Comicbook Cafe idea
Scott T. Jensen
I have a friend that is really into comicbooks and the cafe scene. One
afternoon as we were sipping some cups of the gods at a cafe, I suggested he
combine both into one. A cafe that provided "all" the comicbooks currently
being published for his drinkers' reading pleasure.
The cafe would be located on State Street in Madison, Wisconsin, USA. State
Street allows no car traffic (buses, taxis, delivery vehicles, etc, but not
private cars and trucks), runs a straight line from the campus of "Big Ten"
University of Wisconsin - Madison to the State Capital (about a half mile
long), has VERY heavy foot traffic, is the place Madisonsites go to mingle
(and people watch), already has tons of cafes (yes, even a Starbucks ... but
tons of others as well and ones that do better than Starbucks ... and, no,
no comicbook-theme cafes), and it is considered the "hip" place to hang out
at. As for Madison, Wisconsin, USA, it is a city of 277,000 (50,000 college
students), located in the center of the lower half of the state, and has
snow during the winter and hot humidity during the summer.
Now for more of the nuts and bolts of my idea, here's the following:
+ All comicbooks in plastic protectors ... like those you'd find in
libraries. Won't prevent damage by spilled drinks, but will at least help
reduce it and will do pretty well against dropped food. Different colors
for the backs of the protectors to help patrons know which type of comicbook
it is at a glance, such as red for adult comics, blue for superhero comics,
green for children's comics, black for horror comics, etc.
+ All pages of the comic books will be stamped with a thin small cafe
rubberstamp to discourage theft.
+ No old copies. Once the new issue comes out, the one before is removed
from the cafe. After a month or even week, they'll have practically no
value ... especially since they'll have a property stamp on them as
suggested above. The owner (my friend) will probably keep the ones that are
not too ragged for his own collection.
+ Multiple subscriptions of the same comicbook title would be done for the
highly popular ones ... as well as so to hopefully insure that one copy will
survive the month/week before the new issue comes out.
+ I recommended against offering pornographic comicbooks ... or at least
have them be behind the counter for adults to request and return when
they're done. And some adult comicbooks sometimes cross the line and there
would be a little sign telling when they have and that they're for adults
only and upon request.
+ On the upper half of the walls will hang paintings by comicbooks artists.
Letters will be sent out to the artists telling them about the
comicbook-theme cafe and requesting a painting / drawing of a certain size
of the comicbook character(s) they draw. They be framed behind glass to
prevent vandalism. The artists would be offered some money, but not a lot.
Probably won't get Frank Miller to create one, but would probably get
artists that like the idea for the cafe. The paintings can be serious or
not. These paintings would be added to over time and, once there's more
than can be hanged on the walls, they'll be rotated in and out of storage
once a week.
+ All the cafe drinks and food would be named appropriately after comicbook
characters.
+ Since the patronage will be more along the solitary type (coming to read
as opposed to socialize), the seating will be geared to this. No couches.
Single seats. Comfortable lounge chairs randomly put about and facing all
angles so no one is directly across and staring at you while you sit and
read your comic. If the location has sidewalk space, it will put chairs out
on that space and picket-fence them in.
+ The inside of back of the plastic protectors will have a list of comicbook
stores in town and encourage those that would like to start up their own
collection to frequent them.
+ Host signings of touring comicbook artists and writers who are out on
publicity tours. Have the line for really popular ones be single-file into
the cafe (overflowing the line along the outside sidewalk) and organized in
a way that those who have gone past the signer's table would be right in
front of the drink/food counter. Encourage an atmosphere of those who got
their signing to get a drink and hang out at the cafe to chat with other
fans of the artist/writer, watch the scene, read some comicbooks, etc.
+ Have a sidewalk sign heralding the new arrivals. Simply stagnate them at
regular intervals so there's always at least one new comic being heralded on
the sandwich sign as being put out on the shelves that day. This way
there's always some "news" to tell on the sign to get people to come in.
Additionally, regulars who like more than one title will then hopefully come
in when their comicbooks normally is put out on the shelves thus coming in
more than just once a month.
+ Offer a comicbook trivial question discount to patrons. If a patron would
like 5% off the total price of their order, the wait staff will have a big
stack of trivia question cards to ask them a question and if the patron gets
it right, they get the discount. Perhaps have a few categories for them to
select from. Perhaps have it on a laptop next to the register.
+ As for the wait staff attire, if they're willing to dress up as a
comicbook character (done nicely), they'd receive a higher hourly wage. If
they don't want to go to that length, provide them t-shirts with the emblems
of superheroes, such as the Superman's diamond "S", Batman's bat symbol,
etc.
+ As for comicbook knowledge of the wait staff, my friend used to work at a
comicbook store so he has TONS. But I recommended he not look for the same
in employees. That it is more important to hire employees that have a good
appearance, are friendly, and have a good memory for names (since almost all
people like being remembered ... thus feel like their honored patrons). The
staff will then naturally start reading the comicbooks during slow times and
their comicbook knowledge will quickly build up by that alone.
Now my friend is an experienced cook and he absolutely wants to have at
least a sandwich kitchen set-up for him to whip up a Dagwood sandwich and
such for patrons. That and a pie display case and purchase the pies from
local homemakers that have won prizes for their recipes. There would also
be counter seating for those that would like to chat with him and the wait
staff while they eat, drink, and possibly casually read their comics. Due
to them chatting, sound dampening materials would be sought for the chairs,
behind the paintings/drawings on the walls, etc.
Now this is just in the casual exploration stage. There's a desire, but no
life-or-dead rush to make this come about. Financing hasn't really be
discussed much, but I'd be up for chewing that over with someone here as
well.
As for my part in this business, it would likely be as solely an advisor.
He's a friend and this business isn't likely to make a ton of money. I'd be
happy to just provide the occasional free marketing advice (from Grand
Opening advertising to image management to what-have-you). Also, his mother
is an experienced successful CPA that should be more than willing to do his
business' accounting ... if only to get him to settle down. *laugh*
Anyway...
All suggestions, comments, criticisms, etc. will be greatly appreciated.
Looking forward to a good thread,
Scott Jensen
--
Like a cure for A.I.D.S, Alzheimer, Parkinson, & Mad Cow Disease?
Volunteer your computer for folding-protein research for when it's idle.
Go to http://www.distributedfolding.org/ to sign up your computer.
Mike Turco
"Scott T. Jensen" <s...@charter.net> wrote in message
news:<acsgq...@enews2.newsguy.com>...
> I have a friend that is really into comicbooks and the cafe scene. One
> afternoon as we were sipping some cups of the gods at a cafe, I suggested he
> combine both into one. A cafe that provided "all" the comicbooks currently
> being published for his drinkers' reading pleasure.
>
Scott, I think it is a dandy idea to entertain the guests, and it
sounds like you've put a lot of thought into this.
I wonder if there is a way to test this idea without having to spend
*so* much money up front.
- How many comic aficianodos in the area?
- How many successful comic book shops? Coffee shops?
- How much do the comics add to the overhead?
- If the comics fail but the cafe seems to work, is there a plan b?
Poetry readings? A guitar player? Board games?
- What if you are too successful? A cup of coffee is $4, but it takes
an hour to read the comic book!
There is a hotdog stand about an hours drive from my house. I can't
remember the name, but its kind of famous. The owner is a lawyer. On
Wednsday night, the owner gives free legal advice with the purchase of
a hot dog.
A friend of mine lives in that area. He says that there is a
loooooooooong line of people on Wednesday.
When you "give something away" that is of a high level of value to
people, for the cost of a cup of coffee (or a hot dog), of course
people will line up for it. I don't know that comic books are
necessarily the right thing. But you are on the right track.
Free business advice?
Free help with homework?
My concern would be a big layout without testing. How can you test
this idea before going into business? Maybe you can find an
out-of-town cafe and try the idea out on there premise. Worst case,
you are out a few hundred bucks on comic books.
Mike Turco
P.S. I am looking for a nice tag line. Any ideas?
--
Here is a way to increase your profit:
Sell new products to your existing customers
http://miketurco.com
--
Develop your product
http://miketurco.com
James Logajan
"Scott T. Jensen" <s...@charter.net> wrote:
[ On a cafe with a comicbook theme: ]
> + I recommended against offering pornographic comicbooks ...
I'd second this recommendation and suggest opening a second more adult cafe
only if the first cafe gains traction. I'd recommend against partitioning
the cafe into adult and non-adult sections.
> + All the cafe drinks and food would be named appropriately after
> comicbook characters.
I assume you know most comicbook characters are trademarked, so you'll need
to get licenses from the trademark holders.
Not a bad idea, although it seems to be a variation on the combination
bookstore/cafe idea, with this being primarily a reading cafe. I'm sure one
could eventually segue into selling related merchandise, but probably best
not to lose focus at the outset on the main idea.
Jim Provost
Very good point. Not that I think only kids will want to come in (as it
won't only be just them), but you may have to also worry about kids with no
intentions of buying anything coming in just to read... depending on your
street traffic.
--
Jim Provost
Product Manager
ESPONSIVE Communications
www.esponsive.com
"Mike Turco" <mike...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:actpr...@enews4.newsguy.com...
Scott T. Jensen
"Mike Turco" <mike...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> "Scott T. Jensen" <s...@charter.net> wrote:
> > I have a friend that is really into comicbooks and the cafe
> > scene. One afternoon as we were sipping some cups of
> > the gods at a cafe, I suggested he combine both into one.
> > A cafe that provided "all" the comicbooks currently
> > being published for his drinkers' reading pleasure.
>
> Scott, I think it is a dandy idea to entertain the guests, and
> it sounds like you've put a lot of thought into this.
Well, as much as I would when tickled with an idea and chewing it over with
a friend while drinking coffee and watching the babes walk by. I haven't
written up any business plan or any other documentation of the idea ...
except for what I've just done here in this newsgroup.
> I wonder if there is a way to test this idea without having
> to spend *so* much money up front.
As far as I can think, the answer would be: nope.
> - How many comic aficianodos in the area?
Not only them but also who has even a casual interest in comics. Some
people aren't into comics simply because of the cost. This cafe would
eliminate the reading cost. Not the collecting cost, but definitely the
reading cost ... as long as they got to the cafe in time before the next
issue comes out.
> - How many successful comic book shops?
Successful comicbook shops? They exist?! Where?! Have you been smoking
dope again, Mike?
Over the last couple of years, Madison has lost two comicbook stores that I
know about. Currently, it still has three ... who thought enough of listing
themselves in the yellow pages.
> Coffee shops?
You mean espresso cafes, right? I mean "coffee shop" is so ... so ...
1950's. *laugh*
As for coffee shops, Madison has at least 33 (that's how many cared to list
themselves in the yellow pages) and more seem to pop up everyday. On State
Street and neighboring streets alone, there are fourteen.
> - How much do the comics add to the overhead?
It would definitely be a cost add-on and not a replacement cost of something
else that coffee shops currently offer. As for how much, I have no idea. I
suppose a simple budget could be set up for it and my friend just have to
pick and choose from all the comicbooks out there up to that limit. As his
business succeeds, he could then increase that budget to offer still more.
> - If the comics fail but the cafe seems to work, is there
> a plan b?
That would be something hard to separate from each other since the customers
wouldn't be purchasing or renting the comicbooks.
> Poetry readings?
Just shoot me. Just shoot me now if that's the cafe's fate. The LAST thing
we need is another cafe with a poetry night. *laugh*
> A guitar player?
State Street has a LOT of street musicians and so people rarely go into hear
a solo guitar player in a cafe. And guitar players of any real merit
actually make pretty good money working the streets for "tips". There's
even a street band that is practically a landmark. The band numbers usually
five. Wood guitar player, metal guitar player, bass guitar player, upright
bass player, and harmonica player. They're actually rather good.
> Board games?
My friend is also a big gamer so if the place has backrooms, he wants to let
role-playing groups use them and, if there's a few, even set one aside for
just boardgames. The gamers would just be "asked" not to bring in any
drinks or food and thus pay for their room(s) by buying such from the cafe.
> - What if you are too successful? A cup of coffee is $4, but
> it takes an hour to read the comic book!
WORLD DOMINATION!!!! Bwahahahahaha!
Again, Mike, put down the joint and open a window. ;-)
> When you "give something away" that is of a high level
> of value to people, for the cost of a cup of coffee (or a
> hot dog), of course people will line up for it. I don't
> know that comic books are necessarily the right thing.
> But you are on the right track.
Well, basically, he's only interested if it was a comicbook cafe and there's
no interest within me to do this myself.
> My concern would be a big layout without testing. How
> can you test this idea before going into business?
I just don't think it can be done without actually doing it.
> Maybe you can find an out-of-town cafe and try the idea
> out on there premise.
No, I think it would have to be located on State Street for it to have a
pray of a chance to succeed. State Street overflows with teenagers and
college students ... as well as adults that still entertain the child in
themselves (i.e., George Demmer).
> P.S. I am looking for a nice tag line. Any ideas?
>
> --
> Here is a way to increase your profit:
> Sell new products to your existing customers
> http://miketurco.com
>
> --
>
> Develop your product
> http://miketurco.com
Neither catch me and make me want to click on the link. Start up a new
thread about this and perhaps someone will come up with something ... as
well as possibly being a nice thread about signatures and their business
potential. Let's however not continue discussing sigs here as it is a "bit"
off-topic. ;-)
Scott T. Jensen
"Jim Provost" wrote:
> Very good point. Not that I think only kids will want to come
> in (as it won't only be just them), but you may have to also
> worry about kids with no intentions of buying anything coming
> in just to read... depending on your street traffic.
My friend has been a bouncer so I don't see him having a problem "asking"
people to buy at least a drink or snack before sitting down with a comicbook
nor having a problem asking freeloaders to leave if they refuse. Besides,
if the cafe offers a wide selection of pops, ice cream flavors, cakes, and
pies, I think it would be a very strong-willed kid that could say no to his
tastebuds after just seeing what's there to drink and eat. Also, how you
design the layout should require people coming in to pass by the sales
counter before gaining access to seating.
Scott T. Jensen
"James Logajan" <Jam...@lugoj.com> wrote:
> "Scott T. Jensen" <s...@charter.net> wrote:
> [ On a cafe with a comicbook theme: ]
> > + I recommended against offering pornographic
> > comicbooks ...
>
> I'd second this recommendation and suggest opening
> a second more adult cafe only if the first cafe gains
> traction. I'd recommend against partitioning the cafe
> into adult and non-adult sections.
First, there's a difference between adult and pornographic comics. Adult
comics simply have very mature themes and deal with adult issues. They're
written for adults and are actually one of the fastest growing types of
comics out there right now. Adults that grew up on comics are now admitting
that they still enjoy them and just want them to now deal with issues that
would be of interest to them. And not too long ago, a comicbook (Art
Spiegelman's "Maus") even won a Pulitzer Prize and a Guggenheim Fellowship.
Whereas pornographic comics is ones that are just ... well ... pornographic.
And it isn't hard at all to know which is which. And the LAST thing I would
recommend is setting up a espresso cafe that only offers pornographic
comics. Ugh! Think of the customers you would attract! UGH!!!
> > + All the cafe drinks and food would be named
> > appropriately after comicbook characters.
>
> I assume you know most comicbook characters are
> trademarked, so you'll need to get licenses from the
> trademark holders.
Goes without saying. Possibly wouldn't be allowed to make a Superman Hero
Sandwich, but probably any of the lesser comic creators would feel rather
honored by the place naming a drink or snack after their creations. Once
such a drink/snack name idea is thought up and agreed upon, we'd simply
write its creator a letter asking for written permission to do so. The
letter would include a release form and a stamped self-addressed envelope
for its return.
> Not a bad idea, although it seems to be a variation on the
> combination bookstore/cafe idea, with this being primarily
> a reading cafe. I'm sure one could eventually segue into
> selling related merchandise, but probably best not to lose
> focus at the outset on the main idea.
I wasn't thinking along the lines of the cafe selling the comics.
First, comics more easily lose their value through heavy usage. Unless it
is one of those hotly sought-after super rare comics (like the one that
premiered Superman), anything but "mint" condition is almost worthless to
collectors.
Second, it would require even more space.
Third, it creates a different atmosphere. One where the store hopes you buy
the book you just mauled for the last hour ... as opposed to having a
laid-back atmosphere where no such expectations float in the air.
Lastly, books require hours upon hours to finish whereas comicbooks don't.
I think anyone that comes in to read a comic while sipping on a drink will
get it read and thus not want to then buy it.
James Logajan
>> I'm sure one could eventually segue into
>> selling related merchandise, but probably best not to lose focus at
>> the outset on the main idea.
>
> I wasn't thinking along the lines of the cafe selling the comics.
That wasn't what I had in mind either. I was thinking more along the lines
of coffee mugs, t-shirts, etc.
Mike Turco
Scott,
> > - How many successful comic book shops?
>
> Successful comicbook shops? They exist?! Where?! Have you been smoking
> dope again, Mike?
Successful comic book shops in Madison. Ya, like I'm supposed to know
that :) It isn't "me" who's braiding hemp rope.
>
> Over the last couple of years, Madison has lost two comicbook stores that I
> know about. Currently, it still has three ... who thought enough of listing
> themselves in the yellow pages.
Two went out of business, three are left, and you're opening a fourth
comic book related business. OK.
I'd look for demographic data. I'd also camp out in front of those
comic book stores and do a little recon.
>
> > Coffee shops?
>
> You mean espresso cafes, right? I mean "coffee shop" is so ... so ...
> 1950's. *laugh*
Gee, Scott, I wouldn't know. I wasn't even a happy sperm in the 50's
:))
> As for coffee shops, Madison has at least 33 (that's how many cared to list
> themselves in the yellow pages) and more seem to pop up everyday. On State
> Street and neighboring streets alone, there are fourteen.
OK, more camping trips. Are all fourteen shop bristling with business?
If you divide what's there by 15, what does that leave you?
I think the comic book idea is great, out-of-the-box thinking. But you
have one hell of a lot of competition.
>
> > - How much do the comics add to the overhead?
>
> It would definitely be a cost add-on and not a replacement cost of something
> else that coffee shops currently offer.
My understanding of this kind of industry is that the margins are
pretty low. You should head out of town, to another campus area, and
talk to a few shop owners. It can't hurt.
> As for how much, I have no idea. I
> suppose a simple budget could be set up for it and my friend just have to
> pick and choose from all the comicbooks out there up to that limit. As his
> business succeeds, he could then increase that budget to offer still more.
I have a "business evaluation spreadsheet" somewhere. Its a business
plan template with all the cheese cut out. Mostly numbers and bulleted
items for marketing plans, etc. I'll dig for it if you want it. It may
have gone to the big pentium in the sky with my last computer crash.
> > Poetry readings?
>
> Just shoot me. Just shoot me now if that's the cafe's fate. The LAST thing
> we need is another cafe with a poetry night. *laugh*
Well, how are the crowd turnouts for cafe's with and without
poetry/music? Its going to be your friends business. If he's making
big bucks on Wednsday nights with poetry readings, you don't have to
go. He will gladly treat you to an expresso every Thursday.
> > - What if you are too successful? A cup of coffee is $4, but
> > it takes an hour to read the comic book!
>
> WORLD DOMINATION!!!! Bwahahahahaha!
Hey, if you can rent out a chair, a table and a comic book for $4 an
hour, things must be a lot cheaper there than here (in LA).
> Again, Mike, put down the joint and open a window. ;-)
Gotta keep those windows closed, Scott. Otherwise, I won't be able to
scrape the resin.
> > My concern would be a big layout without testing. How
> > can you test this idea before going into business?
>
> I just don't think it can be done without actually doing it.
Well, take the risk. It sounds like a big outlay. I'd do some more
research.
>
> > Maybe you can find an out-of-town cafe and try the idea
> > out on there premise.
>
> No, I think it would have to be located on State Street for it to have a
> pray of a chance to succeed. State Street overflows with teenagers and
> college students ... as well as adults that still entertain the child in
> themselves (i.e., George Demmer).
Mike
What the hell, click this link
http://miketurco.com
George Demmer
"Scott T. Jensen" <s...@charter.net> wrote in
news:acsgq...@enews2.newsguy.com:
>
> I have a friend that is really into comicbooks and the cafe scene.
> One afternoon as we were sipping some cups of the gods at a cafe, I
> suggested he combine both into one. A cafe that provided "all" the
> comicbooks currently being published for his drinkers' reading
> pleasure.
A couple of thoughts I would add to the discussion...
First, I agree with Mike about the fact that a sitting-and-reading cafe
would slow down the number of customer turns you could achieve. Given the
heavy cafe competition you face and the extra overhead added by the comic
purchase budget, you're already at a bit of a competitive disadvantage
(speaking of financial aspect here), so getting them to sit and read --
and therefore take up the chair for longer -- would hurt your revenues.
And keep in mind that most cafes do a big chunk of their business in
take-out, so there is no chair usage at all. Unless your comic cafe
successfully attracts take-out customers (not easy given your competition
and the higher prices you should be charging for the extra benefit) that
would be another hit on the bottom line compared to other cafes.
Some market research should help you here. Finding out the average sale,
take-out / dine-in ratios, and daily average number of customers for a
typical cafe would allow you to do the math and see if the concept is
even feasible while charging less that $10 for a cup of coffee.
Along those lines, I think Jim's idea of selling some related products
could be a big help in this area by increasing your average sale and
revenues per square foot. The comic-related stuff Jim pointed out would
be good. But why not put on sale those paintings/drawings by the
cartoonists? They'll be happier to send them to you if they make some
cold hard cash for them every time you sell one. There could also be
interesting "collector" type stuff on sale. (If you don't go into direct
competition with them, the other comic stores could provide them to you
to sell and you get to keep a chunk.)
Finally, I'm not sure I agree with you that selling comics would be a bad
idea. Just because people spend time in a library doesn't mean they don't
buy books! In fact, those are some of the heaviest book-buyers. If they
read a comic they particularly like, they may want to buy a copy for their
collection. Or they can't read ALL the comics at the cafe, so they read
the ones they only have a middling interest in, but buy their favorites
to take home and read at their leisure. Why not plan to put a couple more
of those comic stores out of business by taking it away from them?
--
George Demmer
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Reality Marketing Associates, Coquitlam, BC, Canada
Phone: (604) 944-8603
E-mail: nwsgrps-...@realityassociates.com
Web site: www.realityassociates.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Everything your company does is marketing. We can help you do it better.
Scott T. Jensen
"Mike Turco" <mike...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ad5ag...@enews3.newsguy.com...
>
> Scott,
>
> > > - How many successful comic book shops?
> >
> > Successful comicbook shops? They exist?! Where?! Have
> > you been smoking dope again, Mike?
>
> Successful comic book shops in Madison. Ya, like I'm
> supposed to know that :)
Oh, I'd expand that to anywhere. ;-)
> > Over the last couple of years, Madison has lost two
> > comicbook stores that I know about. Currently, it
> > still has three ... who thought enough of listing
> > themselves in the yellow pages.
>
> Two went out of business, three are left, and you're
> opening a fourth comic book related business. OK.
It's my stance that it is hard to compare the two (comicbook stores and
comicbook cafe) simply because one is trying to sell comics and the other
drinks and snacks. One discourages too much reading and the other
encourages.
> I'd look for demographic data. I'd also camp out in
> front of those comic book stores and do a little recon.
We've done a little recon work. Pretty heavily teenage to young adult white
males. Asian males make a decent showing. Black males are quite rare ...
but so are they in Madison. Females is a small but growing minority.
> > As for coffee shops, Madison has at least 33 (that's how
> > many cared to list themselves in the yellow pages) and
> > more seem to pop up everyday. On State Street and
> > neighboring streets alone, there are fourteen.
>
> OK, more camping trips. Are all fourteen shop bristling with
> business?
Pretty much.
> If you divide what's there by 15, what does that leave you?
Drawing in a crowd that doesn't normally do the cafe scene.
> I think the comic book idea is great, out-of-the-box
> thinking. But you have one hell of a lot of competition.
Agreed, but all the competition isn't offering anything but a place to sit
and drink. Even poetry reading nights are only at most once a week and once
a month in some cafes. And most cafes have no poetry reading nights at all.
They really depending mainly just on location and no other draws. The
comicbook cafe is a big draw that should pull from a MUCH wider territories
than any of these other cafes.
> > > - How much do the comics add to the overhead?
> >
> > It would definitely be a cost add-on and not a
> > replacement cost of something else that coffee shops
> > currently offer.
>
> My understanding of this kind of industry is that the
> margins are pretty low.
Just the opposite. The margins are massive in this type of business. We're
talking about two pennies of product selling for $4.
> You should head out of town, to another campus
> area, and talk to a few shop owners. It can't hurt.
Sounds like a good excuse for a roadtrip. :-)
> > As for how much, I have no idea. I
> > suppose a simple budget could be set up for it and my
> > friend just have to pick and choose from all the
> > comicbooks out there up to that limit. As his business
> > succeeds, he could then increase that budget to offer
> > still more.
>
> I have a "business evaluation spreadsheet" somewhere. Its
> a business plan template with all the cheese cut out. Mostly
> numbers and bulleted items for marketing plans, etc. I'll dig
> for it if you want it. It may have gone to the big pentium in
> the sky with my last computer crash.
If you got it, sure, I'd appreciate looking it over.
> > > Poetry readings?
> >
> > Just shoot me. Just shoot me now if that's the cafe's fate.
> > The LAST thing we need is another cafe with a poetry
> > night. *laugh*
>
> Well, how are the crowd turnouts for cafe's with and
> without poetry/music?
Light if they're done weekly and light to heavy if they're only done
monthly.
> Its going to be your friends
> business. If he's making big bucks on Wednsday nights
> with poetry readings, you don't have to go. He will
> gladly treat you to an expresso every Thursday.
First, I was trying to inject a little humor with my statement. Second, I
know my friend isn't into the poetry scene.
> > > - What if you are too successful? A cup of coffee is
> > > $4, but it takes an hour to read the comic book!
> >
> > WORLD DOMINATION!!!! Bwahahahahaha!
>
> Hey, if you can rent out a chair, a table and a comic
> book for $4 an hour, things must be a lot cheaper
> there than here (in LA).
If you give them a reason to stay longer, they'll get another cup of
espresso ... perhaps a slice of cheesecake this time ... perhaps give one of
those new herbal tea flavors a try ... etc.
> > Again, Mike, put down the joint and open a window. ;-)
>
> Gotta keep those windows closed, Scott. Otherwise, I
> won't be able to scrape the resin.
Well, at least take the Mary Jane off the window sill. Yes, yes, it gets
good light there but the cops can see it as they drive by.
> > > My concern would be a big layout without testing. How
> > > can you test this idea before going into business?
> >
> > I just don't think it can be done without actually doing it.
>
> Well, take the risk. It sounds like a big outlay. I'd do some
> more research.
I'll chew it a bit more here and bring it up to him again. I told him I'd
do this and he was all in favor of it.
> What the hell, click this link
> http://miketurco.com
Shouldn't you say instead...
"It maybe a virus, it maybe not.
Give it a click and find out."
Scott T. Jensen
"George Demmer" wrote:
> "Scott T. Jensen" <s...@charter.net> wrote:
> > I have a friend that is really into comicbooks and the
> > cafe scene. One afternoon as we were sipping some
> > cups of the gods at a cafe, I suggested he combine
> > both into one. A cafe that provided "all" the
> > comicbooks currently being published for his
> > drinkers' reading pleasure.
>
> A couple of thoughts I would add to the discussion...
Hmmm. I read more than just two below, George. ;-)
> First, I agree with Mike about the fact that a
> sitting-and-reading cafe would slow down the number
> of customer turns you could achieve. Given the heavy
> cafe competition you face and the extra overhead
> added by the comic purchase budget, you're already
> at a bit of a competitive disadvantage (speaking of
> financial aspect here), so getting them to sit and read --
> and therefore take up the chair for longer -- would
> hurt your revenues. And keep in mind that most cafes
> do a big chunk of their business in take-out, so there is
> no chair usage at all.
Hmmm. That hasn't been my experience with cafes ... at least on State
Street. It's not like people can pull up, jump out of their cars, get a cup
of jo, and take off again quickly. You have to go to one of the big parking
ramps and then walk at few minutes to get to the cafes. My observation is
that most do buy and sit down to drink theirs. My observations also show
that those that bring something to read stay longer and buy more.
> Unless your comic cafe successfully attracts take-out
> customers (not easy given your competition and the
> higher prices you should be charging for the extra
> benefit) that would be another hit on the bottom line
> compared to other cafes.
I'll have to ask this of my friend that's really into the cafe scene to see
if this is what he's observed as well. It could be the set-up for State
Street is different than the normal environment that cafes exist in.
> Some market research should help you here. Finding
> out the average sale, take-out / dine-in ratios, and daily
> average number of customers for a typical cafe would
> allow you to do the math and see if the concept is even
> feasible while charging less that $10 for a cup of coffee.
Good point. I'll bring this up. Then again, anyone know where these
numbers might be on the web?
> Along those lines, I think Jim's idea of selling some
> related products could be a big help in this area by
> increasing your average sale and revenues per
> square foot. The comic-related stuff Jim pointed
> out would be good.
Now that Jim explained what he was meaning, I agreed with him.
> But why not put on sale those paintings/drawings
> by the cartoonists? They'll be happier to send
> them to you if they make some cold hard cash for
> them every time you sell one.
That's an option we can present to them. If they do, we'll put a small
price tag on them. Not for-sale, no price tag.
> There could also be interesting "collector" type
> stuff on sale. (If you don't go into direct
> competition with them, the other comic stores
> could provide them to you to sell and you get
> to keep a chunk.)
Personally, I don't like a cluttered interior design, but I'll bring this up
to him.
> Finally, I'm not sure I agree with you that selling
> comics would be a bad idea. Just because people
> spend time in a library doesn't mean they don't buy
> books! In fact, those are some of the heaviest
> book-buyers. If they read a comic they particularly
> like, they may want to buy a copy for their collection.
> Or they can't read ALL the comics at the cafe, so
> they read the ones they only have a middling interest
> in, but buy their favorites to take home and read at
> their leisure. Why not plan to put a couple more of
> those comic stores out of business by taking it away
> from them?
One, it is a matter of space. To do both a comicbook store and cafe would
almost require double the space.
Two, I would hope they cannot read ALL the comics during one visit. I would
hope they come back again and again to read more and thus buy more drinks
and snacks. Having so many comics is to encourage repeat visit and more
than just once a month when the new comics come out.
Three, I wouldn't be surprised that the cafe would kill off all but one
comicbook store in town. Might not, but I'd put a fiver on that it would.
Scott T. Jensen
"James Logajan" <Jam...@lugoj.com> wrote:
> "Scott T. Jensen" <s...@charter.net> wrote:
> > "James Logajan" <Jam...@lugoj.com> wrote:
> >> I'm sure one could eventually segue into
> >> selling related merchandise, but probably best not to lose
> >> to lose focus the outset on the main idea.
> >
> > I wasn't thinking along the lines of the cafe selling the
> > comics.
>
> That wasn't what I had in mind either. I was thinking
> more along the lines of coffee mugs, t-shirts, etc.
Aaahhh! Know I understand your insanity. Yes, I agree those would be good
things to sell on the side.
George Demmer
"Scott T. Jensen" <s...@charter.net> wrote in
news:adbkd...@enews4.newsguy.com:
>> A couple of thoughts I would add to the discussion...
>
> Hmmm. I read more than just two below, George. ;-)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Wanna make sommething of it? ;-)
>> And keep in mind that most cafes
>> do a big chunk of their business in take-out, so there is
>> no chair usage at all.
>
> Hmmm. That hasn't been my experience with cafes ... at least on State
> Street. It's not like people can pull up, jump out of their cars, get
> a cup of jo, and take off again quickly. You have to go to one of the
> big parking ramps and then walk at few minutes to get to the cafes.
I see that the "no cars" scenario would alter things a bit, but there
must be offices (and maybe apartments?) nearby. So on their way into the
office in the morning people stop by for a cup to take in with them...or
maybe a couple more for their co-workers? Salespeople making a sales call
will pick up a couple of mocha-triple-latte-whatevers to bring to the
meeting to impress the prospect and make them obligated to sit down and
talk for a few minutes...etc.
Here in Vancouver, the downtown places with the outdoor seating would
probably be quite similar to what you are describing, but they still have
a lot of take-out business.
> My observation is that most do buy and sit down to drink theirs. My
> observations also show that those that bring something to read stay
> longer and buy more.
Most of the sit-down business occurs when people go together and
socialize over the drinks. You're basically planning to replace that
scenario with the "socially inept loner" scenario (what can I say, Comic-
book Guy from The Simpsons is a powerful prototype! :-)). Around here,
cafes also serve as major pick-up spots, which you will also largely
eliminate as a possibility (unless there is a substantial gay comic-book
audience). I wonder how all that will affect the length-and-frequency-of-
stay situation?
>> Some market research should help you here. Finding
>> out the average sale, take-out / dine-in ratios, and daily
>> average number of customers for a typical cafe would
>> allow you to do the math and see if the concept is even
>> feasible while charging less that $10 for a cup of coffee.
>
> Good point. I'll bring this up. Then again, anyone know where these
> numbers might be on the web?
No, sorry. How about annual reports from Starbucks and any other public
companies in the industry?
>> But why not put on sale those paintings/drawings
>> by the cartoonists? They'll be happier to send
>> them to you if they make some cold hard cash for
>> them every time you sell one.
>
> That's an option we can present to them. If they do, we'll put a
> small price tag on them. Not for-sale, no price tag.
Ummm...right. You mean a small tag, not a small price. Just checking! :-)
>> Finally, I'm not sure I agree with you that selling
>> comics would be a bad idea. Just because people
>> spend time in a library doesn't mean they don't buy
>> books! In fact, those are some of the heaviest
>> book-buyers. If they read a comic they particularly
>> like, they may want to buy a copy for their collection.
>> Or they can't read ALL the comics at the cafe, so
>> they read the ones they only have a middling interest
>> in, but buy their favorites to take home and read at
>> their leisure. Why not plan to put a couple more of
>> those comic stores out of business by taking it away
>> from them?
>
> One, it is a matter of space. To do both a comicbook store and cafe
> would almost require double the space.
Yup. That's true, although probably not double the space if you made
effective use of it. Especially since you mentioned that you wanted the
seating to be in singles rather than groupings. Comic displays could
possibly be used as dividers in some way.
> Two, I would hope they cannot read ALL the comics during one visit. I
> would hope they come back again and again to read more and thus buy
> more drinks and snacks. Having so many comics is to encourage repeat
> visit and more than just once a month when the new comics come out.
Agreed. But I would use the library analogy again where people still go
frequently and don't buy everything they can't read at one sitting! I
think that will still hold true in the cafe even if there are comics for
sale.
> Three, I wouldn't be surprised that the cafe would kill off all but
> one comicbook store in town. Might not, but I'd put a fiver on that
> it would.
You're probably right (if they are run the way most businesses of that
ilk are), but that would be a good thing if you could pick up the slack,
wouldn't it?
Scott T. Jensen
"George Demmer" wrote:
> "Scott T. Jensen" <s...@charter.net> wrote:
> > George wrote:
> >> And keep in mind that most cafes
> >> do a big chunk of their business in take-out, so
> >> there is no chair usage at all.
> >
> > Hmmm. That hasn't been my experience with cafes
> > ... at least on State Street. It's not like people can
> > pull up, jump out of their cars, get a cup of jo, and
> > take off again quickly. You have to go to one of the
> > big parking ramps and then walk at few minutes to
> > get to the cafes.
>
> I see that the "no cars" scenario would alter things a bit,
> but there must be offices (and maybe apartments?)
> nearby.
Not really close by and not that many. State Street is a lot of one-story
shops. Huge college student populations, but they tend to sit and drink
their espressos.
> > My observation is that most do buy and sit down to
> > drink theirs. My observations also show that those
> > that bring something to read stay longer and buy
> > more.
>
> Most of the sit-down business occurs when people go
> together and socialize over the drinks.
Nah, on State Street most are people just there by themselves. The ones
that stay long bring books or homework.
> You're basically planning to replace that scenario with
> the "socially inept loner" scenario (what can I say,
> Comicbook Guy from The Simpsons is a powerful
> prototype! :-)).
Well, that was a rather unkind statement, young man. No apologize and no
dessert for you tonight.
I would more rather simply say it was going for the comicbook fans. If
you've ever been to a comicbook store, it is quite a social gathering place.
Yes, there are the weirdoes, but I don't know of a place that doesn't
attract its "fair" share of those.
> Around here, cafes also serve as major pick-up
> spots, which you will also largely eliminate as a
> possibility (unless there is a substantial gay
> comic-book audience).
The comicbook cafe would likely have some of the pick-up aspect since there
is a significant minority of women into comicbooks around here. Also, this
is Madison, Wisconsin and it does have a rather large gay populations, both
male and female. If that happens, it happens and my friend's a pretty
laid-back guy in that regards so it should be any problem. Like most of the
Midwest, everything's a bit more low-key so there's not that many flaming
gays here. Those seem to head to San Francisco.
> I wonder how all that will affect the length-and-frequency-of-
> stay situation?
I think the comicbooks would be the thing that would anchor drinks to their
chairs.
> > Three, I wouldn't be surprised that the cafe would kill
> > off all but one comicbook store in town. Might not,
> > but I'd put a fiver on that it would.
>
> You're probably right (if they are run the way most
> businesses of that ilk are), but that would be a good
> thing if you could pick up the slack, wouldn't it?
Not necessarily. I could see comicbook stores actually recommending the
cafe to browsers that seem to be more reading than looking to buy. ;-) In
fact, I could see the cafe helping comicbook store sales as the cafe gets
people hooked on a comicbook title that they eventually "must" have and
"must" have all the old issues they've yet to read. Also, again, comicbooks
easily lose their value through usage (the oils of your fingers smear the
inks and the heat of your fingers warps the paper) so I think you'd be
losing a lot of issues this way. Now you could have a sort of "display"
model of each title and then simply prohibit any reading of for-sale issues,
but again, I don't think the sales (i.e., profits) would justify the space
and it would -- as I've mentioned elsewhere in this thread -- change the
cafe's atmosphere to something I'm not sure would have a good impact on the
bottomline for the cafe.
Ron Clarey
>> > Three, I wouldn't be surprised that the cafe would kill
>> > off all but one comicbook store in town. Might not,
>> > but I'd put a fiver on that it would.
Have you considered partnering with a comic store? You provide the cafe
and they provide the comics which they can obtain easier than you. The
shop can offer damaged or out of date comics etc. Offer a 10% discount
for any one buying from the comic store and they could offer a free
coffee from anyone who spends more than $20 excluding any other
freebies. Why only stick at comics and not use magazines?
When I went to Kissimmee in Florida for a holiday I needed an Internet
cafe this cafe had a pair of sofas for lounging on and they had the
comedy channel on all the time it was a great place to chill out. My
taxi driver had never been inside before and enjoyed the rest. I made
sure the meter wasn't running :-) is this the sort of atmosphere you are
trying to create?
--
Ron Clarey
Translaters.net
HTTP://www.translaters.net
SteveWa
out of bizness in 15 days!
to generate better cash flow, you could just selling time, $5 to spend
an hour in the cafe, reading anything you want. everybody who comes in
has to get signed up as a member, there's your potential for a mailing
list. and customer tracking. first timers get 1/2 hour free to try it
out. people sign in when they enter, you just keep checking the list
every 15 to see who needs to pay up.
plus add a couple of internet computers, some nintendos; xbox units,
so dudes and dudettes could game each other, sell Sobe and MounDew,
(coffee for dad), pop tarts, lots of high margin snackies. rent cd
walkmans, have a cd library to listen to, have lego tables, yamaha
dj-x keyboards (instant dj - only 1 finger needed), get an air
conditioner for the sweaty summers...
basically make a place where anybody could go to escape their parents
(or spouse) for a few hours, create an underground culture. the kidz
will bring the money and the buzz.
you could get the shopping mall owners to fund it to get the kids out
of the malls :-)
iBox
I think its a great idea! Every business needs an "edge" and this would
truly make it original! Here's a few ideas, do with it what you want..
-posters of comic book characters on the wall.
-paint the table and chairs to match certain superheros, ie green chairs,
yellow table for Green Lanturn.
-name your food/drinks to relate to comicbooks, ie Superhero sandwich,
Dynamic Drinks (dynamic dual),
Caped Crapes, etc.
Then, once it takes off - franchise!
--
RFS
iBox Technologies
www.iboxtech.ca
Industrial & Security Computer Cabinets