Carl Kenner banned
Joshua Blake
---
Joshua Blake
Microsoft Surface MVP
OpenKinect Community Founder http://openkinect.org
(cell) 703-946-7176
Twitter: http://twitter.com/joshblake
Blog: http://nui.joshland.org
Multitouch on Windows book: http://manning.com/blake
jonas Biensack
On 9 Dez., 04:38, Joshua Blake <joshbl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Carl Kenner was banned from the OpenKinect group for his previous
> posting. He was warned before about his posting his political and racist
> views. I have also removed his post (and Nink's reply since it quoted) from
> the online archive.
>
> I apologize if anyone was offended by this individual.
>
> Thanks,
> Josh
>
> ---
> Joshua Blake
> Microsoft Surface MVP
Mohamed Ikbel Boulabiar
> Carl Kenner was banned from the OpenKinect group for his previous
> posting. He was warned before about his posting his political and racist
> views. I have also removed his post (and Nink's reply since it quoted) from
> the online archive.
>
> I apologize if anyone was offended by this individual.
I think banning people is a decision which should be taken by more
than just one person.
Robot spam can be removed directly but I don't think this is
appropriate for humans.
He may don't know a good way to express his opinions, but software
licenses can contain "no military use":
http://www.linux.com/archive/feed/56426
And he may wanted to warns about this.
Banning won't make him change his ideas, but a discussion can.
i
Simon Biggs
Sent from my phone
Simon
Simon Biggs
www.littlepig.org.uk
Edinburgh College of Art (eca) is a charity registered in Scotland, number SC009201
David Hubbard
I also agree with you. But how exactly? Vote the "off the island?"
In this case, Joshua Blake and Nink makes "more than just one person." Just sayin...
So what do you think of voting? Since Joshua Blake owns the list, it's really up to him.
Here's how I would do a ban vote:
If I'm being a nuisance and someone wants me banned, they have to get Joshua to agree that there's a good reason. Then he sets up a vote. If during the voting period, there are two people who speak in my favor, I'm not banned.
(That way, those who want me banned don't have to do anything beyond get Joshua to agree. And it doesn't discriminate against a minority -- it just discriminates against the lone troll.)
Just an idea...
Thanks,
David
Nink
In terms of a "vote" minority groups are not adequatly represented by a vote. Example the question for vote is "who should have more rights men or woman in this group?". The 3 woman will vote woman the 1272 men will vote men.
The current situation at the moment under review was the second occurrence, the previous issue was centred around religious persecution. The issue arose when a members signature pointed to the fact they worked for a religious organization. Carl had expressed his concerns with this particular religion. This resulted in several calls for a ban and the final decision was a warning.
I am sure we all have personal, political, gender, race or religious differences and that's the joy of being part of a global diverse team. We can put these all aside and suddenly we discover everyone has a lot to bring to this initiative irrespective of our political opinions, country of residence, gender or gender preference, religious affiliation, race or other difference that are often used to form the bases of discrimination.
Humanity takes a step forward and we get some amaizing NI technology.
Sent from my BlackBerry
Mohamed Ikbel Boulabiar
But if someone is making trouble, there are better ways to deal with
him other than banning.
I don't think that you toss your brother in the sea when he become a
nuisance, better learn him that what he is doing is wrong.
i
Jason
> On Thu, Dec 9, 2010 at 4:38 AM, Joshua Blake <josh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Carl Kenner was banned from the OpenKinect group for his previous
>> posting. He was warned before about his posting his political and racist
>> views. I have also removed his post (and Nink's reply since it quoted) from
>> the online archive.
>>
How about my inbox?
>> I apologize if anyone was offended by this individual.
>
If you don't appreciate the fact that people are different and have
different views (especially those you vehemently disagree with), then
get off the net and live in a cave.
Mailinglists have been around _long_ before forums, or even the web.
"Don't feed the troll" has been the best solution to arise out of that
vibrant ecosystem. "Banning" smacks of bureaucratic bullying at best,
draconian intolerance at worst.
> Banning won't make him change his ideas, but a discussion can.
>
Which, while correct, would be off-topic here. I've said my piece.
Censorship sucks.
jm2c,
Jason.
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right
to say it."
-Evelyn Beatrice Hall on Voltaire
David Hubbard
Now that I've read some more responses, I've changed my mind. Thanks
for pointing that out - I wouldn't throw a brother into the sea. I
agree.
"Don't feed the troll," Jason says.
I think we shouldn't ban anyone. If their message is off topic or
offends me, I'll ignore it.
Thanks,
David
drew.m...@gmail.com
> On 12/09/2010 04:10 AM, Mohamed Ikbel Boulabiar wrote:
>> On Thu, Dec 9, 2010 at 4:38 AM, Joshua Blake <josh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Carl Kenner was banned from the OpenKinect group for his previous
>>> posting. He was warned before about his posting his political and racist
>>> views. I have also removed his post (and Nink's reply since it quoted) from
>>> the online archive.
>>>
>
> different views (especially those you vehemently disagree with), then
> get off the net and live in a cave.
He is welcome to express them rationally and cogently, which he chose not to do.
> Mailinglists have been around _long_ before forums, or even the web.
> "Don't feed the troll" has been the best solution to arise out of that
> vibrant ecosystem. "Banning" smacks of bureaucratic bullying at best,
> draconian intolerance at worst.
Again: warning was given. He was welcome to choose to express his
views in an appeal to reason or in another forum. Hijacking other
discussion threads is not an appropriate way to discuss your topic of
interest.
>> Banning won't make him change his ideas, but a discussion can.
>>
>
> Which, while correct, would be off-topic here. I've said my piece.
> Censorship sucks.
So does having valuable contributors avoid or leave your community
because they find it hostile. There are two sides to that coin, and
this applies to demographics beyond race - read [1]. It's not just a
matter of "don't feed the trolls" - just having the trolls around
hurts the community.
Rational, productive disagreement is valuable, and should be
encouraged. The postings in question were condescending, racially
charged, avoided logic, and were hostile. Maybe a straight-up ban was
too much here, but I'm unconvinced.
-Drew (zarvox)
[1] http://eaves.ca/2009/07/20/women-in-open-source-the-canary-in-the-coal-mine/
Simon Biggs
of a state and its political and military policies. Criticising a state or
its activities does not represent racial discrimination.
It is wise to avoid conflating a state with racial identity. Any state that
defines itself through religious or ethnic identity will, by definition,
exclude others from being members of the state. That is discrimination. In
most countries that is illegal.
I didn't actually find the original post offensive. It simply described the
relationships between certain individuals involved in the development of the
Kinect and a state apparatus that many (myself included) find disturbing.
Best
Simon
Simon Biggs
s.b...@eca.ac.uk si...@littlepig.org.uk
Skype: simonbiggsuk
http://www.littlepig.org.uk/
Research Professor edinburgh college of art
http://www.eca.ac.uk/
Creative Interdisciplinary Research in CoLlaborative Environments
http://www.eca.ac.uk/circle/
Electronic Literature as a Model of Creativity and Innovation in Practice
http://www.elmcip.net/
Centre for Film, Performance and Media Arts
http://www.ed.ac.uk/schools-departments/film-performance-media-arts
> From: Nink <nin...@gmail.com>
> Reply-To: <openk...@googlegroups.com>
> Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2010 17:47:13 +0000
> To: <openk...@googlegroups.com>
> Subject: Re: [OpenKinect] Carl Kenner banned
>
> I would suggest immediate suspension to stop further comments and review as a
> team.
>
> In terms of a "vote" minority groups are not adequatly represented by a vote.
> Example the question for vote is "who should have more rights men or woman in
> this group?". The 3 woman will vote woman the 1272 men will vote men.
>
> The current situation at the moment under review was the second occurrence,
> the previous issue was centred around religious persecution. The issue arose
> when a members signature pointed to the fact they worked for a religious
> organization. Carl had expressed his concerns with this particular religion.
> This resulted in several calls for a ban and the final decision was a warning.
>
> I am sure we all have personal, political, gender, race or religious
> differences and that's the joy of being part of a global diverse team. We can
> put these all aside and suddenly we discover everyone has a lot to bring to
> this initiative irrespective of our political opinions, country of residence,
> gender or gender preference, religious affiliation, race or other difference
> that are often used to form the bases of discrimination.
>
> Humanity takes a step forward and we get some amaizing NI technology.
>
>
>
>
> Sent from my BlackBerry
>
Edinburgh College of Art (eca) is a charity registered in Scotland, number SC009201
Jeremiah Morrill
Microsoft MVP - Client Application Development
Antonio Ospite
Jason <openk...@lakedaemon.net> wrote:
[...]
> >> I apologize if anyone was offended by this individual.
> >
>
> If you don't appreciate the fact that people are different and have
> different views (especially those you vehemently disagree with), then
> get off the net and live in a cave.
>
> Mailinglists have been around _long_ before forums, or even the web.
> "Don't feed the troll" has been the best solution to arise out of that
> vibrant ecosystem. "Banning" smacks of bureaucratic bullying at best,
> draconian intolerance at worst.
>
Jason, you saved me some typing. :)
Ciao,
Antonio
--
Antonio Ospite
http://ao2.it
PGP public key ID: 0x4553B001
A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
Dave Pentecost
jonas Biensack
>It's not just a
matter of "don't feed the trolls" - just having the trolls around
hurts the community. <
there is a difference if somebody don't want to help some military (I
think they laugh about our work, when they look
at their own 3d scanners & software) or just denounce everybody who is
an a piecefull mailing list sharing their hobby
building crazy stuff with the kinect. Would you denounce Einstein as
the devil, because of he made the way free for
hiroshima?
No never.
If someone wants to help us! - You are welcome!
If someone wants to talk to us! - You are welcome!
If someone wants to denounce us! - You are not welcome - I am
married! :)
Let's have some fun!
greetz to the world
in peace jonas
>
> --
> Director, Technology
> Center for Communityhttp://www.girlsclub.org/building
>
> Community Basehttp://c4c.posterous.com
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>
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