Re: The love affair with AVG and Avast
Bigbruva
Out of interest, which Microsoft AV app are you testing? OneCare,
Safety.live.com, Antigen, Malware Removal Tool?
BB
"David H. Lipman" <DLipman~nospam~@Verizon.Net> wrote in message
news:eelKfl$$FHA....@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>I don't understand the love affair that so many have with Avast and AVG.
>Here I post a well
> known Downloader Trojan and Avast and AFG don't recognize this Trojan.
> Even the sh!tty
> ClamAV does.
>
> However, I should state that Microsoft also failed to recognize it as well
> ;-)
>
> AntiVir 6.33.0.61 12.13.2005 TR/Dldr.TComBil.L.1
> Avast 4.6.695.0 12.13.2005 no virus found
> AVG 718 12.08.2005 no virus found
> Avira 6.33.0.61 12.13.2005 TR/Dldr.TComBil.L.1
> BitDefender 7.2 12.13.2005 Trojan.Downloader.Agent.UF
> CAT-QuickHeal 8.00 12.13.2005 TrojanDownloader.Vidlo.y
> ClamAV devel-20051108 12.12.2005 Trojan.Small-152
> DrWeb 4.33 12.13.2005 Trojan.DownLoader.5869
> eTrust-Iris 7.1.194.0 12.13.2005 Win32/SillyDL.9760!Trojan
> eTrust-Vet 12.3.3.0 12.13.2005 Win32/DlWreck.S
> Ewido ?? 12.13.2005 TrojanDownloader.Agent.uf
> Fortinet 2.54.0.0 12.12.2005 W32/Agent.UF!tr
> F-Prot 3.16c 12.12.2005 security risk named W32/Downloader.KZW
> Ikarus 0.2.59.0 12.13.2005 Trojan-Downloader.Win32.Agent.UF
> Kaspersky 4.0.2.24 12.13.2005 Trojan-Downloader.Win32.Vidlo.y
> McAfee 4648 12.12.2005 Downloader-AAP.b
> Microsoft ?? 12.13.2003 no virus found
> NOD32v2 1.1320 12.12.2005 Win32/TrojanDownloader.Agent.NDD
> Norman 5.70.10 12.13.2005 W32/DLoader.NNC
> Panda 8.02.00 12.13.2005 Trj/Downloader.GTG
> Sophos 4.00.0 12.13.2005 Troj/Agent-UF
> Symantec 8.0 12.13.2005 Download.Trojan
> Trend Micro 103 12.13.2005 TROJ_YABE.F
> TheHacker 5.9.1.054 12.13.2005 no virus found
> VBA32 3.10.5 12.13.2005 Trojan-Downloader.Win32.Agent.uf
>
> --
> Dave
> http://www.claymania.com/removal-trojan-adware.html
> http://www.ik-cs.com/got-a-virus.htm
>
>
>
David H. Lipman
| I think the love affair is because they are free ;-)
| Out of interest, which Microsoft AV app are you testing? OneCare,
| Safety.live.com, Antigen, Malware Removal Tool?
|
| BB
Online AV scanner - http://safety.live.com/site/en-US/default.htm .
It uses the same signatures as OneCare and is a superset of MRT.
Panda_man
I never install them on clients computers although most of them have heard
of them.If someone wants cheap and good AV ,let him/her get F-prot.
Panda_man
--
Let''s beat malware black and blue
Panda TruPrevent - the most intelligent technology to combat unknown malware
http://www.pandasoftware.com
http://www.microsoft.com/protect
Mike Hall (MS-MVP)
clients.. nobody has reported any problems, and I do a free monthly service
call on all clients to ensure that all is well..
To present date, all is well.. sorry to disappoint anybody..
--
Mike Hall
MVP - Windows Shell/User
"Panda_man" <Pand...@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:E57F3DD4-9CC5-46F8...@microsoft.com...
David H. Lipman
| I have AVG running on all four networked computers here, and all of my
| clients.. nobody has reported any problems, and I do a free monthly service
| call on all clients to ensure that all is well..
|
| To present date, all is well.. sorry to disappoint anybody..
|
Some are lucky !
AntiVir 6.33.0.61 12.12.2005 TR/Luhn
Avast 4.6.695.0 12.10.2005 no virus found <----------<<
AVG 718 12.08.2005 no virus found <----------<<
Avira 6.33.0.61 12.12.2005 TR/Luhn
BitDefender 7.2 12.13.2005 Trojan.Spy.Luhn.A
CAT-QuickHeal 8.00 12.12.2005 TrojanSpy.Luhn.a
ClamAV devel-20051108 12.12.2005 Trojan.Spy.W32.Luhn
DrWeb 4.33 12.12.2005 Trojan.Sklog
eTrust-Iris 7.1.194.0 12.13.2005 Win32/Luhn!Spy!Dropper
eTrust-Vet 12.3.3.0 12.12.2005 Win32/Luhn.A
Fortinet 2.54.0.0 12.12.2005 W32/SpyLuhn.A-dr
F-Prot 3.16c 12.12.2005 security risk or a "backdoor" program
Ikarus 0.2.59.0 12.13.2005 no virus found
Kaspersky 4.0.2.24 12.13.2005 Trojan-Spy.Win32.Luhn.a
McAfee 4649 12.13.2005 Keylog-Sklog.dr
NOD32v2 1.1320 12.12.2005 no virus found
Norman 5.70.10 12.12.2005 no virus found
Panda 8.02.00 12.12.2005 Trj/Spy.Luhn
Sophos 4.00.0 12.12.2005 Troj/Dropper-BV
Symantec 8.0 12.13.2005 Trojan.Dropper
TheHacker 5.9.1.053 12.12.2005 no virus found
Trend Micro 993 12.09.2005 TROJ_DROPPER.VK
VBA32 3.10.5 12.12.2005 Trojan-Spy.Win32.Luhn.a
AntiVir 6.33.0.61 12.12.2005 BDS/Agent.QN
Avast 4.6.695.0 12.10.2005 no virus found <----------<<
AVG 718 12.08.2005 no virus found <----------<<
Avira 6.33.0.61 12.12.2005 BDS/Agent.QN
BitDefender 7.2 12.13.2005 Backdoor.Agent.QN
CAT-QuickHeal 8.00 12.12.2005 no virus found
ClamAV devel-20051108 12.12.2005 no virus found
DrWeb 4.33 12.12.2005 DLOADER.Trojan
eTrust-Iris 7.1.194.0 12.13.2005 Win32/StartPage.Vall.57856!Troja
eTrust-Vet 12.3.3.0 12.12.2005 no virus found
Fortinet 2.54.0.0 12.12.2005 suspicious
F-Prot 3.16c 12.12.2005 security risk named W32/Backdoor.HKT
Ikarus 0.2.59.0 12.13.2005 Backdoor.Win32.Agent.QN
Kaspersky 4.0.2.24 12.13.2005 Backdoor.Win32.Agent.qn
McAfee 4649 12.13.2005 StartPage-CL
NOD32v2 1.1320 12.12.2005 probably unknown NewHeur_PE virus
Norman 5.70.10 12.12.2005 no virus found
Panda 8.02.00 12.12.2005 Bck/Agent.AXY
Sophos 4.00.0 12.12.2005 Troj/Agent-FN
Symantec 8.0 12.13.2005 no virus found
TheHacker 5.9.1.053 12.12.2005 no virus found
VBA32 3.10.5 12.12.2005 suspected of Trojan-Dropper.Delf.40
Lance
Leythos said the following on 12/13/2005 16:24:
> In article <OU$xTGEAG...@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl>,
> DLipman~nospam~@Verizon.Net says...
>
>>From: "Mike Hall (MS-MVP)" <mike...@mvps.org>
>>
>>| I have AVG running on all four networked computers here, and all of my
>>| clients.. nobody has reported any problems, and I do a free monthly service
>>| call on all clients to ensure that all is well..
>>|
>>| To present date, all is well.. sorry to disappoint anybody..
>>|
>>
>>
>>Some are lucky !
>
>
> We have a BUNCH of Sorority residents that opted for AVG. I've had to
> fix a few of them that had compromised machines due to a AOL IM nasty
> that was undetected - their ones using Norton/Symantec were not
> infected.
>
So you get to visit Sorotity houses that have AVG installed...
OK, I'd like to see David's answer to this one.
Lance
*****
David H. Lipman
>> We have a BUNCH of Sorority residents that opted for AVG. I've had to
>> fix a few of them that had compromised machines due to a AOL IM nasty
>> that was undetected - their ones using Norton/Symantec were not
>> infected.
>>
| So you get to visit Sorotity houses that have AVG installed...
|
| OK, I'd like to see David's answer to this one.
|
| Lance
| *****
Not much I can say. I already knew that he administers Symantec AV and that he supports
Sorority computer assets. And I had joked with him about supporting those assets.
Especially since he's a "hands on" kind of guy. :-)
Wouldn't you like to be supporting Sorority assets at the U. of So. Cal. and checking for
Porn Dialers ?
They have Sororities on your campus -- Right ?
:-)
Charlie Tame
"David H. Lipman" <DLipman~nospam~@Verizon.Net> wrote in message
news:eelKfl$$FHA....@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>I don't understand the love affair that so many have with Avast and AVG.
>Here I post a well
> known Downloader Trojan and Avast and AFG don't recognize this Trojan.
> Even the sh!tty
> ClamAV does.
AVG and AVAST are Anti VIRUS systems, what you are complaining they didn't
detect is a TROJAN. Rather like calling an electrician to fix a leaking
toilet is it not?
See if you can sneak one past BoClean :)
Charlie
David H. Lipman
|
| AVG and AVAST are Anti VIRUS systems, what you are complaining they didn't
| detect is a TROJAN. Rather like calling an electrician to fix a leaking
| toilet is it not?
|
| See if you can sneak one past BoClean :)
|
| www.nsclean.com
|
| Charlie
|
ALL the items listed in the report are AV.
The only difference between viruses and trojans is self-replication.
Trojans have always been in the realm of AV scanners.
BOClean is more like anti spyware in its actions.
Lance
David H. Lipman thought carefully and wrote on 12/13/2005 6:37 PM:
> From: "Lance" <lltbhill@link_earth.net>
>
>
>>>We have a BUNCH of Sorority residents that opted for AVG. I've had to
>>>fix a few of them that had compromised machines due to a AOL IM nasty
>>>that was undetected - their ones using Norton/Symantec were not
>>>infected.
>>>
>
> | So you get to visit Sorotity houses that have AVG installed...
> |
> | OK, I'd like to see David's answer to this one.
> |
> | Lance
> | *****
>
> Not much I can say. I already knew that he administers Symantec AV and that he supports
> Sorority computer assets. And I had joked with him about supporting those assets.
> Especially since he's a "hands on" kind of guy. :-)
>
> Wouldn't you like to be supporting Sorority assets at the U. of So. Cal. and checking for
> Porn Dialers ?
> They have Sororities on your campus -- Right ?
>
> :-)
>
Of course I would and of course we do. That, plus a football team that
does OK and there's ~25 computers that I take care of.
I don't know about Leythos, but the coeds around here look at me like
I'm dear old dad.... :)
Lance
*****
Lisa Simpson
"Mike Hall (MS-MVP)" <mike...@mvps.org> wrote in message
news:OR6Mi8DA...@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
Mister Kurtz
"Lisa Simpson" <no...@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:uPR3p7K...@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> Same here; what's the poster's problem w/AVG?
Did you read the data that was in the post? Of all the scanners listed
only AVG, Avast, MS, & The Hacker didn't recognize the downloader
trojan. Why would anyone want to use a scanner that is so far behind the
curve? Sure AVG & Avast are free, but the time spent cleaning one
infection is more expensive than NOD or Kaspersky. At least the way I
value my time.
To each their own.
--
MK
David H. Lipman
| I don't understand the love affair that so many have with Avast and AVG. Here I post a
| well known Downloader Trojan and Avast and AFG don't recognize this Trojan. Even the
| sh!tty ClamAV does.
|
| However, I should state that Microsoft also failed to recognize it as well ;-)
|
| AntiVir 6.33.0.61 12.13.2005 TR/Dldr.TComBil.L.1
| Avast 4.6.695.0 12.13.2005 no virus found
| AVG 718 12.08.2005 no virus found
| Avira 6.33.0.61 12.13.2005 TR/Dldr.TComBil.L.1
| BitDefender 7.2 12.13.2005 Trojan.Downloader.Agent.UF
| CAT-QuickHeal 8.00 12.13.2005 TrojanDownloader.Vidlo.y
| ClamAV devel-20051108 12.12.2005 Trojan.Small-152
| DrWeb 4.33 12.13.2005 Trojan.DownLoader.5869
| eTrust-Iris 7.1.194.0 12.13.2005 Win32/SillyDL.9760!Trojan
| eTrust-Vet 12.3.3.0 12.13.2005 Win32/DlWreck.S
| Ewido ?? 12.13.2005 TrojanDownloader.Agent.uf
| Fortinet 2.54.0.0 12.12.2005 W32/Agent.UF!tr
| F-Prot 3.16c 12.12.2005 security risk named W32/Downloader.KZW
| Ikarus 0.2.59.0 12.13.2005 Trojan-Downloader.Win32.Agent.UF
| Kaspersky 4.0.2.24 12.13.2005 Trojan-Downloader.Win32.Vidlo.y
| McAfee 4648 12.12.2005 Downloader-AAP.b
| Microsoft ?? 12.13.2003 no virus found
| NOD32v2 1.1320 12.12.2005 Win32/TrojanDownloader.Agent.NDD
| Norman 5.70.10 12.13.2005 W32/DLoader.NNC
| Panda 8.02.00 12.13.2005 Trj/Downloader.GTG
| Sophos 4.00.0 12.13.2005 Troj/Agent-UF
| Symantec 8.0 12.13.2005 Download.Trojan
| Trend Micro 103 12.13.2005 TROJ_YABE.F
| TheHacker 5.9.1.054 12.13.2005 no virus found
| VBA32 3.10.5 12.13.2005 Trojan-Downloader.Win32.Agent.uf
|
AVG and Avast now recognize the this trojan.
Avast 4.6.695.0 12.14.2005 Win32:Trojano-3091
AVG 718 12.14.2005 Downloader.Generic.KWQ
Robert Moir
> I don't understand the love affair that so many have with Avast and
> AVG. Here I post a well known Downloader Trojan and Avast and AFG
> don't recognize this Trojan. Even the sh!tty ClamAV does.
You may remember that I always say they're worth every penny that people
paid for them.
A free AV is better than no AV, providing people understand and accept that
they're making a compromise.
Charlie Tame
"Leythos" <vo...@nowhere.lan> wrote in message
news:hIMnf.187310$tD4.1...@tornado.ohiordc.rr.com...
> In article <u1iCrrF...@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl>, cha...@tames.net
> says...
> Trojan's for a long time.
"Some" yes, mostly those which have a viral component, however Norton have
also been adept at screwing PCs for some time too...
Charlie Tame
"David H. Lipman" <DLipman~nospam~@Verizon.Net> wrote in message
> From: "Charlie Tame" <cha...@tames.net>
>
>
> |
> | AVG and AVAST are Anti VIRUS systems, what you are complaining they
> didn't
> | detect is a TROJAN. Rather like calling an electrician to fix a leaking
> | toilet is it not?
> |
> | See if you can sneak one past BoClean :)
> |
> | www.nsclean.com
> |
> | Charlie
> |
>
> ALL the items listed in the report are AV.
> The only difference between viruses and trojans is self-replication.
> Trojans have always been in the realm of AV scanners.
>
> BOClean is more like anti spyware in its actions.
And spyware is a form of Trojan horse is it not?
You simply answer my observation by making the same observation... Viral =
self replicating. That some non replicating component is not included does
not necessarily imply a major defect. If you want to make comparisons based
on a single omission I suggest you collect some samples or trojans and throw
them at the other systems you claim superiority for and then repeat your
evaluation on a more level playing field. :)
Charlie
Charlie Tame
"Leythos" <vo...@nowhere.lan> wrote in message
> In article <#1NT2PXA...@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl>, cha...@tames.net
> says...
> any issues with thousands of contacts. When it comes to NIS, absolutely,
> it's a total PITA.
Hehe I have to agree, which is a pity.
I did get a month or so test run of Norton Corporate some time back and
frankly the resource hogging and weirdness associated with the retail
products were all missing however I guess one gets used to dealing with
retail customers and the whole brand gets labeled ?
Alun Jones
>And spyware is a form of Trojan horse is it not?
Not necessarily.
Spyware very often describes in excruciating detail exactly what it's going to
do in the rambling EULA that accompanies whatever software you're installing
that brings the spyware along with it.
To my mind, that's the fundamental reason why antivirus and antispyware
approaches are different - virus writers aren't going to sue you for removing
their "product", but spyware writers may very well do so.
Alun.
~~~~
[Please don't email posters, if a Usenet response is appropriate.]
--
Texas Imperial Software | Find us at http://www.wftpd.com or email
23921 57th Ave SE | al...@wftpd.com.
Washington WA 98072-8661 | WFTPD, WFTPD Pro are Windows FTP servers.
Fax/Voice +1(425)807-1787 | Try our NEW client software, WFTPD Explorer.
Mike Hall (MS-MVP)
I use AVG free ed. on the four networked computers in my home.. I haven't
had to clean up anything because 'the free ones are so far behind'..
AVG updates itself daily at around 8.00 am EST, and one has the option of
manually checking for updates that may be released within the ensuing 24
hour period..
Unlike others, one does not have to pay between $40 - $90 for the service,
and a further $30 annually thereafter for a program that is so complex and
invasive that most users install the default program, never actually getting
benefit from the other features provided..
--
Mike Hall
MVP - Windows Shell/User
"Mister Kurtz" <Miste...@invalid.com> wrote in message
news:OGN7mGLA...@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
Charlie Tame
"Alun Jones" <al...@texis.invalid> wrote in message
news:6u6dnevLAvxjgjje...@comcast.com...
> In article <u#OCHVXAG...@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl>, "Charlie Tame"
> <cha...@tames.net> wrote:
>>And spyware is a form of Trojan horse is it not?
>
> Not necessarily.
>
> Spyware very often describes in excruciating detail exactly what it's
> going to
> do in the rambling EULA that accompanies whatever software you're
> installing
> that brings the spyware along with it.
>
> To my mind, that's the fundamental reason why antivirus and antispyware
> approaches are different - virus writers aren't going to sue you for
> removing
> their "product", but spyware writers may very well do so.
>
> Alun.
Hmm, well if you are considering technical definitions I regard a program
you accept in the EULA as "Adware" not "Spyware", so the same program can
actually be both IMO.... if you accept it in the EULA then it's not a
masquerading program but a deceptive legal document :)
Charlie Tame
Generally they are simple to install and require no complicated "Options"
set up, secondly being free removes any excuse for delay in installing.
As you correctly point out most "Users" will probably not get the benefit of
extra options since they are "Users" first and "Admins" second. Not every
driver is a mechanic, but most know where to put water and oil.
There is also the fact that it is going to cost nothing to "Try" whilst
making assessments of other recommendations.
Charlie
"Mike Hall (MS-MVP)" <mike...@mvps.org> wrote in message
news:uIh4qd%23AGH...@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
Mister Kurtz
"Mike Hall (MS-MVP)" <mike...@mvps.org> wrote in message
news:uIh4qd%23AGH...@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
Mike,
How much of your not having to clean up anything is due to your net
savvy and how much is due to AVG? I suspect that your AVG doesn't alert
you much, if at all. I understand the appeal of a free (as in beer) AV
program, but I don't think it's the best solution for many people.
I personally don't find Kaspersky invasive or complex and it's update
frequency much more useful to "most users" that would be more likely to
click on things they shouldn't. NOD32 (IMO) can be a little confusing
when installing, but worth the effort.
Lastly, I'm not so sure that the requests for assistance in this group
and others like it is indicative of the "real garden variety user". The
ones that I come in contact with would be hard pressed to find this
group via Google let alone with a newsreader. I would like to think that
anyone motivated enough to get here looking for help would be able to
handle most AV set ups.
--
MK
Charlie Tame
> How much of your not having to clean up anything is due to your net
> savvy and how much is due to AVG? I suspect that your AVG doesn't alert
> you much, if at all. I understand the appeal of a free (as in beer) AV
> program, but I don't think it's the best solution for many people.
>
> I personally don't find Kaspersky invasive or complex and it's update
> frequency much more useful to "most users" that would be more likely to
> click on things they shouldn't. NOD32 (IMO) can be a little confusing
> when installing, but worth the effort.
>
> Lastly, I'm not so sure that the requests for assistance in this group
> and others like it is indicative of the "real garden variety user". The
> ones that I come in contact with would be hard pressed to find this
> group via Google let alone with a newsreader. I would like to think that
> anyone motivated enough to get here looking for help would be able to
> handle most AV set ups.
>
> --
> MK
One of the most important reasons for suggesting a "Free" program is that
the user is more likely to dash off and get it now rather than wait a week
trying to decide from specs they may not fully understand which of the paid
systems to buy. During that time they may be infected and spread it all over
the place, even when it's a fairly common bug. A "Free" program is better
than none at all and to be honest from what I see the "Paid" versions
generally differ by such things as scanning options and automation rather
than by detection methods or definitions. Not a criticism of your view at
all, you are correct about the "Savvy" 100%, just something I think is
important.
Charlie