Beverly Howard [Ms-MVP/MobileDev] wrote: > afaik, there are no "registry cleaners" for the ppc. you can always > start clean with a hard reset
> it is not necessary to "defrag" solid state memory
Although he could potentially have a microdrive, which being a normal hard drive would possibly benefit from defragging. No idea of PPC defragging tools though, never looked into it myself. I'd use a card reader and defragg it on the desktop personally.
On 17 Jun 2006 07:43:28 -0700, "Skii" <skiingm...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>Where can I get registry cleaner and defrag tools?
I don't know of any registry cleaners for the ppc. I'd do a hard reset AFTER A FULL BACKUP then do a clean install of the software you intend to keep.
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There're several registry cleaner utilities; for example, SKTools, MemMaid. Of the two, I'd go with the former. Make a generic search for "SKTools" in my blog for more info.
-- Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen - Microsoft MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices Please see the Pocket PC Mag Expert Blog (including mine) at http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/ - you will definitely like it.
I know it's hard to believe at first - neither did I believe this before I've done some really extensive, quantitive benchmarks.
--
-- Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen - Microsoft MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices Please see the Pocket PC Mag Expert Blog (including mine) at http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/ - you will definitely like it.
"Tony A." <tony72atgmail.remove.spam.com> wrote in message
> Beverly Howard [Ms-MVP/MobileDev] wrote: >> afaik, there are no "registry cleaners" for the ppc. you can always >> start clean with a hard reset
>> it is not necessary to "defrag" solid state memory
> Although he could potentially have a microdrive, which being a normal > hard drive would possibly benefit from defragging. No idea of PPC > defragging tools though, never looked into it myself. I'd use a card > reader and defragg it on the desktop personally.
Interesting, any chance you could post a link, or is it something you haven't published? I searched your blog, and found a link to a thread that's supposed to contain quantitative results on this, but while it does link to an exhaustive set of tests comparing different format parameters on several brands of card, I can't see any tests comparing before/after defragging, unless I'm being blind.
-- Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen - Microsoft MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices Please see the Pocket PC Mag Expert Blog (including mine) at http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/ - you will definitely like it.
"Tony A." <tony72atgmail.remove.spam.com> wrote in message
> Interesting, any chance you could post a link, or is it something you > haven't published? I searched your blog, and found a link to a thread > that's supposed to contain quantitative results on this, but while it > does link to an exhaustive set of tests comparing different format > parameters on several brands of card, I can't see any tests comparing > before/after defragging, unless I'm being blind.
Well, I already saw that one, in fact that one links to the article that links to the forum thread that I mentioned above. And as with that, there is a comparison of effects of different format parameters, but there is no formal comparison that I can see of fragmented vs defragmented performance.
Anyway not other than one sentence mentioning offhand a 30x speed increase in the LOOXstore write speed of your Loox 720, but no details or methodology - personally I think there has to be something else going on than fragmentation to see a 30x difference.
Maybe I will knock something up to intentionally fragment a storage card, so I can do some repeatable tests, now that you've got me curious.
Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen [MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices] wrote:
> "Tony A." <tony72atgmail.remove.spam.com> wrote in message > news:edE3z6rkGHA.3936@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >> Interesting, any chance you could post a link, or is it something you >> haven't published? I searched your blog, and found a link to a thread >> that's supposed to contain quantitative results on this, but while it >> does link to an exhaustive set of tests comparing different format >> parameters on several brands of card, I can't see any tests comparing >> before/after defragging, unless I'm being blind.
If you have a storage card you haven't formatted for a while but always copy files to/delete files from, try copying a large file to it (and reading back). Then, do the same after formatting. There will be sometimes huge differences.
-- Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen - Microsoft MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices Please see the Pocket PC Mag Expert Blog (including mine) at http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/ - you will definitely like it.
"Tony A." <tony72atgmail.remove.spam.com> wrote in message
> Well, I already saw that one, in fact that one links to the article > that links to the forum thread that I mentioned above. And as with > that, there is a comparison of effects of different format parameters, > but there is no formal comparison that I can see of fragmented vs > defragmented performance.
> Anyway not other than one sentence mentioning offhand a 30x speed > increase in the LOOXstore write speed of your Loox 720, but no details > or methodology - personally I think there has to be something else > going on than fragmentation to see a 30x difference.
> Maybe I will knock something up to intentionally fragment a storage > card, so I can do some repeatable tests, now that you've got me > curious.
> Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen [MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices] > wrote:
>> "Tony A." <tony72atgmail.remove.spam.com> wrote in message >> news:edE3z6rkGHA.3936@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >>> Interesting, any chance you could post a link, or is it something > you >>> haven't published? I searched your blog, and found a link to a > thread >>> that's supposed to contain quantitative results on this, but while > it >>> does link to an exhaustive set of tests comparing different format >>> parameters on several brands of card, I can't see any tests > comparing >>> before/after defragging, unless I'm being blind.
Well, it was the "really extensive, quantitive benchmarks" you said you had done to prove that that I was looking for, rather than an empirical observation ;).
Never mind, like I say, I shall try and knock together a repeatable test setup myself.
Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen [MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices] wrote:
> If you have a storage card you haven't formatted for a while but > always copy files to/delete files from, try copying a large file to > it (and reading back). Then, do the same after formatting. There will > be sometimes huge differences.
> "Tony A." <tony72atgmail.remove.spam.com> wrote in message > news:u$kYSCtkGHA.4284@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >> Well, I already saw that one, in fact that one links to the article >> that links to the forum thread that I mentioned above. And as with >> that, there is a comparison of effects of different format >> parameters, but there is no formal comparison that I can see of >> fragmented vs defragmented performance.
>> Anyway not other than one sentence mentioning offhand a 30x speed >> increase in the LOOXstore write speed of your Loox 720, but no >> details or methodology - personally I think there has to be >> something else going on than fragmentation to see a 30x difference.
>> Maybe I will knock something up to intentionally fragment a storage >> card, so I can do some repeatable tests, now that you've got me >> curious.
>> Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen [MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices] >> wrote:
>>> "Tony A." <tony72atgmail.remove.spam.com> wrote in message >>> news:edE3z6rkGHA.3936@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >>>> Interesting, any chance you could post a link, or is it something >> you >>>> haven't published? I searched your blog, and found a link to a >> thread >>>> that's supposed to contain quantitative results on this, but while >> it >>>> does link to an exhaustive set of tests comparing different format >>>> parameters on several brands of card, I can't see any tests >> comparing >>>> before/after defragging, unless I'm being blind.
I've made a lot of tests, but still hadn't had the time to document them. I'll do this really soon.
-- Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen - Microsoft MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices Please see the Pocket PC Mag Expert Blog (including mine) at http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/ - you will definitely like it.
"Tony A." <tony72atgmail.remove.spam.com> wrote in message
> Well, it was the "really extensive, quantitive benchmarks" you said > you had done to prove that that I was looking for, rather than an > empirical observation ;).
> Never mind, like I say, I shall try and knock together a repeatable > test setup myself.
> Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen [MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices] > wrote: >> If you have a storage card you haven't formatted for a while but >> always copy files to/delete files from, try copying a large file to >> it (and reading back). Then, do the same after formatting. There > will >> be sometimes huge differences.
>> "Tony A." <tony72atgmail.remove.spam.com> wrote in message >> news:u$kYSCtkGHA.4284@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >>> Well, I already saw that one, in fact that one links to the article >>> that links to the forum thread that I mentioned above. And as with >>> that, there is a comparison of effects of different format >>> parameters, but there is no formal comparison that I can see of >>> fragmented vs defragmented performance.
>>> Anyway not other than one sentence mentioning offhand a 30x speed >>> increase in the LOOXstore write speed of your Loox 720, but no >>> details or methodology - personally I think there has to be >>> something else going on than fragmentation to see a 30x difference.
>>> Maybe I will knock something up to intentionally fragment a storage >>> card, so I can do some repeatable tests, now that you've got me >>> curious.
>>> Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen [MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices] >>> wrote:
>>>> "Tony A." <tony72atgmail.remove.spam.com> wrote in message >>>> news:edE3z6rkGHA.3936@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >>>>> Interesting, any chance you could post a link, or is it something >>> you >>>>> haven't published? I searched your blog, and found a link to a >>> thread >>>>> that's supposed to contain quantitative results on this, but > while >>> it >>>>> does link to an exhaustive set of tests comparing different > format >>>>> parameters on several brands of card, I can't see any tests >>> comparing >>>>> before/after defragging, unless I'm being blind.
Anton Tomov has Pocket Mechanic Pro almost ready to release. There are Registry cleaning tools there as well as a very fast defrag tool. (One thing that has always been nice about his programs is that once you buy it, you are entitled to free upgrades forever.)
Personally, I like keeping in touch with what is installed on my PDA well enough that I can go into the Registry and clean out the left over entries manually. Plus I also keep backups of the PDA at specific points where I know things were stable and only what I wanted are installed. If I screw up, I can always go back to one of those backups and get things running again.
Please note that Pocket PC-based defrag / checkdisk tools are better to be avoided. The same can be done on the desktop, much easier, much faster and much more safely.
-- Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen - Microsoft MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices Please see the Pocket PC Mag Expert Blog (including mine) at http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/ - you will definitely like it.
> Anton Tomov has Pocket Mechanic Pro almost ready to release. There are > Registry cleaning tools there as well as a very fast defrag tool. (One > thing that has always been nice about his programs is that once you buy > it, you are entitled to free upgrades forever.)
> Personally, I like keeping in touch with what is installed on my PDA > well enough that I can go into the Registry and clean out the left over > entries manually. Plus I also keep backups of the PDA at specific > points where I know things were stable and only what I wanted are > installed. If I screw up, I can always go back to one of those backups > and get things running again.
> Good luck, > Chris
> Skii wrote: >> Where can I get registry cleaner and defrag tools?
I agree with you. I don't know the particular circumstances, but I am reluctant to use any tools such as these for editing the registry or working with a storage card till I (a) have a known good backup and (b) have tried them enough to depend on them. However, sometimes you are desparate and your choices are limited.
On the PC side, I've used Symantec's Norton Disk Doctor and found it trashed my hard drive, and always felt CHKDSK would've worked better.
I think Anton's new product may be worth looking at. He's bypassing "the file system drivers of Windows CE and access(ing) the files directly through our own FATFS layer..." From what I've seen in beta testing, it works.
Chris
Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen [MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices] wrote:
> Please note that Pocket PC-based defrag / checkdisk tools are better to be > avoided. The same can be done on the desktop, much easier, much faster and > much more safely.
> -- > Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen - Microsoft MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices > Please see the Pocket PC Mag Expert Blog (including mine) at > http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/ - you will definitely like it.
> "Daboo" <Dab...@gmail.com> wrote in message > news:1150663162.164827.284210@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com... > > Anton Tomov has Pocket Mechanic Pro almost ready to release. There are > > Registry cleaning tools there as well as a very fast defrag tool. (One > > thing that has always been nice about his programs is that once you buy > > it, you are entitled to free upgrades forever.)
> > Personally, I like keeping in touch with what is installed on my PDA > > well enough that I can go into the Registry and clean out the left over > > entries manually. Plus I also keep backups of the PDA at specific > > points where I know things were stable and only what I wanted are > > installed. If I screw up, I can always go back to one of those backups > > and get things running again.
> > Good luck, > > Chris
> > Skii wrote: > >> Where can I get registry cleaner and defrag tools?
> If you have a storage card you haven't formatted for a while but always > copy files to/delete files from, try copying a large file to it (and > reading back). Then, do the same after formatting. There will be sometimes > huge differences.
Well, that is not defragging as much as it is just allowing the card extra room to write a large file first. This will always be the case for smart storage devices, which are trying to "spread out" writes across its media in order to make that 10,000 write cycle last longer. Technically it is not as much defragging as it is allowing the card to optimize itself, since by default the card will not be writing to consecutive clusters of memory.
I think we may have had this discussion before, so forgive me if I am beating a deceased equine. :)
xTenn wrote: > "Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen [MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices]" > <!ei.maileja@kiitos!> wrote in message > news:%23Azn9YtkGHA.2304@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... >> If you have a storage card you haven't formatted for a while but >> always copy files to/delete files from, try copying a large file to >> it (and reading back). Then, do the same after formatting. There >> will be sometimes huge differences.
> Well, that is not defragging as much as it is just allowing the card > extra room to write a large file first. This will always be the case > for smart storage devices, which are trying to "spread out" writes > across its media in order to make that 10,000 write cycle last > longer. Technically it is not as much defragging as it is allowing > the card to optimize itself, since by default the card will not be > writing to consecutive clusters of memory.
> I think we may have had this discussion before, so forgive me if I am > beating a deceased equine. :)
As it goes, I've just now finished my own tests on this, because frankly I thought Werner must have been exaggerating the effect (sorry Werner, I'm just naturally sceptical), but my results seem conclusive, I'm certainly now convinced that fragmentation does indeed have a major impact on flash performance, at least with the card and PDA I tested with. So, I guess Werner busts another myth ;).
I missed out on any earlier conversations on the topic, so no idea of the mechanism behind the performance loss, since obviously it's not down to seek time a la hard drives. Maybe something like the wear levelling comes into it, but at the end of the day fixing the fragmentation also fixes the performance, from the users POV, so I guess the mechanism is academic.
I've forgotten to add that only do this in the remaining disk space of a few Megabytes so that it is reused. First, fill up the entire card with stuff that, later, you don't touch.
--
-- Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen - Microsoft MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices Please see the Pocket PC Mag Expert Blog (including mine) at http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/ - you will definitely like it.
"xTenn" <xTennRemoveThisP...@tds.net> wrote in message
> "Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen [MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices]" > <!ei.maileja@kiitos!> wrote in message > news:%23Azn9YtkGHA.2304@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... >> If you have a storage card you haven't formatted for a while but always >> copy files to/delete files from, try copying a large file to it (and >> reading back). Then, do the same after formatting. There will be >> sometimes huge differences.
> Well, that is not defragging as much as it is just allowing the card extra > room to write a large file first. This will always be the case for smart > storage devices, which are trying to "spread out" writes across its media > in order to make that 10,000 write cycle last longer. Technically it is > not as much defragging as it is allowing the card to optimize itself, > since by default the card will not be writing to consecutive clusters of > memory.
> I think we may have had this discussion before, so forgive me if I am > beating a deceased equine. :)
Yup, I've busted a lot of other myths too - for example, the myth about enabled IrDA ports resulting in much higher power consumption.
--
-- Werner "Menneisyys" Ruotsalainen - Microsoft MVP - Windows - Mobile Devices Please see the Pocket PC Mag Expert Blog (including mine) at http://www.pocketpcmag.com/blogs/ - you will definitely like it.
"Tony A." <tony72atgmail.remove.spam.com> wrote in message
