[discuss] Re: Helping people unsubscribe from users@openoffice.org
Harold Fuchs
John Kaufmann wrote:
> In a message dated 2009.11.18 11:22 -0500, Harold Fuchs wrote:
>
>>> I was wondering why you did not say something like "Please see
>>> instructions at the bottom of this post to unsubscribe", and was
>>> going to write to him off-list about it - when I realized that the
>>> instructions were not there! - not in Ray's post, not in your
>>> reply to him.
>>>
>>> That led to a search on posts from the last week, to see how many
>>> have the unsubscribe instructions appended. Each day, a majority of
>>> posts have that appendix, but some do not. I'm not sure about why
>>> there is a difference, but think it may be that unsubscribed posts,
>>> and replies to unsubscribed posts, do not get the appended message
>>> on how to unsubscribe. Is that your understanding? ... Do you know
>>> what determines when the unsubscribe instructions are appended to a
>>> post?
>>
>> As far as I know the instructions are only appended to messages
>> being sent to *subscribed* users, presumably on the grounds that
>> unsubscribed users don't need them (!) ...
>
> I don't think it can be that. Of the messages I get from the list,
> maybe 70%-80% have the unsubscribe instructions appended. But to take
> the example of the exchange between Ray Hall and you, those
> instructions were not attached to either message. So since those
> instructions are appended by the list manager to outgoing mail, it
> clearly does not matter to whom the message goes. It might matter from
> whom (subscribed or not) the message was sent, or whether the message
> is in reply to another message that had no unsubscribe appendix.
> Could Paul help with this kind of question?
>
>
<snip>
Hmm. Then I don't know.
Barbara? Paul? Anyone?
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Paul
> I don't think it can be that. Of the messages I get from the list, maybe
>> 70%-80% have the unsubscribe instructions appended. But to take the example
>> of the exchange between Ray Hall and you, those instructions were not
>> attached to either message. So since those instructions are appended by the
>> list manager to outgoing mail, it clearly does not matter to whom the
>> message goes. It might matter from whom (subscribed or not) the message was
>> sent, or whether the message is in reply to another message that had no
>> unsubscribe appendix. Could Paul help with this kind of question?
>>
>>
>> <snip>
>
> Hmm. Then I don't know.
>
> Barbara? Paul? Anyone?
From a brief look (and this is no way definite) it seems that the message
will appear _at least once_ per thread on subscribed user replies. It
generally doesn't appear for unsubscribed users.
In some ways this makes sense since repeating the same message for long
threads between subscribed users is a little pointless. As I said I'm not
100% sure but I've not found a thread where this hasn't held true - so far.
In the above case (Ray Hall) the email he replied to contained the
unsubscribe message (it appeared in the thread just before his email).
Consequently Harold's email to Ray did not contain the message.
Think we also need to keep in mind that there are many variables at work
here... gmane -v- email posting, how various email clients handle headers,
footers, signature settings, how various people have email configurations,
threaded -v- flat email thread readers etc... and the list goes on. Any one
of these can cause differences in what people see.
Just as an aside - I've noticed that my email is different (even tho' I'm
always using gmail) based on what browser I use - go figure...
Happy to test the theory if people want.
/paul
Paul
>
> In a message dated 2009.11.19 14:07 -0500, Paul wrote:
>
> From a brief look (and this is no way definite) it seems that the
>> message will appear _at least once_ per thread on subscribed user
>> replies. It generally doesn't appear for unsubscribed users.
>
>
I'll ask the question and see where we get to.
Just as an aside - I've noticed that my email is different (even tho' I'm
>> always using gmail) based on what browser I use - go figure...
>>
>
> Paul, could the list owner [whom I guess you know?] either tell you, or put
> you in touch with someone who could tell you, why that is?
This one I think is more to do with gmail/browser than anything to do with
the users/discuss list.
Happy to test the theory if people want.
>>
>
> I'd love a test of the theory - the only theory we have (and even that one
> is incomplete, because "at least once" is indeterminate) - or better yet, an
> explanation of why and when the unsubscribe instructions are appended. I
> don't think the variability is in ezmlm. Here again, can't the list owner
> hook us up with someone involved with the list management? The supreme
> irony of all this guessing at answers is that this is precisely what is not
> supposed to happen in an open-source world.
Are yes - it is open source, but only certain people know how its been
configured.
/paul