New RSS icon
Christian Kirbach
recently done
http://blogs.msdn.com/rssteam/archive/2005/12/14/503778.aspx
but I guess a lot of consistency work is aready going on
http://www.opera.com/security/toronto/
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Mark V
> Perhaps we should adopt Mozilla's RSS icon, just as Microsoft has
> recently done
>
> http://blogs.msdn.com/rssteam/archive/2005/12/14/503778.aspx
Typical of "iconology" the image is meaningless until you've learned
it. LOL Still, a uniform icon across multiple products and
platforms is a huge step in the correct direction.
>
> but I guess a lot of consistency work is aready going on
>
> http://www.opera.com/security/toronto/
Amazing! I would have sprung for the pizza if I'd only know. <G>
This (technical dialog) is a Good Thing!
Camus SoNiCo
It's a great thing that they can sit together to discuss security, a
major issue :D
Brian L Johnson
> In opera.wishlist Christian Kirbach wrote:
>
>> Perhaps we should adopt Mozilla's RSS icon, just as Microsoft has
>> recently done
>>
>> http://blogs.msdn.com/rssteam/archive/2005/12/14/503778.aspx
>
> Typical of "iconology" the image is meaningless until you've learned
> it. LOL Still, a uniform icon across multiple products and
> platforms is a huge step in the correct direction.
I think adopting that icon is a definite step *backwards*.
Look at the zillions of websites that already have on their pages a small
orange icon with a white 'RSS' inside to indicate an RSS feed.
It makes *no sense whatsoever* for the browser to display a *different*
icon in the URL bar.
Opera should simply change the colour of their current blue RSS icon to
orange.
--
-blj-
Mark V
> Mark V wrote:
>
>> In opera.wishlist Christian Kirbach wrote:
>>
>>> Perhaps we should adopt Mozilla's RSS icon, just as Microsoft
>>> has recently done
>>>
>>> http://blogs.msdn.com/rssteam/archive/2005/12/14/503778.aspx
>>
>> Typical of "iconology" the image is meaningless until you've
>> learned it. LOL Still, a uniform icon across multiple
>> products and platforms is a huge step in the correct direction.
>
> I think adopting that icon is a definite step *backwards*.
>
> Look at the zillions of websites that already have on their
> pages a small orange icon with a white 'RSS' inside to indicate
> an RSS feed.
Well, I'm sure those will be changed on many sites should this new
"standard" be adopted by the major clients.
> It makes *no sense whatsoever* for the browser to display a
> *different* icon in the URL bar.
>
> Opera should simply change the colour of their current blue RSS
> icon to orange.
While other browser/syndication clients move on to a "standard"? I
think not.
And does "RSS" mean anything in other languages? I mean, more than
any other arbitrary graphic image. Uniformity across platforms and
products seems overwhelmingly a good plan to me even if the graphic
is as yet widely unknown. And this one (no matter how dumb it
looks now) has no "language" argument against it. :-)
Bottom line here is a standard and uniform usage and graphical
representation, "everywhere". If that is an orange thingy with
"RSS" or a graphic that looks more like a "speakers" indicator <G>
is of no concern to me.
FWIW
--
(Opera Win32 8.51 7712 (registered); W2K, SP4; ADSL; Sun JRE 1.4.2_
08) [ and Opera 9.x P1-8031 ]
Brian L Johnson
> In opera.wishlist Brian L Johnson wrote:
>
<snip>
>> I think adopting that icon is a definite step *backwards*.
>>
>> Look at the zillions of websites that already have on their
>> pages a small orange icon with a white 'RSS' inside to indicate
>> an RSS feed.
>
> Well, I'm sure those will be changed on many sites should this new
> "standard" be adopted by the major clients.
So, just because 2 companies have decided on a 'standard', vast numbers of
people have to change their identically-displayed icons?
That seems like a fair balance. Not.
>> It makes *no sense whatsoever* for the browser to display a
>> *different* icon in the URL bar.
>>
>> Opera should simply change the colour of their current blue RSS
>> icon to orange.
>
> While other browser/syndication clients move on to a "standard"? I
> think not.
If the standard is plainly crap, there's no need to blindly adopt it.
> And does "RSS" mean anything in other languages? I mean, more than
> any other arbitrary graphic image. Uniformity across platforms and
> products seems overwhelmingly a good plan to me even if the graphic
> is as yet widely unknown. And this one (no matter how dumb it
> looks now) has no "language" argument against it. :-)
A large proportion of the web is in English. For them, 'RSS' means
something (even if only the letters R, S & S). For them, having an icon
which says 'RSS' has no downside.
For those who cannot read English, the letters will indicate nothing other
than an inexplicable pattern -- just like the trumpety, wavy, echoing icon
that Moz & MS have chosen. Therefore having an icon which says 'RSS' has
no downside for them either.
> Bottom line here is a standard and uniform usage and graphical
> representation, "everywhere". If that is an orange thingy with
> "RSS" or a graphic that looks more like a "speakers" indicator <G>
> is of no concern to me.
> FWIW
Fair enough. But if it's of no concern to you whether it's one thing or
the other, why change it from what all the web-pages already out there are
already using -- an icon which says 'RSS'?
--
-blj-
Mark V
Clearly, I saw the announcement in a different light. I have no
strong graphics preference and would applaud for some semblance of
uniformity. Why don't you write to the parties concerned and ask
them, "Why?".
Now getting a bit far from the WISH that Opera Software would adopt
something "standard", whatever that may be. I won't beat on this
any further.
Richard Grevers
<no.e...@address.invalid> wrote:
>
> So, just because 2 companies have decided on a 'standard', vast numbers
> of people have to change their identically-displayed icons?
Given that the two companies represent about 95% of market, the numbers
who "hae to change" can't be that vast. Do Safari even have RSS support?
>
> If the standard is plainly crap, there's no need to blindly adopt it.
Yes, but in this case the standard is clearly an improvement, being
non-linguistic, and having an immediate visual meaning of "broadcast".
> Fair enough. But if it's of no concern to you whether it's one thing or
> the other, why change it from what all the web-pages already out there
> are already using -- an icon which says 'RSS'?
They're not all using the same - I see "XML" a god deal of the time.
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Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
FV
20:12:58 +0100:
> Given that the two companies represent about 95% of market, the numbers
> who "hae to change" can't be that vast. Do Safari even have RSS support?
Apple has been advertizing the latest version of its Safari browser as
"Safari RSS" for some time, funny you've missed that. But indeed, Safari's
current appearance is remarkably similar to Opera's.
<http://www.nationwide.co.uk/mediacentre/images/rss-in-saf-add-bar.gif>
> Yes, but in this case the standard is clearly an improvement, being
> non-linguistic
I don't think the current RSS icon is in any way linguistic, as RSS is a
technical name for a file format. That name will be the same in all
languages, presumably, the generic name for the phenomenon being
'newsfeed' or whatever that is translated to in other languages. I don't
think English speakers have an advantage here, as it's not even clear what
the abbreviation RSS stands for anyway.
> and having an immediate visual meaning of "broadcast".
I myself find the whole 'broadcasting' metaphor for RSS a bit vague... But
that might be me.
Anyhow, an icon instead of the current technical description has the
advantage of being smaller, cleaner in the UI and not limited to the term
RSS (being only one form of newsfeeds). I think users who understand the
current term will understand the icon, users who don't won't until they
learn.
--
Fabian
James Howe
> [...]
> I myself find the whole 'broadcasting' metaphor for RSS a bit vague...
> But that might be me.
>
> Anyhow, an icon instead of the current technical description has the
> advantage of being smaller, cleaner in the UI and not limited to the
> term RSS (being only one form of newsfeeds). I think users who
> understand the current term will understand the icon, users who don't
> won't until they learn.
>
Agreed. An important point raised is the fact that newsfeeds are
currently provided in a handful of different formats including RSS, Atom
and others. Also, there is nothing to say that in the future some other
improved newsfeed format might not be implemented. Switching over from
'RSS' (or even 'XML') to an icon makes some sense. I'll admit that the
first time I saw the icon I wasn't sure what it was, but in general I
think coming up with a more generic 'broadcast' or 'newsfeed' icon/symbol
is a good thing and since at least two major browsers are going to support
it, I think that it would good if Opera supported it as well.
--
James Howe
Contact: http://public.xdi.org/=James.Howe
Roger Johansson
Mark V wrote:
> > Opera should simply change the colour of their current blue RSS
> > icon to orange.
Yes, that is the simple solution. I agree.
> Bottom line here is a standard and uniform usage and graphical
> representation, "everywhere". If that is an orange thingy with
> "RSS" or a graphic that looks more like a "speakers" indicator <G>
> is of no concern to me.
> FWIW
The speakers icon looks like that to me too, like an old symbol for
sound
output, should not be used for this new stuff, RSS, which is not sound-
based as far as I know.
The orange symbol with the letters RSS is well known even before
most of us have tried it.
--
Roger J.