> Guys, be nice. Dennis is unusual, sure, but unusual isn't bad. We're > all unusual in some way. I don't see anything sociopathic or trollish > here, just a lot of excitement about a program he's writing, and > perhaps a bit of naivety regarding the best ways to go about > recruiting contributors.
> Dennis,
> The reason you're getting no traction here is that your "I'm going to > be a larger than life superhero because of my code, which I want you > to help with, and it'll make you rich, but no, you can't see it" > matches a *very* common pattern of "crazy person", which we've all > seen before. It's a lot of talk, and no substance. It's trying to > spend credibility on credit, and that's not how credibility works.
> I'd recommend that you assume that no one will take you seriously, and > focus on overcoming that, if your goal is actually to be successful > and recruit others to your mission of whatever it is you hope to > accomplish with your technology. Of course, if your goal is to get a > little bit of attention, and wave your freak flag, well, then bravo, > you're doing a wonderful job, please carry on :)
> FWIW, I agree with most of your politics, and wish you the best of > success. You seem like a nice person. But if you want to recruit > coders, write more code, and fewer words, and share it liberally. The > revolution in software already happened, and that's the new paradigm. > You will gain more credibility if you become a part of the OSS > community before asking it for favors.
> On Tue, Oct 9, 2012 at 1:10 AM, Joshua Gross <joshua...@gmail.com<javascript:>> > wrote: > > Maybe I'll get one, too :) this doesn't seem to be going anywhere > though.
> > -- Joshua Gross > > Christian / SpanDeX / BA Candidate of Computer Science, UW-Madison 2013 > > 414-377-1041 / http://www.joshisgross.com
> > On Oct 9, 2012, at 12:04 AM, Rick Waldron <waldro...@gmail.com<javascript:>> > wrote:
> > Funny thing, I said much the same as you have here and got a gnarly > > chastising.
> > -Rick
> > On Monday, October 8, 2012 at 11:37 PM, Joshua Gross wrote:
> > Dennis, this is a developer forum. If you want to peddle your software > and > > aren't willing to show something besides videos, you're in the wrong > place.
> > Also I'm not going to watch a 15 minute video. You're not selling > yourself > > very well, I kindly advise you to move on so this stops clogging my > inbox :)
> > -- Joshua Gross > > Christian / SpanDeX / BA Candidate of Computer Science, UW-Madison 2013 > > 414-377-1041 / http://www.joshisgross.com
> > On Oct 8, 2012, at 7:12 PM, Dennis Kane <dka...@gmail.com <javascript:>> > wrote:
> > Why do you want the code so bad? It's not like there's any kind of > fancy > > algorithms at work. There are many many open source windowing packages > out > > there. It's not exactly rocket science, this. It's all been done many > > times before. The only difference is that this one is *my* baby! > Besides, > > you are welcome to all the code of my desktop prototype on my site at > > luvluvluv.info... it's just sitting there on the server for the taking.
> > I am mainly using this thing as blackmail to get people to be interested > in > > being my friend. I want to do some real world community building, and > > something like this will go a long way to get a cooperative business up > and > > running.
> > Furthermore... you do realize that asking another programmer to "just > show > > me your code" is exactly the same as asking a girl to "just show me your > > breasts", right? I mean, I have nothing against it in principle, but, > my > > god... I hardly know ye!!!
> > My lastest work includes that rubber-band selection feature as well as > > dropping icons directly onto folder icons (with that "open folder" hover > > trick). I have also included some basic image file support.
> > The current version of the program now includes drag and drop > functionality > > of text files from the native desktop straight into the browser desktop > or > > (any of the subfolders). The difference between my drag and drop and all > the > > HTML5 demos that you see on the web is that the dropped files > immediately > > become icons that are integrated into the program.
> > I will soon start working on getting multimedia icons/files working, so > > you'll be able to drop those directly in too. Then I will probably do a > > very basic kind of image editing demo that will allow you to change > > individual pixels or some such nonsense. But I don't want to get bogged > > down in the details of any particular application, because I always want > to > > stay focused on the big picture of creating a totally powerful and > intuitive > > way to organize our online lives.
> > Anyway, I know I am quite a controversial figure here, but there should > be > > no controversy that this thing is just about ready for prime time. I > really > > do need to start getting interested people on board who would like to > help > > me push the web forward. The basic mission statement for the venture > will > > basically be that the "old web" (HTML4/version 1.0) is dead and gone. > If > > anyone calls in search of help on their Flintstone era <html> documents > with > > all of their <a href> and <div> tags laying about, we'll just point them > in > > an entirely new direction. If they still insist on doing things the old > > way, we'll just hang up on them… This thing is all about the future!
> > We can easily develop libraries of high-level interface widgets that > people > > just need to attach event listeners to. There will be no angle brackets > in > > sight! <hand><coded><html><markup></is></so></last></millenium>!
> > Come one, come all, for the thrill of your lives :)
> > On Tuesday, September 25, 2012 7:36:37 PM UTC-4, Dennis Kane wrote:
> > I was thinking of just responding to this old thread, in which I talk > about > > the browser based Desktop that I've been working on, but the new thing > I've > > been doing for the past week is so superior that I thought it deserved a > > completely new thead. By the way, I know this forum is all about server > > side Javascript, but there is not really any serious place one can go on > the > > web that talks about the client side. Besides, with socket.io & > > websockets... I don't really make much of a distinction between client > and > > server anymore. I just know that there's no reason to do a > > document.getElementById() call in node :)
> > This new thing is a totally shocking clone of OS X. I knew I was going > to > > have to start over from the ground up, because my previous code base was > so > > sh*tty, haha! I have really been concentrating on getting a nice, tight > > little API that developers will positively drool over. I don't want to > make > > this thing publicly available for many reasons... but you can check out > a > > youtube vid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tq_W19QokXk) that shows it > in > > action, and I still have my same old crappy prototype online at > > http://luvluvluv.info. Well, hopefully this is proof that I am able to > do > > some cool stuff, and hopefully summa yous will want to start being my > friend > > now, LOL!!!
> > And get this... the current, uncompressed js file size is only 54kb!
> I said much the same as you have here and got a gnarly chastising.
I don't remember exactly what you said, or how I chastised you, but I
do remember
it was the words used, not the message.
I was on a curmudgeon role that day. I chastised someone for calling
another user a "tard". I couldn't believe two people came back and
defended his usage.
And yes, I'm the nice-police.
On Mon, Oct 8, 2012 at 10:04 PM, Rick Waldron <waldron.r...@gmail.com>wrote:
> Funny thing, I said much the same as you have here and got a gnarly
> chastising.
> -Rick
> On Monday, October 8, 2012 at 11:37 PM, Joshua Gross wrote:
> Dennis, this is a developer forum. If you want to peddle your software and
> aren't willing to show something besides videos, you're in the wrong place.
> Also I'm not going to watch a 15 minute video. You're not selling yourself
> very well, I kindly advise you to move on so this stops clogging my inbox :)
> -- Joshua Gross
> Christian / SpanDeX / BA Candidate of Computer Science, UW-Madison 2013
> 414-377-1041 / http://www.joshisgross.com
> On Oct 8, 2012, at 7:12 PM, Dennis Kane <dkan...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Why do you want the code so bad? It's not like there's any kind of fancy
> algorithms at work. There are many many open source windowing packages out
> there. It's not exactly rocket science, this. It's all been done many
> times before. The only difference is that this one is *my* baby! Besides,
> you are welcome to all the code of my desktop prototype on my site at
> luvluvluv.info... it's just sitting there on the server for the taking.
> I am mainly using this thing as blackmail to get people to be interested
> in being my friend. I want to do some real world community building, and
> something like this will go a long way to get a cooperative business up and
> running.
> Furthermore... you do realize that asking another programmer to "just show
> me your code" is exactly the same as asking a girl to "just show me your
> breasts", right? I mean, I have nothing against it in principle, but, my
> god... I hardly know ye!!!
> My lastest work includes that rubber-band selection feature as well as
> dropping icons directly onto folder icons (with that "open folder" hover
> trick). I have also included some basic image file support.
> The current version of the program now includes drag and drop
> functionality of text files from the native desktop straight into the
> browser desktop or (any of the subfolders). The difference between my drag
> and drop and all the HTML5 demos that you see on the web is that the
> dropped files immediately become icons that are integrated into the program.
> I will soon start working on getting multimedia icons/files working, so
> you'll be able to drop those directly in too. Then I will probably do a
> very basic kind of image editing demo that will allow you to change
> individual pixels or some such nonsense. But I don't want to get bogged
> down in the details of any particular application, because I always want to
> stay focused on the big picture of creating a totally powerful and
> intuitive way to organize our online lives.
> Anyway, I know I am quite a controversial figure here, but there should be
> no controversy that this thing is just about ready for prime time. I
> really do need to start getting interested people on board who would like
> to help me push the web forward. The basic mission statement for the
> venture will basically be that the "old web" (HTML4/version 1.0) is dead
> and gone. If anyone calls in search of help on their Flintstone era <html>
> documents with all of their <a href> and <div> tags laying about, we'll
> just point them in an entirely new direction. If they still insist on
> doing things the old way, we'll just hang up on them… This thing is all
> about the future!
> We can easily develop libraries of high-level interface widgets that
> people just need to attach event listeners to. There will be no angle
> brackets in sight! <hand><coded><html><markup></**
> is></so></last></millenium>!
> Come one, come all, for the thrill of your lives :)
> On Tuesday, September 25, 2012 7:36:37 PM UTC-4, Dennis Kane wrote:
> I was thinking of just responding to this old thread<https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!topic/nodejs/bEhSbsm24Y4>,
> in which I talk about the browser based Desktop that I've been working on,
> but the new thing I've been doing for the past week is so superior that I
> thought it deserved a completely new thead. By the way, I know this forum
> is all about server side Javascript, but there is not really any serious
> place one can go on the web that talks about the client side. Besides,
> with socket.io & websockets... I don't really make much of a distinction
> between client and server anymore. I just know that there's no reason to
> do a document.getElementById() call in node :)
> This new thing is a totally shocking clone of OS X. I knew I was going to
> have to start over from the ground up, because my previous code base was so
> sh*tty, haha! I have really been concentrating on getting a nice, tight
> little API that developers will positively drool over. I don't want to
> make this thing publicly available for many reasons... but you can check
> out a youtube vid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?****v=Tq_W19QokXk<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tq_W19QokXk>) that
> shows it in action, and I still have my same old crappy prototype online at
> http://luvluvluv.info. Well, hopefully this is proof that I am able to
> do some cool stuff, and hopefully summa yous will want to start being my
> friend now, LOL!!!
> And get this... the current, uncompressed js file size is only 54kb!
Carbyn was a real startup that had a lot of the features I've seen
mentioned here and was very well executed on IMHO, not to mention the
upcoming Firefox OS, webOS, and various others in the past. I empathize
with your sentiments that you feel you are seeing beyond the curvature of
where things are currently headed, but as everyone states here talk is
cheap. Familiarize yourself better with your "competitors" and past
precedents and outline specifically in what ways you are trailblazing, in
what ways you are iterating, and in what ways you are doing things exactly
the same way because they worked well for others and you'll find others
tuning out a lot less.
You've been pretty long-winded here. Strive for brevity and conciseness to
be more effective. I wanted to experience the story and vision you are
painting, but stopped far short as I lost interest, and I am someone that
*wanted* to go along. Also, I completely disagree with your political
views, but not your passion and goals with this project. Injecting politics
into software isn't new, but I think you're going to make more enemies than
allies when you do so. In other words, political zealotry is cheap too.
Bringing people together is the real hard work.
On Tue, Oct 9, 2012 at 10:43 AM, Mark Hahn <m...@hahnca.com> wrote:
> > I said much the same as you have here and got a gnarly chastising.
> I don't remember exactly what you said, or how I chastised you, but I do remember
> it was the words used, not the message.
> I was on a curmudgeon role that day. I chastised someone for calling
> another user a "tard". I couldn't believe two people came back and
> defended his usage.
> And yes, I'm the nice-police.
> On Mon, Oct 8, 2012 at 10:04 PM, Rick Waldron <waldron.r...@gmail.com>wrote:
>> Funny thing, I said much the same as you have here and got a gnarly
>> chastising.
>> -Rick
>> On Monday, October 8, 2012 at 11:37 PM, Joshua Gross wrote:
>> Dennis, this is a developer forum. If you want to peddle your software
>> and aren't willing to show something besides videos, you're in the wrong
>> place.
>> Also I'm not going to watch a 15 minute video. You're not selling
>> yourself very well, I kindly advise you to move on so this stops clogging
>> my inbox :)
>> -- Joshua Gross
>> Christian / SpanDeX / BA Candidate of Computer Science, UW-Madison 2013
>> 414-377-1041 / http://www.joshisgross.com
>> On Oct 8, 2012, at 7:12 PM, Dennis Kane <dkan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Why do you want the code so bad? It's not like there's any kind of fancy
>> algorithms at work. There are many many open source windowing packages out
>> there. It's not exactly rocket science, this. It's all been done many
>> times before. The only difference is that this one is *my* baby! Besides,
>> you are welcome to all the code of my desktop prototype on my site at
>> luvluvluv.info... it's just sitting there on the server for the taking.
>> I am mainly using this thing as blackmail to get people to be interested
>> in being my friend. I want to do some real world community building, and
>> something like this will go a long way to get a cooperative business up and
>> running.
>> Furthermore... you do realize that asking another programmer to "just
>> show me your code" is exactly the same as asking a girl to "just show me
>> your breasts", right? I mean, I have nothing against it in principle, but,
>> my god... I hardly know ye!!!
>> My lastest work includes that rubber-band selection feature as well as
>> dropping icons directly onto folder icons (with that "open folder" hover
>> trick). I have also included some basic image file support.
>> The current version of the program now includes drag and drop
>> functionality of text files from the native desktop straight into the
>> browser desktop or (any of the subfolders). The difference between my drag
>> and drop and all the HTML5 demos that you see on the web is that the
>> dropped files immediately become icons that are integrated into the program.
>> I will soon start working on getting multimedia icons/files working, so
>> you'll be able to drop those directly in too. Then I will probably do a
>> very basic kind of image editing demo that will allow you to change
>> individual pixels or some such nonsense. But I don't want to get bogged
>> down in the details of any particular application, because I always want to
>> stay focused on the big picture of creating a totally powerful and
>> intuitive way to organize our online lives.
>> Anyway, I know I am quite a controversial figure here, but there should
>> be no controversy that this thing is just about ready for prime time. I
>> really do need to start getting interested people on board who would like
>> to help me push the web forward. The basic mission statement for the
>> venture will basically be that the "old web" (HTML4/version 1.0) is dead
>> and gone. If anyone calls in search of help on their Flintstone era <html>
>> documents with all of their <a href> and <div> tags laying about, we'll
>> just point them in an entirely new direction. If they still insist on
>> doing things the old way, we'll just hang up on them… This thing is all
>> about the future!
>> We can easily develop libraries of high-level interface widgets that
>> people just need to attach event listeners to. There will be no angle
>> brackets in sight! <hand><coded><html><markup></**
>> is></so></last></millenium>!
>> Come one, come all, for the thrill of your lives :)
>> On Tuesday, September 25, 2012 7:36:37 PM UTC-4, Dennis Kane wrote:
>> I was thinking of just responding to this old thread<https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!topic/nodejs/bEhSbsm24Y4>,
>> in which I talk about the browser based Desktop that I've been working on,
>> but the new thing I've been doing for the past week is so superior that I
>> thought it deserved a completely new thead. By the way, I know this forum
>> is all about server side Javascript, but there is not really any serious
>> place one can go on the web that talks about the client side. Besides,
>> with socket.io & websockets... I don't really make much of a distinction
>> between client and server anymore. I just know that there's no reason to
>> do a document.getElementById() call in node :)
>> This new thing is a totally shocking clone of OS X. I knew I was going
>> to have to start over from the ground up, because my previous code base was
>> so sh*tty, haha! I have really been concentrating on getting a nice, tight
>> little API that developers will positively drool over. I don't want to
>> make this thing publicly available for many reasons... but you can check
>> out a youtube vid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?****v=Tq_W19QokXk<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tq_W19QokXk>) that
>> shows it in action, and I still have my same old crappy prototype online at
>> http://luvluvluv.info. Well, hopefully this is proof that I am able to
>> do some cool stuff, and hopefully summa yous will want to start being my
>> friend now, LOL!!!
>> And get this... the current, uncompressed js file size is only 54kb!
> I was on a curmudgeon role that day. I chastised someone for calling
> another user a "tard". I couldn't believe two people came back and
> defended his usage.
> And yes, I'm the nice-police.
> On Mon, Oct 8, 2012 at 10:04 PM, Rick Waldron <waldron.r...@gmail.com>wrote:
>> Funny thing, I said much the same as you have here and got a gnarly
>> chastising.
>> -Rick
>> On Monday, October 8, 2012 at 11:37 PM, Joshua Gross wrote:
>> Dennis, this is a developer forum. If you want to peddle your software
>> and aren't willing to show something besides videos, you're in the wrong
>> place.
>> Also I'm not going to watch a 15 minute video. You're not selling
>> yourself very well, I kindly advise you to move on so this stops clogging
>> my inbox :)
>> -- Joshua Gross
>> Christian / SpanDeX / BA Candidate of Computer Science, UW-Madison 2013
>> 414-377-1041 / http://www.joshisgross.com
>> On Oct 8, 2012, at 7:12 PM, Dennis Kane <dkan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Why do you want the code so bad? It's not like there's any kind of fancy
>> algorithms at work. There are many many open source windowing packages out
>> there. It's not exactly rocket science, this. It's all been done many
>> times before. The only difference is that this one is *my* baby! Besides,
>> you are welcome to all the code of my desktop prototype on my site at
>> luvluvluv.info... it's just sitting there on the server for the taking.
>> I am mainly using this thing as blackmail to get people to be interested
>> in being my friend. I want to do some real world community building, and
>> something like this will go a long way to get a cooperative business up and
>> running.
>> Furthermore... you do realize that asking another programmer to "just
>> show me your code" is exactly the same as asking a girl to "just show me
>> your breasts", right? I mean, I have nothing against it in principle, but,
>> my god... I hardly know ye!!!
>> My lastest work includes that rubber-band selection feature as well as
>> dropping icons directly onto folder icons (with that "open folder" hover
>> trick). I have also included some basic image file support.
>> The current version of the program now includes drag and drop
>> functionality of text files from the native desktop straight into the
>> browser desktop or (any of the subfolders). The difference between my drag
>> and drop and all the HTML5 demos that you see on the web is that the
>> dropped files immediately become icons that are integrated into the program.
>> I will soon start working on getting multimedia icons/files working, so
>> you'll be able to drop those directly in too. Then I will probably do a
>> very basic kind of image editing demo that will allow you to change
>> individual pixels or some such nonsense. But I don't want to get bogged
>> down in the details of any particular application, because I always want to
>> stay focused on the big picture of creating a totally powerful and
>> intuitive way to organize our online lives.
>> Anyway, I know I am quite a controversial figure here, but there should
>> be no controversy that this thing is just about ready for prime time. I
>> really do need to start getting interested people on board who would like
>> to help me push the web forward. The basic mission statement for the
>> venture will basically be that the "old web" (HTML4/version 1.0) is dead
>> and gone. If anyone calls in search of help on their Flintstone era <html>
>> documents with all of their <a href> and <div> tags laying about, we'll
>> just point them in an entirely new direction. If they still insist on
>> doing things the old way, we'll just hang up on them… This thing is all
>> about the future!
>> We can easily develop libraries of high-level interface widgets that
>> people just need to attach event listeners to. There will be no angle
>> brackets in sight! <hand><coded><html><markup></**
>> is></so></last></millenium>!
>> Come one, come all, for the thrill of your lives :)
>> On Tuesday, September 25, 2012 7:36:37 PM UTC-4, Dennis Kane wrote:
>> I was thinking of just responding to this old thread<https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!topic/nodejs/bEhSbsm24Y4>,
>> in which I talk about the browser based Desktop that I've been working on,
>> but the new thing I've been doing for the past week is so superior that I
>> thought it deserved a completely new thead. By the way, I know this forum
>> is all about server side Javascript, but there is not really any serious
>> place one can go on the web that talks about the client side. Besides,
>> with socket.io & websockets... I don't really make much of a distinction
>> between client and server anymore. I just know that there's no reason to
>> do a document.getElementById() call in node :)
>> This new thing is a totally shocking clone of OS X. I knew I was going
>> to have to start over from the ground up, because my previous code base was
>> so sh*tty, haha! I have really been concentrating on getting a nice, tight
>> little API that developers will positively drool over. I don't want to
>> make this thing publicly available for many reasons... but you can check
>> out a youtube vid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?****v=Tq_W19QokXk<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tq_W19QokXk>) that
>> shows it in action, and I still have my same old crappy prototype online at
>> http://luvluvluv.info. Well, hopefully this is proof that I am able to
>> do some cool stuff, and hopefully summa yous will want to start being my
>> friend now, LOL!!!
>> And get this... the current, uncompressed js file size is only 54kb!
May I say, I endorse Mark Hahn for nice-police, 2012.
Also , much agreed with what Issacs said w.r.t "talk less, code and show
more". If you don't want to show us all of your code, why not talk about
some of the general concepts in a few blog posts, or create a contrived
example that sort of touches on what you are doing in your code? I think we
all understand keeping some of the secret sauce secret, but you know, we
all come here to learn from one another.
Also, if you really want to be revolutionary or a trail-blazer - or hell, a
programmer in general - you will have to adapt the "absolutely giving no
fucks" attitude towards what people say about you in general. A part of you
will have to internalize it ( or else you will never grow ), but if you are
truly working on something great or mind-blowing, there will be a lot of
convincing to do.
You aren't going to convince us with YouTube videos. Try some blog posts
and some code, instead. Good luck.
On Tue, Oct 9, 2012 at 3:11 PM, Rick Waldron <waldron.r...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Oct 9, 2012 at 1:43 PM, Mark Hahn <m...@hahnca.com> wrote:
>> > I said much the same as you have here and got a gnarly chastising.
>> I don't remember exactly what you said, or how I chastised you, but I do remember
>> it was the words used, not the message.
> Wasn't talking about you, homeboy.
>> I was on a curmudgeon role that day. I chastised someone for calling
>> another user a "tard". I couldn't believe two people came back and
>> defended his usage.
>> And yes, I'm the nice-police.
>> On Mon, Oct 8, 2012 at 10:04 PM, Rick Waldron <waldron.r...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>> Funny thing, I said much the same as you have here and got a gnarly
>>> chastising.
>>> -Rick
>>> On Monday, October 8, 2012 at 11:37 PM, Joshua Gross wrote:
>>> Dennis, this is a developer forum. If you want to peddle your software
>>> and aren't willing to show something besides videos, you're in the wrong
>>> place.
>>> Also I'm not going to watch a 15 minute video. You're not selling
>>> yourself very well, I kindly advise you to move on so this stops clogging
>>> my inbox :)
>>> -- Joshua Gross
>>> Christian / SpanDeX / BA Candidate of Computer Science, UW-Madison 2013
>>> 414-377-1041 / http://www.joshisgross.com
>>> On Oct 8, 2012, at 7:12 PM, Dennis Kane <dkan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Why do you want the code so bad? It's not like there's any kind of
>>> fancy algorithms at work. There are many many open source windowing
>>> packages out there. It's not exactly rocket science, this. It's all been
>>> done many times before. The only difference is that this one is *my* baby!
>>> Besides, you are welcome to all the code of my desktop prototype on my
>>> site at luvluvluv.info... it's just sitting there on the server for the
>>> taking.
>>> I am mainly using this thing as blackmail to get people to be interested
>>> in being my friend. I want to do some real world community building, and
>>> something like this will go a long way to get a cooperative business up and
>>> running.
>>> Furthermore... you do realize that asking another programmer to "just
>>> show me your code" is exactly the same as asking a girl to "just show me
>>> your breasts", right? I mean, I have nothing against it in principle, but,
>>> my god... I hardly know ye!!!
>>> My lastest work includes that rubber-band selection feature as well as
>>> dropping icons directly onto folder icons (with that "open folder" hover
>>> trick). I have also included some basic image file support.
>>> The current version of the program now includes drag and drop
>>> functionality of text files from the native desktop straight into the
>>> browser desktop or (any of the subfolders). The difference between my drag
>>> and drop and all the HTML5 demos that you see on the web is that the
>>> dropped files immediately become icons that are integrated into the program.
>>> I will soon start working on getting multimedia icons/files working, so
>>> you'll be able to drop those directly in too. Then I will probably do a
>>> very basic kind of image editing demo that will allow you to change
>>> individual pixels or some such nonsense. But I don't want to get bogged
>>> down in the details of any particular application, because I always want to
>>> stay focused on the big picture of creating a totally powerful and
>>> intuitive way to organize our online lives.
>>> Anyway, I know I am quite a controversial figure here, but there should
>>> be no controversy that this thing is just about ready for prime time. I
>>> really do need to start getting interested people on board who would like
>>> to help me push the web forward. The basic mission statement for the
>>> venture will basically be that the "old web" (HTML4/version 1.0) is dead
>>> and gone. If anyone calls in search of help on their Flintstone era <html>
>>> documents with all of their <a href> and <div> tags laying about, we'll
>>> just point them in an entirely new direction. If they still insist on
>>> doing things the old way, we'll just hang up on them… This thing is all
>>> about the future!
>>> We can easily develop libraries of high-level interface widgets that
>>> people just need to attach event listeners to. There will be no angle
>>> brackets in sight! <hand><coded><html><markup></**
>>> is></so></last></millenium>!
>>> Come one, come all, for the thrill of your lives :)
>>> On Tuesday, September 25, 2012 7:36:37 PM UTC-4, Dennis Kane wrote:
>>> I was thinking of just responding to this old thread<https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!topic/nodejs/bEhSbsm24Y4>,
>>> in which I talk about the browser based Desktop that I've been working on,
>>> but the new thing I've been doing for the past week is so superior that I
>>> thought it deserved a completely new thead. By the way, I know this forum
>>> is all about server side Javascript, but there is not really any serious
>>> place one can go on the web that talks about the client side. Besides,
>>> with socket.io & websockets... I don't really make much of a
>>> distinction between client and server anymore. I just know that there's no
>>> reason to do a document.getElementById() call in node :)
>>> This new thing is a totally shocking clone of OS X. I knew I was going
>>> to have to start over from the ground up, because my previous code base was
>>> so sh*tty, haha! I have really been concentrating on getting a nice, tight
>>> little API that developers will positively drool over. I don't want to
>>> make this thing publicly available for many reasons... but you can check
>>> out a youtube vid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?****v=Tq_W19QokXk<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tq_W19QokXk>) that
>>> shows it in action, and I still have my same old crappy prototype online at
>>> http://luvluvluv.info. Well, hopefully this is proof that I am able to
>>> do some cool stuff, and hopefully summa yous will want to start being my
>>> friend now, LOL!!!
>>> And get this... the current, uncompressed js file size is only 54kb!
> I am mainly using this thing as blackmail to get people to be interested in being my friend. I want to do some real world community building, and something like this will go a long way to get a cooperative business up and running.
> Furthermore... you do realize that asking another programmer to "just show me your code" is exactly the same as asking a girl to "just show me your breasts", right? I mean, I have nothing against it in principle, but, my god... I hardly know ye!!!
Well, sharing code is sort of the main form of currency around web communities these days. If you look at the people in the node community that other people gravitate towards ( and would jump at a chance to work with ), they all produce quite a bit of useful code that they share with the community. And if I'm looking at someone as a technical cofounder, reading their code and seeing how they create working, production-ready libraries are at the top of my list.
So anyways… that's how you do it! Regarding this particular project, I would say many of the people involved in node are people who are interested in rich-client browser apps. The "browser as OS" is an idea that's been around for years now, and many people are already working on it in some form[1]. However, one of the designs that's been tried and rejected along the way is the idea that a browser OS would just be a re-implementation of a desktop GUI, like macOS, only running on a javascript VM with a "cloud" back-end. And some design principals, like a desktop with drag-and-drop, are already going away in general as we move towards mouseless computing. But if out of this project you came up with, say, an improvement on drag-and-drop, or a library that was helpful to people who are building js app's other than a desktop-like interface, people would be interested in those pieces and would give you useful feedback. So breaking up your code into open source libraries and sharing them is super helpful!
BTW, a good short treatise, that was written before the current web boom but predicts many of it's features, is "In the Beginning… Was the Command Line" by Neal Stephenson[2]. Very short, definitely worth the read.
> The current version of the program now includes drag and drop functionality of text files from the native desktop straight into the browser desktop or (any of the subfolders). The difference between my drag and drop and all the HTML5 demos that you see on the web is that the dropped files immediately become icons that are integrated into the program.
> I will soon start working on getting multimedia icons/files working, so you'll be able to drop those directly in too. Then I will probably do a very basic kind of image editing demo that will allow you to change individual pixels or some such nonsense. But I don't want to get bogged down in the details of any particular application, because I always want to stay focused on the big picture of creating a totally powerful and intuitive way to organize our online lives.
> Anyway, I know I am quite a controversial figure here, but there should be no controversy that this thing is just about ready for prime time. I really do need to start getting interested people on board who would like to help me push the web forward. The basic mission statement for the venture will basically be that the "old web" (HTML4/version 1.0) is dead and gone. If anyone calls in search of help on their Flintstone era <html> documents with all of their <a href> and <div> tags laying about, we'll just point them in an entirely new direction. If they still insist on doing things the old way, we'll just hang up on them… This thing is all about the future!
> We can easily develop libraries of high-level interface widgets that people just need to attach event listeners to. There will be no angle brackets in sight! <hand><coded><html><markup></is></so></last></millenium>!
> Come one, come all, for the thrill of your lives :)
> On Tuesday, September 25, 2012 7:36:37 PM UTC-4, Dennis Kane wrote:
> I was thinking of just responding to this old thread, in which I talk about the browser based Desktop that I've been working on, but the new thing I've been doing for the past week is so superior that I thought it deserved a completely new thead. By the way, I know this forum is all about server side Javascript, but there is not really any serious place one can go on the web that talks about the client side. Besides, with socket.io & websockets... I don't really make much of a distinction between client and server anymore. I just know that there's no reason to do a document.getElementById() call in node :)
> This new thing is a totally shocking clone of OS X. I knew I was going to have to start over from the ground up, because my previous code base was so sh*tty, haha! I have really been concentrating on getting a nice, tight little API that developers will positively drool over. I don't want to make this thing publicly available for many reasons... but you can check out a youtube vid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tq_W19QokXk) that shows it in action, and I still have my same old crappy prototype online at http://luvluvluv.info. Well, hopefully this is proof that I am able to do some cool stuff, and hopefully summa yous will want to start being my friend now, LOL!!!
> And get this... the current, uncompressed js file size is only 54kb!
I don't agree with this call to see the code, or remain silent. Like the OP
said, there's nothing revolutionary about it. What is everyone expecting to
find - whether it's MVC or MVVM? How de-coupled the objects are? A video is
way more informative at this point than abstract code. I personally
probably wouldn't have bothered deploying the code without more info. Don't
get me wrong I'm not against seeing the code, but it's not fundamental to
what the OP is trying to achieve or communicate. If this was 2004 and the
video was of an iPhone prototype, I doubt everyone would discredit it
because the hardware schematics weren't released. The whole "controversy"
is simply a reaction to the OP trying to build a coalition by being
divisive and condescending. Some perceive that as strength, others as
naivety, I think that's all there is to it.
On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 1:29 PM, Ted Young <t...@radicaldesigns.org> wrote:
> I am mainly using this thing as blackmail to get people to be interested
> in being my friend. I want to do some real world community building, and
> something like this will go a long way to get a cooperative business up and
> running.
> Furthermore... you do realize that asking another programmer to "just show
> me your code" is exactly the same as asking a girl to "just show me your
> breasts", right? I mean, I have nothing against it in principle, but, my
> god... I hardly know ye!!!
> Well, sharing code is sort of the main form of currency around web
> communities these days. If you look at the people in the node community
> that other people gravitate towards ( and would jump at a chance to work
> with ), they all produce quite a bit of useful code that they share with
> the community. And if I'm looking at someone as a technical cofounder,
> reading their code and seeing how they create working, production-ready
> libraries are at the top of my list.
> So anyways… that's how you do it! Regarding this particular project, I
> would say many of the people involved in node are people who are interested
> in rich-client browser apps. The "browser as OS" is an idea that's been
> around for years now, and many people are already working on it in some
> form[1]. However, one of the designs that's been tried and rejected along
> the way is the idea that a browser OS would just be a re-implementation of
> a desktop GUI, like macOS, only running on a javascript VM with a "cloud"
> back-end. And some design principals, like a desktop with drag-and-drop,
> are already going away in general as we move towards mouseless computing.
> But if out of this project you came up with, say, an improvement on
> drag-and-drop, or a library that was helpful to people who are building js
> app's other than a desktop-like interface, people would be interested in
> those pieces and would give you useful feedback. So breaking up your code
> into open source libraries and sharing them is super helpful!
> BTW, a good short treatise, that was written before the current web boom
> but predicts many of it's features, is "In the Beginning… Was the Command
> Line" by Neal Stephenson[2]. Very short, definitely worth the read.
>>> The current version of the program now includes drag and drop
>>> functionality of text files from the native desktop straight into the
>>> browser desktop or (any of the subfolders). The difference between my drag
>>> and drop and all the HTML5 demos that you see on the web is that the
>>> dropped files immediately become icons that are integrated into the program.
>>> I will soon start working on getting multimedia icons/files working, so
>>> you'll be able to drop those directly in too. Then I will probably do a
>>> very basic kind of image editing demo that will allow you to change
>>> individual pixels or some such nonsense. But I don't want to get bogged
>>> down in the details of any particular application, because I always want to
>>> stay focused on the big picture of creating a totally powerful and
>>> intuitive way to organize our online lives.
>>> Anyway, I know I am quite a controversial figure here, but there should
>>> be no controversy that this thing is just about ready for prime time. I
>>> really do need to start getting interested people on board who would like
>>> to help me push the web forward. The basic mission statement for the
>>> venture will basically be that the "old web" (HTML4/version 1.0) is dead
>>> and gone. If anyone calls in search of help on their Flintstone era <html>
>>> documents with all of their <a href> and <div> tags laying about, we'll
>>> just point them in an entirely new direction. If they still insist on
>>> doing things the old way, we'll just hang up on them… This thing is all
>>> about the future!
>>> We can easily develop libraries of high-level interface widgets that
>>> people just need to attach event listeners to. There will be no angle
>>> brackets in sight! <hand><coded><html><markup></**
>>> is></so></last></millenium>!
>>> Come one, come all, for the thrill of your lives :)
>>> On Tuesday, September 25, 2012 7:36:37 PM UTC-4, Dennis Kane wrote:
>>>> I was thinking of just responding to this old thread<https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!topic/nodejs/bEhSbsm24Y4>,
>>>> in which I talk about the browser based Desktop that I've been working on,
>>>> but the new thing I've been doing for the past week is so superior that I
>>>> thought it deserved a completely new thead. By the way, I know this forum
>>>> is all about server side Javascript, but there is not really any serious
>>>> place one can go on the web that talks about the client side. Besides,
>>>> with socket.io & websockets... I don't really make much of a
>>>> distinction between client and server anymore. I just know that there's no
>>>> reason to do a document.getElementById() call in node :)
>>>> This new thing is a totally shocking clone of OS X. I knew I was going
>>>> to have to start over from the ground up, because my previous code base was
>>>> so sh*tty, haha! I have really been concentrating on getting a nice, tight
>>>> little API that developers will positively drool over. I don't want to
>>>> make this thing publicly available for many reasons... but you can check
>>>> out a youtube vid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?****v=Tq_W19QokXk<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tq_W19QokXk>) that
>>>> shows it in action, and I still have my same old crappy prototype online at
>>>> http://luvluvluv.info. Well, hopefully this is proof that I am able
>>>> to do some cool stuff, and hopefully summa yous will want to start being my
>>>> friend now, LOL!!!
>>>> And get this... the current, uncompressed js file size is only 54kb!
