YES! ON 2010
minimus
It has arrived and looks quite sleek to me. Many things improved.
- Search is much much better and faster. Actually it does not take any
search time. As you write start to enter the keyword, ON immediately gives
search results. Impressive really.
- I really like the ribbon. The commands now look very organized.
- It is now easy to move the sections by dragging and dropping them wherever
you want.
There are many more pluses that I will not count.
But I am disappointed that you still cannot set a global template. I don't
understand. This was one of the most requested features and it is still not
there. What is so difficult to make it?
I also don't know how sync is. I used to have sync problems when updating my
ON files on my usb stick. Hope there is some improvement there.
But I like the new ON. I actually liked it very much. I will see how it will
go in the next days but for the moment it looks really good and inviting one
to work on it.
My most favorite program ON!
Daniel Escapa [MSFT]
and do this in a future version of OneNote but we don't have it in OneNote
2010 currently.
"minimus" <min...@live.co.uk> wrote in message
news:he9len$n56$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
John Waller
> Setting a global template is much harder than you realize and we want
to try and do this in a future version of OneNote but we don't have it
in OneNote 2010 currently.
That's a shame. I've been waiting for a global template since 2005.
Regards
John Waller
Meer
version?
"John Waller" wrote:
> .
>
John Guin [ msft ] dot at
--
Thanks,
John Guin
OneNote Test Team
http://blogs.msdn.com/johnguin
minimus
"Daniel Escapa [MSFT]" <des...@microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:e4XJ0Fva...@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
> Setting a global template is much harder than you realize and we want to
> try and do this in a future version of OneNote but we don't have it in
> OneNote 2010 currently.
Ok, I understand that it is more difficult than what I can imagine. But
there has been some time since this is a popular request. And it is rather a
fundamental issue whose improvement would have made the user's life much
easier. I think people will hope to see this in the next office service pack
rather than in the next version of ON.
Since I got this chance of having a direct conversation here with a
specialist (Daniel), I would like to mention a concern that most people, who
feed back via Connect, share, I think. We leave feedback at Connect and have
no response. The only response is a new version of ON where we wait for a
long time and see if our feedback has been read. I think On developers can
provide some feedback to the feedbacks. For example, if users request the
global template at Connect, why not to give a short answer as you did here:
Just tell with a sentence that it is more difficult than we can imagine so
we will need to wait for a while. Then we know if our voice is heard. I
myself am a very heavy user of ON and I am excited using it every day. Then
I go to connect and leave feedback. Such a person who is excited about ON
wishes that his voice is heard and there is communication for improvement of
ON. I think the 'Connect' idea is very good but it is not mutual. We are
connected to you, which is great, but you are not connected to us, which is
frustrating. Surely you are all busy, but we are too. In our businesses, we
should keep our brains alive for the improvement of ON. This is what you
want, and this is what we want.
Please let me express my appreciation and congratulations for the new
version of ON. Apart from the issues, it is a great improvement and looks
and feels very good.
Greetings from a ON fan.
Rainald Taesler
> - I really like the ribbon. The commands now look very organized.
Having used the TP since it was available, I must say that these praises
do not apply when using a TabletPC.
There have been many discussions on this issue in the TP newsgroup.
Too bad that MS does not give us the option to use customized toolbars.
Rainald
Rainald Taesler
>> Do you have to uninstall OneNote 2007 before installing the 2010 beta
>> version?
>
> No - it upgrades existing ON 2007 installs.
Dies this also apply to the 2010 TP version?
I think to remember that previously we had been told that the TP has to
be un-installed.
Rainald
minimus
"Rainald Taesler" <tae...@gmx.de> wrote in message
news:#Mv$F#3aKHA...@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
The ribbon is customizable. You can hide it, relocate the buttons. Ok maybe
you cannot make it smaller... But then you can also put commands on the
quick acess toolbar. So what is the problem?
Rainald Taesler
> "Rainald Taesler" wrote: in message
>> minimus wrote:
>>> - I really like the ribbon. The commands now look very organized.
>>
>> Having used the TP since it was available, I must say that these
>> praises do not apply when using a TabletPC.
>> There have been many discussions on this issue in the TP newsgroup.
>> Too bad that MS does not give us the option to use customized
>> toolbars.
>
> The ribbon is customizable.
Only to a very small extent (adding a custom Tab) That's it.
> You can hide it,
Right.
> relocate the buttons.
Which buttons?
> Ok maybe you cannot make it smaller... But then you can
> also put commands on the quick acess toolbar.
Right. Been there done that. Long ago ;-) ;-)
> So what is the problem?
Quite some problems remain.
Too many to talk about in a short reply :-( :-(
Rainald
Erik Sojka
your ON2007 installation or install it to a different directory and run
both versions.
=?Utf-8?B?TWVlcg==?= <Me...@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
news:7C6DA265-C331-445F...@microsoft.com:
Erik Sojka
a given Notebook.
John Waller <jo...@pinnacleweb.com.au> wrote in
news:4B0876AB...@pinnacleweb.com.au:
Erik Sojka
as a direct upgrade path.
"Rainald Taesler" <tae...@gmx.de> wrote in
news:Ol$vG#3aKHA...@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl:
Erik Sojka
if you don't like the answer) and there are several MS folks on the COnnect
newsgroups.
"minimus" <min...@live.co.uk> wrote in
news:heb0op$5ed$1...@news.eternal-september.org:
Rainald Taesler
> =?Utf-8?B?TWVlcg==?= wrote:
>> "John Waller" wrote:
>> Do you have to uninstall OneNote 2007 before installing the 2010 beta
>> version?
>
> You shouldn't have to. You can either have the ON2010 installer
> upgrade your ON2007 installation or install it to a different
> directory and run both versions.
I did not yet install the Beta (still running the TP).
But with the ON2010 TP it was possible to run ON2007 and ON2010
side-by-side without problems and using the very same notebooks
(different from Outlook which behaves along the line: "Thou shalt not
have any Gods besides Me!" <g>).
With some functions ON2010 TP was predominant (the "Send to OneNote
printer, the TaskTray icon), but not a single conflict, whatsoever.
Rainald
Rainald Taesler
> John Waller wrote:
>> Daniel,
>>> Setting a global template is much harder than you realize and we
>>> want
>> to try and do this in a future version of OneNote but we don't have
>> it in OneNote 2010 currently.
>>
>> That's a shame. I've been waiting for a global template since 2005.
>
> I imagine that a global template would be difficult with multiple
> users of a given Notebook.
Although I trust Daniel's explanation that it would not have been easy
to implement that, I do not think that *this* would be a problem.
a) Pages with templates do show fine for users of shared notebooks.
b) The settings *now* can be transferred to other machines (one of the
big steps forward <!>).
So AFAICS it would be easy to distribute (aa) the templates and (bb) the
setting for which template would be the default for those participating
in a group using shared notebooks.
Rainald
Rainald Taesler
> "Rainald Taesler" wrote: in
>>>> Do you have to uninstall OneNote 2007 before installing the 2010
>>>> beta version?
>>>
>>> No - it upgrades existing ON 2007 installs.
>>
>> I think to remember that previously we had been told that the TP has
>> to be un-installed.
> That's different. The 2010TP needs to be uninstalled.
Thanks for the info.
> 2007 is supported as a direct upgrade path.
An upgrade path or "side-by-side" as with ON2010 TP and ON2007??
Rainald
Rainald Taesler
> What do you see missing from Connect?
A lot! At least the ON section is terribly dead.
I am at least as disappointed as "minimus" is.
> Bug reports are responded to
????
When have you last been there and checked progress on bug-reports ad
especially suggestions?
Could you name any examples from the last year?
> (even if you don't like the answer)
That's not the question!!
The problem is that one shouts in the fog and no echo at all. {siiigh}
I think that without any doubt I have been the one who most often sent
folks to connect.
But I gave that up (just like quite some others).
> and there are several MS folks on the COnnect newsgroups.
Which Newsgroups?
Are there any "Connect" Newsgroups for ON?
In case you might know any, would you mind sharing the info?
Well, there *were* special exclusive NGs for the TP (Connectnews). Nut
the were closed on the very same day the Beta was available.
And there still are verrrrry exclusive NGs for the participants of the
*Technical*Beta*, access to which not even the TP-participants were
granted. :-( :-(
Now there are several "forum" places but no NGs (which makes a whole lot
of a difference <!!>).
And no structures for specialized feedback and direct communications
with the developers in sight.
If you should have more insight than Me, pls let Me know.
Rainald
John Waller
> What do you see missing from Connect?
Since you ask Eric: Feedback.
I have seen none.
It's a big black hole for suggestions. That's why I've stopped taking it
seriously as a place for dialogue with Microsoft.
Regards
John Waller
minimus
"Erik Sojka" <eso...@ms-onenote.net.nospam> wrote in message
news:#2tSkWJb...@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
> What do you see missing from Connect?
Feedback to feedbacks. me and many others wondered for months about a global
template and other wishes. Do we get any response at connect?
> Bug reports are responded to
Where?
> (even > if you don't like the answer) and there are several MS folks on
> the COnnect newsgroups.
What is a Connect newsgroup? I only know the website that I sign in with my
passport id and send feedback. And I did this I think about 7 times. Could
you let me know about the newsgroup? The name of it?
Tim Mastrogiacomo
Does it still only support pasting website content (while keeping
formatting, etc) from internet explorer? Or does it support other
browsers nows?
Tim Mastrogiacomo
jeffrey
another (rather than the cut and paste currently required)?
--
jeffrey
"Rainald Taesler" <tae...@gmx.de> wrote in message
news:%23Mv$F%233aKH...@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
Rainald Taesler
> i am wondering, will ON2010 allow dragging notes from one
> section/page to another (rather than the cut and paste currently
> required)?
This has been possible since at least ON2007 and is unchanged.
Rainald
Rainald Taesler
> Does it still only support pasting website content (while keeping
> formatting, etc) from internet explorer? Or does it support other
> browsers nows?
Ni changes in this area.
But you may try out things yourself. <g>
Just download the Beta and install it.
Rainald
jeffrey
the page that they are on. i get the circle with diagonal line indicating an
unallowed action.
--
jeffrey
"Rainald Taesler" <tae...@gmx.de> wrote in message
news:edB6Osd...@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
Rainald Taesler
> "Rainald Taesler" wrote:
>> jeffrey wrote:
>>> i am wondering, will ON2010 allow dragging notes from one
>>> section/page to another (rather than the cut and paste currently
>>> required)?
>>
>> This has been possible since at least ON2007 and is unchanged.
>
> Rainald, i have to disagree.
How can you "disagree" if there is an *individual* problem just on your
side? <g>
> i have ON07 and cannot drag notes
> away from the page that they are on. i get the circle with diagonal
> line indicating an unallowed action.
Sorry, I have absolutely no idea on what might be wrong with your
system.
I have been using ON2007 since the early Beta on several systems.
Drag + Drop for pages has always been working fluently - be it across
sections, sections groups or notebooks. I never had to face the symptoms
you report.
If your system plays that crazy you might try an uninstall and a
re-install after having booted.
Rainald
John Waller
> Drag + Drop for pages has always been working fluently - be it across
> sections, sections groups or notebooks.
Rainald,
I think you and jeffrey are talking about two different things.
Drag and drop pages between sections, section groups or notebooks works
fine.
I think jeffrey is talking about highlighting a *piece* of content (e.g.
a word or paragraph) within a page and dragging that word or paragraph
to a different page, section or notebook.
Dragging a piece of content within a page is easy enough.
However as soon as you go outside the page boundary to a different page,
section or notebook you see the circle with diagonal line indicating a
disallowed action.
The only way to move a piece of text or a paragraph beyond the page to a
different page, section or notebook is cut-and-paste as jeffrey mentions.
Regards
John Waller
Rainald Taesler
>> I have been using ON2007 since the early Beta on several systems.
>> Drag + Drop for pages has always been working fluently - be it across
>> sections, sections groups or notebooks.
>
>
> Drag and drop pages between sections, section groups or notebooks
> works fine.
>
> I think jeffrey is talking about highlighting a *piece* of content
> (e.g. a word or paragraph) within a page and dragging that word or
> paragraph to a different page, section or notebook.
Oh, now I see!
Thanks for the explanation.
Obviously I mistook his wording "note" for "page".
> Dragging a piece of content within a page is easy enough.
>
> However as soon as you go outside the page boundary to a different
> page, section or notebook you see the circle with diagonal line
> indicating a disallowed action.
>
> The only way to move a piece of text or a paragraph beyond the page
> to a different page, section or notebook is cut-and-paste as jeffrey
> mentions.
Yes. This is unchanged in ON2010.
Thanks again and regards
Rainald
jeffrey
appears when you hover over the data. i thought that this is referred to as
a "note".
being able to drag a "note" between pages or sections seems like an obvious
action to expect.
--
jeffrey
"John Waller" <jo...@pinnacleweb.com.au> wrote in message
news:4B0F8F84...@pinnacleweb.com.au...
Rainald Taesler
> yes, i was referring to any bit of data surrounded by the blue square
> that appears when you hover over the data. i thought that this is
> referred to as a "note".
Could be.
I call that "containers".
> being able to drag a "note" between pages or sections seems like an
> obvious action to expect.
Wouldn't there be a problem with the placement of a moved "note" on the
target page?
IMO it's easy enough to just cut the "note" (Shift+Del), click on the
target page, select the proper place and/or create it, paste the item
there (Ctrl+Ins/Ctrl-V) and then click the "Back button" to return.
Rainald
John Waller
the target page?
No issue that I can see. Just drop the note on the page wherever the
cursor is located when the mouse button is released.
> IMO it's easy enough to just cut the "note" (Shift+Del), click on the
> target page, select the proper place and/or create it, paste the item
> there (Ctrl+Ins/Ctrl-V) and then click the "Back button" to return.
Totally logical if you're mainly keyboard-centric. Not everyone works
like that.
Microsoft is famous for providing at least three ways of doing any task
e.g. keyboard, mouse and perhaps context menu.
I'm mouse-centric and I would have expected to be able to drag and drop
notes/containers between pages and sections.
Rainald Taesler
>> Wouldn't there be a problem with the placement of a moved "note" on
>> the target page?
>
> No issue that I can see. Just drop the note on the page wherever the
> cursor is located when the mouse button is released.
And where would it be placed when dropped?
Possibly at the end of the page.
This would mean extra work later to sort things to a proper sequence.
For it's preferable to sort the moved stuff when I'm at it.
>> IMO it's easy enough to just cut the "note" (Shift+Del), click on the
>> target page, select the proper place and/or create it, paste the item
>> there (Ctrl+Ins/Ctrl-V) and then click the "Back button" to return.
>
> Totally logical if you're mainly keyboard-centric. Not everyone works
> like that.
Me knows ;-)
And I am anything than mainly keyboard-centric.
On a PC I worked in a mixed way.
On my TabletPC I don't have any key-combinations available (and ON has
ways too many things which are based on a keyboard-centered approach
{siiiigh}).
> Microsoft is famous for providing at least three ways of doing any
> task e.g. keyboard, mouse and perhaps context menu.
Yes. But not throughout.
> I'm mouse-centric
But this not mean that things would be less easy to perform the
operation with the mouse. Everything needed to perform what I described
with key-combinations is available from the context menu.
> and I would have expected to be able to drag and
> drop notes/containers between pages and sections.
It's not there and we won't change that.
Perhaps a chance for Office 15 :-(
Rainald
John Waller
>>> the target page?
>> No issue that I can see. Just drop the note on the page wherever the
>> cursor is located when the mouse button is released.
>
> And where would it be placed when dropped?
> Possibly at the end of the page.
No. At the cursor location on the page. Not sure what's difficult about
that in ON.
>> I'm mouse-centric
>
> But this not mean that things would be less easy to perform the
> operation with the mouse. Everything needed to perform what I described
> with key-combinations is available from the context menu.
Agreed but drag and drop in very intuitive for me for this particular
operation. I see no reason to touch the keyboard when I'm
dragging-and-dropping.
Rainald Taesler
>>>> Wouldn't there be a problem with the placement of a moved "note" on
>>>> the target page?
>>>
>>> No issue that I can see. Just drop the note on the page wherever the
>>> cursor is located when the mouse button is released.
>>
>> And where would it be placed when dropped?
>> Possibly at the end of the page.
>
> No. At the cursor location on the page. Not sure what's difficult
> about that in ON.
To place a moved "note" to the proper place in the target (other page
and/or section) following your concept would consequently mean that -
prior to moving - the cursor would have had been sitting in the *target*
page at the place where a moved item shall be dropped after having been
moved, plus: enough space being available there for accommodating the
import.
Sorry to say so, but this does not at all seem logical to me:
- navigating to the target page (after having opened the target
section);
- creating space for the import;
- placing the cursor at the wanted position;
- navigating back to the source page;
- then dragging the note onto the target (where/which page, if it's a
different section?).
How could that be easier than Cut&Paste??
Sorry, you have just lost me :-( :-(
>>> I'm mouse-centric
>>
>> But this not mean that things would be less easy to perform the
>> operation with the mouse. Everything needed to perform what I
>> described with key-combinations is available from the context menu.
>
> Agreed but drag and drop in very intuitive for me for this particular
> operation. I see no reason to touch the keyboard when I'm
> dragging-and-dropping.
As said: Cut&Paste works really fine without touching the keyboard at
all.
Rainald
Rainald Taesler
> Agreed but drag and drop in very intuitive for me for this particular
> operation. I see no reason to touch the keyboard when I'm
> dragging-and-dropping.
You had really left me clueless with your last reply.
You might have seen that from my last reaction. :-( :-(
A few minutes later a flash did strike me <bg>:
Why in heaven don't you just open a second instance (window) of ON
(Ctrl+M)???
You could easily drag any item from the one side to the other window.
Well, this is not really *moving*, only copying with Drag&Drop.
But would the need to delete the item on the source side hurt at all?
Rainald
P.S. It works the same way in ON2007 and ON2010
John Waller
> You might have seen that from my last reaction. :-( :-(
Yes, I got that impression but it seems simple to me <shrug>.
> A few minutes later a flash did strike me <bg>:
> Why in heaven don't you just open a second instance (window) of ON
> (Ctrl+M)???
> You could easily drag any item from the one side to the other window.
>
> Well, this is not really *moving*, only copying with Drag&Drop.
> But would the need to delete the item on the source side hurt at all?
Sure it would work but it's a workaround. Dragging and dropping notes
between pages seems like a natural feature for ON to offer.
John Waller
> and/or section) following your concept would consequently mean that -
> prior to moving - the cursor would have had been sitting in the *target*
> page at the place where a moved item shall be dropped after having been
> moved, plus: enough space being available there for accommodating the
> import.
>
> Sorry to say so, but this does not at all seem logical to me:
> - navigating to the target page (after having opened the target
> section);
> - creating space for the import;
> - placing the cursor at the wanted position;
> - navigating back to the source page;
> - then dragging the note onto the target (where/which page, if it's a
> different section?).
>
> How could that be easier than Cut&Paste??
> Sorry, you have just lost me :-( :-(
I think you're over-analyzing this.
Not trying to re-invent the space shuttle.
It would simply work the same way that normal drag-and-drop, e.g.
Microsoft Word, works now.
Highlight what to move, drag it to another page, drop it either a) on
top of existing notes (overlapping although that would need fixing later
so not much point), or b) the user places the note in an empty spot on
the page
Rainald Taesler
>> You had really left me clueless with your last reply.
>> You might have seen that from my last reaction. :-( :-(
>
> Yes, I got that impression but it seems simple to me <shrug>.
Different People think in different ways. <bg>
>> A few minutes later a flash did strike me <bg>:
>> Why in heaven don't you just open a second instance (window) of ON
>> (Ctrl+M)???
>> You could easily drag any item from the one side to the other window.
>>
>> Well, this is not really *moving*, only copying with Drag&Drop.
>> But would the need to delete the item on the source side hurt at all?
>
> Sure it would work but it's a workaround. Dragging and dropping notes
> between pages seems like a natural feature for ON to offer.
I don't regard this to be a workaround.
Opening 2 windows side by side is the natural way for working with more
than just one open page.
And Drag&Drop from/to pages is just one of the operations touching 2
pages.
But 'nuff said ;-)
Your word into Daniel Escapa's ear ;-)
You might try to reach him in the ON2010 Beta forum:
http://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/onenote/threads
Rainald
Rainald Taesler
>> How could that be easier than Cut&Paste??
>> Sorry, you have just lost me :-( :-(
>
> I think you're over-analyzing this.
Maybe a result from an "industrial disease" (acquired by this law
professor and database programmer)??<gbg>
> Not trying to re-invent the space shuttle.
>
> It would simply work the same way that normal drag-and-drop, e.g.
> Microsoft Word, works now.
Interesting.
How do you use Drag&Drop for moving a marked paragraph from one doc to
another?? <g&d>
> Highlight what to move, drag it to another page, drop it either a) on
> top of existing notes (overlapping although that would need fixing
> later so not much point), or b) the user places the note in an empty
> spot on the page
Both would require to open the page (and if another section the section
first).
How would this work in your concept?
Should the sections and pages automatically be opened when a timed
"onMouseOver" event fires?
Rainald
John Waller
Yep, 'nuff said. Time to move on.
Thanks for exploring it with me Rainald.
John Waller
>> top of existing notes (overlapping although that would need fixing
>> later so not much point), or b) the user places the note in an empty
>> spot on the page
>
> Both would require to open the page (and if another section the section
> first).
> How would this work in your concept?
> Should the sections and pages automatically be opened when a timed
> "onMouseOver" event fires?
I think we're talking at cross purposes here.
Never mind, I don't really have time to design a feature which isn't
going to happen anyway. And I'm certain Microsoft will find another
clever way of doing it.
Thanks for the thread Rainald, it's been fun.
JW
Rainald Taesler
> Never mind, I don't really have time to design a feature which isn't
> going to happen anyway. And I'm certain Microsoft will find another
> clever way of doing it.
>
> Thanks for the thread Rainald, it's been fun.
Tahnks back and kindest regards
Rainald