Kriminal Kop Kerik - GIULIANI'S CHOICE!
Freedom Man
November 6, 2009
Kerik Confesses to Cheating I.R.S. and Telling Lies
By SAM DOLNICK
WHITE PLAINS Bernard B. Kerik, a former detective who rose to lead
the New York Police Department through the 9/11 attack before his
career crumbled in scandal, pleaded guilty Thursday to eight charges
including tax fraud and lying to White House officials.
Wearing a blue suit and a red tie in Federal District Court here, Mr.
Kerik sat at the defense table in the packed courtroom with a subdued
expression. In a deep, gravelly voice, he said, "Guilty, Your Honor,"
as the judge read the charges against him.
--
Never wear a suit or tie - you might be mistaken for a white-collar
criminal.
--
One of his lawyers, Michael F. Bachner, rubbed Mr. Kerik's back during
the 90-minute proceeding.
--
I wonder if that lawyer's bill will itemize a charge for a back rub?
--
The prosecution and the defense recommended that the judge, Stephen C.
Robinson, sentence Mr. Kerik, who faced up to 30 years in prison on
the most serious charge, to 27 to 33 months. The judge, who is not
bound by the recommendation, set sentencing for Feb. 18. Mr. Kerik was
also ordered to pay restitution of nearly $188,000.
--
As usual with rich white-collar criminals, especially those coming from high
positions, Kerik will get a slap-on-the-wrist few months in a country club
jail. I wonder if his mentor Tyrant Ghouliani will visit him there?
--
The tax fraud charges stemmed in part from Mr. Kerik's acceptance of
$250,000 in renovations to his Bronx apartment, provided by a company
accused of having ties to organized crime. He also admitted lying to
White House officials, denying improprieties, while he was being
interviewed to be head of the Department of Homeland Security.
--
At least the Feds do a better job of vetting than Ghouliani does. All the
Ghoul requires is blind loyalty. Give him that, and you get to be Deputy
Dictator.
--
For the swaggering Mr. Kerik, a man at ease with powerful politicians
and street cops alike, the morning marked the low point in a career
filled with operatic twists that wound through the Bronx, the rubble
of ground zero, and the White House.
Mr. Kerik was a police detective when Rudolph W. Giuliani chose him as
his bodyguard and chauffeur during his first mayoral campaign. The two
men forged a connection that lasted throughout Mr. Giuliani's
mayoralty and beyond.
--
Ghouliani also supports and employs an ex-priest, Alan Placa, that was
defrocked for supporting pedophiles in the church and strong evidence of his
own pedophilia. See the article below documenting Ghouliani's support of
pedophiles.
--
-->> Mr. Giuliani appointed Mr. Kerik to a senior position in the
Correction Department, where he went on to be commissioner, and even
have a prison named after him in downtown Manhattan. (The name has
since been removed.) In 2000, Mr. Giuliani selected him as the city's
40th police commissioner even though he lacked a college degree,
normally a qualification for the job.
--
Serve as Ghouliani's loyal hired gun and you can get anything, no matter how
stupid or uneducated you are!
--
Mr. Kerik led the Police Department through the 9/11 attack, meeting
President George W. Bush at the ruins of the World Trade Center. Mr.
Kerik impressed the president enough that the White House tapped Mr.
Kerik to lead Homeland Security in 2004. The bid quickly collapsed and
Mr. Kerik withdrew his name from consideration, citing unpaid taxes
for his family's nanny. More serious allegations then began to
surface, marking the beginning of Mr. Kerik's downfall.
As he sat in court Thursday, peering through reading glasses, Mr.
Kerik seemed a lifetime removed from his days of power.
With the agreement, he pleaded guilty to two counts of tax fraud, one
count of making a false statement on a loan application and five
counts of making false statements to the federal government while
being vetted for senior posts. Corruption charges against him will be
dropped.
--
How convenient for Ghouliani, as deeper probes into Kerik's past might
expose organized crime or other corrupt ties to Ghouliani himself.
--
The plea deal also suggests that the investigation delved into Mr.
Kerik's business activities abroad between 2005 and 2007, and
provides that in exchange for his admissions, he will not be
prosecuted by the United States attorney's office in Manhattan in
connection with those activities or for any tax crimes that might have
stemmed from them.
The case against Mr. Kerik centered on charges that a New Jersey
construction firm, the Interstate Industrial Corporation, suspected of
organized crime ties, paid for much of the renovation work at Mr.
Kerik's home in Riverdale, in the Bronx, in the hope that he would
help the company obtain a city license.
--
The Mob does work for a city official! So much for Ghouliani's law and order
hypocrisy -
--
Mr. Kerik admitted Thursday to allowing Interstate to pay for
renovations on his Riverdale apartment while he was correction
commissioner, and to contacting officials on Interstate's behalf.
Mr. Kerik read several brief statements admitting to the series of
crimes. After the first statement, Judge Robinson asked, "Did you
understand what you were doing was wrong and a crime?" he asked.
"I did, Your Honor," Mr. Kerik said.
Through the long pretrial hearing process, the judge had made clear
his displeasure with Mr. Kerik. On Oct. 20, Judge Robinson denounced
his "arrogance" and sent Mr. Kerik to the Westchester County Jail in
Valhalla for leaking sealed information.
Mr. Bachner said he would ask Judge Robinson in the coming days to
reinstate the bail and release Mr. Kerik until sentencing.
On Thursday, Judge Robinson indicated that he saw Mr. Kerik as more
than the sum of his crimes, and that he would take his law enforcement
career into account during sentencing. "I think you had a very full
life," he told Mr. Kerik." There is much good in that full life, I believe."
--
And thus he sets the stage for the slap-on-the-wrist sentence to come.
--
Moments later, Judge Robinson adjourned the hearing. The gallery set
to murmuring, the lawyers gathered their papers, and the former police
commissioner walked stiffly from the courtroom on his way back to
jail.
---------------------------
Rudy Giuliani and Alan Placa: "Mayor Morality" and the PEDOPHILE PRIESTS
References:
http://thenexthurrah.typepad.com/the_next_hurrah/2007/03/rudy_giuliani_w.html
http://www.townhall.com/blog/g/432306c2-20b7-4fb5-bb5a-008d54eaf343
http://trustme.com/story.php?title=Rudy-Giuliani--pedo-priest
http://www.bishop-accountability.org/
http://littlemissattila.mu.nu/archives/giuliani_in_drag.jpg
http://bottleofblog.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/guilianidrag.jpg
With the above references you can read in depth about priestly pedophilia
and its ties to a rather hypocritical ex-mayor and Presidential candidate.
Giuliani's close association with and promotion of indicted criminal cop
Kerik is a better known issue, as are his adultery and family estrangements,
but these are less deeply indicative of Giuliani's moral bankruptcy than his
relatively unknown Placa connection.
Alan Placa and Rudy Giuliani were high school buddies, and they remained
close friends through College. Post-college, Placa went to the Seminary, and
Giuliani to law school. After he was ordained, Placa attended law school
too. Eventually he became a Monsignor in the Diocese of Rockville Center on
Long Island, and Giuliani went to Washington in Reagan's Department of
Justice. When Giuliani wanted an annulment of his first marriage - to a 2nd
cousin, a union normally frowned upon by the Catholic Church, Placa did the
job - after being best man at their wedding!
Monsignor Placa got into considerable trouble in the late 1990s when accused
of sexually abusing two minors that could not sue him or the Diocese because
the five-year statute of limitations was long past. When the story broke
Monsignor Placa came up in several parts of it. While serving on Long Island
he had developed a legal strategy for dealing with sex abuse complaints.
This involved having an "intervention team" meet with family members and the
abused, without revealing that Placa was indeed the Diocese lawyer on such
matters. Placa took great pride that in cases that if litigated might cost
the Diocese millions, he could frequently manipulate the situation and get
them off for a few thousand. Of course the Monsignor was flying a false
flag - he was not a spiritual counsel, he was the Bishop's lawyer. He
traveled the country teaching Bishops this evasion technique, with about 200
successful cases outside his own Diocese.
In the 1980s, the preferred method of dealing with Priestly Pedophilia was
to send the black-collar criminal child molesters off for "therapy." There
were several institutions available, one being a huge fraud called the House
of Affirmation run by a Father Thomas A. Kane. Kane lied about his degrees
in psychology, but that was only found out later. In the meantime he
acquired lots of high-grade real estate, and when he was about to go under,
he transferred to Placa titles for property in Massachusetts and Florida,
among other assets. The transfers were not discovered for years.
When this story was all over the papers in 2002, Suffolk County Long Island
had a Grand Jury review the situation with the Rockville Center Diocese, and
while they could not charge Placa because of the statute of limitations,
they issued a report about his "intervention team" manipulating victims and
their families, and the allegations of his abuse of two teens. As a result
Monsignor Placa was suspended from the priesthood and essentially defrocked.
He was allowed to say one public Mass however - at Giuliani's Mother's
funeral, causing the event to be picketed by sex abuse victims! When the
Grand Jury was trying to serve Placa with a subpoena, Giuliani hid him until
the term was out - a probable obstruction of justice by former U.S. Attorney
Giuliani.
Placa is today an extremely close Giuliani friend and associate, despite
being credibly accused of sexual molestation and, perhaps worse, using the
system to cover up his and other abuse cases. The story goes back to a 2002
Newsday article about a January 1975 day when a teenager, Richard Tollner,
volunteered to help make banners for the annual Right to Life march in
Washington. According to the story, the student claims Monsignor Placa
pulled out some posters in the deserted administrative area as if to show
him something, and then began fondling him - all the while making
conversation about the posters.
Tollner said the incidents were repeated every month or so for the next year
and a half. "It was always groping," he said. "He'd draw his hand
deliberately to the inside of my thigh, and over my penis. It would go on
for four or five minutes, sometimes as long as ten."
Placa denies any wrongdoing and has never been formally charged with a
crime. But it is also true that the Diocese of Rockville Center has removed
him from wearing the collar and performing official duties.
It should also be noted that a Grand Jury report paints a devastating
picture of sexual deviancy and criminality in his Rockville Center Diocese.
According to the National Catholic Reporter:
"The report documents allegations of the rape of cheerleaders and altar
boys, of acts of molestation and seductions in churches, rectories, on
camping trips, and in the homes of the minors who were abused. It tells of
instances in which priests provided minors with pornography and alcohol, and
of cases in which the Diocese received allegations but didn't report them to
the police, but instead transferred the accused priests to other parishes."
In the Suffolk County Supreme Court Grand Jury report, Placa, by his own
admission, is referred to as "Priest F," a priest who engaged in pedophilia.
Even after the grand jury testimony, Giuliani stood by him. In another 2003
New York Times article, Placa described the zero-tolerance sex abuse policy
on priests as "immoral and unchristian." Apparently, in Placa's mind, Christ
condoned such perversions. Judging by his loyalty and support, Giuliani, a
proven transvestite and adulterer, does likewise.
Additionally, the 2002 Newsday story included a quote from Kevin Waldron, a
fellow high school friend who corroborates sex abuse victim Tollner's story,
saying Tollner told him of the events after they happened. The Newsday story
goes on to report:
"A second former student, who asked that his name be withheld, said he
described to Suffolk prosecutors what he called 'the newspaper drill.' 'He
(Placa) always had a New York Times in his office. And he'd sit down next to
you on the couch and open it wide and, inevitably, his hand would brush your
crotch.' 'He did it over and over again, I can't tell you how many times.'
That man said he felt so violated that he wrote Placa an unsigned letter 20
years later, blaming him for his loss of interest in pursuing the
priesthood."
Despite all these allegations, Giuliani hired Placa right after all this
went down, and based on news reports and a call to the Giuliani Partners
office, he remains with him today. And as the New York Times reported in
2002, even amid these strong allegations Giuliani jumped to Placa's defense
saying: "He's one of the people I admire most in the world, and if most
people did half the good that Alan's done, the world would be a wonderful
place." Yes, in Giuliani's world child molesters would run free to prey upon
minors, they would protect each other through religious organizations, and
criminals would head police departments and the Department of Homeland
Security. And thus, under Giuliani's autocratic rule, "the world would be a
wonderful place."
Every bit of this has been reported over the years in Newsday, the NY Times,
and in books by Jason Berry. You can find the articles, as well as the Grand
Jury report, archived at www.bishop-accountability.org/. The Times
front-paged it when Giuliani hired Placa for his consulting firm, a firm
known to provide legal counsel for accused white-collar criminals that can
afford it.
So why did Giuliani defend and hire the unsavory Alan Placa? Is this his
version of Affirmative Action? We know he recommended his buddy, criminal
cop Kerik, to George W. Bush for heading up Homeland Security. And two-faced
Giuliani, the closet neo-con, flip-flopped on the abortion issue among
others while a Presidential candidate. He tried to curry favor with
pro-choice advocates but as President would probably have sabotaged women's
rights through judicial appointees that would overturn Roe vs. Wade. If
Giuliani had been elected we could well have seen pedophile priest-lawyers
that oppose abortion on "moral grounds" sitting on the Supreme Court!
And why the lack of media attention to all this before the Presidential
election? Suppose John Edwards, Barack Obama, or Hillary Clinton had given a
cozy sinecure to a defrocked priest credibly accused of pedophilia. What
would've happened? I'll tell you what - every newspaper reader, every radio
listener, and every television news watcher in America would've been
discussing the matter the very next day. But I'll bet you're learning for
the first time right here about Giuliani's de facto defense of child sex
abuse and staunch support of his probable pedophile priestly pal.
Aside from his moral issues, do we want someone in a government executive
position whose definition of freedom is:
" - FREEDOM IS NOT A CONCEPT IN WHICH PEOPLE CAN DO ANYTHING
THEY WANT, BE ANYTHING THEY CAN BE. FREEDOM IS ABOUT AUTHORITY.
FREEDOM IS ABOUT THE WILLINGNESS OF EVERY SINGLE HUMAN BEING
TO CEDE TO LAWFUL AUTHORITY A GREAT DEAL OF DISCRETION ABOUT
WHAT YOU DO AND HOW YOU DO IT."
- Mayor Giuliani, quoted in the New York Times, March 17, 1994.
Obwon
<lib...@once.net> wrote:
>NY Times
>November 6, 2009
>Kerik Confesses to Cheating I.R.S. and Telling Lies
>By SAM DOLNICK
>
When Kerik began talking that became a threat, now he's
been mollified, keep watching.
Werner
> NY Times
> November 6, 2009
> Kerik Confesses to Cheating I.R.S. and Telling Lies
> By SAM DOLNICK
>
> WHITE PLAINS Bernard B. Kerik, a former detective who rose to lead
> the New York Police Department through the 9/11 attack before his
> career crumbled in scandal, pleaded guilty Thursday to eight charges
> including tax fraud and lying to White House officials.
>
I've started to wonder if crooked cops are now the norm.
Obwon
Not only you, seeing the twisted logic and other tales
the gov't spins to avoid having to hold police accountable,
in high profile cases, one can only imagine what goes on in
the low profile cases. If things not seen are as bad as
what is being seen, then I'd have to guess you are right!
Look at the incredible pressure it took to bring Justin
Volpe down. Now imagine if his actions did not result in an
emergency trip to the hospital.
Obwon
wrote:
What will it be? Accident, suicide or terminal disease?
Sanders Kaufman
news:f1bc7c30-3fd7-4bff...@31g2000vbf.googlegroups.com...
> I've started to wonder if crooked cops are now the norm.
As you continue the plunge into dementia, that feeling will only get worse.
But there are drugs like Aricept that can slow the progression.,
Make sure your shrink knows about this developing situation.
Phil
wrote:
>I've started to wonder if crooked cops are now the norm.
You think this way because you hear only about the bad cops.
Newspapers rarely report on them if they do good.
Phil
Sanders Kaufman
news:mshef5dfh72ueu2de...@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 8 Nov 2009 06:29:43 -0800 (PST), Werner <whet...@mac.com>
>>I've started to wonder if crooked cops are now the norm.
>
> You think this way because you hear only about the bad cops.
> Newspapers rarely report on them if they do good.
If you're not seeing pro-cop stories, it's because you're not looking.
Here, in Dallas, we have a pro-cop story nearly every day.
Today's story is about a female cop who took down the Ft. Dix shooter.
Sid9
.
Cops need to conform to a higher standard.
If they can't, they should a different line of work.
Sanders Kaufman
news:hd7hmn$ni4$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
> Cops need to conform to a higher standard.
> If they can't, they should a different line of work.
They DO conform to a higher standard.
Some civilians have to take drug tests - but all cops have to.
Some civilians have to have college - but all cops have to.
When a civilian gets a DWI, he gets a fine - when a cop does it, he's
usually loses his job, and even his career.
When a civilian goes to work, he chooses how to dress - cops have to buy
uniforms out of their own pocket.
The list goes on and on and on.
Werner
> "Sid9" <s...@belsouth.net> wrote in message
Check this out:
http://www.truthinjustice.org/p-pmisconduct.htm
http://michaelbluejay.com/police/
check out my own story
http://www.capitaldistrict-lp.org/Amerika.shtml
or try a search on 'recent police misconduct articles'
I'm sure there are lots of fine cops out there, but I'm equally sure
there are lots of bad ones. They are very well protected by their
unions. Actually I wonder if my local Police Chief is just a figure
head.
Freedom Man
news:4zFJm.2848$dc2....@newsfe20.iad...
Ad-hominem attack is the refuge of unintelligent and immature people
incapable of disproving a valid assertion with facts or logic, so in
frustration they resort to childish name-calling.
Sanders Kaufman
> On Nov 8, 6:07 pm, "Sanders Kaufman" <bu...@kaufman.net> wrote:
>> They DO conform to a higher standard.
[snip]
> Check this out:
> http://www.truthinjustice.org/p-pmisconduct.htm
> http://michaelbluejay.com/police/
> check out my own story
> http://www.capitaldistrict-lp.org/Amerika.shtml
> or try a search on 'recent police misconduct articles'
I don't need to read a lot of anectdotes to know that cops are indeed held
to a higher standard.
I just look at the standards and see that they are indeed being held to
them.
I realize that there are a lot of people who have run afoul of the law.
In fact, I think just about everyone has at some point.
Some of us learn from our mistakes.
Others of us, such as you, set up web pages to announce our outrage at
having been caught.
Sanders Kaufman
news:hd9rva$9i8$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
> "Sanders Kaufman" <bu...@kaufman.net> wrote in message
>>> I've started to wonder if crooked cops are now the norm.
>>
>> As you continue the plunge into dementia, that feeling will only get
>> worse.
>
> Ad-hominem attack is the refuge of unintelligent and immature people
> incapable of disproving a valid assertion with facts or logic, so in
> frustration they resort to childish name-calling.
He expressed a genuine fear that "crooked cops are the norm".
Maybe in your community, where anti-government crack-pots hang out, this
might be considered normal and healthy.
But in the real world, it's a great big red flag that his mental condition
is deteriorated.
Or in medical terms, that he is "demented".
Sure, I could have given him a couple of volumes of facts to try to get him
to understand - but there's no point in it.
You anti-government types don't see what healthy people see.
When you look at the world, it's like looking into a fun-house mirror - what
you see is a distortion of what's really there.
So, no matter what I might say to him, he's still going to be ascared that
the gubmint is out to get him.
The BEST that I or anyone else can do for him is to encourage him to get the
medical help he needs.
The WORST anyone can do for him is to take him seriously; to lend
credibility to his delusion.
Werner
> "Werner" <whetz...@mac.com> wrote in message
My mistake? What was it? Would you not be outraged at having been
framed?
Werner
> "Freedom Man" <libe...@once.net> wrote in message
>
> news:hd9rva$9i8$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>
> > "Sanders Kaufman" <bu...@kaufman.net> wrote in message
> >>> I've started to wonder if crooked cops are now the norm.
>
> >> As you continue the plunge into dementia, that feeling will only get
> >> worse.
>
> > Ad-hominem attack is the refuge of unintelligent and immature people
> > incapable of disproving a valid assertion with facts or logic, so in
> > frustration they resort to childish name-calling.
>
> He expressed a genuine fear that "crooked cops are the norm".
> Maybe in your community, where anti-government crack-pots hang out, this
> might be considered normal and healthy.
>
You can go to some of the bluest communities in the country and find
communities where cops are not welcome. Are people there crackpots or
are you?
> But in the real world, it's a great big red flag that his mental condition
> is deteriorated.
> Or in medical terms, that he is "demented".
>
Where are the facts to substantiate this other than in your own
head?
> Sure, I could have given him a couple of volumes of facts to try to get him
> to understand - but there's no point in it.
Give me facts.
> You anti-government types don't see what healthy people see.
> When you look at the world, it's like looking into a fun-house mirror - what
> you see is a distortion of what's really there.
> So, no matter what I might say to him, he's still going to be ascared that
> the gubmint is out to get him.
>
http://gnn.tv/headlines/20014/Schenectady_Mayor_Considers_Martial_Law_Over_Police_Woes
now do some on your own, Sanders
> The BEST that I or anyone else can do for him is to encourage him to get the
> medical help he needs.
> The WORST anyone can do for him is to take him seriously; to lend
> credibility to his delusion.
kiss my ass
Sanders Kaufman
While I recognize that you like to think of yourself as a VICTIM, - I just
don't see it that way.
Sanders Kaufman
> On Nov 9, 4:00 pm, "Sanders Kaufman" <bu...@kaufman.net> wrote:
>> Sure, I could have given him a couple of volumes of facts to try to get
>> him
>> to understand - but there's no point in it.
>
> Give me facts.
You already have the facts.
What you lack is character - and there's nothing I can do to help you with
that.
Werner
> "Werner" <whetz...@mac.com> wrote in message
You're a character, Sanders. No matter how often your nose is pressed
in shit, you're like a puppy who wont get trained.
Sanders Kaufman
That's what I'm talking about!
Freedom Man
> "Freedom Man" <lib...@once.net> wrote in message
> news:hd9rva$9i8$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>> "Sanders Kaufman" <bu...@kaufman.net> wrote in message
>
>>>> I've started to wonder if crooked cops are now the norm.
>>>
>>> As you continue the plunge into dementia, that feeling will only get
>>> worse.
>>
>> Ad-hominem attack is the refuge of unintelligent and immature people
>> incapable of disproving a valid assertion with facts or logic, so in
>> frustration they resort to childish name-calling.
> He expressed a genuine fear that "crooked cops are the norm".
> Maybe in your community, where anti-government crack-pots hang out, this
> might be considered normal and healthy.
I agree that some cops are crooked, but not all.
What I saw was merely an insult to the poster, not a rational reply or
discussion of the facts or opinions presented.
I see that you are resorting to the same childish conduct too.
> But in the real world, it's a great big red flag that his mental condition
> is deteriorated.
> Or in medical terms, that he is "demented".
So everyone you disagree with is insane? Do you know what "projection"
means?
Sanders Kaufman
> "Sanders Kaufman" <bu...@kaufman.net> wrote in message
>> He expressed a genuine fear that "crooked cops are the norm".
>> Maybe in your community, where anti-government crack-pots hang out, this
>> might be considered normal and healthy.
>
> I agree that some cops are crooked, but not all.
> What I saw was merely an insult to the poster, not a rational reply or
> discussion of the facts or opinions presented.
> I see that you are resorting to the same childish conduct too.
Identifying a mental illness is not childish conduct.
I can see where you would think that it is, though.
After all - within y'alls community, that kind of behavior is pretty much
the norm.
So when somebody points out how weird you're behaving - you just don't see
it.
From your perspective, there's nothing crazy at all about thinking that all
cops are crooked and that the government is out to gitcha.
However, from a mental health perspective, that kind of paranoia is nothing
BUT crazy.
Phil
This isn't the case in New York. It's even less so in nyc.* Here, a
cop is considered guilty as soon as something happens. If he's found
guilty in court then that's all there is. If he's found not guilty,
then it's the result of a corrupt judicial system.
Phil
Sanders Kaufman
> This isn't the case in New York. It's even less so in nyc.* Here, a
> cop is considered guilty as soon as something happens. If he's found
> guilty in court then that's all there is. If he's found not guilty,
> then it's the result of a corrupt judicial system.
Whenever you make such obviously false and ridiculously broad statements
about what you think everyone else does - you're just talking about
yourself, really.
What you did there - that's a textbook example of projection.
What you're really saying is that YOU always presume they're guilty, corrupt
and such.
Projecting this onto everyone else is just your way of avoiding confronting
your own bad character.
I see this a lot with junkies who are detoxing.
During that period when sobriety is dawning and they have to soberly
confront the fact that they're fuck-ups, they always blame everyone else -
and they usually start with the cops.
What you're doing here is no different than when a junkie is detoxing.
Phil
<bu...@kaufman.net> wrote:
>Whenever you make such obviously false and ridiculously broad statements
>about what you think everyone else does - you're just talking about
>yourself, really.
>What you did there - that's a textbook example of projection.
>
>What you're really saying is that YOU always presume they're guilty, corrupt
>and such.
That's funny. I'm the guy, here, who is often ridiculed for NOT
shouting how they're guilty.
Welcome to nyc.*
Phil
Freedom Man
> "Freedom Man" <lib...@once.net> wrote in message
> news:hdcda6$2mv$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>> "Sanders Kaufman" <bu...@kaufman.net> wrote in message
>
>>> He expressed a genuine fear that "crooked cops are the norm".
>>> Maybe in your community, where anti-government crack-pots hang out, this
>>> might be considered normal and healthy.
>>
>> I agree that some cops are crooked, but not all.
>> What I saw was merely an insult to the poster, not a rational reply or
>> discussion of the facts or opinions presented.
>> I see that you are resorting to the same childish conduct too.
> Identifying a mental illness is not childish conduct.
Are you a qualified psychiatrist?
If not, and I'm SURE you're not by what you say here, you have no
qualifications to judge the sanity of others!
> I can see where you would think that it is, though.
Another childish statement.
> After all - within y'alls community, that kind of behavior is pretty much
> the norm.
How do you know the "community" the post came from?
> So when somebody points out how weird you're behaving - you just don't see
> it.
> From your perspective, there's nothing crazy at all about thinking that
> all cops are crooked and that the government is out to gitcha.
>
> However, from a mental health perspective, that kind of paranoia is
> nothing BUT crazy.
People that often call others crazy are usually just projecting.
You do know what "projecting" means in the psychological sense, don't you?
Believing that "crooked cops are the norm" is not sufficient for a diagnosis
of mental illness. I can understand a crooked cop with something to hide
saying that though -
Sanders Kaufman
> "Sanders Kaufman" <bu...@kaufman.net> wrote in message
>> Identifying a mental illness is not childish conduct.
>
> Are you a qualified psychiatrist?
> If not, and I'm SURE you're not by what you say here, you have no
> qualifications to judge the sanity of others!
Actually - sanity is a *legal* term, not a psychological one .
I simply pointed out the painfully obvious fact that he's got an illness.
Clearly - you too have some issues to deal with.
Freedom Man
Also clearly - you are a troll, and worthy of my killfile!
PLONK!
HOW TO DEFEAT THE TROLLS
An Internet "troll" is a person who delights in sowing discord
on the Internet. He or she slanders others and seeks to cause
conflicts and upset people. Trolls are malicious, antisocial,
and often mentally ill. They crave attention, and care not
whether it is positive or negative. The Internet is a
convenient venue for their bizarre, misanthropic games - a
means to abuse others without fear of retaliation. Trolls are
cowards - lacking the courage to be overtly hostile towards
people, they hide behind their computers and the anonymity of
the Internet. The troll is a less intelligent version of the
malicious hacker or virus writer.
Trolls are impervious to meaningful dialogue. You CANNOT reason
with them and you CANNOT cause them to feel shame or
compassion. Trolls do not feel bound by rules of courtesy or
social responsibility. They are simply not playing with a full
deck. It is futile to try to "cure" a troll of his obsession.
Trolls are irrational and not accessible through any sane approach.
Established posters may leave a newsgroup/message board because
of troll-created conflicts, and lurkers (readers that do not
post) may not want to expose themselves to abuse and therefore
never speak up. Thus they unwisely allow the troll to violate
their rights of free speech and expression. The Internet is a
vital resource - and probably the last stand for free speech.
Being antisocial, trolls hate this and try to subvert it.
When you try to reason with a troll, he wins. When you curse at
a troll, he wins. If he succeeds in angering you, he's succeeded.
THE ONLY THING THE TROLL CAN'T HANDLE IS BEING IGNORED -
having NO EFFECT on his intended targets!
So the best way to deal with trolls is to IGNORE THEM and
occasionally (and ONLY occasionally) remind others not to
respond to them either.
Hard to ignore? You can set up your computer to AUTOMATICALLY
ignore the troll by using your KILLFILE. Just go to the
offensive message, and bring your pointer to the "MESSAGE" tab
near the top of your screen. Click, and a menu opens. Go to and
click on "BLOCK SENDER." You will no longer see any of the
sender's posts from that account. This is called "plonking" the troll.
Ignored, these children will have to find another game to play.
Slim
Here in NYC, the cops perceive everyone as a criminal, perp, skell or mutt.
Why else are "stop and frisks" occring in record numbers?
Cops have to have PROBABLE CAUSE to Stop and Frisk, yet only 10% of all
these contacts end in arrest.
That means the cops are WRONG 90% OF THE TIME.
Sickos like Phil get thier jollies from innocent people of color being
harrassed by the cops.
Cops
'stop-and-frisk' more than 500,000 New Yorkers on the street each year
THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Friday, October 9th 2009, 10:59 AM
NEW YORK — A teenager trying to get into his apartment after school is
confronted by police. A man leaving his workplace chooses a different
route back home to avoid officers who roam a particular street.
These and hundreds of thousands of other Americans in big cities have
been stopped on the street by police using a law-enforcement practice
called stop-and-frisk that alarms civil libertarians but is credited by
authorities with helping reduce crime.
Police in major U.S. cities stop and question more than a million
people each year — a sharply higher number than just a few years ago.
Most are black and Hispanic men. Many are frisked, and nearly all are
innocent of any crime, according to figures gathered by The Associated
Press.
And the numbers are rising at the same time crime rates are dropping.
Ronnie Carr's experience was typical: He was fumbling with his
apartment door after school in Brooklyn when plainclothes officers
flashed their badges.
"What are you doing here?" one asked, as they rifled through his
backpack and then his pockets. The black teenager stood there, quiet
and nervous, and waited.
Carr said the officers told him they stopped him because he looked
suspicious peeking in the windows. He explained that he had lost his
keys. Twenty minutes later, the officers left. Carr was not arrested or
cited with any offense.
"I felt bad, like I did something wrong," he said.
Civil liberties groups say the practice is racist and fails to deter crime.
Police departments maintain it is a necessary tool that turns up
illegal weapons and drugs and prevents more serious crime.
Police records indicate that officers are drawn to suspicious behavior:
furtive movements, actions that indicate someone may be serving as a
lookout, anything that suggests a drug deal, or a person carrying
burglary tools such as a slim jim or pry bar.
The New York Police Department is among the most vocal defenders of the
practice. Commissioner Raymond Kelly said recently that officers may
stop as many as 600,000 people this year. About 10 percent are arrested.
"This is a proven law enforcement tactic to fight and deter crime, one
that is authorized by criminal procedure law," he said.
The practice is perfectly legal. A 1968 Supreme Court decision
established the benchmark of "reasonable suspicion" — a standard that
is lower than the "probable cause" needed to justify an arrest.
But in the mid-1990s, then-Mayor Rudy Giuliani and NYPD Commissioner
William Bratton made stop-and-frisk an integral part of the city's law
enforcement, relying on the "broken windows" theory that targeting
low-level offenses helps prevent bigger ones.
Street stops started to go up, and overall crime dropped dramatically
in a once-dangerous city.
Last year, New York police stopped 531,159 people, more than five times
the number in 2002.
Fifty-one percent of those stopped were black, 32 percent Hispanic and
11 percent white.
Not all stops are the same. Some people are just stopped and
questioned. Others have their bag or backpack searched. And sometimes
police conduct a full pat-down.
David Harris, a law professor at the University of Pittsburgh and an
expert on street stops, said few searches yield weapons or drugs. And
the more people are searched, the more innocent people are hassled.
"The hit rate goes down because you're being less selective about how
you're doing this. That has a cost. It's not free," Harris said.
When officers make a stop, they are required to fill out a form,
including the time and location of the stop and why police were
suspicious. Age, race and whether the person was frisked are also
recorded.
In Philadelphia, stops nearly doubled to more than 200,000 from 2007 to
2008. Philadelphia Mayor Michael Nutter deployed an "aggressive"
stop-and-frisk policy in the year since his election in November 2007
and overall crime has dropped.
In Los Angeles, where Bratton recently stepped down as police
commissioner, pedestrian stops have doubled in the past six years to
244,038 in 2008. The number of people stopped in cars is higher.
About 15 percent of the stops resulted in arrests in 2002, compared
with about 30 percent in 2008, according to an analysis of the data by
Harvard University's Kennedy School of Government.
Several other major police departments do not keep street-stop
statistics or do not release them. Chicago police refused to release
numbers to the AP. Boston police say they do not keep the records. The
New Orleans department is not required to keep statistics on race and
pedestrian stops.
RAND, an independent research agency hired by the New York Police
Department to analyze street-stop data in 2007 after public outcry,
found little racial profiling.
It said the raw statistics "distorted the magnitude and, at times, the
existence of racially biased policing."
The NYPD continues to monitor the issue, but after the RAND analysis,
officials agreed that large-scale restructuring was unnecessary.
Kelly has warned against more simplistic data reviews.
"There are 8.4 million people in New York City. That number swells to
more than 10 million every work day. Police are responsible for more
than 800,000 summonses and arrests annually based on the higher
standard of probable cause," Kelly said.
"Under the circumstances, it's not surprising that we make 500,000 or
even 600,000 stops based on the less stringent standard of reasonable
suspicion."
Civil liberties groups also complain because New York police keep a
database of everyone stopped — innocent or not. That makes them targets
for future investigations, said Christopher Dunn, associate legal
director of the New York Civil Liberties Union.
Los Angeles was forced by federal mandate to release data on street
stops — including the race of those stopped — starting in 2000 after a
series of scandals. The city government promised to adopt scores of
reform measures under federal court supervision.
The LAPD was released from the federal decree in July, but a report
last year by the ACLU in Southern California showed that blacks were
still nearly three times more likely to be stopped by police than
whites.
"The initial defense was: 'Because we're over-policing higher crime
neighborhoods, they're predominantly populated by people of color, and
that's why,'" said Peter Bibring, an ACLU attorney in Los Angeles.
But an analysis done for the ACLU in 2008 by Yale law professor Ian
Ayres accounts for differences in crime rates and still shows
minorities are stopped much more.
Some people who are stopped file lawsuits against the city and speak
out publicly. Most just accept it.
In Harlem, George Lucas changed his route home from work to avoid a
stretch of Seventh Avenue, because he kept being stopped by the police.
"The inconvenience of walking out of my way still saves me the worry
and frustration about being stopped," said Lucas, 28, director of a
nonprofit.
It's so common in some areas that community groups have begun offering
classes on how to behave when stopped.
Courtney Bennett of the nonprofit New York City Mission Society says he
regularly hosts groups of 30 men, of all ages, who feel powerless
because they are stopped routinely for what they say is no reason. Carr
recently attended a similar meeting for teens at another nonprofit
called The Door.
Bennett is also a member of the Order of the Feather, a black
fraternity that mentors young men and promotes community service. At a
recent initiation ceremony in Harlem, it did not take long to find
dozens of people who said they were stopped by police.
"You see these guys? They're normal guys, you know? Regular dudes,"
said Paul Hawkins, 22. "They've all been affected by it somehow. They
were stopped, or someone they knew, or their dad or whatever. And
they're not, you know, criminals."
--
"A nickel isn't worth a dime today." - Y. Berra
Slim
Cops can do no wrong in Phil's addled mind.
Every time they kill an unarmed, inncent person, its just a tragedy,
never a crime.