MakerBot FUTURE! NYC MakerBot Meetup – Wednesday September 8!

[Bre Pettis]

Hey MakerBot Operators!

If you're in NYC, we'd like to invite you to the Botcave to help us
think about the future of Makerbot. What kind of features should we
prioritize for future machines? What would a future MakerBot be like?

So we’re going to have an open office tomorrow, Wednesday September
8th from 7:30-9PM. We’d really like it if you can swing by and give us
some feedback about what you’d like to see in the future of 3D
printers from MakerBot.

If that sounds like fun, RSVP on eventbrite for this free event and
say hi! We're at 87 3rd Ave Brooklyn NY 11217.

http://makerbot.eventbrite.com/

Can’t make it? Drop a note in the comments on the blog, send us an
email or carry on the discussion right here on the google group!

- Bre

[Richard K]

I won't be able to make it. Here is a list of things I would like to
see, in order of importance:
1 - Next gen electronics (soon?)
2 - Faster slicing and dicing of STL files
3 - Official Stepper driven extruder support
4 - Axis z-roids (or heavier duty than the standard ones)
5 - "Mega" Makerbot (i.e. larger build area)
6 - Multi-extruder support (possibly mix-n-match between normal
extruders and frostruder?) and support in ReplicatorG for it

[Charles Edward Pax]

I've added your ideas to http://wiki.makerbot.com/brainstorm . I know
everyone is full of great ideas. Let's start populating the wiki.

Charles Edward Pax
 blog: http://charlespax.com/
 twitter: http://twitter.com/charlespax

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[JohnA.]

I'll bring a list tomorrow night...

JohnA.



On Sep 7, 2:58 pm, Charles Edward Pax <charles....@gmail.com> wrote:
> I've added your ideas tohttp://wiki.makerbot.com/brainstorm. I know

> everyone is full of great ideas. Let's start populating the wiki.
>
> Charles Edward Pax
>  blog:http://charlespax.com/
>  twitter:http://twitter.com/charlespax
>

[Thomas Mahady]

any chance of a gotomeeting cam and link for those of us outside a 5 hour drive radius?

--------------------------------
Makerbot #441
Thomas Mahady
tma...@gmail.com
http://twitter.com/onikaze
Pittsburgh PA
USA

[Ethan Dicks]

On 9/7/10, Richard K <kutc...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I won't be able to make it. Here is a list of things I would like to
> see, in order of importance:
> 1 - Next gen electronics (soon?)

I'm not as gung-ho about this as some, it seems, but the progression
is inevitable.

> 2 - Faster slicing and dicing of STL files

Have you tried using psyco? I saw a huge difference in speed when I
dropped that on my build laptop.

> 3 - Official Stepper driven extruder support

That would be handy.

> 4 - Axis z-roids (or heavier duty than the standard ones)

z-roids?

> 5 - "Mega" Makerbot (i.e. larger build area)

Certainly a wide-bot or something similar would be handy. A build
area of even 120mm x 100mm would go a long way to not having to dodge
build-platform bolts/clips and be able to build parts that are
currently impossible.

> 6 - Multi-extruder support (possibly mix-n-match between normal
> extruders and frostruder?) and support in ReplicatorG for it

I have been waiting a long time for true multi-extruder support - and
it's not just for support material - I'd like to be able to make
decorative items in one color with accents in another color, or, as
you mention, mix plastics and pastes.

[Richard K]

> > 4 - Axis z-roids (or heavier duty than the standard ones)
>
> z-roids?

My attempt at a little humor.. The ACME z-rods are on steroids
(compared to the official makerbot ones, i.e. they're bigger and
sturdier).

Regarding #1 next gen electronics (or whatever flavor of the day
they're calling them) is because myself, and seems to be a bunch of
others too, have problems with the extruder controller, among other
electronics woes. Sometimes intermittent problems, sometimes not, it
is somewhat random it seems. Hopefully it will be much stabler.

On Sep 7, 3:52 pm, Ethan Dicks <ethan.di...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Charles Edward Pax]

psyco link?

Charles Edward Pax
 blog: http://charlespax.com/
 twitter: http://twitter.com/charlespax

[ddurant]

> psyco link?

It makes python math faster.. http://psyco.sourceforge.net/

> > For more options, visit this group athttp://groups.google.com/group/makerbot?hl=en.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[ddurant]

> It makes python math faster..

...but still nowhere near as fast as the superskein stuff Allan is
working on or the (Mac-only) stuff Zaggo wrote.

On Sep 7, 4:16 pm, ddurant <dduran...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > psyco link?
>

> It makes python math faster..http://psyco.sourceforge.net/

> > > For more options, visit this group athttp://groups.google.com/group/makerbot?hl=en.-Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

[tmo]

cant make it but hopefully someday i will be able to visit.

I think the #1 thing that makerbot should be working on is support
material. when i talk to people about the makerbot and the
limitations of it i always have to explain to people the "i cant
really do that" or "i cant make that part like that" because of the
overhang issues. then i get the reaction "ohh.. well thats cool but
you are pretty limited as to what you can make" i know better than
that but it would be incredible if we could shed the "toy" aspect of
this printer and step up with the heavy hitters (stratasys, dimension,
objet etc.)

here are a few more

a. get rid of hidden folders with skeinforge on OSX. makes no sense
to me to me to have invisible folders with all the most important
stuff (profiles, presets, etc.) i installed make visible app on my
machine, but its an unnecessary hassle i think.
b. mendel style z stage (the cupcake mendel Y stage has been
redesigned like 5 times now.. the first one worked, lets stop
redesigning things that already work, i appreciate the redesigns and
improvements but a z stage would be better and i am not able to design
one.. i have spent HOURS on it now and have really gotten nowhere.
support material would solve this one as well)
c. stepper extruder, i hear good things about these but dont really
have the time to shut down my bot while experimenting and some of the
changes necessary are above my level of tinkering..
d. support material (preferably water soluble) get a cheap harbor
freight ultrasonic cleaner, drop the part in and let it do its thing.
e. conveyor belt kit. i am REALLY interested in one of these.
f. better skeinforge interface/ integrate it into repG. take out most
of the options (at least visibly) and have some kind of interface with
drop down menus (infill %, speed, nozzle size etc.) when changing drop
downs tons of other settings would change in the background. having
the ability to change all kinds of variables is great but would be
cool to make it super easy to use.
g. 2 acme screw/ 2 smooth rod Z stage. the acme upgrade was really
great on my machine, i dont think 4 are necessary (they are really
expensive too)
h. 80/20 or makerbeam frame i think you could get away with a minimal
frame made from extrusions. the machine would be quieter, easier to
put together, less laser cutting, less fasteners, cheaper to
manufacture the kits (much less labor i think) etc..
i. hidden electronics (under the machine)
j. hidden z stage belts and pulleys (under the machine)
k. different nozzle sizes. i have been using a .35 nozzle and its
awesome, about to switch to .25 this week (extruder is all printed up,
just need to add the heating element.)

and last but not least something like this but 1/5th the size
http://www.fortus.com/Finishing_Stations.aspx

i think the focus should really be making the makerbots radically
better with new parts and not so much constantly redesigning the
things that already work (electronics, extruders etc) the existing
parts might not work the best they possibly could, but they are
certainly good enough. we already have awesome electronics and hot
end options sure they could be better but they work. printing a T
just doesn't work.

focus on improving the resolution and adding support material and this
machine will not be thought of as an irrelevant toy to the
competition.

t

[tmo]

ustream it with an iphone :)

On Sep 7, 10:50 am, Bre Pettis <brepet...@gmail.com> wrote:

[ddurant]

> I think the #1 thing that makerbot should be working on is support
> material.

To balance out your vote, I disagree. :)

Skeinforge can do support structures today by extruding at a lower PWM
value, the same way (or close to it) that the UP! printer's software
does. It may not be perfect but it works suprisingly well. Today.

Going to an different material for support structures means a whole
'nother extruder and big software changes (or something other than
skeinforge). ABS is pretty cheap stuff - I'm all for using it, if it
can be used (and it can!).

> and last but not least something like this but 1/5th the sizehttp://www.fortus.com/Finishing_Stations.aspx

> > - Bre- Hide quoted text -

[tmo]

just throwing this one out there for 1-2 years down the road.... far
more important things to focus on than this :)

add a webcam that is interfaced into replicatorG. if the build does
not "look" like what the 3d model is from a specified angle of the
webcam the print would be aborted.

if it comes off the platform, doesn't stick, gets all jammed up etc..

[tmo]

i want to move away from having to manually clean up prints, its a
time consuming and messy activity that i would rather not be doing.
the ball bearing that the up printer did that was posted to
thingiverse took 30 min + to clean up, thats not a fun activity.

by making that leap to a dual extruder (yes its an enormous one) you
open up so much more than just support material. you can have 2 or
more color prints, 2 material prints, support material (even if it is
abs at a different temp, the prints will be able to print much faster
than waiting for the temp to go up and down with the same head), and
probably more things that i/anyone has yet to come up with

[Ethan Dicks]

On 9/7/10, tmo <tmop...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I think the #1 thing that makerbot should be working on is support
> material. when i talk to people about the makerbot and the
> limitations of it i always have to explain to people the "i cant
> really do that" or "i cant make that part like that" because of the
> overhang issues.

I would be happy to be able to work with ablative support material
(since I know things partially handle homogeneous support material
now, but that has issues all its own).

> here are a few more
>
> a. get rid of hidden folders with skeinforge on OSX. makes no sense
> to me to me to have invisible folders with all the most important
> stuff (profiles, presets, etc.) i installed make visible app on my
> machine, but its an unnecessary hassle i think.

Sounds like you don't come from a UNIX background. For decades,
config stuff on UNIX machines is stuffed into "dotted directories" so
it doesn't clutter up your view.

So since I've been using UNIX for more than half my life, it _does_
make sense to me. "ls -al" is your friend; so is "find".

> h. 80/20 or makerbeam frame i think you could get away with a minimal
> frame made from extrusions. the machine would be quieter, easier to
> put together, less laser cutting, less fasteners, cheaper to
> manufacture the kits (much less labor i think) etc..

While I like Makerbeam and 80/20, I don't think of it as cheap. Less
laser cutting, sure, but considering the material cost of a Makerbot
frame is under $50 and laser cut flatpacks retail for around $200, I
don't think you are going to see significant savings with extruded
aluminum and lots of brackets, bolts and capture nuts. One advantage
to using cut sheet vs a framework design is that it's easier to square
up since the material itself is rigid along two axes (the
disadvantage, of course, is that you either need an expensive tool or
lots of labor to make your own copies).

Slapping down a few sheets of flat stock and watching a cutter go at
it is not that labor-intensive to make (compared to sorting and
counting and bagging hundreds of loose parts), but perhaps someone
from Makerbot could comment on how long it takes to compile a CupCake
kit.

-ethan

[Charles Edward Pax]

All these ideas should really go on the wiki. Otherwise, it's only a
hand full of us who will ever see it.

Charles Edward Pax
 blog: http://charlespax.com/
 twitter: http://twitter.com/charlespax

[ddurant]

> ...took 30 min + to clean up, thats not a fun activity.

I think that's a typo.. On the youtube video of them printing that
Thing, they say "It totally takes one hour and 14 minuts, 1 hour and
11 minutes to print and another 3 minutes to remove support
structure." http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOEbZ98J1Ks

I'm not disputing your right to want separate support materials. I
just think it's a whole lot of work and would raise the price too
much.

I would rather see anything, anything at all, they can do to make it
easier for people to go from "assembled" to "printing". (that and a
stepper extruder)

> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

[tmo]

nope i dont come from a unix background. what i dont understand is
why they would make something invisible when you would want access to
it, sure making things invisible in UNIX is beneficial, but explaining
to a beginner that they need to make invisible files visible to clean
out the repg presets (no way to delete them from within repg, only add
and edit..) or to reinstall and completely start over when they
completely borked everything up or to move to another machine or to
share profiles with others.

i think you could get away with minimal extrusions, it would not look
like a current makerbot (box design) would look more like a mini cnc
mill and would take 30 min to assemble and wouldn't be fragile at
all.. look how simple and inexpensive the Up! printer is made. they
could be shipped assembled fairly easily (i know a lot of people would
prefer that and actually pay a lot of $ for someone else to assemble a
makerbot for them)

i dont know what it costs to replace a laser but i do know they have a
limited life and there is a lot of cutting on the makerbot frame. i
just think less parts is better.



On Sep 7, 2:39 pm, Ethan Dicks <ethan.di...@gmail.com> wrote:

[minutilabs]

Ideally, you'd have a way to clean out skein profiles from within
skein or repg. A beginner really shouldn't be screwing with raw config
files by hand. "Dot files" are the standard UNIX way of doing things,
and as such, OSX has inherited them. Windows has "hidden files" which
serve the same purpose.

I agree about the chassis redesign. I know someone on this mailing
list called the bot a violin, and whoever it was, they were totally
right.

Psyco is a nice suggestion, but doesn't work on 64-bit, and never
will. I've never opened up the skeinforge code, but perhaps we could
get a speed improvement through the use of scipy/numpy? Or maybe just
translate the slowest modules to C?

Personally, I think skeinforge/repg needs serious simplification, and
a lot of that can come from more sane electronics design. Putting no
heatsinks on the mosfets on the extruder controller? Seriously? It was
pretty clear that they were going to be moving some serious current.
The stepper controllers probably ought to have heatsinking as well.
The variability of thermistors has caused a lot of people issues, and
yesterday I finally realized that the reason I haven't been able to
get my bot to act consistently is because with the recommended
settings, my temps were about 20 degrees lower than I had thought.
Yes, it's a bit more expensive, but a thermocouple setup would have
solved this from day one for myself and countless others, plus it
would have made configurations a bit more universal.

Actually, on the electronics note, I've heard electrical horror
stories about the MK5's recommended setup driving the relay board with
PWM. That's even more error-prone than a thermistor, and kind of a
serious safety issue as well. That never should have made it out the
door. Heatsinking, sure, everybody messes that one up every so often,
and it's sorta excusable. But PWMing a relay is a big deal. I'm just
hoping that what I've been hearing has all been a misunderstanding.

Sorry if this comes off as a frustrated rant. I got my bot back in
April or so, and I'm only now getting it to act right at all.
Apologies if any feelings were hurt!

[Zydac]

Can't make it even though I'm in the neighborhood.

Based on my own experiences and what I've been reading on the Gmail
group it seems like the issues that get mentioned a lot are the Z axis
wobble and mystery quirks in the extruder electronics. A more
accurate Z axis and more robust electronics (something to prevent the
thing frying itself when things go wrong) would be great. Also the
Skeinforge interface could be massively improved, but that's probably
a given. For instance I noticed that some things are descriptions of
the machine and other things are commands. Color coding could help.
Also manually editable paths in Skeinview would be really great! Some
sort of a vector drawing program that could work on each layer.
Sounds fiddly, but I could find uses for it especially if it could
import .eps or .dwg files.

Another idea I had was that the Z axis platform could be supported on
three rods instead of four so that it always makes a stable plane even
when it is not level. Save time on fiddling with the z axis nuts
after a crash.

Whatever it is, it would be great if the changes were an upgrade to
the present machine instead of a replacement. If it was a replacement
it should be makeable by current machines.

In terms of crazy ideas, I would like the thing to extrude using
plastic shopping bags that I would stuff in a bin at the top!

Peter

[JohnA.]

http://wiki.makerbot.com/brainstorm

A few of us updated / added to that list tonight, and I'll add
anything else that I hear mentioned at the meetup tomorrow.

JohnA.

[tmo]

the z axis doesnt need to be perfectly level. the build platform
does.

[Bo Lorentzen]

He suggested that 3 rods would keep the z platform stable, not level. ;-)

[tmo]

USB or wireless support for uploading to the SD card/ control of the
makerbot, i am pretty sure someone is doing bluetooth right now, that
would be a great upgrade kit.

[cyrozap]

I can make it. Also, the Eventbrite page says the wrong end time: on
the side, it says the event goes from 7:30 PM today to 9PM on October
17th ;)
The Eventbrite event description says the right times, though.

[Zydac]

Although having some way to level the build platform is a good idea
too! Currently mine is a little warped and I have to shim it.

[Rob Giseburt]

I added a Blog Posts section to the wiki, with a link to my blog post about it. I hope no one minds. My thoughts were too long winded, I think, for the wiki. :)

http://www.tinkerin.gs/2010/09/makerbot-past-and-future.html

The wiki link again, is:

http://wiki.makerbot.com/brainstorm

  -Rob

—

MakerBot Operator

Member of CCCKC Hackerspace

Member of KC Fabricators Google Group

[tmo]

folders for profiles from within repg. (i have 3 nozzles and profiles
for different colors and the list is getting HUGE)

if i could have folders for .35, .25, .5 nozzles and then folders in
that directory for different colors/ options

On Sep 8, 3:35 pm, Rob Giseburt <giseb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I added a Blog Posts section to the wiki, with a link to my blog post about it. I hope no one minds. My thoughts were too long winded, I think, for the wiki. :)
>
> http://www.tinkerin.gs/2010/09/makerbot-past-and-future.html
>
> The wiki link again, is:
>
> http://wiki.makerbot.com/brainstorm
>
>   -Rob
> —
> MakerBot Operator
> Member of CCCKC Hackerspace
> Member of KC Fabricators Google Group
>
> On Sep 7, 2010, at 1:58 PM, Charles Edward Pax wrote:
>

> > I've added your ideas tohttp://wiki.makerbot.com/brainstorm. I know

> > everyone is full of great ideas. Let's start populating the wiki.
>
> > Charles Edward Pax
> >  blog:http://charlespax.com/
> >  twitter:http://twitter.com/charlespax
>

> >> For more options, visit this group athttp://groups.google.com/group/makerbot?hl=en.

[Richard K]

Truly like your blog Rob!! :) And so true.

[inevit01]

I would like to second the support material request. I think this is
the biggest issue I have with my makerbot. I have been able to print
some beautiful stuff with my 0.25mm print nozzle, but I'm so limited
by not having a good support material solution. I have been strongly
considering buying the up printer for this reason, if only it was open
source. Makerbot your losing business, and I think this is because of
up's great support solution.
I want to be able to do this with my makerbot
http://www.pp3dp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=39
Maybe this requires you to create a good stepper extruder solution
that you can lay down little dots of plastic in between the support
and part layer, I don't know. Either way you need to figure out what
"up" is doing and one up them, I know you can. Make it a priority and
blow them away before they take to many customers away.

Besides this I would caution that you do not over engineer a solution,
for instance the new MK5 extruder I would say is overkill. You should
take a note from makergear and just make a simple PEEK/PTFE brass
extruder. I have had makergear's extruder printing without problems
for sometime now. Not to mention it would be alot cheaper for you
guys, did you really need 3 stainless steel parts? probably not.

I'm not trying to rant here, I'm very happy with my makerbot. I just
see how much better it could be, and I hope you see that as well.

[ddurant]

> I want to be able to do this with my makerbothttp://www.pp3dp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=39

I think a stepper would definitely help but you CAN do support
structures with skeinforge. You can do them today. Well, it's 11:30PM
so maybe not today but you can do them tomorrow!
http://davedurant.wordpress.com/2010/07/31/skeinforge-support-part-1/

The Up! costs 3x what a makerbot does (once they stop the first-100-
orders discount), you have to buy the ABS from them and, at least for
now, it only comes in white.

I'm really itching to get a stepper extruder. I think (but don't
*know*) that that will bring cupcakes a lot closer to Up!s.


So.. Did anybody take notes or minutes from the meetup tonight?

On Sep 8, 10:00 pm, inevit01 <bmcco...@cincinnati-test.com> wrote:
> I would like to second the support material request. I think this is
> the biggest issue I have with my makerbot. I have been able to print
> some beautiful stuff with my 0.25mm print nozzle, but I'm so limited
> by not having a good support material solution. I have been strongly
> considering buying the up printer for this reason, if only it was open
> source. Makerbot your losing business, and I think this is because of
> up's great support solution.

> I want to be able to do this with my makerbothttp://www.pp3dp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=39

> Maybe this requires you to create a good stepper extruder solution
> that you can lay down little dots of plastic in between the support
> and part layer, I don't know. Either way you need to figure out what
> "up" is doing and one up them, I know you can. Make it a priority and
> blow them away before they take to many customers away.
>
> Besides this I would caution that you do not over engineer a solution,
> for instance the new MK5 extruder I would say is overkill. You should
> take a note from makergear and just make a simple PEEK/PTFE brass
> extruder. I have had makergear's extruder printing without problems
> for sometime now. Not to mention it would be alot cheaper for you
> guys, did you really need 3 stainless steel parts? probably not.
>
> I'm not trying to rant here, I'm very happy with my makerbot. I just
> see how much better it could be, and I hope you see that as well.
>
> On Sep 8, 1:37 am, tmo <tmoph...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > USB or wireless support for uploading to the SD card/ control of the
> > makerbot, i am pretty sure someone is doing bluetooth right now, that

> > would be a great upgrade kit.- Hide quoted text -

[Rob Giseburt]

On Sep 8, 2010, at 10:28 PM, ddurant <ddur...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> So.. Did anybody take notes or minutes from the meetup tonight?

Yeah, or just any comments about the meeting? How did it go?

[tmo]

i think you will need to drop down to a .25 or at least a .35 nozzle
in addition to the stepper extruder to get close to the resolution of
the UP!

> So.. Did anybody take notes or minutes from the meetup tonight?

interested in what happened as well, bummed i live 2000+ miles away
with nobody within a 7 hour round trip that has a makerbot..

[tmo]

i agree. it seems like the parts that are getting the most attention/
R and D are parts that already work (granted the MK4 idler needed a
replacement but the printruder does that)

extruder works, electronics work, neither are perfect but both do work
exceptionally well when they are working.

resolution and support, without these 2 things its just a toy. (a toy
that i absolutely love and have 2 of, but still nothing for any
company to be worried about thats for sure)

this sums it up perfectly.
http://www.shapeways.com/blog/archives/521-The-Shapeways-Makerbot-Bunny.html#extended

On Sep 8, 8:00 pm, inevit01 <bmcco...@cincinnati-test.com> wrote:
> I would like to second the support material request. I think this is
> the biggest issue I have with my makerbot. I have been able to print
> some beautiful stuff with my 0.25mm print nozzle, but I'm so limited
> by not having a good support material solution. I have been strongly
> considering buying the up printer for this reason, if only it was open
> source. Makerbot your losing business, and I think this is because of
> up's great support solution.

> I want to be able to do this with my makerbothttp://www.pp3dp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=39

[ddurant]

> i think you will need to drop down to a .25 or at least a .35 nozzle

They print in the 0.2 to 0.3mm layer height range.. A stock makerbot
is capable of better than that.

The axis control may be a different story, though. And, of course, the
stepper extruder.

[ddurant]

> this sums it up perfectly. http://www.shapeways.com/blog/archives/521-The-Shapeways-Makerbot-Bunny.html

This was done with a 0.5mm nozzle on a mostly-stock makerbot..

http://www.flickr.com/photos/52118225@N08/4972587445/

It was just one of my stock skeinforge profiles though.. I've now got
a 0.35mm nozzle and some other tricks up my sleve and hope to be
getting eve better prints soon.

On Sep 8, 11:41 pm, tmo <tmoph...@gmail.com> wrote:
> i agree.  it seems like the parts that are getting the most attention/
> R and D are parts that already work (granted the MK4 idler needed a
> replacement but the printruder does that)
>
> extruder works, electronics work, neither are perfect but both do work
> exceptionally well when they are working.
>
> resolution and support, without these 2 things its just a toy.  (a toy
> that i absolutely love and have 2 of, but still nothing for any
> company to be worried about thats for sure)
>

> this sums it up perfectly.http://www.shapeways.com/blog/archives/521-The-Shapeways-Makerbot-Bun...

[tmo]

"This was done with a 0.5mm nozzle on a mostly-stock makerbot"

that is all that makerbot sells, i know you can get stuff elsewhere (i
have never owned a makerbot hot end).

could you take a photo of that with a sheet of white paper under it?
did the features of the face come out? looks a lot better than what
they made. we all hope to be getting better prints soon, thats my
point.

i only referenced that for the tone of shapeways and how they think
its basically a joke, this machine is not a joke... to advance the
company, not necessary the cupcake (the cupcake will be replaced very
soon i think) something needs to be done about resolution and support
material and it will cost more to get it, precision does not come
cheap.. the final product is the primary thing that matters with a 3d
printer, then the usability of the machine in a close second.

i personally think a makerbot shouldn't ship with anything bigger than
a .35 nozzle (unless you are doing high volume fast blocky prints then
a .5 is great) high end models should have .25 and would be for
advanced users. could they sell the makergear stuff in the store?
its so simple to double the resolution on these machines with a 5$
part.

sending the customers of a brand new machine to a competitor to get
the best results is not exactly the best long term business plan with
everything being open source. I didnt order a cupcake kit from
makerbot because i knew that a number of things really needed to be
changed right away before the power was ever turned on.

its interesting that the Up! printer hasn't really taken off yet, not
like the makerbot anyway. is the market for 3d printing a different
crowd who is more interested in building a machine then using it than
just buying it? I wonder what would happen if they had a US
distributor.

i think i just found out what one of the new products is... "the one
eyed creature"

[ddurant]

> i only referenced that for the tone of shapeways and how they think
> its basically a joke, this machine is not a joke...

I don't think they take makerbots as a joke.. They just (rightfully)
think their Stratasys machines are a very nice bit of kit.

Back on topic for this thread, that shapeways blog really is something
that I think MBI needs to take seriously.

Not because their $25k machine can out-print their $1k machine but
because their $1k machine is printing at far lower quality than it's
capable of. They did a so-so job with their $1k machine because that's
pretty much all any new user can do with it. The Up! people are
definitely going to take advantage of this, too - they can go from
unpacking to printing high-quality stuff in hours instead of weeks or
months. This is not a comment about pre-assembled vs a kit, it's about
how close to 'done' you are once the hardware is all hooked up and
ready to start.

That, IMO, is the biggest danger to MBI right now. Or at least the
biggest roadblock in their path to world-wide domination (which I
fully support, BTW).

> i personally think a makerbot shouldn't ship with anything bigger than
> a .35 nozzle

Don't underestimate the 0.5mm nozzle!! With a few mostly-printable
tweaks, a lot of resolution can be squeezed out of them: See also:
http://wiki.makerbot.com/hall-of-fame-highest-resolution .

> could you take a photo of that with a sheet of white paper under
> it? did the features of the face come out?

The features in the STL are very fine but yes, they did come out.

> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

[RyanP]

ddurant,

Could you upload your .gcode for this Bowie The Bunny? (I think you
can email the group and attach a file, not intuitive!) I guess I
should ask for skeinforge settings, but I can probably just tweak the
file to work on my machine.

So nice! Have you tried droping the temp on higher levels of the
print?

Ryan

[ddurant]

> Could you upload your .gcode for this Bowie The Bunny?

Sorry - the STL isn't public and when I asked the author for it, I
promised not to pass it out.

I'm not sure which profile I printed her with on that picture.
Probably down around 0.25-0.28mm layer height for detail and probably
with a 1.8 or so width/thickness to slow down the feed rate.

> So nice! Have you tried droping the temp on higher levels of the
> print?

That one was from at least a month ago (maybe closer to 2) and I'm not
really sure what I did. :) Between work, getting sick and machine
breakdowns & upgrades, I haven't been able to get back to it.. Hope to
soon, though.

[Martin Bogomolni]

Rob Parthowens ( creator of Bowie ) has an adorable and -very- hard to
print version called 'Baby Bowie' which has a safety pin on a diaper.
It's a great model, and a classic example of why a Makerbot could
really, really use support material.

I wonder if I could persuade Rob to make a cute model of some fuzzy
creature (like a squirrel) to put on thingiverse...

-M

[Bo Lorentzen]

Sure would like to toss it on the UP! if you are in LA stop by and feel free to print it from your laptop.

[Boris Camelo]

Hello team, i have a little software write in vb 6.0  to slice stl file, i help with toolpath. Friend's we can develop a better open software. if you want to give your help send me your email.

Boris Camelo

Bogota, Colombia

2010/9/10 Bo Lorentzen <b...@bophoto.com>