Opening a DOC File

[Cy Burnot]

My wife's computer (an HP All-In-One) came with Microsoft Office Client
Virtualization (aka Word and Excel Starter) and it works fine when I try
to open a regular WORD or EXCEL file.

But if a Word file is an attachment to an email, TB will not open it
even though Tools > Options > Attachments says to use Microsoft Client
Virtualization.

Is this a TB problem or a Win 7 problem?

[Mike Easter]

Cy Burnot wrote:
> My wife's computer (an HP All-In-One) came with Microsoft Office Client
> Virtualization (aka Word and Excel Starter) and it works fine when I try
> to open a regular WORD or EXCEL file.
>
> But if a Word file is an attachment to an email, TB will not open it
> even though Tools > Options > Attachments says to use Microsoft Client
> Virtualization.

I would save the attachment and open it separately.

> Is this a TB problem or a Win 7 problem?

This article^1 explains about the encoding issue. The 'condition' of the
.doc part of the Tbird email file is that it is both encoded and
'smushed' into the Tbird database filesystem. How to get it 'out of
there' in a condition usable by the app?

One way is to save it to disk. The article also talks about extensions.

^1 http://kb.mozillazine.org/Attachments_(Thunderbird) When you receive
an attachment—for example, Word documents or photos—Thunderbird keeps it
with the e-mail message the attachment came with unless you remove it
... MIME converts the file to a format compatible with Internet
transmission (i.e. "encodes" it) and attaches it to text of the message,
creating one large e-mail. Then the whole e-mail, including the
attachment, is sent together. ... Thunderbird stores the whole e-mail
together, including the attachment ...

--
Mike Easter

[Cy Burnot]

Mike Easter has written on 6/9/2011 3:26 PM:

> Cy Burnot wrote:
>> My wife's computer (an HP All-In-One) came with Microsoft Office Client
>> Virtualization (aka Word and Excel Starter) and it works fine when I try
>> to open a regular WORD or EXCEL file.
>>
>> But if a Word file is an attachment to an email, TB will not open it
>> even though Tools > Options > Attachments says to use Microsoft Client
>> Virtualization.
>
> I would save the attachment and open it separately.

That's you. My wife prefers that TB act as configured.

>
>> Is this a TB problem or a Win 7 problem?
>
> This article^1 explains about the encoding issue. The 'condition' of the
> .doc part of the Tbird email file is that it is both encoded and
> 'smushed' into the Tbird database filesystem. How to get it 'out of
> there' in a condition usable by the app?
>
> One way is to save it to disk. The article also talks about extensions.
>
>
> ^1 http://kb.mozillazine.org/Attachments_(Thunderbird) When you receive

> an attachment—for example, Word documents or photos—Thunderbird keeps it

> with the e-mail message the attachment came with unless you remove it
> ... MIME converts the file to a format compatible with Internet
> transmission (i.e. "encodes" it) and attaches it to text of the message,
> creating one large e-mail. Then the whole e-mail, including the
> attachment, is sent together. ... Thunderbird stores the whole e-mail
> together, including the attachment ...

Your point?

I use Openoffice.org as my DOC app and TB uses it to open attached DOCs.

[Greywolf]

On 09/06/2011 3:45 PM, Cy Burnot wrote:
> Mike Easter has written on 6/9/2011 3:26 PM:
>> Cy Burnot wrote:
>>> My wife's computer (an HP All-In-One) came with Microsoft Office Client
>>> Virtualization (aka Word and Excel Starter) and it works fine when I try
>>> to open a regular WORD or EXCEL file.
>>>
>>> But if a Word file is an attachment to an email, TB will not open it
>>> even though Tools> Options> Attachments says to use Microsoft Client
>>> Virtualization.
>>
>> I would save the attachment and open it separately.
>
> That's you. My wife prefers that TB act as configured.

Now, now, let's not get testy here. Sometimes a work-around is all
that's possible. Sometimes you have to eliminate the problem, and
sometimes you can actually solve the problem. In this case, i don't
thinbk you can solve the problem.

>>> Is this a TB problem or a Win 7 problem?

[...]

AFAICT, it's a "Microsoft Office Client Virtualization" problem.
"Virtualization" doesn't open anything, it just calls Word & Excel when
you click on a document filename. TBird doesn't click on filenames. You
need to specify Word as the program to use. IOW, list Winword.exe as the
program to open the *.doc files. You may have to Browse to find the path
to it.

Or install Open Office on your wife's computer. It's enough like MS
Office that it should be easy for her to make the switch. Besides, she
can have both. Besides, it's free. ;-)

HTH
Wolf K.

[goodwin]

On 06/09/2011 02:57 PM, Greywolf wrote:
>
> Or install Open Office on your wife's computer. It's enough like MS
> Office that it should be easy for her to make the switch. Besides, she
> can have both. Besides, it's free. ;-)
>

OO can be a problem with some doc files - might send the wife over the
edge...

[Keith Nuttle]

Because it takes time to open a large wordprocessor like MS word, I have
down loaded the MSWord viewers at

http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/downloads/CD001022584.aspx

You only then have to set the application options to the viewer instead
of the MSWord program

The advantage is that it loads quicker

[Mike Easter]

Keith Nuttle wrote:
> Mike Easter wrote:

>> I would save the attachment and open it separately.

> You only then have to set the application options to the viewer instead

> of the MSWord program
>
> The advantage is that it loads quicker

I like that idea better than saving if one only wants to be reading the
doc and not editing it from clicking on a Tbird attachment.

So the strategy would be to Tbird configure to use the viewer. If one
wanted to edit the .doc, then they would instead R click and save it.

--
Mike Easter

[Cy Burnot]

Greywolf has written on 6/9/2011 5:57 PM:

> On 09/06/2011 3:45 PM, Cy Burnot wrote:
>> Mike Easter has written on 6/9/2011 3:26 PM:
>>> Cy Burnot wrote:
>>>> My wife's computer (an HP All-In-One) came with Microsoft Office Client
>>>> Virtualization (aka Word and Excel Starter) and it works fine when I try
>>>> to open a regular WORD or EXCEL file.
>>>>
>>>> But if a Word file is an attachment to an email, TB will not open it
>>>> even though Tools> Options> Attachments says to use Microsoft Client
>>>> Virtualization.
>>>
>>> I would save the attachment and open it separately.
>>
>> That's you. My wife prefers that TB act as configured.
>
> Now, now, let's not get testy here. Sometimes a work-around is all
> that's possible. Sometimes you have to eliminate the problem, and
> sometimes you can actually solve the problem. In this case, i don't

> think you can solve the problem.

Me, specifically? :-)

>
>>>> Is this a TB problem or a Win 7 problem?
> [...]
>
> AFAICT, it's a "Microsoft Office Client Virtualization" problem.
> "Virtualization" doesn't open anything, it just calls Word & Excel when
> you click on a document filename. TBird doesn't click on filenames. You
> need to specify Word as the program to use. IOW, list Winword.exe as the
> program to open the *.doc files. You may have to Browse to find the path
> to it.

I was surprised to find that there is no file winword.* on her machine!
(Searched with Total Commander, starting at C:\, hidden and system files
visible.)

> Or install Open Office on your wife's computer. It's enough like MS
> Office that it should be easy for her to make the switch. Besides, she
> can have both. Besides, it's free. ;-)

Word/Excel Starter was free with her computer. Besides, she's used to
that awful interface now and I would not ask her to change.

Thanks for the input.

[Cy Burnot]

goodwin has written on 6/9/2011 6:04 PM:

Hey, watch how you talk about my wife! :-)

I think that many people here do not realize how non-techies think about
the computers they use. They'd like them to be as unobtrusive as
possible. Once they have a routine, they can focus on the work and not
on the computer. We, OTOH, ... :-)

[Cy Burnot]

Keith Nuttle has written on 6/9/2011 6:07 PM:

<snip>

> Because it takes time to open a large wordprocessor like MS word

About 2 seconds on her HP.

[Greywolf]

On 09/06/2011 7:48 PM, Cy Burnot wrote:
> Greywolf has written on 6/9/2011 5:57 PM:
>> On 09/06/2011 3:45 PM, Cy Burnot wrote:
>>> Mike Easter has written on 6/9/2011 3:26 PM:
>>>> Cy Burnot wrote:
>>>>> My wife's computer (an HP All-In-One) came with Microsoft Office Client
>>>>> Virtualization (aka Word and Excel Starter) and it works fine when I try
>>>>> to open a regular WORD or EXCEL file.
>>>>>
>>>>> But if a Word file is an attachment to an email, TB will not open it
>>>>> even though Tools> Options> Attachments says to use Microsoft Client
>>>>> Virtualization.
>>>>
>>>> I would save the attachment and open it separately.
>>>
>>> That's you. My wife prefers that TB act as configured.
>>
>> Now, now, let's not get testy here. Sometimes a work-around is all
>> that's possible. Sometimes you have to eliminate the problem, and
>> sometimes you can actually solve the problem. In this case, i don't
>> think you can solve the problem.
>
> Me, specifically? :-)

Ok, "I don't think one can solve the problem." ;-)

Actually, I think one can, but _I_ can't, if there's no executable for Word.

[...]

> Word/Excel Starter was free with her computer. Besides, she's used to
> that awful interface now and I would not ask her to change.

Yeah, I know, wasn't thinking on all 8 cylinders.

> Thanks for the input.

You're welcome. If you google on "Microsoft Office Client
Virtualization", you may find useful info. I did, it seems quite a few
people had/have problems with it.

Searching on "word/excel starter executables", I found this on
http://www.addictivetips.com/microsoft-office/a-challenge-for-developers-disabling-advertisement-in-office-2010-starter/:

"Coming back to this version of Office, for novice users it will be
astonishing that Starter folder will be residing in a very strange
location that is in Virtualization Handler folder. Microsoft built an
app launcher which actually invoke Word & Excel starter version. So it
would be difficult for cracker to go about it as Microsoft embed the app
in labyrinth of other apps. The developers who will be looking forward
to disable advertisements, would caught in maze of files and facing a
great challenge as core apps are embedded in other app, which apparently
do nothing, besides invoking Word or Excel(and also updating them).

In retrospect, if we jump in to the details that, whenever users
encountered any problem which was deliberately incorporated into the
app, developers come up with an idea to get it over with, by building
different scripts and patches, that eventually abets user to get rid of
the problem, But the dev-team which Microsoft have been working with,
must have built this version of office in a way, which would be
difficult to hamper and elevate hindrance for crackers, preventing them
to enter in to the Office Starter application code structure to start
modifying code or changing its structure for adding more features.
Whenever it comes to the acme of cracker’s desperation, they have proved
that ‘nothing is impossible’. So when Microsoft Starter would hit the
market, developers will start to look up for a way to make adverts
disappear from the app window. As we have seen many applications have
been modified for providing easier use, far reach access, enhancing
interactivity, and embedding plug-ins to make the app more productive."

Don't sound so good, eh?

Good luck,
Wolf K.

[Greywolf]

On 09/06/2011 7:48 PM, Cy Burnot wrote:

[...]

> Word/Excel Starter was free with her computer. Besides, she's used to
> that awful interface now and I would not ask her to change.
>
> Thanks for the input.

PS: on the previously refernced page I also found:

"This is the target file location of Word 2010 Starter, this seems
really tough to even find out where it is actually residing.

“C:\Program Files\Common Files\microsoft shared\Virtualization
Handler\CVH.EXE” “Microsoft Word Starter 2010 2014006604090000″

CVH.EXE is the app launcher for both Word and Excel 2010, when you will
launch Word Starter 2010, it would refer to this executable file, and
then CVH.EXE will invoke the app you needed to run, but on running it
exclusively, this dialog box appears...."

It seems to me that CVH.EXE is the file you want, with the parameter
"Microsoft Word...". Anyhow, perusing that page and others may give you
the info you need. Once again,

Good luck,
Wolf K.

[Cy Burnot]

Greywolf has written on 6/9/2011 8:11 PM:

"Sorry! The page you were looking for got scared and ran away, but we
can't let you run away too. Below are some recent posts you might be
interested in."

> "Coming back to this version of Office, for novice users it will be
> astonishing that Starter folder will be residing in a very strange
> location that is in Virtualization Handler folder.

Novice users have no idea where any executable resides. Nor do they care.

> Microsoft built an
> app launcher which actually invoke Word & Excel starter version. So it
> would be difficult for cracker to go about it as Microsoft embed the app
> in labyrinth of other apps. The developers who will be looking forward
> to disable advertisements, would caught in maze of files and facing a
> great challenge as core apps are embedded in other app, which apparently
> do nothing, besides invoking Word or Excel(and also updating them).

??? What ads?

> In retrospect, if we jump in to the details that, whenever users
> encountered any problem which was deliberately incorporated into the
> app, developers come up with an idea to get it over with, by building
> different scripts and patches, that eventually abets user to get rid of
> the problem, But the dev-team which Microsoft have been working with,
> must have built this version of office in a way, which would be
> difficult to hamper and elevate hindrance for crackers, preventing them
> to enter in to the Office Starter application code structure to start
> modifying code or changing its structure for adding more features.
> Whenever it comes to the acme of cracker’s desperation, they have proved
> that ‘nothing is impossible’. So when Microsoft Starter would hit the
> market, developers will start to look up for a way to make adverts
> disappear from the app window. As we have seen many applications have
> been modified for providing easier use, far reach access, enhancing
> interactivity, and embedding plug-ins to make the app more productive."

Is there a version of this in English? :-)

So far, she has had no problems using the starters (except as noted).
She, like the vast majority of users of office-type s/w, has very simple
needs.

Thx.

[Cy Burnot]

Greywolf has written on 6/9/2011 8:16 PM:

> On 09/06/2011 7:48 PM, Cy Burnot wrote:
> [...]
>> Word/Excel Starter was free with her computer. Besides, she's used to
>> that awful interface now and I would not ask her to change.
>>
>> Thanks for the input.
>

> PS: on the previously referenced page I also found:

>
> "This is the target file location of Word 2010 Starter, this seems
> really tough to even find out where it is actually residing.
>
> “C:\Program Files\Common Files\microsoft shared\Virtualization
> Handler\CVH.EXE” “Microsoft Word Starter 2010 2014006604090000″

I found that via the shortcut pinned to her taskbar.

> CVH.EXE is the app launcher for both Word and Excel 2010, when you will
> launch Word Starter 2010, it would refer to this executable file, and
> then CVH.EXE will invoke the app you needed to run, but on running it
> exclusively, this dialog box appears...."
>
> It seems to me that CVH.EXE is the file you want, with the parameter
> "Microsoft Word...".

Now if I could find the place in TB that I could enter that command line....

[Ron K.]

Cy Burnot on 6/9/2011 8:29 PM, keyboarded a reply:

mimeTypes.rdf is the storage file for helper app associations. For some
reasion, the Gecko mimeTypes code is not picking up the default *.doc
handler from the registry.

I was just looking at the Options > Attachments dialog and saw that it has
been improved in TB 3.1 over what it was in TB 3 Beta and 3.0 releases.
One of the options in the Use drop-down is a file browser.

I hope there is a solution easier than having to hack the storage file.

--
Ron K.
Who is General Failure, and why is he searching my HDD?
Kernel Restore reported Major Error used BSOD to msg the enemy!

[Cy Burnot]

Ron K. has written on 6/10/2011 10:50 AM:

> Cy Burnot on 6/9/2011 8:29 PM, keyboarded a reply:
>> Greywolf has written on 6/9/2011 8:16 PM:
>>> On 09/06/2011 7:48 PM, Cy Burnot wrote:
>>> [...]
>>>> Word/Excel Starter was free with her computer. Besides, she's used to
>>>> that awful interface now and I would not ask her to change.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for the input.
>>>
>>> PS: on the previously referenced page I also found:
>>>
>>> "This is the target file location of Word 2010 Starter, this seems
>>> really tough to even find out where it is actually residing.
>>>

>>> “C:\Program Files\Common Files\microsoft shared\Virtualization
>>> Handler\CVH.EXE†“Microsoft Word Starter 2010 2014006604090000″

>>
>> I found that via the shortcut pinned to her taskbar.
>>
>>> CVH.EXE is the app launcher for both Word and Excel 2010, when you will
>>> launch Word Starter 2010, it would refer to this executable file, and
>>> then CVH.EXE will invoke the app you needed to run, but on running it
>>> exclusively, this dialog box appears...."
>>>
>>> It seems to me that CVH.EXE is the file you want, with the parameter
>>> "Microsoft Word...".
>>
>> Now if I could find the place in TB that I could enter that command line....
>>
>
> mimeTypes.rdf is the storage file for helper app associations. For some
> reasion, the Gecko mimeTypes code is not picking up the default *.doc
> handler from the registry.
>
> I was just looking at the Options > Attachments dialog and saw that it has
> been improved in TB 3.1 over what it was in TB 3 Beta and 3.0 releases.
> One of the options in the Use drop-down is a file browser.

Aha! I missed that. I'll go try it and see if I can point it at CVH.EXE

Thanks.

[Christoph Schmees]

Am 2011-06-10 00:04, schrieb goodwin:
> On 06/09/2011 02:57 PM, Greywolf wrote:
>>
>> Or install Open Office on your wife's computer. It's enough
>> like MS
>> Office that it should be easy for her to make the switch.
>> Besides, she
>> can have both. Besides, it's free. ;-)
>>
>

> OO can be a problem with some doc files ...

I for one have *never* seen a problem of OO (or LO nowadays)
_reading_ a DOC or DOCX file or attachment. You may encounter
problems when you edit complex DOC or DOCX files an give them
back to MS office users - because of some quirks hidden in these
proprietary formats. But pure reading, never a problem. Give me
one example.

Christoph

--
email:
nurfuerspam -> gmx
de -> net

[Christoph Schmees]

because MS preloads all it's sh... to RAM at boot time,
cluttering your working memory. If you can and want to afford the
amount of RAM for it, you can have that with OO or LO as well -
it is called "Quick Start". Even Java has it on as default
although nearly no one ever needs Java.

[Ron Hunter]

IF you use MSW a lot, and IF you have enough RAM so it stays in the ram
cache (HD cache), it will load that fast. However, if you don't have it
in ram, and have to wait while it builds a prefetch file, and then
loads, it will take a LOT longer to load.
Since I run such applications very rarely, I usually have to wait 15-30
seconds for that kind of program to load. Other things, like Firefox,
load in a second or two.