High School Chemistry and Biology
John Gilmer
school the other day.
She said that here schools offers TWO years each of Biology and Chemistry.
Moreover, there are "levels" ("tracks") in the first year programs.
It this now the "standard?"
What do college admission folks expect?
I know that when I went to engineering school even thought chemistry and
physics were expected to have been taken in HS, the instruction was also
ground zero basic. A student willing to study could easily have passed the
freshman physics and chemistry.
What's the point of beating this stuff to death in high school?
The only things I know (beyond what I read in the papers) about VA schools
is what I observed in the elementary school my girls attend.
The teach said that the second year involved a lot of memorization tasks
while the first year was general stuff.
Herman Rubin
John Gilmer <gil...@crosslink.net> wrote:
>I had a chance conversation with the chemistry teacher at our local high
>school the other day.
>She said that here schools offers TWO years each of Biology and Chemistry.
>Moreover, there are "levels" ("tracks") in the first year programs.
>It this now the "standard?"
>What do college admission folks expect?
>I know that when I went to engineering school even thought chemistry and
>physics were expected to have been taken in HS, the instruction was also
>ground zero basic. A student willing to study could easily have passed the
>freshman physics and chemistry.
>What's the point of beating this stuff to death in high school?
At one of the universities where I taught, the head of
the physics department, when visiting high schools,
advised them to take physics only for a "recreational"
course, but instead to take what was still good
mathematics. I understand the university chemistry
departments preferred that they take this in high school,
so that they would have experience in handling fragile
equipment in less dangerous circumstances.
What we need are the sound mathematical concepts, not
calculations, in elementary school, so that we can do
the science courses using the necessary language of
mathematics. There is no need to waste time by useless
repetition, and sound conceptual understanding is not
enhanced by poor approximations.
--
This address is for information only. I do not claim that these views
are those of the Statistics Department or of Purdue University.
Herman Rubin, Deptartment of Statistics, Purdue University
hru...@stat.purdue.edu Phone: (765)494-6054 FAX: (765)494-0558
John Gilmer
>
> At one of the universities where I taught, the head of
> the physics department, when visiting high schools,
> advised them to take physics only for a "recreational"
> course, but instead to take what was still good
> mathematics.
Well, since any college that even pretends to teach math and science never
assumes that the freshman knows calculus, what's the point of the kids
studying hard in high school (except to get the grades that will impress the
admissions and scholarship folks)?
> I understand the university chemistry
> departments preferred that they take this in high school,
> so that they would have experience in handling fragile
> equipment in less dangerous circumstances.
Exceot that public schools bend over backwards to make "labs" almost as risk
free (including potential risk from abuse by smart ass students). This
means that the kids just don't get the opportunity to make the "little
mistakes" that might prevent the bigger mistakes later on.
Herman Rubin
John Gilmer <gil...@crosslink.net> wrote:
>> At one of the universities where I taught, the head of
>> the physics department, when visiting high schools,
>> advised them to take physics only for a "recreational"
>> course, but instead to take what was still good
>> mathematics.
>Well, since any college that even pretends to teach math and science never
>assumes that the freshman knows calculus, what's the point of the kids
>studying hard in high school (except to get the grades that will impress the
>admissions and scholarship folks)?
At that time, calculus was not taught in high school.
The material was trigonometry and what was then a good
college algebra course. This was BC (before computers).
A good rigorous geometry and college algebra, using proofs
and emphasizing concepts, is worth far more than any
cookbook calculus course. In fact, other than being able
to grind out answers which some pocket calculators can do,
what good is learning the formulas for computing
derivatives and anti-derivatives without knowing what
these mean?
Mike
I went to high school in VA many years ago. I took two years of
chemistry,
but the second was an AP course. Since I did well enough on the AP test,
Va Tech gave me credit for chemistry.
I would worry more about the students tracked into the "lower" bio &
chem
courses. It may be that their options in college will be limited to non
technical majors. If they know and understand this fine, but that is not
the case.
Mike
John Gilmer
"Herman Rubin" <hru...@odds.stat.purdue.edu> wrote in message
news:b96b05$1m...@odds.stat.purdue.edu...
> In article <3eb63171$0$32...@dingus.crosslink.net>,
> John Gilmer <gil...@crosslink.net> wrote:
>
>
>
> >> At one of the universities where I taught, the head of
> >> the physics department, when visiting high schools,
> >> advised them to take physics only for a "recreational"
> >> course, but instead to take what was still good
> >> mathematics.
>
> >Well, since any college that even pretends to teach math and science
never
> >assumes that the freshman knows calculus, what's the point of the kids
> >studying hard in high school (except to get the grades that will impress
the
> >admissions and scholarship folks)?
>
> At that time, calculus was not taught in high school.
At what time?
Some classmates who went to school in Arlington, VA (class of 61) took
calculus in HS.
>
> The material was trigonometry and what was then a good
> college algebra course. This was BC (before computers).
>
> A good rigorous geometry and college algebra, using proofs
> and emphasizing concepts, is worth far more than any
> cookbook calculus course. In fact, other than being able
> to grind out answers which some pocket calculators can do,
> what good is learning the formulas for computing
> derivatives and anti-derivatives without knowing what
> these mean?
Why bother? It will not give the kid a leg up in college.
Mike
John,
I took AP Calculus at a Fairfax high school in 1977. I got credit for a
year of calculus at Va Tech and placed into honors second year calculus.
So, I got a leg up in college.
Today however, many high schools, under pressure from parents, rush kids
through algebra and into an AP calculus course. This can hurt them in
college as they will have a head full of calculus formulas but do not
even understand algebra.
In 6th grade I was named as the top math student is my class. But in 7th
grade
I was placed in the slower math class. I was not told I was in the
slower class. In order to take calculus in high school I took Algebra II
& Trig in summer school. So, there are problems in both directions.
You should ask to meet with school officials to learn about the
curriculum options your children will have. Course titles are not good
guides to course
content, so ask lots of questions. Overall, the education I got in
Fairfax County schools has served me well. I am currently a math
professor in the midwest.
Mike
toto
<gil...@crosslink.net> wrote:
>
>"Herman Rubin" <hru...@odds.stat.purdue.edu> wrote in message
>news:b96b05$1m...@odds.stat.purdue.edu...
>> In article <3eb63171$0$32...@dingus.crosslink.net>,
>> John Gilmer <gil...@crosslink.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> >> At one of the universities where I taught, the head of
>> >> the physics department, when visiting high schools,
>> >> advised them to take physics only for a "recreational"
>> >> course, but instead to take what was still good
>> >> mathematics.
>>
>> >Well, since any college that even pretends to teach math and science
>never
>> >assumes that the freshman knows calculus, what's the point of the kids
>> >studying hard in high school (except to get the grades that will impress
>the
>> >admissions and scholarship folks)?
>>
>> At that time, calculus was not taught in high school.
>
>At what time?
>
>Some classmates who went to school in Arlington, VA (class of 61) took
>calculus in HS.
>
Note calculus was apparently not taught in high schools
before 1951.
After AP was developed, it also took some time to spread
into the high schools around the country. It is still not given
in all schools, btw. Small rural schools are probably less likely
to have such a course, though it may be possible for bright
students to take calculus at the local community college for
both hs and college credit. My own high school did not offer
calculus in 1962, but did in 1964 after I had graduated.
I looked up the history of AP courses and found this:
1951
The Ford Foundation Fund for the Advancement of Education
sponsors two parallel studies that lead to the creation of
Advanced Placement: General Education in School and
College and the Kenyon Plan. They conclude that high school
students can and should succeed in doing college-level work,
set in motion a collaboration of schools and colleges to develop
curricula and standards for the creation of advanced placement
courses in high schools, and implement exams for assessment.
1955-1956
The College Board takes over administration of AP, with
Williams College professor Charles Keller as director, and
11 initial subject offerings: American history, biology, chemistry,
English, French, German, Latin IV (fourth-year Vergil), Latin V
(prose, comedy, lyric), mathematics, physics, and Spanish.
1957
European History is introduced as a subject.
1958
The College Board contributes to professional development
by beginning training programs for AP faculty consultants.
1960s-1970s
Professional development for AP teachers increases with
creation of summer institutes. The College Board attempts
to expand AP's reach to schools in lower-income areas with
workshops at the Hampton Institute in Virginia and televised
AP courses in New York City.
1961
James B. Conant, president of Harvard, praises AP, and key
administrators at many colleges follow suit. Increasing
numbers of colleges begin to give credit for AP Exam grades
of 3 or better.
1962
The College Board begins to win support for AP from leading
educators at state levels. New York State begins contributing
resources to the program.
1969
AP Mathematics becomes Calculus AB and Calculus BC, and
Physics is split into two separate exams: Physics B and
Physics C.
1971
The AP French Exam becomes two separate exams: French
Language and French Literature.
1972
AP Art History and AP Music Listening and Literature are
introduced.
1972
AP Art History and AP Music Listening and Literature are
introduced.
1973
The Physics C exam is split in two: Physics C -- Electricity
and Magnetism, and Physics C -- Mechanics.
1977
The AP Spanish Exam is divided into two exams: Spanish
Language and Spanish Literature.
1978
AP Music Theory is introduced, in addition to Music Listening
and Literature. Listening and Literature is dropped in 1991.
1980s-1990s
Pre-AP programs are introduced, including AP Vertical Teams
and Building Success workshops for teachers, to start students
on the path to advanced work before high school. New courses
and exams continue to be added to meet changing educational
needs, these include:
1980 Studio Art
1984 Computer Science
1987 U.S. Government and Politics and Comparative Government
and Politics
1989 The two Latin exams become known as Latin Vergil and Latin
Literature, the latter based on the works of Catullus, Ovid, Cicero,
and Horace.
1989 Macroeconomics and Microeconomics
1992 Psychology
1995 AP Calculus adds a calculator requirement.
1997 Statistics
1997 International English Language (APIEL)
1998 Environmental Science1980
1980
The AP English Exam is divided into two exams: English
Language and Composition and English Literature and
Composition; the German Exam splits into German
Language and German Literature. German Literature is
dropped in 1983.
1998
Number of AP Exams administered tops one million!
1999
Minority participation rises to 31 percent. United States
Department of Education implements AP Incentive
Program, providing exam fee subsidies to low-income
students and supporting state initiatives to expand
access to AP.
2000
More than 250 teachers of economically disadvantaged
students attend AP Summer Institutes through the College
Board's AP Fellows program.
2001
AP students receiving a grade of 3 or higher on AP Math
and Physics Exams outperform other advanced math and
physics students in both the United States and abroad,
according to an assessment conducted by TIMSS (the
Third International Mathematics and Science Study). AP
Human Geography is offered as a course and exam.
2002
World History is now offered as a course and exam.
Dorothy
--
There is no sound, no cry in all the world
that can be heard unless someone listens ..
Outer Limits
Herman Rubin
John Gilmer <gil...@crosslink.net> wrote:
>"Herman Rubin" <hru...@odds.stat.purdue.edu> wrote in message
>news:b96b05$1m...@odds.stat.purdue.edu...
>> In article <3eb63171$0$32...@dingus.crosslink.net>,
>> John Gilmer <gil...@crosslink.net> wrote:
>> >> At one of the universities where I taught, the head of
>> >> the physics department, when visiting high schools,
>> >> advised them to take physics only for a "recreational"
>> >> course, but instead to take what was still good
>> >> mathematics.
>> >Well, since any college that even pretends to teach math and science
>never
>> >assumes that the freshman knows calculus, what's the point of the kids
>> >studying hard in high school (except to get the grades that will impress
>the
>> >admissions and scholarship folks)?
>> At that time, calculus was not taught in high school.
>At what time?
>Some classmates who went to school in Arlington, VA (class of 61) took
>calculus in HS.
This was before then. Also, at that time, honest
mathematics, not dumbed down so that almost all could take
it, was still taught in most high schools, and proof
geometry was still the geometry course, as was rigorous
"algebra 2". The educationists had not yet managed to
get rid of rigor in favor of computation.
Teaching someone how to do calculus computations and
calling it learning calculus only makes it harder.
Euclid's students understood limits, even if they could
not give a formal definition. Some of those now coming
out of calculus can give a formal definition, but it is
just words.