Fog Light Fools
Wayne Marsh
drivers are going around with their fog lights on all the time. I have
fog lights too, but I don't switch them on unless it's actually foggy,
or rainy or snowy. It's as nonsensical to burn your fog lights when the
weather is clear as it is to run your windshield wipers when it isn't
raining.
Having fog lights lit in clear weather doesn't help the driver to see,
and it doesn't help to make the vehicle more visible, since the
headlights and taillights are already on. As far as I can make out, the
folks who run their fog lights all the time are making some sort of
statement -- but what? "My lumens are bigger than your lumens?" "I'm
richer than you are, because I can afford to burn the extra gas
necessary to make my car as bright as a Holidazzle float?"
Wayne Marsh Minneapolis, Minnesota, USA
wayne...@mac.com
Al
Or maybe "I don't worry about the small stuff and actually forgot I have
them on". (and) "hopefully I am ruining someone's day by doing this".
Bigger worries you need, perhaps.
Hell Toupee
> Now that it's dark 20 hours a day, it's become obvious that a lot of
> drivers are going around with their fog lights on all the time. I have
> fog lights too, but I don't switch them on unless it's actually foggy,
> or rainy or snowy. It's as nonsensical to burn your fog lights when the
> weather is clear as it is to run your windshield wipers when it isn't
> raining.
>
> Having fog lights lit in clear weather doesn't help the driver to see,
They most certainly do, when it's dark. They help light up the pavement
in front of the car, which helps me avoid downed tree branches and twigs
in my heavily-treed neighborhood (our roads get messy when it gets windy).
They also illuminate the sides of the road better - which makes it
easier for me to spot wildlife before said wildlife charges into my
path. Since they're angled to light up the ground fairly close to the
car, they won't help much at all at high speeds. But for the same
reason, they don't create problems for other drivers, so there's no
downside to using them.
Thomas T. Veldhouse
Actually, more lights does grap more attention. Also, it seems to deter deer
a bit more. I often drive dark roads with the fog lights on because it is
bright enough without using brights and I don't have to shut them off when a
car comes over the hill and further, evern 1/2 mile or so, I can blink my
brights and I have seen many deer run well ahead of the car. Knock on wood, I
have yet to hit one of those studip MOFOs.
--
Thomas T. Veldhouse
Religion is a crutch, but that's okay... humanity is a cripple.
Jerry
I think it makes the vehicle more visible. Just like a motorcycle with
three lights is more visible than one with one light. I've also found
in past vehicles I've owned with fog lights that they do help me see
the road better.
--
Jerry
Thomas T. Veldhouse
BTW ... most lights that are under the bumper by the air dam are NOT fog
lights. I can't think of the name of them offhand, but, a fog light requires
a bulb that puts out a light frequency that passes through water better than
others. Blue scatters [hence the blue sky] and white [which contains all
visible colors] largely reflects back in thick fog or snow. I believe, but am
not certain, that yellow lights are what will shine through fog at the
greatest distance. If you replace the little lights near the air dam, you
will notice they are simple halogens like all the other lights in your car
[unless you have a car that uses LED lights which should never burn out ...
but the cars that have them use LEDs that emit a lot of blue, so the light
will scatter in fog making them relatively poor fog lights].
Jules
> BTW ... most lights that are under the bumper by the air dam are NOT fog
> lights. I can't think of the name of them offhand, but, a fog light requires
> a bulb that puts out a light frequency that passes through water better than
> others.
I've heard 'em called anything from driving lamps to spot lights... but
I think they *are* typically switched via the fog light switch on the
dash, are they not?
> I believe, but am not certain, that yellow lights are what will shine
> through fog at the greatest distance.
I certainly remember rally cars back in the 80s on snow courses often
using yellow rather than "white" lights - I wonder if the yellow color
just produces less reflection from the snow (or fog or whatever)?
> but the cars that have them use LEDs that emit a lot of blue,
I've found that with my Maglites - the LED one is good for lighting a
specific point at a distance, but crappy compared to the incandescent
for general illumination and useless for cutting through anything in
the air (whether it be smoke, rain, snow etc.). That's despite the LED one
using 50% more batteries...
Jules
> Now that it's dark 20 hours a day, it's become obvious that a lot of
> drivers are going around with their fog lights on all the time. I have
> fog lights too, but I don't switch them on unless it's actually foggy,
> or rainy or snowy.
I think a lot of idiots switch them on and then forget that they've done
so; unlike wipers they not really intrusive to the driver once the hazard
has passed. Sometimes that's coupled with a bad dashboard design where
there's poor - or even no - indication that they're even on. There's also
a possibility that people turn them off and even when the fog goes their
mentality is, "it's been foggy once on this trip, I'll leave them on just
in case".
Oh, I've heard numerous tales of dashboards where the fog light switch is
in a goofy place too (possibly just because the designers run out of
useful room or the switch almost gets tacked on as an afterthought) - and
it's possible to hit the switch by accident. Of course a lot of drivers
might never have used fog lights before, so don't realise what that
strange little light on their dash actually means... (although obviously
this isn't the case here if you're noticing more lights on now that it's
darker)
cheers
Jules
Thomas T. Veldhouse
> On Mon, 16 Nov 2009 16:38:18 +0000, Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote:
>> BTW ... most lights that are under the bumper by the air dam are NOT fog
>> lights. I can't think of the name of them offhand, but, a fog light requires
>> a bulb that puts out a light frequency that passes through water better than
>> others.
>
> I've heard 'em called anything from driving lamps to spot lights... but
> I think they *are* typically switched via the fog light switch on the
> dash, are they not?
They are switching on via a switch on the dash, yes, but I do not concede that
the switch is a fog light switch. I have not seen any mention of "fog"
including symbolism in my car. Granted, I have not looked in the manual to
see what the switch [or lamps] are officially called.
>
>> I believe, but am not certain, that yellow lights are what will shine
>> through fog at the greatest distance.
>
> I certainly remember rally cars back in the 80s on snow courses often
> using yellow rather than "white" lights - I wonder if the yellow color
> just produces less reflection from the snow (or fog or whatever)?
Water and ice pass different frequencies of light and reflect others. The
best color/wavelength of light is one that will pass through fog in particular
and with the least amount of refraction [if it refracts a lot the light goes
in many different directions and you end up with a diffused beam that doesn't
travel far. I am not positive, but I believe that color is yellow or close to
it [it probably isn't a perfect yellow is what I mean].
>
>> but the cars that have them use LEDs that emit a lot of blue,
>
> I've found that with my Maglites - the LED one is good for lighting a
> specific point at a distance, but crappy compared to the incandescent
> for general illumination and useless for cutting through anything in
> the air (whether it be smoke, rain, snow etc.). That's despite the LED one
> using 50% more batteries...
LEDs should use a LOT LESS POWER, that and the fact that they rarely fail is
the reason for putting them in a car. LED light is HIGHLY EFFICIENT and that
is why they sell LED based flashlights, not to mention computer monitors and
high definition televisions (actually monitors as well) are moving towards LED
and OLED technology and away from plasma and LCD.
dr...@bin.sh
> I've found that with my Maglites - the LED one is good for lighting a
> specific point at a distance, but crappy compared to the incandescent
> for general illumination and useless for cutting through anything in
> the air (whether it be smoke, rain, snow etc.). That's despite the LED one
> using 50% more batteries...
you're doing something wrong. i replaced the bulb in my maglite with
an aftermarket LED at least a year ago, and haven't had to change the
batteries since then. its brighter, too.
--
We will not live in a two dimensional world. We won't go in one direction,
or zig when we can zag. We will walk through walls. We will take a look
around us. We will not be confined. We believe in the path of least
limits. We won't be told how to view the world. We will experience true
freedom. We will not compromise, we will live the game through our hands.
We will be in control of something changing. We will change the system.
Gandalf
wrote:
On my car, the lights on the air dam, which contain standard halogen
H8006 (white) lamps are referred to in the owner's manual as 'fog
lights'.
I use them whenever there are pedestrians around, since they light up
the sidewalk on the right of my car, and the road right in front of my
car far better than the headlights alone.
And, I turn them off when I don't need them anymore. I don't want to
have to replace one in the winter: it's a real PITA to get to them.
Earnest Questioner
to see through fog. So I was surprised when I did a little Googling
and found out that it ISN'T. In fact, there is no single color that's
best. What happened is that long, long ago fog lamps were introduced
in yellow, and have remained yellow ever since. For no scientific
reason!
http://www.gi.alaska.edu/ScienceForum/ASF5/593.html
As pointed out above, fog lights are quite useful for illuminating the
pavement closest to the car. But that doesn't have to be with yellow
light.
Jules
> Alien mind control rays made Jules <jules.rich...@remove.this.gmail.com> write:
>> I've found that with my Maglites - the LED one is good for lighting a
>> specific point at a distance, but crappy compared to the incandescent
>> for general illumination and useless for cutting through anything in
>> the air (whether it be smoke, rain, snow etc.). That's despite the LED one
>> using 50% more batteries...
>
> you're doing something wrong. i replaced the bulb in my maglite with
> an aftermarket LED at least a year ago, and haven't had to change the
> batteries since then. its brighter, too.
Sorry, I should clarify that... I meant that it's a 3-cell light, but the
incandescent one I have is just a 2-cell, hence the 50% thing. It was
free, so I can't bitch about it *too* much :-)
The LED one does last way longer on the batteries, but it's a more bulky
light (physically longer) and not as useful because it produces a sickly
blue cast to everything and a very sharp cutoff between light/shadow. If I
want to see a specific point far away then I think it beats the
incandescent, but overall for all uses I think it's just not as good (when
I last had it apart it looked like it might be possible to fit it with a
conventional bulb, but I've not got a round tuit yet).
I suspect it's just a spectrum thing, because I've seen a similar effect
with cars that have a blueish cast to their lights (whatever the
technical name for them is) - they seem to light up everything straight
ahead really well, but do badly for things that are outside the main light
"cone".
cheers
Jules
Mike H
Most lights that come on cars from the factory are not really fog
lights, they are more like driving lights. They add foreground
lighting but they are neither bright enough, nor aimed properly, nor
provide a good light pattern for effective use in the fog. In
addition they are often tied to the headlight circuit, so that if you
are in any real fog and want to be able to see, you can't turn off
your headlights and leave your fog lights on.
My wife likes to have them on all the time. I'm always turning them
off when I get into the car. I've asked for her reasoning, and I have
never received an answer that made any sense. All I know is it's a
pain to change the bulbs as they are behind the bumper cover and I
have to lay on my back, usually on a wet garage floor because they
fail in the winter) to replace the bulbs when they wear out.
The idea of Yellow fog lights (also known as Selective Yellow) is that
they provide a light that is less work for the human eye to process,
thus reducing perceived glare. Various people swear by selective
yellow fog lights. Analysis of this though has shown that any real
advantage with selective yellow fog lights is more taste then actual
benefit.
http://www.lightingresearch.org/programs/transportation/pdf/SAE/2001-01-0320.pdf
This page has a good discussion on fog lights and where they apply.
http://www.danielsternlighting.com/tech/lights/fog_lamps/fog_lamps.html
Lutsen Lumberjack
Lights formats fog past our dance.
Brian Elfert
>Now that it's dark 20 hours a day, it's become obvious that a lot of
>drivers are going around with their fog lights on all the time. I have
>fog lights too, but I don't switch them on unless it's actually foggy,
>or rainy or snowy. It's as nonsensical to burn your fog lights when the
>weather is clear as it is to run your windshield wipers when it isn't
>raining.
The "fog" lights on my motorhome are actually labeled as auxiliary lights.
They do light up the road much better than my low beam headlights alone so
they aren't just for fog. The issue right now is they aren't aligned
right so they blind oncoming drivers so I don't use them.