Frugal way to unclog drains?
Wanna B Frugal
the environment even though my drains get unclogged. Is there a cheap
and environmentally sound way to unclog sink drains?
WBF
Bob Young
ordinary tap water gets damned hot, but if your's doesn't, you could
boil it on a stove.] And pour it in as fast as you can. Sometimes folks
add Clorox to it, cause what you're attemtping to do is break up grease.
Al Bundy
I assume we're talking about the kitchen or bath drains. Try not to put
grease and stuff down the drains first. A simple plunger works on most
clogs and cost about $2 for the sink size. If it's the local trap in a
floor drain you can use a hand auger that costs about $10. You won't
need any chemicals again.
Dee
news:1159701034.2...@c28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:
I pour some bleach down the drain (maybe 1-2 cups) and let it set for about
30 minutes. Then I boil some water and pour it down, and the clog is gone.
Dee
Don K
news:1159710220.7...@m7g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
A plunger works. Just remember to cover the overflow inlet near the
top of the sink so it can build up pressure to force the blockage down
the drain.
Another method is to unbend a wire hanger. Bend a little hook on the
end and fish out all the hairy gunk clogging the sink. Then use the
plunger as necessary and flush clear with running water.
A third method is to get one of those steel ribbon "snakes" that
you can force down thru the trap and rotate until the blockage
is open.
There's no need to ever use Drano or chemicals.
Don
Michael Black
Go down below, and disconnect the trap. Then you can get rid of
the junk that is trapped there. Use something to poke the pipe
going up to the drain, and poke a bit of the pipe going away from
the other side of the trap.
This will really clear things up.
If you don't want to do that easy step, there's always pouring some
baking soda down the drain, and then applying some vinegar.
Using a plunger before the problem builds up likely helps a lot.
Michael
Paul
wrote:
First, use a plunger. Unless you don't mind having the residue from
your toilet in your kitchen sink, buy a plunger for your kitchen sink
and a different one for your toilet. Mark the plungers to prevent
confusion.
Second, buy a plumber's snake. It's a device with a long metal coily
part that you run down the drain and then spin it around to grab
whatever is blocking the drain, or to push the block out of the way.
I gave-up on chemicals a long time ago because they just don't work on
many clogs. You get a toxic stew to add to your problems.
bungalo...@yahoo.com
a manually operated snake drain opener works very well on any clog, no
chemicals, I had one chronically slow drain that required ten feet of
the snake to get to the problem.
usene...@nobdy.com
<1159701034.2...@c28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
kim...@yahoo.com says...
> Just bought Drano but lately have been very conscious about polluting
> the environment even though my drains get unclogged. Is there a cheap
> and environmentally sound way to unclog sink drains?
A wire coat hanger, unbent, and then with a 2-inch hook on the
end (tight enough to get into the drain.)
Worked great on my last clog.
And, if clogs are a repeat problem, try pouring some boiling
water down each drain, once a week.
--
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http://www.pipeplug.com/df.htm
If your trap is PVC then you want to limit the pressure, as too much
pressure will blow the PVC apart, but if the clog is in the trap then
you won't need much pressure anyway.
If the clog is past the trap, then disconnect the trap from the iron
drain pipe that connects to the main sewer pipe, and put the hydraulic
device into the iron pipe.
vjp...@at.biostrategist.dot.dot.com
toilet clogs. After she died I realised how brilliant it was, when I
didn't want to have to clean the plunger, or let it drip on the way to
being cleaned.
For minor sink clogs, expired (outdated) aspirin works well. I
suppose anything acidic, like vinegar, Pepsi (if it removes paint, why
not).. and so on..
However, you should take active measures to prevent clogs.
Because everything you do will weaken your pipes somewhat.
- = -
Vasos-Peter John Panagiotopoulos II, Reagan Mozart Pindus BioStrategist
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/vjp2/vasos.htm
---{Nothing herein constitutes advice. Everything fully disclaimed.}---
[Homeland Security means private firearms not lazy obstructive guards]
[Yellary Clinton, Yellalot Spitzer & Angrew Cuomo: Nasty Together]
Vic Smith
wrote:
>Wanna B Frugal wrote:
>> Just bought Drano but lately have been very conscious about polluting
>> the environment even though my drains get unclogged. Is there a cheap
>> and environmentally sound way to unclog sink drains?
>> WBF
>
>http://www.pipeplug.com/df.htm
>
>If your trap is PVC then you want to limit the pressure, as too much
>pressure will blow the PVC apart, but if the clog is in the trap then
>you won't need much pressure anyway.
>
More likely to blow a hole in a rusted metal J-trap than affect PVC or
its joints.
Sometimes the chrome plating is all that's left.
There are also rubber J-traps that can be squeezed to clear clogs, but
I've never used one and can't recommend it. PVC is the best option
for drains IMO.
When sink and tub drains clog or slow down, I've had good luck using
the following methods. If you're a tenant don't take anything apart.
Let the landlord handle it.
1. Make sure there are no hair clogs by doing a good plunging. If you
see hair or other junk (like a toothpaste cap one of the kids managed
to get in there) use a coat hanger hook or similar to remove the
clogs. Consistent clogs usually mean a solid object is snagging hair.
You may have to disassemble the sink trap to remove it, or remove
the cap of a bathtub trap to clean that kind of trap.
2. As a drain begins to slow with no apparent solid blockage, heat the
drain a bit by running the hot water. Give a good squirt of dish
detergent down the drain and let it set a few hours. Plunge it to
break loose any matter the detergent has weakened, then run hot water
down the drain for a couple minutes. Repeat this until it works or
you feel it isn't working. This has *always* worked for me when there
wasn't a solid object stuck in the drain, or the next point didn't
apply.
3. In older drain systems grunge can build in the lines past the trap
to the point the line diameter is reduced enough to cause frequent
clogs or unacceptable drain speed. The line must be mechanically
cleaned. For sink lines some homeowners may prefer to do this
themselves by owning or renting a power auger. They cost $2-300.00.
You might also do an adequate job with a hand operated auger which
costs @ $25.00, but it is a PITA and should not be used unless your
heart is good.
Unless you're a pro yourself, hire a pro for sewer lines.
--Vic
PS
Hey Steve, thanks for the A530 camera recommendation, which I saw in a
post of yours addressing camera needs similar to mine
I know you recommend Eveready lithiums for this app, but I want to go
with rechargeables as I use them for other things.
I can pick up the Evereadys if I need them.
What's your frugal all-around AA battery/charger choice?
--Vic
Bob Young
they advise against using a plunger on tub/sink. They claim folks have
actually destroyed pipe connections using a plunger. It sometimes can
be too much pressure for older plumbing.
Logan Shaw
> My late mom (90# weakling) used to throw buckets of hot water at
> toilet clogs. After she died I realised how brilliant it was, when I
> didn't want to have to clean the plunger, or let it drip on the way to
> being cleaned.
Sometimes minor toilet clogs can be solved by using nothing other than
the toilet itself. The idea is to manually open the flapper valve and
fill the bowl all the way up to the rim with water. The pressure of
the extra few gallons of water will often push the clog through.
Sometimes it works on the first try, sometimes on the second or third,
and sometimes it doesn't work at all. But I would say it works about
half the time, and when it does, it's really easy, and there is nothing
to put away or clean afterwards.
It's important to be very careful when doing this, though, since the
flapper is designed to stay open once it opens beyond a certain point.
If you let it get into this state, you could easily overflow the toilet.
I handle that by taking the lid off the tank and manually grabbing the
chain leading to the flapper, allowing me to pull it up just a tiny
amount, say 1/4" to 1/2". You can use the regular handle on the outside
of the tank, but you have a lot less control, so I don't recommend it.
- Logan
Vic Smith
wrote:
They're giving bad advice. Even their buddy won't follow it.
--Vic
Melissa
">
> Second, buy a plumber's snake. It's a device with a long metal coily
> part that you run down the drain and then spin it around to grab
> whatever is blocking the drain, or to push the block out of the way.
>
> I gave-up on chemicals a long time ago because they just don't work on
> many clogs. You get a toxic stew to add to your problems.
A few years ago, before we replumbed the kitchen, we would get clogs in the
section of pipe that was in the basement. The first time, we tried Liquid
Plumber. When we paid a real plumber to come in and take care of it, we
were charged more because of the "toxic stew" in the pipes.
He recommended once a month putting a cup of baking soda down the sink, and
pouring in a tea kettle full of boiling water. It kept the greasy sludge
from building up.
Once we had it replumbed, the trouble stopped. For us, it was old badly done
plumbing that allowed the stuff to build up (from the garbage disposal).
Letting the water run long enough after you use the garbage disposal is one
thing you can do. Not pouring greasy stuff down the drain is another. I
still don't put certain items down the disposal, potato peels for one,
especially if I'm peeling 5 pounds of potatoes.
Melissa
Bob Young
they advise against using a plunger on tub/sink. They claim folks
have actually destroyed pipe connections using a plunger. It sometimes
can be too much pressure for older plumbing.
Vic wrote:
They're giving bad advice. Even their buddy won't follow it.
--Vic
---------------
The meaning of my comment was that I have done that in the past,
with a bath tub, but now I don't. One plumber buddy is licensed for
the city and the county and working on his master's, & grew up learning
his trade from his own dad.
His advise is based on customers, who have really made a bigger
mess and created more expense, trying to use a plunger in a bathtub.
The building I live in was built in 1940, the plumbing is old.
His advise was based on dummies who know everything and end up
calling him to repair their damage.
Don K
>
> Letting the water run long enough after you use the garbage disposal is one
> thing you can do. Not pouring greasy stuff down the drain is another. I
> still don't put certain items down the disposal, potato peels for one,
> especially if I'm peeling 5 pounds of potatoes.
That's a good attitude. A garbage disposal shouldn't be used as a
yard chipper. Just use it to chew up whatever remnants are left stuck
to your pots or plates after you scrape most of it into a plastic
bag and into the garbage can for pickup.
Don
PaPaPeng
I once helped out a friend with a blocked kitchen sink. No hot water,
lye or rotor rooter could get past 15 feet into the drain. The only
solution left was to cut the drainpipe run after the elbow in the
basement Fortunately this section was easily accessible and ran along
the basement celing before descending into a floor drainpipe. The
plan was to rotoroot it from this cut end back to the kitchen sink.
If necessary we could also rotoroot it from the cut into the floor
pipe. I wouldn't have believed it but there was a solid plug of fat
18 inches deep that we had to scrape out of the cut length. This
friends is not the first owner. The former owner must have been
pouring cooking fat down the kitchen sink.
The Real Bev
> Wanna B Frugal wrote:
>> Just bought Drano but lately have been very conscious about polluting
>> the environment even though my drains get unclogged. Is there a cheap
>> and environmentally sound way to unclog sink drains?
>> WBF
>
> http://www.pipeplug.com/df.htm
I love those things.
> If your trap is PVC then you want to limit the pressure, as too much
> pressure will blow the PVC apart, but if the clog is in the trap then
> you won't need much pressure anyway.
>
> If the clog is past the trap, then disconnect the trap from the iron
> drain pipe that connects to the main sewer pipe, and put the hydraulic
> device into the iron pipe.
BUT if the clog is on the other side of the standpipe you'll just end up
washing your roof. Don't ask me how I know this.
--
Cheers, Bev (Registered Linux User 85683)
=====================================================================
Some people have told me they don't think a fat penguin really
embodies the grace of Linux, which just tells me they have never seen
an angry penguin charging at them in excess of 100mph. They'd be a
lot mmailcareful about what they say if they had. -- Linus Torvalds
The Real Bev
> 3. In older drain systems grunge can build in the lines past the trap
BTW, we bought a sink trap made of clear plastic with a little door on
the bottom -- unsnap the door and the crud either falls out or can be
easily removed. The "clear" feature doesn't last long, though :-(
> to the point the line diameter is reduced enough to cause frequent
> clogs or unacceptable drain speed. The line must be mechanically
> cleaned. For sink lines some homeowners may prefer to do this
> themselves by owning or renting a power auger.
We had to do that. We ended up taking the business end up onto the
roof, feeding it down the standpipe, having somebody push something down
the toilet drain to make it go toward the clog rather than away from it,
and turning it on. Miraculous. Renting it was $35/day for either the
50-foot model or the 100-foot model (can't remember which we got, but it
was enough).
They make you clean it before you return it, though.
> They cost $2-300.00.
> You might also do an adequate job with a hand operated auger which
> costs @ $25.00, but it is a PITA and should not be used unless your
> heart is good.
You can get one of these with a thingy to chuck in a drill. Way better.
> Unless you're a pro yourself, hire a pro for sewer lines.
Around here you have to be licensed to actually enter the sewer line,
but I figure anything before it joins the line down the street is fair game.
--
Cheers, Bev (Registered Linux User 85683)
=====================================================================
Some people have told me they don't think a fat penguin really
embodies the grace of Linux, which just tells me they have never seen
an angry penguin charging at them in excess of 100mph. They'd be a
lot more careful about what they say if they had. -- Linus Torvalds
James
Considering the acid rain problem a little alkaline might actually help
our rivers. Pouring vinegar down the drain can't be good for the
environment.
aplay...@yahoo.com
pass the U-trap. Plumbers had been called repeatedly, but the drain is
never cleared completely and soon return to the eternally partially
clogged state.
I had the perfect solution, Easyflow, or other sulphuric acid based
liquid drain opener. But the problem is that, the extra charge for
handling international hazardous materials is US $90 !! I have tried
all those available on HK supermarket shelves - all useless. Those
Drano and everything else in US are pretty useless too, except for
sulphuric acid. I found a non-toxic non-hazardous opener called
Everfree that I can mail, but it probably won't work.
Can someone help me to find something similar so that I can order on
the web from a HK company and ship it to my parents? If you know where
it can be brought is good too. But asking them to go to some far away
industrial chemical shops to get pure sulphuric acid and the like is
probably not a good idea. These consumer openers, though concentrated
acid, are "buffered" and easy to handle. There are no flumes and the
heat is released gradually.
As for the environment, the most harmless material are bacteria mixed
drain cleaners. But since they are live, I can't mail them too without
the sky high extra charge same for hazardous materials. Sulphuric acid
is "organic" if I didn't miss read the labels. At least it's
completely biodegradable I think. So a bottle at most once in 6 month
doesn't seem to be too bad. Phosphates in detergents are also
biodegradable, but everybody uses lots of it everyday that is too many
to decompose in a lifetime.
My plumbing experience is from my kitchen sink in California. We have
the usual garbage disposal unit, and in the dishwasher is another mini
(poor) garbage disposal unit that feed to the same drain. In the first
few years that we moved in, it's trouble free. Then the problem is
recurring.
The plumber charges US $80 each time, and that's cheap. He's a retired
fireman. He often politely discourage people from doing some work that
he doesn't want to do for various reason. I doubt if he's fully
licensed and I doubt very much if he report all his income on his tax
returns.
We are careful not to pour rice and tea leaf residue into the drain.
Rinse the dishes pretty thoroughly and trap the solid residues before
putting to the dish washer. But it doesn't help. So I believe it's
the unavoidable grease build up.
Each clearance lasted for a couple of months. For that sort of money,
I have enough motivation to buy all the gadgets and chemicals that I
can get hold of and try it myself. Of course I tried the snake. The
clog got deeper and deeper into the drain every time. The last time it
must have been 25 or 50 ft ?, the full length of my snake. I can turn
the snake with my power drill. BTW, I didn't know that I have to clean
my snake and apply snake oil to it. My snakes doesn't last long, it
rust and smell badly so I had to throw it away. Every time I managed
to unclog a tiny bit of material at the tip of the snake, and the drain
will flow perfectly at least for a couple of months. So I think it's
mainly grease, and some solid material collected over long time will
clog the drain completely. It might still work, but it's too much hard
work. It's not easy to insert the snake after some length, with
probably one or two bends down under.
I had those sausage / bladder thing to put at the opening of the drain,
and let it expand with water. The pressure when the thing "explode"
unclog the drain for the 1st couple of times, and no more.
As for chemicals, I tried everything available on hardware stores and
supermarkets, often creating a dead pool of toxic sludge. The U-trap
is squeaky clean but the clog is 50 ft down under.
Rod Speed
> My parents have a bathtub in HK that is trapped with probably hair way
> pass the U-trap. Plumbers had been called repeatedly, but the drain
> is never cleared completely and soon return to the eternally partially
> clogged state.
> I had the perfect solution, Easyflow, or other sulphuric acid based
> liquid drain opener. But the problem is that, the extra charge for
> handling international hazardous materials is US $90 !! I have tried
> all those available on HK supermarket shelves - all useless. Those
> Drano and everything else in US are pretty useless too, except for
> sulphuric acid. I found a non-toxic non-hazardous opener called
> Everfree that I can mail, but it probably won't work.
> Can someone help me to find something similar so that I can
> order on the web from a HK company and ship it to my parents?
> If you know where it can be brought is good too.
It should be readily available there, since its used in car batterys.
> But asking them to go to some far away industrial chemical shops
> to get pure sulphuric acid and the like is probably not a good idea.
Conc sulphuric needs to be handled very carefully, its
quite dangerous to dilute it if you dont do it correctly.
> These consumer openers, though concentrated acid, are "buffered" and
> easy to handle. There are no flumes and the heat is released gradually.
> As for the environment, the most harmless material are bacteria
> mixed drain cleaners. But since they are live, I can't mail them too
> without the sky high extra charge same for hazardous materials.
> Sulphuric acid is "organic" if I didn't miss read the labels.
No it isnt. Nothing like 'organic'
> At least it's completely biodegradable I think.
Its certainly trivial to neutralise. I bet the HK authoritys
dont allow it to be tipped into their drains tho.
> So a bottle at most once in 6 month doesn't seem to be too bad.
Dunno, not very good for the plumbing at all.
> Phosphates in detergents are also biodegradable,
> but everybody uses lots of it everyday
> that is too many to decompose in a lifetime.
Its much more complicated than that.
> My plumbing experience is from my kitchen sink in California.
> We have the usual garbage disposal unit, and in the dishwasher
> is another mini (poor) garbage disposal unit that feed to the
> same drain. In the first few years that we moved in, it's
> trouble free. Then the problem is recurring.
> The plumber charges US $80 each time, and that's cheap.
> He's a retired fireman. He often politely discourage people
> from doing some work that he doesn't want to do for
> various reason. I doubt if he's fully licensed and I doubt
> very much if he report all his income on his tax returns.
> We are careful not to pour rice and tea leaf residue into the drain.
> Rinse the dishes pretty thoroughly and trap the solid residues before
> putting to the dish washer.
Pointless worrying about that when you have a garbage disposal unit.
That is the real problem.
> But it doesn't help. So I believe it's the unavoidable grease build up.
Its actually the garbage you put thru the garbage disposal unit.
> Each clearance lasted for a couple of months. For that sort of money,
> I have enough motivation to buy all the gadgets and chemicals that I
> can get hold of and try it myself. Of course I tried the snake. The
> clog got deeper and deeper into the drain every time. The last time
> it must have been 25 or 50 ft ?, the full length of my snake. I can
> turn the snake with my power drill. BTW, I didn't know that I have
> to clean my snake and apply snake oil to it. My snakes doesn't last
> long, it rust and smell badly so I had to throw it away. Every time
> I managed to unclog a tiny bit of material at the tip of the snake,
> and the drain will flow perfectly at least for a couple of months.
> So I think it's mainly grease, and some solid material collected over
> long time will clog the drain completely. It might still work, but
> it's too much hard work. It's not easy to insert the snake after
> some length, with probably one or two bends down under.
> I had those sausage / bladder thing to put at the opening of the
> drain, and let it expand with water. The pressure when the thing
> "explode" unclog the drain for the 1st couple of times, and no more.
> As for chemicals, I tried everything available on hardware stores
> and supermarkets, often creating a dead pool of toxic sludge.
> The U-trap is squeaky clean but the clog is 50 ft down under.
A plumber mate of mine has always favoured a winchester (4L)
of conc nitric acid poured down the drain. That does work,
but its even more dangerous to use and I wouldnt suggest
normal consumers use it, and its even harder to get.
aplay...@yahoo.com
>
> No it isnt. Nothing like 'organic'
I know it sound stupid but it's not me. If you walk down to the
nearest supermarket like Parkin, you can find organic orange juice. So
are there orange juice that isn't made of carbon based compounds?
Alien orange juice? So if I spotted the word organic on the label, I
won't be surprised if that means it or it decomposes into common
natural occurring elements.
> > At least it's completely biodegradable I think.
>
> Its certainly trivial to neutralise. I bet the HK authoritys
> dont allow it to be tipped into their drains tho.
I'll take your bet. It's not worse than the extreme akline coustic
soda power on HK supermarket shells. If it's against the regulations,
I bet you don't need to be licensed to be a plumber. Or at least you
don't need to be licensed to be a drain cleaner. What regulation? Who
cares when you can't take a decent bath for a few days? In Cali, if
you get a licensed plumber to do the job, if your drain is found to be
damaged after 10 years, you will probably sure the plumbing company,
and settle with their insurance company. All the cost add ups so it's
hard to find someone decent to come to you to clean your pipes or do
any work for less than $100. They normally have to come from 50 miles
away with affordable housing.
>
> > So a bottle at most once in 6 month doesn't seem to be too bad.
>
> Dunno, not very good for the plumbing at all.
>
Not too bad compared to other solutions. The snake is harder and
harder to get fully inside. I kept turning the snake with my power
drill. The exploding bladder/sausage obviously has high pressure. The
other chemical doesn't work. Bacteria doesn't work either at 50 ft
down. Easyflow claim to be safe for any pipes. Although it's >90%
Sulphuric acid, it doesn't look at all like concentrated acid. There's
no fumes and it doesn't seem to react with water or anything on
contact. Just leave it for 15 min for the worst clog and then rinse.
> > Phosphates in detergents are also biodegradable,
> > but everybody uses lots of it everyday
> > that is too many to decompose in a lifetime.
>
> Its much more complicated than that.
>
> > My plumbing experience is from my kitchen sink in California.
> > We have the usual garbage disposal unit, and in the dishwasher
> > is another mini (poor) garbage disposal unit that feed to the
> > same drain. In the first few years that we moved in, it's
> > trouble free. Then the problem is recurring.
>
> > The plumber charges US $80 each time, and that's cheap.
> > He's a retired fireman. He often politely discourage people
> > from doing some work that he doesn't want to do for
> > various reason. I doubt if he's fully licensed and I doubt
> > very much if he report all his income on his tax returns.
>
> > We are careful not to pour rice and tea leaf residue into the drain.
> > Rinse the dishes pretty thoroughly and trap the solid residues before
> > putting to the dish washer.
>
> Pointless worrying about that when you have a garbage disposal unit.
>
> That is the real problem.
>
> > But it doesn't help. So I believe it's the unavoidable grease build up.
>
> Its actually the garbage you put thru the garbage disposal unit.
>
At the time we were careful not to let rice and tea leaf residue into
the kitchen drain. Of course we weren't using the garbage disposal
unit. To Chinese from HK, garbage disposal seems to be a silly idea.
We rarely put things into the garbage disposal when we can put it in
the trash can. It doesn't save you any work.
If you know what Americans put into their garbage disposal
(everything), and their drain don't clog as often, you will bet that
it's grease build up. The snake head always come back with a sludge of
grease with a tiny bit of non-decomposed solid. I guess it's like
cholesterol build up in blood vessels. The build up described earlier
also support my case.
> > Each clearance lasted for a couple of months. For that sort of money,
> > I have enough motivation to buy all the gadgets and chemicals that I
> > can get hold of and try it myself. Of course I tried the snake. The
> > clog got deeper and deeper into the drain every time. The last time
> > it must have been 25 or 50 ft ?, the full length of my snake. I can
> > turn the snake with my power drill. BTW, I didn't know that I have
> > to clean my snake and apply snake oil to it. My snakes doesn't last
> > long, it rust and smell badly so I had to throw it away. Every time
> > I managed to unclog a tiny bit of material at the tip of the snake,
> > and the drain will flow perfectly at least for a couple of months.
> > So I think it's mainly grease, and some solid material collected over
> > long time will clog the drain completely. It might still work, but
> > it's too much hard work. It's not easy to insert the snake after
> > some length, with probably one or two bends down under.
>
> > I had those sausage / bladder thing to put at the opening of the
> > drain, and let it expand with water. The pressure when the thing
> > "explode" unclog the drain for the 1st couple of times, and no more.
>
> > As for chemicals, I tried everything available on hardware stores
> > and supermarkets, often creating a dead pool of toxic sludge.
> > The U-trap is squeaky clean but the clog is 50 ft down under.
>
> A plumber mate of mine has always favoured a winchester (4L)
> of conc nitric acid poured down the drain. That does work,
> but its even more dangerous to use and I wouldnt suggest
> normal consumers use it, and its even harder to get.
Still looking for suggestions. BTW, it doesn't need to be very potent.
It's just hair in the bathroom and only partially clogged, not
completely. I couldn't find any liquid drain opener in the
supermarkets. For the solid ones, they got trapped at the U-trap under
the bathtub. Everything may got totally destroyed at the U-trap, but
not any further. Whereas I can pour sufficient liquid drain opener to
fill the U-trap and then flow further down the drain.
AndyS
Andy writes:
Take out the plug or stopper and stick a garden hose in the
opening, packing around it with a wet towel so that the hose
will feed water directly into the drain.....
Tell someone to turn on the hose.... The pressure will generally
force out the stoppage and the full flow of the hose will wash
out the drain.
After letting the hose flow for about a minute, shut the water off
and you are done.....
This works very well, much better than any sort of chemicals,
and is easy to do..... You can do it with only one person if you
have a shutoff at the wet end of the hose..
Andy in Eureka, Texas
Rod Speed
>>> Sulphuric acid is "organic" if I didn't miss read the labels.
>> No it isnt. Nothing like 'organic'
> I know it sound stupid but it's not me. If you walk down to the
> nearest supermarket like Parkin, you can find organic orange juice.
> So are there orange juice that isn't made of carbon based compounds?
That isnt what 'organic' means in that context. It means that
pesticides etc havent been used in the production of the oranges
and preservatives etc havent been added to the juice etc.
> Alien orange juice? So if I spotted the word organic
> on the label, I won't be surprised if that means it or it
> decomposes into common natural occurring elements.
That last doesnt happen with sulphuric acid in the drains.
>>> At least it's completely biodegradable I think.
>> Its certainly trivial to neutralise. I bet the HK authoritys
>> dont allow it to be tipped into their drains tho.
> I'll take your bet.
You've just lost it. Essentially because it stuffs up the treatment process.
> It's not worse than the extreme akline coustic
> soda power on HK supermarket shells.
Caustic soda isnt an 'extreme' alkali, its a relatively innocuous alkali.
> If it's against the regulations, I bet you don't need to be licensed
> to be a plumber. Or at least you don't need to be licensed to be
> a drain cleaner. What regulation? Who cares when you can't take
> a decent bath for a few days? In Cali, if you get a licensed plumber
> to do the job, if your drain is found to be damaged after 10 years,
> you will probably sure the plumbing company, and settle with their
> insurance company. All the cost add ups so it's hard to find someone
> decent to come to you to clean your pipes or do any work for less
> than $100. They normally have to come from 50 miles away with
> affordable housing.
Irrelevant to what is legal.
>>> So a bottle at most once in 6 month doesn't seem to be too bad.
>> Dunno, not very good for the plumbing at all.
> Not too bad compared to other solutions.
Wrong. Particularly with the high rise that
those relatives in HK are likely to be 'living' in.
> The snake is harder and harder to get fully inside.
> I kept turning the snake with my power drill.
Irrelevant to damage to the plumbing.
> The exploding bladder/sausage
Nothing 'exploding' about it, its just one way of doing a seal.
> obviously has high pressure.
Nope, the pressure cant be greater than the water pressure.
> The other chemical doesn't work. Bacteria doesn't work either at 50 ft down.
Wrong.
> Easyflow claim to be safe for any pipes.
Claims and reality can have one hell of a chasm between them.
> Although it's >90% Sulphuric acid,
Dont believe that either. That is minimally diluted conc
sulphuric and there is no way that that would be sold
to the general public, its FAR too dangerous to dilute.
> it doesn't look at all like concentrated acid. There's no fumes
> and it doesn't seem to react with water or anything on contact.
Then it cant be >90% Sulphuric acid. It may well be dilute sulphuric tho.
> Just leave it for 15 min for the worst clog and then rinse.
>>> Phosphates in detergents are also biodegradable,
>>> but everybody uses lots of it everyday
>>> that is too many to decompose in a lifetime.
>> Its much more complicated than that.
>>> My plumbing experience is from my kitchen sink in California.
>>> We have the usual garbage disposal unit, and in the dishwasher
>>> is another mini (poor) garbage disposal unit that feed to the
>>> same drain. In the first few years that we moved in, it's
>>> trouble free. Then the problem is recurring.
>>> The plumber charges US $80 each time, and that's cheap.
>>> He's a retired fireman. He often politely discourage people
>>> from doing some work that he doesn't want to do for
>>> various reason. I doubt if he's fully licensed and I doubt
>>> very much if he report all his income on his tax returns.
>>> We are careful not to pour rice and tea leaf residue into the drain.
>>> Rinse the dishes pretty thoroughly and trap the solid residues
>>> before putting to the dish washer.
>> Pointless worrying about that when you have a garbage disposal unit.
>> That is the real problem.
>>> But it doesn't help. So I believe it's the unavoidable grease build up.
>> Its actually the garbage you put thru the garbage disposal unit.
> At the time we were careful not to let rice and tea leaf residue into the
> kitchen drain. Of course we weren't using the garbage disposal unit.
You previously said you did.
> To Chinese from HK, garbage disposal seems to be a silly idea.
To much of the rest of the world too. Its
actually illegal in much of the rest of the world.
> We rarely put things into the garbage
> disposal when we can put it in the trash can.
Bet the problem is that 'rarely'
> It doesn't save you any work.
> If you know what Americans put into their garbage disposal
> (everything), and their drain don't clog as often, you will bet
> that it's grease build up. The snake head always come back
> with a sludge of grease with a tiny bit of non-decomposed
> solid. I guess it's like cholesterol build up in blood vessels.
Nope, nothing like.
> The build up described earlier also support my case.
Nope.
> Still looking for suggestions.
If there was anything, it would be commercially available.
> BTW, it doesn't need to be very potent. It's just hair in the
> bathroom and only partially clogged, not completely. I couldn't
> find any liquid drain opener in the supermarkets. For the solid
> ones, they got trapped at the U-trap under the bathtub.
They dissolve.
> Everything may got totally destroyed at the U-trap, but not any further.
That stuff has to end up 'further' while ever there is any flow at all.
> Whereas I can pour sufficient liquid drain opener to
> fill the U-trap and then flow further down the drain.
That happens with the solid cleaners too when they dissolve.
Rod Speed
> On 16 Oct 2006 03:01:49 -0700, in misc.consumers.frugal-living
> aplay...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>>
>> If you know what Americans put into their garbage disposal
>> (everything), and their drain don't clog as often, you will bet that
>> it's grease build up. The snake head always come back with a sludge
>> of grease with a tiny bit of non-decomposed solid. I guess it's like
>> cholesterol build up in blood vessels. The build up described
>> earlier also support my case.
>
>
Doesnt help when its hair.
Jeffy3
Melissa wrote:
> ">
> Letting the water run long enough after you use the garbage disposal is one
> thing you can do.
This is a very good point. Keep the water on long enough so that
whatever was ground up in the disposal is off your property!
Gary Heston
<aplay...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>My parents have a bathtub in HK that is trapped with probably hair way
>pass the U-trap. Plumbers had been called repeatedly, but the drain is
>never cleared completely and soon return to the eternally partially
>clogged state.
>I had the perfect solution, Easyflow, or other sulphuric acid based
>liquid drain opener. [ ... ]
>As for chemicals, I tried everything available on hardware stores and
>supermarkets, often creating a dead pool of toxic sludge. The U-trap
>is squeaky clean but the clog is 50 ft down under.
You can find sulfuric acid at some battery shops or auto supply stores;
it's used in car batteries.
You might want to have them look for enzyme-based cleaners; they're not
bacterial and therefore don't run into the restrictions about "living"
products.
Gary
--
Gary Heston ghe...@hiwaay.net http://www.thebreastcancersite.com/
Astronomers have developed a definition of "planet" which excludes Pluto.
I'm developing a definition of "scientist" which excludes astronomers.
Gary Heston
AndyS <andys...@juno.com> wrote:
>Andy writes:
> Take out the plug or stopper and stick a garden hose in the
>opening, packing around it with a wet towel so that the hose
>will feed water directly into the drain.....
>
> Tell someone to turn on the hose.... The pressure will generally
>force out the stoppage and the full flow of the hose will wash
>out the drain.
[ ... ]
Or, it may force backed-up sewage out of the toilet, bathtub, or other
drains that are an easier path than going through the clog.
aplay...@yahoo.com
> You can find sulfuric acid at some battery shops or auto supply stores;
> it's used in car batteries.
Hard to convince them to do something like that. Various reasons. And
I can't trust them to use something that I haven't tried. Say for
Easyflow, it's 15 min tops and you have to rinse it.
>
> You might want to have them look for enzyme-based cleaners; they're not
> bacterial and therefore don't run into the restrictions about "living"
> products.
>
I came across some enzyme based products but never took at them in
details, as I think some contains bacteria, and the enzyme help to
break down faster. Could be chemical enzyme to help the faster
chemical break down of hair? I'll look closely if I find some. But
that sounded slow. Also drain cleaner and drain opener are very
different things.
There's the British Wiseman that is non-hazardous liquid chemical. One
is Earth soemthing that is power, which I don't trust. The U-trap
traps all the solid cleaners and most are designed to attack that area.
>
> Gary
>
aplay...@yahoo.com
thread, feeding into a HK google group. I don't know there are still
people reading usenet instead of youtube. I didn't mean to step on
some one's tail, someone who need to get a life, or more bandwidth for
video.
People don't listen to you because of your expert like tone. The Jury
will listen only if you can stand up to cross from the lawyers.
>
> >> No it isnt. Nothing like 'organic'
>
> > I know it sound stupid but it's not me. If you walk down to the
> > nearest supermarket like Parkin, you can find organic orange juice.
> > So are there orange juice that isn't made of carbon based compounds?
>
> That isnt what 'organic' means in that context. It means that
> pesticides etc havent been used in the production of the oranges
> and preservatives etc havent been added to the juice etc.
>
This discredit your man of science disguise. You cannot have it both
ways. Do you think anybody think that I don't know what organic means?
> >> Its certainly trivial to neutralise. I bet the HK authoritys
> >> dont allow it to be tipped into their drains tho.
>
> > I'll take your bet.
>
> You've just lost it. Essentially because it stuffs up the treatment process.
So are you bluffing or are you betting? If they don't allow it, they
have done poorly about educating the public. I wouldn't know as I'm
not a plumber nor I had any career involvement with sewage.
>
> > It's not worse than the extreme akline coustic
> > soda power on HK supermarket shells.
>
> Caustic soda isnt an 'extreme' alkali, its a relatively innocuous alkali.
I bet it's ph 1. Is that extreme in the ph scale?
>
> > If it's against the regulations, I bet you don't need to be licensed
> > to be a plumber. Or at least you don't need to be licensed to be
> > a drain cleaner. What regulation? Who cares when you can't take
> > a decent bath for a few days? In Cali, if you get a licensed plumber
> > to do the job, if your drain is found to be damaged after 10 years,
> > you will probably sure the plumbing company, and settle with their
> > insurance company. All the cost add ups so it's hard to find someone
> > decent to come to you to clean your pipes or do any work for less
> > than $100. They normally have to come from 50 miles away with
> > affordable housing.
>
> Irrelevant to what is legal.
I didn't want a debate about nothing. I tried to bring out my
expertise in plumbing with dramatization to make it interesting to
read, hoping for some solution to come out.
>
> >>> So a bottle at most once in 6 month doesn't seem to be too bad.
>
> >> Dunno, not very good for the plumbing at all.
It's common sense, but the bottle claim to be safe for all types of
pipes. You have to do a cost benefit analysis here. The plumber
didn't find the cause, me neither. The snake didn't drag out anything
of significant. The alternative is, as someone described, dug out the
house right now and cut out the pipes. Of course nowadays there are
drain cameras and they can send a whole team to do it. But I am not
going to pay for that.
Anyway, that's my plumbing experience, nothing to do with my parents'
problem in HK.
>
> > The snake is harder and harder to get fully inside.
> > I kept turning the snake with my power drill.
>
> Irrelevant to damage to the plumbing.
It's like I'm talking to a cockroach trapped in my kitchen drain since
birth. You haven't seen those power snakes in any hardware store here
that need a truck to bring home. That's not the point. Basically
there must be turns down there, and I don't know how the pipes are
supported down there. The first problem is getting in, the next
problem will be pulling out without pulling anything down with it.
>
> > The exploding bladder/sausage
>
> Nothing 'exploding' about it, its just one way of doing a seal.
You have no sense of humor. Your secondary school composition must be
boring.
>
> > obviously has high pressure.
>
> Nope, the pressure cant be greater than the water pressure.
>
I'm not so sure. I hope you have seen those thing or used it. Yes,
the bladder is at 60 PSI at my house. At the time of "explosion",
there is the total force around the surface of the bladder, forcing
water out in a small hole. The pressure of that water jet is high.
You do the math.
> > The other chemical doesn't work. Bacteria doesn't work either at 50 ft down.
>
> Wrong.
Again I don't know you ever use bacteria. First you have to flush the
drain with warm water. But since the drain is clogged or partially
clogged, it can hardly be done. Then you have to use warm water to
make a solution. 500 ml of warm water will be cold by the time it got
down 50 feet of cooling pipe. If you use hotter water, then you will
kill the bacteria in the first place. If your drain is completely
flowing, most of the solid in the "solution" are trapped in the U-trap.
And by the time the 500 ml of solution reached the clog, there aren't
much bacteria left. Actually, since the pipe are certainly not
straight down, I doubt if the solution will reach the clog in the first
place. You can pour a lot more solution than recommended, but the
drain isn't flowing nicely in the first place. And if the drain is
flow well, you are just pouring money down the drain. Like most drain
openers, clearing the clog at the U-trap is trivial.
>
> > Easyflow claim to be safe for any pipes.
>
> Claims and reality can have one hell of a chasm between them.
Yes, but if I get a burnt pipe, I will be rich. But sadly, it doesn't
do anything to my PVC pipes. Rather than pouring that into the sink,
there's an opening bypassing the garbage disposal and the U-trap. I
can see the reaction on the PVC surface.
>
> > Although it's >90% Sulphuric acid,
>
> Dont believe that either. That is minimally diluted conc
> sulphuric and there is no way that that would be sold
> to the general public, its FAR too dangerous to dilute.
I have seen the material safety date sheet that i need to submit with
it if I were to mail it anywhere. It's far more than 90% sulphuric
acid. There's enough material for you to prove me wrong if you care to
search the net. The label says virgin sulphuric acid with 12 buffers.
But that's not the worse. The 1st effective product that I used was
sort of pure sulphuric acid that is stained black for some safety. I
saw a 2 mm black spot in my clothes but I didn't do anything about it.
Seconds later, there's a 2mm hole there.
>
> > it doesn't look at all like concentrated acid. There's no fumes
> > and it doesn't seem to react with water or anything on contact.
>
> Then it cant be >90% Sulphuric acid. It may well be dilute sulphuric tho.
>
> > Just leave it for 15 min for the worst clog and then rinse.
>
> >>> Phosphates in detergents are also biodegradable,
> >>> but everybody uses lots of it everyday
> >>> that is too many to decompose in a lifetime.
>
> >> Its much more complicated than that.
As if you know?
>
> >>> My plumbing experience is from my kitchen sink in California.
> >>> We have the usual garbage disposal unit, and in the dishwasher
> >>> is another mini (poor) garbage disposal unit that feed to the
> >>> same drain. In the first few years that we moved in, it's
> >>> trouble free. Then the problem is recurring.
>
> >>> The plumber charges US $80 each time, and that's cheap.
> >>> He's a retired fireman. He often politely discourage people
> >>> from doing some work that he doesn't want to do for
> >>> various reason. I doubt if he's fully licensed and I doubt
> >>> very much if he report all his income on his tax returns.
>
> >>> We are careful not to pour rice and tea leaf residue into the drain.
> >>> Rinse the dishes pretty thoroughly and trap the solid residues
> >>> before putting to the dish washer.
>
> >> Pointless worrying about that when you have a garbage disposal unit.
>
> >> That is the real problem.
>
> >>> But it doesn't help. So I believe it's the unavoidable grease build up.
>
> >> Its actually the garbage you put thru the garbage disposal unit.
>
> > At the time we were careful not to let rice and tea leaf residue into the
> > kitchen drain. Of course we weren't using the garbage disposal unit.
>
> You previously said you did.
To draw or not to draw the guts whenever you draw a doll, that's the
problem talking to you. Obviously, if you use your brain to complete
the picture, rather than I have to draw every blood vessel, we use the
garbage disposal unit and dish washer machine some what like the
Americans and some what like Hong Kong people would (not a lot).
There's no trouble in the first 5+ years. Then the 1st time we call
the plumber, he cleared it but couldn't say what's the problem. He
just blame it on Chinese way of cooking and we believed him at the
time. The only things that are unusual to an American garbage disposal
unit are rice (sticky) and tea leaf (hard to decompose). Then we tried
to keep any solid from getting into the dish washer and the garbage
disposal. Of course it's not perfect, but less solid will be passing
into the drain than my mother would allow back home. But the problem
didn't go away.
>
> > To Chinese from HK, garbage disposal seems to be a silly idea.
>
> To much of the rest of the world too. Its
> actually illegal in much of the rest of the world.
>
> > We rarely put things into the garbage
> > disposal when we can put it in the trash can.
>
> Bet the problem is that 'rarely'
Your problem is mental. Everybody else in my street grew up with
garbage disposal units. I didn't. I seldom heard anybody need to call
the plumber to clear their clog once very few months. (But maybe
everybody have a secret formula to pour into their drain when the time
comes.)
>
> > It doesn't save you any work.
>
> > If you know what Americans put into their garbage disposal
> > (everything), and their drain don't clog as often, you will bet
> > that it's grease build up. The snake head always come back
> > with a sludge of grease with a tiny bit of non-decomposed
> > solid. I guess it's like cholesterol build up in blood vessels.
>
> Nope, nothing like.
>
> > The build up described earlier also support my case.
>
> Nope.
What do you know? Many drain openers have a picture or diagram on the
label showing how a dirty drain looks like. Are you a plumber?
Special in drain opening?
I doubt if your drain ever clog, and if they do, they do seem to clog
anywhere further than the U-trap.
You think you make a uniform solution with those caustic soda and then
pour it down the drain? Nope. The moment you drop those solid opener
in, they react with water and dissolve anything in their path. Since
the U-trap is very effective in trapping any solids, the vigorous
reaction almost always happen there. And if the clog is there, problem
solved. If you don't believe me, hold a beaker of water in front of
your eyes, and drop any caustic soda type solid drain opener into the
beaker. You can't get those reaction any further down the U-trap.
SoCalMike
> As for chemicals, I tried everything available on hardware stores and
> supermarkets, often creating a dead pool of toxic sludge. The U-trap
> is squeaky clean but the clog is 50 ft down under.
muriatic acid from the pool department. pour the whole gallon down, and
itll break up any organics in the pipe. flush with hot water for a long time
Rod Speed
> Well, I search the world for a solution and I stumped upon
> this usenet thread, feeding into a HK google group. I don't
> know there are still people reading usenet instead of youtube.
> I didn't mean to step on some one's tail, someone who need
> to get a life, or more bandwidth for video.
> People don't listen to you because of your expert like tone. The
> Jury will listen only if you can stand up to cross from the lawyers.
God knows what this mindless shit is about.
>>>> No it isnt. Nothing like 'organic'
>>> I know it sound stupid but it's not me. If you walk down to the
>>> nearest supermarket like Parkin, you can find organic orange juice.
>>> So are there orange juice that isn't made of carbon based compounds?
>> That isnt what 'organic' means in that context. It means that
>> pesticides etc havent been used in the production of the oranges
>> and preservatives etc havent been added to the juice etc.
> This discredit your man of science disguise. You cannot have it both ways.
> Do you think anybody think that I don't know what organic means?
You clearly dont have a clue.
>>>> Its certainly trivial to neutralise. I bet the HK authoritys
>>>> dont allow it to be tipped into their drains tho.
>>> I'll take your bet.
>> You've just lost it. Essentially because it stuffs up the treatment process.
> So are you bluffing or are you betting? If they don't allow
> it, they have done poorly about educating the public.
No surprises there. Thats just as true of most of the first world too.
> I wouldn't know as I'm not a plumber
That's always been obvious.
> nor I had any career involvement with sewage.
>>> It's not worse than the extreme akline coustic
>>> soda power on HK supermarket shells.
>> Caustic soda isnt an 'extreme' alkali, its a relatively innocuous alkali.
> I bet it's ph 1.
So stupid it cant even work out the most basic stuff with ph either.
> Is that extreme in the ph scale?
Pathetic, really.
>>> If it's against the regulations, I bet you don't need to be licensed
>>> to be a plumber. Or at least you don't need to be licensed to be
>>> a drain cleaner. What regulation? Who cares when you can't take
>>> a decent bath for a few days? In Cali, if you get a licensed plumber
>>> to do the job, if your drain is found to be damaged after 10 years,
>>> you will probably sure the plumbing company, and settle with their
>>> insurance company. All the cost add ups so it's hard to find someone
>>> decent to come to you to clean your pipes or do any work for less
>>> than $100. They normally have to come from 50 miles away with
>>> affordable housing.
>> Irrelevant to what is legal.
> I didn't want a debate about nothing. I tried
> to bring out my expertise in plumbing
You have none, zero, nada, ziltch.
> with dramatization to make it interesting to
> read, hoping for some solution to come out.
If there was some simple 'solution', you'd be able to buy it.
>>>>> So a bottle at most once in 6 month doesn't seem to be too bad.
>>>> Dunno, not very good for the plumbing at all.
> It's common sense, but the bottle claim to be safe for all types of pipes.
Then it clearly isnt sulphuric acid.
> You have to do a cost benefit analysis here. The plumber didn't find
> the cause, me neither. The snake didn't drag out anything of significant.
> The alternative is, as someone described, dug out the house right now
> and cut out the pipes. Of course nowadays there are drain cameras and
> they can send a whole team to do it. But I am not going to pay for that.
Your problem.
> Anyway, that's my plumbing experience,
> nothing to do with my parents' problem in HK.
>>> The snake is harder and harder to get fully inside.
>>> I kept turning the snake with my power drill.
>> Irrelevant to damage to the plumbing.
> It's like I'm talking to a cockroach trapped in my kitchen drain since
> birth. You haven't seen those power snakes in any hardware store
> here that need a truck to bring home. That's not the point. Basically
> there must be turns down there, and I don't know how the pipes are
> supported down there. The first problem is getting in, the next
> problem will be pulling out without pulling anything down with it.
>>> The exploding bladder/sausage
>> Nothing 'exploding' about it, its just one way of doing a seal.
> You have no sense of humor. Your secondary school composition must be boring.
You couldnt bullshit your way out of a wet paper bag.
>>> obviously has high pressure.
>> Nope, the pressure cant be greater than the water pressure.
> I'm not so sure.
More fool you, its VERY basic physics.
> I hope you have seen those thing or used it.
Dont need to on that stuff.
> Yes, the bladder is at 60 PSI at my house. At the time
> of "explosion", there is the total force around the surface
> of the bladder, forcing water out in a small hole. The
> pressure of that water jet is high. You do the math.
Thanks for that completely superfluous proof that you
have never ever had a clue about anything at all, ever.
>>> The other chemical doesn't work.
>>> Bacteria doesn't work either at 50 ft down.
>> Wrong.
> Again I don't know you ever use bacteria.
Dont need to, again, its VERY basic physics.
> First you have to flush the drain with warm water. But since the
> drain is clogged or partially clogged, it can hardly be done. Then
> you have to use warm water to make a solution. 500 ml of warm
> water will be cold by the time it got down 50 feet of cooling pipe.
Firstly, it aint 'bacteria' and secondly it doesnt have to be warm.
> If you use hotter water, then you will kill the bacteria in the first place.
Thanks for that completely superfluous proof that you
have never ever had a clue about anything at all, ever.
> If your drain is completely flowing, most of the solid in the "solution"
> are trapped in the U-trap. And by the time the 500 ml of solution
> reached the clog, there aren't much bacteria left. Actually, since
> the pipe are certainly not straight down, I doubt if the solution will
> reach the clog in the first place. You can pour a lot more solution
> than recommended, but the drain isn't flowing nicely in the first place.
> And if the drain is flow well, you are just pouring money down the drain.
> Like most drain openers, clearing the clog at the U-trap is trivial.
Thanks for that completely superfluous proof that you
have never ever had a clue about anything at all, ever.
>>> Easyflow claim to be safe for any pipes.
>> Claims and reality can have one hell of a chasm between them.
> Yes, but if I get a burnt pipe, I will be rich. But sadly, it doesn't
> do anything to my PVC pipes. Rather than pouring that into the
> sink, there's an opening bypassing the garbage disposal and
> the U-trap. I can see the reaction on the PVC surface.
>>> Although it's >90% Sulphuric acid,
>> Dont believe that either. That is minimally diluted conc
>> sulphuric and there is no way that that would be sold
>> to the general public, its FAR too dangerous to dilute.
> I have seen the material safety date sheet that i need to submit with
> it if I were to mail it anywhere. It's far more than 90% sulphuric acid.
Thanks for that completely superfluous proof that you
have never ever had a clue about anything at all, ever.
> There's enough material for you to prove me wrong if you care
> to search the net. The label says virgin sulphuric acid with 12
> buffers. But that's not the worse. The 1st effective product that
> I used was sort of pure sulphuric acid that is stained black for
> some safety. I saw a 2 mm black spot in my clothes but I didn't
> do anything about it. Seconds later, there's a 2mm hole there.
Irrelevant to whether its actually 'far more than 90% sulphuric acid'
>>> it doesn't look at all like concentrated acid. There's no fumes
>>> and it doesn't seem to react with water or anything on contact.
You've just said the exact opposite now on that last.
>> Then it cant be >90% Sulphuric acid. It may well be dilute sulphuric tho.
>>> Just leave it for 15 min for the worst clog and then rinse.
>>>>> Phosphates in detergents are also biodegradable,
>>>>> but everybody uses lots of it everyday
>>>>> that is too many to decompose in a lifetime.
>>>> Its much more complicated than that.
> As if you know?
Pathetic, really.
This is from the clown that claims that caustic soda has a ph of 1.
Or their plumbing is properly designed and can handle it.
>> Nope, nothing like.
>> Nope.
>>> Still looking for suggestions.
>> They dissolve.
Guess which pathetic little prat has just got egg all over its silly little face ?
> You think you make a uniform solution with those
> caustic soda and then pour it down the drain?
Nope.
> The moment you drop those solid opener in, they
> react with water and dissolve anything in their path.
So much for your mindlessly silly shit above.
> Since the U-trap is very effective in trapping any solids,
Not a fucking clue, as always.
> the vigorous reaction almost always happen there. And if the clog is
> there, problem solved. If you don't believe me, hold a beaker of water
> in front of your eyes, and drop any caustic soda type solid drain opener
> into the beaker. You can't get those reaction any further down the U-trap.
Not a fucking clue, as always.
roger...@yahoo.com
and have never ever ever had any luck with Drano or any other chemical.
Never. I always end up taking the drain apart or fishing a hanger or
whatever. Most clogs seem to be hair and this includes whiskers that
are shaved off, these pack up like sludge. The blockage though is
physical and requires a physical mechanism like a hanger or whatever.
If your bathtub is clogged you can undo it the way a plumber showed me
once. Take apart the doohickey that switches from tub to shower.
Stuff a wet rag in there. Fill the sink with water. This blocks,
hopefully, all the air egresses. The fill the bathtub with a few
inches of water, and plunge away. The plumber did this, took him 5
minutes, cost me about $60.
Rod Speed
> Just chiming in while the coffee makes itself. I've had
> clogged drains and have never ever ever had any luck
> with Drano or any other chemical. Never.
Yeah, me neither. Havent actually tried the conc nitric acid that the
plumber mate of mine likes, essentially because its very hard to get.
He was working at a scientific research operation at the time and
it was easy to just get a winchester of that out of the chem store.
> I always end up taking the drain apart or fishing a hanger or whatever.
Not practical here with concrete slab on the ground,
that stuff is underground with no access underneath.
> Most clogs seem to be hair and this includes whiskers
> that are shaved off, these pack up like sludge. The
> blockage though is physical and requires a physical
> mechanism like a hanger or whatever.
> If your bathtub is clogged you can undo it the way a plumber
> showed me once. Take apart the doohickey that switches
> from tub to shower. Stuff a wet rag in there. Fill the sink
> with water. This blocks, hopefully, all the air egresses.
Wanna try and explain this bit better, I cant quite work out what you mean here.
The problem as I see it is that most bathrooms should have a floor
drain as well and this approach wont block that for the 'air egresses'
aplay...@yahoo.com
I think the readily available versions of laboratory strength sulphuric
acid in the plumbing department are simpler. Just that I couldn't send
anything hazards back to HK.
aplay...@yahoo.com
Rod Speed 寫道：
> aplay...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > Well, I search the world for a solution and I stumped upon
> > this usenet thread, feeding into a HK google group. I don't
> > know there are still people reading usenet instead of youtube.
> > I didn't mean to step on some one's tail, someone who need
> > to get a life, or more bandwidth for video.
>
> > People don't listen to you because of your expert like tone. The
> > Jury will listen only if you can stand up to cross from the lawyers.
>
> God knows what this mindless shit is about.
I know, you only know about plumbing and sewage treatment.
>
> >>>> No it isnt. Nothing like 'organic'
>
> >>> I know it sound stupid but it's not me. If you walk down to the
> >>> nearest supermarket like Parkin, you can find organic orange juice.
> >>> So are there orange juice that isn't made of carbon based compounds?
>
> >> That isnt what 'organic' means in that context. It means that
> >> pesticides etc havent been used in the production of the oranges
> >> and preservatives etc havent been added to the juice etc.
>
> > This discredit your man of science disguise. You cannot have it both ways.
> > Do you think anybody think that I don't know what organic means?
>
> You clearly dont have a clue.
That is a court TV technique to discredit any expert witness or any
witness. You simply cannot pick context according to your liking -
biased. You fell for it.
>
> >>>> Its certainly trivial to neutralise. I bet the HK authoritys
> >>>> dont allow it to be tipped into their drains tho.
>
> >>> I'll take your bet.
>
> >> You've just lost it. Essentially because it stuffs up the treatment process.
>
> > So are you bluffing or are you betting? If they don't allow
> > it, they have done poorly about educating the public.
>
> No surprises there. Thats just as true of most of the first world too.
>
> > I wouldn't know as I'm not a plumber
>
> That's always been obvious.
>
> > nor I had any career involvement with sewage.
>
> >>> It's not worse than the extreme akline coustic
> >>> soda power on HK supermarket shells.
>
> >> Caustic soda isnt an 'extreme' alkali, its a relatively innocuous alkali.
>
> > I bet it's ph 1.
>
> So stupid it cant even work out the most basic stuff with ph either.
>
> > Is that extreme in the ph scale?
>
> Pathetic, really.
>
The concept is, any drain opener worth your while to put in the drain
is extreme in the ph scale 1 or 14. As for the details, I prefer to
delegate to plumbing or sewage treatment experts. Caustic soda is one
of those extremes. It's pathetic if you don't admit it for the 2nd
time.
> >>> If it's against the regulations, I bet you don't need to be licensed
> >>> to be a plumber. Or at least you don't need to be licensed to be
> >>> a drain cleaner. What regulation? Who cares when you can't take
> >>> a decent bath for a few days? In Cali, if you get a licensed plumber
> >>> to do the job, if your drain is found to be damaged after 10 years,
> >>> you will probably sure the plumbing company, and settle with their
> >>> insurance company. All the cost add ups so it's hard to find someone
> >>> decent to come to you to clean your pipes or do any work for less
> >>> than $100. They normally have to come from 50 miles away with
> >>> affordable housing.
>
> >> Irrelevant to what is legal.
>
> > I didn't want a debate about nothing. I tried
> > to bring out my expertise in plumbing
>
> You have none, zero, nada, ziltch.
Not only a cockroach trapped under my kitchen drain, as in frog under
the well, but blind folded as well. My experience is - tried all the
drain openers on the shelf of CA (California) hardware stores,
including various conc sulphuric acid that you doesn't believe existed
in consumer packages. The 50 ft snake with power drill attachment.
Exploding bladder that you haven't seen and you have not enough physics
to understand it.
>
> > with dramatization to make it interesting to
> > read, hoping for some solution to come out.
>
> If there was some simple 'solution', you'd be able to buy it.
>
> >>>>> So a bottle at most once in 6 month doesn't seem to be too bad.
>
> >>>> Dunno, not very good for the plumbing at all.
>
> > It's common sense, but the bottle claim to be safe for all types of pipes.
>
> Then it clearly isnt sulphuric acid.
I have the material safety data sheet, as I wanted to mail it:
http://www.plumbest.com/pdf-files/msds/floweasy.pdf
Moron.
If you don't know physics, then ask 12 people why blowing up a balloon
is so easy, but putting a needle inside it is so dramatic?
If you have any logic wired in your brain, why not just use the hose
instead of the bladder?
>
> >>> The other chemical doesn't work.
> >>> Bacteria doesn't work either at 50 ft down.
>
> >> Wrong.
>
> > Again I don't know you ever use bacteria.
>
> Dont need to, again, its VERY basic physics.
>
> > First you have to flush the drain with warm water. But since the
> > drain is clogged or partially clogged, it can hardly be done. Then
> > you have to use warm water to make a solution. 500 ml of warm
> > water will be cold by the time it got down 50 feet of cooling pipe.
>
> Firstly, it aint 'bacteria' and secondly it doesnt have to be warm.
>
> > If you use hotter water, then you will kill the bacteria in the first place.
>
> Thanks for that completely superfluous proof that you
> have never ever had a clue about anything at all, ever.
>
Well you if you never get out of your hole once in a while, at least
take a look at the web. This is a common brand on hardware stores in
US:
http://www.roebictechnologyinc.com/
There's two brands I'm talking about, if you care to read.
>
> >> Then it cant be >90% Sulphuric acid. It may well be dilute sulphuric tho.
>
> >>> Just leave it for 15 min for the worst clog and then rinse.
>
> >>>>> Phosphates in detergents are also biodegradable,
> >>>>> but everybody uses lots of it everyday
> >>>>> that is too many to decompose in a lifetime.
>
> >>>> Its much more complicated than that.
>
> > As if you know?
>
> Pathetic, really.
You know anything apart from subjective baseless ramblings?
>
> This is from the clown that claims that caustic soda has a ph of 1.
I think you are funnier than me when you don't admit that caustic soda
isn't extreme on the ph scale, mild you claim?
I think you need to get out of your hole more. A typical CA street in
the suburb, with house prices above the 700K level, are basically on a
development tract or something. That means tens or hundreds of houses
are basically of the same design, with several models to choose from so
they don't look the same, like a spread out horizontal building. You
can have choice of about 4 door colors, and only recently you can have
different colors of your external walls.
As always, you have no fucking clue that you need to convince people
base on FACTS.
Rod Speed
> Rod Speed wrote
>> aplay...@yahoo.com wrote
>>> Well, I search the world for a solution and I stumped upon
>>> this usenet thread, feeding into a HK google group. I don't
>>> know there are still people reading usenet instead of youtube.
>>> I didn't mean to step on some one's tail, someone who need
>>> to get a life, or more bandwidth for video.
>>> People don't listen to you because of your expert like tone. The
>>> Jury will listen only if you can stand up to cross from the lawyers.
>> God knows what this mindless shit is about.
> I know, you only know about plumbing and sewage treatment.
Pathetic, really.
Even someone as stupid as you should be able to find plenty
of my posts that are about a hell of a lot more than just that.
>>>>>> No it isnt. Nothing like 'organic'
>>>>> I know it sound stupid but it's not me. If you walk down to the
>>>>> nearest supermarket like Parkin, you can find organic orange juice.
>>>>> So are there orange juice that isn't made of carbon based compounds?
>>>> That isnt what 'organic' means in that context. It means that
>>>> pesticides etc havent been used in the production of the oranges
>>>> and preservatives etc havent been added to the juice etc.
>>> This discredit your man of science disguise. You cannot have it both ways.
>>> Do you think anybody think that I don't know what organic means?
>> You clearly dont have a clue.
> That is a court TV technique to discredit any expert witness or any witness.
You aint anything even remotely resembling anything
like a 'witness', let alone an 'expert' at anything when
you cant even manage to work out what PH alkalies have.
Or even the most basic physics either.
> You simply cannot pick context according to your liking - biased. You fell for it.
Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed fantasys, child.
>>>>>> Its certainly trivial to neutralise. I bet the HK authoritys
>>>>>> dont allow it to be tipped into their drains tho.
>>>>> I'll take your bet.
>>>> You've just lost it. Essentially because it stuffs up the
>>>> treatment process.
>>> So are you bluffing or are you betting? If they don't allow
>>> it, they have done poorly about educating the public.
>> No surprises there. Thats just as true of most of the first world too.
>>> I wouldn't know as I'm not a plumber
>> That's always been obvious.
>>> nor I had any career involvement with sewage.
>>>>> It's not worse than the extreme akline coustic
>>>>> soda power on HK supermarket shells.
>>>> Caustic soda isnt an 'extreme' alkali, its a relatively innocuous alkali.
>>> I bet it's ph 1.
>> So stupid it cant even work out the most basic stuff with ph either.
>>> Is that extreme in the ph scale?
>> Pathetic, really.
> The concept is, any drain opener worth your while
> to put in the drain is extreme in the ph scale 1 or 14.
Wrong, as always.
> As for the details, I prefer to delegate to
> plumbing or sewage treatment experts.
Just as well, you clearly dont actually have a clue.
> Caustic soda is one of those extremes. It's
> pathetic if you don't admit it for the 2nd time.
Pathetic, really.
>>>>> If it's against the regulations, I bet you don't need to be> licensed
>>>>> to be a plumber. Or at least you don't need to be licensed to be
>>>>> a drain cleaner. What regulation? Who cares when you can't take
>>>>> a decent bath for a few days? In Cali, if you get a licensed plumber
>>>>> to do the job, if your drain is found to be damaged after 10 years,
>>>>> you will probably sure the plumbing company, and settle with their
>>>>> insurance company. All the cost add ups so it's hard to find someone
>>>>> decent to come to you to clean your pipes or do any work for less
>>>>> than $100. They normally have to come from 50 miles away with
>>>>> affordable housing.
>>>> Irrelevant to what is legal.
>>> I didn't want a debate about nothing. I tried
>>> to bring out my expertise in plumbing
>> You have none, zero, nada, ziltch.
> Not only a cockroach trapped under my kitchen drain,
> as in frog under the well, but blind folded as well.
Never ever could bullshit its way out of a wet paper bag.
> My experience is - tried all the drain openers
> on the shelf of CA (California) hardware stores,
Well whoopy fucking do. You'll have to
pardon us if we dont actually swoon, child.
> including various conc sulphuric acid that
> you doesn't believe existed in consumer packages.
Conc sulphuric, >90% certainly doesnt.
> The 50 ft snake with power drill attachment.
Well whoopy fucking do. You'll have to
pardon us if we dont actually swoon, child.
> Exploding bladder
No such animal, child.
> that you haven't seen
Guess, which pathetic little pig ignorant prat has
just got egg all over its pathetic little face, yet again ?
> and you have not enough physics to understand it.
Never ever could bullshit its way out of a wet paper bag.
>>> with dramatization to make it interesting to
>>> read, hoping for some solution to come out.
>> If there was some simple 'solution', you'd be able to buy it.
>>>>>>> So a bottle at most once in 6 month doesn't seem to be too bad.
>>>>>> Dunno, not very good for the plumbing at all.
>>> It's common sense, but the bottle claim to be safe for all types of pipes.
>> Then it clearly isnt sulphuric acid.
> I have the material safety data sheet, as I wanted to mail it:
> http://www.plumbest.com/pdf-files/msds/floweasy.pdf
Doesnt say its >90% conc sulphuric acid, you pathetic excuse for a bullshit artist.
> Moron.
Fuckwit.
>> Your problem.
>>>>> The exploding bladder/sausage
>>>>> obviously has high pressure.
I do thank, since before you were even born too, child.
> then ask 12 people why blowing up a balloon is so
> easy, but putting a needle inside it is so dramatic?
Irrelevant to that stupid pig ignorant claim of yours.
> If you have any logic wired in your brain, why
> not just use the hose instead of the bladder?
The bladder is there to stop the water coming back
up the pipe you put the hose into, fuckwit child.
>>>>> The other chemical doesn't work.
>>>>> Bacteria doesn't work either at 50 ft down.
>>>> Wrong.
>>> Again I don't know you ever use bacteria.
>> Dont need to, again, its VERY basic physics.
>>
>>> First you have to flush the drain with warm water. But since the
>>> drain is clogged or partially clogged, it can hardly be done. Then
>>> you have to use warm water to make a solution. 500 ml of warm
>>> water will be cold by the time it got down 50 feet of cooling pipe.
>> Firstly, it aint 'bacteria' and secondly it doesnt have to be warm.
>>> If you use hotter water, then you will kill the bacteria in the first place.
>> Thanks for that completely superfluous proof that you
>> have never ever had a clue about anything at all, ever.
> Well you if you never get out of your hole once in a while, at least take
> a look at the web. This is a common brand on hardware stores in US:
> http://www.roebictechnologyinc.com/
Doesnt say anything like that pig ignorant shit of yours above. That
is WASTE TREATMENT, nothing like drain cleaning, fuckwit child.
Pity they aint actually >90% conc sulphuric acid.
>>>> Then it cant be >90% Sulphuric acid. It may well be dilute sulphuric tho.
>>>>> Just leave it for 15 min for the worst clog and then rinse.
>>>>>>> Phosphates in detergents are also biodegradable,
>>>>>>> but everybody uses lots of it everyday
>>>>>>> that is too many to decompose in a lifetime.
>>>>>> Its much more complicated than that.
>>> As if you know?
>> Pathetic, really.
> You know anything apart from subjective baseless ramblings?
Never ever could bullshit its way out of a wet paper bag.
Not a shred of evidence that you are actually capable of thought, child.
> A typical CA street in the suburb, with house prices above the
> 700K level, are basically on a development tract or something.
> That means tens or hundreds of houses are basically of the
> same design, with several models to choose from so they
> don't look the same, like a spread out horizontal building.
> You can have choice of about 4 door colors, and only
> recently you can have different colors of your external walls.
Irrelevant to whether the waste plumbing has been properly designed, child.
>>>> Nope, nothing like.
>>>> Nope.
>>>>> Still looking for suggestions.
>>>> They dissolve.
>> Nope.
You wouldnt know what a FACT was it if bit you on your lard arse, child.
So stupid that you arent even capable of checking what the PH of caustic soda is.
quietguy
part shop or auto elect and buy it there
David
Logan Shaw
> Wanna B Frugal wrote:
>> Just bought Drano but lately have been very conscious about polluting
>> the environment even though my drains get unclogged. Is there a cheap
>> and environmentally sound way to unclog sink drains?
>> WBF
> Andy writes:
> Take out the plug or stopper and stick a garden hose in the
> opening, packing around it with a wet towel so that the hose
> will feed water directly into the drain.....
>
> Tell someone to turn on the hose.... The pressure will generally
> force out the stoppage and the full flow of the hose will wash
> out the drain.
There's a special gizmo just for this called the Drain King:
http://www.gtwaterproducts.com/drain.html
The thing came out sometime in maybe the late 1970's or early 1980's.
I don't know exactly how it works mechanically, but when you attach
it to the garden hose and turn on the water, the thing expands until
it fills up the opening and the rubber on the outside makes a pretty
good seal. That is, provided you use with a drain (or pipe) that
is the right general size and shape.
- Logan
Logan Shaw
> roger...@yahoo.com wrote:
>> If your bathtub is clogged you can undo it the way a plumber
>> showed me once. Take apart the doohickey that switches
>> from tub to shower. Stuff a wet rag in there. Fill the sink
>> with water. This blocks, hopefully, all the air egresses.
>
> Wanna try and explain this bit better, I cant quite work out what you mean here.
>
> The problem as I see it is that most bathrooms should have a floor
> drain as well and this approach wont block that for the 'air egresses'
In the US, virtually no bathrooms (in residences) have floor drains.
If you do have one, I suppose you could seal it up somehow. One
possible way would be to use a second plunger on it.
What I don't get is how filling the bathroom sink with water blocks
all the possible routes for air. Virtually every bathroom sink I've
seen anywhere (in a residence in the US) has an "emergency drain"
that wouldn't be blocked by filling the sink with water. Indeed,
it's designed to prevent you from being able to fill the sink with
water all the way to the top.
- Logan
Rod Speed
>>> If your bathtub is clogged you can undo it the way a plumber
>>> showed me once. Take apart the doohickey that switches
>>> from tub to shower. Stuff a wet rag in there. Fill the sink
>>> with water. This blocks, hopefully, all the air egresses.
>> Wanna try and explain this bit better, I cant quite work out what
>> you mean here.
>> The problem as I see it is that most bathrooms should have a floor
>> drain as well and this approach wont block that for the 'air egresses'
> In the US, virtually no bathrooms (in residences) have floor drains.
Weird.
> If you do have one, I suppose you could seal it up somehow.
That isnt as easy to do as it looks. That drain king thing would be fine.
> One possible way would be to use a second plunger on it.
Dunno, you'd have to have someone holding it and it isnt that
practical since most are recessed with tiles around them so you
wouldnt necessarily get a decent seal with the joints in the tile etc.
> What I don't get is how filling the bathroom sink with water blocks
> all the possible routes for air. Virtually every bathroom sink I've
> seen anywhere (in a residence in the US) has an "emergency drain"
> that wouldn't be blocked by filling the sink with water. Indeed,
> it's designed to prevent you from being able to fill the sink with
> water all the way to the top.
We dont see that much here, presumably because we have floor drains.
Pretty sure they are a legal requirement here.
aplay...@yahoo.com
will look like a moron. Several factors are at play here. Few big
manufacturers dominating the distribution chain. When you have a shop,
you need to sell something that worth the shop space. Insufficient
skilled labor who knows how to top up with distilled water. Deadly
expensive skilled labor - you better top yourself up with whiskey and
buy a maintenance free sealed one. So if when they tell you your OEM
unsealed battery is dead, you have to accept it's stone dead, and you
have to let them put one of their own into your car. It's their own
interest not to have the ability to service unsealed battery. Nobody
uses unsealed batteries anyway.
Similar situation in HK. Much more expensive shop space. Nobody wants
to be a mechanic, and you won't trust your car to cheap cowboys. Car
is possibly cheapest in USA. And the space to put your car in HK can
buy a decent house in many countries. I couldn't imagine their
reaction if you go into a car maintenance specialist shop asking for
sulphuric acid?
Although some drain openers are > 90% sulphuric acid, there are some
important differences. They have some buffers so that they are not
fuming in the bottle. The reaction rate and heat release rate are
somewhat controlled to be slower or buffered. One product is dyed
black and much more oil like than acid, to minimize the danger of
splashing. I don't know how many and how long to use it. And there's
no point to sue myself if anything goes wrong.
I won't trust the acid to my parents, who's motors and sensors are not
as good as before.
The number one enemy to healthy seniors is slipping. You have to be
careful going out for dinner with whole family, to some favorite
restaurants. Going to unfamiliar places, doing unfamiliar things is
hazardous.
Once you survive for that long, you tend to have you own way of doing
things and looking at things, that is really hard to change. If I send
them something delivered to the door, and just pour it down the drain,
they might try it. What can I do when several plumbers can't? I know
it's worth a try because I saw what chemical the plumbers left behind.
If you are a frog living under the well, you don't know the sky is so
big outside. They won't know the numbers of drain openers available on
US shelves is 10 times.
That reminded me of Rod who doesn't believe there's Organic Drain
Opener on sale that is neither carbon compound, nor wholesome food, nor
bacteria cultures. Who doesn't believe virgin sulphuric acid, 90% by
weight, is widely available on US hardware stores, which are as many as
supermarkets.
quietguy 寫道：
aplay...@yahoo.com
available everywhere in every down in USA that can afford to pour a few
dollars into the drain. It's a legal requirement for the documents if
it ever need to be transported.
http://www.plumbest.com/pdf-files/msds/floweasy.pdf
Check the content of the sulphuric acid inside. It's not >90% as I
wrote, it's the exact figure that is larger than 90%. Why can't you
believe that we can buy almost pure sulphuric acid on hardware store
shelves? This keeps down the incidents that people using their assault
riffles to blow up their clogged kitchen drains.
Caustic soda is extreme alkaline in the ph scale, why don't you test it
yourself?
Drain kings, that you haven't seen, uses high pressure, relative to the
normal atmosphere pressure of drain pipes. Pipes can do better than
that but the joints may not, depending on the cowboy who joined the
pipes.
Organic is a well defined scientific word, but recently hijacked by
some fruitcakes to promote food. You can't take two contradictory
definitions seriously. If you have to, I got one better for you - the
all chemical organic drain opener:
http://www.plumbersurplus.com/ProductDetail.aspx?Prod=12350&Cat=6
Have a nice drink, cheers moron.
Rod Speed
> That's the data sheet of just one of the sulphuric based drain
> opener available everywhere in every down in USA that can
> afford to pour a few dollars into the drain. It's a legal
> requirement for the documents if it ever need to be transported.
> http://www.plumbest.com/pdf-files/msds/floweasy.pdf
> Check the content of the sulphuric acid inside. It's not >90% as I wrote,
> it's the exact figure that is larger than 90%. Why can't you believe that
> we can buy almost pure sulphuric acid on hardware store shelves?
Because I realise the dangers involved in diluting conc sulphuric, even if you dont.
And I dont believe that its legal to tip conc sulphuric down the drain in the US either.
> This keeps down the incidents that people using their
> assault riffles to blow up their clogged kitchen drains.
Never ever could bullshit its way out of a wet paper bag.
> Caustic soda is extreme alkaline in the ph scale,
Duh.
> why don't you test it yourself?
Dont need to to know it aint gotta PH of 1, fuckwit child.
> Drain kings, that you haven't seen,
Guess which pathetic little pig ignorant prat has just
got egg all ever its pathetic little face, as always ?
> uses high pressure, relative to the normal
> atmosphere pressure of drain pipes.
Nothing like your original howler, child.
> Pipes can do better than that but the joints may not,
> depending on the cowboy who joined the pipes.
> Organic is a well defined scientific word, but recently
> hijacked by some fruitcakes to promote food.
Conc sulphuric acid has never been, and never will be, 'organic', fuckwit child.
> If you have to, I got one better for you - the all chemical organic drain opener:
> http://www.plumbersurplus.com/ProductDetail.aspx?Prod=12350&Cat=6
Easy to claim its 'organic', fuckwit child.
The Real Bev
They come in several sizes. They also pulse, which adds to the
unclogging ability. Provided, of course, that the clog is on THIS side
of the standpipe...
--
Cheers,
Bev
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
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