new provider and newsgroups
johngood_____
sign up with. But they tell me that they do not provide access to Newsgroup
via Outlook Express.
Since I want to regularly access Newsgroups and don't want the inconvenience
of accessing Newsgroups through Google; is there a reasonably priced and
easy way for me to get to the Newsgroups using this new provider please. I
phoned up the technical line and they said to use RSS feeds, I did a search
on this but it doesn't seem to me to connect in any way with Newsgroups as
far as I can see. Thanks for any advice.
Bob Eager
wrote:
Frankly, if this new provider thinks RSS feeds are a viable alternative,
I wouldn't use them!
--
[ 7'ism - a condition by which the sufferer experiences an inability
to give concise answers, express reasoned argument or opinion.
Usually accompanied by silly noises and gestures - incurable, early
euthanasia recommended. ]
Graham.
"johngood_____" <vo...@voidacious.net> wrote in message
news:SrIOj.93844$5i5....@newsfe6-gui.ntli.net...
I have been very satisfied with the free one I am using.
http://news.motzarella.org/RegisterNewsAccount.php
<hint>
They do however impose a limit on the number of groups
a you can x-post to, so it might not be ideal for you .
<\hint>
--
Graham
%Profound_observation%
John
> johngood_____ wrote
> on Sun, 20 Apr 2008 14:30:10 GMT in message
> <SrIOj.93844$5i5....@newsfe6-gui.ntli.net>:
>
> Free:
>
> news.motzarella.org
>
> news.albasani.net
>
> Are two and have been reliable all the time I've used them.
>
> Then there's news.individual.net for ¤10 (Ten Euro) per year. When I
> used them in the past, they were reliable.
>
> For binaries, afraid someone else will have to answer there.
Hey, Welcome - can you please explain your sig in a bit more detail? I live
in Preston and I'm on BT Internet (or whatever they're calling themselves
this week) but a neighbour four doors down is on Virgin cable, so I'm
curious now.
John
Bruce Hagen
news:SrIOj.93844$5i5....@newsfe6-gui.ntli.net...
Free and Public Usenet News Servers:
http://freenews.maxbaud.net/
Find a news server at:
http://www.newzbot.com/
--
Bruce Hagen
MS-MVP
George
> In looking around for another ISP, I've found one that I think that I might
> sign up with. But they tell me that they do not provide access to Newsgroup
> via Outlook Express.
Newsgroups is not a profitable business for ISP's. It's better to
access NG directly using a good NG reader like Thunderbird or whatever
or even browsing Google Groups.
Barb
>
> For text only:
>
> Free:
>
> news.motzarella.org
>
> news.albasani.net
>
> Are two and have been reliable all the time I've used them.
>
> Then there's news.individual.net for ¤10 (Ten Euro) per year. When I used
> them in the past, they were reliable.
>
> For binaries, afraid someone else will have to answer there.
I concur - I'm on Sky, which doesn't have any usenet access, and I'm now
using motzarella with OE, which works fine for text. I subscribe to
EasyNews for binaries - been with them for years, cheap and reliable.
Barb UK
Bob Eager
What do you mean 'directly'? You still need to find a server...
johannes
johngood_____ wrote:
>
> In looking around for another ISP, I've found one that I think that I might
> sign up with. But they tell me that they do not provide access to Newsgroup
> via Outlook Express.
Although there are loads of different e-mail clients, many of them free and
Outlook Express is not everybody's cuppa, OE is fairly standard and commonly
used. Sounds to me like some misunderstanding of what the ISP has told you.
I can't see why they should object to Outlook Express in particular. Here,
I'm using Netscape Messenger.
Eeyore
johngood_____ wrote:
> In looking around for another ISP, I've found one that I think that I might
> sign up with. But they tell me that they do not provide access to Newsgroup
> via Outlook Express.
Well there's nothing special about how Outlook Express reads nntp so that
suggests to me they don't know what they're talking about.
An ISP having a news server is NO reason for choosing one anyway when a $10
one-off purchase for 25GB from astranews may last you years.
Graham
Eeyore
johannes wrote:
> I'm using Netscape Messenger.
An excellent choice IMHO. So do I . The user interface is simple, uncluttered and
it all works.
Graham
George
> What do you mean 'directly'? You still need to find a server...
Many years ago ISP's used newsgroups servers as a repository within the
Usenet system. Individual users read from and post messages to a local
server operated by their ISP. The servers then exchanged the messages
between other servers, so that they were available to readers beyond the
original server. Most ISP's do not run those servers anymore, so you
must access newsgroups servers directly using whatever client you wish.
George Weston
"George" <nos...@please.com> wrote in message
news:eyCpp4vo...@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
Very many still do.
BT, Plusnet - to name but two.
George
SteveH
Care to expain what the hell it is you're wibbling on about? - 'cos it
looks like complete nonsense to me.
--
SteveH 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - Hongdou GY200 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 TSpark - B6 Passat 2.0TDI SE - COSOC KOTL
BOTAFOT #87 - BOTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #
larry
> <hint>
> They do however impose a limit on the number of groups
> a you can x-post to, so it might not be ideal for you .
> <\hint>
What? this is a bad thing? like the OP on 5 groups?
xposter=spammer
Thanks for the Sunday morning funny...
-- larry/dallas
John
> John wrote
> on Sun, 20 Apr 2008 15:59:12 +0100 in message
> <EtKdnRMcb6eox5bV...@bt.com>:
>
> Virgin Media Technical Support - Karl Rio wrote
> on Mon, 14 Apr 2008 12:59:39 GMT in message
> <%yIMj.7737$yD2....@text.news.virginmedia.com>:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I know there have been many queries regarding STM (Traffic
>> Management), and below is the official statement regarding changes
>> to the STM policy.
>>
>> If you have any questions or comments, please can I ask that you
>> post these in the Feedback group (virginmedia.feedback) to keep the
>> support groups clear for the team to respond to service affecting
>> issues. This has been cross-posted to feedback.
>>
>> Thankyou.
>>
>> STM Statement:
>>
>> · As part of our continued efforts to improve our customer's
>> broadband experience we are continuing to trial measures which will
>> more efficiently and pro-actively manage network traffic.
>>
>> · As part of our continued efforts to improve our customer's
>> broadband experience, we are making changes to the current Traffic
>> Management Policy within certain trial regions.
>>
>> · This updated policy will be trialed within the following
>> regions Preston, Wigan, Blackpool, Camden, Dalston, Enfield and
>> Haringey.
>>
>> · These measures are based on policies that detect traffic
>> patterns that are deemed potentially abnormal and apply traffic
>> management rules to ensure that other customers are not adversely
>> affected by this traffic.
>>
>> · The trial aims to prevent or reduce the effects of a
>> minority of users abusing the network and preventing the majority of
>> subscribers from having the network performance they desire.
>>
>> · For the vast majority of customers, upwards of 95% of the
>> base, their experience will be a more consistent speed (both upload
>> and download).
>>
>> · Those who have the policies applied to their connection will
>> experience their download / upload speed being constrained (less
>> than 5% affected). Breach of acceptable use policy may lead to these
>> policies being applied.
>>
>> · These optimisation policies are being trialed during the
>> following times where the potential for abnormal traffic has been
>> identified as having the greatest adverse impact on our customers'
>> experience.
>>
>> 10am - 3pm Download only
>> 4pm - 9pm Download
>> 3pm - 8pm Upload
>>
>>
>> During these times the following thresholds will be applied for
>> upstream and downstream.
>>
>> 10am - 3pm Download
>> Size M: 900Mb
>> Size L: 2400Mb
>> Size XL: 6000Mb
>>
>> 4pm - 9pm Download
>> Size M: 450Mb
>> Size L:1200Mb
>> Size XL: 3000Mb
>>
>> 3pm - 8pm Upload
>> Size M: 200Mb
>> Size L: 700Mb
>> Size XL: 1400Mb
>
> If you hit these limits your broadband connection will be throttled
> at the speeds of that of which the STM applies for users in other
> areas.
>
> http://abcde.co.uk/virginmedia/stm.html
>
> 2Mbit users get throttled for 5 hours down to 1Mbit
> 4Mbit users get throttled for 5 hours down to 1Mbit
> 10Mbit users get throttled for 5 hours down to 2.5Mbit
> 20Mbit users get throttled for 5 hours down to 5Mbit.
>
> The standard hours where VM check for the amount you download or
> upload are 16:00 - 21:00 this means you can get hit once per 24 hours
> with slow speeds for 5 hours.
>
> In the areas mentioned above the hours they check for the amount you
> download or upload are 10:00 - 21:00 so you could get hit a couple of
> times with slow speeds for 5 hours a time.
Thanks for that, Welcome - very interesting.
John.
Kenny
Signed up with Madasafish and happy with them so far. I have an "up to
8meg" speed and a 20Gb monthly allowance for Ł17.99. That's split 10Gb news
and 10Gb internet.
For downloading binaries you'll need something other than OE. I'm using
Newsbin Pro but there aoters like Forte Agent.
--
Kenny Cargill
"johannes" <jo...@sizef4467866445itter.com> wrote in message
news:480B5D94...@sizef4467866445itter.com...
johannes
Yes, and Netscape Messenger has build-in spell checker. OE only gives you
spell checker if you have MS Office installed. Netscape Messenger has a more
transparent file organisation which makes it easier to archive and retrieve
messages from file backup.
johannes
Kenny wrote:
>
> I dropped Wanadoo some time ago because they dropped their newsserver.
> Signed up with Madasafish and happy with them so far. I have an "up to
> 8meg" speed and a 20Gb monthly allowance for Ł17.99. That's split 10Gb news
> and 10Gb internet.
> For downloading binaries you'll need something other than OE. I'm using
> Newsbin Pro but there aoters like Forte Agent.
Madasafish was my first ISP many years ago (dial-up). It was OK for a while,
but when sour when they installed new user accounts software which was unable
to recognise my old account; just incompetent system upgrade. So I went to
Surfanytime, name sounds good, but they got stroppy about users taken the
name at face value! Surfanytime didn't mean surf anytime. So on I went to
Tesco broadband with 1Mb. But Tesco lied to me when they told me that I
could not upgrade to 2Mb because of my local exchange. I jumped ship to
ADSL24 which gave me 8Mb (same local exchange) and huge download allowance.
So far so good.
mcheu
<vo...@voidacious.net> wrote:
>In looking around for another ISP, I've found one that I think that I might
>sign up with. But they tell me that they do not provide access to Newsgroup
>via Outlook Express.
Does this mean that they don't provide NNTP access or that they just
don't support Outlook Express? If they do provide NNTP groups
access, then you can set up Outlook yourself. You just need for them
to give you the address for the NNTP/Usenet server. Just don't expect
them to answer any support questions about it.
>
>Since I want to regularly access Newsgroups and don't want the inconvenience
>of accessing Newsgroups through Google; is there a reasonably priced and
>easy way for me to get to the Newsgroups using this new provider please. I
>phoned up the technical line and they said to use RSS feeds, I did a search
>on this but it doesn't seem to me to connect in any way with Newsgroups as
>far as I can see. Thanks for any advice.
If your chosen ISP doesn't provide an NNTP feed, the cheapest option
other than finding another ISP might be a Teranews 'free' account --
they charge a 3.95 setup fee, so it's not totally free anymore and
it's limited to 50megs of transfer a day. So long as you don't read
a lot of groups or hit the binary groups, that should be ok, but keep
an eye on it, as they want users to pay for overages. They charge a
monthly fee for their premium accounts, which allow more transfer, and
probably have better retention.
Giganews is another option for a paid NNTP server.
http://www.giganews.com
The big advantage to going with an outside paid NNTP feed is that they
tend to be more complete, with longer retention periods and faster
download speeds. The NNTP servers offered by ISPs tend to be
throttled (ie. slower) and have shorter retention periods to disuade
people from using the binary groups. However, in the long run, if
those aren't issues for you, finding another ISP that includes an NNTP
feed in the subscription service is going to be a lot cheaper.
Bob Eager
I'm perfectly aware of how it works; I was using newsgroups in 1982.
It didn't sound as if you did; you implied direct access to the
newsgroup, as if it lived in one place. That's all.
John
> I dropped Wanadoo some time ago because they dropped their newsserver.
> Signed up with Madasafish and happy with them so far. I have an "up
> to 8meg" speed and a 20Gb monthly allowance for Ł17.99. That's split
> 10Gb news and 10Gb internet.
> For downloading binaries you'll need something other than OE. I'm
> using Newsbin Pro but there aoters like Forte Agent.
>
>
> news:480B5D94...@sizef4467866445itter.com...
>>
>>
>> johngood_____ wrote:
>>>
>>> In looking around for another ISP, I've found one that I think that
>>> I might
>>> sign up with. But they tell me that they do not provide access to
>>> Newsgroup
>>> via Outlook Express.
>>
>> Although there are loads of different e-mail clients, many of them
>> free and
>> Outlook Express is not everybody's cuppa, OE is fairly standard and
>> commonly
>> used. Sounds to me like some misunderstanding of what the ISP has
>> told you.
>> I can't see why they should object to Outlook Express in particular.
>> Here, I'm using Netscape Messenger.
OE downloads binaries alright.
John
thanatoid
news:SrIOj.93844$5i5....@newsfe6-gui.ntli.net:
Frankly, I wasn't sure if you weren't having us all on, since
the statement above is so full of confusion and misinformation
that I thought you were a troll.
All Internet Surveillance Providers used to offer Usenet access
as part of the basic package, MANY MOONS ago. As a smaller and
smaller /percentage/ of internet users access the Usenet, many
have dropped that service and others will continue to do so.
Those that still provide it do a lousy job with limited groups,
low retention, and no service.
ANY computer with a newsreader program can access ANY Usenet
server in the world, it's just like visiting a web site
anywhere. I use www.usenetrocket.com which has a 6GB/$7.50 (for
TEN years) pay-as-you-go plan. Whenever you need more, you buy
more. If you don't access their server for three months, it
costs you nothing. Retention is 2-3 months plus depending on
groups, more than enough for anyone IMO.
If you are not interested in binaries, you just might be able to
get 10 years of Usenet for $7.50. The service is second to none
since it's a small operation by a person who cares about his
customers. Try getting ANY service from some of the "big"
premium providers.
Xnews is an excellent though slightly complicated free
newsreader. GrabIt is a less excellent but super-simple free
newsreader - it's more of a binary grabber than a post-oriented
program, but you CAN post with it, and needless to say, read
text as well.
--
Of course, it is no easy matter to be polite; in so far, I mean,
as it requires us to show great respect for everybody, whereas
most people deserve none at all; and again in so far as it
demands that we should feign the most lively interest in people,
when we must be very glad that we have nothing to do with them.
- Arthur Schopenhauer
Ken Blake, MVP
<vo...@voidacious.net> wrote:
> In looking around for another ISP, I've found one that I think that I might
> sign up with. But they tell me that they do not provide access to Newsgroup
> via Outlook Express.
It's not really that they don't provide access "via Outlook Express."
It's rather that they don't provide a news server. so you can't access
*their* news server at all, whether via Outlook Express or any other
newsreader.
> Since I want to regularly access Newsgroups and don't want the inconvenience
> of accessing Newsgroups through Google; is there a reasonably priced and
> easy way for me to get to the Newsgroups using this new provider please. I
> phoned up the technical line and they said to use RSS feeds, I did a search
> on this but it doesn't seem to me to connect in any way with Newsgroups as
> far as I can see. Thanks for any advice.
If you want to use these Microsoft newsgroups, the best way to get to
them is via Microsoft's news server, msnews.microsoft.com. You can use
that with Outlook Express (or any newsreader), even with your ISP.
If you want to access other, non-Microsoft, newsgroups, such as those
in the alt. hierarchy, try the free news.motzarella.org news server,
which also works with Outlook Express or any newsreader.
--
Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP - Windows Desktop Experience
Please Reply to the Newsgroup
Rod Speed
Rod Speed
> In looking around for another ISP, I've found one that I think that I might sign up with. But they tell me that they
> do not provide access to Newsgroup via Outlook Express.
> Since I want to regularly access Newsgroups and don't want the inconvenience of accessing Newsgroups through Google;
> is there a reasonably priced and easy way for me to get to the Newsgroups using this new provider please.
Yes, there are plenty of commercial newsgroup providers that work fine with OE.
> I phoned up the technical line and they said to use RSS feeds,
They're fools.
HeyBub
> In looking around for another ISP, I've found one that I think that I
> might sign up with. But they tell me that they do not provide access
> to Newsgroup via Outlook Express.
>
> Since I want to regularly access Newsgroups and don't want the
> inconvenience of accessing Newsgroups through Google; is there a
> reasonably priced and easy way for me to get to the Newsgroups using
> said to use RSS feeds, I did a search on this but it doesn't seem to
> me to connect in any way with Newsgroups as far as I can see. Thanks
> for any advice.
Hundreds. Google "news+servers" yields over 7 million hits.
On the larger question of the competency of your prospective ISP, on a scale
of one-to-ten, I'd rate them somewhere near the baked-beans aisle.
Richard Colton
"John" <noneinuse@> wrote in message
news:UYKdnTkRGY2dH5bV...@bt.com...
Lol. Define "alright".
--
Unlock Your Phone's Potential
www.UselessInfo.org.uk
www.ThePhoneLocker.co.uk
www.GSM-Solutions.co.uk
nobody >
> Kenny wrote:
>> I dropped Wanadoo some time ago because they dropped their newsserver.
>> Signed up with Madasafish and happy with them so far. I have an "up
>> 10Gb news and 10Gb internet.
>> For downloading binaries you'll need something other than OE. I'm
>> using Newsbin Pro but there aoters like Forte Agent.
>>
>>
>> "johannes" <jo...@sizef4467866445itter.com> wrote in message
>> news:480B5D94...@sizef4467866445itter.com...
>>>
>>> johngood_____ wrote:
>>>> In looking around for another ISP, I've found one that I think that
>>>> I might
>>>> sign up with. But they tell me that they do not provide access to
>>>> Newsgroup
>>>> via Outlook Express.
>>> Although there are loads of different e-mail clients, many of them
>>> free and
>>> Outlook Express is not everybody's cuppa, OE is fairly standard and
>>> commonly
>>> used. Sounds to me like some misunderstanding of what the ISP has
>>> told you.
>>> I can't see why they should object to Outlook Express in particular.
>>> Here, I'm using Netscape Messenger.
>
> OE downloads binaries alright.
OE doesn't do yEnc decodes.
Appelation Controlee
-------------------8><
> All Internet Surveillance Providers ...
Paranoid, or misinformed?
Michael Chare
news:480B5D94...@sizef4467866445itter.com...
>
>
Some ISPs e.g. don't O2 don't provide news servers.
--
Michael Chare
Big Al
> In looking around for another ISP, I've found one that I think that I might
> sign up with. But they tell me that they do not provide access to Newsgroup
> via Outlook Express.
>
> of accessing Newsgroups through Google; is there a reasonably priced and
> easy way for me to get to the Newsgroups using this new provider please. I
> phoned up the technical line and they said to use RSS feeds, I did a search
> on this but it doesn't seem to me to connect in any way with Newsgroups as
> far as I can see. Thanks for any advice.
>
>
concept of letting you roll over your quota from month to month. So if
you had 5 gig left over, you could use it next month. I kinda liked
that feature. I can go 3 months without downloads so I could do 30 gig
on month 4 say?
Some of these are limited but its a small list. And there are so many
and the prices vary so much, you check them out. It would be suggested
to test before a long commitment. As some lack groups, some have low
retention, some may miss parts of messages or whole messages. It just
runs the gauntlet.
http://ngroups.net/index1.php?p=3c
News groups .net
http://www.newsrazor.net/pricing.php
News Razor
http://www.newsgroupdirect.com/signup/?gclid=CNen3rialpECFUWoGgod52zXOA
news group direct Has many plans
(69.28.186.120) Try this for a free server , no login etc.
Found at http://www.newsservers.net/FreeNewsServers.php
http://newsgroupservers.easynews.com/
Easy news
http://www.newsfeeds.com/
newsfeeds.com
http://100proofnews.com/
100 proof
http://www.newsrover.com/service.htm
This web page seems to have a ton of servers listed.
thanatoid
news:f4eh21b01ty1$.t5t3gjjv...@40tude.net:
No comment.
BTW, (assuming Reply-To is genuine) enjoy your gmail account.
Google IS the promise of eternal life come true, you know - at
least for all your email.
"Do not be evil" - but be forever.
Ivor Jones
thanatoid <wai...@the.exit.invalid> typed, for some strange, unexplained
reason:
[snip]
: BTW, (assuming Reply-To is genuine) enjoy your gmail account.
: Google IS the promise of eternal life come true, you know - at
: least for all your email.
:
: "Do not be evil" - but be forever.
There is a simple rule when it comes to email, or Usenet for that matter -
don't type anything you would not be happy for the world to read.
With that in mind, I have no problem with Google mail, I pass all my mail
through a gmail account in order to take advantage of their excellent spam
filters.
Ivor
Gary Heston
Ivor Jones <iv...@thisaddressis.invalid> wrote:
[ ... ]
>There is a simple rule when it comes to email, or Usenet for that matter -
>don't type anything you would not be happy for the world to read.
I tell people to regard email as a postcard that is likely to fall into the
hands of their worst enemy, and to assume that it will. Sometimes, they
actually believe me.
>With that in mind, I have no problem with Google mail, I pass all my mail
>through a gmail account in order to take advantage of their excellent spam
>filters.
Must only be on the incoming email.
Gary
--
Gary Heston ghe...@hiwaay.net http://www.thebreastcancersite.com/
Barack and Hillary, sitting in a tree, H-I-S-S-I-N-G;
First comes a primary, then an election;
Next thing you know, McCain's getting sworn in.
Appelation Controlee
> Appelation Controlee <m...@privacy.net> wrote in
> news:f4eh21b01ty1$.t5t3gjjv...@40tude.net:
>
>> On 20 Apr 2008 18:06:16 GMT, thanatoid wrote:
>>
>> -------------------8><
>>> All Internet Surveillance Providers ...
>>
>> Paranoid, or misinformed?
>
> No comment.
>
> BTW, (assuming Reply-To is genuine) enjoy your gmail account.
> Google IS the promise of eternal life come true, you know - at
> least for all your email.
It's genuine, but I only read mail there when notified.
Appelation Controlee
> With that in mind, I have no problem with Google mail, I pass all my mail
> through a gmail account in order to take advantage of their excellent spam
> filters.
I do the same. I used to run POPfile (which, after a period of training,
produces very good results) but Gmail is even better.
And yes, inbound only, as noted by Gary.
Ivor Jones
Gary Heston <ghe...@hiwaay.net> typed, for some strange, unexplained
reason:
: In article <679a3cF...@mid.individual.net>,
: Ivor Jones <iv...@thisaddressis.invalid> wrote:
: [ ... ]
: >There is a simple rule when it comes to email, or Usenet for that
: >matter - don't type anything you would not be happy for the world to
: >read.
:
: I tell people to regard email as a postcard that is likely to fall
: into the hands of their worst enemy, and to assume that it will.
Indeed.
: Sometimes, they actually believe me.
:
: >With that in mind, I have no problem with Google mail, I pass all my
: >mail through a gmail account in order to take advantage of their
: >excellent spam filters.
:
: Must only be on the incoming email.
:
:
: Gary
I don't send via them so you're right.
Ivor
The Real Bev
Why would you want spam filters on your outbound mail unless you're a
Polish spammer?
--
Cheers, Bev
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
Polish loan sharks: they loan you money and then skip town.
Appelation Controlee
> Appelation Controlee wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 23 Apr 2008 18:31:19 +0100, Ivor Jones wrote:
>>
>>> With that in mind, I have no problem with Google mail, I pass all my mail
>>> through a gmail account in order to take advantage of their excellent spam
>>> filters.
>>
>> I do the same. I used to run POPfile (which, after a period of training,
>> produces very good results) but Gmail is even better.
>> And yes, inbound only, as noted by Gary.
>
> Why would you want spam filters on your outbound mail unless you're a
> Polish spammer?
Well, I wouldn't, would I? Sorry for not being totally conclusive. All I
intended to convey with my last sentence was that I don't use Gmail for
sending mail. In case any ambiguity remains, I'll add that I send mail via
the smtp server provided by my ISP.
Stormin Mormon
a couple others are out there. They provide you a log on name and pass word
to enter into your OE news group properties.
--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.
"johngood_____" <vo...@voidacious.net> wrote in message
news:SrIOj.93844$5i5....@newsfe6-gui.ntli.net...