TB3-quite an accomplishment!!!
Miles
will be worked out over the next few months. I only wish that some of
the changes made had an easy way to turn them off, or perhaps a help
site that describes that --- perhaps in the near future!! (Tabs is
the 1st to come to mind, or at least a way to simply double click on
the tab to shut it down as is accomplished in FX.)
Also apparently the address book hasn't yet been worked on, and
believe I read that's destined for 3.1 which hopefully won't be long,
for that has been a sore spot for years.
In closing want to thank the TB team for their hard & diligent work
which was definitely worth the wait.
Miles
Ron P
This works great for me to double click & close the tab.
Miles
> On 1/5/2010 10:34 PM, Miles wrote:
>> Obviously a great deal of effort went into this upgrade and a few bugs
>> will be worked out over the next few months. I only wish that some of
>> the changes made had an easy way to turn them off, or perhaps a help
>> site that describes that --- perhaps in the near future!! (Tabs is the
>> 1st to come to mind, or at least a way to simply double click on the tab
>> to shut it down as is accomplished in FX.)
>>
>> Also apparently the address book hasn't yet been worked on, and believe
>> I read that's destined for 3.1 which hopefully won't be long, for that
>> has been a sore spot for years.
>>
>> which was definitely worth the wait.
>> Miles
>
>
> https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/thunderbird/addon/55539
>
>
>
Double click doesn't work here using XP and a 3-button Logitech mouse
with the middle button set to double click. Nor does it work if click
twice with the left-hand button.
To be clear, reference is to 2 or more tabs open, each representing a
msg. (I believe one can single click on the red x on the right of each
tab.) In FX only need to double click or hit the "delete" key to
close a tab. Preferable is using the keyboard "delete", but since my
hand is usually on the mouse when reading a web page, it's no
difficulty to simply double click on the tab; however, while reading
msgs, my hand is usually not on the mouse.
KristleBawl
You can minimize the impact of tabs with a few easy settings.
Tools - Options - Advanced tab - Reading & Display
Open new messages in: An existing message window
In Config Editor, set /mail.tabs.autoHide/ to *true*
--
To seek out strange, new taglines... to BOLDLY quote...
KristleBawl's Taglines by http://tagzilla.mozdev.org
Localizations by http://www.babelzilla.org/ Get Involved
Miles
> Miles expressed an opinion:
>> Obviously a great deal of effort went into this upgrade and a few bugs
>> will be worked out over the next few months. I only wish that some of
>> the changes made had an easy way to turn them off, or perhaps a help
>> site that describes that --- perhaps in the near future!! (Tabs is the
>> 1st to come to mind, or at least a way to simply double click on the tab
>> to shut it down as is accomplished in FX.)
>>
>> Also apparently the address book hasn't yet been worked on, and believe
>> I read that's destined for 3.1 which hopefully won't be long, for that
>> has been a sore spot for years.
>>
>> which was definitely worth the wait.
>> Miles
>
> You can minimize the impact of tabs with a few easy settings.
>
> Open new messages in: An existing message window
>
> In Config Editor, set /mail.tabs.autoHide/ to *true*
>
Thanks, open new msgs in an existing msg window operates as before:
double click a msg & it opens full screen. Hit delete key & it's
deleted. And there are no tabs! Haven't yet touched Config Editor
and not certain what that setting would produce since only the
original 1 tab is seen in the tab bar -- perhaps it removes the tab bar?
Miles
> * KristleBawl wrote, On 1/5/2010 22:00:
>> Miles expressed an opinion:
>>
>> You can minimize the impact of tabs with a few easy settings.
>>
>> Tools - Options - Advanced tab - Reading& Display
>> Open new messages in: An existing message window
>>
>> In Config Editor, set /mail.tabs.autoHide/ to *true*
>>
>
> Thanks, open new msgs in an existing msg window operates as before:
> double click a msg& it opens full screen. Hit delete key& it's
> deleted. And there are no tabs! Haven't yet touched Config Editor
> and not certain what that setting would produce since only the
> original 1 tab is seen in the tab bar -- perhaps it removes the tab bar?
Yes, the config change eradicates the tab bar -- which unless using
multiple tabs is redundant since one can see which folder is in focus
simply by looking in the left-hand column. If the powers ever turn
up with an easy way to shut down a tab, I'll again give it a try.
C A Upsdell
It was not worth the wait for those of us who found that TB3 is very
flaky, rife with bugs.
responder
I've been around a long time and I'm not aware of any program that
doesn't have a bug or two. I think that the OP was appreciative of the
free programs that Mozilla has offered and simply wanted to thank them
for doing so.
I too, will join the ranks of those who have been with Netscape since
the very beginning and offer my thanks to the developers as well.
For those who are not happy with the product, perhaps M$ or someone else
can do better.
KristleBawl
> * Miles wrote:
It isn't gone, just hidden. If you open a folder or message in a tab,
the tab bar returns, but only until you close the second tab, then it
disappears again. I do love auto-hide options! <vbg>
--
This tagline protected by THE CLUB(tm).
C A Upsdell
>>> In closing want to thank the TB team for their hard & diligent work
>>> which was definitely worth the wait.
>>
>> It was not worth the wait for those of us who found that TB3 is very
>> flaky, rife with bugs.
>>
> It should be obvious that not everyone is displeased.
>
> I've been around a long time and I'm not aware of any program that
> doesn't have a bug or two. I think that the OP was appreciative of the
> free programs that Mozilla has offered and simply wanted to thank them
> for doing so.
> I too, will join the ranks of those who have been with Netscape since
> the very beginning and offer my thanks to the developers as well.
>
> For those who are not happy with the product, perhaps M$ or someone else
> can do better.
Instead of telling people to go to a Microsoft product, would it not be
better to fix the Mozilla product? I have been a loyal FF and TB user
for years, but TB 3 proved to be so buggy that I had to revert to TB 2.
That was the FIRST TIME I have ever had to revert to an older Mozilla
product.
nobody
with bugs". Personally I find it very stable (hasn't crashed since
upgrade) and feature rich. Rather than just bitchin, maybe you should
report your bugs for confirmation and work on stability of your system.
If you really find it "very flaky, rife with bugs" then I suspect TB
is not responsible for your problems. It isn't perfect but it is quite
solid for a moving target.
I don't think responder was pushing you away from TB, but was suggesting
if you are very unhappy, maybe something else would make you happier.
There ARE quite a few options. We all are gonna stay with TB and help
make it better.
XS11E
> Obviously a great deal of effort went into this upgrade and a few
> bugs will be worked out over the next few months.
It's certainly increased my appreciation for TB2! ;-)
I wish the makers of add-ons had kept up, I'm waiting for a couple of
them to catch up to TB3 before changing...
--
XS11E, Killing all posts from Google Groups
The Usenet Improvement Project:
http://twovoyagers.com/improve-usenet.org/
th
> Miles<mile...@REMOVEMEpacbell.net> wrote:
>
>> Obviously a great deal of effort went into this upgrade and a few
>> bugs will be worked out over the next few months.
>
> It's certainly increased my appreciation for TB2! ;-)
>
> I wish the makers of add-ons had kept up, I'm waiting for a couple of
> them to catch up to TB3 before changing...
>
>
TB3 novelties are really not needed (except maybe the improved address
book). However there is one thing that really has improved (or rather
gone back to the way the old Netscape news reader once worked) since the
"Mark Newsgroup Read" now only needs Shift + C. I never understood why
the TB developers insisted in having Ctrl + Shift + C for so many years.
--
th
Old Gringo
Two Cents To The C A Upsdell Post:
--
Old Gringo
Just West Of Nowhere
Enjoy Life And Live It To Its Fullest
http://www.NuBoy-Industries.com
Ron Hunter
machine, but had to revert to tb2 on my XP Netbook because it was
periodically spiking the CPU to 50% for several seconds every minute or
so, and holding it, locking everything else out, for 10 seconds or so.
NO REASON for that to happen. Now it does the same thing with TB2!
Will have to make a new profile, I guess.
--
Ron Hunter - rphu...@charter.net
C A Upsdell
>>> For those who are not happy with the product, perhaps M$ or someone
>>> else can do better.
>>
>> Instead of telling people to go to a Microsoft product, would it not be
>> better to fix the Mozilla product? I have been a loyal FF and TB user
>> for years, but TB 3 proved to be so buggy that I had to revert to TB 2.
>> That was the FIRST TIME I have ever had to revert to an older Mozilla
>> product.
>>
> You miss the point that most people do not find TB3 "very flaky, rife
> with bugs". Personally I find it very stable (hasn't crashed since
> upgrade) and feature rich. Rather than just bitchin, maybe you should
> report your bugs for confirmation and work on stability of your system.
> If you really find it "very flaky, rife with bugs" then I suspect TB is
> not responsible for your problems. It isn't perfect but it is quite
> solid for a moving target.
I did report them in this newsgroup. The response was that they
appeared to be known bugs, already reported.
PWM
Read the whole thread and decided you all know a lot more about this
than I do. I'm just a busy academic who needs a quick, reliable email
system. The system my university offers is very limited clunky. I
started out years ago with Netscape and then heard (erroneously?) that
they were no more. Went to Outlook--I really like the calendar and
address book--but it is SLOW.
Switched to TB a couple of years ago because it was quick and reliable.
Sometimes I don't want a thousand bells and whistles, just email.
I had some trouble with 2, but I have to say, so far, TB3 seems to be a
real improvement in every way. I wish the address book had more room for
more info--a bit more like Outlook--but for email I now use TB3 for
everything--simple, reliable, user-friendly. My compliments to all who
worked on it. It's a good system and the usergroup is wonderful. Can't
get that kind of support with Microsoft.
Terry R.
> On 1/6/2010 9:47 AM, C A Upsdell wrote:
>> responder wrote:
>>>>> In closing want to thank the TB team for their hard& diligent work
I don't know how you can state, "most people". There have been many here
that have been long time supporters of TB (including myself and CA U)
that had many negative things to say about TB3. And if these long time
supporters aren't happy with it, who's to say about "most" of the others.
TB3 didn't work for me when I installed it, and yet 1.5, TB2, TB3.04pre
all work fine. I now how have TB3 up for newsgroups, but it doesn't work
on the normal profiles for mail that all the other ones use (different
profiles, same data).
Many here thought TB3 was kind of a step backwards in multimedia support
with the elimination of JS execution.
Responder's snide comment about MS sounded more like how a fan boy
responds.
And yes, thankfully there are a lot of options now days. I have moved
my mail accounts into the cloud, so I'm no longer bound to one computer
and program. It has simplified my email life in ways that TB will never
be able to approach. And since newsgroups are slowly giving ground to
online forums (which I hate), mail client programs may not have much of
a life span left.
Terry R.
--
Anti-spam measures are included in my email address.
Delete NOSPAM from the email address after clicking Reply.
Wayne Mery
Because, statisticly, most people make the effort to post only when they
have a problem or something to complain about, less so when they have
some positive to say. For example 10-20% (eyeball) of
mozilla.feedback.thunderbird (hendrix) is positive, which is far from
the majority. So one might argue most people are up in arms. But IMO
that ratio of positive to negative balance is not far off from what I'd
expect for a new release, in that type forum.
> TB3 didn't work for me when I installed it, and yet 1.5, TB2,
> TB3.04pre all work fine.
yup, there are certainly a few install issues. The major ones in
bugzilla are being addressed. But no doubt, it would have been nice if
more people had been testing the upgrade steps. Perhaps more people
will volunteer to test v3.0.1?? http://wiki.mozilla.org/Thunderbird:Testing
OTOH, increased instability and problems are to be expected:
a) the complexity of the landscape is far different from 3-6 years ago,
like increased pervasiveness of AV software and extensions. Example from
the last few days, some so called "compatible" extensions have been
found to be causing performance problems, but the users were blaming
Thunderbird, indexing, etc. (Our average alpha, beta or nightly build
tester isn't using lots of extensions. And extension developers don't
tend to focus on upgrades until the last month or two before release.
The result ... problems due to extensions.)
b) TB3 introduces way more change than previous versions, and also has a
major Gecko bump in using 1.9.x (vs. TB 2.0 which was based on the same
stable Gecko v1.8.x as TB 1.5)
> I now how have TB3 up for newsgroups, but it doesn't work
> on the normal profiles for mail that all the other ones use (different
> profiles, same data).
>
> Many here thought TB3 was kind of a step backwards in multimedia support
> with the elimination of JS execution.
>
> Responder's snide comment about MS sounded more like how a fan boy
> responds.
nothing sensitive about it in my I read.
[rant]
[this isn't about Terry]
Frankly, from my POV what has been sad about these types of threads is
a) they get hijacked about unrelated issues b) that a poster can't voice
an opinion about what they like without someone else piping up "but it's
a dog for me".
Really, it would be nicer if identified bugs were worked through in
bugzilla, rather than debated, philosophized, mused, ... in a rather
non-productive way in a help forum. It's time consuming to wade through
posts that really aren't really about resolving a poster's problem and
aren't headed to a resolution. And a disincentive for people who don't
have much time to spend in the forum but still want to help others -
some days it's hard to stick around.
[/rant]
--
http://wiki.mozilla.org/Thunderbird:Testing
http://www.spreadthunderbird.com/aff/165/
Clif McIrvin
> It's time consuming to wade through
> posts that really aren't really about resolving a poster's problem and
> aren't headed to a resolution. And a disincentive for people who don't
> have much time to spend in the forum but still want to help others -
> some days it's hard to stick around.
> [/rant]
>
>
to help others is very much appreciated ... even if not always
acknowledged. (The same thanks to all the others who hang out here to
help the community.)
--
Clif
Win XP Pro SP3, IE8
Thunderbird version 2.0.0.23 (20090812)
Tarkus
> And yes, thankfully there are a lot of options now days. I have moved
> my mail accounts into the cloud, so I'm no longer bound to one computer
> and program. It has simplified my email life in ways that TB will never
> be able to approach.
In what way did you move them into a cloud?
Mine have been in a cloud for ages, considering I use Gmail with IMAP.
But I still use TB as my interface (though I could use Gmail's web
interface in a pinch).
Terry R.
Well, I'm a consultant, and I've installed FF & TB on countless client
machines. And when I go back and visit a client and they're no longer
using what I installed, I always ask why. Most of the time it's, "It
was asking something I didn't understand", or, "It updated and didn't
work right afterwards". I tried to move clients away from the MS
domination, but it's beyond my control. People just want a simple way
to use the internet and access their email. And sometimes they just
don't care if it's free or not, they just want it to work.
>
>> TB3 didn't work for me when I installed it, and yet 1.5, TB2,
> > TB3.04pre all work fine.
>
> yup, there are certainly a few install issues. The major ones in
> bugzilla are being addressed. But no doubt, it would have been nice if
> more people had been testing the upgrade steps. Perhaps more people
> will volunteer to test v3.0.1?? http://wiki.mozilla.org/Thunderbird:Testing
>
They are? How about the ones that USERS want fixed?
>
> OTOH, increased instability and problems are to be expected:
>
> a) the complexity of the landscape is far different from 3-6 years ago,
> like increased pervasiveness of AV software and extensions. Example from
> the last few days, some so called "compatible" extensions have been
> found to be causing performance problems, but the users were blaming
> Thunderbird, indexing, etc. (Our average alpha, beta or nightly build
> tester isn't using lots of extensions. And extension developers don't
> tend to focus on upgrades until the last month or two before release.
> The result ... problems due to extensions.)
>
> b) TB3 introduces way more change than previous versions, and also has a
> major Gecko bump in using 1.9.x (vs. TB 2.0 which was based on the same
> stable Gecko v1.8.x as TB 1.5)
>
>
>> I now how have TB3 up for newsgroups, but it doesn't work
>> on the normal profiles for mail that all the other ones use (different
>> profiles, same data).
>>
>> Many here thought TB3 was kind of a step backwards in multimedia support
>> with the elimination of JS execution.
>>
>> Responder's snide comment about MS sounded more like how a fan boy
>> responds.
>
> nothing sensitive about it in my I read.
>
You don't think, "For those who are not happy with the product, perhaps
M$ or someone else can do better."? ANYONE that puts M$ IMO is a fanboy.
>
>
> [rant]
> [this isn't about Terry]
> Frankly, from my POV what has been sad about these types of threads is
> a) they get hijacked about unrelated issues b) that a poster can't voice
> an opinion about what they like without someone else piping up "but it's
> a dog for me".
>
> Really, it would be nicer if identified bugs were worked through in
> bugzilla, rather than debated, philosophized, mused, ... in a rather
> non-productive way in a help forum. It's time consuming to wade through
> posts that really aren't really about resolving a poster's problem and
> aren't headed to a resolution. And a disincentive for people who don't
> have much time to spend in the forum but still want to help others -
> some days it's hard to stick around.
> [/rant]
>
>
You mean like the address book issue that is over 7 years old? It would
actually be nicer if the bugs that frustrated users were fixed. I
posted bug reports and they came back, "Won't fix". How much does that
encourage someone to keep supporting a product?
Terry R.
I only recently setup a Gmail account and moved my 9 email accounts into
it. Up to that point, I would access all my accounts from my
workstation at my office or through webmail by each individual account.
Now they all come into Gmail which I can access anywhere, and they are
all sent to my Palm Pre, which makes responding immediate, rather than
waiting until I return to my office.
Tarkus
> Well, I'm a consultant, and I've installed FF & TB on countless client
> machines. And when I go back and visit a client and they're no longer
> using what I installed, I always ask why. Most of the time it's, "It
> was asking something I didn't understand", or, "It updated and didn't
> work right afterwards". I tried to move clients away from the MS
> domination, but it's beyond my control. People just want a simple way
> to use the internet and access their email. And sometimes they just
> don't care if it's free or not, they just want it to work.
That's why I have to laugh at people who defend FF for not loading a
page properly, when IE does, blaming it on the webmaster. The average
person surfing the web couldn't care less whose fault it is. "They just
want it to work."
Terry R.
> On 1/8/2010 10:07 PM, Terry R. wrote:
>> Well, I'm a consultant, and I've installed FF& TB on countless client
>> machines. And when I go back and visit a client and they're no longer
>> using what I installed, I always ask why. Most of the time it's, "It
>> was asking something I didn't understand", or, "It updated and didn't
>> work right afterwards". I tried to move clients away from the MS
>> domination, but it's beyond my control. People just want a simple way
>> to use the internet and access their email. And sometimes they just
>> don't care if it's free or not, they just want it to work.
>
> That's why I have to laugh at people who defend FF for not loading a
> page properly, when IE does, blaming it on the webmaster. The average
> person surfing the web couldn't care less whose fault it is. "They just
> want it to work."
Exactly. I have given up my mission to put every client machine on FF &
TB. Unless I see a machine frequently, too many times an issue will
arise and they'll solve it the best way they know, by using something
that works. Something as simple as you state. They don't care that the
site has coding errors, they just need to get work done.
responder
===================
You mentioned my comment a few times, but I didn't yet respond. I don't
use Microsoft for anything except the OS. I could still be back in the
days of DOS given a choice.
I don't like virtual monopolies and that would Microsoft insisting that
they know what's best for their customers. But, times are changing, I hope.
In any event, I hope this post assures you that I am certainly not a
fanboy for Microsoft, if that's what you were alluding to....
===================
Tarkus
> You mentioned my comment a few times, but I didn't yet respond. I don't
> use Microsoft for anything except the OS. I could still be back in the
> days of DOS given a choice.
> I don't like virtual monopolies and that would Microsoft insisting that
> they know what's best for their customers.
And Mozilla doesn't? Nor Apple or any other large entity?
Wayne Mery
responder
Does Mozilla charge you for their products? They don't charge me and all
I've ever paid them are compliments.
Does Apple, etc., work the same way?
Terry R.
>>>>
>>>> Responder's snide comment about MS sounded more like how a fan boy
>>>> responds.
>>>
>>> nothing sensitive about it in my I read.
>>>
>>
>> You don't think, "For those who are not happy with the product, perhaps
>> M$ or someone else can do better."? ANYONE that puts M$ IMO is a fanboy.
>
> ===================
>
> You mentioned my comment a few times, but I didn't yet respond. I don't
> use Microsoft for anything except the OS. I could still be back in the
> days of DOS given a choice.
As do I.
> I don't like virtual monopolies and that would Microsoft insisting that
> they know what's best for their customers. But, times are changing, I hope.
> In any event, I hope this post assures you that I am certainly not a
> fanboy for Microsoft, if that's what you were alluding to....
>
> ===================
>
I don't either, but I can use the proper initials for a company to show
you have respect for the same. Bashers/fanboys are usually the only
ones who use M$/Outhouse, etc. in naming. But maybe you haven't noticed
that yet.
In the same line of thought, Mozilla devs seem to feel they know what's
best for their customers, and frequently make the wrong decisions. So
are they that different? If the power was in Mozilla's hands, do you
think it would be any different?
Tarkus
You missed the point. It has nothing to do with charging or not. All
developers (at least large ones) choose what they feel is best for their
customers. There are no shortage of complaints in that area for FF and
TB, regardless of whether or not they're free.
Al M
Whoa, These "devs" are not all in the same building afaik, they are all
over the world. These are new times and with that there will be
allusions to the "old" way of doing programming projects. Things have
changed, and maybe not the way your or I might want, so look for the
evolving "product". Its like Car parts from all over the world
converging to be the next hybrid, there is no one person directing the
traffic flow, just QA ensuring it all goes out when needed.
responder
Respect....what respect? How in the world can you assign the same
integrity and values to a Microsoft or ATT or Comcast or Chevron or
Mobil, as you would to an open source group of people who are not only
genius level in my opinion, but who give back to the community in volumes.
I respect the people who give and support what they have created and
take pride in their work. And again, I haven't paid one cent for it.
If not for Microsoft, for example, we might have traveled a completely
different course if they hadn't devoured DR-DOS around 1990. And that
goes as well for what GM and Ford did before they reached their Waterloo.
Ron Hunter
When applying this method to programming, some real problems come up.
There needs to be someone, or multiple someones, who set up the
framework of what the program is to be, and who monitors it to make sure
that the guidelines are observed. Otherwise, we end up with something
like the programming language Ada.