A License To Steal...a Lucas production
The Starmaker
"Submissions\) shall be deemed and shall remain the property of Lucas in
perpetuity. By making any Submission, the sender automatically grants,
or warrants that the owner of such material expressly grants, Lucas the
royalty-free, perpetual, irrevocable, non-exclusive right and license to
use, reproduce, modify, adapt, publish, translate, and distribute such
material (in whole or in part) throughout the universe and/or to
incorporate it in other works in any form, media or technology now known
or hereafter developed, for the full term of any copyright, trademark or
patent that may exist in such material for any purpose that Lucas
chooses, whether internal, public, commercial, or otherwise, without any
compensation, credit or notice to the sender whatsoever.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125658217507308619.html?mod=WSJ_hpp_MIDDLENexttoWhatsNewsThird
Lucasfilm Ltd., Star Wars creator George Lucas's entertainment company
that runs the site, said the language is "standard in Hollywood".
In otherwords, it is 'standard business practice' to *steal* everything
from you in Hollywood.
The Starmaker
Frank Frank
What part of "non-exclusive" don't you understand? You retain your rights.
The Starmaker
You mean you get to keep your fingers and your toes? And the blood that
runs
through your body, you retain that also...you might as well just shoot
me
if your intentions is just to rob me!
The Starmaker
MICHAEL
My father made him an offer he couldn't refuse.
KAY
What was that?
MICHAEL
Luca Brasi held a gun to his head, and my father assured him that either
his brains -- or his signature -- would be on the contract.
Frank Frank
Who said anything about robbing anyone?
The Starmaker
The contract is 'deceitful', so that makes it ...robbery.
A License To Steal...
The Starmaker
A lawyer with a briefcase can steal more than a hundred men with guns.
-Puzo, Mario
The Godfather, bk.1, ch.1.
richard
The copyright office and law clearly says that "possession of a work does
not transfer copyright ownership".
If you were to buy a book, do you own the copyright? Of course not.
While this wording may be standard operational bull, will it hold up in
court? Not likely.
If you submit to Lucas a screenplay, and they use it, without properly
contracting with you, they have violated the law.
Noting the source of that material, I doubt if it's the real thing.
Frank Frank
Where's the deception? It says what it says in plain English.
Deadrat
news:odk86qnkxk62.1xkh4x8tej1z5$.d...@40tude.net:
Even when you're right, you're wrong. This is completely inapt. You
have a choice when you post to "submissions" to the Star Wars site -- if
you don't want to accept the conditions, don't post.
> While this wording may be standard operational bull, will it hold up
> in court? Not likely.
What, exactly, do you think makes it unenforceable? This is virtual
shrinkwrap contract. The standing of these is not entirely clear in the
US, but it would seem they're OK if they give sufficient notice and
require active consent.
> If you submit to Lucas a screenplay, and they use it, without properly
> contracting with you, they have violated the law.
Of course, but that's not the case here.
>
> Noting the source of that material, I doubt if it's the real thing.
Of course, it would never occur to you to go to www.starwars.com/terms to
actually find out. It's there as described. But part of the terms
specifically disallows accepting "creative ideas, suggestions, or
materials."
Deadrat
news:4AE9E5...@ix.netcom.com:
No, robbery requires a threat to a person in person.
>
> A License To Steal...
The contract isn't deceptive in the least. It says that in return for
your participation on the message boards, you give up any copyright
claims against the site's owner. If you don't like the terms, then don't
participate.
Note that submissions are essentially worthless to begin with. It's just
written bloviation from people a little too invested in Lucas' scifi.
The site specifically disallows the submission of creative ideas (like
screenplays) that could theoretically be valuable.
> The Starmaker
<snip/>
The Starmaker
Give me a break! I'm not a lawyer. I'm not here to argue 'contract law'...
any clear minded person can see it's deception when you have a site
that contains a contract
for the sole purpose of stealing ideas from others
http://www.starwars.com/terms/
where a "3 year old" can enter that forum and have to agree to the terms
of the a Hollywood contract:
http://forums.starwars.com/
Would you let your 7 year old agree to those terms?
http://www.starwars.com/terms/
Oh, I forgot, it's in "plain English"
The Starmaker
Who is going to protect the children from Hollywood contracts?
Deadrat
Gee, that's too bad because contract law is what governs the issue.
> any clear minded person
How about an ignoramus like youself?
> can see it's deception when you have a site
>
> that contains a contract
> for the sole purpose of stealing ideas from others
> http://www.starwars.com/terms/
And if you'd actually read the terms you'd know that the site doesn't
accept and won't consider any "creative ideas, suggestions, or material."
> where a "3 year old" can enter that forum and have to agree to the
> terms of the a Hollywood contract:
> http://forums.starwars.com/
Three year olds can't enter the forum.
> http://www.starwars.com/
>
> Would you let your 7 year old agree to those terms?
> http://www.starwars.com/terms/
It's unlikely that a court would enforce the provisions against a minor.
> Oh, I forgot, it's in "plain English"
You didn't forget. You just never bothered to find out. The site
doesn't want to be bothered by ignoramuses like yourself who mgiht claim
copyright violations for their bloviations on a message board.
The site doesn't accept or consider anything of value, like scripts or
even suggestions for scripts.
>
> The Starmaker
> Who is going to protect the children from Hollywood contracts?
Who is going to protect misc.legal from ignoramuses like you?
The Starmaker
Okay, I'll make it easy for everyone...tell George Lucas that I said I want him to
stop letting 3 year olds ---make it 18 and under from entering his forums where they are *forced*
to sign Hollywood agreements, is that too much to ask? Or maybe one of yous 'hungry lawyers' can sue
George Lucas first that will force him to do so...
because right now a 3 year old can enter the forums and has to agree to the contract first:
Go ahead, enter birthdate - Month, date and year 2006
http://forums.starwars.com/
The Starmaker
These people will steal your babies ideas and sue them too..perpetuity.
Deadrat
I'm gonna guess that's not true. How about doing a little thinking
before posting? I realize that will make it more difficult for you.
> tell George Lucas that I said I
> want him to stop letting 3 year olds ---make it 18 and under
Finally figured out that 3 year olds aren't logging on to starwars.com?
> from
> entering his forums where they are *forced* to sign Hollywood
> agreements,
They aren't forced to do anything.
> is that too much to ask?
Yup. Contracts with minors are probably unenforceable.
> Or maybe one of yous 'hungry
> lawyers' can sue George Lucas first that will force him to do so...
On what grounds? Oh, that's right, you're not a lawyer. Take a guess
anyway.
> because right now a 3 year old can enter the forums and has to agree
> to the contract first:
>
> Go ahead, enter birthdate - Month, date and year 2006
> http://forums.starwars.com/
Three year olds don't have the capacity to enter the forum.
>
> The Starmaker
>
> These people will steal your babies ideas and sue them
> too..perpetuity.
No, they won't. In the first place, like you, babies don't have ideas
worth stealing. Secondly, the site won't accept or consider creative
ideas. It's just a place where people can yak about Star Wars.
richard
Just like any law, legal and enforcable until the courts rule otherwise.
>
>> If you submit to Lucas a screenplay, and they use it, without properly
>> contracting with you, they have violated the law.
>
> Of course, but that's not the case here.
>>
>> Noting the source of that material, I doubt if it's the real thing.
>
> Of course, it would never occur to you to go to www.starwars.com/terms to
> actually find out. It's there as described. But part of the terms
> specifically disallows accepting "creative ideas, suggestions, or
> materials."
The big difference here is that the item quoted above is from a website.
If you posted something to my website, technically, I can use it as I see
fit. Let's say I required users to pay a fee to post. Somebody post parts
of his copyrighted material. I take that material and commercialize it. Can
he sue me and win? Most likely. I do not acquire copyright by possession.
When it comes to submitting things to Hollywood studios, most people are
not aware that there is a proper method for doing so. If that is not
followed, the work is rejected.
Deadrat
news:1dezmu0tlrfzi.efu9847u774c$.d...@40tude.net:
> On Thu, 29 Oct 2009 15:17:47 -0500, Deadrat wrote:
>
>> richard <mem...@newsguy.com> wrote in
>> news:odk86qnkxk62.1xkh4x8tej1z5$.d...@40tude.net:
>>
>>> On Thu, 29 Oct 2009 09:30:25 -0800, The Starmaker wrote:
>>>
>>>> A License To Steal...a Lucas Produation
>>>>
>>>> "Submissions\) shall be deemed and shall remain the property of
>>>> Lucas in perpetuity. By making any Submission, the sender
>>>> automatically grants, or warrants that the owner of such material
>>>> expressly grants, Lucas the royalty-free, perpetual, irrevocable,
>>>> non-exclusive right and license to use, reproduce, modify, adapt,
>>>> publish, translate, and distribute such material (in whole or in
>>>> part) throughout the universe and/or to incorporate it in other
>>>> works in any form, media or technology now known or hereafter
>>>> developed, for the full term of any copyright, trademark or patent
>>>> that may exist in such material for any purpose that Lucas chooses,
>>>> whether internal, public, commercial, or otherwise, without any
>>>> compensation, credit or notice to the sender whatsoever.
>>>> http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125658217507308619.html?mod=WSJ_hpp_
>>>> MI DDLENexttoWhatsNewsThird
Wrong. As usual. And that's why Lucas' company goes to some trouble to
insist that your posting is consent to use.
> Let's say I required users to pay a fee to post.
> Somebody post parts of his copyrighted material. I take that material
> and commercialize it. Can he sue me and win? Most likely. I do not
> acquire copyright by possession.
This contradicts your previous statement that you can use posts to your
site as you see fit. But perhaps this has to do with your delusion that
the copyright violation requires commercialization. It doesn't.
>
> When it comes to submitting things to Hollywood studios, most people
> are not aware that there is a proper method for doing so. If that is
> not followed, the work is rejected.
There is a usual method for submitting things like screenplays, and
things tossed over the transom are usually ignored. But this is more
custom than anything else. But the site in question doesn't seek and
claims to disregard "creative" material.
The Starmaker
If it's just a place where "people can yak about Star Wars"..Why a
contract that extends "throught the universe"?
The terms of use listed on Starwars.com, where people can post to
message boards among other things, tell users that they give up the
rights to any content submissions "throughout the universe and/or to
incorporate it in other works in any form, media or technology now known
or hereafter developed."
If at our request you send certain specific submissions (e.g., postings
to chats, surveys, message boards, contests, or similar items) or,
despite our request that you not send us any other creative materials,
you send us creative suggestions, ideas, notes, drawings, concepts, or
other information (collectively the "Submissions\) shall be deemed and
shall remain the property of Lucas in perpetuity. By making any
Submission, the sender automatically grants, or warrants that the owner
of such material expressly grants, Lucas the royalty-free, perpetual,
irrevocable, non-exclusive right and license to use, reproduce, modify,
adapt, publish, translate, and distribute such material (in whole or in
part) throughout the universe and/or to incorporate it in other works in
any form, media or technology now known or hereafter developed, for the
full term of any copyright, trademark or patent that may exist in such
material for any purpose that Lucas chooses, whether internal, public,
commercial, or otherwise, without any compensation, credit or notice to
the sender whatsoever.
-- Terms of use listed on Starwars.com, where people can post to message
boards, among other things
You people make me sick...with your, 'looking the other way'..while they
steal and rape your children. (whe is
Roman Polanski coming to the U.S. speaking of child rape)
Ubiquitous
And you posted this off-topic article here because?
--
It's now time for healing, and for fixing the damage the Democrats did
to America.
Homer Mandrill
> In article <4AE9D131.2...@ix.netcom.com>, starma...@ix.netcom.com wrote:
> >A License To Steal...a Lucas Produation
> >"Submissions\) shall be deemed and shall remain the property of Lucas in
> >perpetuity. By making any Submission, the sender automatically grants,
> >or warrants that the owner of such material expressly grants, Lucas the
> >royalty-free, perpetual, irrevocable, non-exclusive right and license to
> >use, reproduce, modify, adapt, publish, translate, and distribute such
> >material (in whole or in part) throughout the universe and/or to
> >incorporate it in other works in any form, media or technology now known
> >or hereafter developed, for the full term of any copyright, trademark or
> >patent that may exist in such material for any purpose that Lucas
> >chooses, whether internal, public, commercial, or otherwise, without any
> >compensation, credit or notice to the sender whatsoever.
>
> >Lucasfilm Ltd., Star Wars creator George Lucas's entertainment company
> >that runs the site, said the language is "standard in Hollywood".
>
> >In otherwords, it is 'standard business practice' to *steal* everything
> >from you in Hollywood.
>
> And you posted this off-topic article here because?
>
> --
> It's now time for healing, and for fixing the damage the Democrats did
> to America.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
It's obvious to me the intent of the Lucas contract is to deliberately
discourage any creative submissions without going thru the
correct process, i.e. hiring an agent. The whole purpose of agency
is to have a reliable, informed, licensed witness to your
submissions.
I sent a list of ideas (scenes) for a movie about Osa and Martin
Johnson to one of the biggest Hollywood law firms. They sent me
a nice letter saying they would keep my submission in their vault
for safekeeping. They promptly arranged the publication of a new
edition of "I Married Adventure." When book sales did not
materialize, they dropped the idea of making a movie based on the
Johnson book. They figured the movie would flop
because the new edition was a flop. Had they been successful,
I am sure I would not have received a dime for submitting the idea
in the first place because I did not submit correctly.
David H
~~~~~~~
Deadrat
news:885bf4f3-9599-4a56...@b15g2000yqd.googlegroups.com:
Nonsense. You hire an agent because you hope he or she will be a
informed advocate for placing your work. Agents aren't licensed as
agents. And you don't need anyone to witness your copyright -- that's
what copyright registration is for.
> I sent a list of ideas (scenes) for a movie about Osa and Martin
> Johnson to one of the biggest Hollywood law firms. They sent me
> a nice letter saying they would keep my submission in their vault
> for safekeeping. They promptly arranged the publication of a new
> edition of "I Married Adventure." When book sales did not
> materialize, they dropped the idea of making a movie based on the
> Johnson book. They figured the movie would flop
> because the new edition was a flop. Had they been successful,
> I am sure I would not have received a dime for submitting the idea
> in the first place because I did not submit correctly.
All of the discussion is in the subjunctive here, so it's hard to say. A
list of ideas for scenes would hardly qualify for protection, especially
if these scenes had appeared in the book. If you had submitted a
screenplay to the lawfirm, and they shopped your screenplay to a studio,
which then made a movie using your dialog, then you would have a claim
for copyright violation if they hadn't received your permission to use
the screenplay. Whether you would have received remuneration from the
studio is another question, and if not, whether it would have been worth
your while to pursue a law suit is another.
>
> David H
The Starmaker
They don't want 3 year olds submitting without an agent...
(but if you went to the starwars.com website forums, you'll see requests
for submissions of ideas (without pay)...somebody protect those 3 year
olds for Lucas before it's too late!!!)
> The whole purpose of agency
> is to have a reliable, informed, licensed witness to your
> submissions.
>
> I sent a list of ideas (scenes) for a movie about Osa and Martin
> Johnson to one of the biggest Hollywood law firms. They sent me
> a nice letter saying they would keep my submission in their vault
> for safekeeping. They promptly arranged the publication of a new
> edition of "I Married Adventure." When book sales did not
> materialize, they dropped the idea of making a movie based on the
> Johnson book. They figured the movie would flop
> because the new edition was a flop. Had they been successful,
> I am sure I would not have received a dime for submitting the idea
> in the first place because I did not submit correctly.
>
> David H
> ~~~~~~~
You certaintly don't submit to a lawyer who will keep it in his vault!
Entertainment laywers *teach* studios How To Steal Scripts, Ideas, Treatments and any other
submissions...the only correct way is to have them sign a confientially aggreement before any submissions are made.
Video tape it and tape record the submission once you have them sigh your confidentially aggreement...
and before you walk out the door tell them,
"You steal from me and I'll come back and burn down this fuckin place, ...and your fuckin family,
and your fuckin children."
The Starmaker
Deadrat
Nobody thinks 3 year olds have anything worth submitting to a agent.
> (but if you went to the starwars.com website forums, you'll see
> requests for submissions of ideas (without pay)...somebody protect
> those 3 year olds for Lucas before it's too late!!!)
I don't plan to waste any more time on starwars.com. Their terms of
service disclaim any interest in creative ideas. So don't submit any.
>> The whole purpose of agency
>> is to have a reliable, informed, licensed witness to your
>> submissions.
>>
>> I sent a list of ideas (scenes) for a movie about Osa and Martin
>> Johnson to one of the biggest Hollywood law firms. They sent me
>> a nice letter saying they would keep my submission in their vault
>> for safekeeping. They promptly arranged the publication of a new
>> edition of "I Married Adventure." When book sales did not
>> materialize, they dropped the idea of making a movie based on the
>> Johnson book. They figured the movie would flop
>> because the new edition was a flop. Had they been successful,
>> I am sure I would not have received a dime for submitting the idea
>> in the first place because I did not submit correctly.
>>
>> David H
>> ~~~~~~~
>
> You certaintly don't submit to a lawyer who will keep it in his vault!
>
> Entertainment laywers *teach* studios How To Steal Scripts, Ideas,
> Treatments and any other submissions...the only correct way is to have
> them sign a confientially aggreement before any submissions are made.
Bwahahahahaha! How's that workin' out for you?
Your screenplays or ideas for screenplays aren't confidential.
> Video tape it and tape record the submission once you have them sigh
> your confidentially aggreement...
Bwahahahahahah! Don't hold your breath.
>
> and before you walk out the door tell them,
>
> "You steal from me and I'll come back and burn down this fuckin place,
> ...and your fuckin family,
> and your fuckin children."
Yeah, threatening arson and mayhem will impress the hell out of them.
> The Starmaker
Ulysses in Sur Tejas
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I don't know whether to believe you or Deadrat.
The lawyer firm to whom I submitted the list
of memorable scenes from different sources is
Bert Fields or some similar name. The main thing
is he or they gave it a shot. The book
I MARRIED ADVENTURE was reprinted. But It
did not make waves, and another
good "Out of Africa" period piece went down the tubes.
The bankable scenes are (1) Martin hiring Osa at age 15
to help him run his nickel Kinograph showing the same
Africa footage over and over; (2) Martin as deckhand
on the Snark with Jack and Charmian London, (3) Osa
fending off lions while Jack operated his camera.
She was a crack shot with a rifle. I studied the book as a kid in
the 1940's. The book had a faux but compelling zebra
skin binding !
David H
~~~~~~~~~
The Starmaker
Do you mean this Bert Fields?
http://staging.radaronline.com/exclusives//pellicano_032508_fresh.jpg
When are they going to put that gangster Bert Fields in jail?
The Starmaker
What is wrong with the F.B.I today? They have become a bunch of pussies!
The Starmaker
Well you cannot rely on the law to protect your, ....work.
You have to give them a, ..verbal contract.
You have to tell them, "You steal from me and I'll fuckin kill you!"
Because "these people" in Hollywood will steal from you regardless what contract
you sigh with them.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/13051757#13051757
The Starmaker
Lyle Talbot
> Deadrat wrote:
>
> > The Starmaker <starma...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Hey Starman,
This correspondence took place in 1989. Bert Fields is probably dead
by now.
Let's get back to I MARRIED ADVENTURE.
I have mentioned 3 dynamite scenes for another Africa movie.
The 4th plot point is the return to Pygmy Island. (See illustrations
in the book.) Osa and Martin Johnson spent a week filming the Pygmies
on that island. Today we think of them as Odo characters out of
Starwars. There may not be any pygmies left in Africa. Or, the
pygmies
who remember Osa and Martin may all be dead. So the producer of this
film may have to rely on the SFX studios to come up with 21st Century
black African pygmies. I seriously doubt today's younger generation
has
ever seen a real pygmy.
David H
~~~~~~~~