why not combine the dev efforts for Nitrogen and ChicagoBoss and blend them into a yet better alternative for web development in erlang? (i know, i know that's how a) flaming wars start b) usually yet another halfready framework forks ... still this is erlang world with wiser ppl involved;)
I'm not sure how active the dev. of Nitrogen really is but some of its concepts (comet-process-pools, erlang => html mapping, the custom-controls/actions system f.e.) would be definitively great to see reused. On the other hand storage and template handling plus the funky reactive processes, well that's what makes ChicagoBoss shine imho. (both have tons of other important features ofc.)
But I want it all in one framework! /sniff ;)
Was this discussed already? Opinions? Alternatives? Any roadmaps? Thanks in advance cheers Radek
ChicagoBoss has some really great things going for it (BossDB stuff
intrigues me much), and I've been giving some (admittedly very
passive) consideration into ChicagoBoss integration.
The first step to uniting the two is with getting CB to use
SimpleBridge as a dependency, and that's pretty much ready. It still
need a few tweaks.
I'm honestly not sure what it would take to go about combining the
two, but I suspect the easier thing would be to copy some of
nitrogen's core functionality like tuple element rendering system and
possibly the comet pool stuff (though I'm not sure how CB does its
comet stuff).
But there's nothing "flamey" about your post, it's an honest and solid
recommendation. I don't know how conducive Evan would be to importing
such features (especially if they conflict with his roadmap), but a
separate hybrid project might be an interesting experiment if someone
wants to proof-of-concept it some :)
> why not combine the dev efforts for Nitrogen and ChicagoBoss and blend them
> into a yet better alternative for web development in erlang?
> (i know, i know that's how a) flaming wars start b) usually yet another
> halfready framework forks ... still this is erlang world with wiser ppl
> involved;)
> I'm not sure how active the dev. of Nitrogen really is but some of its
> concepts (comet-process-pools, erlang => html mapping, the
> custom-controls/actions system f.e.) would be definitively great to see
> reused. On the other hand storage and template handling plus the funky
> reactive processes, well that's what makes ChicagoBoss shine imho.
> (both have tons of other important features ofc.)
> But I want it all in one framework! /sniff ;)
> Was this discussed already? Opinions? Alternatives? Any roadmaps?
> Thanks in advance
> cheers
> Radek
> --
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-- Jesse Gumm
Owner, Sigma Star Systems
414.940.4866 || sigma-star.com || @jessegumm
On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 9:16 AM, Jesse Gumm <g...@sigma-star.com> wrote:
> Hi Radek,
> I think you present some interesting ideas here.
> ChicagoBoss has some really great things going for it (BossDB stuff
> intrigues me much), and I've been giving some (admittedly very
> passive) consideration into ChicagoBoss integration.
> The first step to uniting the two is with getting CB to use
> SimpleBridge as a dependency, and that's pretty much ready. It still
> need a few tweaks.
> I'm honestly not sure what it would take to go about combining the
> two, but I suspect the easier thing would be to copy some of
> nitrogen's core functionality like tuple element rendering system and
> possibly the comet pool stuff (though I'm not sure how CB does its
> comet stuff).
> But there's nothing "flamey" about your post, it's an honest and solid
> recommendation. I don't know how conducive Evan would be to importing
> such features (especially if they conflict with his roadmap), but a
> separate hybrid project might be an interesting experiment if someone
> wants to proof-of-concept it some :)
> Thanks!
> -Jesse
> On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 7:14 AM, Radek Jedrasiak
> <radek.jedras...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> why not combine the dev efforts for Nitrogen and ChicagoBoss and blend them
>> into a yet better alternative for web development in erlang?
>> (i know, i know that's how a) flaming wars start b) usually yet another
>> halfready framework forks ... still this is erlang world with wiser ppl
>> involved;)
>> I'm not sure how active the dev. of Nitrogen really is but some of its
>> concepts (comet-process-pools, erlang => html mapping, the
>> custom-controls/actions system f.e.) would be definitively great to see
>> reused. On the other hand storage and template handling plus the funky
>> reactive processes, well that's what makes ChicagoBoss shine imho.
>> (both have tons of other important features ofc.)
>> But I want it all in one framework! /sniff ;)
>> Was this discussed already? Opinions? Alternatives? Any roadmaps?
>> Thanks in advance
>> cheers
>> Radek
I use Nitrogen (embedded) and I love it. I have not used ChicagoBoss,
and from I know of its DB wrappers I doubt I would use them (it did
not have a Riak interface last I saw). What else about ChicagoBoss
would people like to see in Nitrogen and how would in benefit?
Well, there's no real need to *merge* BossDB into Nitrogen, as it's a
standalone app that - if you wanted to - you could just link it as a
rebar dependency easily enough.
But I understand the aversions to generalized DB abstraction layers -
there's only so much you can abstract away. But it's definitely a
noble cause, and I admit the idea of the post and pre-hooks in BossDB
intrigue me.
Just for fun, I should build something in ChicagoBoss just to get the
feel for it.
>> I use Nitrogen (embedded) and I love it. I have not used ChicagoBoss,
>> and from I know of its DB wrappers I doubt I would use them
> Same here. I had some very disappointing experiences with DB wrappers
> and tend to avoid them now.
> Steffen
> --
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-- Jesse Gumm
Owner, Sigma Star Systems
414.940.4866 || sigma-star.com || @jessegumm
Oh, and Overmind, Riak support is currently experimental in BossDB, so
maybe it's worth another look. At least, that is, according to it's
Readme in github.
On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 11:57 PM, Jesse Gumm <g...@sigma-star.com> wrote:
> Well, there's no real need to *merge* BossDB into Nitrogen, as it's a
> standalone app that - if you wanted to - you could just link it as a
> rebar dependency easily enough.
> But I understand the aversions to generalized DB abstraction layers -
> there's only so much you can abstract away. But it's definitely a
> noble cause, and I admit the idea of the post and pre-hooks in BossDB
> intrigue me.
> Just for fun, I should build something in ChicagoBoss just to get the
> feel for it.
> -Jesse
> On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 11:50 PM, Steffen Panning
> <steffen.pann...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>> Hi,
>>> I use Nitrogen (embedded) and I love it. I have not used ChicagoBoss,
>>> and from I know of its DB wrappers I doubt I would use them
>> Same here. I had some very disappointing experiences with DB wrappers
>> and tend to avoid them now.
>> Steffen
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Nitrogen Project / The Nitrogen Web Framework for Erlang" group.
>> To post to this group, send email to nitrogenweb@googlegroups.com.
>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nitrogenweb+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nitrogenweb?hl=en.
> --
> Jesse Gumm
> Owner, Sigma Star Systems
> 414.940.4866 || sigma-star.com || @jessegumm
-- Jesse Gumm
Owner, Sigma Star Systems
414.940.4866 || sigma-star.com || @jessegumm
I played with Nitrogen this last days. It's an incredible, awesome work.
As said before, it's a very different of CB. It's not a clean MVC
framework but all about magical autogeneration of JS (Ajax and Comet).
For some people, as me, who absolutly doesn't want write JS, it's a must have !
Nitrogen hasn't routing system nor ORM so it could be really improved
by an integration in CB : routing system + BossDB and specialy the
asynchronous (as Nitrogen) BossNews.
The only integration to do is to switch from the Nitrogen template
language to erlydtl.
This could be a very interesting option to have the Nitrogen power
inside a clean CB integration (instead of a Nitrogen + webmachine +
BossDB + erlydtl hack).
On Thu, May 31, 2012 at 6:59 AM, Jesse Gumm <g...@sigma-star.com> wrote:
> Oh, and Overmind, Riak support is currently experimental in BossDB, so
> maybe it's worth another look. At least, that is, according to it's
> Readme in github.
> -Jesse
> On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 11:57 PM, Jesse Gumm <g...@sigma-star.com> wrote:
>> Well, there's no real need to *merge* BossDB into Nitrogen, as it's a
>> standalone app that - if you wanted to - you could just link it as a
>> rebar dependency easily enough.
>> But I understand the aversions to generalized DB abstraction layers -
>> there's only so much you can abstract away. But it's definitely a
>> noble cause, and I admit the idea of the post and pre-hooks in BossDB
>> intrigue me.
>> Just for fun, I should build something in ChicagoBoss just to get the
>> feel for it.
>> -Jesse
>> On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 11:50 PM, Steffen Panning
>> <steffen.pann...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>>> I use Nitrogen (embedded) and I love it. I have not used ChicagoBoss,
>>>> and from I know of its DB wrappers I doubt I would use them
>>> Same here. I had some very disappointing experiences with DB wrappers
>>> and tend to avoid them now.
>>> Steffen
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Nitrogen Project / The Nitrogen Web Framework for Erlang" group.
>>> To post to this group, send email to nitrogenweb@googlegroups.com.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nitrogenweb+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nitrogenweb?hl=en.
>> --
>> Jesse Gumm
>> Owner, Sigma Star Systems
>> 414.940.4866 || sigma-star.com || @jessegumm
> --
> Jesse Gumm
> Owner, Sigma Star Systems
> 414.940.4866 || sigma-star.com || @jessegumm
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Nitrogen Project / The Nitrogen Web Framework for Erlang" group.
> To post to this group, send email to nitrogenweb@googlegroups.com.
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> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nitrogenweb?hl=en.
One of these days, I'll spend a little time playing with CB to get a good
feel for it. From reading about it and seeing the split off of BossNews and
BossDB stuff (which are fully cool), I know that integration would
definitely be easier.
It definitely does seen like the two solve different problems, and that
lends itself well to cross-integration.
--
Jesse Gumm
Owner, Sigma Star Systems
414.940.4866 || sigma-star.com || @jessegumm
On Sep 14, 2012 8:13 AM, "Florent Gallaire" <fgalla...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I played with Nitrogen this last days. It's an incredible, awesome work.
> As said before, it's a very different of CB. It's not a clean MVC
> framework but all about magical autogeneration of JS (Ajax and Comet).
> For some people, as me, who absolutly doesn't want write JS, it's a must
> have !
> Nitrogen hasn't routing system nor ORM so it could be really improved
> by an integration in CB : routing system + BossDB and specialy the
> asynchronous (as Nitrogen) BossNews.
> The only integration to do is to switch from the Nitrogen template
> language to erlydtl.
> This could be a very interesting option to have the Nitrogen power
> inside a clean CB integration (instead of a Nitrogen + webmachine +
> BossDB + erlydtl hack).
> Best regards
> Florent
> On Thu, May 31, 2012 at 6:59 AM, Jesse Gumm <g...@sigma-star.com> wrote:
> > Oh, and Overmind, Riak support is currently experimental in BossDB, so
> > maybe it's worth another look. At least, that is, according to it's
> > Readme in github.
> > -Jesse
> > On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 11:57 PM, Jesse Gumm <g...@sigma-star.com>
> wrote:
> >> Well, there's no real need to *merge* BossDB into Nitrogen, as it's a
> >> standalone app that - if you wanted to - you could just link it as a
> >> rebar dependency easily enough.
> >> But I understand the aversions to generalized DB abstraction layers -
> >> there's only so much you can abstract away. But it's definitely a
> >> noble cause, and I admit the idea of the post and pre-hooks in BossDB
> >> intrigue me.
> >> Just for fun, I should build something in ChicagoBoss just to get the
> >> feel for it.
> >> -Jesse
> >> On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 11:50 PM, Steffen Panning
> >> <steffen.pann...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> >>> Hi,
> >>>> I use Nitrogen (embedded) and I love it. I have not used ChicagoBoss,
> >>>> and from I know of its DB wrappers I doubt I would use them
> >>> Same here. I had some very disappointing experiences with DB wrappers
> >>> and tend to avoid them now.
> >>> Steffen
> >>> --
> >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "Nitrogen Project / The Nitrogen Web Framework for Erlang" group.
> >>> To post to this group, send email to nitrogenweb@googlegroups.com.
> >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> nitrogenweb+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> >>> For more options, visit this group at
> http://groups.google.com/group/nitrogenweb?hl=en.
> >> --
> >> Jesse Gumm
> >> Owner, Sigma Star Systems
> >> 414.940.4866 || sigma-star.com || @jessegumm
> > --
> > Jesse Gumm
> > Owner, Sigma Star Systems
> > 414.940.4866 || sigma-star.com || @jessegumm
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "Nitrogen Project / The Nitrogen Web Framework for Erlang" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to nitrogenweb@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> nitrogenweb+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> > For more options, visit this group at
> http://groups.google.com/group/nitrogenweb?hl=en.
> --
> FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
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> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
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> http://groups.google.com/group/nitrogenweb?hl=en.
Integrating Nitrogen with ErlyDTL was one of the goals of Zotonic.
You might want to have a look how we redid the actions, validations etc to work nice with the template language.
> One of these days, I'll spend a little time playing with CB to get a good feel for it. From reading about it and seeing the split off of BossNews and BossDB stuff (which are fully cool), I know that integration would definitely be easier.
> It definitely does seen like the two solve different problems, and that lends itself well to cross-integration.
> --
> Jesse Gumm
> Owner, Sigma Star Systems
> 414.940.4866 || sigma-star.com || @jessegumm
> On Sep 14, 2012 8:13 AM, "Florent Gallaire" <fgalla...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Cross-posted on the Chicago Boss thread :
> I played with Nitrogen this last days. It's an incredible, awesome work.
> As said before, it's a very different of CB. It's not a clean MVC
> framework but all about magical autogeneration of JS (Ajax and Comet).
> For some people, as me, who absolutly doesn't want write JS, it's a must have !
> Nitrogen hasn't routing system nor ORM so it could be really improved
> by an integration in CB : routing system + BossDB and specialy the
> asynchronous (as Nitrogen) BossNews.
> The only integration to do is to switch from the Nitrogen template
> language to erlydtl.
> This could be a very interesting option to have the Nitrogen power
> inside a clean CB integration (instead of a Nitrogen + webmachine +
> BossDB + erlydtl hack).
> Best regards
> Florent
> On Thu, May 31, 2012 at 6:59 AM, Jesse Gumm <g...@sigma-star.com> wrote:
> > Oh, and Overmind, Riak support is currently experimental in BossDB, so
> > maybe it's worth another look. At least, that is, according to it's
> > Readme in github.
> > -Jesse
> > On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 11:57 PM, Jesse Gumm <g...@sigma-star.com> wrote:
> >> Well, there's no real need to *merge* BossDB into Nitrogen, as it's a
> >> standalone app that - if you wanted to - you could just link it as a
> >> rebar dependency easily enough.
> >> But I understand the aversions to generalized DB abstraction layers -
> >> there's only so much you can abstract away. But it's definitely a
> >> noble cause, and I admit the idea of the post and pre-hooks in BossDB
> >> intrigue me.
> >> Just for fun, I should build something in ChicagoBoss just to get the
> >> feel for it.
> >> -Jesse
> >> On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 11:50 PM, Steffen Panning
> >> <steffen.pann...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> >>> Hi,
> >>>> I use Nitrogen (embedded) and I love it. I have not used ChicagoBoss,
> >>>> and from I know of its DB wrappers I doubt I would use them
> >>> Same here. I had some very disappointing experiences with DB wrappers
> >>> and tend to avoid them now.
> >>> Steffen
> >>> --
> >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Nitrogen Project / The Nitrogen Web Framework for Erlang" group.
> >>> To post to this group, send email to nitrogenweb@googlegroups.com.
> >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nitrogenweb+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> >>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nitrogenweb?hl=en.
> >> --
> >> Jesse Gumm
> >> Owner, Sigma Star Systems
> >> 414.940.4866 || sigma-star.com || @jessegumm
> > --
> > Jesse Gumm
> > Owner, Sigma Star Systems
> > 414.940.4866 || sigma-star.com || @jessegumm
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Nitrogen Project / The Nitrogen Web Framework for Erlang" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to nitrogenweb@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to nitrogenweb+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/nitrogenweb?hl=en.
> --
> FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Nitrogen Project / The Nitrogen Web Framework for Erlang" group.
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> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Nitrogen Project / The Nitrogen Web Framework for Erlang" group.
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On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 4:30 AM, Marc Worrell <mworr...@me.com> wrote:
> Hi Jesse,
> Integrating Nitrogen with ErlyDTL was one of the goals of Zotonic.
> You might want to have a look how we redid the actions, validations etc to
> work nice with the template language.
> - Marc
> On 14 sep. 2012, at 17:01, Jesse Gumm wrote:
> Thanks Florent!
> One of these days, I'll spend a little time playing with CB to get a good
> feel for it. From reading about it and seeing the split off of BossNews and
> BossDB stuff (which are fully cool), I know that integration would
> definitely be easier.
> It definitely does seen like the two solve different problems, and that
> lends itself well to cross-integration.
> --
> Jesse Gumm
> Owner, Sigma Star Systems
> 414.940.4866 || sigma-star.com || @jessegumm
>> I played with Nitrogen this last days. It's an incredible, awesome work.
>> As said before, it's a very different of CB. It's not a clean MVC
>> framework but all about magical autogeneration of JS (Ajax and Comet).
>> For some people, as me, who absolutly doesn't want write JS, it's a must
>> have !
>> Nitrogen hasn't routing system nor ORM so it could be really improved
>> by an integration in CB : routing system + BossDB and specialy the
>> asynchronous (as Nitrogen) BossNews.
>> The only integration to do is to switch from the Nitrogen template
>> language to erlydtl.
>> This could be a very interesting option to have the Nitrogen power
>> inside a clean CB integration (instead of a Nitrogen + webmachine +
>> BossDB + erlydtl hack).
>> Best regards
>> Florent
>> On Thu, May 31, 2012 at 6:59 AM, Jesse Gumm <g...@sigma-star.com> wrote:
>> > Oh, and Overmind, Riak support is currently experimental in BossDB, so
>> > maybe it's worth another look. At least, that is, according to it's
>> > Readme in github.
>> > -Jesse
>> > On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 11:57 PM, Jesse Gumm <g...@sigma-star.com>
>> > wrote:
>> >> Well, there's no real need to *merge* BossDB into Nitrogen, as it's a
>> >> standalone app that - if you wanted to - you could just link it as a
>> >> rebar dependency easily enough.
>> >> But I understand the aversions to generalized DB abstraction layers -
>> >> there's only so much you can abstract away. But it's definitely a
>> >> noble cause, and I admit the idea of the post and pre-hooks in BossDB
>> >> intrigue me.
>> >> Just for fun, I should build something in ChicagoBoss just to get the
>> >> feel for it.
>> >> -Jesse
>> >> On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 11:50 PM, Steffen Panning
>> >> <steffen.pann...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>> >>> Hi,
>> >>>> I use Nitrogen (embedded) and I love it. I have not used
>> >>>> ChicagoBoss,
>> >>>> and from I know of its DB wrappers I doubt I would use them
>> >>> Same here. I had some very disappointing experiences with DB wrappers
>> >>> and tend to avoid them now.
>> >>> Steffen
>> >>> --
>> >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>> >>> Groups "Nitrogen Project / The Nitrogen Web Framework for Erlang" group.
>> >>> To post to this group, send email to nitrogenweb@googlegroups.com.
>> >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>> >>> nitrogenweb+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>> >>> For more options, visit this group at
>> >>> http://groups.google.com/group/nitrogenweb?hl=en.
>> >> --
>> >> Jesse Gumm
>> >> Owner, Sigma Star Systems
>> >> 414.940.4866 || sigma-star.com || @jessegumm
>> > --
>> > Jesse Gumm
>> > Owner, Sigma Star Systems
>> > 414.940.4866 || sigma-star.com || @jessegumm
>> > --
>> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>> > Groups "Nitrogen Project / The Nitrogen Web Framework for Erlang" group.
>> > To post to this group, send email to nitrogenweb@googlegroups.com.
>> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>> > nitrogenweb+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>> > For more options, visit this group at
>> > http://groups.google.com/group/nitrogenweb?hl=en.
>> --
>> FLOSS Engineer & Lawyer
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "Nitrogen Project / The Nitrogen Web Framework for Erlang" group.
>> To post to this group, send email to nitrogenweb@googlegroups.com.
>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
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>> For more options, visit this group at
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> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
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> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
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-- Jesse Gumm
Owner, Sigma Star Systems
414.940.4866 || sigma-star.com || @jessegumm
