I remember years ago, in one of my previous lives, the manager of a
steel plant I worked at said that removing 80% of pollution was
relatively economical, but removing 85% cost twice as much and
removing 90% cost 10 times as much.
The same thing is obviously true when it comes to protecting Americans
against terrorist attacks. If we start screaming like frightened
little girls every time a few Americans are killed, our politicians
will simply start spending more and more and more money on Homeland
Security and the CIA and FBI and the military, in an attempt to get
down to zero casualties.
About half of our income-tax money already goes to military spending,
and then a bunch goes to Homeland Security, etc. Then too, there's the
huge cost of medical care, money for Big Oil, and the money we need to
save for retirement, and in the meantime, wages for the working class
are going down. So, what are we supposed to do? Based on the current
line of propaganda, it looks to me like we're supposed to give up our
retirement and medical care, and let our kids teeth rot out, so that
we can keep feeding the insatiable military/industrial/Homeland
Security complex.
Where did you ever get the idea that medical care is a
responsibility of the Federal Government. If it is, then consider yourself
royally screwed as medical efficacy drops to the level of other Federal
bureaucratic agencies.
Please don't use that tired old erroneous saw about promoting the
general welfare. That does NOT mean the welfare state, cradle to grave,
government nanny state that progressives profess that it does.
Do you really live in a world in which the government or other
entities owes you anything for which a specific contractual agreement has
been executed between yourself and that entity. Do you really deny that the
responsibility for yourself and your welfare is yours alone? If not, then
you apparently do not seek maturity and adulthood or independence.
Tom "Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money,
The Shit has hit the Fan"
"Hiding in Honduras" - Warren Zevon
[mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of mg
Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2012 8:56 AM
To: Open Debate Political Forum IMHO
Subject: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An
American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
I remember years ago, in one of my previous lives, the manager of a steel
plant I worked at said that removing 80% of pollution was relatively
economical, but removing 85% cost twice as much and removing 90% cost 10
times as much.
The same thing is obviously true when it comes to protecting Americans
against terrorist attacks. If we start screaming like frightened little
girls every time a few Americans are killed, our politicians will simply
start spending more and more and more money on Homeland Security and the CIA
and FBI and the military, in an attempt to get down to zero casualties.
About half of our income-tax money already goes to military spending, and
then a bunch goes to Homeland Security, etc. Then too, there's the huge cost
of medical care, money for Big Oil, and the money we need to save for
retirement, and in the meantime, wages for the working class are going down.
So, what are we supposed to do? Based on the current line of propaganda, it
looks to me like we're supposed to give up our retirement and medical care,
and let our kids teeth rot out, so that we can keep feeding the insatiable
military/industrial/Homeland Security complex.
--
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We got the idea from framers. And we got the idea that a country that refuses to care for all of its people is falling apart. And we don't have medical efficiency now by any sense of the word. 65Million Americans without access to health care, other than hideously expensive ER's, we're not being very efficient. The bureaucracy of private insurance is estimated at 87% of billed amounts, plus if you get a bill 30 days later, over 700 vendors have already touched it. Single payer countiries, like France, pay 12% in bureaucratic losses. So tell me now who's efficient.
The other issue is that young people today are choosing fancy cars and condos, having decided that health insurance is too much to pay for something that probably won't happen. But when it does...who pays? We do!
65 million Americans without health insurance! In a country as rich as we act like are that's a sin! We cannot afford to have this many people walking aaround sick...it weakens our workforce and our nation. What possible benefit could there be to holding people - many of them youngsters under the age of 18
Why is our health insurance tied to our emloyers? That's dumb. Companies should be focused on developing their core comptencies, like product performance and developing processes that give us back our comparative advantage. Like education, health is a requirement for a healthy, wealthy nation. L
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom <boldsa...@gmail.com>
To: opendebateforum <opendebateforum@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Nov 18, 2012 10:25 am
Subject: RE: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
Where did you ever get the idea that medical care is a
esponsibility of the Federal Government. If it is, then consider yourself
oyally screwed as medical efficacy drops to the level of other Federal
ureaucratic agencies. Please don't use that tired old erroneous saw about promoting the
eneral welfare. That does NOT mean the welfare state, cradle to grave,
overnment nanny state that progressives profess that it does. Do you really live in a world in which the government or other
ntities owes you anything for which a specific contractual agreement has
een executed between yourself and that entity. Do you really deny that the
esponsibility for yourself and your welfare is yours alone? If not, then
ou apparently do not seek maturity and adulthood or independence.
om Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money,
he Shit has hit the Fan"
Hiding in Honduras" Warren Zevon
----Original Message-----
rom: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of mg
ent: Sunday, November 18, 2012 8:56 AM
o: Open Debate Political Forum IMHO
ubject: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An
merican Is Killed In The War On Terror?
I remember years ago, in one of my previous lives, the manager of a steel
lant I worked at said that removing 80% of pollution was relatively
conomical, but removing 85% cost twice as much and removing 90% cost 10
imes as much.
The same thing is obviously true when it comes to protecting Americans
gainst terrorist attacks. If we start screaming like frightened little
irls every time a few Americans are killed, our politicians will simply
tart spending more and more and more money on Homeland Security and the CIA
nd FBI and the military, in an attempt to get down to zero casualties.
About half of our income-tax money already goes to military spending, and
hen a bunch goes to Homeland Security, etc. Then too, there's the huge cost
f medical care, money for Big Oil, and the money we need to save for
etirement, and in the meantime, wages for the working class are going down.
o, what are we supposed to do? Based on the current line of propaganda, it
ooks to me like we're supposed to give up our retirement and medical care,
nd let our kids teeth rot out, so that we can keep feeding the insatiable
ilitary/industrial/Homeland Security complex.
--
ou received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
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o post to this group, send email to OpenDebateForum@googlegroups.com To
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Just the first paragraph. Lynne, you're using propaganda. Obamacare
promises us Hell on Earth when it comes to medical quality and efficiency.
It will be the Drivers License Bureau on Meth with mistakes being literally
buried sans a care.
We got the idea from framers. (No we didn't. Hell, Benjamin Rush had just
built Pennsylvania Hospital in Philly and many "Doctors and Dentists were
full time barbers and part time practitioners, Few had attended schools of
medicine and dentistry in the founders day) And we got the idea that a
country that refuses to care for all of its people is falling apart.
(Huh???) And we don't have medical efficiency now by any sense of the word.
(The word I used was efficacy but that doesn't matter. I don't care what
the snot noses at the WHO say, our system has its problems, most of which
can be tied to earlier Europeanization such as DRGs, uncapped Tort law, the
managed care fiasco. The imposition of regulations having little or nothing
to do with care and safety for patients such as those promulgated by JCAHO.
The customerization of the medical system to where the cost of the beans
assumes more importance than their quality.) 65Million Americans without
access to health care, other than hideously expensive ER's, we're not being
very efficient. ( The last figure I was aware of was about 50 million, has
it gone up 15 million since the election???) The bureaucracy of private
insurance is estimated at 87% of billed amounts, plus if you get a bill 30
days later, over 700 vendors have already touched it. Single payer
countiries, like France, pay 12% in bureaucratic losses. So tell me now
who's efficient.
If you prefer France so much, then maybe you should consider retiring there
when you're ready. America IS NOT a EURO Socialist nation and while I'm
sure progressives feel all snug and comfy with Obama re-elected, this too
will pass. The hope is that the rebuilding of national values, integrity,
strength, exceptionalism, Core Industries, and infrastructure isn't too
massive a task for the remaining productive Americans when O exits. (Stage
Left, obviously)
Tom
"Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money,
The Shit has hit the Fan"
"Hiding in Honduras"
- Warren Zevon
From: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
[mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of lynn...@aol.com
Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2012 4:50 PM
To: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An
American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
We got the idea from framers. (No we didn't. Hell, Benjamin Rush had just
built Pennsylvania Hospital in Philly and many "Doctors and Dentists were
full time barbers and part time practitioners, Few had attended schools of
medicine and dentistry in the founders day) And we got the idea that a
country that refuses to care for all of its people is falling apart. Huh???
And we don't have medical efficiency now by any sense of the word. The word
I use was efficacy but that doesn't matter. I don't care what the snot
noses at the WHO say, our system has it's problems, most of which can be
tied to earlier Europeanization such as DRGs, uncapped Tort law, the managed
care fiasco. The imposition of regulations having little or nothing to do
with care and safety for patients such as those promulgated by JCAHO. The
customerization of the medical system to where the cost of the beans assumes
more importance than their quality. 65Million Americans without access to
health care, other than hideously expensive ER's, we're not being very
efficient. ( The last figure I was aware of was about 50 million, has it
gone up 15 million since the election???) The bureaucracy of private
insurance is estimated at 87% of billed amounts, plus if you get a bill 30
days later, over 700 vendors have already touched it. Single payer
countiries, like France, pay 12% in bureaucratic losses. So tell me now
who's efficient.
The other issue is that young people today are choosing fancy cars and
condos, having decided that health insurance is too much to pay for
something that probably won't happen. But when it does...who pays? We do!
65 million Americans without health insurance! In a country as rich as we
act like are that's a sin! We cannot afford to have this many people
walking aaround sick...it weakens our workforce and our nation. What
possible benefit could there be to holding people - many of them youngsters
under the age of 18
Why is our health insurance tied to our emloyers? That's dumb. Companies
should be focused on developing their core comptencies, like product
performance and developing processes that give us back our comparative
advantage. Like education, health is a requirement for a healthy, wealthy
nation. L
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom <boldsa...@gmail.com>
To: opendebateforum <opendebateforum@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Nov 18, 2012 10:25 am
Subject: RE: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An
American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
Where did you ever get the idea that medical care is a
responsibility of the Federal Government. If it is, then consider yourself
royally screwed as medical efficacy drops to the level of other Federal
bureaucratic agencies.
Please don't use that tired old erroneous saw about promoting the
general welfare. That does NOT mean the welfare state, cradle to grave,
government nanny state that progressives profess that it does.
Do you really live in a world in which the government or other
entities owes you anything for which a specific contractual agreement has
been executed between yourself and that entity. Do you really deny that the
responsibility for yourself and your welfare is yours alone? If not, then
you apparently do not seek maturity and adulthood or independence.
Tom "Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money,
The Shit has hit the Fan"
"Hiding in Honduras" - Warren Zevon
-----Original Message-----
From: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
[mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
<mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com?> ] On Behalf Of mg
Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2012 8:56 AM
To: Open Debate Political Forum IMHO
Subject: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An
American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
I remember years ago, in one of my previous lives, the manager of a steel
plant I worked at said that removing 80% of pollution was relatively
economical, but removing 85% cost twice as much and removing 90% cost 10
times as much.
The same thing is obviously true when it comes to protecting Americans
against terrorist attacks. If we start screaming like frightened little
girls every time a few Americans are killed, our politicians will simply
start spending more and more and more money on Homeland Security and the CIA
and FBI and the military, in an attempt to get down to zero casualties.
About half of our income-tax money already goes to military spending, and
then a bunch goes to Homeland Security, etc. Then too, there's the huge cost
of medical care, money for Big Oil, and the money we need to save for
retirement, and in the meantime, wages for the working class are going down.
So, what are we supposed to do? Based on the current line of propaganda, it
looks to me like we're supposed to give up our retirement and medical care,
and let our kids teeth rot out, so that we can keep feeding the insatiable
military/industrial/Homeland Security complex.
--
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I think we will have problems with implementation. I think there are pieces of the bill we don't yet understand. It's largely unknown, and the nation has expressed its desire to have Medicare for all, which is what this bill amounts to. I see that you are afraid of it, but that's to be expected with any new sweeping legislation.
It's Not propaganda. Trust me, I have access to people and information that tell me the opposite of what you say. People like Bill Frist and Phil Bredesen. Turn off Fox and enjoy new truths. Your party and its ideals just took a boot to the head. When will you wake up?
Rome and Greece fell when the returning soldiers found that their wives had sold the family farms while they were stationed in the Provinces. Greece had many of the same problems and resolved it by executing their leadership, when the entire economy sank into the sea. In more modern times, you can cite Germany's excessive inflation and no jobs.
The real problem with our medical care is that it is for profit. can you imagine?Making money off sick people? How sick is that? And that was not data from WHO, it was from McKinsey and printed several times in the WSJ, so be careful that you know who you're attacking. I am sure you will now try to tell me that both the consulting firm and the newspaper are Marxist, in which case the last laugh will be on you.
65 million is accurate. Politicians lie...what kind of number would you find acceptable?
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom <boldsa...@gmail.com>
To: opendebateforum <opendebateforum@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Nov 18, 2012 6:57 pm
Subject: RE: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
Just the first paragraph. Lynne, you’re using propaganda. Obamacare promises us Hell on Earth when it comes to medical quality and efficiency. It will be the Drivers License Bureau on Meth with mistakes being literally buried sans a care.
We got the idea from framers. (No we didn’t. Hell, Benjamin Rush had just built Pennsylvania Hospital in Philly and many “Doctors and Dentists were full time barbers and part time practitioners, Few had attended schools of medicine and dentistry in the founders day) And we got the idea that a country that refuses to care for all of its people is falling apart. (Huh???) And we don't have medical efficiency now by any sense of the word. (The word I used was efficacy but that doesn’t matter. I don’t care what the snot noses at the WHO say, our system has its problems, most of which can be tied to earlier Europeanization such as DRGs, uncapped Tort law, the managed care fiasco. The imposition of regulations having little or nothing to do with care and safety for patients such as those promulgated by JCAHO. The customerization of the medical system to where the cost of the beans assumes more importance than their quality.) 65Million Americans without access to health care, other than hideously expensive ER's, we're not being very efficient. ( The last figure I was aware of was about 50 million, has it gone up 15 million since the election???) The bureaucracy of private insurance is estimated at 87% of billed amounts, plus if you get a bill 30 days later, over 700 vendors have already touched it. Single payer countiries, like France, pay 12% in bureaucratic losses. So tell me now who's efficient.
If you prefer France so much, then maybe you should consider retiring there when you’re ready. America IS NOT a EURO Socialist nation and while I’m sure progressives feel all snug and comfy with Obama re-elected, this too will pass. The hope is that the rebuilding of national values, integrity, strength, exceptionalism, Core Industries, and infrastructure isn’t too massive a task for the remaining productive Americans when O exits. (Stage Left, obviously)
Tom "Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money,
The Shit has hit the Fan"
"Hiding in Honduras" - Warren Zevon
From: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com [mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of lynn...@aol.com
Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2012 4:50 PM
To: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
We got the idea from framers. (No we didn’t. Hell, Benjamin Rush had just built Pennsylvania Hospital in Philly and many “Doctors and Dentists were full time barbers and part time practitioners, Few had attended schools of medicine and dentistry in the founders day) And we got the idea that a country that refuses to care for all of its people is falling apart. Huh??? And we don't have medical efficiency now by any sense of the word. The word I use was efficacy but that doesn’t matter. I don’t care what the snot noses at the WHO say, our system has it’s problems, most of which can be tied to earlier Europeanization such as DRGs, uncapped Tort law, the managed care fiasco. The imposition of regulations having little or nothing to do with care and safety for patients such as those promulgated by JCAHO. The customerization of the medical system to where the cost of the beans assumes more importance than their quality. 65Million Americans without access to health care, other than hideously expensive ER's, we're not being very efficient. ( The last figure I was aware of was about 50 million, has it gone up 15 million since the election???) The bureaucracy of private insurance is estimated at 87% of billed amounts, plus if you get a bill 30 days later, over 700 vendors have already touched it. Single payer countiries, like France, pay 12% in bureaucratic losses. So tell me now who's efficient.
The other issue is that young people today are choosing fancy cars and condos, having decided that health insurance is too much to pay for something that probably won't happen. But when it does...who pays? We do!
65 million Americans without health insurance! In a country as rich as we act like are that's a sin! We cannot afford to have this many people walking aaround sick...it weakens our workforce and our nation. What possible benefit could there be to holding people - many of them youngsters under the age of 18
Why is our health insurance tied to our emloyers? That's dumb. Companies should be focused on developing their core comptencies, like product performance and developing processes that give us back our comparative advantage. Like education, health is a requirement for a healthy, wealthy nation. L
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom <boldsa...@gmail.com>
To: opendebateforum <opendebateforum@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Nov 18, 2012 10:25 am
Subject: RE: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
Where did you ever get the idea that medical care is a
responsibility of the Federal Government. If it is, then consider yourself
royally screwed as medical efficacy drops to the level of other Federal
bureaucratic agencies.
Please don't use that tired old erroneous saw about promoting the
general welfare. That does NOT mean the welfare state, cradle to grave,
government nanny state that progressives profess that it does.
Do you really live in a world in which the government or other
entities owes you anything for which a specific contractual agreement has
been executed between yourself and that entity. Do you really deny that the
responsibility for yourself and your welfare is yours alone? If not, then
you apparently do not seek maturity and adulthood or independence.
Tom "Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money,
The Shit has hit the Fan"
"Hiding in Honduras" - Warren Zevon
-----Original Message-----
From: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
[mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of mg
Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2012 8:56 AM
To: Open Debate Political Forum IMHO
Subject: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An
American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
I remember years ago, in one of my previous lives, the manager of a steel
plant I worked at said that removing 80% of pollution was relatively
economical, but removing 85% cost twice as much and removing 90% cost 10
times as much.
The same thing is obviously true when it comes to protecting Americans
against terrorist attacks. If we start screaming like frightened little
girls every time a few Americans are killed, our politicians will simply
start spending more and more and more money on Homeland Security and the CIA
and FBI and the military, in an attempt to get down to zero casualties.
About half of our income-tax money already goes to military spending, and
then a bunch goes to Homeland Security, etc. Then too, there's the huge cost
of medical care, money for Big Oil, and the money we need to save for
retirement, and in the meantime, wages for the working class are going down.
So, what are we supposed to do? Based on the current line of propaganda, it
looks to me like we're supposed to give up our retirement and medical care,
and let our kids teeth rot out, so that we can keep feeding the insatiable
military/industrial/Homeland Security complex.
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"Open Debate Political Forum IMHO" group.
To post to this group, send email to OpenDebateForum@googlegroups.com To
unsubscribe from this group, send email to
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From: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
[mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of lynn...@aol.com
Sent: Monday, November 19, 2012 12:53 PM
To: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An
American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
I think we will have problems with implementation. I think there are pieces
of the bill we don't yet understand. It's largely unknown, and the nation
has expressed its desire to have Medicare for all, which is what this bill
amounts to. I see that you are afraid of it, but that's to be expected with
any new sweeping legislation.
It's Not propaganda. Trust me, I have access to people and information that
tell me the opposite of what you say. People like Bill Frist and Phil
Bredesen. Turn off Fox and enjoy new truths. Your party and its ideals just
took a boot to the head. When will you wake up?
Rome and Greece fell when the returning soldiers found that their wives had
sold the family farms while they were stationed in the Provinces. Greece had
many of the same problems and resolved it by executing their leadership,
when the entire economy sank into the sea. In more modern times, you can
cite Germany's excessive inflation and no jobs.
The real problem with our medical care is that it is for profit. can you
imagine?Making money off sick people? How sick is that? And that was not
data from WHO, it was from McKinsey and printed several times in the WSJ, so
be careful that you know who you're attacking. I am sure you will now try to
tell me that both the consulting firm and the newspaper are Marxist, in
which case the last laugh will be on you.
65 million is accurate. Politicians lie...what kind of number would you find
acceptable?
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom <boldsa...@gmail.com>
To: opendebateforum <opendebateforum@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Nov 18, 2012 6:57 pm
Subject: RE: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An
American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
Just the first paragraph. Lynne, you're using propaganda. Obamacare
promises us Hell on Earth when it comes to medical quality and efficiency.
It will be the Drivers License Bureau on Meth with mistakes being literally
buried sans a care.
We got the idea from framers. (No we didn't. Hell, Benjamin Rush had just
built Pennsylvania Hospital in Philly and many "Doctors and Dentists were
full time barbers and part time practitioners, Few had attended schools of
medicine and dentistry in the founders day) And we got the idea that a
country that refuses to care for all of its people is falling apart.
(Huh???) And we don't have medical efficiency now by any sense of the word.
(The word I used was efficacy but that doesn't matter. I don't care what
the snot noses at the WHO say, our system has its problems, most of which
can be tied to earlier Europeanization such as DRGs, uncapped Tort law, the
managed care fiasco. The imposition of regulations having little or nothing
to do with care and safety for patients such as those promulgated by JCAHO.
The customerization of the medical system to where the cost of the beans
assumes more importance than their quality.) 65Million Americans without
access to health care, other than hideously expensive ER's, we're not being
very efficient. ( The last figure I was aware of was about 50 million, has
it gone up 15 million since the election???) The bureaucracy of private
insurance is estimated at 87% of billed amounts, plus if you get a bill 30
days later, over 700 vendors have already touched it. Single payer
countiries, like France, pay 12% in bureaucratic losses. So tell me now
who's efficient.
If you prefer France so much, then maybe you should consider retiring there
when you're ready. America IS NOT a EURO Socialist nation and while I'm
sure progressives feel all snug and comfy with Obama re-elected, this too
will pass. The hope is that the rebuilding of national values, integrity,
strength, exceptionalism, Core Industries, and infrastructure isn't too
massive a task for the remaining productive Americans when O exits. (Stage
Left, obviously)
Tom
"Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money,
The Shit has hit the Fan"
"Hiding in Honduras"
- Warren Zevon
From: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
[mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
<mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com?> ] On Behalf Of lynn...@aol.com
Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2012 4:50 PM
To: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An
American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
We got the idea from framers. (No we didn't. Hell, Benjamin Rush had just
built Pennsylvania Hospital in Philly and many "Doctors and Dentists were
full time barbers and part time practitioners, Few had attended schools of
medicine and dentistry in the founders day) And we got the idea that a
country that refuses to care for all of its people is falling apart. Huh???
And we don't have medical efficiency now by any sense of the word. The word
I use was efficacy but that doesn't matter. I don't care what the snot
noses at the WHO say, our system has it's problems, most of which can be
tied to earlier Europeanization such as DRGs, uncapped Tort law, the managed
care fiasco. The imposition of regulations having little or nothing to do
with care and safety for patients such as those promulgated by JCAHO. The
customerization of the medical system to where the cost of the beans assumes
more importance than their quality. 65Million Americans without access to
health care, other than hideously expensive ER's, we're not being very
efficient. ( The last figure I was aware of was about 50 million, has it
gone up 15 million since the election???) The bureaucracy of private
insurance is estimated at 87% of billed amounts, plus if you get a bill 30
days later, over 700 vendors have already touched it. Single payer
countiries, like France, pay 12% in bureaucratic losses. So tell me now
who's efficient.
The other issue is that young people today are choosing fancy cars and
condos, having decided that health insurance is too much to pay for
something that probably won't happen. But when it does...who pays? We do!
65 million Americans without health insurance! In a country as rich as we
act like are that's a sin! We cannot afford to have this many people
walking aaround sick...it weakens our workforce and our nation. What
possible benefit could there be to holding people - many of them youngsters
under the age of 18
Why is our health insurance tied to our emloyers? That's dumb. Companies
should be focused on developing their core comptencies, like product
performance and developing processes that give us back our comparative
advantage. Like education, health is a requirement for a healthy, wealthy
nation. L
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom <boldsa...@gmail.com>
To: opendebateforum <opendebateforum@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Nov 18, 2012 10:25 am
Subject: RE: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An
American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
Where did you ever get the idea that medical care is a
responsibility of the Federal Government. If it is, then consider yourself
royally screwed as medical efficacy drops to the level of other Federal
bureaucratic agencies.
Please don't use that tired old erroneous saw about promoting the
general welfare. That does NOT mean the welfare state, cradle to grave,
government nanny state that progressives profess that it does.
Do you really live in a world in which the government or other
entities owes you anything for which a specific contractual agreement has
been executed between yourself and that entity. Do you really deny that the
responsibility for yourself and your welfare is yours alone? If not, then
you apparently do not seek maturity and adulthood or independence.
Tom "Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money,
The Shit has hit the Fan"
"Hiding in Honduras" - Warren Zevon
-----Original Message-----
From: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
[mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
<mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com?> ] On Behalf Of mg
Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2012 8:56 AM
To: Open Debate Political Forum IMHO
Subject: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An
American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
Trust me, I have access to people and information that tell me the
opposite of what you say. People like Bill Frist
---
who was caught red-handed bilking the feds for medicare fraud to the
tune of $631 million, plus interest, and pay $17.5 million to state
Medicaid agencies, in addition to $250 million paid up to that point
to resolve outstanding Medicare expense claims.[15] In all, civil law
suits cost HCA more than $2 billion to settle, by far the largest
fraud settlement in US history.
The real problem with our medical care is that it is for profit. can
you imagine?Making money off sick people? How sick is that?
---
how do you feel about private prisons?
> I think we will have problems with implementation. I think there are pieces of the bill we don't yet understand. It's largely unknown, and the nation has expressed its desire to have Medicare for all, which is what this bill amounts to. I see that you are afraid of it, but that's to be expected with any new sweeping legislation.
> It's Not propaganda. Trust me, I have access to people and information that tell me the opposite of what you say. People like Bill Frist and Phil Bredesen. Turn off Fox and enjoy new truths. Your party and its ideals just took a boot to the head. When will you wake up?
> Rome and Greece fell when the returning soldiers found that their wives had sold the family farms while they were stationed in the Provinces. Greece had many of the same problems and resolved it by executing their leadership, when the entire economy sank into the sea. In more modern times, you can cite Germany's excessive inflation and no jobs.
> The real problem with our medical care is that it is for profit. can you imagine?Making money off sick people? How sick is that? And that was not data from WHO, it was from McKinsey and printed several times in the WSJ, so be careful that you know who you're attacking. I am sure you will now try to tell me that both the consulting firm and the newspaper are Marxist, in which case the last laugh will be on you.
> 65 million is accurate. Politicians lie...what kind of number would you find acceptable?
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Tom <boldsa...@gmail.com>
> To: opendebateforum <opendebateforum@googlegroups.com>
> Sent: Sun, Nov 18, 2012 6:57 pm
> Subject: RE: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
> Just the first paragraph. Lynne, you’re using propaganda. Obamacare promises us Hell on Earth when it comes to medical quality and efficiency. It will be the Drivers License Bureau on Meth with mistakes being literally buried sans a care.
> We got the idea from framers. (No we didn’t. Hell, Benjamin Rush had just built Pennsylvania Hospital in Philly and many “Doctors and Dentists were full time barbers and part time practitioners, Few had attended schools of medicine and dentistry in the founders day) And we got the idea that a country that refuses to care for all of its people is falling apart. (Huh???) And we don't have medical efficiency now by any sense of the word. (The word I used was efficacy but that doesn’t matter. I don’t care what the snot noses at the WHO say, our system has its problems, most of which can be tied to earlier Europeanization such as DRGs, uncapped Tort law, the managed care fiasco. The imposition of regulations having little or nothing to do with care and safety for patients such as those promulgated by JCAHO. The customerization of the medical system to where the cost of the beans assumes more importance than their quality.) 65Million Americans without access to health care, other than hideously expensive ER's, we're not being very efficient. ( The last figure I was aware of was about 50 million, has it gone up 15 million since the election???) The bureaucracy of private insurance is estimated at 87% of billed amounts, plus if you get a bill 30 days later, over 700 vendors have already touched it. Single payer countiries, like France, pay 12% in bureaucratic losses. So tell me now who's efficient.
> If you prefer France so much, then maybe you should consider retiring there when you’re ready. America IS NOT a EURO Socialist nation and while I’m sure progressives feel all snug and comfy with Obama re-elected, this too will pass. The hope is that the rebuilding of national values, integrity, strength, exceptionalism, Core Industries, and infrastructure isn’t too massive a task for the remaining productive Americans when O exits. (Stage Left, obviously)
> Tom
> "Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money,
> The Shit has hit the Fan"
> "Hiding in Honduras"
> - Warren Zevon
> From: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com [mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of lynn...@aol.com
> Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2012 4:50 PM
> To: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
> We got the idea from framers. (No we didn’t. Hell, Benjamin Rush had just built Pennsylvania Hospital in Philly and many “Doctors and Dentists were full time barbers and part time practitioners, Few had attended schools of medicine and dentistry in the founders day) And we got the idea that a country that refuses to care for all of its people is falling apart. Huh??? And we don't have medical efficiency now by any sense of the word. The word I use was efficacy but that doesn’t matter. I don’t care what the snot noses at the WHO say, our system has it’s problems, most of which can be tied to earlier Europeanization such as DRGs, uncapped Tort law, the managed care fiasco. The imposition of regulations having little or nothing to do with care and safety for patients such as those promulgated by JCAHO. The customerization of the medical system to where the cost of the beans assumes more importance than their quality. 65Million Americans without access to health care, other than hideously expensive ER's, we're not being very efficient. ( The last figure I was aware of was about 50 million, has it gone up 15 million since the election???) The bureaucracy of private insurance is estimated at 87% of billed amounts, plus if you get a bill 30 days later, over 700 vendors have already touched it. Single payer countiries, like France, pay 12% in bureaucratic losses. So tell me now who's efficient.
> The other issue is that young people today are choosing fancy cars and condos, having decided that health insurance is too much to pay for something that probably won't happen. But when it does...who pays? We do!
> 65 million Americans without health insurance! In a country as rich as we act like are that's a sin! We cannot afford to have this many people walking aaround sick...it weakens our workforce and our nation. What possible benefit could there be to holding people - many of them youngsters under the age of 18
> Why is our health insurance tied to our emloyers? That's dumb. Companies should be focused on developing their core comptencies, like product performance and developing processes that give us back our comparative advantage. Like education, health is a requirement for a healthy, wealthy nation. L
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Tom <boldsa...@gmail.com>
> To: opendebateforum <opendebateforum@googlegroups.com>
> Sent: Sun, Nov 18, 2012 10:25 am
> Subject: RE: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
> Where did you ever get the idea that medical care is a
> responsibility of the Federal Government. If it is, then consider yourself
> royally screwed as medical efficacy drops to the level of other Federal
> bureaucratic agencies.
> Please don't use that tired old erroneous saw about promoting the
> general welfare. That does NOT mean the welfare state, cradle to grave,
> government nanny state that progressives profess that it does.
> Do you really live in a world in which the government or other
> entities owes you anything for which a specific contractual agreement has
> been executed between yourself and that entity. Do you really deny that the
> responsibility for yourself and your welfare is yours alone? If not, then
> you apparently do not seek maturity and adulthood or independence.
> Tom
> "Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money,
> The Shit has hit the Fan"
> "Hiding in Honduras"
> - Warren Zevon
> -----Original Message-----
> From: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of mg
> Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2012 8:56 AM
> To: Open Debate Political Forum IMHO
> Subject: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An
> American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
> I remember years ago, in one of my previous lives, the manager of a steel
> plant I worked at said that removing 80% of pollution was relatively
> economical, but removing 85% cost twice as much and removing 90% cost 10
> times as much.
> The same thing is obviously true when it comes to protecting Americans
> against terrorist attacks. If we start screaming like frightened little
> girls every time a few Americans are killed, our politicians will simply
> start spending more and more and more money on Homeland Security and the CIA
> and FBI and the military, in an attempt to get down to zero casualties.
> About half of our income-tax money already goes to military spending, and
> then a bunch goes to Homeland Security, etc. Then too, there's the huge cost
> of medical care, money for Big Oil, and the money we need to save for
> retirement, and in the meantime, wages for the working class are going down.
> So, what are we supposed to do? Based on the current line of propaganda, it
Your party and its ideals just took a boot to the head ------------------------------- Because an incumbent won? Really? Man, you musta really freaked out from 81 to 93, only to be followed by a midterm slaughter in 94
> Your party and its ideals just took a boot to the head
> -------------------------------
> Because an incumbent won? Really? Man, you musta really freaked out from
> 81 to 93, only to be followed by a midterm slaughter in 94
Yes, we all know Bill is not to be trusted. But I think he is going to become a doctor again rather than a politician. and Phil is a pretty good guy - he has the healthcare thing nailed. Why else would you run for office if not to bilk the government.
I don't like private prisons, either. We have one here and it's truly amazing how many inmates have died of undetermined causes.
-----Original Message-----t
From: plainolamerican <plainolameri...@gmail.com>
To: Open Debate Political Forum IMHO <opendebateforum@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Mon, Nov 19, 2012 4:09 pm
Subject: Re: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
Trust me, I have access to people and information that tell me the
pposite of what you say. People like Bill Frist
--
ho was caught red-handed bilking the feds for medicare fraud to the
une of $631 million, plus interest, and pay $17.5 million to state
edicaid agencies, in addition to $250 million paid up to that point
o resolve outstanding Medicare expense claims.[15] In all, civil law
uits cost HCA more than $2 billion to settle, by far the largest
raud settlement in US history.
The real problem with our medical care is that it is for profit. can
ou imagine?Making money off sick people? How sick is that?
--
ow do you feel about private prisons?
On Nov 19, 12:53 pm, lynn...@aol.com wrote:
I think we will have problems with implementation. I think there are pieces of he bill we don't yet understand. It's largely unknown, and the nation has xpressed its desire to have Medicare for all, which is what this bill amounts o. I see that you are afraid of it, but that's to be expected with any new weeping legislation.
It's Not propaganda. Trust me, I have access to people and information that ell me the opposite of what you say. People like Bill Frist and Phil Bredesen. urn off Fox and enjoy new truths. Your party and its ideals just took a boot to he head. When will you wake up?
Rome and Greece fell when the returning soldiers found that their wives had old the family farms while they were stationed in the Provinces. Greece had any of the same problems and resolved it by executing their leadership, when he entire economy sank into the sea. In more modern times, you can cite ermany's excessive inflation and no jobs.
The real problem with our medical care is that it is for profit. can you magine?Making money off sick people? How sick is that? And that was not data rom WHO, it was from McKinsey and printed several times in the WSJ, so be areful that you know who you're attacking. I am sure you will now try to tell e that both the consulting firm and the newspaper are Marxist, in which case he last laugh will be on you.
65 million is accurate. Politicians lie...what kind of number would you find cceptable?
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom <boldsa...@gmail.com>
To: opendebateforum <opendebateforum@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Nov 18, 2012 6:57 pm
Subject: RE: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An merican Is Killed In The War On Terror?
Just the first paragraph. Lynne, you’re using propaganda. Obamacare promises s Hell on Earth when it comes to medical quality and efficiency. It will be he Drivers License Bureau on Meth with mistakes being literally buried sans a are.
We got the idea from framers. (No we didn’t. Hell, Benjamin Rush had just uilt Pennsylvania Hospital in Philly and many “Doctors and Dentists were full ime barbers and part time practitioners, Few had attended schools of medicine nd dentistry in the founders day) And we got the idea that a country that efuses to care for all of its people is falling apart. (Huh???) And we don't ave medical efficiency now by any sense of the word. (The word I used was fficacy but that doesn’t matter. I don’t care what the snot noses at the WHO ay, our system has its problems, most of which can be tied to earlier uropeanization such as DRGs, uncapped Tort law, the managed care fiasco. The mposition of regulations having little or nothing to do with care and safety or patients such as those promulgated by JCAHO. The customerization of the edical system to where the cost of the beans assumes more importance than their uality.) 65Million Americans without access to health care, other than ideously expensive ER's, we're not being very efficient. ( The last figure I as aware of was about 50 million, has it gone up 15 million since the lection???) The bureaucracy of private insurance is estimated at 87% of billed mounts, plus if you get a bill 30 days later, over 700 vendors have already ouched it. Single payer countiries, like France, pay 12% in bureaucratic osses. So tell me now who's efficient.
If you prefer France so much, then maybe you should consider retiring there hen you’re ready. America IS NOT a EURO Socialist nation and while I’m sure rogressives feel all snug and comfy with Obama re-elected, this too will pass. The hope is that the rebuilding of national values, integrity, strength, xceptionalism, Core Industries, and infrastructure isn’t too massive a task for he remaining productive Americans when O exits. (Stage Left, obviously)
Tom
"Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money,
The Shit has hit the Fan"
"Hiding in Honduras"
- Warren Zevon
From: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com [mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com] n Behalf Of lynn...@aol.com
Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2012 4:50 PM
To: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An merican Is Killed In The War On Terror?
We got the idea from framers. (No we didn’t. Hell, Benjamin Rush had just uilt Pennsylvania Hospital in Philly and many “Doctors and Dentists were full ime barbers and part time practitioners, Few had attended schools of medicine nd dentistry in the founders day) And we got the idea that a country that efuses to care for all of its people is falling apart. Huh??? And we don't have edical efficiency now by any sense of the word. The word I use was efficacy but hat doesn’t matter. I don’t care what the snot noses at the WHO say, our ystem has it’s problems, most of which can be tied to earlier Europeanization uch as DRGs, uncapped Tort law, the managed care fiasco. The imposition of egulations having little or nothing to do with care and safety for patients uch as those promulgated by JCAHO. The customerization of the medical system to here the cost of the beans assumes more importance than their quality. 65Million Americans without access to health care, other than hideously xpensive ER's, we're not being very efficient. ( The last figure I was aware of as about 50 million, has it gone up 15 million since the election???) The ureaucracy of private insurance is estimated at 87% of billed amounts, plus if ou get a bill 30 days later, over 700 vendors have already touched it. Single ayer countiries, like France, pay 12% in bureaucratic losses. So tell me now ho's efficient.
The other issue is that young people today are choosing fancy cars and condos, aving decided that health insurance is too much to pay for something that robably won't happen. But when it does...who pays? We do!
65 million Americans without health insurance! In a country as rich as we act ike are that's a sin! We cannot afford to have this many people walking around sick...it weakens our workforce and our nation. What possible benefit ould there be to holding people - many of them youngsters under the age of 18
Why is our health insurance tied to our emloyers? That's dumb. Companies hould be focused on developing their core comptencies, like product performance nd developing processes that give us back our comparative advantage. Like ducation, health is a requirement for a healthy, wealthy nation. L
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom <boldsa...@gmail.com>
To: opendebateforum <opendebateforum@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Nov 18, 2012 10:25 am
Subject: RE: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An merican Is Killed In The War On Terror?
Where did you ever get the idea that medical care is a
responsibility of the Federal Government. If it is, then consider yourself
royally screwed as medical efficacy drops to the level of other Federal
bureaucratic agencies.
Please don't use that tired old erroneous saw about promoting the
general welfare. That does NOT mean the welfare state, cradle to grave,
government nanny state that progressives profess that it does.
Do you really live in a world in which the government or other
entities owes you anything for which a specific contractual agreement has
been executed between yourself and that entity. Do you really deny that the
responsibility for yourself and your welfare is yours alone? If not, then
you apparently do not seek maturity and adulthood or independence.
Tom
"Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money,
The Shit has hit the Fan"
"Hiding in Honduras"
- Warren Zevon
-----Original Message-----
From: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
[mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of mg
Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2012 8:56 AM
To: Open Debate Political Forum IMHO
Subject: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An
American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
I remember years ago, in one of my previous lives, the manager of a steel
plant I worked at said that removing 80% of pollution was relatively
economical, but removing 85% cost twice as much and removing 90% cost 10
times as much.
The same thing is obviously true when it comes to protecting Americans
against terrorist attacks. If we start screaming like frightened
Why, tom - it is thw voice of your gods! The right speaketh always the truth while all others lie. Besides, we all know the real medical journal is the Reader's Digest.
That must be why all those people voted for Obama.
We will have an implementation nightmare. We did with civil rights legislation, too. But I predict the sun will rise in the morning, and God is more than likely on his Throne. L
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom <boldsa...@gmail.com>
To: opendebateforum <opendebateforum@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Mon, Nov 19, 2012 2:41 pm
Subject: RE: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
When did the Wall Street Journal become a Medical Journal?
BTW:
Repeal of Health Care Law: Favor/Oppose
More Health Care Polls: Support for Obama and Democrats' Health Care Law
Polling Data
Poll
Date
Sample
Favor Repeal
Oppose Repeal
Spread
RCP Average
6/28 - 11/4
--
50.3
44.3
Favor Repeal +6.0
Rasmussen Reports
11/4 - 11/4
1000 LV
50
44
Favor Repeal +6
Quinnipiac
7/1 - 7/8
2722 RV
49
43
Favor Repeal +6
CNN/Opinion Research
6/28 - 7/1
1390 RV
52
46
Favor Repeal +6
All Repeal of Health Care Law: Favor/Oppose Polling Data
Tom "Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money,
The Shit has hit the Fan"
"Hiding in Honduras" - Warren Zevon
From: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com [mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of lynn...@aol.com
Sent: Monday, November 19, 2012 12:53 PM
To: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
I think we will have problems with implementation. I think there are pieces of the bill we don't yet understand. It's largely unknown, and the nation has expressed its desire to have Medicare for all, which is what this bill amounts to. I see that you are afraid of it, but that's to be expected with any new sweeping legislation.
It's Not propaganda. Trust me, I have access to people and information that tell me the opposite of what you say. People like Bill Frist and Phil Bredesen. Turn off Fox and enjoy new truths. Your party and its ideals just took a boot to the head. When will you wake up?
Rome and Greece fell when the returning soldiers found that their wives had sold the family farms while they were stationed in the Provinces. Greece had many of the same problems and resolved it by executing their leadership, when the entire economy sank into the sea. In more modern times, you can cite Germany's excessive inflation and no jobs.
The real problem with our medical care is that it is for profit. can you imagine?Making money off sick people? How sick is that? And that was not data from WHO, it was from McKinsey and printed several times in the WSJ, so be careful that you know who you're attacking. I am sure you will now try to tell me that both the consulting firm and the newspaper are Marxist, in which case the last laugh will be on you.
65 million is accurate. Politicians lie...what kind of number would you find acceptable?
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom <boldsa...@gmail.com>
To: opendebateforum <opendebateforum@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Nov 18, 2012 6:57 pm
Subject: RE: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
Just the first paragraph. Lynne, you’re using propaganda. Obamacare promises us Hell on Earth when it comes to medical quality and efficiency. It will be the Drivers License Bureau on Meth with mistakes being literally buried sans a care.
We got the idea from framers. (No we didn’t. Hell, Benjamin Rush had just built Pennsylvania Hospital in Philly and many “Doctors and Dentists were full time barbers and part time practitioners, Few had attended schools of medicine and dentistry in the founders day) And we got the idea that a country that refuses to care for all of its people is falling apart. (Huh???) And we don't have medical efficiency now by any sense of the word. (The word I used was efficacy but that doesn’t matter. I don’t care what the snot noses at the WHO say, our system has its problems, most of which can be tied to earlier Europeanization such as DRGs, uncapped Tort law, the managed care fiasco. The imposition of regulations having little or nothing to do with care and safety for patients such as those promulgated by JCAHO. The customerization of the medical system to where the cost of the beans assumes more importance than their quality.) 65Million Americans without access to health care, other than hideously expensive ER's, we're not being very efficient. ( The last figure I was aware of was about 50 million, has it gone up 15 million since the election???) The bureaucracy of private insurance is estimated at 87% of billed amounts, plus if you get a bill 30 days later, over 700 vendors have already touched it. Single payer countiries, like France, pay 12% in bureaucratic losses. So tell me now who's efficient.
If you prefer France so much, then maybe you should consider retiring there when you’re ready. America IS NOT a EURO Socialist nation and while I’m sure progressives feel all snug and comfy with Obama re-elected, this too will pass. The hope is that the rebuilding of national values, integrity, strength, exceptionalism, Core Industries, and infrastructure isn’t too massive a task for the remaining productive Americans when O exits. (Stage Left, obviously)
Tom
"Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money,
The Shit has hit the Fan"
"Hiding in Honduras" - Warren Zevon
From: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com [mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of lynn...@aol.com
Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2012 4:50 PM
To: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
We got the idea from framers. (No we didn’t. Hell, Benjamin Rush had just built Pennsylvania Hospital in Philly and many “Doctors and Dentists were full time barbers and part time practitioners, Few had attended schools of medicine and dentistry in the founders day) And we got the idea that a country that refuses to care for all of its people is falling apart. Huh??? And we don't have medical efficiency now by any sense of the word. The word I use was efficacy but that doesn’t matter. I don’t care what the snot noses at the WHO say, our system has it’s problems, most of which can be tied to earlier Europeanization such as DRGs, uncapped Tort law, the managed care fiasco. The imposition of regulations having little or nothing to do with care and safety for patients such as those promulgated by JCAHO. The customerization of the medical system to where the cost of the beans assumes more importance than their quality. 65Million Americans without access to health care, other than hideously expensive ER's, we're not being very efficient. ( The last figure I was aware of was about 50 million, has it gone up 15 million since the election???) The bureaucracy of private insurance is estimated at 87% of billed amounts, plus if you get a bill 30 days later, over 700 vendors have already touched it. Single payer countiries, like France, pay 12% in bureaucratic losses. So tell me now who's efficient.
The other issue is that young people today are choosing fancy cars and condos, having decided that health insurance is too much to pay for something that probably won't happen. But when it does...who pays? We do!
65 million Americans without health insurance! In a country as rich as we act like are that's a sin! We cannot afford to have this many people walking aaround sick...it weakens our workforce and our nation. What possible benefit could there be to holding people - many of them youngsters under the age of 18
Why is our health insurance tied to our emloyers? That's dumb. Companies should be focused on developing their core comptencies, like product performance and developing processes that give us back our comparative advantage. Like education, health is a requirement for a healthy, wealthy nation. L
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom <boldsa...@gmail.com>
To: opendebateforum <opendebateforum@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Nov 18, 2012 10:25 am
Subject: RE: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
Where did you ever get the idea that medical care is a
responsibility of the Federal Government. If it is, then consider yourself
royally screwed as medical efficacy drops to the level of other Federal
bureaucratic agencies.
Please don't use that tired old erroneous saw about promoting the
general welfare. That does NOT mean the welfare state, cradle to grave,
government nanny state that progressives profess that it does.
Do you really live in a world in which the government or other
entities owes you anything for which a specific contractual agreement has
been executed between yourself and that entity. Do you really deny that the
responsibility for yourself and your welfare is yours alone? If not, then
you apparently do not seek maturity and adulthood or independence.
Tom "Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money,
The Shit has hit the Fan"
"Hiding in Honduras" - Warren Zevon
-----Original Message-----
From: opendebateforum@googlegroups.com
[mailto:opendebateforum@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of mg
Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2012 8:56 AM
To: Open Debate Political Forum IMHO
Subject: Should We Scream Like Frightened Little Girls Every Time An
American Is Killed In The War On Terror?
On Monday, November 19, 2012 5:35:55 PM UTC-5, plainolamerican wrote: > r u talking to me?
> On Nov 19, 4:18 pm, GregfromBoston <greg.vinc...@yahoo.com> wrote: > > Your party and its ideals just took a boot to the head > > ------------------------------- > > Because an incumbent won? Really? Man, you musta really freaked out > from > > 81 to 93, only to be followed by a midterm slaughter in 94
