Our $500 1969 van Canadian adventure
OhioGuy
responding mentioning off topic comments about another posting I made over a
month ago, regarding whether I should rent a vehicle or buy an old van when
I flew out to Bellingham, Washington.
Just to satisfy people's curiosity, I suppose I should just give you guys
the information you would like.
To refresh your memory, we got those $40 round trip tickets from Columbus,
Ohio to Bellingham, Washington, through Skybus. Originally I had just
assumed we would be renting a car, but when I saw how much the hotels were
up across Canada, I found myself wishing we could camp more. (many places
across Canada, the cheapest hotels are $90 to $100 a night. This is because
they depend a lot on tourist dollars, and tourists are mostly going up there
for just 3-4 months a year) We then considered tent camping, but found that
it was going to be getting down in the low to mid 40's at night, and could
often be rainy where we would be.
So, we settled on a van. Renting a van for the 23 days would have cost us
just over $2,000. However, I found one through Craigslist for $500, which
we would own when we got done with the trip. My wife had been wanting a
second backup vehicle for some time, saying that we needed more room once in
a while. (we have two toddlers), and our main vehicle is an increasingly
small seeming 1996 Buick Century. Lots of folks online told me the trip
would be nothing but a nightmare, and cautioned me against buying the van,
saying renting was the only safe way to go. I hate to rent, and we could
really use the van after the trip, so we bought outright instead.
The trip on the plane went great, and the stewardesses didn't bother us
much at all, unlike what some people claimed would happen. For the most
part, I was left in peace to read my book. The plane wasn't crowded. We
didn't pay for the priority boarding, but since we had toddlers, we got on
early enough that both of our toddlers got window seats, and great views out
the window.
Anyway, when we arrived in Bellingham, we went to our hotel, and the guy
who had advertised the van on Craigslist showed up when he said he would,
with the van. I checked it out in a parking lot, and since it started and
drove well, I gave him the $500 for it.
The van came only with the driver and passenger front seat, so I added
another seat for $80 so that there would be no questions when we went into
Canada. (regarding seatbelts, etc.) I emailed our insurance folks, and had
the van added on to our insurance. Since this was our second vehicle, it
actually somehow caused our rates to decrease on our first vehicle as well.
Now we have coverage on both vehicles for only about 50% more than we were
paying before on just the car. I didn't expect that. Since the van is
equipped for camping, though, and we would mostly use it that way, we may
only drive and insure it during the summers. We haven't made up our minds
on that part yet.
Let's see - we got the van licensed and registered, and title transferred
in Washington, as well as current license plate stickers attached for about
$150. They are good through July of 2008.
Then we started driving. I decided to have the brakes looked at just to
see if they were worn too much to be safe. The guy adjusted the parts,
putting some back properly that hadn't been installed right. He also
regreased the wheel bearings, all for about $70. He said all the brakes had
more than 50% life left on them.
Something happened to the accelerator cable near a fishery we were
visiting, so we had to have it towed to the closest Ford dealership with 24
hour repair bays. The tow would have cost us $200, but we had GM Motor Club
coverage ($39 a year - was a Christmas present from my parents), so it
didn't cost a cent.
The Ford folks found out that it was a very minor problem, which took them
all of a couple of hours to fix. Evidently someone had tried to mess with
the accelerator cable on their own, and had left a piece of wire that poked
out too far and got stuck. I had also noticed that the emergency brake
cable was loose, and they fixed that so that they worked well. Total cost
was $60.
After that, I decided to have the battery changed, which was $70. When I
saw part of the steel belt sticking out on the right front tire, and that
the right side of the right front tire was balding, I got new front tires
for $200. Oh, and I also got an oil change and filter at Wal-Mart, plus new
windshield wipers for about $25. I left the back tires on because they
still had a lot of tread, and looked good.
Oh, I almost forgot - there was also a point during the trip when it
became very difficult to get the van into first gear. (it is a manual
transmission) I squired WD-40 on the shifter (under the front hood) as a
short term fix, but later noticed a grease zerk. I went to a service
station, where they squirted grease in there until we saw it coming out.
That fixed the problem, so now it shifts easily again. Total cost for that
was $10 I spotted them for fixing the trouble.
So, my grand total expense thus far for the 1969 Ford Econoline van is
about $1,170. That's about 55% of what renting a van would have cost for
just 3 weeks. Plus, I could now turn around easily and get my money back
out of it if I wanted to. I think instead I'll end up retrofitting it into
even more of a camper van - perfect for us to take on weekend trips to the
state parks within 3 hours or so drive of here.
We also camped in it for about half of the nights of our trip, staying
with relatives some of the other nights, and hotels the rest. I'd estimate
that we saved $1,200 by camping in the van, rather than staying at hotels
all the time. Up in Canada, they actually encourage you to stay at roadside
rests for free! There are signs up at many of them saying you can camp
overnight for 8 hours for free, so we did that for absolutely no cost
several times. Oh, since the van also had cupboards, which we stocked, we
also probably saved another $500 by not eating out all that much.
The van itself is in good shape, with about 135,000 miles on it. A Sears
Auto tech, after examining it while they changed the battery, said that the
engine "purred like a kitten", and that he wouldn't be surprised at all if
it gave us another 100,000 miles of driving. He said that he had seen a
number of these that had gone more than 300,000 miles with regular
maintenance - which is what it will be getting from me from now on.
Despite all the naysaying, we had a good trip. Some of the highlights:
visited Mt. St. Helens - got some pumice
camped at La Wis Wis state forest campground
in lower Washington State - where some of the trees were wider at the base
than our van
went through Jasper National Park in British Columbia,
where we went on a boat trip on Maligne Lake. We got to see the famous
scene of Spirit Island that is often featured on nature calendars,
postcards, etc. (and which was the wallpaper on one side of my room growing
up)
went as far North through Saskatchewan and into Manitoba as Flin Flon, which
is up as far as Alaska. The nights were less than 7 hours long, with the
Western horizon ever so slowly darkening for nearly 2 hours after the
sunset.
finally got to visit North Dakota, which means that now I've been to every
State West of the Mississippi.
Worst moment of the trip - coming back across the border, and having to wait
for 45 minutes while they checked everything out. Especially the part when
officers came out putting on those rubber gloves, making you wonder if a
body cavity search was next! I think we have too many of those homeland
security folks up there at our Northern border - because I don't hear a lot
about illegal aliens sneaking across from Canada. (perhaps we should move
half of them down to the Mexico border?)
Total we spent for 23 days of fun and exploration was about $2,800,
including airfair out West, the van, fuel, food, maintenance and occasional
hotel rooms. By doing it that way, we spent money we had, rather than
building up debts on our credit card that we would have had to pay on for
months.
Could we have done it for less? Sure, but it really made the trip seem a
lot nicer to eat out once in a while, and to stop at a hotel room every 3 or
4 nights.
Of course, it would have been quite easy to spend a lot more on the trip.
If we had stayed at hotels every night, and eaten out most meals, those two
expenses could have easily been $2,600 by themselves. (remember, Canadian
hotels most areas start out at $100 a night, and those are the cheap ones)
Anybody else have any summer vacation stories to share?
Rod Speed
Chloe
> Strangely enough, every post I have made on here lately has had people
> responding mentioning off topic comments about another posting I made over
> a month ago, regarding whether I should rent a vehicle or buy an old van
> when I flew out to Bellingham, Washington.
>
> Just to satisfy people's curiosity, I suppose I should just give you guys
> the information you would like.
>those two expenses could have easily been $2,600 by themselves. (remember,
>Canadian hotels most areas start out at $100 a night, and those are the
>cheap ones)
I was one of the major naysayers on the idea of buying the van. It sounds
like it worked out very well for you. I'm glad you had a good trip.
Anthony Matonak
> Strangely enough, every post I have made on here lately has had people
> responding mentioning off topic comments about another posting I made over a
> month ago, regarding whether I should rent a vehicle or buy an old van when
> I flew out to Bellingham, Washington.
If I might summarize...
$730 Van, Seat and license.
$ 70 Putting the brakes back together that hadn't been installed right.
$ 60 Towed and fixed sticking accelerator and loose emergency brake.
$270 New battery and replace bald front tires.
$ 10 Grease so it'll shift into first gear.
A $500 van that wound up costing $1140 and that only had to be towed
once and repaired four times with the minor risks of bad brakes, bald
tires and a sticking accelerator.
I wonder if you would be quite so happy if those bald tires, improperly
installed brakes or sticking accelerator had caused you to crash. How
large would the injuries to you or your loved ones have to be to wipe
out the satisfaction of saving a couple of thousand dollars?
Do you even count the value of your vacation time spent messing around
with this vehicle? Say you work 50 weeks a year for 2 weeks vacation.
You would have to work nearly a month for every day of vacation.
In short, you took a risk and feel you came out ahead. This isn't so
much frugality as gambling. It could just as easily have gone the other
way.
Anthony
Rod Speed
> On Aug 17, 2:32 pm, Anthony Matonak
> He also could have stayed home and had an F-16 crash into his house.
> Sounds to me like he had a super cool road trip.
And even the minor pauses to fix the problems is really
no big deal and provides a bit of a break in the trip.
Melinda Meahan - take out TRASH to reply
>
> And even the minor pauses to fix the problems is really
> no big deal and provides a bit of a break in the trip.
EEK!!!! when I was a child, we had a number of vacations in a lemon
where we had to spend time getting the car fixed. To me it would not be
worth it, but I suppose to each their own.
--
Every job is a self-portrait of the person who does it. Autograph your
work with excellence.
timeOday
> OhioGuy wrote:
>
>> Strangely enough, every post I have made on here lately has had
>> people responding mentioning off topic comments about another posting
>> I made over a month ago, regarding whether I should rent a vehicle or
>> buy an old van when I flew out to Bellingham, Washington.
>
>
> If I might summarize...
> $730 Van, Seat and license.
> $ 70 Putting the brakes back together that hadn't been installed right.
> $ 60 Towed and fixed sticking accelerator and loose emergency brake.
> $270 New battery and replace bald front tires.
> $ 10 Grease so it'll shift into first gear.
>
> A $500 van that wound up costing $1140 and that only had to be towed
> once and repaired four times with the minor risks of bad brakes, bald
> tires and a sticking accelerator.
>
It's definitely a "glass half full"-type situation. But since OhioGuy
clearly bargain hunts for sport, it was worth it for him. Good, I say.
Anthony Matonak
> Anthony Matonak wrote:
>> OhioGuy wrote:
>>
>>> Strangely enough, every post I have made on here lately has had
>>> people responding mentioning off topic comments about another posting
>>> I made over a month ago, regarding whether I should rent a vehicle or
>>> buy an old van when I flew out to Bellingham, Washington.
>>
>> once and repaired four times with the minor risks of bad brakes, bald
>> tires and a sticking accelerator.
>
> It's definitely a "glass half full"-type situation. But since OhioGuy
> clearly bargain hunts for sport, it was worth it for him. Good, I say.
I've got nothing against folks gambling, taking risks or bargain
hunting. Many folks feel a vacation isn't worth it if they haven't
faced down death at least once.
I just wanted to point out that his $500 van cost much more than $500
and that his savings came at the cost of time out of his vacation and
higher risk. It's just hard to put a dollar figure on waiting around
for the tow truck, stopping to get new tires or that special feeling
when your accelerator sticks or brakes don't quite work.
I put this in the same category as people who drive with their infant
on their lap or after one too many drinks. They take the gamble and
almost all the time they win.
Anthony
simon
Different gamble tho when the worst result is some time wasted.
PaPaPeng
<antho...@nothing.like.socal.rr.com> wrote:
>In short, you took a risk and feel you came out ahead. This isn't so
>much frugality as gambling. It could just as easily have gone the other
>way.
If the troubles during the first week of ownership started to pile it
would have been easy enough to dump the van and write off under $1000.
I think they came off with a great vacation. The only thing I would
add would be to advise anyone doing the same thing, ie. camp at
roadside reststops and a hotel evenry three to four days travel, is to
get your showers at the town swimming pool. A swim is before the
shower is great for stretching tired muscles and to get rid of road
grime.
OhioGuy
>with this vehicle?
Not really - most of that was up front, during the first 6 days of the
trip. We are talking about a 23 day vacation here, not just a shorter week
trip. I had already allowed for several days staying in hotels up front,
since I figured that there would be at least SOME things that would need
some work, while we were still close to civilization. I knew that once we
started driving in earnest, we would no longer be by the big cities, and
would be on our own a lot more. Better to get the glitches worked out, and
potential problems taken care of up front. Besides, it gave us an excuse to
stay in some nicer hotels while still in the USA (Washington), where the
hotels were available for half the prices they would have cost later in
Canada.
So, my wife and kids didn't mind at all, since it meant sleeping in more
comfortable hotel with pool those days, and getting better night's sleep. I
guess there's an upside to everything - even auto repair!
Joe
www.yunx.com - See the trip link at the very top... Just got back about 2
weeks ago...
Joe in Northern, NJ - V#8013-R
Currently Riding The "Mother Ship"
http://yunx.com/valk.htm
Ride a motorcycle in or near NJ?
http://tinyurl.com/5apkg
Zuke
> timeOday wrote:
>> Anthony Matonak wrote:
>>> OhioGuy wrote:
>>>
>>>> Strangely enough, every post I have made on here lately has had people
>>>> responding mentioning off topic comments about another posting I made
>>>> over a month ago, regarding whether I should rent a vehicle or buy an old
>>>> van when I flew out to Bellingham, Washington.
>>>
>>> A $500 van that wound up costing $1140 and that only had to be towed
>>> once and repaired four times with the minor risks of bad brakes, bald
>>> tires and a sticking accelerator.
>>
>> It's definitely a "glass half full"-type situation. But since OhioGuy
>> clearly bargain hunts for sport, it was worth it for him. Good, I say.
>
> I've got nothing against folks gambling, taking risks or bargain
> hunting. Many folks feel a vacation isn't worth it if they haven't
> faced down death at least once.
>
> I just wanted to point out that his $500 van cost much more than $500
> and that his savings came at the cost of time out of his vacation and
> higher risk. It's just hard to put a dollar figure on waiting around
> for the tow truck, stopping to get new tires or that special feeling
> when your accelerator sticks or brakes don't quite work.
I got stuck with my young children on a busy highway once. A piece
came off a tanker truck and hit our car. Fortunately my wife was
able to get control of the car and pull off to the left median.
So we are stuck on a busy highway with cars buzzing by us at 70mph.
And our car was stuck right after a short bend. I thought one place
we don't want to be is in front of the car. Then I took the older
child, probable six and my wife took the younger one, about 2. I told
my wife, once we get a break in the traffic we have to get across
this expressway. Once when I was about twelve, me and two of my
knucklehead friends on a dare ran across a highway. I was shocked
at that time how fast cars moving 70mph can get up on you.
Fortunately in this case we were able to make it across and into
the relative safety of the berm. Then the cops showed up 10 or 15
minutes later and everything worked out ok. We were even able to
idenfity the truck that had lost the stanchion that had hit our car.
Zuke
This sounds like the roadtrip in the movie "Little Miss Sunshine". Congrats
on having a good time and saving money. Your kids probably learned a little
something about life too. I don't think you exhibited any irresponsibility.
You tried to cut your risks as much as possible. Enjoy the camping
at the state parks also.
James
I was a naysayer too. I've bought used cars that did not work out that
well, even though they had been thoroughly inspected.
Congrats on your good luck.
As for "Canadian Hotels" thats like saying US hotels. Its a huge
generalization. Of course you are going to find that the touristy
areas have higher prices and seasonally adjusted rates - I just stayed
in Santa Barbara, California last week - same story, But if you look
you can find hotels acoss Canada for much less than your quoted rates,
even in high season. I went last year to rent a cottage in PEI and had
to stop at a motel along the way - $59. for a room with two twins -
nothing fancy but clean. Super 8 advertise their rates around Toronto
- $69. Hotels.com and expedia are good choices for Canada. Last year a
friend of mine came from Ireland and got a downtown "mid luxury"
Toronto hotel within walking distance of the financial and theatre
districts for $125 a night by going on line and watching for specials.
She could have gotten a lower end but clean for well undre a hundred,
or stayed farther out for $69.
I can imagine it might be low to mid 40s in Flin Flon at nigth , but
not many other places in Canada.
My unfrugal vacation:
Flew to LA area to see the inlaws. They been to see us twice in
Toronto, driving both times. My wife isn't well and we thought flying
would be better than driving. They provided a place to stay, and
offered to fund some of the kids attractions.
We flew out of Buffalo airport, for the first time - much cheaper
flights, cheaper long term parking and no need for passports(yet).
$1700 US for 5 of us to fly round trip to LA - via Atlanta both
times.
First hassle was parking - parked in long term followed the
instructions went to a booth and hit a button - and watched 7 shuttles
pass us by -not coming close to us. We then trundled ourselves to
another booth (wife in walker) and finally on our way. The flashing
light in the first booth was broken. We could have been there all day.
Homeland security sure has stepped up since I last flew in the US
(about a year ago). Don't assume you know the process anymore.
We didn't need a rent a car, as my Father in law's mother doesn't
drive but has a 12 year old minivan in great shape. I did pay for gas,
which is about 3/4 of the Canadian price.
Joshua Tree National Park - beautiful desert. Not expensive. Bring
your own water and lots of it. Bring your camera. Suprisingly its true
what they say here - its not the heat its the humidity. In the <1%
humidity, the hot desert air didn't feel so bad. Stopped on the way
back at Hadley's and had a Date Milkshare - share one, they are really
thick and yummy.
Disney. FIL paid close to $300 for admission of 5. It was fun, if you
don't mind crowds. No discounts for single day passes. We didn't pack
our own food, Just had lunch - about $40 for 5 of us - not bad food
either actually - pasta. I'm sure there were more expensive places
there to eat. Kids enjoyed it, lines were too much for FIL. Souvenirs
not terribly priced, but you can find some of the Tshirts at the local
CVS for much less :)
Santa Barbara - left the kids with the in laws and took my wife to
Santa Barbara. Beyond the smog of LA, cooler. Shopped online for
hotels - they are expensive there - found a modest one for $150 that
was still a walk to the beach. Could have saved a lot by staying 10
miles out of town. Took a catamaran tour of the harbour and used the
coupon they gave us for dinner - not bad at all actually. Main courses
from $16 - $30 so a $10 coupon was good. Tour of the local mission -
good and inexpensive. Took the local scenic drive tour - free.
Santa Monica pier - on the way back from Santa Barbara took the PCH
through Malibu and stopped at Santa Monica Pier. Parking was $7.00 for
all day. No admittance fee to pier. Had lunch at Mexican place at end
of pier - pretty good and not expensive.
Raging waters - huge water park had a special - buy one day pass and
get another free - I took the kids the second day. Still had to pay
for parking ($9) and lockers ($11 for a tiny one, $5 refunded when you
return the key). Kids had a lot of fun.
Watts towers - look it up on internet - art pieces in the middle of
watts - no where to legally park though - and not the nicest
neighbourhood but I've seen worse.
Pinks - hot dog stand to the stars - loved their chili cheese and
bacon dog - $4.30 - long lines at lunch time though. (laBrea)
Few general comments.
Supermarket pricing - similar - more lost leaders, and california
produce is cheaper in CA than Ontario produce is in Ontario.
Wine - much cheaper in US.
Restaurant meals - bout the same.
Cars (from the ads) much cheaper in US.
Gas - cheaper, as I said 3/4.
Its true you do pretty much need a car in LA - everything is far,
transit is non existent, and parking is $$ and hard to find.
Oh and my discount airline serves pretzels and mangled all my luggage
- tore the handles off and ripped it.
James
The Real Bev
> So, my wife and kids didn't mind at all, since it meant sleeping in more
> comfortable hotel with pool those days, and getting better night's sleep. I
> guess there's an upside to everything - even auto repair!
What brand? Dodge?
--
Cheers,
Bev
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
"History I believe furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people
maintaining a free civil government."
-- letter from Thomas Jefferson to Baron vonHumboldt, 1813
OhioGuy
>many other places in Canada
You might be surprised how much of a difference elevation, not latitude,
can make on nightly temperatures. When we were roughly one mile high in the
rockies (down near the Canadian-US border), it was cooler at night than when
we were as far North as Alaska, up in Flin Flon.
It makes me wish that the Appalachian mountains were taller - then we
could retreat to cooler temps in the summer without having to drive very
far, here in Ohio.
OhioGuy
1969 Ford Econoline van. I'm not saying Fords are made better or anything -
just that perhaps autos were simpler back then. My Dad says that the trucks
and vans tended to last longer. Often, around here anyway, the trucks from
that era would last until they got all rusted through in the floorpan and
sides.
New Leaf
The mountains make a big difference even if you aren't in the midst of
them. Our vacation home is at sea level but surrounded by mountains.
Even on days where it is over 90 F, the nights are cool. We have a
small a/c unit and rarely need to use it.
Viv