Transcript of today's IRC chat
Wolf Ellis
Hi all,
Here’s the transcript of today’s IRC chat.
Hope to see you online for the next one,
Wolf
#open-ihm
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hi | ||
hi | ||
hi Celia, can you share the agenda here please? | ||
Wolf_ | Hi | |
I spoke to Brown earlier. He can't make this afternoon and Tiwonge is in the field. I asked him to look out for the transcript of this meeting-and to review the last transcript | ||
@John - dd you ever get any follow up from Nigel after we met? | ||
Wolf has the agenda: as advertised. Review of last week, issues arising and priorities for the coming week | ||
no, I have been preoccupied with other work but I will in the next few dyas | ||
from last wek oi picked out: me to write up the porposed work package for IHM; that's on the wiki. | ||
Wolf_ | Agenda: | |
Wolf_ | 1. Progress since last week | |
Wolf_ | 2. Points for discussion/technical decisions | |
Wolf_ | 3. Priorities for next week | |
Wolf and I have been discussing the unit tests. The headings are simple if we've got it right-ie all the headings under Reports | ||
I'm not quite sure I follow that. What are the headings? | ||
Reports: Disposable Income/Adult equivalent | ||
Income as cash and food energy (kcals) by income source -raw and standardised per adult equivalent | ||
Budget summary | ||
Standard of living threshold | ||
@john, is he waiting on you then? can you make sure everything gets documented as an issue please? | ||
Identify hholds by Household and personal characteristics | ||
I still don't understand at all | ||
What is a budget summary? | ||
me neither | ||
Household Budget | ||
Household Number: | ||
Household Membership: Male Female | ||
Age - years Age - years | ||
12 | ||
20 | ||
26 | ||
51 | ||
14 | ||
20 | ||
25 | ||
26 | ||
27 | ||
54 | ||
9 | ||
Assets | ||
Category Type Unit Value | ||
Land Leased Land NULL 0 | ||
Land Marsh land NULL 0 | ||
Land Upland Acre 0 | ||
Livestock Cattle item 0 | ||
Livestock Chicken item 0 | ||
Livestock Donkey NULL 0 | ||
Livestock Duck item 0 | ||
Livestock Goat item 0 | ||
Livestock Pig item 0 | ||
Livestock Rabbit NULL 0 | ||
Livestock Sheep NULL 0 | ||
Tradable Goods Axe item 0 | ||
Tradable Goods Bicycle item 0 | ||
Tradable Goods Car NULL 0 | ||
Tradable Goods Cell Phone item 0 | ||
Tradable Goods Computer NULL 0 | ||
Tradable Goods DVD Player NULL 0 | ||
Tradable Goods Generator NULL 0 | ||
Tradable Goods Hoe item 0 | ||
Tradable Goods Motorcycle item 0 | ||
Tradable Goods Ox-cart item 0 | ||
Tradable Goods Ox-plough item 0 | ||
Tradable Goods Panga item 0 | ||
Tradable Goods Radio item 0 | ||
Tradable Goods Sickle item 0 | ||
Tradable Goods slasher item 0 | ||
Tradable Goods Tractor NULL 0 | ||
Tradable Goods TV NULL 0 | ||
Tradable Goods Wheelbarrow NULL 0 | ||
Income | ||
Income Source Food (Kcal) Cash - | ||
Crop production 1917168 98 | ||
Employment 0 273000 | ||
Livestock & livestock products 439110 18200 | ||
Gifts 0 0 | ||
Wild foods & hunting 86400 0 | ||
Total 2442678 291298 | ||
The Household Budget | ||
Household food energy requirement 9617750 | ||
% household food requirement met from own production 19.93 | ||
Cost of food purchase to meet household requirement 74044.06 | ||
% of food deficit which can be afforded 0 | ||
Cash remaining after food purchase -73946.06 | ||
Cost of non-food expenses 46692 | ||
% of non-food expenses which can be met 0 | ||
Cash remaining after non-food expenses -120638.06 | ||
Kcals/resident person/day | ||
We need to be able to test the accuracy of output. Discussed this with John earlier in the week as there is a bug in the standard of living thresehold calculations. John could you explain the tests that need to be done. | ||
Did you just copy and paste a spreadsheet into the IRC channel? | ||
Does this relate to an Issue on the Issues list? | ||
not in detail - the problem is that openihm is producing a higher proportion of hh below the SOLT than JSihm; theer could be sveeral explanations for that and there is no clue in the numbers | ||
what's a SOLT? | ||
standard of living threshold | ||
Right. | ||
So, to start from the beginning, there is a report generated by open-ihm which does not produce the expected results. Is that right? | ||
@sarah the above is what we understand by Dai's 'Corollary' on the wiki | ||
"Corollary | ||
We also need a program of work to improve the user testing; this should consist a smoke test (for patches) and an acceptance test, for anything more significant. These are not tasks for developers who cannot know what real world users are doing with the software." | ||
@Sarah this relates to a point i made in the quality improvement wiki i posted today. i asked Celia to identify all the outputs that need to be tested automatically. i regard it as the best way to get maximal coverage for the effort | ||
@sarah just c&P'd by celia now - the 'corollary' | ||
@sarah, and i suggested a manual user acceptance test document to cover the same outputs, because the automatic testing will not cover the UI | ||
So we aren't talking about unit tests then? | ||
@celia@wolf what happened to the smoke test? last update promises completeion week of 8th October. | ||
@sarah-earlier SOLT comment-yes open ihm is gnerating a report that doesn't give the expected result | ||
Yes -it's posted under issue 33. | ||
Wolf_ | The smoke test is almost finished | |
Wolf_ | We've had some problems with inconsistent results produced by different computers, so there didn't seem to be much point in adding the bits about results that should be produced by certain steps, in case the results listed were wrong. | |
@Sarah. i asked Celia for a list of the distinct outputs as a driver for the 1st tranche of unit tests. being greedy i also suggested a user-driven test of the same outputs. | ||
@celia Issue 33 is one which was marked Verified and now has been marked Started? | ||
@dai that sounds very sensible! | ||
@wolf it would have been better to document that in the issue -setting the | ||
issue as blocked on whatever issue number is stopping the work being completed. | ||
@sarah Yes, I changed the status yesterday as a bug that appeared to have been fixed hasn't. Or perhaps this is a new bug, in which case it would need a new issue? | ||
I'm confused by Issue 33. It seems to have started out as a feature enhancement in Sept 2010. In April 2011 the Issue was re-opened with a comment that starts "Just found a new bug:...", it was marked as Fixed in April 2011, then marked as Started in Sept 2012, then Fixed in Oct 2012, then Verified in Oct 2012, then Started again yesterday. It looks to the casual observer like there are at least four separate Issues there, are they | ||
really all one thing? | ||
@wolf, so is the smoke test blocked on issue33? | ||
Possibly or different elements of the same problem if the objective is to get an accurate SOLT. It looks to me as if a new bug came in after the intermediate problem was resolved | ||
============================================ | ||
the quality improvement program i have proposed for OpenIHM is here http://code.google.com/p/open-ihm/wiki/QualityImprovementProgam | ||
I'd welcome any comments/corrections/suggestions. | ||
============================================ | ||
scuse the formatting - just wanted to draw this to the attention of any transcript readers later. | ||
Wolf_ | Issue 33 and also issue 185 | |
@dai I'm going to add something to your wiki page. The "check-in triggers" you mention are a commit-hook built into Google Code which push something to Jenkins. We also IMHO need pre-commit hooks that the dev's use to stop silly errors being pushed to Google code at all. We could have prevented a number of catestrophic errors had we had this and the matter has been blocked on Issue 86 since Aug 2011. | ||
@celia basically it's a different bug if the same steps to reproduce apply. | ||
If you have to do some thing different , it;s a different bug | ||
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the first report of Issue was an enhancement though, not a bug report | ||
@Sarah, please do. when we've had review of the overall proposal and it's been approved, i suggest we go through the issues, flagging all the relevant ones for R1.5.1 (and nothing else for R1.5.1) we'll also need to raise a bunch of new issues to cover the actual work. | ||
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@dai OK, what do we do about all the issues that were marked for revisions 1.0 and 1.1 (which never exsited)? I posted about this on the list but haven't had any responses | ||
BT cut me out - apologies. Issues marked for revisions? Following last week's discussion we're starting to compile a list for '1.5.6' -is this the question? | ||
Why are we planning v1.5.6? | ||
@wolf thx fr updating 161 to suspended. i have also set it as blocked on 185, take a look, you'll see how i did that (bottom of thre UI) | ||
Version 1.5.1 was released 8 days after PyConUK finsihed. Where is the list of changes for that version? | ||
@dai wiki page updated | ||
We need Brown's input for that I think? A lot of issues came up with changes introduced at pycon-using a different version of python from 1.5 if I've got it right | ||
@Sarah i propose to mark for 1.5.x only the work for this quality improvement program. And the criteria would exclude any feature work, except critical bugs, that would need to be fixed on main as well. | ||
(incidentally i called it 1.5.1 in the wiki. will change that now & look at your changes | ||
Wolf-do you recall the precise issue? | ||
What process has been gone through to decide when a release is made and what goes in it? Where's the documentation for that? | ||
Wolf_ | Do I recall the precise issue for what? | |
None. It's clear that some rules are needed | ||
the problems that came up at/after Python-some work was done using a different version if I've got it right. | ||
A different version of /python/ or a different version of /open-ihm/? Why did this warrent a new release? Do we now have "real" users who are using different versions of Python? | ||
Wolf_ | I think it was Issue 185 again, although the problem has persisted now we're using the same version of open-IHM. | |
This is very, very important, do we have real users using different versions of Python? | ||
Or not? | ||
the download notes for 1.5.1 say: OpenIHM build using Python 2.7. Can be installed alongside old (Python 2.6) version of OpenIHM. | ||
And have "real" users installed version 1.5.1? | ||
And Wolf and Celia are getting different results running different reports on the same data? ... hint hint | ||
Wolf_ | Lots of real users have installed version 1.5.1 now, yes. | |
Then we are right up a creak | ||
Version 1.5.1 was released on October 8th | ||
Sorry 9th | ||
So, we need to go back through all Issues on the list that were entered after that, figure out which problems can be caused by installing different versions of Python and find some what for an ordinary user, who has no idea that Python is installed on their system to report to us what version they are using | ||
One question, sorry if it's dumb: can/should we ask everyone in the user group to download/install 1.5.1? This is what we've been doing with SHA users. Brown has sent a protocol which seems to work. This instruction is posted-ie download and uncheck mysql... otherwise agree to everything | ||
I have no idea but it's worth finding out, where's Brown's protocol? | ||
issue 190 | ||
190 is an issue about installing MySQL (I think), it doesn't list a protocol for updating IHM from 1.5 to 1.5.1. Where did Brown send the "protocol", I can't see it on the Mailing List? | ||
I thought this had the protocol you're right. | ||
This is logged in issu 194 | ||
Can we confirm priorities for next week, People will need to go.... | ||
EfD/user tasks -we'll continue with the list set out last week. Dai, Sarah -should we speak to Tiwonge and Brown re the issues posted on the wiki: Brown should be able to give dedicated time next month | ||
yes, and there are a lot of Issues waiting for clarification, waiting for documents to be uploaded, etc, etc, these all need to be actioned | ||
have you and Wolf_ sorted out the "user" mailing lists yet? | ||
we're working on it. For open -HEA onl the developers are active so the user list wont' be used for a while. Wolf-was there anything on the open-ihm user group? we should send out a note to all users to install V1.5.1 if they haven't already and include the instructions + screen shot of the mysql uncheck | ||
Wolf, if that's all , could you copy the transcript and circulate? | ||
Wolf_ | With the open-ihm user group, do we essentially just need to transfer all the relevant people from the 'openihm-dev' group to the 'openihm-users' group? | |
Wolf_ | Will do. | |
Not all-a lot of the names on the developers' list are ex students. The users are SHA/Chancellor etc. We can do this on Monday | ||
Have good weekends | ||
bye | ||
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bye | ||
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