I have tried to look some advices to how to upgrade thousands of computers from TB2 to TB3 without changing their "feel" and keeping initial settings as close to TB2 as possible.
What I would require is at least:
Keep "smart folders" out of the picture. Keep toolbars as close to original as possible
and because of roaming profiles and gigabyte-class mailboxes - indexing off - IMAP -mail folder settings offline off for all folders.
Users could then, if they want to, change those any way they want, but for migration process change is too big and would just block our helpdesk completely if those cannot be set during installation.
Is there any way to force these settings for initial installation?
> I have tried to look some advices to how to upgrade thousands of > computers from TB2 to TB3 without changing their "feel" and keeping > initial settings as close to TB2 as possible.
> What I would require is at least:
> Keep "smart folders" out of the picture. > Keep toolbars as close to original as possible
> and because of roaming profiles and gigabyte-class mailboxes > - indexing off > - IMAP -mail folder settings offline off for all folders.
> Users could then, if they want to, change those any way they want, but > for migration process change is too big and would just block our > helpdesk completely if those cannot be set during installation.
> Is there any way to force these settings for initial installation?
> Timo Pietil
You perhaps should ask these questions in the mozilla.dev.apps.thunderbird group as well.
>> I have tried to look some advices to how to upgrade thousands of >> computers from TB2 to TB3 without changing their "feel" and keeping >> initial settings as close to TB2 as possible.
>> What I would require is at least:
>> Keep "smart folders" out of the picture. >> Keep toolbars as close to original as possible
>> and because of roaming profiles and gigabyte-class mailboxes >> - indexing off >> - IMAP -mail folder settings offline off for all folders.
>> Users could then, if they want to, change those any way they want, but >> for migration process change is too big and would just block our >> helpdesk completely if those cannot be set during installation.
>> Is there any way to force these settings for initial installation?
>> Timo Pietil
> You perhaps should ask these questions in the > mozilla.dev.apps.thunderbird group as well.
> Annailís wrote: >> Timo Pietilä wrote: >>> Hello.
>>> I have tried to look some advices to how to upgrade thousands of >>> computers from TB2 to TB3 without changing their "feel" and keeping >>> initial settings as close to TB2 as possible.
>>> What I would require is at least:
>>> Keep "smart folders" out of the picture. >>> Keep toolbars as close to original as possible
>>> and because of roaming profiles and gigabyte-class mailboxes >>> - indexing off >>> - IMAP -mail folder settings offline off for all folders.
>>> Users could then, if they want to, change those any way they want, but >>> for migration process change is too big and would just block our >>> helpdesk completely if those cannot be set during installation.
>>> Is there any way to force these settings for initial installation?
>>> Timo Pietilä
>> You perhaps should ask these questions in the >> mozilla.dev.apps.thunderbird group as well.
> x-post added there.
> Timo Pietilä
Hello Timo,
At our organization, where I'm in charge of deploying updates, I've found that "disabling" Smart Folders means copying or patching localstore.rdf in the user's Thunderbird profile. I typically create a default localstore.rdf by opening Thunderbird with a new profile, and copying the file from there into our deployment server.
When installing/updating Thunderbird, that file just gets copied into the Default User Thunderbird profile, and any other profiles on the workstations.
Overwriting this file might not work for you, since it will change toolbar positions, window size/position, etc. A Diff/Patch approach might be a better option.
Jason Oster wrote: > On 01/04/2010 08:08 AM, Timo Pietilä wrote: >> Annailís wrote: >>> Timo Pietilä wrote: >>>> Hello.
>>>> I have tried to look some advices to how to upgrade thousands of >>>> computers from TB2 to TB3 without changing their "feel" and keeping >>>> initial settings as close to TB2 as possible.
>>>> What I would require is at least:
>>>> Keep "smart folders" out of the picture. >>>> Keep toolbars as close to original as possible
>>>> and because of roaming profiles and gigabyte-class mailboxes >>>> - indexing off >>>> - IMAP -mail folder settings offline off for all folders.
>>>> Users could then, if they want to, change those any way they want, but >>>> for migration process change is too big and would just block our >>>> helpdesk completely if those cannot be set during installation.
>>>> Is there any way to force these settings for initial installation?
>>>> Timo Pietilä
>>> You perhaps should ask these questions in the >>> mozilla.dev.apps.thunderbird group as well.
>> x-post added there.
>> Timo Pietilä
> Hello Timo,
> At our organization, where I'm in charge of deploying updates, I've > found that "disabling" Smart Folders means copying or patching > localstore.rdf in the user's Thunderbird profile. I typically create a > default localstore.rdf by opening Thunderbird with a new profile, and > copying the file from there into our deployment server.
> When installing/updating Thunderbird, that file just gets copied into > the Default User Thunderbird profile, and any other profiles on the > workstations.
> Overwriting this file might not work for you, since it will change > toolbar positions, window size/position, etc. A Diff/Patch approach > might be a better option.
Or just deploy using a script that temporarily copies that file to safe place and restores it after upgrading has happened. Or does the format of the file change?
I need to check that. This alone is great help for upgrading, thanks.
There is still the problem that TB3 has bugs and is not very stable yet, and TB2 has security hole that apparently gets never fixed. This is very very bad for Thunderbird reputation.
Developers! note this:
In corporate environments new stuff gets never ever installed at X.0 stage, because experience has told that new stuff is never as stable as old for few first versions of new product. Corporates use stuff that a) works, b) is stable. New features are not concern of us. If it works there is no point replacing it unless new version offers something that users would need. This is not the case with TB3.
In fact I don't see any reason to upgrade to TB3 at all. I use TB2 at work, rock solid, no bugs, works like a charm, and TB3 at home because I needed to see if it is any worth, slow, uses huge amount of additional disk space, I haven't found any features yet that makes me want to upgrade. In fact, if there weren't that security issue I would revert back to TB2 for home machine too.
> In corporate environments new stuff gets never ever installed at X.0 > stage, because experience has told that new stuff is never as stable as > old for few first versions of new product. Corporates use stuff that a) > works, b) is stable. New features are not concern of us. If it works > there is no point replacing it unless new version offers something that > users would need. This is not the case with TB3.
> In fact I don't see any reason to upgrade to TB3 at all. I use TB2 at > work, rock solid, no bugs, works like a charm, and TB3 at home because I > needed to see if it is any worth, slow, uses huge amount of additional > disk space, I haven't found any features yet that makes me want to > upgrade. In fact, if there weren't that security issue I would revert > back to TB2 for home machine too.
Amen to that!
I'm currently facing that exact same problem: we need to migrate ~1,200 users from Thunderbird 2.0.0.23 to Thunderbird 3.0. At least that's what I initially thought was necessary but I'm beginning to think it may not be possible at all. I'm starting to rephrase this entire project, it has now become "migrating away from Thunderbird".
The indexing and offline folders are indeed our biggest concern. We run a very server-centric environment with hundreds of thin clients connected via XDMCP sessions to a more or less powerful server. I remember how slow my computer became when Thunderbird first started indexing gigabytes of mails and I really don't want to be near a phone when we first deploy TB3 on one of our servers. Same goes for Thunderbird's bad habit of downloading every message, only topped by its persistency to do so. There are two (!) different settings that I found need to be changed in order for Thunderbird to finally stop this nonsense. The new user inteface, with header pane buttons that can only be disabled by installing an add-on for each user (wtf?) and tabs that are enabled by default and cannot be disabled completely (again: wtf?) completes the top three on our Thunderbird-clusterfuck-list.
Thunderbird might be great for home users, no doubt about that, but corporate use is a different issue. And with its current setup and problems there is absolutely no way that we'll ever migrate from Thunderbird 2 to Thunderbird 3.
Martin
-- Rieke Computersysteme GmbH Hellerholz 5 D-82061 Neuried
The new features I'm using HEAVILY in my company are: - Open a full thread in a tab (using the Gmail Conversation View addon) - Global search - Full-fledged calendar management with new Lighting addon (requires TB3) - Mails in tabs - Less resource consumption
These alone were sufficient drivers for migration.
I'm sorry but I haven't noted figures, but from my experience at work and at home (4 years old Celeron on XP), I've noted that less memory is consumed than in TB2, and the overall response time is better. With one exception : the folder panel is redrawn with some latency with the Celeron, and the time to display a message is a little bit longer than in TB2, but still acceptable (I have seen some posts complaining about unbearable response times with TB3, but that is not my own experience).
Of course, you should wait for and test the next version to be released very soon (before the end of the month), TB3.01, correcting a lot of youth issues, and hopefully all migration issues met so far (they were some...)
Last, to be honest, I'm not using TB3 at work as the official corporate tool (it is Outlook 2003), so I have no experience about rolling out TB3 to a large number of users.
> I have tried to look some advices to how to upgrade thousands of > computers from TB2 to TB3 without changing their "feel" and keeping > initial settings as close to TB2 as possible.
> What I would require is at least:
> Keep "smart folders" out of the picture. > Keep toolbars as close to original as possible
> and because of roaming profiles and gigabyte-class mailboxes > - indexing off > - IMAP -mail folder settings offline off for all folders.
> Users could then, if they want to, change those any way they want, but > for migration process change is too big and would just block our > helpdesk completely if those cannot be set during installation.
> Is there any way to force these settings for initial installation?
Hi all,
I'm dealing with the same issues, this is what I did so far:
* Preventing indexation : set the preference "mailnews.database.global.indexer.enabled" to "false"
* Preventing offline synchronization for IMAP account : for each account, set the preference "mail.server.<server_id>.offline_download" to "false".
Do do that, the easiest way is to use the "autoconfig" which allow you to force setting on a system-level bassis and not on user-lever. It's very simple, you need to deploy two files (works on linux too) :
// /* This will disable indexation */ lockPref("mailnews.database.global.indexer.enabled", false);
/* This will parse the prefs.js and disable "offline_download" for each IMAP account */
if (getPref("mail.accountmanager.accounts")) {
var listExistingAccounts = getPref("mail.accountmanager.accounts"); var arrayExistingAccounts = listExistingAccounts.split(',');
for (var i=0; i < arrayExistingAccounts.length; i++) { var serverFromAccount = getPref("mail.account." + arrayExistingAccounts[i] + ".server"); var configType = getPref("mail.server." + serverFromAccount + ".type"); if (configType == "imap") { lockPref("mail.server." + serverFromAccount + ".offline_download", false); } }
}
I'm still investigating a way to disable smart folders automatically but as far as it's not managed in the "prefs.js" (but "localstore.rdf") this is far more tricky.
> > I have tried to look some advices to how to upgrade thousands of > > computers from TB2 to TB3 without changing their "feel" and keeping > > initial settings as close to TB2 as possible.
> > What I would require is at least:
> > Keep "smart folders" out of the picture. > > Keep toolbars as close to original as possible
> > and because of roaming profiles and gigabyte-class mailboxes > > - indexing off > > - IMAP -mail folder settings offline off for all folders.
> > Users could then, if they want to, change those any way they want, but > > for migration process change is too big and would just block our > > helpdesk completely if those cannot be set during installation.
> > Is there any way to force these settings for initial installation?
> Hi all,
> I'm dealing with the same issues, this is what I did so far:
> * Preventing indexation : set the preference > "mailnews.database.global.indexer.enabled" to "false"
> * Preventing offline synchronization for IMAP account : for each > account, set the preference "mail.server.<server_id>.offline_download" > to "false".
> Do do that, the easiest way is to use the "autoconfig" which allow you > to force setting on a system-level bassis and not on user-lever. It's > very simple, you need to deploy two files (works on linux too) :
> // > /* This will disable indexation */ > lockPref("mailnews.database.global.indexer.enabled", false);
> /* This will parse the prefs.js and disable "offline_download" for each > IMAP account */
> if (getPref("mail.accountmanager.accounts")) {
> var listExistingAccounts = getPref("mail.accountmanager.accounts"); > var arrayExistingAccounts = listExistingAccounts.split(',');
> for (var i=0; i < arrayExistingAccounts.length; i++) { > var serverFromAccount = getPref("mail.account." + > arrayExistingAccounts[i] + ".server"); > var configType = getPref("mail.server." + serverFromAccount + > ".type"); > if (configType == "imap") { > lockPref("mail.server." + serverFromAccount + > ".offline_download", false); > } > }
> }
> I'm still investigating a way to disable smart folders automatically but > as far as it's not managed in the "prefs.js" (but "localstore.rdf") this > is far more tricky.
> Am 12.01.2010 09:08, schrieb Timo Pietilä: >> Developers! note this:
>> In corporate environments new stuff gets never ever installed at X.0 >> stage, because experience has told that new stuff is never as stable as >> old for few first versions of new product. Corporates use stuff that a) >> works, b) is stable. New features are not concern of us. If it works >> there is no point replacing it unless new version offers something that >> users would need. This is not the case with TB3.
>> In fact I don't see any reason to upgrade to TB3 at all. I use TB2 at >> work, rock solid, no bugs, works like a charm, and TB3 at home because I >> needed to see if it is any worth, slow, uses huge amount of additional >> disk space, I haven't found any features yet that makes me want to >> upgrade. In fact, if there weren't that security issue I would revert >> back to TB2 for home machine too.
> Amen to that!
> I'm currently facing that exact same problem: we need to migrate ~1,200 > users from Thunderbird 2.0.0.23 to Thunderbird 3.0. At least that's what > I initially thought was necessary but I'm beginning to think it may not > be possible at all. I'm starting to rephrase this entire project, it has > now become "migrating away from Thunderbird".
> The indexing and offline folders are indeed our biggest concern. We run > a very server-centric environment with hundreds of thin clients > connected via XDMCP sessions to a more or less powerful server. I > remember how slow my computer became when Thunderbird first started > indexing gigabytes of mails and I really don't want to be near a phone > when we first deploy TB3 on one of our servers. Same goes for > Thunderbird's bad habit of downloading every message, only topped by its > persistency to do so. There are two (!) different settings that I found > need to be changed in order for Thunderbird to finally stop this > nonsense. The new user inteface, with header pane buttons that can only > be disabled by installing an add-on for each user (wtf?) and tabs that > are enabled by default and cannot be disabled completely (again: wtf?) > completes the top three on our Thunderbird-clusterfuck-list.
> Thunderbird might be great for home users, no doubt about that, but > corporate use is a different issue. And with its current setup and > problems there is absolutely no way that we'll ever migrate from > Thunderbird 2 to Thunderbird 3.
>> I'm dealing with the same issues, this is what I did so far:
>> * Preventing indexation : set the preference >> "mailnews.database.global.indexer.enabled" to "false"
>> * Preventing offline synchronization for IMAP account : for each >> account, set the preference >> mail.server.<server_id>.offline_download" to "false".
>> Do do that, the easiest way is to use the "autoconfig" which allow >> you to force setting on a system-level bassis and not on >> user-lever. It's very simple, you need to deploy two files (works >> on linux too) :
>> I'm still investigating a way to disable smart folders >> automatically but as far as it's not managed in the "prefs.js" (but >> "localstore.rdf") this is far more tricky.
> This ALMOST worked for us, we needed to add one more line, to change > the default for new accounts as well:
These could be easily achieved by deploying this file after the installation of Thunderbird.
When Thunderbird is launched for the first under a user session with no previous configuration, it will use this file and copy it on the profile so the user won't have Smart Folders enabled.
Unfortunately, this won't *override* existing "localstore.rdf" in existing profiles...
In our production environment, the profile is stored in a "known" path that we have fixed with the Profile Manager so we know exactly were the file is and we'll be able to replace it with no problem.
But for people who use the classic behavior of Thunderbird, it is stored in a random directory in the user profile (%APPDATA%\Thunderbird\Profiles\<radom_name>) and a don't know a simple way to get the profile's path.
The most direct solution is to parse the "%APPDATA%\Thunderbird\profile.ini" file but I don't think these could be achieved with the autoconfig mechanism, an external script is needed.
>> I'm dealing with the same issues, this is what I did so far:
>> * Preventing indexation : set the preference >> "mailnews.database.global.indexer.enabled" to "false"
>> * Preventing offline synchronization for IMAP account : for each >> account, set the preference "mail.server.<server_id>.offline_download" >> to "false".
>> Do do that, the easiest way is to use the "autoconfig" which allow you >> to force setting on a system-level bassis and not on user-lever. It's >> very simple, you need to deploy two files (works on linux too) :
>> // >> /* This will disable indexation */ >> lockPref("mailnews.database.global.indexer.enabled", false);
>> /* This will parse the prefs.js and disable "offline_download" for each >> IMAP account */
>> if (getPref("mail.accountmanager.accounts")) {
>> var listExistingAccounts = getPref("mail.accountmanager.accounts"); >> var arrayExistingAccounts = listExistingAccounts.split(',');
>> for (var i=0; i < arrayExistingAccounts.length; i++) { >> var serverFromAccount = getPref("mail.account." + >> arrayExistingAccounts[i] + ".server"); >> var configType = getPref("mail.server." + serverFromAccount + >> ".type"); >> if (configType == "imap") { >> lockPref("mail.server." + serverFromAccount + >> ".offline_download", false); >> } >> }
>> }
>> I'm still investigating a way to disable smart folders automatically but >> as far as it's not managed in the "prefs.js" (but "localstore.rdf") this >> is far more tricky.
>> I'm dealing with the same issues, this is what I did so far:
>> * Preventing indexation : set the preference >> "mailnews.database.global.indexer.enabled" to "false"
>> * Preventing offline synchronization for IMAP account : for each >> account, set the preference >> mail.server.<server_id>.offline_download" to "false".
>> Do do that, the easiest way is to use the "autoconfig" which allow >> you to force setting on a system-level bassis and not on >> user-lever. It's very simple, you need to deploy two files (works >> on linux too) :
>> I'm still investigating a way to disable smart folders >> automatically but as far as it's not managed in the "prefs.js" (but >> "localstore.rdf") this is far more tricky.
> This ALMOST worked for us, we needed to add one more line, to change > the default for new accounts as well:
These could be easily achieved by deploying this file after the installation of Thunderbird.
When Thunderbird is launched for the first under a user session with no previous configuration, it will use this file and copy it on the profile so the user won't have Smart Folders enabled.
Unfortunately, this won't *override* existing "localstore.rdf" in existing profiles...
In our production environment, the profile is stored in a "known" path that we have fixed with the Profile Manager so we know exactly were the file is and we'll be able to replace it with no problem.
But for people who use the classic behavior of Thunderbird, it is stored in a random directory in the user profile (%APPDATA%\Thunderbird\Profiles\<radom_name>) and a don't know a simple way to get the profile's path.
The most direct solution is to parse the "%APPDATA%\Thunderbird\profile.ini" file but I don't think these could be achieved with the autoconfig mechanism, an external script is needed.
>> I'm dealing with the same issues, this is what I did so far:
>> * Preventing indexation : set the preference >> "mailnews.database.global.indexer.enabled" to "false"
>> * Preventing offline synchronization for IMAP account : for each >> account, set the preference "mail.server.<server_id>.offline_download" >> to "false".
>> Do do that, the easiest way is to use the "autoconfig" which allow you >> to force setting on a system-level bassis and not on user-lever. It's >> very simple, you need to deploy two files (works on linux too) :
>> // >> /* This will disable indexation */ >> lockPref("mailnews.database.global.indexer.enabled", false);
>> /* This will parse the prefs.js and disable "offline_download" for each >> IMAP account */
>> if (getPref("mail.accountmanager.accounts")) {
>> var listExistingAccounts = getPref("mail.accountmanager.accounts"); >> var arrayExistingAccounts = listExistingAccounts.split(',');
>> for (var i=0; i < arrayExistingAccounts.length; i++) { >> var serverFromAccount = getPref("mail.account." + >> arrayExistingAccounts[i] + ".server"); >> var configType = getPref("mail.server." + serverFromAccount + >> ".type"); >> if (configType == "imap") { >> lockPref("mail.server." + serverFromAccount + >> ".offline_download", false); >> } >> }
>> }
>> I'm still investigating a way to disable smart folders automatically but >> as far as it's not managed in the "prefs.js" (but "localstore.rdf") this >> is far more tricky. > This ALMOST worked for us, we needed to add one more line, to change > the default for new accounts as well:
These could be easily achieved by deploying this file after the installation of Thunderbird.
When Thunderbird is launched for the first under a user session with no previous configuration, it will use this file and copy it on the profile so the user won't have Smart Folders enabled.
Unfortunately, this won't *override* existing "localstore.rdf" in existing profiles...
In our production environment, the profile is stored in a "known" path that we have fixed with the Profile Manager so we know exactly were the file is and we'll be able to replace it with no problem.
But for people who use the classic behavior of Thunderbird, it is stored in a random directory in the user profile (%APPDATA%\Thunderbird\Profiles\<radom_name>) and a don't know a simple way to get the profile's path.
The most direct solution is to parse the "%APPDATA%\Thunderbird\profile.ini" file but I don't think these could be achieved with the autoconfig mechanism, an external script is needed.
