MassHighway now MassDOT
Bob Malme
related information have a new web address to remember. Starting
November 1, all of MassHighway, the Mass Turnpike Authority, DCR
parkways (and on 1/1/10, the Tobin Bridge) came under the banner of
MassDOT which will have four new transportation divisions (Highway,
Rail & Transit, Aeronautics, and the Registry of Motor Vehicles. The
new address to access all of this is:
http://www.massdot.state.ma.us/
They have a blog that you can refer to if you want more information or
to see videos:
http://transportation.blog.state.ma.us/
On a related note, MassDOT recently expanded the number of traffic
cameras available to view by the public; including those on the Tobin
and Zakim bridges, I-93 from Columbia Road to the tunnel entrance, and
several Mass Pike interchanges. The link is on the main page.
Garrett Wollman
Bob Malme <rma...@verizon.net> wrote:
>Those wanting to access the traffic cameras or other MassHighway
>related information have a new web address to remember. Starting
>November 1, all of MassHighway, the Mass Turnpike Authority, DCR
>parkways (and on 1/1/10, the Tobin Bridge) came under the banner of
>MassDOT
Not entirely correct. Only "designated" DCR parkways (defined as
"McGrath and O?Brien Highways in the cities of Cambridge and
Somerville, the Carrol parkway, Middlesex avenue in the city of
Medford, William Casey highway overpass in the Jamaica Plain section
of the city of Boston, Columbia road in the South Boston section of
the city of Boston, Morton Street in Boston and Gallivan boulevard in
the Dorchester section of the city of Boston") are transferred to the
new DOT. However, all DCR "vehicular bridges" appear to be
transferred, subject to the following restriction:
SECTION 176. Notwithstanding the provisions of section 35 of
chapter 92 of the General Laws, or any other general or
special law to the contrary, the department of conservation
and recreation shall transfer the care, custody and control of
all vehicular bridges and underpasses, to the Massachusetts
Department of Transportation to be held for the same purposes;
provided, however, that the following bridges or underpasses
shall not be transferred to the authority until the department
of conservation and recreation completes an appropriate phase
of design, /or construction and renovation work an upon the
execution of a memorandum of understanding by the commissioner
of the department of conservation and recreation and the
secretary of transportation: Boston University Bridge, River
Street at Mother Brook, Woods Memorial Bridge, Craddock
Bridge, Craige Dam Bridge, Lech Walesa/Mount Vernon Street
Bridge, Patten?s Cove Bridge, Cheney Bridge, Mystic Valley
Parkway over Alewife Brook, Neponset River Bridge, General
Edwards Drawbridge, Trestle/Charles River Bridge and the Hugh
Farren Bridge; provided, however, that said bridges shall be
transferred not later than December 31, 2014. (2009 c. 25)
As a consolation prize for losing the Tobin Bridge, Massport gets to
buy Worcester airport from the city.
All of the RTAs are required to move to "forward funding" in two years
(the MBTA has already done so).
It's not clear to me whether the Turnpike Authority's authority to
establish special traffic regulations for the Turnpike (as distinct
from the generally-applicable traffic rules) is transferred to the new
DOT, and if so, whether it now applies to all state highways or just
the Turnpike.
There are two "trust funds" established, a "Commonwealth
Transportation Fund" and a "Massachusetts Transportation Trust Fund";
it's not clear why there are two of them. (However, several of the
older such funds are abolished so it's probably still a net
simplifications.)
-GAWollman
--
Garrett A. Wollman | What intellectual phenomenon can be older, or more oft
wol...@bimajority.org| repeated, than the story of a large research program
Opinions not shared by| that impaled itself upon a false central assumption
my employers. | accepted by all practitioners? - S.J. Gould, 1993
JG
> Those wanting to access the traffic cameras or other MassHighway
> related information have a new web address to remember. Starting
> November 1, all of MassHighway, the Mass Turnpike Authority, DCR
> parkways (and on 1/1/10, the Tobin Bridge) came under the banner of
> MassDOT which will have four new transportation divisions (Highway,
> Rail & Transit, Aeronautics, and the Registry of Motor Vehicles.
Wow, Toll and DOTs can be combined. I doubt the IL Republicans would
give up 1700 jobs to do this here.
Boston is lucky their state capitol isn't in Springfield too !
Nathan Perry
<5ce4488c-5d09-4124...@k17g2000yqh.googlegroups.com>,
JG <jgro...@hotmail.com> wrote:
I didn't know Boston had a state capital... ;-)
Free Lunch
Nathan Perry <npe...@rochester.rr.com> wrote in
<nperry-92E98C....@news.frontiernet.net>:
I've seen it.
Now, the question is what state it is in. I think it might be called New
England, because that seems to be the most common name for things in
that area.
John S
> Wow, Toll and DOTs can be combined. I doubt the IL Republicans would
> give up 1700 jobs to do this here.
Well, don't be too impressed just yet. If the latest "merger" falls in
the same pattern as previous mergers/renaming efforts, there won't be
much change at all. Sure, they'll spend lots of time and money renaming
signs and painting trucks with new logos, but the hackerama just shifts
to the new name. Example: The old MDC transformed into the DCR a few
years back and not much changed then. Of course now with the DCR now
connected to the Highway Dept, perhaps the DCR's nonstandard signage and
road markings will be expanded to the entire state. Keep a close eye on
who's in charge and where they came from.
The Massachusetts Turnpike Authority was created solely to build the
turnpike and collect tolls until the debt was paid. The debt off was
paid in the early 1980s. The tolls remain, and much of the tolls gets
diverted toward free roads driven by folks who don't pay any tolls. The
bulk of the rest pays for the toll takers and their important
bureaucracy.
See also the merger of the Garden State Parkway into the New Jersey
Turnpike. There was some initial consolidation due to the intense
fiscal need, but you'd be hard pressed to find any savings passed to
taxpayers/tollpayers. On the contrary, tolls increased even more.
John F. Carr
Garrett Wollman <wol...@bimajority.org> wrote:
>It's not clear to me whether the Turnpike Authority's authority to
>establish special traffic regulations for the Turnpike (as distinct
>from the generally-applicable traffic rules) is transferred to the new
>DOT, and if so, whether it now applies to all state highways or just
>the Turnpike.
Based on my quick read, the Turnpike is now a state highway with all
the limitations that implies but old oddball regulations are
grandfathered. See Sections 134 and 147:
134: "Notwithstanding any general or special law to the contrary, any
order, rule, or regulation duly promulgated, or any license, permit,
certificate or approval duly granted, by or on behalf of the
Massachusetts Turnpike Authority shall continue in effect from and
after the date of dissolution of the authority and shall be enforced by
the Massachusetts Department of Transportation until superseded,
revised, rescinded or cancelled by the Massachusetts Department of
Transportation."
147: "Any order, rule or regulation duly promulgated by or on behalf of
the department of highways, the Massachusetts aeronautics commission,
the registry of motor vehicles, and the Massachusetts Turnpike
Authority, shall continue in full force and effect to the extent
consistent with this act and the laws of the commonwealth, and shall
continue to be enforced, until superseded, revised, rescinded or
cancelled by the secretary of the department of transportation."
DCR and MassPort regulations appear to expire. I don't know the
practical consequence.
>There are two "trust funds" established, a "Commonwealth
>Transportation Fund" and a "Massachusetts Transportation Trust Fund";
>it's not clear why there are two of them. (However, several of the
>older such funds are abolished so it's probably still a net
>simplifications.)
The Massachusetts trust fund authorizes the department to spend its own
revenue, mostly tolls, as it sees fit. The Commonwealth fund relates
to RMV fees, gax taxes, and other less directly road-related revenue
and may be taken by the legislature to repay bonds. The distinction
may relate to the constitutional requirement that user fees be spent
on the purpose for which they are collected and gas taxes be spent on
transportation.
--
John Carr (j...@mit.edu)
John S
when they break down? Previously only the Turnpike Authority's chosen
company(ies) could tow a car on I-90.
Pete Jenior
news:d4c9091b-8c84-4efe...@p35g2000yqh.googlegroups.com...
> Those wanting to access the traffic cameras or other MassHighway
> related information have a new web address to remember. Starting
> November 1, all of MassHighway, the Mass Turnpike Authority, DCR
> parkways (and on 1/1/10, the Tobin Bridge) came under the banner of
> MassDOT which will have four new transportation divisions (Highway,
> Rail & Transit, Aeronautics, and the Registry of Motor Vehicles. The
> new address to access all of this is:
How many states still have a "Highway" agency instead of a "Transportation"
agency? I'm thinking about the name of the agency, not what they do.
Nebraska is only one I can think of. In my mind, Maryland ("State Highway
Administration") does not count because it is part of the Maryland DOT.
Pete
larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite
>
> See also the merger of the Garden State Parkway into the New Jersey
> Turnpike. There was some initial consolidation due to the intense
> fiscal need, but you'd be hard pressed to find any savings passed to
> taxpayers/tollpayers. On the contrary, tolls increased even more.
as per usual you have no idea what you are talking about
what were oil prices 18 months ago?
and the NJTP is widening 20 miles of tpk to accomodate the new I-95
as well the GS Pkwy is widening
D. Kirkpatrick
John S <joh...@no.spam> wrote:
> Well, don't be too impressed just yet. If the latest "merger" falls in
> the same pattern as previous mergers/renaming efforts, there won't be
> much change at all. Sure, they'll spend lots of time and money renaming
> signs and painting trucks with new logos, but the hackerama just shifts
> to the new name. Example: The old MDC transformed into the DCR a few
> years back and not much changed then. Of course now with the DCR now
> connected to the Highway Dept, perhaps the DCR's nonstandard signage and
> road markings will be expanded to the entire state. Keep a close eye on
> who's in charge and where they came from.
Their police division was merged with others.
At the time the Registry police, State House Police, and MDC police
were merged with the State Police.
DMK
Pete from Boston
They can if the "department" is a quasi-public corporation
("authority"), as the new MassDOT appears to be. Recall that at its
inception it was named "Massachusetts Surface Transportation
Authority." This is going to prove interesting next time the governor
butts heads with its board, which can theoretically cite a corporate
mandate that supersedes his/her directives. This was a regular issue
with the Massachusetts Turnpike Authority.
On a related note, does anyone know if the Tobin Bridge will continue
to grant toll discounts for holders of transponders from any agency,
or if they will adopt the Mass Pike's "discounts for our transponders
only" policy?
John S
>> See also the merger of the Garden State Parkway into the New Jersey
>> Turnpike. There was some initial consolidation due to the intense
>> fiscal need, but you'd be hard pressed to find any savings passed to
>> taxpayers/tollpayers. On the contrary, tolls increased even more.
>
> as per usual you have no idea what you are talking about
>
> what were oil prices 18 months ago?
I was talking about toll prices today, not oil prices 18 months ago, or
at anytime for that matter.
> and the NJTP is widening 20 miles of tpk to accomodate the new I-95
>
> as well the GS Pkwy is widening
Being paid for with bonds. You'll see that in even more future toll
increases too.
larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite
> larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite wrote:
> >> See also the merger of the Garden State Parkway into the New Jersey
> >> Turnpike. There was some initial consolidation due to the intense
> >> fiscal need, but you'd be hard pressed to find any savings passed to
> >> taxpayers/tollpayers. On the contrary, tolls increased even more.
>
> > as per usual you have no idea what you are talking about
>
> > what were oil prices 18 months ago?
>
> I was talking about toll prices today, not oil prices 18 months ago, or
> at anytime for that matter.
>
you were whining about toll increases even with the merger
apparently you are oblivious of things like fuel and its effects on
toll road operations
what do you think, their vehicles run on air?
maybe that has something to do with toll rates
> > and the NJTP is widening 20 miles of tpk to accomodate the new I-95
>
> > as well the GS Pkwy is widening
>
> Being paid for with bonds. You'll see that in even more future toll
> increases too.
no, you are kidding, any more obvious statements
again you were whining about toll increases even with the merger
now why do you think those bonds would be issued if it were not for
toll increases to pay them off
please quit whining about things you know nothing about
John S
> On Nov 5, 9:38 pm, John S <joh...@no.spam> wrote:
>> larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite wrote:
>>>> See also the merger of the Garden State Parkway into the New Jersey
>>>> Turnpike. There was some initial consolidation due to the intense
>>>> fiscal need, but you'd be hard pressed to find any savings passed to
>>>> taxpayers/tollpayers. On the contrary, tolls increased even more.
>>> as per usual you have no idea what you are talking about
>>> what were oil prices 18 months ago?
>> I was talking about toll prices today, not oil prices 18 months ago, or
>> at anytime for that matter.
>>
>
> you were whining about toll increases even with the merger
Actually I was merely pointing out that the purported merger benefits
have not been realized .
>
> apparently you are oblivious of things like fuel and its effects on
> toll road operations
>
> what do you think, their vehicles run on air?
>
> maybe that has something to do with toll rates
Maybe it doesn't. Note that fuel efficient cars that use less fuel are
getting a *discount* on tolls. I certainly did not claim that anyone
was running anything on air. If it's too much trouble to operate a toll
road when vehicles that use it are required to purchase fuel, perhaps
the road shouldn't be tolled. Even Corzine himself didn't claim that
the toll increases were related to gas prices, and neither did the
Turnpike Authority. And we certainly have *not* seen tolls decrease
after fuel prices declined, have we?
>>> and the NJTP is widening 20 miles of tpk to accomodate the new I-95
>>> as well the GS Pkwy is widening
>> Being paid for with bonds. You'll see that in even more future toll
>> increases too.
> now why do you think those bonds would be issued if it were not for
> toll increases to pay them off
>
Bonds are issued by toll roads regularly with no toll increases.
Good news for tollpayers is that Governor Corzine will not be in office
for long.
larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite
> larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite wrote:
> > On Nov 5, 9:38 pm, John S <joh...@no.spam> wrote:
> >> larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite wrote:
> >>>> See also the merger of the Garden State Parkway into the New Jersey
> >>>> Turnpike. There was some initial consolidation due to the intense
> >>>> fiscal need, but you'd be hard pressed to find any savings passed to
> >>>> taxpayers/tollpayers. On the contrary, tolls increased even more.
> >>> as per usual you have no idea what you are talking about
> >>> what were oil prices 18 months ago?
> >> I was talking about toll prices today, not oil prices 18 months ago, or
> >> at anytime for that matter.
>
> > you were whining about toll increases even with the merger
>
> Actually I was merely pointing out that the purported merger benefits
> have not been realized .
>
>
now what party dem or repub is going to completely end the patronage
of the NJTP? tell me, I want to know
the only way is for the whole thing to be under NJDOT and that is very
unlikely to happen
>
> > apparently you are oblivious of things like fuel and its effects on
> > toll road operations
>
> > what do you think, their vehicles run on air?
>
> > maybe that has something to do with toll rates
>
> Maybe it doesn't. Note that fuel efficient cars that use less fuel are
> getting a *discount* on tolls.
and NJT buses pay the same toll as those fuel efficient cars
I certainly did not claim that anyone
> was running anything on air.
I never said anything about the toll payers
I said the tpk operations, meaning the tpk vehocles
they use more expensive fuel
plus asphalt which is oil based
as well as everything the tpk buys which is effected by the price of
oil
apparently you are oblivious of things like fuel and its effects on
> > toll road operations
I guess you missed this the first time
If it's too much trouble to operate a toll
> road when vehicles that use it are required to purchase fuel, perhaps
> the road shouldn't be tolled.
you are oblivious, I guess to everything
lets take the tolls of the tpk
and you know what, you would still be running on 4 lanes from New
Brunswick to the GWB
no one is forcing anyone to pay a toll
you are free to use 1-9, if that suits you better
Even Corzine himself didn't claim that
> the toll increases were related to gas prices, and neither did the
> Turnpike Authority.
nope, it was for the widening, but part of it has to take operation
costs into account
And we certainly have *not* seen tolls decrease
> after fuel prices declined, have we?
>
has anything come back down? please tell me
> >>> and the NJTP is widening 20 miles of tpk to accomodate the new I-95
> >>> as well the GS Pkwy is widening
> >> Being paid for with bonds. You'll see that in even more future toll
> >> increases too.
> > now why do you think those bonds would be issued if it were not for
> > toll increases to pay them off
>
> Bonds are issued by toll roads regularly with no toll increases.
>
and which ones might these be
> Good news for tollpayers is that Governor Corzine will not be in office
> for long.
any more absurd statements
I don't care who the Gov is, transportation in NJ is in desperate
trouble
John S
> On Nov 5, 11:53 pm, John S <joh...@no.spam> wrote:
>> larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite wrote:
>>> On Nov 5, 9:38 pm, John S <joh...@no.spam> wrote:
>>>> larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite wrote:
>>>>>> See also the merger of the Garden State Parkway into the New Jersey
>>>>>> Turnpike. There was some initial consolidation due to the intense
>>>>>> fiscal need, but you'd be hard pressed to find any savings passed to
>>>>>> taxpayers/tollpayers. On the contrary, tolls increased even more.
>>>>> as per usual you have no idea what you are talking about
>>>>> what were oil prices 18 months ago?
>>>> I was talking about toll prices today, not oil prices 18 months ago, or
>>>> at anytime for that matter.
>>> you were whining about toll increases even with the merger
>> Actually I was merely pointing out that the purported merger benefits
>> have not been realized .
>>
>>
>
> now what party dem or repub is going to completely end the patronage
> of the NJTP? tell me, I want to know
Thank you for proving my point.
>
> has anything come back down? please tell me
Yes. Don't take my word for it, look at the consumer price index.
Have a nice day.
larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite
> larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite wrote:
> > On Nov 5, 11:53 pm, John S <joh...@no.spam> wrote:
> >> larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite wrote:
> >>> On Nov 5, 9:38 pm, John S <joh...@no.spam> wrote:
> >>>> larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite wrote:
> >>>>>> See also the merger of the Garden State Parkway into the New Jersey
> >>>>>> Turnpike. There was some initial consolidation due to the intense
> >>>>>> fiscal need, but you'd be hard pressed to find any savings passed to
> >>>>>> taxpayers/tollpayers. On the contrary, tolls increased even more.
> >>>>> as per usual you have no idea what you are talking about
> >>>>> what were oil prices 18 months ago?
> >>>> I was talking about toll prices today, not oil prices 18 months ago, or
> >>>> at anytime for that matter.
> >>> you were whining about toll increases even with the merger
> >> Actually I was merely pointing out that the purported merger benefits
> >> have not been realized .
>
> > now what party dem or repub is going to completely end the patronage
> > of the NJTP? tell me, I want to know
>
> Thank you for proving my point.
and where were you with all the whining when Pkwy tolls were not
increased for 50+ years
all the while traffic more then doubled
not to mention, it took the Dems, Jim McGreevey to eliminate the auth
that ran the pkwy
>
>
>
> > has anything come back down? please tell me
>
> Yes. Don't take my word for it, look at the consumer price index.
>
so that is an average, heavily influenced by oil prices
but no individual prices that went up to take into account oil have
come back down
not Mc Donalds, not groceries, nothing that I know of
averages are misleading
> Have a nice day.
liars figure and figures lie
rsh...@gmail.com
> x-no-archive: yes
>
>
>
> larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite wrote:
> > On Nov 6, 9:04 pm, John S <joh...@no.spam> wrote:
> >> larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite wrote:
> >>> On Nov 5, 11:53 pm, John S <joh...@no.spam> wrote:
> >>>> larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite wrote:
> >>>>> On Nov 5, 9:38 pm, John S <joh...@no.spam> wrote:
> >>>>>> larrysheldonisalyingfuckinghypocrite wrote:
> >>>>>>>> See also the merger of the Garden State Parkway into the New Jersey
> >>>>>>>> Turnpike. There was some initial consolidation due to the intense
> >>>>>>>> fiscal need, but you'd be hard pressed to find any savings passed to
> >>>>>>>> taxpayers/tollpayers. On the contrary, tolls increased even more.
> >>>>>>> as per usual you have no idea what you are talking about
> >>>>>>> what were oil prices 18 months ago?
> >>>>>> I was talking about toll prices today, not oil prices 18 months ago, or
> >>>>>> at anytime for that matter.
> >>>>> you were whining about toll increases even with the merger
> >>>> Actually I was merely pointing out that the purported merger benefits
> >>>> have not been realized .
> >>> now what party dem or repub is going to completely end the patronage
> >>> of the NJTP? tell me, I want to know
> >> Thank you for proving my point.
>
> > and where were you with all the whining when Pkwy tolls were not
> > increased for 50+ years
>
> point, you are very helpful.
>
>
>
> > all the while traffic more then doubled
>
and how much more has to be spent to accomodate the doubled traffic
if you notice there is a new Driscoll Br
>
>
>
> > not to mention, it took the Dems, Jim McGreevey to eliminate the auth
> > that ran the pkwy
>
> Yeah, Gov McGreedy was *GREAT*!!! Was it the appointment of a
> completely unqualified, "homeland security adviser" with no experience
> outside of writing poetry because he was involved in a relationship, the
> pay to play, or perhaps the extortion scandals that you found most
> inspiring?
he was better then the Whitman DiFransesco mess
and you were babbling about the tpk-pkwy merger which he did
whitman who I am sure you are very proud of, could not pull it off
>
> And the Dems have been such doing a such a fantastic job in New Jersey,
> the voters are begging for a Democrat governor, right?
>
so lets see what Cristie does in the next 4 years
btw, the dems still control the legislature
I don't know if you realize that
> >>> has anything come back down? please tell me
> >> Yes. Don't take my word for it, look at the consumer price index.
>
> > so that is an average, heavily influenced by oil prices
>
> Actually it is a shopping basket of popular consumer items from across
> the board.
>
right and it is heavily influenced by oil prices it is not reality
>
>
> > but no individual prices that went up to take into account oil have
> > come back down
>
> > not Mc Donalds, not groceries, nothing that I know of
>
> > averages are misleading
>
> Clearly you don't shop much. Airline prices are off 30% from last year
> for similar tickets.
so lets see
oil went up to $170 a bar, about tripled
then dropped to about $70 a bar
In the grocery store, milk is down nearly 50% off
> last year.
see oil prices above
Grocery prices as a whole have dropped 3% in the past six
> months alone.
3% huh, see oil prices above
Please explain how the consumer price index is
> "misleading."
obviously it has not shown up with the drop in oil prices
I haven't been in a McDonald's in decades, so what is a
> hamburger up to now with all of your price increases? 10 dollars?
about $4 and it hasn't come down in the last year
rsh...@gmail.com
> much product to more people that you need to invest to expand!
>
fine compare it to running a business
what business could have survived the inflation of the 1970's and kept
the same prices as it had in the mid 1950's
fine, your business doubles, but your expenses quadruple
and you never raise your prices and you want expansion????
that is a prescription for bankruptcy
what exactly did you expect from the merger, a free ride?
the tolls on the pkwy are about 30% higher then they were when then
road was built in the 1950's
what business could raise its prices once in 55 years
and still not cover inflation
btw, there were benefits to the merger
the honchos from the authority that ran the pkwy are gone
I realize they got bought out, but still they are gone and the pkwy is
under the tpk
something else, the new Driscoll Br, the Pkwy Auth did not have enough
revenue to let the contracts, that was a primary reason for the
merger, so the Tpk could let the const contracts and use its revenues
>
>
> >>> not to mention, it took the Dems, Jim McGreevey to eliminate the auth
> >>> that ran the pkwy
> >> Yeah, Gov McGreedy was *GREAT*!!! Was it the appointment of a
> >> completely unqualified, "homeland security adviser" with no experience
> >> outside of writing poetry because he was involved in a relationship, the
> >> pay to play, or perhaps the extortion scandals that you found most
> >> inspiring?
>
> > he was better then the Whitman DiFransesco mess
>
> > and you were babbling about the tpk-pkwy merger which he did
>
> > whitman who I am sure you are very proud of, could not pull it off
>
> Yes, she couldn't "pull off" something which has not had much benefit.
these are your words:
There was some initial consolidation due to the intense
> >>>>>>>>>> fiscal need,
what was that fiscal need again?????
and btw you never answered my question
what toll road auth issued bonds without raising tolls???
a toll road that had never raised the tolls in 50+ years while
expenses quadruped
it was merged with a larger auth so they could use the tpk revenue for
expansion which the pkwy could not
again, what do you want, a free ride?
>
> >> And the Dems have been such doing a such a fantastic job in New Jersey,
> >> the voters are begging for a Democrat governor, right?
>
> > so lets see what Cristie does in the next 4 years
>
> > btw, the dems still control the legislature
>
> > I don't know if you realize that
>
> I realize it. So the legislature is going to reverse course and start
> acting to make New Jersey competitive right? Ha!
>
>
you want to make NJ competitive
566 municipalities, 600+ school dists
who did you support, that idiot Lonegan for gov?
the only thing he ever got elected to was mayor of the huge town of
Bogota
if he would put his conservative mouth into action he would be
merging Bogota schools with Teaneck
as a matter of fact, the whole town should be merged with Teaneck
Bogota is less then 1 square mile
>
> >>>>> has anything come back down? please tell me
> >>>> Yes. Don't take my word for it, look at the consumer price index.
> >>> so that is an average, heavily influenced by oil prices
> >> Actually it is a shopping basket of popular consumer items from across
> >> the board.
>
> > right and it is heavily influenced by oil prices it is not reality
>
> >>> but no individual prices that went up to take into account oil have
> >>> come back down
> >>> not Mc Donalds, not groceries, nothing that I know of
> >>> averages are misleading
> >> Clearly you don't shop much. Airline prices are off 30% from last year
> >> for similar tickets.
>
> > so lets see
>
> > oil went up to $170 a bar, about tripled
>
> > then dropped to about $70 a bar
>
> > In the grocery store, milk is down nearly 50% off
> >> last year.
>
> > see oil prices above
>
> ????
I thought you might be able to reference a few lines above, sorry
> > oil went up to $170 a bar, about tripled
>
> > then dropped to about $70 a bar
so by that prices should be down what 70-75%
>
>
> > Grocery prices as a whole have dropped 3% in the past six
> >> months alone.
>
> > 3% huh, see oil prices above
>
> ??? You thought that 100% of food cost was the price of oil!???
>
nope, but a significant part of it is
it should have come down a lot more then 3%
something about profit taking
>
>
> > Please explain how the consumer price index is
> >> "misleading."
>
it only measures a "market basket" and certain living exp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_price_index
The prices of 95,000 items from 22,000 stores, and 35,000 rental units
are added together and averaged. They are weighted this way: Housing:
41.4%, Food and Beverage: 17.4%, Transport: 17.0%, Medical Care: 6.9%,
Other: 6.9%, Apparel: 6.0%, Entertainment: 4.4%.
in NJ you are going to be hard pressed to find rent 41.4% of your
income
maybe in MT, but not NJ
> > obviously it has not shown up with the drop in oil prices
>
> Obviously your data is incorrect.
>
>
>
> > I haven't been in a McDonald's in decades, so what is a
> >> hamburger up to now with all of your price increases? 10 dollars?
>
> > about $4 and it hasn't come down in the last year
>
> And this is relevant or somebody cares because...
all your babbling about the cpi and price drops and I am showing you
that not all prices have dropped corresponding to the drop in oil
prices
the for profit businesses used the oil price drops to raise their
profits
rsh...@gmail.com
>
>
thru tolls went from 70c to $1
>
> > what business could raise its prices once in 55 years
>
> > and still not cover inflation
>
> > btw, there were benefits to the merger
>
> > the honchos from the authority that ran the pkwy are gone
>
> > I realize they got bought out, but still they are gone and the pkwy is
> > under the tpk
>
> Great, thanks for catching up!
>
>
>
> > something else, the new Driscoll Br, the Pkwy Auth did not have enough
> > revenue to let the contracts, that was a primary reason for the
> > merger, so the Tpk could let the const contracts and use its revenues
>
> What a great plan, we'll divert money from one road's users to pay for
> another. Swell.
The auth that ran the pkwy did not have enough revenue to let the
contracts
there should have been a toll increase, but politically it was not
possible
is it your suggestion that the Driscoll Br should not have been
reconstructed?
>
>
>
>
>
> >>>>> not to mention, it took the Dems, Jim McGreevey to eliminate the auth
> >>>>> that ran the pkwy
> >>>> Yeah, Gov McGreedy was *GREAT*!!! Was it the appointment of a
> >>>> completely unqualified, "homeland security adviser" with no experience
> >>>> outside of writing poetry because he was involved in a relationship, the
> >>>> pay to play, or perhaps the extortion scandals that you found most
> >>>> inspiring?
> >>> he was better then the Whitman DiFransesco mess
> >>> and you were babbling about the tpk-pkwy merger which he did
> >>> whitman who I am sure you are very proud of, could not pull it off
> >> Yes, she couldn't "pull off" something which has not had much benefit.
>
> > these are your words:
>
> > There was some initial consolidation due to the intense
> >>>>>>>>>>>> fiscal need,
>
> > what was that fiscal need again?????
>
> > and btw you never answered my question
>
> > what toll road auth issued bonds without raising tolls???
>
> Gosh did not you just claim that GSP did not raise tolls for fifty
> years? Haha! During that time they were issuing bonds throughout.
>
and they used the increased revenues from increases in traffic to pay
them off instead of improving the road
> > a toll road that had never raised the tolls in 50+ years while
> > expenses quadruped
>
> Speaking of expenses, how much did expenses go up on I-195, I-78, I-295?
>
well, considering there are billions of dollars in unmet maintainence
needs and unmet expansion and the state gas tax has not gone up since
1990, substantially
furthermore NJDOT has been issuing GARVEE bonds against future
revenues, this is not good
>
>
> > it was merged with a larger auth so they could use the tpk revenue for
> > expansion which the pkwy could not
>
> > again, what do you want, a free ride?
>
> Clearly fiscal management is too much to ask for.
>
>
what do you want, expansion and no toll increases
the tolls are still a huge bargain
and they save the NJDOT a lot of money
in that the auth gives something like $30M a year to NJDOT
>
> >>>> And the Dems have been such doing a such a fantastic job in New Jersey,
> >>>> the voters are begging for a Democrat governor, right?
> >>> so lets see what Cristie does in the next 4 years
> >>> btw, the dems still control the legislature
> >>> I don't know if you realize that
> >> I realize it. So the legislature is going to reverse course and start
> >> acting to make New Jersey competitive right? Ha!
>
> > you want to make NJ competitive
>
> > 566 municipalities, 600+ school dists
>
> > who did you support, that idiot Lonegan for gov?
>
> > the only thing he ever got elected to was mayor of the huge town of
> > Bogota
>
> > if he would put his conservative mouth into action he would be
> > merging Bogota schools with Teaneck
>
> > as a matter of fact, the whole town should be merged with Teaneck
>
> > Bogota is less then 1 square mile
>
> Far off topic. Maybe you could start your own thread for random rants
> about whatever.
so it is alright for you to rant about "Mc Greedy" but anything else
is ot?
and you want to make NJ "competitive" and I just told you how,
you are the one that brought it up
you would not be a hypocrite would you?
> Uh, sure.
so no for profit business is taking advantage of oil price increases
to make additional profit????
>
>
>
> >>> Please explain how the consumer price index is
> >>>> "misleading."
>
> > it only measures a "market basket" and certain living exp
>
> >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_price_index
>
> > The prices of 95,000 items from 22,000 stores, and 35,000 rental units
> > are added together and averaged. They are weighted this way: Housing:
> > 41.4%, Food and Beverage: 17.4%, Transport: 17.0%, Medical Care: 6.9%,
> > Other: 6.9%, Apparel: 6.0%, Entertainment: 4.4%.
>
> > in NJ you are going to be hard pressed to find rent 41.4% of your
> > income
>
> You just again demonstrated that you have no idea about the subject
> matter you talk about. CPI has nothing to do with a percentage of income!
it is a measure of inflation, what is the point of measuring inflation
if it is not compared to incomes
>
>
>
> > maybe in MT, but not NJ
>
> Well with the NJ legislature working so hard to make NJ has unaffordable
> and unattractive, where is the surprise?
>
>
>
> >>> obviously it has not shown up with the drop in oil prices
> >> Obviously your data is incorrect.
>
> >>> I haven't been in a McDonald's in decades, so what is a
> >>>> hamburger up to now with all of your price increases? 10 dollars?
> >>> about $4 and it hasn't come down in the last year
> >> And this is relevant or somebody cares because...
>
> > all your babbling about the cpi and price drops and I am showing you
> > that not all prices have dropped corresponding to the drop in oil
> > prices
>
> Great. I already showed you that as a whole consumer prices are down as
> a whole. You then confused CPI with income, somehow. An economics
> student you are not. Sorry that the McDonald's hamburgers take such a
> bite out of your wallet.
>
and you don't have living exp that take a bite out of yours
oil dropped 200+% so why haven't living exp
as well your income
> > the for profit businesses used the oil price drops to raise their
> > profits
>
> Yeah, sure.
so since oil dropped by 200+% that is what the corresponding cpi
should drop by
3% ain't nothing
only in your little world
you just like stats that support your twisting, you don't like
interpretation
and why blame the legislature
I told you what the solution is, should I repeat it?
John S
You are confusing a toll price with revenue.
>
>
>
>
>>> what business could raise its prices once in 55 years
>>> and still not cover inflation
>>> btw, there were benefits to the merger
>>> the honchos from the authority that ran the pkwy are gone
>>> I realize they got bought out, but still they are gone and the pkwy is
>>> under the tpk
>> Great, thanks for catching up!
>>
>>
>>
>>> something else, the new Driscoll Br, the Pkwy Auth did not have enough
>>> revenue to let the contracts, that was a primary reason for the
>>> merger, so the Tpk could let the const contracts and use its revenues
>> What a great plan, we'll divert money from one road's users to pay for
>> another. Swell.
>
>
> The auth that ran the pkwy did not have enough revenue to let the
> contracts
>
> there should have been a toll increase, but politically it was not
> possible
Not possible? There just was a toll increase.
>
> is it your suggestion that the Driscoll Br should not have been
> reconstructed?
Read carefully, I have not made such a suggestion.
>
>
>
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>>>>> not to mention, it took the Dems, Jim McGreevey to eliminate the auth
>>>>>>> that ran the pkwy
>>>>>> Yeah, Gov McGreedy was *GREAT*!!! Was it the appointment of a
>>>>>> completely unqualified, "homeland security adviser" with no experience
>>>>>> outside of writing poetry because he was involved in a relationship, the
>>>>>> pay to play, or perhaps the extortion scandals that you found most
>>>>>> inspiring?
>>>>> he was better then the Whitman DiFransesco mess
>>>>> and you were babbling about the tpk-pkwy merger which he did
>>>>> whitman who I am sure you are very proud of, could not pull it off
>>>> Yes, she couldn't "pull off" something which has not had much benefit.
>>> these are your words:
>>> There was some initial consolidation due to the intense
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> fiscal need,
>>> what was that fiscal need again?????
>>> and btw you never answered my question
>>> what toll road auth issued bonds without raising tolls???
>> Gosh did not you just claim that GSP did not raise tolls for fifty
>> years? Haha! During that time they were issuing bonds throughout.
>>
>
> and they used the increased revenues from increases in traffic to pay
> them off instead of improving the road
And you can cite that "fact," right?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>> a toll road that had never raised the tolls in 50+ years while
>>> expenses quadruped
>> Speaking of expenses, how much did expenses go up on I-195, I-78, I-295?
>>
>
> well, considering there are billions of dollars in unmet maintainence
> needs and unmet expansion and the state gas tax has not gone up since
> 1990, substantially
Funny how those roads are in such good condition then. And they didn't
even need a toll booth.
>
> furthermore NJDOT has been issuing GARVEE bonds against future
> revenues, this is not good
>
>
>
>
>>
>>> it was merged with a larger auth so they could use the tpk revenue for
>>> expansion which the pkwy could not
>>> again, what do you want, a free ride?
>> Clearly fiscal management is too much to ask for.
>>
>>
>
>
> what do you want, expansion and no toll increases
>
> the tolls are still a huge bargain
>
> and they save the NJDOT a lot of money
>
> in that the auth gives something like $30M a year to NJDOT
Sure, the tolls are a "bargain." Tollpayers get the privilege of paying
for a whole separate overpriced bureacracy, a massive payroll for highly
paid cashiers, toll administration, and untold millions/billions more on
outdated and very expensive E-ZPass technology. All the while the
tollpayers simultaneously spend gas tax at the same time, which pays for
roads someone else is driving on. What a deal!
>
>
>
>
>>>>>> And the Dems have been such doing a such a fantastic job in New Jersey,
>>>>>> the voters are begging for a Democrat governor, right?
>>>>> so lets see what Cristie does in the next 4 years
>>>>> btw, the dems still control the legislature
>>>>> I don't know if you realize that
>>>> I realize it. So the legislature is going to reverse course and start
>>>> acting to make New Jersey competitive right? Ha!
>>> you want to make NJ competitive
>>> 566 municipalities, 600+ school dists
>>> who did you support, that idiot Lonegan for gov?
>>> the only thing he ever got elected to was mayor of the huge town of
>>> Bogota
>>> if he would put his conservative mouth into action he would be
>>> merging Bogota schools with Teaneck
>>> as a matter of fact, the whole town should be merged with Teaneck
>>> Bogota is less then 1 square mile
>> Far off topic. Maybe you could start your own thread for random rants
>> about whatever.
>
>
> so it is alright for you to rant about "Mc Greedy" but anything else
> is ot?
>
> and you want to make NJ "competitive" and I just told you how,
>
> you are the one that brought it up
>
> you would not be a hypocrite would you?
You introduced the Gov. McGreedy, not I. Now you've skipped around
again and moved into municipal level politics for whatever reason. If
you'd like to continue that very important discussion with someone,
perhaps a more suitable newsgroup would be in order. May I suggest
alt.stupidity?
Huh? Companies compete with each other on price. If you don't like
company A, try another. Consider the difference between a shift and a
slide on a supply curve.
>
>
>
>>
>>
>>>>> Please explain how the consumer price index is
>>>>>> "misleading."
>>> it only measures a "market basket" and certain living exp
>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_price_index
>>> The prices of 95,000 items from 22,000 stores, and 35,000 rental units
>>> are added together and averaged. They are weighted this way: Housing:
>>> 41.4%, Food and Beverage: 17.4%, Transport: 17.0%, Medical Care: 6.9%,
>>> Other: 6.9%, Apparel: 6.0%, Entertainment: 4.4%.
>>> in NJ you are going to be hard pressed to find rent 41.4% of your
>>> income
>> You just again demonstrated that you have no idea about the subject
>> matter you talk about. CPI has nothing to do with a percentage of income!
>
> it is a measure of inflation, what is the point of measuring inflation
> if it is not compared to incomes
Inflation of prices is a measure of how much an overall basket of good
changes (increases) over time. A percentage of housing goods in the
sample overall basket has absolutely nothing, nada, to do with what
percent of rent vs income. If you'd like to know more, I'd recommend a
microeconomics text book.
>
>
>
>
>>
>>
>>> maybe in MT, but not NJ
>> Well with the NJ legislature working so hard to make NJ has unaffordable
>> and unattractive, where is the surprise?
>>
>>
>>
>>>>> obviously it has not shown up with the drop in oil prices
>>>> Obviously your data is incorrect.
>>>>> I haven't been in a McDonald's in decades, so what is a
>>>>>> hamburger up to now with all of your price increases? 10 dollars?
>>>>> about $4 and it hasn't come down in the last year
>>>> And this is relevant or somebody cares because...
>>> all your babbling about the cpi and price drops and I am showing you
>>> that not all prices have dropped corresponding to the drop in oil
>>> prices
>> Great. I already showed you that as a whole consumer prices are down as
>> a whole. You then confused CPI with income, somehow. An economics
>> student you are not. Sorry that the McDonald's hamburgers take such a
>> bite out of your wallet.
>>
>
> and you don't have living exp that take a bite out of yours
>
> oil dropped 200+% so why haven't living exp
>
> as well your income
Because 100% of my living expenses are not comprised of crude oil. I
strongly doubt yours are either.
>
>
>
>
>>> the for profit businesses used the oil price drops to raise their
>>> profits
>> Yeah, sure.
>
> so since oil dropped by 200+% that is what the corresponding cpi
> should drop by
>
> 3% ain't nothing
>
> only in your little world
And the rest of reality.
>
>
>
>
>
> you just like stats that support your twisting, you don't like
> interpretation
>
> and why blame the legislature
>
> I told you what the solution is, should I repeat it?
Because I live in reality and facts, not dancing around random topics.
HTH HAND