Hide's ride
Me
heat's on you for something else you did, so very quietly return it,
then that's okay - isn't it?
Not that anything was stolen - unless you've spent your life campaigning
on the principle that taxation is theft...
hellicopter
The government of the UK is also using the smoke screen of
investigating its own, in a internal crisis, to distract
from the external crisis, the economic.
Rich...@hotmail.com
wrote:
Hide is using the "Hanover Finance" defence - giving a little of the
profits away to distract from breaking the rules regarding charging
for speaking as a Minister.
hellicopter
BrentC
wrote:
like that 400 million overpaid on a crapped out railway?
who got the new house?
hellicopter
What! Buffet buys into rail! Don't you read! No, you're a zombie
economist!
>
> who got the new house?
At the moment the music has stopped. You only sell if you have
debts! People buying have big bonuses to lock into real assets.
If the elites fail to re-balance, turn around the drivers
of income inequality, then we heading for a massive inflationary
spurt, hence why people are buying any asset, even rail roads!
This is why National what to give the rich a safe harbor in
Auckland local assets, bail the rats out one last time.
Rich...@hotmail.com
Its a city Hide is stuffing up - and according to him Key and National
Ministers are too lazy to get involved and are leaving it all to him.
If Hyde stayed at Key's house in Hawaii with his girlfriend that is
between him and John Key - it is the hypocrisy of a 'perk buster'
spending $10,000 on a holiday for his girlfriend (and presumably
something similar for himself) that has people a little excited.
But do not be distracted - this government is doing as little as
possible to help ordinary New Zealanders in these difficult times - we
entered the recession earlier than Australia because of a severe
drought - Australia had it later, but we both suffered from the
effected of the global recession. At the time of the last election New
Zealand as in a stronger financial position than Australia - but we
now have higher unemployment and are emerging slower than Australia -
there the Rudd government did use government money to help get their
economy going - they did give a cash amount to all taxpayers,
encouraged education and retraining, encouraged research, retained
encouragement of savings so that Australian Companies have a source of
finance.
What did National do? Gave the rich a tax cut - presumably on the
'trickle down' theory. Gave nothing to most New Zealanders to assist
them in tough times. They knew trickle down wouldn't work, but they
just felt like showing they were in poweer by giving most New
Zealanders a golden shower. National have cut education. Reduced
Kiwisaver. Did away with most of the incentives for companies to
undertake Research and Development.
And what do we have instead - a never-never promise of a bicycle track
to attract tourists! - and Rodney Hide being given carte blanche to
plan selling off our water supplies to private interests, to reduce
local government services, and to force a voting system on Auckland
that favours the wealthy.
BrentC
>What did National do? Gave the rich a tax cut - presumably on the
>'trickle down' theory.
Fuck the trickle down theory - Labour wasted 9 years pissing away an
extra 6% of my income for no good reason - all those surpluses wasted
- the fuckers
Brian Dooley
Yup, that's why the second richest guy in the world is getting
into railways.
--
Brian Dooley
Wellington New Zealand
misanthropic_curmudgeon
> On Sun, 08 Nov 2009 00:08:30 +1300, BrentC <b...@b.b> wrote:
> >On Sat, 07 Nov 2009 23:06:10 +1300, hellicopter <stonesn...@kol.co.nz>
> >wrote:
>
> >>Rich80...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> >>> On Sat, 07 Nov 2009 08:46:26 +1300, hellicopter <stonesn...@kol.co.nz>
> >>> wrote:
>
> >>>>Me wrote:
>
> >>>>> If you steal something, then realise you might get caught because the
> >>>>> heat's on you for something else you did, so very quietly return it,
> >>>>> then that's okay - isn't it?
> >>>>> Not that anything was stolen - unless you've spent your life campaigning
> >>>>> on the principle that taxation is theft...
>
> >>>>The government of the UK is also using the smoke screen of
> >>>>investigating its own, in a internal crisis, to distract
> >>>>from the external crisis, the economic.
>
> >>> Hide is using the "Hanover Finance" defence - giving a little of the
> >>> profits away to distract from breaking the rules regarding charging
> >>> for speaking as a Minister.
>
> >>Money talks too loud these days.
>
> >like that 400 million overpaid on a crapped out railway?
>
> >who got the new house?
>
> Yup, that's why the second richest guy in the world is getting
> into railways.
Maybe its because gullible saps like you wanting to pour billions of
taxpayers dollars into trhem that makes them attractive to him
John Cawston
Berkshire is sitting on a cash mountain and Buffet himself is/was
heading for a US record in tax payments if he declared dividends
(he owns 26% of Berkshire's shares). So he's buying into more
rail companies plus other investments such as $3 billion in tax
credits from Fannie Mae to reduce Fed taxes.
JC
Pooh
"Brian Dooley" <bri...@paradise.net.nz> wrote in message
news:foqcf599n6hehu6c8...@4ax.com...
I think you'll find that railway actually makes a profit Brian. Not like the
black hole for taxpayer funds Labour lumbered NZ with.
Pooh
hellicopter
Nothing ventured nothing gained. Private holdings sat on the
railways and ran them down. Now they are in government hands
the government wants them magically to make money. The problem
with our elites is they think Buffet is a moron for buying into
a rail network and hedge, sorry, to use his words buy into the
US economy. Rail is a hedge against peak oil! That's why we
not only need to buy rail but invest in rail, then partly
sell off the company and let capitalist have a hedge to use
to offset peak oil crunches! But no there socialism for the
rich only haven't got read their Adam Smith for a long time!
It is essential National invest in rail and bring it fit
and partially back to the market. The assurance of a government
run operation will insure that private holders do not run it down
again, we know how that harmed out economy and don't want to
do that again!
Rich...@hotmail.com
wrote:
I can see no justification for even partial privatisation,
hellicopter. All it would do is result in the taxpayer subsidising
shareholder profits again - that is after all what happened here as
you pointed out above, and what happened in the UK. Without
competition, private ownership is just a guaranteed profit to the
private shareholders without real risk.
hellicopter
Private business has its place in the economy. Its about at
what level the intervention comes up to. Roads are funded
by general taxation. Rails should also, but we don't support
the freight in the container, on the roads or on the train!
In fact its good governance to for the legislator, executive
and judiciary to be separated. So it doesn't make sense
that any industry is run by, of, and overseen by government.
Therein lies the attack on government by the right, and a
worthy attack. When government provides the schools, provides
the inspectors and provides the stack tribunal then schools
turn in to shit holes like in the states! No amount of vounchers
will change the facts! Government needs to held accountable
for the outcomes of regulation, but because government is also
the supplier of the services and the rule setter, and the
overseer then they of course create bad government.
Just look at welfare, there is a stack tribunal sitting
deliberating over abuse by WINZ. Look at the Human Rights
Commission, they help oversee legislation, they have a hand
in the writing and so are no longer impartial acting to
hold government accountable, or an authentic author of
of what Human Rights apply!
Sorry, back to the question, private ownership of risky
facets of any business (not the underlying assets!) is
always good. i.e. insuring the freight on the public
rail, or bidding to run a special train that maximizes
delivery time of mail via the rail, or being bidding for
to deliver subsidized public transport (like Auckland Buses!).
Private has a place, the left are wrong to ban it outright,
the right are wrong to allow rich people to own public
assets! Left and right have failed because they fail to
fear the bigger picture, because isolated on out little
island at the edge of the world its just far too easy
to give into the ideologues of left and right.
We've being nuking each other camps to long, and the
economy is in a shocking state, the young are like
refugees seeking escape from the battle! The right
have most of the blame because they persist in their
arrogant right wing economic crusade. The left however
are full of old trot-skies! Who have always weaken
the left and let the rich roll over them! Hoping one
day that the worker will rise up and have their head on
the red flag! Its a poor show!
We should never sell roads, water pipes, fibre optics,
or rail assets. We should however allow for bidders
to compete with the government for contracts.
i.e. if government estimate the cost, roll a non-profit
to run the business, pay the non-profit, then if business
can out bid then they can get the business for a reasonable
period.
No to wholesale sell off, but also no to fully government run!
Rich...@hotmail.com
wrote:
Rail privatisations are notable for their end result of the taxpayers
subsidizing profits and guaranteeing losses; of asset stripping and
deferral of maintenance in favour of profits,and of eventual expensive
re-nationalisation.
The reality is that especially in New Zealand there is no room for
effective competition - we often have only single tracks, and no
alternative routes other than road or sea - neither of which are
suitable for some items.
The priority now is to restore tracks to a reasonable level of
maintenance, update rolling stock where that makes sense, and to build
new lines in carefully selected areas. New lines in particualr
generally invovle the government for acquisition at least.
BrentC
>
>The priority now is to restore tracks to a reasonable level of
>maintenance, update rolling stock where that makes sense, and to build
>new lines in carefully selected areas. New lines in particualr
>generally invovle the government for acquisition at least.
You what
NZ Rail is a dead duck for all but shipping coal
Don't waste any more money - junk all rolling stock and staff - except
tourist carrages and put a bike track down the centre of the rails -
longest rail trail in the world.
hellicopter
Local communter lines exist in most major cities. At huge
cost, they are drilled under cities, under rivers.
Only a idiot would some how ignore the synergies! Now do
I agree that we should ship goods over land when we can
take it to most centers who have a port and just on load it
to a coastal freight ship! But just like research credits
for business, National rolled back Clarks support for freight!
It is obvious that peak oil is bearing down on us, that
the best cities to work in have integrated public transport
systems. IT will not relocate to a city whose electricity is
unreliable, whose rail infrastructure is run down, whose
planners will not build up, whose concern for lifestyle
comes to a completion in low taxation for the richest!
But wait, aren't peak oil and information society two of the
fundamental absolutes of the next 100 years!
How can people so assured in their expertise ignore such
essential trends? Miss them completely! We send the best
brightest scurrying for the airports the moment they graduate
and then wonder why will persistently slip against other
OECD nations who use our best employees to build their economies
AND here's the kicker, invest in their RAIL with the taxes
on their economic activity!
Kiwis are better off paying taxes to other governments to
build integrated, rail!
But stop! Wait a second. Didn't the first new rail station
in forever just get open in Manakau! And the minister of
transport, a National MP was there! So what's this more
two faced policy. Integrate ticketing across Auckland
and investing in Auckland rail! Oh, say it ain't true!
How can you still peddle the lie that National should not
invest in rail! Of course it should, will have to.