Major drawback of MLO - outline filtering
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daneb
Sep 1, 2009, 12:38:00 PM9/1/09
to MyLifeOrganized
Hello,
There are several issues, which I have expected to improve in MLO for
long, long time. It is 1) prioritization of tasks (not importance/
urgency, but real ABC or similar prioritization method, over which has
user full control) and even more important 2) filtering in tree view
(based on this prioritization and other criteria)
What was always my problem with MLO – when my tree became too
complicated (included all work and home areas, someday/maybe, area,
long-term goals, deferred tasks etc) and had several hundreds of
items, it was absolutely impossible to focus on tasks, which were
important at the moment (e.g. week goals, A-priority…). Of course, I
could filter and view them in to-do view, but in case I would be
satisfied with not hierarchical to-do view, I would stay with Outlook.
I just want to view only relevant tasks at the moment in my tree view,
like Achieve Planner enables me to.
I do not understand why so important feature has not been implemented
yet, especially when basic filtering in outline is in fact available,
although in very elemental way (you can filter out completed tasks
from the tree view).
I would like to ask other users or Andrey if they would consider this
filtering important or what you do when the task lists become several
hundreds items long and start to be too cluttered. I know, there are
many ways how to get around this problem – to use several MLO files,
to-do views, A,B,C folders as priorities. But why to compromise when
other applications (even Outlook) can solve this issue very easily?
MLO is best GTD application available in my opinion. But I am afraid
that it only remains best application for GTD and will have very
limited possibility for using for more strategic (vertical, 30000 feet
or how to name it) goal and time management, which is impossible to
implement in well-arranged way without implementation of priorities
and filtering in tree view (and ad lib sorting of tasks in to-do view,
but it is another problem). Because GTD is ingenious but there are
also limits of this approach (especially with vertical TM), which
could be avoid by combination with other methods (e.g. Covey) which
require above mentioned features.
Thank you for your opinions, replies or suggestions!
Daneb
There are several issues, which I have expected to improve in MLO for
long, long time. It is 1) prioritization of tasks (not importance/
urgency, but real ABC or similar prioritization method, over which has
user full control) and even more important 2) filtering in tree view
(based on this prioritization and other criteria)
What was always my problem with MLO – when my tree became too
complicated (included all work and home areas, someday/maybe, area,
long-term goals, deferred tasks etc) and had several hundreds of
items, it was absolutely impossible to focus on tasks, which were
important at the moment (e.g. week goals, A-priority…). Of course, I
could filter and view them in to-do view, but in case I would be
satisfied with not hierarchical to-do view, I would stay with Outlook.
I just want to view only relevant tasks at the moment in my tree view,
like Achieve Planner enables me to.
I do not understand why so important feature has not been implemented
yet, especially when basic filtering in outline is in fact available,
although in very elemental way (you can filter out completed tasks
from the tree view).
I would like to ask other users or Andrey if they would consider this
filtering important or what you do when the task lists become several
hundreds items long and start to be too cluttered. I know, there are
many ways how to get around this problem – to use several MLO files,
to-do views, A,B,C folders as priorities. But why to compromise when
other applications (even Outlook) can solve this issue very easily?
MLO is best GTD application available in my opinion. But I am afraid
that it only remains best application for GTD and will have very
limited possibility for using for more strategic (vertical, 30000 feet
or how to name it) goal and time management, which is impossible to
implement in well-arranged way without implementation of priorities
and filtering in tree view (and ad lib sorting of tasks in to-do view,
but it is another problem). Because GTD is ingenious but there are
also limits of this approach (especially with vertical TM), which
could be avoid by combination with other methods (e.g. Covey) which
require above mentioned features.
Thank you for your opinions, replies or suggestions!
Daneb
chuckdevee
Sep 2, 2009, 2:10:33 AM9/2/09
to MyLifeOrganized
not exactly sure how filtering would work in a tree view.. you have a
zoom which can limit what you see to the branches of a single top-
level task.. beyond that, I'm not sure how this could be improved..
could you be more specific about how you would see this working?
zoom which can limit what you see to the branches of a single top-
level task.. beyond that, I'm not sure how this could be improved..
could you be more specific about how you would see this working?
MikeM
Sep 2, 2009, 10:26:52 AM9/2/09
to MyLifeOrganized
I tend to filter the to-do by perverting the Context filter which
really annoys me. I group projects like work/home/etc in different
folders using the tree structure itself.
I would really like to see an additional filters for what David Allen
calls the Roles and Responsibilitie and Horizons of Focus areas
(REXWireless toDoMatrix calls these definable Dimensions and allows
filtering). I also would like to see these filters available on the
Outline as well as the ToDo lists. In fact I had gone to the
toDoMatrix just because of these features but their lack of
development of their Desktop (Web) product for over 2 years drove me
back to MLO. Now the BB version work is making me glad I came back.
But I would really like better (more flexible) filtering.
Just my 50 cents worth.
Mike
really annoys me. I group projects like work/home/etc in different
folders using the tree structure itself.
I would really like to see an additional filters for what David Allen
calls the Roles and Responsibilitie and Horizons of Focus areas
(REXWireless toDoMatrix calls these definable Dimensions and allows
filtering). I also would like to see these filters available on the
Outline as well as the ToDo lists. In fact I had gone to the
toDoMatrix just because of these features but their lack of
development of their Desktop (Web) product for over 2 years drove me
back to MLO. Now the BB version work is making me glad I came back.
But I would really like better (more flexible) filtering.
Just my 50 cents worth.
Mike
MikeM
Sep 2, 2009, 10:32:27 AM9/2/09
to MyLifeOrganized
Chuck,
I believe what Daneb is wanting is filtering like the Context
filtering in the ToDo list only on the Outline (tree view). Should
not be too difficult to do as long as Andrey is using ADO.NET, just
add a dataview to feed the Tree control and slap a RowFilter on it. I
am pretty sure he is using Visual Studio and the .NET Framework since
the PPC version requires the .NET framework.
I believe what Daneb is wanting is filtering like the Context
filtering in the ToDo list only on the Outline (tree view). Should
not be too difficult to do as long as Andrey is using ADO.NET, just
add a dataview to feed the Tree control and slap a RowFilter on it. I
am pretty sure he is using Visual Studio and the .NET Framework since
the PPC version requires the .NET framework.
chuckdevee
Sep 2, 2009, 11:00:31 AM9/2/09
to MyLifeOrganized
Hi Mike, I'm not sure how filtering might work in a tree as opposed to
a list.. if, say, you want to see only tasks of a specific category,
and their parents do not have that category, how then is the parent
displayed? And if it isn't displayed, then how can you move that task
or add a sibling? thanks
a list.. if, say, you want to see only tasks of a specific category,
and their parents do not have that category, how then is the parent
displayed? And if it isn't displayed, then how can you move that task
or add a sibling? thanks
daneb
Sep 2, 2009, 12:56:08 PM9/2/09
to MyLifeOrganized
Hi Chuck,
Achieve Planner (Effexis) or Todolist (AbstractSpoon) is good example
how this filtering in outline can be done. If you filter e.g. by
category, you can see all the tasks labeled by that category PLUS all
their parents (irrespective of their categories), but not necessarily
their siblings and children. The same applies for priorities and any
other filtering criteria. What it brings is easy view to your specific
tasks which you need at the moment (e.g. today tasks, A-priorities,
particular context) without (at the moment) irrelevant tasks but with
all the hierarchy.
It is really very helpful when you have several hundreds of items in
the tree and “zoom” is not the option, because you have e.g. tree
structured by areas or responsibilities and you want to see ALL today
tasks... Also adding new task in the hierarchy is very easy – although
you cannot see all the tasks, in case new task will belong to some of
the visible tasks, there is not problem to add it (although it can
later disappear by refreshing the view).
Daneb
Achieve Planner (Effexis) or Todolist (AbstractSpoon) is good example
how this filtering in outline can be done. If you filter e.g. by
category, you can see all the tasks labeled by that category PLUS all
their parents (irrespective of their categories), but not necessarily
their siblings and children. The same applies for priorities and any
other filtering criteria. What it brings is easy view to your specific
tasks which you need at the moment (e.g. today tasks, A-priorities,
particular context) without (at the moment) irrelevant tasks but with
all the hierarchy.
It is really very helpful when you have several hundreds of items in
the tree and “zoom” is not the option, because you have e.g. tree
structured by areas or responsibilities and you want to see ALL today
tasks... Also adding new task in the hierarchy is very easy – although
you cannot see all the tasks, in case new task will belong to some of
the visible tasks, there is not problem to add it (although it can
later disappear by refreshing the view).
Daneb
chuckdevee
Sep 2, 2009, 1:15:31 PM9/2/09
to MyLifeOrganized
ah.. yes, then I agree, this functionality would definitely be useful
tool to help manage large task trees.
Indeed, it would be great to have something like the Advanced Filters
used in the To_Do lists, so that someone could view, for example,
tasks added over the past week, or tasks due today, or tasks with a
high importance rating, or tasks with no start date, or lead time
greater than a certain period.. etc. etc.
however, if you fliter you tasks, there is a danger that you would not
be able to see sub-tasks and in completing that task, you'd disrupt
the logic of your task tree. So my suggestion would perhaps be to
disallow task completion while in 'filtered' mode, or disallow task
completion if there are uncompleted subtasks. (I think there should be
an option for this anyway.)
tool to help manage large task trees.
Indeed, it would be great to have something like the Advanced Filters
used in the To_Do lists, so that someone could view, for example,
tasks added over the past week, or tasks due today, or tasks with a
high importance rating, or tasks with no start date, or lead time
greater than a certain period.. etc. etc.
however, if you fliter you tasks, there is a danger that you would not
be able to see sub-tasks and in completing that task, you'd disrupt
the logic of your task tree. So my suggestion would perhaps be to
disallow task completion while in 'filtered' mode, or disallow task
completion if there are uncompleted subtasks. (I think there should be
an option for this anyway.)
RichardCollings
Sep 2, 2009, 1:34:25 PM9/2/09
to MyLifeOrganized
+1 to being able to fiter in the Outline view. A NOT option would
also be useful. At the moment, I am managing a list that has grownn
too long by adding a @Now context to those tasks that I want to do in
the short term. I would be really useful to be able to have an
Outline view which just consisted of those items which do not have the
@Now context.
also be useful. At the moment, I am managing a list that has grownn
too long by adding a @Now context to those tasks that I want to do in
the short term. I would be really useful to be able to have an
Outline view which just consisted of those items which do not have the
@Now context.
daneb
Sep 2, 2009, 1:35:18 PM9/2/09
to MyLifeOrganized
yes, you are right, it could happen – disallowing completion would be
good idea. Moreover, I think outline is usually used more for overview
of the tasks, daily review etc. and whole-day “hard” work is usually
done from to-do view, including completion of the tasks, so this
disallowing would not be disruptive.
good idea. Moreover, I think outline is usually used more for overview
of the tasks, daily review etc. and whole-day “hard” work is usually
done from to-do view, including completion of the tasks, so this
disallowing would not be disruptive.
vikram.sjn
Sep 3, 2009, 5:45:44 AM9/3/09
to MyLifeOrganized
+1
I have exactly same opinion as daneb's. I have always wanted filtering
in outline, and expected to come in ... but still waiting.
I have exactly same opinion as daneb's. I have always wanted filtering
in outline, and expected to come in ... but still waiting.
Top Cat
Sep 4, 2009, 8:02:01 AM9/4/09
to MyLifeOrganized
+1 for filtering in outline
cd
Sep 6, 2009, 4:36:44 AM9/6/09
to MyLifeOrganized
and another vote for that filter - i switched from achieve planner to
MLO
due to superior MLO PPC functionality but miss the outline filter
which is fantastic
MLO
due to superior MLO PPC functionality but miss the outline filter
which is fantastic
reesd
Oct 6, 2009, 10:46:21 AM10/6/09
to MyLifeOrganized
I switched from MLO to Bonsai over a year ago because I needed outline
filtering. I wrote several detailed posts about how it could work, but
it just never happened. I check back every once in a while to see if
its finally been put back in, but am sadly disappointed each time.
Personally I can't function without outline filtering so I'll be
sticking with Bonsai for now (though I am eyeing InfoCube also -
http://www.infoqube.biz/).
d
On Sep 6, 4:36 am, cd <camerond.i...@gmail.com> wrote:
> and another vote for thatfilter- i switched from achieve planner to
filtering. I wrote several detailed posts about how it could work, but
it just never happened. I check back every once in a while to see if
its finally been put back in, but am sadly disappointed each time.
Personally I can't function without outline filtering so I'll be
sticking with Bonsai for now (though I am eyeing InfoCube also -
http://www.infoqube.biz/).
d
On Sep 6, 4:36 am, cd <camerond.i...@gmail.com> wrote:
> and another vote for thatfilter- i switched from achieve planner to
> MLO
> due to superior MLO PPC functionality but miss the outlinefilter
> which is fantastic
>
> On Sep 4, 10:02 pm, Top Cat <tcolo...@juno.com> wrote:
>
> > +1 for filtering in outline
>
> > On Sep 1, 12:38 pm, daneb <dals...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Hello,
>
> > > There are several issues, which I have expected to improve in MLO for
> > > long, long time. It is 1) prioritization of tasks (not importance/
> > > urgency, but real ABC or similar prioritization method, over which has
> > > user full control) and even more important 2) filtering in tree view
> > > (based on this prioritization and other criteria)
>
> > > What was always my problem with MLO – when my tree became too
> > > complicated (included all work and home areas, someday/maybe, area,
> > > long-term goals, deferred tasks etc) and had several hundreds of
> > > items, it was absolutely impossible to focus on tasks, which were
> > > important at the moment (e.g. week goals, A-priority…). Of course, I
> > > couldfilterand view them in to-do view, but in case I would be
> due to superior MLO PPC functionality but miss the outlinefilter
> which is fantastic
>
> On Sep 4, 10:02 pm, Top Cat <tcolo...@juno.com> wrote:
>
> > +1 for filtering in outline
>
> > On Sep 1, 12:38 pm, daneb <dals...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Hello,
>
> > > There are several issues, which I have expected to improve in MLO for
> > > long, long time. It is 1) prioritization of tasks (not importance/
> > > urgency, but real ABC or similar prioritization method, over which has
> > > user full control) and even more important 2) filtering in tree view
> > > (based on this prioritization and other criteria)
>
> > > What was always my problem with MLO – when my tree became too
> > > complicated (included all work and home areas, someday/maybe, area,
> > > long-term goals, deferred tasks etc) and had several hundreds of
> > > items, it was absolutely impossible to focus on tasks, which were
> > > important at the moment (e.g. week goals, A-priority…). Of course, I
> > > satisfied with not hierarchical to-do view, I would stay with Outlook.
> > > I just want to view only relevant tasks at the moment in my tree view,
> > > like Achieve Planner enables me to.
>
> > > I do not understand why so important feature has not been implemented
> > > yet, especially when basic filtering in outline is in fact available,
> > > although in very elemental way (you canfilterout completed tasks
> > > I just want to view only relevant tasks at the moment in my tree view,
> > > like Achieve Planner enables me to.
>
> > > I do not understand why so important feature has not been implemented
> > > yet, especially when basic filtering in outline is in fact available,
pkelecy
Oct 7, 2009, 8:33:59 AM10/7/09
to MyLifeOrganized
On Oct 6, 10:46 am, reesd <d...@ubiqsoft.com> wrote:
> I switched from MLO to Bonsai over a year ago because I needed outline
> filtering. I wrote several detailed posts about how it could work, but
> it just never happened. I check back every once in a while to see if
> its finally been put back in, but am sadly disappointed each time.
> Personally I can't function without outline filtering so I'll be
> sticking with Bonsai for now (though I am eyeing InfoCube also -http://www.infoqube.biz/).
I'm starting to come to a similar conclusion. For the way I work, I
> I switched from MLO to Bonsai over a year ago because I needed outline
> filtering. I wrote several detailed posts about how it could work, but
> it just never happened. I check back every once in a while to see if
> its finally been put back in, but am sadly disappointed each time.
> Personally I can't function without outline filtering so I'll be
> sticking with Bonsai for now (though I am eyeing InfoCube also -http://www.infoqube.biz/).
think outline filtering would
be very beneficial. So I'm starting to look around at other options
that have this, and Bonsai looks
like a good candidate. One question though. How did you transfer
your data from MLO into Bonsai?
That's my main concern, as it would be a major chore to retype it all.
Richard Collings
Oct 8, 2009, 3:48:01 PM10/8/09
to mylifeo...@googlegroups.com
I am interested in what you would both use outline filtering for. Not
being negative here, just interested.
being negative here, just interested.
Lisa Stroyan
Oct 8, 2009, 4:37:56 PM10/8/09
to mylifeo...@googlegroups.com
At 01:48 PM 10/8/2009, you wrote:
I am interested in what you would both use outline filtering for. Not
being negative here, just interested.
I would love to be able to filter out future-dated tasks (but still see
the tree view), and have dynamic sorting in the outline view so that I
don't have to move tasks around so much.
Lisa Stroyan, li...@stroyan.net
www.empathic-parenting.com
Lisa
Lisa Stroyan, li...@stroyan.net
www.empathic-parenting.com
Treo Boy
Oct 8, 2009, 7:39:50 PM10/8/09
to mylifeo...@googlegroups.com
Are you using the Beta version of Bonsai for Win Mobile? I went from Palm to Win Mobile some time ago and I don't know of a Palm device out there that I could go back to.
tb
tb
vikram.sjn
Oct 9, 2009, 6:28:52 AM10/9/09
to MyLifeOrganized
i too started with mlo, then moved to achieve planner, then returned
back
now using mlo continously - but miss outline filtering
back
now using mlo continously - but miss outline filtering
Richard Collings
Oct 10, 2009, 2:31:03 PM10/10/09
to mylifeo...@googlegroups.com
Er -
why (re filtering out future dated tasks)? And what do you mean by
dynamic sorting (as before - just interested).
-----Original Message-----
From: mylifeo...@googlegroups.com [mailto:mylifeo...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Lisa Stroyan
Sent: 08 October 2009 9:38 p
To: mylifeo...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [MLO] Re: Major drawback of MLO - outline filtering
Lisa Stroyan
Oct 10, 2009, 5:00:41 PM10/10/09
to mylifeo...@googlegroups.com
At 12:31 PM 10/10/2009, you wrote:
Er - why (re filtering out future dated tasks)? And what do you mean by dynamic sorting (as before - just interested).
I usually future date my tasks to get them out of my view but still have
them show up at the right time. So I like to switch back and forth
between seeing them and not seeing them. Same reason as being
able to filter out completed tasks, or not, depending on what is
needed.
Dynamic sorting is already available in the Todo tab, but is static in the outline - it doesn't update based on criteria when new tasks are added - the actual location is changed when sorting is applied, rather than a filtered view that can be turned on/off.
By dynamic sorting, I mean being able to temporarily "sort the outline by Caption", but still keep the tree view of folders/projects, and not have that order messed up every time I add a new task (it goes to the bottom or the top of whatever folder I put it in).
I put a priority indicator in the beginning of my captions - haven't switched to MLO's priority calculations yet, though I'm thinking about it. Again, it would be nice to be able to switch between filtered (sorted) and static/unsorted.
Ideally, I'd like a similar Filtering UI for the outline that is in the Todo tab. (I wouldn't want them combined - I really like having two views, one that is my "big picture" and other that is my slice-and-dice of what I want to see.
Dynamic sorting is already available in the Todo tab, but is static in the outline - it doesn't update based on criteria when new tasks are added - the actual location is changed when sorting is applied, rather than a filtered view that can be turned on/off.
By dynamic sorting, I mean being able to temporarily "sort the outline by Caption", but still keep the tree view of folders/projects, and not have that order messed up every time I add a new task (it goes to the bottom or the top of whatever folder I put it in).
I put a priority indicator in the beginning of my captions - haven't switched to MLO's priority calculations yet, though I'm thinking about it. Again, it would be nice to be able to switch between filtered (sorted) and static/unsorted.
Ideally, I'd like a similar Filtering UI for the outline that is in the Todo tab. (I wouldn't want them combined - I really like having two views, one that is my "big picture" and other that is my slice-and-dice of what I want to see.
Mr. Analogy
Oct 12, 2009, 10:37:23 PM10/12/09
to MyLifeOrganized
+1 for this idea of filtering the tree. (Or showing filter results in
a tree so you can see the hierarchy)
-Clay
a tree so you can see the hierarchy)
-Clay
reesd
Mar 7, 2011, 9:54:55 PM3/7/11
to mylifeo...@googlegroups.com
FYI, You can now vote for outline filtering in the MLO UserVoice forum at http://mlo.uservoice.com/forums/9235-general/suggestions/1044979-outline-filtering
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