Job posts and Node.js mailing list guidelines (was: PHP/MongoDB Developer - Pants optional)
Isaac Schlueter
see new job postings. http://jobs.nodejs.org has an RSS feed.
Subscribe to it. http://jobs.nodejs.org/a/jbb/find-jobs-rss
Other people find these posts to be annoying. At the very least, it
encourages a lot of "don't post that here" "nono, you should post that
here" discussions, which are highly flammable, and pretty worthless.
People posting jobs don't always realize that there IS a job board,
which is why they post them here, and then they get a bunch of guff
from the very people that they're trying to help and befriend. Here
we are hijacking this poor guy's attempt to find a node.js developer,
simply because he wants a developer who also knows php (a 100% fair
request, imo).
As a moderator of this list, I've had to bat away quite a few
moderated-first-messages that were obvious nonsensical recruiter
buzzword spam of the worst sort, not looking for nodejs devs at all,
including at least one for a "Jquery Java/JavaScript .NET" programmer.
Some of those have gotten through, because apparently google groups'
spam-prevention rules have some loopholes.
We've discussed it on this list in the past, and on the nodejs-dev
list, but haven't really ever made the policy explicit. It's
especially confusing because it used to be *encouraged* for a while.
So, I wrote up this:
https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines
That's gonna be linked at the bottom of the mailing list messages now.
If you think that there are things that should be changed in that
policy, then let's talk about it.
Yes, the job board costs money, but it's not in any way a significant
source of revenue. If you really can't afford $100, you *definitely*
can't afford to hire someone. If you're a buzzword spammer, then $100
is way more than the value you'd gain from annoying us, so it's a good
gate that helps everyone who is honest. Candidates know that the
posts are valid, and positions get taken more seriously.
If the price tag is actually a blocker for you for some reason, then
please contact me, Tom Hughes-Croucher, or Ryan Dahl, and we'll try to
figure something out.
On Fri, Jun 24, 2011 at 11:24, Jacobus brogly.decap
<jacobu...@gmail.com> wrote:
> LOL, yeah , I just took a look at the link he was supposed to post the
> job,...$100 a pop... I bet he doesnt own stock)))
> Socialist thinking always does a good job in killing innovation)
>
> 2011/6/24 Sotonin <sot...@gmail.com>
>>
>> Indeed. It's hardly "out of control" seeing a job posting like one a week
>> at most.... hell even 1 per day is fine in my book... Why force people to go
>> elsewhere. preface with [JOB] as this guy did and nobody is forcing you to
>> open the email. delete it.
>>
>> On Fri, Jun 24, 2011 at 1:20 PM, Jacobus brogly.decap
>> <jacobu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Indeed, Keep the job-post comming)).
>>> The nagging is nothing other then the rot is US culture thinking
>>> something commercial is (quote) "crap" or "belongs somewhere else."
>>>
>>>
>>> 2011/6/24 Sotonin <sot...@gmail.com>
>>>>
>>>> Agreed. this post was not spam in my opinion. It was a valid post. Don't
>>>> pay to post a ad somewhere.
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Jun 24, 2011 at 1:00 PM, Jacobus brogly.decap
>>>> <jacobu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Knowledge on economic activity with node.js is absoluutly crucial in
>>>>> having the use of node.js grow!
>>>>> Post like this absoluutly belong in this group!
>>>>> 2011/6/24 Buzzedword <dga...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Not to seem the hypocrite, but I'm in agreement with you. The job
>>>>>> postings have been getting a bit ridiculous lately, but all the same I feel
>>>>>> that we need to make a delineation somewhere. In order for node to succeed,
>>>>>> there has to be work with it. As part of the community, we have a
>>>>>> responsibility to help it grow-- be it by asking intelligent questions,
>>>>>> providing feedback, contributing software, and in certain cases, yes I do
>>>>>> believe job postings should also be endorsed. The main difference is that I
>>>>>> don't particularly care for cold calls with no background on node, just
>>>>>> understanding it's the "next big thing". Full disclosure: for this posting,
>>>>>> I receive no commission, no monetary gain, nothing. An associate came to me
>>>>>> with this offer, explained what they were looking for, explained what they
>>>>>> did NOT want to do (switch entirely to node) and explained what had to be
>>>>>> achieved.
>>>>>> I felt that an opportunity like this, to be able to take node as not
>>>>>> just a primary stack but as a supplementary technology was an enticing
>>>>>> promise, and overall felt that it would be a great way to get more exposure
>>>>>> to node in resistant markets with low risk. Does it go against everything I
>>>>>> believe in to post a job on the list? Yes. Do I feel the benefits to our
>>>>>> community outweighed the backlash? Absolutely. I will stand behind that 100
>>>>>> percent.
>>>>>> At the same time, I do feel that we need an appropriate outlet for
>>>>>> this kind of outreach-- the jobs board is a little steep for raising
>>>>>> awareness, which is really all I was attempting to do.
>>>>>> So, again, I apologize to all for the construed spam, but I assure you
>>>>>> I had our best interest at heart.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
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>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msg/nodejs/-/8XbnLJ38OvoJ.
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>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>>>>>> nodejs+un...@googlegroups.com.
>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at
>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs?hl=en.
>>>>>
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>>>>
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>>>
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>
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Matt
Yes, the job board costs money, but it's not in any way a significant
source of revenue. If you really can't afford $100, you *definitely*
can't afford to hire someone. If you're a buzzword spammer, then $100
is way more than the value you'd gain from annoying us, so it's a good
gate that helps everyone who is honest. Candidates know that the
posts are valid, and positions get taken more seriously.
If the price tag is actually a blocker for you for some reason, then
please contact me, Tom Hughes-Croucher, or Ryan Dahl, and we'll try to
figure something out.
Stephen Belanger
--
Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/
Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
Groups "nodejs" group.
To post to this group, send email to nod...@googlegroups.com
For more options, visit this group at
Sotonin
Roman Land
For jobs outside of the US it might be a long shot to post there, but if its free I would definitely do that.
"Make everything as simple as possible, but not simpler."
- Albert Einstein
Joe Developer
That said, I do think that having a revenue stream isn't something that we should be begrudging anyone. I also think that there is value in there being a cost to posting jobs - as a matter of being able to have some assurance that they are serious about hiring someone.
Stephen Belanger
Mikeal Rogers
we do have a problem with semi-relevant job postings, and more
importantly the endless discussion that follows, flooding the list.
we also have another problem. many developers on this list that would
like to be working with node.js full time arent. both issues need to
be addressed.
the job board is not a solution to either problem. it's not that
appealing to developers because it has less relevancy rules than we
have on this list. if people take issue with these posts being on this
list then why would they want to follow and entire forum for it? and
it's not appealing to job posters because nobody is reading it.
here were my previous suggestions for job posting rules:
- must be posted by an engineer at the company that is hiring. no
recruiters inside or out of the company.
- position must PRIMARILY be working with node.js
if PHP or Java are in the title of a position and node is not, it's
not a valid post for this list.
pretty simple but it means that more than half of the latest posts
would not have come through.
-Mikeal
Isaac Schlueter
> As I said in the other thread - it's not that $100 is too much, it's that it
> means companies have to invoice for it, get cost centres involved (HR vs the
> department you're hiring for), approve the money, etc.
Yeah. Any company that's serious about hiring someone should be able
to find room in their budget to do this. I remain unconvinced that
this is actually a blocker for many companies. Feedback from actual
hiring managers facing this problem would be helpful.
> Just make it moderated. That's how jobs.perl.org works and it's a very
> successful setup.
No one's saying it's going to be for-pay forever, but it's cutting
down on noise for now, with very little effort.
If you'd like to post a job offer, and the price tag is a blocker, and
you're an actual person who's actually trying to hire a noder to do a
job with node, we'd love to hear about your situation.
On Fri, Jun 24, 2011 at 13:59, Mikeal Rogers <mikeal...@gmail.com> wrote:
> we do have a problem with semi-relevant job postings, and more
> importantly the endless discussion that follows, flooding the list.
+1! That was my motivation for writing up guidelines.
> the job board is not a solution to either problem. it's not that
> appealing to developers because it has less relevancy rules than we
> have on this list. if people take issue with these posts being on this
> list then why would they want to follow and entire forum for it? and
> it's not appealing to job posters because nobody is reading it.
I think that a large part of the problem has to do with the fact that
it's not clear that there *is* a job board to someone who hasn't
already seen a bunch of these discussions.
> here were my previous suggestions for job posting rules:
It's much simpler to say "post jobs over there, and not here" than to
explain what is ok and what isn't. That being said, the guidelines
you suggest are pretty reasonable, in my opinion.
But still, if it has to be from a non-recruiter/hr person, and has to
be primarily working with node, then that cuts out a lot of jobs that
noders would probably still love to hear about. Directing traffic to
the job board is a good thing. If you're writing PHP for a day job
now, and you could be writing PHP and Node for a day job somewhere
else, then that's a net improvement, if your goal is to be working
with node.
Mikeal Rogers
> On Fri, Jun 24, 2011 at 12:10, Matt <hel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> As I said in the other thread - it's not that $100 is too much, it's that it
>> means companies have to invoice for it, get cost centres involved (HR vs the
>> department you're hiring for), approve the money, etc.
>
> Yeah. Any company that's serious about hiring someone should be able
> to find room in their budget to do this. I remain unconvinced that
> this is actually a blocker for many companies. Feedback from actual
> hiring managers facing this problem would be helpful.
>
i agree, I fail to see the price tag or paperwork behind spending the
money as the real blocker. I think this is a red herring.
the real blocker is that the people who you want to reach won't watch
a job board. it's a common hiring dichotomy that the people you want
to employ are the least likely to be actively looking for new work.
the challenge for us is to find a ruleset that gets relevant posts to
a very high value audience without annoying them.
>> Just make it moderated. That's how jobs.perl.org works and it's a very
>> successful setup.
>
> No one's saying it's going to be for-pay forever, but it's cutting
> down on noise for now, with very little effort.
>
> If you'd like to post a job offer, and the price tag is a blocker, and
> you're an actual person who's actually trying to hire a noder to do a
> job with node, we'd love to hear about your situation.
>
>
> On Fri, Jun 24, 2011 at 13:59, Mikeal Rogers <mikeal...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> we do have a problem with semi-relevant job postings, and more
>> importantly the endless discussion that follows, flooding the list.
>
> +1! That was my motivation for writing up guidelines.
>
>> the job board is not a solution to either problem. it's not that
>> appealing to developers because it has less relevancy rules than we
>> have on this list. if people take issue with these posts being on this
>> list then why would they want to follow and entire forum for it? and
>> it's not appealing to job posters because nobody is reading it.
>
> I think that a large part of the problem has to do with the fact that
> it's not clear that there *is* a job board to someone who hasn't
> already seen a bunch of these discussions.
that might be part of it, but I would still ask the question: if
people don't want that content on this list why would they follow a
forum dedicated to it?
>
>
>> here were my previous suggestions for job posting rules:
>
> It's much simpler to say "post jobs over there, and not here" than to
> explain what is ok and what isn't. That being said, the guidelines
> you suggest are pretty reasonable, in my opinion.
>
> But still, if it has to be from a non-recruiter/hr person, and has to
> be primarily working with node, then that cuts out a lot of jobs that
> noders would probably still love to hear about. Directing traffic to
> the job board is a good thing. If you're writing PHP for a day job
> now, and you could be writing PHP and Node for a day job somewhere
> else, then that's a net improvement, if your goal is to be working
> with node.
if a recruiter finds our rules and can't find an engineer to post it
for them and put their reputation on the line then I don't think it's
the type of post we want.
we need to leverage the existing social structure in the place our
community *already is* to filter content for relevancy.
>
> --
> Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/
> Posting guidelines: https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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Matt
On Fri, Jun 24, 2011 at 12:10, Matt <hel...@gmail.com> wrote:Yeah. Any company that's serious about hiring someone should be able
> As I said in the other thread - it's not that $100 is too much, it's that it
> means companies have to invoice for it, get cost centres involved (HR vs the
> department you're hiring for), approve the money, etc.
to find room in their budget to do this. I remain unconvinced that
this is actually a blocker for many companies. Feedback from actual
hiring managers facing this problem would be helpful.
Ben Noordhuis
> On Fri, Jun 24, 2011 at 5:09 PM, Isaac Schlueter <i...@izs.me> wrote:
>> Yeah. Any company that's serious about hiring someone should be able
>> to find room in their budget to do this. I remain unconvinced that
>> this is actually a blocker for many companies. Feedback from actual
>> hiring managers facing this problem would be helpful.
>
> I am involved in the hiring process, I'm not just spouting ideas for the
> sake of it. Now granted I'm with a super-large company (18k employees), and
> we're not hiring node people, but here if you're not using a previously
> approved supplier (in this case a recruitment agency) then good luck getting
> money approved. It just won't happen.
Me too post. I did hiring at a company with 4k employees. Getting a
$100 expenditure authorized could easily take over a month there. I
should tell you sometime about that one lousy server we wanted
provisioned...
Joe Developer
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Tauren Mills
I would prefer to see only relevant job postings on this list. I am
not going to go looking for them somewhere else, it just isn't
something that I will think to do on a regular basis. Out-of-sight,
out-of-mind. And I certainly wouldn't subscribe to a jobs-only mailing
list and be inundated with a bunch of recruiter crap.
However, if we must use a separate website for posting jobs, why
couldn't jobs.nodejs.com or nodejobs.com send out a weekly report to
this list? The announcement would provide a list of the job titles
posted that week. It could be easily ignored by those who don't care,
and would remind others to go check out the job board.
Regarding the cost, I understand the reasoning to charge something to
weed out noise. But aren't we trying to foster and grow this
community? Setting up barriers like this will probably reduce the
number of opportunities. For instance, if I am just looking for
someone to help me out with something small for a day on a consulting
basis, the $100 fee could represent a good size chunk of my budget. At
least until Node becomes a bit more mainstream, it might be wise to
not charge a fee.
Lastly, when a company is looking for someone to hire, many don't like
to limit themselves to one outlet. Granted, this list is probably the
best place to find node developers. But StackOverflow's Careers 2.0
service ($350) might be appealing too. These costs start adding up,
especially for a bootstrapped startup.
http://careers.stackoverflow.com/jobs?searchTerm=node.js&location=
Just my 2c.
Tauren
Stephen Belanger
Isaac Schlueter
controversial than I'd expected. :D
I've heard a lot of opinions today from a bunch of people. Some are
definitely more right than others, since they conflict, but I'm not
sure which. Here's what we know, and I hope most of this is fairly
uncontroversial:
1) A price tag on a job board will prevent some valid jobs from being posted.
2) A price tag on a job board will increase the average validity of
the jobs that *are* posted there.
3) Job posts on the mailing list are hard to get right.
4) A job board no one checks is not very valuable to post to.
5) A job board no one posts to is not very valuable to check.
6) The node job board is not well publicized.
For #6, at least, this link in the footer should help a lot:
> Job Board: http://jobs.nodejs.org/
I don't really see how emails that are "easy to ignore" are any better
(in terms of pure publicity) than a job board that no one visits.
Clearly, either the emails are not as easy to ignore as the website,
or they're not any more useful for an employer.
The community reaction to job posts seems to indicate to me that
they're not all that easy to ignore. Node is brand new. I think the
number of "pure node.js" jobs out there is pretty slim. There are a
lot of jobs, though, that involve a lot of bash and server admin
stuff, maybe some python or ruby, some front-end jQuery/html/css type
stuff, and so on.
None of this is set in stone. Let's see if the added publicity makes
any difference. What I really don't want to do is come up with a set
of rules more complicated than "Job posts should go at X", and
continue having these drawn out debates about it.
Maybe we need to flip that whole thing on its head, and have a place
where noders can post their availability and github info, and get
contacted directly.
h...@neosource.cl
We do what we do with some idealism. We do it for fun, we do it to fullfill ourselves someway.
Methinks that we should be more tolerant, and try to sit back and enjoy the trip.
What I'm trying to say is: 'if you don't like it, ignore it'. Ranting just adds pressure to the oven...
Haj.-
shawn wilson
I don't know if I like the 'if you don't like it ignore it' thing, but I like the 'sit back and enjoy the ride' part... until things get out of hand. I didn't think the job posts were out of hand yet.
As long as jobs are noted as such '[JOB]', why not. Granted, these posts are probably ot, but so are update announcements '[ANN]' (imo - they aren't code related).
I will probably add the jobs rss to my feeds in diggcatcher (Android app) but I am less likely to look at that than email (donno why - that's just me).
$100 for a job board... whatever. Craigslist is pretty popular around here.
Long of the short: I don't see the issue with job postings here.
john.tiger
what about feeding the valid posts on the job board into the main list
for the visibility that many want. That way they meet the screening
test, but everyone still sees it.
btw as a tight fisted business owner, I think the $100 fee is perfectly
reasonable. Any company involved in hiring should certainly have some
ad budget associated with it and if HR can't be convinced that a Node
users group is the best place to look for Node programmers, well....
>>>>> To post to this group, send email tono...@googlegroups.com
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>>>> --
>>>> Job Board:http://jobs.nodejs.org/
>>>> Posting guidelines:
>>>> https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines
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>>>>
>>> --
>>> Job Board:http://jobs.nodejs.org/
>>> Posting guidelines:
>>> https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines
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>> --
>> Job Board:http://jobs.nodejs.org/
>> Posting guidelines:
>> https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines
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Dean Landolt
Boy, humans sure are fun and surprising. This is so much more
controversial than I'd expected. :D
Jacobus brogly.decap
for jobs to be posted here.
Isaac Schlueter
<jacobu...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I dont think Google groups would allow for people charging money (even via a
> -"second handshake"-site)
> for jobs to be posted here.
I'm not sure, but that's a good point.
Quite apart from how Google would feel about it, though, that just
sounds really complicated. It seems a lot simpler to just say "Post
jobs at http://jobs.nodejs.org/, and not here. If you want to see job
posts, that's where they are."
I think "the policy that would be ideal if everyone followed it" is
probably not as good as "the policy that's easy to follow, easy to
enforce, and solves most of the problems."
Dean Landolt
On Sun, Jun 26, 2011 at 01:40, Jacobus brogly.decapI'm not sure, but that's a good point.
<jacobu...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I dont think Google groups would allow for people charging money (even via a
> -"second handshake"-site)
> for jobs to be posted here.
Quite apart from how Google would feel about it, though, that just
sounds really complicated. It seems a lot simpler to just say "Post
jobs at http://jobs.nodejs.org/, and not here. If you want to see job
posts, that's where they are."
I think "the policy that would be ideal if everyone followed it" is
probably not as good as "the policy that's easy to follow, easy to
enforce, and solves most of the problems."
Mikeal Rogers
i don't think the issue people have is with frequency of job posts specifically. this comes up every time something that is irrelevant to a large number of people on the list starts to flood the list. the last one i can remember is the "let's do node but with coroutines" and i was probably freaking out more than anyone.
rules are stupid.
rules take more effort to enforce than they take to follow.
by our current rules you could post a message to the list about every small release of your library you push to npm in an effort to promote it. people don't do that, cause everyone would hate them. people are invested in this list and the community.
we have already established some amount of social capital and best practices that are not documented but somewhat understood by those participating in the list. we should build on that. we shouldn't try to create a set of rigid guidelines for what *can* be on the list but simply document what is not acceptable.
this list is moderated, we can remove posts that flagrantly violate best practices.
if we establish best practices for job posts that leverage the existing social structure of the list it will be, mostly, self enforcing and whatever makes it through by people who are not invested in the list (like recruiters) we can just remove.
let's be honest, nobody is going to look at that job board. as easy as it sounds to "just move all that stuff over there", it's not easy because people want to see *relevant* job posts and they won't watch a separate job board.
i don't want to hear what happily employed developers or recruiters think about these rules, i want to know what people who are employed but casually search for more exciting employment.
also, i'm as concerned with the rest of the rules posted on that wiki page as being too rigid and somewhat bossy as i am concerned with the job posting section.
how about this:
nodejs -- for discussion and help *with* node.js and node.js libraries
nodejs-dev -- for discussion and issues *in* node.js
Rules
- do not be an asshole
- really, don't be an asshole
- no, i'm serious, don't be an asshole
friesnow
desolate place.
If moderation is (understandably) a pain point for Isaac, how about
choosing some additional admins from trusted associates? That's what
Groups-based lists typically end up doing to combat spam anyway.
I had read backward to the beginning of May last week and I think
there were only 5 or 6 job posts during that time. How many package
announcements were made during the same period?
Isaac Schlueter
> I was just looking at the job board before reading this. It's a
> desolate place.
It's not too different than what's on nodejobs.com, or Dice or Hotjobs
if you search for "node.js". The difference is that posts on
http://jobs.nodejs.org expire after 1 month, and are only allowed if
they're specifically searching for Node.js devs to work on Node.js
problems. (That is, not just "experience a plus".) There just aren't
that many companies (yet) trying to hire specifically node-focused
employees.
I think it makes sense to extend the expiration time a bit.
> If moderation is (understandably) a pain point for Isaac, how about
> choosing some additional admins from trusted associates? That's what
> Groups-based lists typically end up doing to combat spam anyway.
I'm actually one of I think 5 or 6 people who can moderate the list.
Ryan's the owner, I believe.
> I had read backward to the beginning of May last week and I think
> there were only 5 or 6 job posts during that time. How many package
> announcements were made during the same period?
I'm measuring the relevance by number of complaints, not by the number
of threads.
Shimon Doodkin
i strongly discourage offensive behavior against _humble_ posters.
everybody should get respected.
with hope to be patient and nice to mailing list posters and in
node.js community.
otherwise you will get people who _will not help you_
also please realize we are here helping each other to make money for
free.
because this is the point of open source.
otherwise we would go to ms.net.
so please keep things free. because this is the point of open source.
and this is our community so please nice to each other
On Jun 24, 10:02 pm, Isaac Schlueter <i...@izs.me> wrote:
> Some people like job posts on the mailing list, because they want to
> see new job postings. http://jobs.nodejs.orghas an RSS feed.
> Subscribe to it.http://jobs.nodejs.org/a/jbb/find-jobs-rss
>
> Other people find these posts to be annoying. At the very least, it
> encourages a lot of "don't post that here" "nono, you should post that
> here" discussions, which are highly flammable, and pretty worthless.
>
> People posting jobs don't always realize that there IS a job board,
> which is why they post them here, and then they get a bunch of guff
> from the very people that they're trying to help and befriend. Here
> we are hijacking this poor guy's attempt to find a node.js developer,
> simply because he wants a developer who also knows php (a 100% fair
> request, imo).
>
> As a moderator of this list, I've had to bat away quite a few
> moderated-first-messages that were obvious nonsensical recruiter
> buzzword spam of the worst sort, not looking for nodejs devs at all,
> including at least one for a "Jquery Java/JavaScript .NET" programmer.
> Some of those have gotten through, because apparently google groups'
> spam-prevention rules have some loopholes.
>
> We've discussed it on this list in the past, and on the nodejs-dev
> list, but haven't really ever made the policy explicit. It's
> especially confusing because it used to be *encouraged* for a while.
> So, I wrote up this:https://github.com/joyent/node/wiki/Mailing-List-Posting-Guidelines
>
> That's gonna be linked at the bottom of the mailing list messages now.
> If you think that there are things that should be changed in that
> policy, then let's talk about it.
> Yes, the job board costs money, but it's not in any way a significant
> source of revenue. If you really can't afford $100, you *definitely*
> can't afford to hire someone. If you're a buzzword spammer, then $100
> is way more than the value you'd gain from annoying us, so it's a good
> gate that helps everyone who is honest. Candidates know that the
> posts are valid, and positions get taken more seriously.
>
> If the price tag is actually a blocker for you for some reason, then
> please contact me, Tom Hughes-Croucher, or Ryan Dahl, and we'll try to
> figure something out.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> <jacobusbog...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > LOL, yeah , I just took a look at the link he was supposed to post the
> > job,...$100 a pop... I bet he doesnt own stock)))
> > Socialist thinking always does a good job in killing innovation)
>
> > 2011/6/24 Sotonin <soto...@gmail.com>
>
> >> Indeed. It's hardly "out of control" seeing a job posting like one a week
> >> at most.... hell even 1 per day is fine in my book... Why force people to go
> >> elsewhere. preface with [JOB] as this guy did and nobody is forcing you to
> >> open the email. delete it.
>
> >> On Fri, Jun 24, 2011 at 1:20 PM, Jacobus brogly.decap
> >> <jacobusbog...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>> Indeed, Keep the job-post comming)).
> >>> The nagging is nothing other then the rot is US culture thinking
> >>> something commercial is (quote) "crap" or "belongs somewhere else."
>
> >>> 2011/6/24 Sotonin <soto...@gmail.com>
>
> >>>> Agreed. this post was not spam in my opinion. It was a valid post. Don't
> >>>> pay to post a ad somewhere.
>
> >>>> On Fri, Jun 24, 2011 at 1:00 PM, Jacobus brogly.decap
> >>>> <jacobusbog...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>>>> Knowledge on economic activity with node.js is absoluutly crucial in
> >>>>> having the use of node.js grow!
> >>>>> Post like this absoluutly belong in this group!
> >>>>> 2011/6/24 Buzzedword <dgar...@gmail.com>
>
> >>>>>> Not to seem the hypocrite, but I'm in agreement with you. The job
> >>>>>> postings have been getting a bit ridiculous lately, but all the same I feel
> >>>>>> that we need to make a delineation somewhere. In order for node to succeed,
> >>>>>> there has to be work with it. As part of the community, we have a
> >>>>>> responsibility to help it grow-- be it by asking intelligent questions,
> >>>>>> providing feedback, contributing software, and in certain cases, yes I do
> >>>>>> believe job postings should also be endorsed. The main difference is that I
> >>>>>> don't particularly care for cold calls with no background on node, just
> >>>>>> understanding it's the "next big thing". Full disclosure: for this posting,
> >>>>>> I receive no commission, no monetary gain, nothing. An associate came to me
> >>>>>> with this offer, explained what they were looking for, explained what they
> >>>>>> did NOT want to do (switch entirely to node) and explained what had to be
> >>>>>> achieved.
> >>>>>> I felt that an opportunity like this, to be able to take node as not
> >>>>>> just a primary stack but as a supplementary technology was an enticing
> >>>>>> promise, and overall felt that it would be a great way to get more exposure
> >>>>>> to node in resistant markets with low risk. Does it go against everything I
> >>>>>> believe in to post a job on the list? Yes. Do I feel the benefits to our
> >>>>>> community outweighed the backlash? Absolutely. I will stand behind that 100
> >>>>>> percent.
> >>>>>> At the same time, I do feel that we need an appropriate outlet for
> >>>>>> this kind of outreach-- the jobs board is a little steep for raising
> >>>>>> awareness, which is really all I was attempting to do.
> >>>>>> So, again, I apologize to all for the construed spam, but I assure you
> >>>>>> I had our best interest at heart.
>
> >>>>>> --
> >>>>>> Groups "nodejs" group.
> >>>>>>https://groups.google.com/d/msg/nodejs/-/8XbnLJ38OvoJ.
> >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to nod...@googlegroups.com.
>
> >>>>> --
> >>>>> Groups "nodejs" group.
>
> >>>> --
> >>>> Groups "nodejs" group.
>
> >>> --
> >>> "nodejs" group.
>
> >> --
> >> "nodejs" group.
>
> > --
> > "nodejs" group.
Dan Di Spaltro
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