Re: OGP - Consultation Event

[Second Republic]

Kieran,

Just to say that I think the agenda looks good from a Second Republic point of view. I think the choice of three themes cuts to the heart of the discussion.

As I've said, an evening or (better again) a weekend event would be better from a citizen engagement point of view - but let's start with what we have, which is a very good agenda and what looks like it is going to be a very well-run event.

Thanks for all your work and the work of all in DPER,

Oliver

On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at 5:12 PM Kieran Sheedy <Kieran...@per.gov.ie> wrote:

Folks

 

I have booked the Institute of Public Administration for Tuesday 14^th July, from 4.30-7.30pm, as a venue to hold the OGP Consultative Event. As it is on the DART line, it should be relatively easy to access. They have wi-fi , but unfortunately live-streaming is not an option.

 

I attach a document which copies in one place all the comments made to date (that I am aware of) on the themes to be discussed at the consultative event.

 

I have also attached a draft agenda. Taking account of both Ann’s views and Brian McCleland suggestions at our last meeting, I am proposing to remove the Consultative Guidelines theme to allow for adequate time to discuss the remaining themes. I have also retitled the event and moved one bullet point regarding the evaluation of the quality of open policy making processes from theme 4 to theme 2, as Ann has suggested.

 

In relation to the timing  - I intend to allocate the vast majority of the time available to the key themes and consider that each would require more or less the  same amount of time.  

 

I would welcome any final views you may have on the Agenda please?   

 

When the Agenda is finalised,  I will put a notice of the event on our own and on the OGP website and can have the Press Office put it on Twitter etc.   I will issue invites via email as broadly as possible and I will copy to each of you and you might pass it at that stage please?  

 

In the absence of any suggestions for improvement to the Agenda by then,  I will issue the invitation first thing on Monday morning. 

 

 

Kieran Sheedy

Government Reform Unit

Department of Public Expenditure and Reform

3^rd Floor, 7-9 Merrion Row, Dublin 2

 

e: kieran...@per.gov.ie

p: 01 604 5729

w: http://hr.per.gov.ie/

 

 

 

 

From: Kieran Sheedy
Sent: 03 June 2015 12:35
To: 'Second Republic'; Andrew Jackson; Annette Aspell; a...@eire.com; col...@eircom.net; Denis Parfenov; Flora Fleischer; Ingo Keck; Ivan Cooper; Liam O'Connor; nhau...@tasc.ie; tom.m...@ombudsman.gov.ie; NiamhMcCar...@lgma.ie; Evelyn O'Connor; William Beausang; Kalpana Shankar
Subject: RE: OGP - Consultation Event

 

Folks

 

Regarding the date for the consultative event - I understand from Evelyn (who is in Tbilisi, Georgia all this week at an international OGP event) that Denis will be holding a health information/data event in mid-June. Meanwhile, we will be holding an event ourselves on Open Data that has had to be pushed out to the end of June to secure speakers etc. We would need to leave a little breathing space between those events and the OGP Consultative event as there will be some overlap of attendees, and we think it would be best to host OGP event the week of the 13th July.  It has been very difficult to get a venue for any date in June. I will seek one for a  mid-July date, later today and tomorrow if necessary. I will let you know the outcome of that.

 

There has been very little response at this stage to the questions proposed – can you let me know if you have received responses from colleagues that have not been copied? As the event is being moved out, perhaps we could aim to have the majority of responses back by (say) 10^th June? We could meet, or communicate by email perhaps, once we have all the feedback.     

 

 

Kieran Sheedy

Government Reform Unit

Department of Public Expenditure and Reform

3^rd Floor, 7-9 Merrion Row, Dublin 2

 

e: kieran...@per.gov.ie

p: 01 604 5729

w: http://hr.per.gov.ie/

 

 

 

From: Second Republic [mailto:in...@2nd-republic.ie]
Sent: 03 June 2015 11:45
To: Kieran Sheedy; Andrew Jackson; Annette Aspell; a...@eire.com; col...@eircom.net; Denis Parfenov; Flora Fleischer; Ingo Keck; Ivan Cooper; Liam O'Connor; nhau...@tasc.ie; tom.m...@ombudsman.gov.ie; NiamhMcCar...@lgma.ie; Evelyn O'Connor; William Beausang; Kalpana Shankar; open-govern...@googlegroups.com; OGP irl
Subject: Re: OGP - Consultation Event

 

Kieran,

 

Second Republic didn't receive any feedback on the specific themes for discussion: http://discuss.2nd-republic.ie/t/broadening-participation-in-the-open-government-partnership/180

 

I was wondering, however, if there has been any further progress on planning for the event?

 

Thanks for your work,

Oliver

On Wed, May 13, 2015 at 2:44 PM Kieran Sheedy <Kieran...@per.gov.ie> wrote:

Oliver

 

We are aiming to hold the event before end June. A response by 27^th May could mean that the questions won’t be finally agreed before the invitations have to issue.  I think that is probably ok though – full agreement on the questions in advance is not a reason to delay issuing invitations. 

 

Kieran

 

 

From: Second Republic [mailto:in...@2nd-republic.ie]
Sent: 13 May 2015 14:36
To: Kieran Sheedy; Andrew Jackson; Annette Aspell; a...@eire.com; col...@eircom.net; Denis Parfenov; Flora Fleischer; Ingo Keck; Ivan Cooper; Liam O'Connor; nhau...@tasc.ie; tom.m...@ombudsman.gov.ie; NiamhMcCar...@lgma.ie; Evelyn O'Connor; William Beausang; Kalpana Shankar; Oliver Moran; open-govern...@googlegroups.com; OGP irl

Subject: Re: OGP - Consultation Event

Kieran,

 

Thanks for this.

 

In order to help with this discussion, I've opened a thread on the Second Republic discussion forum here:

 

http://discuss.2nd-republic.ie/t/broadening-participation-in-the-open-government-partnership/180

 

Everyone is invited to participate and to share this link.

 

I think 22 May might be a bit early. Would it be possible to stretch it out to two full weeks (i.e. 27 May) in order to get the fullest input while still keeping a short time frame?

 

Kind regards,

Oliver

 

On 13 May 2015 at 13:21, Kieran Sheedy <Kieran...@per.gov.ie> wrote:

I refer to my email of 8th May (copied below) and attach, for your consideration, a draft of the questions that might be considered at the event.

 

Please advise what timescale is considered necessary to seek/collate the  views from among broader civil society/interested individuals on the draft? Would it be possible to revert to me by COB on 22^nd May?     

 

A bit more work is required on the draft consultation guidelines and they are not ready to issue at this stage. I  will issue them to you as soon as possible in advance of the event.

Kieran

 

From: Kieran Sheedy
Sent: 08 May 2015 14:45
To: 'andrew....@antaisce.org'; 'Annette Aspell'; 'a...@eire.com'; 'col...@eircom.net'; 'denis.p...@gmail.com'; 'flora fleischer'; 'in...@2nd-republic.ie'; 'Ingo Keck'; 'iv...@wheel.ie'; 'Liam'; 'nhau...@tasc.ie'; 'Oliver Moran'; 'tom.m...@ombudsman.gov.ie'; 'Niamh McCarthy'; Evelyn O'Connor; William Beausang
Cc: 'Kalpana Shankar'
Subject: OGP - Consultation Event

 

Below are the key Action Points from Wednesday’s meeting.  

 

1.      An initial consultative event is to be arranged before end June through the co-ordination group.  Further such events (2-3 per annum) will build on success/outcome of the first one.

·         Initial meeting to be held in a Dublin location; subsequent meeting will be in a regional location

·         Depending on venue availability and facilities, timing for initial meeting will be from 4-7pm; and it will be live streamed if possible

·         Wide representation from civil society and public service to be sought   

 

2.      Brian Cleland outlined e-participation process  – he will assist in applying this process at the event

·         The process will require the use of moderators, using ipads, to guide and collect inputs on round table discussions (6-10 people per table) on a set of pre-agreed questions on key themes.

·         Inputs are routed live to a small group of input collators, who prepare a report of the event before conclusion. It is possible to rank 3-4 key points/priority actions from each table as part of process.

·         Live streaming of event and twitter feed would be necessary to enable those who wish to participate and feed into the process on line.  The potential to have this done will be examined.

 

3.       The themes were discussed.  It was agreed that there will need to be three short briefings on

·         the first theme on the OGP

·         the public consultation process leading to the development of the first national action plan

·         the findings of the research and the revised draft consultation guidelines 

 

4.       Event agenda and questions to be addressed to be developed 

·         Department to develop an initial set of questions and civil society sub group will respond having sought views from among broader civil society/interested individuals

 

We will develop drafts of the questions that might be considered at the event and forward them early next week.

 

Kieran Sheedy

Government Reform Unit

Department of Public Expenditure and Reform

3^rd Floor, 7-9 Merrion Row, Dublin 2

 

e: kieran...@per.gov.ie

p: 01 604 5729

w: http://hr.per.gov.ie/

 

 

 

[Denis Parfenov]

*Apologies for cross-posting*

**Please share widely**

Today citizens use the 21st century technology to talk, the government uses the 20th century technology to listen and responds with the 19th century processes. This needs to change and your help is needed.

Please register and play an active part in shaping consultative policy making in Ireland via Open Government Partnership

WHEN: Tuesday afternoon, 14th July 2015 (4.30pm - 7.30pm)
WHERE: Institute of Public Administration, 57-61 Lansdowne Road, Ballsbridge, Dublin 4

Registration page: https://ti.to/open-government-partnership/ogp-consultative-event%C2%A0

About event: http://www.ogpireland.ie/2015/06/17/open-government-partnership-consultative-event-organised-by-the-department-of-public-expenditure-and-reform/

Tweet for sharing: https://twitter.com/OGPirl/status/611157933049651200

Twitter Hashtag: #OGPirl

 --
Denis Parfenov

Open Knowledge Ambassador / Open Knowledge Ireland, Founder

https://openknowledge.ie/  | @OKFirl | Google+

'To open up all essential public interest information and see it used to create insight that drives change.'

 

 

 

 

 

[John Handelaar]

Denis, et al

Please stop spamming us all with daytime meetings in D2 which normal people cannot possibly attend.  

Most of all please have the common sense to refrain from calling it a consultation.

[Tony Canning]

Wow - While I must admit to having tried to unsubscribe from this group several times, I've never felt so compelled to pursue it in earnest mostly because I disagree with this pathetically critical sentiment.

There is no spamming - if you would like to not receive as much email, it's very easy to just ask to unsubscribe or suggest a change in dissemination of information.

I'd like to make it clear that I have no personal investment in OKI - I'm just an interested "lurker". But I do feel absolutely compelled to highlight that it is ignorant, in ever sense of the word, to be so ridiculously negative.

Best of luck to all involved.

Tony

[John Handelaar]

Never heard of you.

You may attempt to insult me *after* you've actually done something -- anything -- in the field of open government, Until then, take your ad hominem attacks and shove them up your arse.

[Tony Canning]

Childish flaming on top of ignorance - sorry I'm not on your step of the ladder. Enjoy feeling superior.

[Denis Parfenov]

Hi guys -

@ John and all -

Look, at every meeting with DPER I insist that face to face public consultations/meetings have to take place on Saturdays. Unfortunately Saturdays don't suit those who work for the government, professional civil society and many of us who have children.

As you can see from agenda , the *process* of consultation is the main topic for discussion for this meeting.

It's clear that if the government is serious about public consultation process (like the OGP / open data), it has to see this process as a permanent digital+physical public infrastructure with a dedicated budget for design, development and maintenance. So everyone who is interested in participation in policy making can do so, no matter where s/he lives or works.

* Hiring lacking ambition and imagination consultants who create illusions by recycling ideas of others and produce no-one-reads reports doesn't help to make this process neither wider nor deeper.

Please keep in mind, same as you are, the Open Knowledge Ireland and the 2nd Republic do what we can in our spare time to keep this fire burning. We need your help!

@ Tony - I removed you from Open Government Ireland group, as per your request. (I didn't find you on two other groups). Please feel free to re-join any time if you feel so.

Thank you for your contributions.

Best regards,

Denis

[Oliver Moran]

Yes. Hold off with the friendly fire, John. The people on this list agree with you.

The time of events is a very serious issue. For those of us who work, a "free" event held during work hours costs money. The OGP consultative event in July, for example, will cost me the better part of €300 to attend through lost earnings:

http://www.ogpireland.ie/2015/06/17/open-government-partnership-consultative-event-organised-by-the-department-of-public-expenditure-and-reform/

Thankfully, I earn enough to take that kind of hit. The lower someone income the less they are able to afford to attend events like this. Someone earning €100 a day, for example, certainly could not afford to give up a days pay to attend an event like this.

That's assuming too that my employer will release me to attend. I am after all, like most employees, contracted to be at my place of employment 9 to 5, Monday to Friday.

For this reason, the times that these events are held at is, in my opinion, the greatest single barrier to citizen participation in them.

And it's not just events advertised on this list that are affected by this problem. This morning I was inquiring about the Public Participation Networks in Cork. The one in Cork had its information day at 10:30am - 1:00pm on a Tuesday. It appears that regular meetings are the same. How can the great bulk of the public attend events like that?

There's a simple rule: if you hold a public meeting during work hours, most people won't be able to come. And work hours, for avoidance of doubt, include commuting times and turn-around time to get to the planned event after eating some dinner (so 7:00am to 7:00pm are out for most people).

I know you have an issue with the magic 2km sq in Dublin 2 also, John. For my part, that's just something we have to live with. Dublin is the greatest centre of population on this island by a long shot. In the same way that if you want to maximize participation, you choose a time that suits the greatest number of people, you must also choose a location that suits the greatest number of people. And that's Dublin (and I write from Cork).

We raised this issues at the planning meetings. We raised them in email. We'll raised them again at the event. We'll keep raising them. And maybe, eventually, the importance of the message will understood.

Oliver

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[Treasa Lynch]

Hi, 

"It's clear that if the government is serious about public consultation process (like the OGP / open data), it has to see this process as a permanent digital+physical public infrastructure with a dedicated budget for design, development and maintenance. So everyone who is interested in participation in policy making can do so, no matter where s/he lives or works. "

Denis, from what I can see for the notice of the meeting under discussion, there is no provision for video conferencing or streaming. Instead of asking for meetings on Saturdays upfront, at least enabling people to attend remotely should be within the realms of the possible. Given the subject under discussion, I would be interested in knowing what objections people might have to that.

regards

[Denis Parfenov]

Hi Kieran -

It would be appreciated if you can help to locate notes from the OGP event which took place one month ago. Have the notes been made public?

Thanking you in advance.

Best regards,

Denis