PIGMAN!!!!
SnipeUNblue
attack everyone, from one end of philosophy to the other. From Snipe all the
way to Olson.
Snipe
S. Olson
'Recognized Authority' on something; that when he makes a
pronouncement, it comes straight from the Burning Bush. He has picked
the GeeBees as his topic.
S. Olson
PGISSource
>He has picked
>the GeeBees as his topic.
Really? I thought you said all I talked about was "Pothier." Though he is a bit
of a goofy bastard, isn't he? Remember when he accused Gray of being a witch?
Heck. Even Pitcavage has repeatedly had to tell the boy to shut up.
Mr. Wizard
PGISSource
>I think Pigman is the worst poster we have
>on this group because he seems to
>attack everyone, from one end of philosophy
>to the other.
Not really. I only attack those of you who are variants on a certain variety of
the "right." The fact is that you, Olson, "Pothier," et al are really just
kissin' cousins. But it wasn't *me* who accused Gray of being a witch. No. That
was our boy "Pothier."
Further and as old timers know, I've had good relations with the *TRUE* antis
like Kaa, Randy, Medintz, etc. As well as quite workable debate relationships
with "militia" types like Joe, Arlin, et al.
So really, Snipe. You're talking out of your pothier. But that's to be expected
with you zealots.
Mr. Wizard
S. Olson
Jesus, Pigman. I am losing count. For the fourth time, I am not
interested in your fight with Mr. Pothier. Go somewhere else with it.
Maybe the inside of your closet.
Pigman, you desperately want to be an authority on the GeeBees but you
can't be one for four main reasons:
1. Your Pothier obsession.
2. You don't know what you're talking about.
3. Your total lack of reasoning skills.
4. You are either insane or pretend to be.
S. Olson
PGISSource
right:
>Pigman,
Don't you little righwing punkers often whimper about name-calling? Seems you
haven't an honest bone in your body. And no backbone at all. Not even a
cartilaginous one.
>you desperately want to be an authority
>on the GeeBees
Actually, it's been a long-established fact that the "militias" per se are not
an area that I'm overly concerned about. Pitcavage and I agreed on that. I
don't even stress myself as a pro- or anti- on the militia topic. No, my main
focus is on zealots in general and their propensity for violence primarily as
it relates to crimes against women and women's clinics. At one end of the
spectrum that includes nuts like you and your little Aryan supporting boy
"Pothier." Remember, it was "Pothier" who encouraged the clinic bombing
advocate David Donnell and even took up Donnell's torch of religious hate. A
hate that is expressed among a variety of Army of God and similarly violent
activists. Your boy plays right to that crowd. No shock. From his pretended
ignorance about religious commonlaw types in Wisconsin on out, he's in his own
provable actions in this group supported such types every step of the way.
As to wanting to be an "authority?" Nope. I leave that to folks like Pitcavage.
If you review my material, or get an adult to help you on that, you'll find
that I've always claimed that I have no pretense of expertise, merely an
interest. Analyzing security issues means I must poke at and evaluate *ALL* of
you nuts, not just the "militias."
BTW, Pitcavage has interest in zealots and their evolution in activism, too. Go
figure.
>4. You are either insane or pretend to be.
Oh, I freely admit to some of the latter. I've always stated that a lot of my
material is tongue-in-cheek, meant as much to provoke thought as anything else.
So I'm sorry little boy, you lose again. Now quit stomping your widdle feet,
toddle on off, and just sit quietly and fondle your little pothier, okay? Don't
pretend to have a clue, little boy. You clearly don't. That's why it's really
just you and your boyfriend tilting at windmills, fluttering your manicures,
and muttering at Snipe these days. Rather pathetic, dontcha know. Is it any
wonder that I make fun of you in your own style?
Mr. Wizard
S. Olson
PGISSource wrote:
> Actually, it's been a long-established fact that the "militias" per
se are not
> an area that I'm overly concerned about. Pitcavage and I agreed on
that. I
> don't even stress myself as a pro- or anti- on the militia topic. No,
my main
> focus is on zealots in general and their propensity for violence
primarily as
> it relates to crimes against women and women's clinics. At one end of
the
> spectrum that includes nuts like you and your little Aryan supporting
boy
> "Pothier." Remember, it was "Pothier" who encouraged the clinic
bombing
> advocate David Donnell and even took up Donnell's torch of religious
hate.
Yeah, yeah yeah. I knew you'd try and bring up Pothier-World, Pigman.
This is the sixth time you've had to be told: NONE OF US CARE. And
remember all those 'real antis' you supposedly got along with? NONE OF
THEM CARED, EITHER. You want to get into a flame-war with Pothier? Go
ahead. Just don't try to involve any of us, Pigman. WE DON'T CARE. The
only person it's important to is the one in your mirror.
> As to wanting to be an "authority?" Nope. I leave that to folks like
Pitcavage.
No you don't. I believe there are several postings by you in the 90s in
which you slammed Dr. Pitcavage and his expertise.
> >4. You are either insane or pretend to be.
>
> Oh, I freely admit to some of the latter. I've always stated that a
lot of my
> material is tongue-in-cheek, meant as much to provoke thought as
anything else.
Outside of Irwin Schiff, who admitted that he was crazy in a legal
brief, I don't know of anybody who readily admits that he is insane. So
I really wouldn't expect you to say, "Yes, I'm as unstable as a kid on
crack."
Instead, you say "a lot of my material is tongue-in-cheek, meant as
much to provoke thought as anything else." I don't thik your little
Stupid Man routine inspires much thought. How much thought does it take
for someone to twirl their index fingers at their temples when talking
to you?
S. Olson
Joseph T. Adams
I'd have to strongly disagree here.
I frequently disagree with Jim, but it's simply a matter of public
record that, for nearly a decade, he's maintained a consistent and
productive dialogue with people on varying sides of the issues
discussed here, myself included.
Meanwhile, although I agree with you about some things, you've posted
enough racist diatribes that you would not have been allowed to
participate in any capacity in the Militia organization of which I was
a part (it was explicitly non-racist and out of necessity became, de
facto, *anti*-racist as well). In addition you haven't managed much
genuine dialogue with anyone.
I think that not only you, but many of us, myself included, have
things we could learn from Jim.
One of those things is that genuine discussion doesn't require
ideological conformity, but it *does* require basic respect for one
another.
Joe
Joseph Pothier
Joseph T. Adams wrote:
> SnipeUNblue <snipe...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>> I think Pigman is the worst poster we have on this group because he seems to
>>attack everyone, from one end of philosophy to the other. From Snipe all the
>>way to Olson.
>
> I'd have to strongly disagree here.
>
> I frequently disagree with Jim, but it's simply a matter of public
> record that, for nearly a decade, he's maintained a consistent and
> productive dialogue with people on varying sides of the issues
> discussed here, myself included.
>
To use a one word phrase, Mr. Adams-- Bull!
Last year the poster with the e-mail address PGISS...@aol.com,
referred to you as Jim, and known to the rest of us as Wizard or Wiz-bo,
made a total of 436 posts in this newsgroup, of those 293, or 67%, were
attack/hate posts using ad hominem attacks and lies about other
newsgroup members. A full 2/3rds of this man's postings are nothing but
rants and raves. His behavior in this newsgroup over the last eight
years hardly constitutes 'a productive dialogue' of any kind.
As you are, and have been, one of the more vociferous pro-militia
posters in this newsgroup over the years, however, I can see why you try
to defend this individual as his ad hominem attacks and lies have been
directed at the anti-militia faction.
Birds of a feather....... Mr. Adams!
Yours,
JP
Happy Harpy
PGISSource
>To use a one word phrase, Mr. Adams-- Bull!
Look, "Pothier." Folks generally are aware that in addition to defending things
like public education, landuse planning, environmental policy, immigrant
rights, etc, I've also gotten along about as well with various folks on the
"militia" side as I have withg those like Kaa, Randy, Stu, Mike, etc who
constituted the bulk of the *real* antis posting hereabouts. Hey, I even keep
in touch with some. And I generally leave Gray alone, it was *YOU* who accused
him of being a witch, as you recall. Go figure.
Have I picked on Pitcavage? Yes. But only to the same level that he
contemptuously picked on others. And remember, he lashed out at me, first. I
merely handed the kid back what he quite clearly at the time thought was
appropriate behavior.
Remember Pitcavage's "Looky Marthy!" cartoons? His derisive posts? His
incessant name-calling? Yet some have the gall to whimper when he is treated
similarly? No. What's good for the goose, is good for the gander. But later
Pitcavage began to question the development of zealots within activist groups.
While I'm sure that he still despises me, I no longer have reason to slam on
him. He's clearly learning and I agree with most of what he strives to do even
though I think watchdogs also need to be watched.
We also all know that nuts like Snipe desperately need to believe, in order to
sustain their own zealotry, that pro-violence halfwits like you and Olson
represent "liberals," the "left," and the "sheeple." In the end this helps make
your two fringe groups de facto allies via that odd symbiosis. Your kind of
zealot don't fight hate, you feed it. You are part of how nuts like Snipe feel
they can justify their own insanities. Still, the fact is that rightwing
extremists like you and your hopped up buddy Olson are merely cultural
outriders in love with hate. The American people, while more conservative than
I care for, are still far more rational than your sick kind. For this reason,
even Pitcavage has had to tell you to shut up, boy.
Now, do I attack you? Of course. And not just for the reason noted above. You
are, after all, a *proven* supporter of various Aryan and other extremist
groups in terms of peddling their very agendas of hate. You deserve attack. You
are not an "anti," you are merely a little Wisconsin Aryan loser who represents
no rational faction, least of all ADL nor even the American people.
Now let us consider the *real* domain of what constitutes "hate posts" similar
to that which ADL opposes. The following are SOME of the many, many posts where
pro-Aryan activist "Pothier" has employed religious hate. By count, he is
actually among the more prolific pro-Aryan posters to appear in this newsgroup.
While perhaps he should have been banned along with his National Alliance
brethren, he initially escaped by pretending to be a Pitcavage supporter. Oh,
well. Mistakes happen.
in "Re: Atlanta - Pipe Bomb. Militia to get the blame" on 1996/08/06 "Pothier"
wrote:
"TELL ME MORMON **BOY** ABOUT THAT UNDERWARE YOU WARE."
And in "Re: OUTLAW the MILITIA!" on 1996/08/06 "Pothier" wrote:
"Boy, you just called me boy! ***ARE YOU A MORMON,
BOY?**** TELL ME ***BOY*** WHAT IS THIS I HEAR
ABOUT YOUNG MORMON WOMEN BEING INTERESTED
IN SOME SORT OF UNDERWARE YOU ***BOYS*** ARE
SUPPOSED TO KEEP ON ALL THE TIME. AND WHILE
WE ARE AT IT ***BOY*** JUST HOW MANY WIVES DO
YOUINS' PLAN ON HAVIN'.
While it's known the "Pothier" is not African-American, I'm told that convicts
and ex-convicts, and especially Aryan gang types, often get upset when called
"boy." Perhaps other groups do, too. So any guess on his claims of an obviously
irrational basis for employing religious hate over such a trivial slight,
however, would be speculative. However most of us guys, at least those of us
who don't hate women, simply aren't that bothered by the "boy" tag. It takes
*major* insecurities or other history for a reaction like our boy "Pothier"
displayed.
Oh, sure. "Pothier" did try a Texas two-step he claimed to be some sort of an
apology. In "Re: What's in a Name?" on 1996/08/10 he wrote:
"Personally I have nothing against Mormons. One of my
best friends is one, that is how I knew about the underware
thing. Mr. Perry Eidelbus chose to deliberately insult me by
calling me a 'boy.'
This comes off sounding like the way in which some Aryan supremacists talk
about Jews or African-Americans while in mixed company, doesn't it? And even if
one were to accept this supposed apology, "Pothier's" long-continued use of
religious hate as applied to not only Mormons but other non-mainstream belief
sets shows how false it truly was. Probably why he never bothered to *actually*
apologize to the ones he had directed the hate toward, Perry and the LDS.
Instead, his meager effort was directed solely at a third party.
While I omit the body of the posts to save space, some other of "Pothier's"
posts that folks might want to look up include the following titles:
From: Joseph Pothier (jos...@worldnet.att.net)
Subject: !! Wiccan Initiation Rites [Pt. 1] !!
Newsgroups: misc.activism.militia
Date: 1998/11/25
While "Pothier" claimed this to be a
retaliatory post, a check of the
archives shows that what he pretends
to be retaliating against didn't
happen. This is typical of the Aryan
fringes, though. They often lay claim
to martyrdom to try to justify their
own hate.
From: Joseph Pothier (jos...@worldnet.att.net)
Subject: Re: Liberal Control
Newsgroups: misc.activism.militia
Date: 1998/11/22
Like most rightwing extremists,
our resident little Aryan boy "Pothier"
truly hates liberals.
From: Joseph Pothier (jos...@worldnet.att.net)
Subject: Re: !! Wiccan Initiation Rites!!
Newsgroups: misc.activism.militia
Date: 1998/12/04
Although his purported justification is a
verifiable non-item, "Pothier" wrote:
>Be advised I will continue to use
>Wicca as a lever against Mr. Wiz-bo.
>He lies about me,
so ... pointing out that "Pothier" uses
religious hate is lying? Not according
to Google. But then the little Wisconsin
pasty-white Aryan boy says:
>I expose some truths about Wicca
>using Wiccan web sites. I just
>that kind of son-of-a-bitch.
<chuckle> You gotta love the boy's
grammar. He sounds like one of those
'rural militia' types that Lindstedt
brags on so much.
From: Joseph Pothier (jos...@worldnet.att.net)
Subject: Re: Attn: Head Happy Harpy
Newsgroups: misc.activism.militia
Date: 1999/03/16
From: Joseph Pothier (jos...@worldnet.att.net)
Subject: Re: CAPJOHN Caps Himself Again
Newsgroups: misc.activism.militia
Date: 1998/11/01
this one was interesting because
Pothier" complained that because
nobody answer affirmatively to his
own personal fantasy about
"five-fold kissing" which he thought
to be a sex game, it was a position
of "defensiveness." In point of fact
it was just that "Pothier" was so
absurdly ignorant in his assertion
that no response was possible. After
all, how would you respond to a
pedophile? "Pothier" was behaving
much in the same category of confused
sexuality. Pothier's ignorance of
Voodoo was rather interesting, too.
From: Joseph Pothier (jos...@worldnet.att.net)
Subject: Re: U.S. Army recruits Witches, recognizes as legitimate religion!
Newsgroups: misc.activism.militia
Date: 1999/05/18
In this (as in much of his material)
we can see how "Pothier" hates the
feds and their laws
From: Joseph Pothier (jos...@worldnet.att.net)
Subject: Re: Valgosi are neo-right cultists (also too stupic to handle thread
titles)
Newsgroups: misc.activism.militia
Date: 1998/12/12
this was one where "Pothier" tried
to make wild claims about "warlocks"
in his abject ignorance.
From: Joseph Pothier (jos...@worldnet.att.net)
Subject: Re: A question for Joseph Pothier, ineptly closeted neo-nazi
Newsgroups: misc.activism.militia
Date: 1998/11/24
What more need be said? The boy is
a three-dollar-bill homophobic
Aryan
From: Joseph Pothier (jos...@worldnet.att.net)
Subject: Re: And His Buddy, Joey (was-CAPJOHN Caps Himself Again)
Newsgroups: misc.activism.militia
Date: 1998/11/01
This was almost funny, because "Pothier"
asked Shockley,
"Your post seems a weeee
bit too defensive, are you a Wiccan also?"
It's amazing the strange paths down which
a sexual deviant like "Pothier" can be
led by religious hate. In pursuit of his
own sexual fantasy, "Pothier" asked Gray,
"I doubt you have a mind, much
less an inquiring one. Are
you a Wiccan? If so, have you been
five-fold kissed?"
Wow. Do you think ADL encourages such
things? Nah. They don't. But nuts like
our Aryan boy "Pothier" hate them
enough to try to make us believe they
do.
I'd suggest that you just toddle on off with Olson and both of you just sit and
toss your little pothiers, "Pothier." That's about all you likely can handle
without looking like the Aryan idiot you so clearly are.
Mr. Wizard
S. Olson
We all know what YOU look like, Pigman.
In the future, knock off the peckerwood sexual fantasies linking me and
Mr. Pothier. Don't know him, never have. You wanna flame him, try
getting stuff right for a change.
S. Olson