AW>Neulich schrieb Paul_Foerster folgenden Wortlaut zum Thema Re: Waht AW>ever! durch meine Leitung! Ich wollte nur noch etwas dazu anmerken: AW>Möge meine Weisheit mit Euch sein!!! !
AW>Of course! ;-))
... then remove the German parts of your postings. This group's called talk.*ENGLISH*.
I am not so sure. There might also be a problem with some other part. The operator of my box conceded that he suspects that certain parts of the software are still wrong. On the other hand, he said he did something about my special problem lately. So it might all be OK by now. Gotta wait and see. :-)
PF>AFAIK PGP should be able to handle binary files and transport 8-bit char.
It should. I have had it do some umlaut conversions already.
PF>Btw., you could add a filter which would change umlauts to ae, oe, ue and ss
PF>accordingly.
Yes, but the filter entry fields of my frontend are already pretty much filled up. I could circumvent it, but then I'd have to understand very long batch files. (Which I usually can't. ;-)) Maybe one of the currently installed filters could do it, too. Dunno. It's a big hassle already, and I don't want to change too much in it. Mostly it works and, you know: never change a running system. ;-)
PF>That'd take the hassle with the keyboard
Pah, I already have to be used to three different keyboards: US, SV/FI, GR, which is hard enough. I do regularly mistype.
OK, about a documentation:
Prepare to be a beta tester! You have to contact a operator of a Maus/Quark, which has direct Internet access (e. g. M2 or DU3). I chose DU3, but I am sure I would have had the same service in M2.
Then you need to tell him the exact address from which you will be sending infiles and to which you want your outfiles mailed. Furthermore, you need an own PGP key and have to give your sysop it over a secure channel. You get the key that box uses to encrypt the outfiles.
Your infiles have to be signed with your key and have to be mailed from the noted account, thus the box knows it's really your infile. At DU3, you have a special email address to which to send your infile. (I guess, the box uses this information to recognize the user name.)
Regularly, you get an outfile. in the case of DU3, this is twice a day. If you didn't send a new infile, a default infile is used. This way, it takes quite some time until you get a confirmation that the messages in the infile were accepted. Fortunately, there's a pretty good dupe check, so it doesn't matter, if the messages appear in several infiles.
Some implementation details:
First, my system is absolutely non-standard. (Did you expect anything else?)
I was user in SL, and cannot reach it currently. I view it as my main account, tho. So I decided to feed the Internet email I receive at my university account into it instead. I wrote special conversion programs that create infiles from mail files and vice versa.
Then I have the DU3 account for my Maus mail.
Furthermore, most of the filters I use are OS/2 versions and I use a special DOS program to call them from my Minnie environment. If there is a "os2 -o " in front of a command, simply forget about it and you have a pure DOS equivalent.
Thus, these are my filter configs: SL, create infile (for university ...)
MH>So it might all be OK by now. Gotta wait and see. :-)
... well, it's ok now, as the PM test has proven so far. But what was the reason?
MH>It should. I have had it do some umlaut conversions already.
... which worked, I suppose ...
MH>but then I'd have to understand very long batch files.
... lemme guess: You use W95. Nobody understand W95, the world's longest batch file. ;^)
MH>Pah, I already have to be used to three different keyboards: US, SV/FI,
MH>GR, which is hard enough. I do regularly mistype.
... I never get used to switching between a gr and a us keyboard. We use the latter partly at work. Switching from one machine to another even at work means switching to another keyboard. Not to mention the fr editions (Sun), the HP proprietary edition, the ... :-(
MH>OK, about a documentation:
... thanx for the effort. Sounds quite adventurous what I've read so far.
MH>Prepare to be a beta tester!
... I won't. As I wrote already I am interested in how it works, but do not do it. Maybe in the future, but this can be a few years from now, if the MausNet still exists then, which I hope.
MH>You have to contact a operator of a Maus/Quark, which has direct MH>Internet access (e. g. M2 or DU3).
... what does that mean? Does that particular Maus have to have a dial-in account, so that the ISP may call it and initiate a transfer or does it mean a Maus running normal gateway software?
MH>Then you need to tell him the exact address from which you will be MH>sending infiles and to which you want your outfiles mailed. MH>Furthermore, you need an own PGP key and have to give your sysop it MH>over a secure channel.
... but in theory, the actual tausch would be possiblöe without running the Infile and Outfile thru PGP?
MH>First, my system is absolutely non-standard. (Did you expect anything MH>else?)
... yes, I expecvted the 100% compatible standard version and I'm pretty much disappointed you configure everything in such a non-standard way. ;-)
MH>I wrote special conversion programs that create infiles from mail files
MH>and vice versa.
... which again are non-standard ...
(deltia)
... quite interesting, the whole thing, tho I thought it would be easier. However, I saved this mail because it probably may be of some value in a few years, if, as I said, the MausNet still exists.
Kommentar zu A47315@AC2 in der Gruppe talk.english
Moin Paul,
PF>... well, it's ok now, as the PM test has proven so far. But what was the reason?
a bug in the Quark software, I guess. At least the programmer said he worked a little bit on it.
PF>... lemme guess: You use W95. Nobody understand W95, the world's longest batch file. ;^)
Nope, I use the longest REXX file: OS/2.
PF>... I never get used to switching between a gr and a us keyboard. We use the latter partly at work. Switching from one machine to another even at work means switching to another keyboard. Not to mention the fr editions (Sun), the HP proprietary edition, the ... :-(
What I really hated most, were the keyboards of the Power Macs in Turku. They had finger-marks on the D and K keys, not the F and J keys. A real pain to use those, if you use the ten-finger system.
PF>... what does that mean? Does that particular Maus have to have a dial-in account, so that the ISP may call it and initiate a transfer or does it mean a Maus running normal gateway software?
The latter is enough. (In fact, in DU3 the first works, too, but I didn't want to pay the extra charge for that. Having had rather long turnaround times in Turku, those few hours didn't matter to me anyway.)
PF>... but in theory, the actual tausch would be possiblöe without running the Infile and Outfile thru PGP?
Yes, but do you want to have fake emails sent from your account? Or everybody on the Internet reading your email or sharing access to exclusive groups? Me not.
PF>... quite interesting, the whole thing, tho I thought it would be easier.
I think a few steps can be done easier, but I had some special wishes I wanted implemented. That required work.
MH>At least the programmer said he worked a little bit on it.
... sounds like a new version is due. <dg>
MH>Nope, I use the longest REXX file: OS/2.
... as long as you have a damn fast machine to interpret the script. ;)
MH>What I really hated most, were the keyboards of the Power Macs in MH>Turku.
... I never used any Mac. I never understood why computers have to have such funny keys like that with the cloverleaf or such a thing. And the M$NK isn't any better. I always hit the menu-key when I want to press alt-gr. :( I love my good ol' Cherry G80-3000. It's IMHO the best keyboard you can get. :)))
MH>They had finger-marks on the D and K keys, not the F and J keys. A real
MH>pain to use those, if you use the ten-finger system.
... I don't use all 10 fingers when typing. I type for some 18 years now and never did any course in typing. It won't do any good any more. Another reason why it would be pretty useless to 'learn' typing in such a way is that a programmer does a totally different typing than does the writer. Btw., what finger-marks do you mean? Do you mean these funny pins on some keys? Are they for keeping track of where you put your fingers when you write blindly?
MH>but I didn't want to pay the extra charge for that.
... >;-)
MH>Having had rather long turnaround times in Turku, those few hours MH>didn't matter to me anyway.)
... you could use the spare time to go sight-seeing?! ;-)
MH>Yes, but do you want to have fake emails sent from your account? Or MH>everybody on the Internet reading your email or sharing access to MH>exclusive groups? Me not.
... I think, such arguments are somewhat of an overreaction. Even if there is the intention to spy, and it has to be the intention to explicitly spy *YOU*, not everybody on the internet would read what you have written or are intended to read exclusively. It is technically possible to track the transfer by accessing each machine it runs over. But that would have to be done by sick-minded admins who run these machines. Every access from outside should be impossible anyway.
Don't get me wrong. I do not intend to argue against PGP. I intend to argue against that sort of argumentation for it. PGP sure is a good thing, but the arguments you listed sound rather paranoid. ;)
MH> What I really hated most, were the keyboards of the Power Macs in Turku. They had finger-marks on the D and K keys, not the F and J keys. A real pain to use those, if you use the ten-finger system.
Well my german Mac has finger-marks on the D amd K keys, and my German PC has them on the F and J keys, and my English laptop has them also on F and J. So it looks like a Mac thing rather than a Finnish thing.
I'll try to remember to take a look at some sparcstations and Irix workstations and maybe some Sun 3s and whatever else I can find, maybe it's an OS thing.
MS>So it looks like a Mac thing rather than a Finnish thing.
I'd rather come to the conclusion that it is a Mac-typical feature. And a very bad one, too. The Finnish/Swedish PCs and Suns didn't have such marks (otherwise it might have been a little bit easier to get used to it).
MH>At least the programmer said he worked a little bit on it. PF>... sounds like a new version is due. <dg>
well, he just did it on the fly. That's one of the advantages, if you have the full sources available. ;-)
MH>Nope, I use the longest REXX file: OS/2. PF>... as long as you have a damn fast machine to interpret the script. ;)
You just need quite a lot of RAM for the interpreter. OS/2 never really required FAST machines, just memory. A different thing is the VoiceType system, that requires a fast math coprocessor.
PF>a programmer does a totally different typing than does the writer.
Yeah, but from time to time, an added comment line is needed and this can be done much faster using standard typing. Of course, real programmers ... ,-)
PF>Btw., what finger-marks do you mean? Do you mean these funny pins on some keys? Are they for keeping track of where you put your fingers when you write blindly?
Right, that's what they are for. I didn't really appreciate them until I had these big troubles with the Macs.
PF>PGP sure is a good thing, but the arguments you listed sound rather paranoid. ;)
Well, I wanted to read some closed groups, so I think that in my case this was necessary. An easier scheme would have been enough, but PGP is so easily available, that it would be too much work to use other programs.
MS>So it looks like a Mac thing rather than a Finnish thing. MH> MH> I'd rather come to the conclusion that it is a Mac-typical feature. And a very bad one, too. The Finnish/Swedish PCs and Suns didn't have such marks (otherwise it might have been a little bit easier to get used to it).
I have since checked out as many keyboards as I can find, including some old typewriters, and they either have no marks at all, or the F J marks. It's beginning to look like Apple is out on a limb here. I'll try and find time to ask the apple gurus.
MH>well, he just did it on the fly. That's one of the advantages, if you MH>have the full sources available. ;-)
... it also requires good connections to your sysop. ;)
MH>A different thing is the VoiceType system, that requires a fast math MH>coprocessor.
... then that voice thingy is nothing for AMD, Cx & IBM. ;)
MH>Of course, real programmers ... ,-)
... right! ;)
MH>Right, that's what they are for. I didn't really appreciate them until MH>I had these big troubles with the Macs.
... strange enough, my Cherry G80-3000 has it only on the numpad-5 key. Well, I don't need them, because I rarely look to the screen when typing but rather merely look to the keyboard. And I'm damn fast with it. :)
MH>that it would be too much work to use other programs.
... well, you must admit that PGP is anything else but easy to use. It is really a secure way to transfer information but easy to use? Well, the complexity of the topic forbids ease of use.
PF>... then that voice thingy is nothing for AMD, Cx & IBM. ;)
yeah, indeed that's *the* only reason why I got an int*l processor again.
PF>... strange enough, my Cherry G80-3000 has it only on the numpad-5 key.
Sometimes, the keys itself have a slightly different shape, like a more curved top, or things like that.
MH>that it would be too much work to use other programs. PF> PF>... well, you must admit that PGP is anything else but easy to use.
Well, you can write a real short doc file on how to use it. Of course, many aspects would remain unknown to the user this way. If you really want to understand it and have a secure installation, I guess a full afternoon is necessary to install it.
What I referred to was actually the idea, that once you know PGP, it is easier to use it for modified purposes than getting to know another software. ;-)
MH>yeah, indeed that's *the* only reason why I got an int*l processor MH>again.
... ;-)
MH>Sometimes, the keys itself have a slightly different shape, like a more
MH>curved top, or things like that.
... nope. They're all the same, apart from of course the special keys, shift(-lock), tab, cr, ctrl, alt, alt-gr and (back-)space. But these are not the keys people normally use for orientation purposes.
MH>Well, you can write a real short doc file on how to use it.
... but such a thing does AFAIK not exists. It would have been of great use for me.
MH>I guess a full afternoon is necessary to install it.
... so much about ease-of-use. ;-)
MH>What I referred to was actually the idea, that once you know PGP, it is
MH>easier to use it for modified purposes than getting to know another MH>software. ;-)
