Re: OT: Global warming update...
Cliff
> What I disagree with is our emmssions are causing global warming.
And you know this how, exactly?
Rush & Faux with their 10th grade non-science C- educations
told you & clearly they know better than thousands of PhDs in the
hard sciences with decades of research to back it up, right?
You don't even seem to know what it's about, sorry.
--
Cliff
Cliff
>
>"BillT" <kin...@mail.com> wrote in message news:hhojmh$cs1$1...@solani.org...
>> On 1/2/2010 8:39 PM, vinny wrote:
>>> Tonight it's supposed to be 30-32 degrees.
>>> That's 20 degrees colder than our average for this time of year.
>>>
>>>
>>> Note to global warming conspirators...next time name it global climate
>>> change as opposed to global warming. What a major marketing blunder.
>>>
>>
>> I think the official term is climate change now. I mean it is science so
>> it's all still a learning curve. Think of the Wright Brothers or Newton.
>> They were called crazy in their times for their "beliefs". What makes this
>> issue so polarizing is how the politicians have grabbed on to it to fuel
>> their selfish needs.
>>
>> My own view after some reading is the immediate temperatures are not
>> relevant. What is happening is a general warming in areas that are
>> traditionally colder. Note the melting of polar ice. This affects things
>> in both directions. The problem is as it melts, it creates a cycle of
>> current that accelerates the melting up there. The colder freshly melted
>> water is moving away (cold jetstream affects downstream weather) and a
>> fresh supply of warm current heads back to the ice. There is no doubt in
>> my mind that I will live long enough to see the extinction of the Polar
>> Bear from its natural habitat. Not a big deal to some but I have a value
>> on animals as they are a real indicator for the health of the ecosystem.
>> Frogs are another amazing indicator of subtle yet important changes.
>>
>> As far as the logic of why some areas are warmer or colder, think about
>> this: During El Nino events, while there will be higher than normal rain
>> amounts in some areas, there is often extended dry periods in regions that
>> would normally have rain during those times.
>>
>> --
>> Bill
>
>I'll admit, I stick it to the global warming people every chance I get. :)
> I don't believe or disbelieve the climate is changing. I think it changes
>relative to the sun all the time. There was a mini ice age just 150 years
>ago.
> That was yesterday practically.
> And I don't think what we are adding to the atmosphere can ever be seen as
>a good thing, so we should continue to cut dangerous emmissions with laws
>like the clean air act.
> What I disagree with is our emmssions are causing global warming. And if I
>disagree I am as crazy as a non darwin believing nut.
> The sun is the main cause of everything. A secondary cause is we are
>spinning like a top, and there's a rythm to the spin, creating cycles in
>everything.
> The timing is off from the sun because of 7 miles of ocean, absorbing and
>releasing energy from the sun causing a delay effect.
>This is no different than the recycling movement.
> Recycling has caused more pollution than any other source on Earth. The
>stuff simply should of been buried, instead we burned it for electricity, we
>cleaned and purified it in the name of recycling, which uses 20 times more
>resources than from scratch.
>
> The oceans will rise 30 feet.
>
>WTF, do they think it's the year 1571 and we will believe anything?
>JEESH!!!!
>
>
Cliff
>Cliff <Clhuprich...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
>news:fjn8k5hqf9djpaba6...@4ax.com:
>
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:2000_Year_Temperature_Comparison.pn
>> g
>>
>> IOW Probably not a global event and seemingly clearly unrelated to
>> CO2 &
>> Methane-induced global warming.
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:2000_Year_Temperature_Comparison.pn
>> g Note the upwards tail ..... Zooommmmm
>
>Pick a temp -
>
>http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Holocene_Temperature_Variations.png
>
>Now tell us a fairy tale about how we can tax our way back to that temp.
What are you gibbering about?
Did you miss
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:2000_Year_Temperature_Comparison.png ????
>
>Doesn't look so zoomy in the overall context of things.
You are in fear of another ice age in the coming decades?
Why?
>And there's a very
>wide variation in the proxy data. Certainly more than the 1/10 resolution
>of your zoomy cartoon. Plus it becomes painfully obvious that you can
>cherry pick data points.
Like isotope ratios, right?
And fake ice cores.
You have RushRot.
>
>Not nearly as zoomy -
>
>http://www.drroyspencer.com/wp-content/uploads/UAH_LT_1979_thru_Dec_09.jpg
>
>Damn wingers and their satellite data.
.6 degrees C wamer in ONLY 30 years and rapidly zooming up as greenhouse
gasses increase.
Kind of exactly as predicted.
http://www.physics.unlv.edu/~jeffery/astro/earth/atmosphere/ipcc_temp_future.jpg
Your point being?
Wingers lay eggs.
--
Cliff
Cliff
>vinny wrote:
>
>> Note to global warming conspirators
>
>
>The 15 Most Heinous Climate Villains
>By Michael Roddy and Ian Murphy, Buffalo Beast
>Posted on January 6, 2010, Printed on January 7, 2010
>http://www.alternet.org/story/144990/
>
>The science of climate change is pretty basic: humans dig up fossilized
>carbon to fuel power plants and internal combustion machines, releasing CO2
>into the atmosphere. Result: greenhouse effect global heating. Around 50%
>of all the species on the planet are predicted to become extinct by 2100 in
>the CO2-as-usual model. Our own species will face drought, famine, rising
>tides, soaring temperatures, calamity and chaos. Hundreds of millions will
>become climate refugees. Billions may die from starvation, genocide and
>war. We have precious little time to mitigate this looming global
>catastrophe.
>
>Those of us still denying the depressing facts are either tragically stupid
>or profoundly corrupt or both. If there�s anyone alive to write the history
>of corporate funded climate science denial, the following list of 15
>Heinous Climate Villains will, by the sheer magnitude of death their lies
>wrought, make the infamous dictatorial monsters of the 20th century seem
>like incompetent children. Enjoy!
>
>
>1) Don Blankenship, CEO Massey Energy
>
>Misdeeds: According to the EPA, Massey�s mountaintop removal coal operation
>is filthier than a Tiger Woods text. When a West Virginia Circuit Court
>fined the energy giant $50 million, it wasn�t a problem for Blankenship,
>because he owns the West Virginia Supreme Court. A few years earlier, he�d
>polluted the airwaves with $3 million in accusations that an incumbent
>State Supreme Court justice released sexual deviants, so that his man Brent
>Benjamin could be elected. The Massey-friendly court promptly heard the
>case and reversed the lower court�s ruling. A few months later, Blankenship
>was caught partying in Monte Carlo with two bimbos and Ted Maynard, another
>sympathetic justice. Last summer, Don held a nightmarish pro-coal rally on
>a leveled mountaintop with fellow retards Sean Hannity and Ted �Suck my
>machine gun, Obama� Nugent.
>
>Corporate teat: Massey Energy is the fourth largest coal company in the US.
>
>Most egregious lie: �The Greeniacs are taking over the world.�
>
>Comeuppance: The Greeniacs do take over the world, and use Blankenship to
>fertilize a rooftop garden.
>
>2) George Will, Columnist
>
>Misdeeds: The errors Will has committed to print over the years are both
>more numerous and irresponsible than his bow tie collection, for which he
>also feels no remorse. He claimed in a February 2009 Washington Post column
>that �According to the University of Illinois� Arctic Climate Research
>Center, global sea ice levels now equal those of 1979.� The Center
>responded: �We do not know where George Will is getting his information�
>global sea ice levels are 1.34 million sq. km less in February 2009 than in
>February 1979.�
>
>Corporate teats: The Republican Party, a catchall for corporate polluters,
>his wife, rapacious swine in general, and anyone who cites Ronald Reagan to
>justify his massive carbon footprint.
>
>Most egregious lie: �So the column accurately reported what the Center had
>reported.� Incredibly, the Post backed him up.
>
>Comeuppance: Locked in a large freezer, strapped to a chair directly under
>a ten-foot icicle and made to write a column. The room�s climate is
>controlled by a computer program, which checks his column for scientific
>veracity. The temperature goes down when Will�s right and up when he�s
>wrong. He either freezes to death or the icicle falls and splits his head
>open. It�s up to him.
>
>3) James Inhofe, Senator from Oklahoma
>
>Misdeeds: Inhofe thinks that global warming is �the greatest hoax ever
>perpetrated on mankind,� yet somehow served as the Chairman of the Senate
>Environment and Public Works Committee from �03 to �07. Once called
>Jurassic Park author Michael Crichton to testify as a key witness. Believes
>that �scientific consensus� on climate change is a conspiracy perpetrated
>by greedy scientists to score grant money. Went to Copenhagen as the
>leader of the Climate Truth Squad, earning big laughs from overseas
>reporters. Lifetime recipient of Twelve Dumbest Members of Congress award.
>
>Corporate teats: Seven figures from Exxon Mobil, Chevron, Conoco Phillips
>and anyone willing to pay for his �campaign expenses.�
>
>Most egregious lie: �You know, God�s still up there. We�re now going
>through a cooling spell.�
>
>Comeuppance: Locked in an outhouse and set on fire.
>
>4) Steve Milloy, Fake Scientist
>
>Misdeeds: Founder of the aptly named junkscience.com and featured �junk
>science expert� on Fox News, Milloy believes science favoring tobacco or
>oil companies is �sound science,� and the peer-reviewed stuff coming from
>nerds in lab coats is �junk science.� Steve holds a Bachelor of Arts and a
>law degree; you almost have to admire his chutzpah.
>
>Corporate teats: Fox News, Competitive Enterprise Institute, Phillip
>Morris, Exxon Mobil and Monsanto.
>
>Most egregious lie: �It�s time for sound science and common sense to be
>heard.�
>
>Comeuppance: Forced to smoke 100 petroleum-dipped cigarettes by his mommy.
>
>5) Fred Singer, University of Virginia
>
>Misdeeds: For the last 60 years, Singer�s pimped his PhD credentials to any
>and every industry in need of phony science. He�s slithered seamlessly from
>denying that smoking causes cancer to saying that DDT is harmless to
>�raising questions about and undercutting the �prevailing scientific
>wisdom�� of climate change. Glacier data he later attributed to his wife
>was denounced as �complete bullshit� by the Glacier Monitoring Service.
>
>Corporate teats: Exxon Mobil, Shell, Sun Oil, Competitive Enterprise
>Institute, American Petroleum Institute and the Heartland Institute.
>
>Most egregious lie: �55% of glaciers have gained mass in the last 30
>years.�
>
>Comeuppance: While addressing yet another denier conference in 2012, the
>pressure created by an undetected tumor in Singer�s brain triggers an
>anomalous episode of schizophasia, causing his entire speech to spew forth
>as an incoherent word salad. Instead of the audience stopping Singer and
>urging him to seek the immediate medical attention he so obviously needs,
>they offer him a thunderous standing ovation and an invitation to speak
>again next year.
>
>6) Myron Ebell, Competitive Enterprise Institute
>
>Misdeeds: As head of CEI, Myron admits using the money his organization
>solicited from the DDT, cigarette and coal industries to conduct
>intentionally biased research that suits their bullshit PR goals.
>
>Corporate teats: Exxon Mobil, BP, Massey, Chevron and Southern.
>
>Most egregious lie: �CO2 increases will lead to more plant growth and
>prosperity. Everyone will be more comfortable, including humans.�
>
>Comeuppance: Forced to live in a Bedouin camp in the Arabian Desert to
>prepare for a warming world. The Chieftain assigns Ebell to be the wife of
>his favorite camel. The camel defiles him, kicks in his teeth, spits in his
>face and then seeks an annulment.
>
>7) Patrick Michaels, Cato
>
>Misdeeds: As a Senior Fellow at The Cato Institute and the Chief Editor of
>World Climate Report (an industry PR rag created by the evil coal trade
>group Western Fuels Association), Michaels is often touted as a climate
>expert in the mainstream media, though he has done no scientific research
>in 20 years. He lies about the wonders of �clean coal� so that the coal
>�families� can survive � you know, if black lung hasn�t killed them
>already.
>
>Corporate teats: Cato, Western Fuels Association and the Kuwait Foundation
>for Advancement of Science.
>
>Most egregious lie: �It has been known since 1872 that as we emit more and
>more carbon dioxide into our atmosphere, each increment results in less and
>less warming.� (He apparently forgot about feedback loops.)
>
>Comeuppance: Admits on hidden camera that there is no such thing as �clean
>coal� when we secretly replace his maid�s cleaning supplies with coal;
>contracts black lung disease.
>Sallie Baliunas8) Sallie Baliunas, George C. Marshall Institute
>
>Misdeeds: As an astrophysicist and ruthless GOP housewife lookalike,
>Baliunas lends both credibility and aesthetic reassurance to the denier
>movement. Claimed in a 2003 paper that �The Medieval Warming Period was
>hotter than today.� (Actually, it�s hotter today than it�s been for 130,000
>years.) Her article in Climate Research was so riddled with errors, and so
>subverted the peer review process, the editor and half of the journal�s
>editorial board resigned. This led to celebrity status in the denier world,
>where if research is published that makes top scientists throw up, it must
>be accurate.
>
>Corporate teats: George C. Marshall Institute, Exxon, Competitive
>Enterprise Institute, American Petroleum Institute and any far right group
>that needs a convention speaker who isn�t senile and doesn�t spit while
>talking.
>
>Most egregious lie: �If scientists and researchers were coming out
>releasing reports that global warming has little to do with man, and more
>to do with just how the planet works, there wouldn�t be as much money to
>study it.�
>
>Comeuppance: Made to �Wango Tango� with Ted Nugent for life.
>
>9) Stephen McIntyre, Mathematician
>
>Misdeeds: Despite having no training or field experience in climate
>science, McIntyre runs the blog ClimateAudit.org, whose mission is to use
>arcane statistical analyses to break the �hockey stick� reconstruction of
>historical climate patterns. He recently claimed victory over the Briffa
>tree ring data controversy, but failed to note that there are at least 15
>studies that don�t need tree ring data to show the identical late 20th
>century hockey stick shape of rising temperatures and CO2 concentrations.
>
>Corporate teats: McIntyre lives in tar sands besotted Canada as a
>�semiretired minerals consultant,� and served as President of Northwest
>Exploration Co Ltd before they became CGX Energy, Inc. His funding sources
>are hidden, since the Canadian government is legally somewhere between
>Texas and Saudi Arabia, and transparency is not required.
>
>Most egregious lie: �I constructed a variation on the CRU data set,
>removing the 12 selected cores and replacing them with the 34 cores from
>the Schweingruber Yamal sample�.� The echo chamber goes wild, but neither
>they nor McIntyre himself have any idea what he�s talking about, since
>Climate Audit is all about masturbating to numbers. Even Briffa�s tree ring
>work was later vindicated by something McIntyre never considered: further
>scientific research.
>
>Comeuppance: Sent to the Maldives, given cement shoes and used to mark the
>rising tide.
>
>10) Marc Morano, Professional Douchebag
>
>Misdeeds: Morano is possibly the most embarrassing wingnut in all of
>Denierdom�a dishonor earned as an Inhofe staffer and producer for the Rush
>Limbaugh Show. Reporting for Cybercast News Service, he was the first
>source of the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth lies about John Kerry in 2004
>and John Murtha in 2006. It�s no surprise that his blog (climatedepot.com)
>is primarily a vehicle for lies, smears and character assassination aimed
>at credible climate scientists.
>
>Corporate teats: Oil and coal companies, usually laundered through think
>tanks such as Cato, CEI, etc.
>
>Most egregious lie: �We can�t afford action against climate change. It
>would damage our economy.�
>
>Comeuppance: Sent to terraform Mars�without sufficient tools, food or
>oxygen.
>
>11) Professor Roy Spencer, University of Alabama at Huntsville
>
>Misdeeds: Professor Spencer is skeptical of widely accepted Paleoclimate
>data, like the kind provided by 800,000 year old ice cores, because he
>believes God created the earth and sculpted man out of clay approximately
>6,000 years ago. Even you can do better, Alabama.
>
>Corporate teats: Heartland Institute, George C. Marshall Institute,
>Republican Party, numerous lobbying firms and NASA. (Really? This idiot
>works at NASA? We�re fucking doomed.)
>
>Most egregious lie: Spencer coauthored a roundly debunked scientific paper
>with fellow denier John Christie that �proved� the troposphere (the lowest
>part of the atmosphere) was cooling, despite satellite data to the
>contrary. Spencer apologized for the error, but the incident added to his
>legendary status among deniers.
>
>Comeuppance: The magical harp that Jesus gives him during the Rapture only
>plays �Wango Tango.�
>
>12) Richard Lindzen, MIT
>
>Misdeeds: The professor�s predilection for citing bad data to try to refute
>widely accepted climate science is a black eye for the state of
>Massachusetts and research institutes everywhere. Lindzen thinks global
>warming is basically a �political� issue, and yet has not provided
>compelling scientific evidence for his contrarian views. When not writing
>comedy for his peers or the Wall Street Journal, Lindzen plays keynote
>speaker for any loony tune denial fest that will have him. Claims that
>water vapor is the main cause of global warming.
>
>Corporate teats: Heartland Institute, Cato Institute and the Annapolis
>Center, a think tank funded by ExxonMobil.
>
>Most egregious lie: �Global warming has been merely a device for
>implementing broader agendas.�
>
>Comeuppance: Locked in a very hot sauna with a running automobile.
>
>13) Bj�rn Lomborg, Economist
>
>Misdeeds: A serial liar, whose books have spawned a cottage industry for
>scientists who debunk them, Lomborg reluctantly admits that the earth is
>getting hotter, but insists that we�ll like the warmer weather. He has
>opinions about many scientific issues, but is trained only in economics and
>game theory. His love of numbers and arguments does not extend to facts.
>
>Corporate teats: Denier conference speaking fees, book sales and Lord
>Monckton knows what else.
>
>Most egregious lie: �The Kangerlussuaq glacier is inconveniently growing.�
>(Actually, this glacier lost 55 billion tons of ice from 2000 to 2006
>alone, and loses several gigatons of ice annually.)
>
>Comeuppance: Dropped into the Sahara to do penance among climate refugees.
>Lomborg�s Danish skin can�t take the sun, so he�s buried entirely in sand,
>save for a mouth hole. Incoherent shit streams continuously from the hole,
>so the natives assume it�s a latrine.
>
>14) Roger Pielke Jr., Political Scientist
>
>Misdeeds: It�s telling that Pielke thinks his poli sci degree entitles him
>to have an opinion about all aspects of climate science. Specifically, it�s
>telling us that he thinks we�re idiots. Pielke constantly parrots
>fallacious claims about ice, ocean temperature and warming rates from
>whacked out websites like wattsupwiththat.com. Roger has been dubbed the
>Most Debunked Science Writer in the Blogosphere by Climate Progress, yet
>still appears in the media as a contrarian �expert.�
>
>Corporate teat: The Breakthrough Institute, whose founders, like Fox News,
>stress �balance.�
>
>Most egregious lie: �In the ongoing battle between climate scientists and
>skeptics, there will be disproportionate carnage, because the climate
>scientists have so much more to lose.�
>
>Comeuppance: Having been denied access to a newly-green Siberia by the
>Russian Army, vultures circle Pielke as he roams aimlessly in search of
>food and water. Hyenas, an invasive species from drought stricken Africa,
>track his every move in anticipation. Too weak to continue, he collapses.
>As the scavengers close in, Pielke finally realizes the irony of the above
>quote and cries, �I get it now!� The hyenas laugh and rip him to shreds.
>Lord Monckton15) Lord Christopher Monckton, Viscount of Brenchley
>
>Misdeeds: Admired by Glenn Beck. His Lordship�s hysterical condescension
>and anger flashes are classic examples of dangerous Royal inbreeding. Can
>be found at all the big denier fests, including Blankenship�s nightmarish
>blasted mountaintop jamboree. Habitually confabulates his autobiography and
>fabricates scientific facts. Monckton recently called a gathering of
>activists in Copenhagen �Hitler Youth.�
>
>Corporate teats: Heartland Institute, SPPI and Frontiers of Freedom�all
>recipients of oil money.
>
>Most egregious lie: �The right response to the non-problem of global
>warming is to have the courage to do nothing.�
>
>Comeuppance: Climate refugees storm his castle in 2030 and pillage
>everything but Monckton�s prized medieval pear of anguish, which he
>cleverly hides up his own ass. Unable to remove the excruciating device by
>himself, The Lord checks into the hospital. The doctors are brave enough to
>do nothing.
Cliff
>
>"sittingduck" <du...@spamherelots.com> wrote in message
>news:Xns9CF96C5DD8DC9du...@nomail.afraid.org...
>> vinny wrote:
>>
>>> Note to global warming conspirators
>>
>>
>> The 15 Most Heinous Climate Villains
>> By Michael Roddy and Ian Murphy, Buffalo Beast
>> Posted on January 6, 2010, Printed on January 7, 2010
>> http://www.alternet.org/story/144990/
>>
>>
>> Those of us still denying the depressing facts are either tragically
>> stupid
>> or profoundly corrupt or both.
>
>This is my complaint on Global warming, it's a fact, but it's a theory?
> If you disagree with the theory, your....
>
>either tragically stupid
>> or profoundly corrupt or both.
>
>"Stupid is stupid does"
> some profound retard said that.
So you keep doing it, eh?
>
> Look, I agree with the theory, but I don't agree with the cause. We are
>dumping c02 into the air, about as much in 100 years as one single volcano
>did.
A winger lie.
We produce about 100 X what all the volcanos in total do each year.
And the volcanic CO2 was part of the normal background.
> If we really cared about things and this wasnt just a power grab by some,
>and blind stupid sheep following by the rest, we would be worried about the
>real single biggest threat to humans...
See The Duck's post.
> "FERTILIZER"!
>
> Due to fertilizer we are able to extract 100 times the food we could just
>100 years ago from the Earth. The ingrediants are a finite resource and
>unless an alternative is found one day 2/3rds of the world will dye from
>hunger when we run out.
We get Ntrogen from air, right?
And it goes back into the air, right?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fertilizer
> Not to mention fertilizer runoff is the single biggest pollutant on the
>Earth, and kills enough fish every year to feed the whole earth. It's
>creating 100 square mile dead zones in the ocean. And due to it's ability to
>increase production, there are 4 billion more people than the Earth can
>support naturally.
> Global warming....pffft!
> It's horseshit! It's nothing but a power grab, money making gimmic. Add C02
>emmissions to the clean air act, problem solved...oops, that wont bring in
>1/3 of the American cash flow, and allow government to control industry, and
>make the way for global control of the rich nations over the poor ones.
>
> This crap started in the 70's. We were supposed to all be dead by now from
>oil pollution, but due to moldmaking and emerging countries we are using oil
>at a rate 100 times that of the 70's. And yet...the air is cleaner in
>America than in 100 years. Americans are living longer than ever.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/232803.stm
"Millions dead in Sudan civil war"
Etc.
> I say be a fool if you want. Walk around with your head up your ass if it
>makes you feel smart, no sweat off reality. Just stop trying to use insults
>over argument to force your view.
>
> The oceans will rise 30 feet by the year 2100.
>
>Hmmm, 10 years have gone by, 10% of the elotted time till doomsday, and the
>oceans have risen.....oh wait, THEY HAVN'T RISEN A FREAKING THOUSANDTH OF AN
>INCH!
They are up at least an inch.
--
Cliff
Cliff
>"vinny" <vi...@vp3d.net> wrote in
>news:hi5qbr$n9q$1...@news.eternal-september.org:
>
>>
>> "sittingduck" <du...@spamherelots.com> wrote in message
>> news:Xns9CF96C5DD8DC9du...@nomail.afraid.org...
>>> vinny wrote:
>>>
>>>> Note to global warming conspirators
>>>
>>>
>>> The 15 Most Heinous Climate Villains
>>> By Michael Roddy and Ian Murphy, Buffalo Beast
>>> Posted on January 6, 2010, Printed on January 7, 2010
>>> http://www.alternet.org/story/144990/
>>>
>>>
>>> Those of us still denying the depressing facts are either tragically
>>> stupid
>>> or profoundly corrupt or both.
>>
>> This is my complaint on Global warming, it's a fact, but it's a
>> theory?
>> If you disagree with the theory, your....
>
>The whole rant is deeply flawed and misrepresents actual facts. Some
>simple things, Massey Energy is a coal mining compnay, They don't burn
>the coal, hence they don't produce the CO2, so they aren't climate
>criminals. Are their mining operations clean? Who knows. The authors
>don't think so, but that would make them polluters of their immediate
>environment, not climate criminals.
>
>The George Will thing played out publicly. He used figures reported in
>Daily Tech that showed no change in sea ice extent in Dec 2008 over the
>same month in 1979 or somesuch. The article was written in February so
>the data from February was not yet available. So no maatter what the
>University of Illinois says, if you don't ask the right question you
>won't get the right answer.
>
>There is only 30 years of sea ice data available in the Arctic, less in
>the antarctic. It's a stretch to say that the last thirty years are
>abnormal or normal.
>
>And on and on.
>
>Does any credible source really believe that half the species on the
>planet will become extinct? Really? When all known data shows life
>flourishes on a warmer planet and diminshes when it gets colder.
>
>Like most rants of this type, the writers are short on enumerating
>actual factual crimes against the climate and long on invective and
>innuendo.
>
>It follows the typical bullying tactics employed by the left. While this
>following excerpt is talking about another subject (tea party movement)
>it fits with climate change -
>http://biggovernment.com/2010/01/07/the-liberal-bullying-psyche/#more-
>562
>78
>
>
>[The tea party movement seems to perpetually be in the crosshairs of the
>Left�s most insidious propaganda artists. A post on taxpayer subsidized
>NPR�s blog that�s getting some attention this week features a video by
>Mark Fiore entitled �Learn to Speak Tea Bag.� The cartoon gives mock
>step-by-step instructions on what Fiore believes is the modus operandi
>of tea party activists. Fiore unintentionally serves up a nearly
>all-inclusive package on all that is dishonest and malicious about the
>Left�s continued campaign to discredit this wildly popular grassroots
>force.
>
>Fiore�s isn�t the first and likely won�t be the last tea party hit job.
>Everyone from the President to �mainstream� media commentators have
>joined in since the movement�s inception in February 2009. This
>multifaceted attack on the tea party movement has revealed an
>interesting trend that mirrors the evolving tactics of a maladjusted,
>intellectual deficient schoolboy bully.
>
>
>Kindergarten: Don�t like what someone has to say? Call them stupid! A
>central theme of Fiore�s video is that those that make up the movement
>are uneducated. I�ve collectively seen hundreds of thousands of
>attendees at the various tea party events I�ve been to. While degrees
>aren�t required for admittance, I think it is safe to say that there are
>a few smart folks in this large, popular movement. Furthermore, how
>Fiore and others can simultaneously deride the movement as dumb yet
>high-tech GOP �Astroturf� is beyond me.
>
>While Fiore mockingly encourages viewers to �learn to speak tea bag,� he
>could use some lessons on the English language. His presumably
>self-penned biography contains a glaring redundancy: �[Fiore]�creates
>political animation from an undisclosed location somewhere in San
>Francisco.� [Emphasis added] As Michelle Malkin recently wrote, obscure
>cartoonists like Fiore aren�t the only ones trying to tally IQs. In a
>piece that reads at best as a backhanded compliment to the movement�s
>influence, David Brooks of the New York Times recently juxtaposed the
>tea party movement with�Democrats? No! He contrasted them with the
>educated class. Ah! The Left�s agenda is not only inherently
>progressive, but intellectually informed and fact based!
>
>High School: When the pesky protestors just won�t go away, make a sex
>joke and call them gay! Fiore invokes �tea bag,� a reference to
>�teabagging,� a sexual act invoked to mock the tea party movement � an
>implicitly homoerotic joke. This is a staple in the Left�s anti-tea
>party propaganda campaign lexicon. (See other slurs from Anderson
>Cooper, Rachel Maddow, and Keith Olbermann, to name a few.)
>
>College: If simple name calling just won�t work, it�s time to break out
>the big guns � something politically charged and completely unfounded
>that just sucks the air out of the room. Drop the racism card! This is
>a very common (and very effective) tactic invoked by intellectually
>frustrated leftist students, aging hippy professors, and university
>administrators on campuses across the country. Chris Matthews isn�t the
>first to invoke it, but he recently revived this move in a double whammy
>sexual/racist slur.
>
>Graduate School: When the racist card gets old, it�s time to get to
>undermine the foundation of the issue at hand. Fudge the facts! Fiore
>isn�t the only one guilty of this of course, but his video has one real
>whopper. In it, he implies that tea party activists are being dishonest
>about the health care debate because many Republicans have received
>money from health care industries. This is a great trick. For one, it
>implies a necessary link between the movement and the GOP � a fallacy.
>While the principles of the tea party movement � fiscal conservatism,
>individual responsibility, limited government � are more often than not
>going to be advanced by the Republican Party, there is no intrinsic
>link. For example, at the event I ran on tax day 2009 in Chicago,
>Michael Steele was publicly turned down as a speaker. (Not
>surprisingly, this received little press coverage and certainly wasn�t
>weighed as hard evidence of the movement�s nonpartisanship.)
>
>Nor is there a responsibility of all tea party activists to answer for
>the political contributions of a handful of Republicans. It is, of
>course, fair game to dig into the political contributions of politicians
>opposing and pushing ObamaCare. Sure, many Republicans have and will
>continue to receive money from �special interest groups� including those
>related to the health care industry.
>
>So do Democrats, though. In fact, Barack Obama received more money from
>health industry lobbyists than any presidential candidate in history.
>Not only did he receive more than his opponent John McCain, but more
>than George W. Bush in both of his campaigns combined.
>
>Does this impact President Obama�s allies� votes or closed-door
>House-Senate reconciliation for a final ObamaCare bill? How about the
>President�s policy stances? What about his decision to renege on his
>promise to televise health care debates and to instead hold closed-door
>meetings with these very same special interests in the West Wing? (For
>more �odd alliances� exposed, see my review of Tim Carney�s
>Obamanomics.)
>
>Dropout: When none of these more �cerebral� attempts work, many on the
>Left drop the attempt at any semblance of reasonable discourse and turn
>to threats. Tea party activists regularly receive threatening emails and
>phone calls. Others are at the receiving end of actual violence. Take
>Kenneth Gladney, who had racial slurs, fists, and feet hurled upon him
>by SEIU thugs at a tea party protest.
>
>While these transparent attempts to undermine this movement are
>frustrating, I encourage my tea party compatriots to take heart and
>stick to the high road. These superficial tactics and inaccurate claims
>will lose their effectiveness in the long-run. As with the bullies you
>may have encountered in the buses and hallways of your school years,
>these attacks reveal deep emotional and intellectual voids in the hearts
>and minds of those that perpetrate them. Finally, if your mere
>involvement in the political process is triggering this much vitriol
>from politicians and members of the media big and small, you�ve got to
>be doing something right]
>
>The nut jobs in this latest cut and paste from SD rant about some dumb
>opinion column George Will wrote, but they overlook Barack Obama's
>sweetheart dealings as a Senator with the coal and ethanol indutries. I
>guess it's OK to subsidize big coal and big corn just so long as you're
>a Democrat. But if you are anywhere near the right of center you are a
>climate criminal.
VFW
Cliff <Clhuprich...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote:
some ignorant people confuse Weather with Climate.
they are not too bright.
--
Hint; Enjoy the moment !
Cliff
>Cliff <Clhuprich...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
>news:vbkek51usg7j495sr...@4ax.com:
>
>> On 8 Jan 2010 04:51:45 GMT, D Murphy <dmur...@att.net> wrote:
>>
>>>Cliff <Clhuprich...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
>>>news:1k6ck5pledg4kemu7...@4ax.com:
>>>
>>>> The combined global land and ocean average surface temperature for
>>>> November 2009 was 0.60�C (1.08�F) above the 20th century average of
>>>> 12.9�C (55.2�F). This is the fourth warmest such value on record.
>>>
>>>Weather.
>>
>> But wingers claim it was cold, cold, cold ....
>
>"These fluctuations are a useful reminder that "global warming" as yet
>remains smaller than natural temperature fluctuations on regional and
>seasonal time scales." - NASA
Did you expect otherwise ????
Did you like the "as yet"?
You still have no idea what any of this is about it seems.
>
>HTH
BTW, We still have "day" & "night" too.
They will just be warmer ones, on average.
Too much warmer it looks like.
--
Cliff
leona...@gmail.com
> In article <4akek59qnjkqc36v0kfq6o9m1eemr0m...@4ax.com>,
>
> some ignorant people confuse Weather with Climate.
> they are not too bright.
• There is no confusion except in the minds of
Cliff and Georgie boy.
• All "weather" is a product of "climate"
HH&C
wrote:
Seems to make sense.
Why does weather change?
Why does climate change?
Weather is measured. How is climate measured?
Why does the USDA (and more recently J Sterling Morton) use a weather
measurements from a series of years to derive climate?
Ditto NOAA/NWS?
When calculating climate from weather records, do you go with natural
breaks, do you force the breaks, or do you use a sliding 30 year
average such as NOAA/NWS?
Cliff
>"vinny" <vi...@vp3d.net> wrote in
>news:hig8ej$ast$1...@news.eternal-september.org:
>
>>
>> This is such bullcrap.
>> This post showed NASA basically saying there is doubt. Soon cliff
>> will post
>> one where NASA says there's substantial warming.
>
>Here is why yopu haven't seen any sea rise where you live, or anywhere
>else for that matter.
>
>http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/IMAGES/global.daily.ice.area.wit
>htrend.jpg
Surface area does not indicate mass. You need the thickness too.
Plus the graphs both show clear declines even in surface area.
SAME site: http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/
[
Recent observed surface air temperature changes over the Arctic region are the
largest in the world. Winter (DJF) rates of warming exceed 4 degrees C. over
portions of the Arctic land areas (shown left). We provide Arctic temperature
trends and changes of other primary surface variables (e.g., sea level pressure,
precipitation, sea ice cover) archived in this climate summary, portions of
which are published each year in the Bulletin of the American Meteorological
Society.
Sea ice extent averaged over the Northern Hemisphere has decreased
correspondingly over the past 50 years (shown right). The largest change has
been observed in the summer months with decreases exceeding 30%. Decreases
observed in winter are more modest.
]
See charts/graphs & photos: http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/
See
http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/IMAGES/seasonal.extent.1900-2007.jpg
The GREEN line indicates that about half the summer Arctic sea ice is already
gone.
>Here is where someone noticed something didn't look right with the
>famous "Hockey Stick" chart and did a little digging -
>
>http://stephenschneider.stanford.edu/Publications/PDF_Papers/mcintyre_
>02.pdf
>
>Cliff doesn't like pdf files so he's never actually read a scientific
>paper. He gets all his info from huffpo, move-on, and other left wing
>k00k sites.
Stephen McIntyre & Ross McKitrick do NOT write actual "scientific papers".
Nor is "Energy & Environment" much of a related journal.
>The peer review process in climate "science" is broken.
Nope.
> Hopefully it
>will get fixed and people can make informed policy decisions based on
>fact rather than politics.
Like winger lies?
>And even if AGW is found to be a real problem, geoengineering would be a
>more effective and efficient way to deal with it than some corrupt Ponzi
>type tax schemes.
Where are you going to pump the excess energy?
How much coal & oil will you burn doing it?
--
Cliff
Cliff
>
>"P" <som...@microsoft.com> wrote in message
>news:hifirf$lni$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>>
>> "D Murphy" <dmur...@att.net> wrote in message
>> news:Xns9CFAC40213E0...@130.133.4.11...
>>> Cliff <Clhuprich...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
>>> news:vbkek51usg7j495sr...@4ax.com:
>>>
>>> > On 8 Jan 2010 04:51:45 GMT, D Murphy <dmur...@att.net> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >>Cliff <Clhuprich...@aoltmovetheperiodc.om> wrote in
>>> >>news:1k6ck5pledg4kemu7...@4ax.com:
>>> >>
>>> >>> The combined global land and ocean average surface temperature for
>>> >>> November 2009 was 0.60�C (1.08�F) above the 20th century average of
>>> >>> 12.9�C (55.2�F). This is the fourth warmest such value on record.
>>> >>
>>> >>Weather.
>>> >
>>> > But wingers claim it was cold, cold, cold ....
>>>
>>> "These fluctuations are a useful reminder that "global warming" as yet
>>> remains smaller than natural temperature fluctuations on regional and
>>> seasonal time scales." - NASA
>>>
>>> HTH
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Dan
>>
>> NASA! Ha, what do THEY know???
>>
>
> This is such bullcrap.
> This post showed NASA basically saying there is doubt.
That winter is colder than summer?
IOW "natural temperature fluctuations on regional and
seasonal time scales".
>Soon cliff will post
>one where NASA says there's substantial warming.
About one degree so far IIRC.
With many more to come.
> Then there's scientists like the head of NASA who says Global warming is
>global horseshit.
[
�I have no doubt that global � that a trend of global warming exists,� NASA
Administrator Michael Griffin said in a taped interview that aired Thursday on
National Public Radio. �I am not sure that it is fair to say that is a problem
we must wrestle with.�
]
"Scientists called the remarks ignorant."
"Mr. MICHAEL GRIFFIN (Administrator, NASA): I have no doubt that global - that
a trend of global warming exists"
"Jerry Mahlman, a scientist at the National Center for Atmospheric Research,
said that Griffin was either �totally clueless� or �a deep antiglobal warming
ideologue.�"
[
In a closed-door meeting on June 4, 2007 at the Jet Propulsion Laboratory,
Griffin said:
�Unfortunately, this is an issue which has become far more political than
technical, and it would have been well for me to have stayed out of it.� �All I
can really do is apologize to all you guys.... I feel badly that I caused this
amount of controversy over something like this.�
]
His was a bushco political appointment & he's now gone it seems.
>Then the head of the super doo wah dept at nASA says we
>are going to see 100 foot rise in seas by tommorrow morning.
You lie.
>Fuckit! If it's real, It's time delayed, and so big we can't stop it.
Probably only mitigate at this point.
>What
>we should do instead is figure out how to adapt to a different world, no
>different than adapting to a new job.
Florida at 119 degrees F + by 2100.
(Old record high was 109.)
> If the water rises, ok. We live on the outer edges of the world, plenty
>of places inland to migrate to.
Something like 30% of the world's population & most of the major ports ..
plus lots & lots of farmers.
> Higher tidal storm, built things like stilt houses, more jobs!!!
How did New Orleans work out?
> Polar bears....This is like the only downside, there will be less
>maneating white giant bears roaming free across the countryside, and that
>would suck.
They can change their diets & eat fat old white guys, right?
> But the solution is....EAT THE FUCKERS!!!
How Palinesque.
> When I moved to Florida, Aligators were endangered. In fact an Aligator
>over 5 feet wouldn't be allowed to live in the neiborhoods.
> Then...we got Gator Nuggets!! A bar opened up on the beach as the longest
>bar in the world. And their specialty was Gator Nuggets. Now, shit, there's
>farms full of gators, gators are everywhere, its even legal to hunt them
>once a year there's so many.
> So If we eat Polar bear Nuggets....? Problem solved.
>
>Let's do this, STOP spending our decendents money with all this friggen DEBT
That rethugs like you ran up?
>so they will be able to afford to fix what damage was done in the 20th
>century.
> In the meantime...Polar NUGGETTS!!!!
>
> I bet they would be soooooo juicy and soft.
>
>
--
Cliff