was democracy.
I am not suggesting we “sweep this under the rug” “let it go” or “move on”
 but we do need to get the Occupy community engaged and functioning…
a conversation must ensue…and though it will not be enjoyable or easy a consensus must be reached.
=========================================================================== ==========As the power dynamic is at play                                                                                                                                                                  and many would argue                                                                                                                                                                      is the cause of humanities conundrum
                                                                                                                                                    it is unwise to resort to totalitarianism.       
I urge the writer of this pamphlet…    
I don’t follow the internet but people tell me it has created a buzz.
The dangers of autonomous groups making decisions that affect us all
is well recorded in history.
…it is a slippery slope
“membership” is now by a group of people                                                                                                                     who have not been chosen or elected by the community                                                                                                          which of course leads the door open
to misuses of power.  
The pamphleteer states they are “nothing short of inspiring to us concerned members of Occupy Vancouver and other radical communities in and around Vancouver.”
Well I am a very concerned member of the Occupy move and I my biggest concern is the revolution. I agree we live in sick society and racism, sexism, homophobia are still rampant. But I want the community I am a part of to deal with oppressive hierarchies not by ultimatums issued autonomously but through consensus which was agreed to at the encampment.
if you want to participate fine…if you want to run the show…not cool  
*************************************************************************** *******
Personally I am neither inspired nor motivated by this situation.
Both parties have resorted to polemics and righteousness.
Yes again we do live in a sick society
but this divisiveness mixed with righteousness
is what keeps situations like Palestine alive.
...the jews point to the holocaust as vindication…
                                                                                                     and two wrongs do not make a right.        
*************************************************************************** **********The louder voice is listened to and believed without question.
 On may day the thin labor day crowd in Vancouver heard the pamphlet read twice from the stage:
(my only polemicJ)
once by a woman who seemed earnest
and once by a man who was a bad actor     
         
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
“Supposedly the fluid community of Occupy Vancouver has been plagued by abuse, neutrality towards that abuse and even support of that abuse”.
By taking a stand in power dynamics you immerse yourself in the dialectical and de facto feed the flame.  What is required is a stance against power dynamics and their totalitarianism which must be propagandistic in nature...well at least advertising is... 

--- On Thu, 5/3/12, iain <iain.mjba...@gmail.com> wrote:

From: iain <iain.mjba...@gmail.com>
Subject: [OVLib] Next meeting with Lisa at Rhizome?
To: "ovpeopleslibrary" <ovpeopleslibrary@googlegroups.com>
Received: Thursday, May 3, 2012, 5:47 PM

Hey guys,

So when is the big Library Summit?

Iain

--
ATTENTION LIBRARIANS!

If replying to a message sent from someone outside the group, please copy-paste their name into the "TO" field of your email client, and put "ovpeopleslibrary@googlegroups.com in the "CC" field.

Why? It's a gerry-rigged system, until we build an email system that's designed for flat organizations.

I think it's fantastic, Gareth. I hope its copied as widely as the
original. I'm behind you 100%.

Iain

Hey Gareth!
It feels ages since we've spoken but I've been otherwise occupied.  
Firstly, check your small details (spacing, periods, spelling - 'know' instead of 'no', 'decisions' instead of 'descions', 'propagandist' instead of 'propagandistic').  
Secondly, I was a little lost about what you were talking about until about half way through but I get what you are talking about and agree with your sentiment.  
Lastly, I will add my two cents.  
The greatness of nature is cooperation.  When individuals work together for a common goal, whether abstract, such as making art, or tangible, such as raising a barn, the goal can't help but be accomplished so long as those individuals refuse to give in, to give up, to stop.  A community is a group of individuals inhabiting the same space, working together for a common end, that being an acceptable life.  Communities are large and small, they are the size of the earth and the size of one's family, but let us not forsake the lessons nature has taught us, there is order in all things, to attempt to form community without order is fallible at the micro level and disastrous at the macro level.  How would the earth fair if the sun decided to come closer or the moon to crumble?  How does a baby fair without a mother?  We must "run the show", if not us then who? will it be done by magic? by divine intervention?  Running the show is not a bad thing, having leaders is not a bad thing.  What happens when gathering many communities together and forging a larger, more broad one?  Do we forgo order? do we ignore the truths of nature?  The action of a community is to set goals, the responsibility for achieving them is on the individuals.  Therefore the best goals, those most agreeable to the most individuals, must be at the forefront, the top of the order, whether these goals come from one, a hundred or a million people makes no difference so long as the people agree to the aims of the stated goals, after this the rest must be left to the individuals, to those willing to do the work.  Until we, as a people, reconcile our two greatest social paradigms, those being the greatness of the individual (known by the name of capitalism) and the greatness of the community or common endeavour (known by the name of communism), there is no advancement for humankind, there can be only the fear and distrust, experienced by so many, of the possibility of the true greatness of humanity, of the evolution of the mind and body and the realisation of the power which we, humans, truly hold.  Occupy is nothing, the Statement of Unity is nothing, they are words given to an idea by those who would see it destroyed.  Let the statement simply read: Revolution - Yes or No?  For either we gather with enough force to alter our larger community in one fell swoop or we gather enough force to alter our larger community through the historically agreed upon political process.  Either way we must work together as individuals towards a common goal, all that is left is to set that goal, whether one or a thousand set it makes no difference, all that matters is the most individuals agree to work as a community, as a whole, towards that goal.  Let us not be caught up in the facades of false names and perceived positions.
Sincere Regards,
Your brother and comrade,
Simon        

Date: Fri, 4 May 2012 15:11:42 -0700
From: gareth...@yahoo.ca
Subject: Re: [OVLib] Next meeting with Lisa at Rhizome?
To: ovpeopleslibrary@googlegroups.com

hey lovely librarians working on a piece of process re: the ga and consensus model
any input appreciated.

“Unceded Coast Salish Territories”
If propaganda is defined in Oxford as:
information , especially of a biased or misleading nature,                                                                  used to promote a political cause or point of view…
(page 1410 Oxford Dictionary of English 2nd Edition Revised)
then the using the title “Unceded Coast Salish Territories”
implies native groups have taken a stand on this issue
While in fact I have only used this title to draw attention to a tactic.
 ___________________________________________________________________________ ______
“Not taking a stand in a situation with power dynamics immediately and by definition provides more power to the privileged party…neutrality =complicity”
from a brochure handed out on May day and read twice at a rally in Vancouver BC.

I help with the Occupy Vancouver Library and no for a fact this pamphlet was not endorsed by the community.
There haven’t been enough members for a quorum so nothing has been agreed to.
-----------------------------------------------------------*****----------- ------------------------------------------------------------
Being an individual who deeply believes in personal freedoms                                                                                          I am offended when people make decisions for me.                                                                                                                            I do not know either of the members personally                                                                                                                        and I do not know the particulars of this situation.
And I only make informed descions on important issues.
 _______________________________**************------------------------------ ----------
A person has de facto been banned from the Occupy Movement by a group who says they are acting on behalf and in the best interests of the Occupy move.    
They have not used the democratic method of consensus but have unilaterally appointed themselves to the post and have made a decision.  
This is not what democracy looks like…
The community should decisions
that affects everyone  
as banning a member does.  

The pamphlet states
“as a community we are thrilled                                                                                                                                                             we are dealing with these issues autonomously                                                                                                                                          and without state intervention.”
Personally I am not thrilled about the autonomous part.
“The group is not only dealing with one isolated problematic and dangerous situation but is providing a framework which we can look to the future when more problems arise. And they will arise.”
Granted problems will arise but again the beauty of Occupy was democracy.
I am not suggesting we “sweep this under the rug” “let it go” or “move on”
 but we do need to get the Occupy community engaged and functioning…
a conversation must ensue…and though it will not be enjoyable or easy a consensus must be reached.
=========================================================================== ==========As the power dynamic is at play                                                                                                                                                                 &
nbsp;and many would argue                                                                                                                                                                      is the cause of humanities conundrum                                                                                                                                                    it is unwise to resort to totalitarianism.      
I urge the writer of this pamphlet…    
I don’t follow the internet but people tell me it has created a buzz.
The dangers of autonomous groups making decisions that affect us all
is well recorded in history.
…it is a slippery slope
“membership” is now by a group of people                                                                                                                     who have not been chosen or elected
 by the community                                                                                                          which of course leads the door open
to misuses of power.  
The pamphleteer states they are “nothing short of inspiring to us concerned members of Occupy Vancouver and other radical communities in and around Vancouver.”
Well I am a very concerned member of the Occupy move and I my biggest concern is the revolution. I agree we live in sick society and racism, sexism, homophobia are still rampant. But I want the community I am a part of to deal with oppressive hierarchies not by ultimatums issued autonomously but through consensus which was agreed to at the encampment.
if you want to participate fine…if you want to run the show…not cool  
*************************************************************************** *******
Personally I am neither inspired nor motivated by this situation.
Both parties have resorted to polemics and righteousness.
Yes again we do live in a sick society
but this divisiveness mixed with righteousness
is what keeps situations like Palestine alive.
...the jews point to the holocaust as vindication…
                                                                                                     and two wrongs do not make a right.        
*************************************************************************** **********The louder voice is listened to and believed without question.
 On may day the thin labor day crowd in Vancouver heard the pamphlet read twice from the stage:
(my only polemicJ)
once by a woman who seemed earnest
and once by a man who was a bad actor    

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
“Supposedly the fluid community of Occupy Vancouver has been plagued by abuse, neutrality towards that abuse and even support of that abuse”.
By taking a stand in power dynamics ...

read more »

hey Simon,
 
Good to hear from you and i read your e-mail with interest.
 
I like what you say about community. I agree there is  nothing wrong with leaders and it seems to me the people whho are expereinced in the endeavour should be the ones running the show...i'd rather have someone explain and tell me what to do say in the case of building a barn from some one who has expereince in the building profession.
 
One of the challenges of keeping ocuppy togethor is we no longer are inhabiting physical space. Now the special interest groups seem to have the loudest voice and they are not tempered by the physical community of the occupy movement...
 
at least at the VAG you had to get a long or leave...the confines of the physical space meant people had to work out their differences...
 
but now some groups are saying this is they way it is under the guise of "I don't feel safe" and everyone has to agree with them and the way they see the community moving forward.
 
It's an old historical problem and has been used to divide the left repeatedly. The personal rights of the individual taking precedence over the health of the community         
 
Divide and conquer.
 
Hope to see you at Rhizome tonight at 7pm if your in town.
 
stay in touch
 
gareth
 

--- On Tue, 5/8/12, Simon P <simo...@hotmail.com> wrote:

From: Simon P <simo...@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [OVLib] Next meeting with Lisa at Rhizome?
To: ovpeopleslibrary@googlegroups.com
Received: Tuesday, May 8, 2012, 6:03 AM

Hey Gareth!
It feels ages since we've spoken but I've been otherwise occupied. 
Firstly, check your small details (spacing, periods, spelling - 'know' instead of 'no', 'decisions' instead of 'descions', 'propagandist' instead of 'propagandistic'). 
Secondly, I was a little lost about what you were talking about until about half way through but I get what you are talking about and agree with your sentiment. 
Lastly, I will add my two cents. 
The greatness of nature is cooperation.  When individuals work together for a common goal, whether abstract, such as making art, or tangible, such as raising a barn, the goal can't help but be accomplished so long as those individuals refuse to give in, to give up, to stop.  A community is a group of individuals inhabiting the same space, working together for a common end, that being an acceptable life.  Communities are large and small, they are the size of the earth and the size of one's family, but let us not forsake the lessons nature has taught us, there is order in all things, to attempt to form community without order is fallible at the micro level and disastrous at the macro level.  How would the earth fair if the sun decided to come closer or the moon to crumble?  How does a baby fair without a mother?  We must "run the show", if not us then who? will it be done by magic? by divine intervention?  Running the show is not a bad thing, having
 leaders is not a bad thing.  What happens when gathering many communities together and forging a larger, more broad one?  Do we forgo order? do we ignore the truths of nature?  The action of a community is to set goals, the responsibility for achieving them is on the individuals.  Therefore the best goals, those most agreeable to the most individuals, must be at the forefront, the top of the order, whether these goals come from one, a hundred or a million people makes no difference so long as the people agree to the aims of the stated goals, after this the rest must be left to the individuals, to those willing to do the work.  Until we, as a people, reconcile our two greatest social paradigms, those being the greatness of the individual (known by the name of capitalism) and the greatness of the community or common endeavour (known by the name of communism), there is no advancement for humankind, there can be only the fear and distrust, experienced
 by so many, of the possibility of the true greatness of humanity, of the evolution of the mind and body and the realisation of the power which we, humans, truly hold.  Occupy is nothing, the Statement of Unity is nothing, they are words given to an idea by those who would see it destroyed.  Let the statement simply read: Revolution - Yes or No?  For either we gather with enough force to alter our larger community in one fell swoop or we gather enough force to alter our larger community through the historically agreed upon political process.  Either way we must work together as individuals towards a common goal, all that is left is to set that goal, whether one or a thousand set it makes no difference, all that matters is the most individuals agree to work as a community, as a whole, towards that goal.  Let us not be caught up in the facades of false names and perceived positions.
Sincere Regards,
Your brother and comrade,
Simon       

Date: Fri, 4 May 2012 15:11:42 -0700
From: gareth...@yahoo.ca
Subject: Re: [OVLib] Next meeting with Lisa at Rhizome?
To: ovpeopleslibrary@googlegroups.com

hey lovely librarians working on a piece of process re: the ga and consensus model
any input appreciated.
 
“Unceded Coast Salish Territories”
If propaganda is defined in Oxford as:
information , especially of a biased or misleading nature,                                                                  used to promote a political cause or point of view…
(page 1410 Oxford Dictionary of English 2nd Edition Revised)
then the using the title “Unceded Coast Salish Territories”
implies native groups have taken a stand on this issue
While in fact I have only used this title to draw attention to a tactic.
 ___________________________________________________________________________ ______
“Not taking a stand in a situation with power dynamics immediately and by definition provides more power to the privileged party…neutrality =complicity”
from a brochure handed out on May day and read twice at a rally in Vancouver BC.
 
I help with the Occupy Vancouver Library and no for a fact this pamphlet was not endorsed by the community.
There haven’t been enough members for a quorum so nothing has been agreed to.
-----------------------------------------------------------*****----------- ------------------------------------------------------------
Being an individual who deeply believes in personal freedoms                                                                                          I am offended when people make decisions for me.                                                                                                                            I do not know either of the members personally                                                                                                                        and I do not know the particulars of this situation.
And I only make informed descions on important issues.
 _______________________________**************------------------------------ ----------
A person has de facto been banned from the Occupy Movement by a group who says they are acting on behalf and in the best interests of the Occupy move.    
They have not used the democratic method of consensus but have unilaterally appointed themselves to the post and have made a decision.  
This is not what democracy looks like…
The community should decisions
that affects everyone   
as banning a member does.  
 
The pamphlet states
“as a community we are thrilled                                                                                                                                                             we are dealing with these issues autonomously                                                                                                                                          and without state intervention.”
Personally I am not thrilled about the autonomous part.
“The group is not only dealing with one isolated problematic and dangerous situation but is providing a framework which we can look to the future when more problems arise. And they will arise.”
Granted problems will arise but again the beauty of Occupy was democracy.
I am not suggesting we “sweep this under the rug” “let it go” or “move on”
 but we do need to get the Occupy community engaged and functioning…
a conversation must ensue…and though it will not be enjoyable or easy a consensus must be reached.
=========================================================================== ==========As the power dynamic is at play                                                                                                                                                                 & nbsp;and many would argue                              ...

read more »