Hi all,
I am using Chrome for a web browser, and I have a few questions about reading and navigating web pages.
1. In the vo utility, you can choose either DOM order or grouping. Which is better?
2. Is there a way to disable the web rotor, so the arrows will act like they do in text reading or editing? With letter navigation, I see the web rotor as redundant and I'd rather use the arrow keys in the usual text navigation way.
Thanks in advance.
You might want to try using chrome vox. If you hit the command key twice while in chromevox then all the shortcuts are able to be done without holding down command-control. Chrome Vox does do things a bit different for arrows. Up/Down is your primary navigator and left / right navigates at a smaller incrment.
So if up/down is reading sentences then left / right will navigate by word. In a table however all four arrow keys while in Object navigation will navigate by table cell.
I am not sure if dom/group works in Chomebox. In Safari and Webkit, DOM mode navigates much like a windows browser with speech. Group mode combines major clusters of information and will navigate as things are layed out on the screen to the most part.
Jonathan C. Cohn
jonc...@cox.net
> Hi all,
> I am using Chrome for a web browser, and I have a few questions about reading and navigating web pages.
> 1. In the vo utility, you can choose either DOM order or grouping. Which is better?
> 2. Is there a way to disable the web rotor, so the arrows will act like they do in text reading or editing? With letter navigation, I see the web rotor as redundant and I'd rather use the arrow keys in the usual text navigation way.
> Thanks in advance.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group.
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> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
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I've heard of Chromevox and I even tried it a while back, but I found it confusing and difficult to work with. Still, if I can arrow around, it might be worth looking into again. Are there any podcasts on it?
On 29 Apr 2012, at 20:49, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
> You might want to try using chrome vox. If you hit the command key twice while in chromevox then all the shortcuts are able to be done without holding down command-control. Chrome Vox does do things a bit different for arrows. Up/Down is your primary navigator and left / right navigates at a smaller incrment.
> So if up/down is reading sentences then left / right will navigate by word. In a table however all four arrow keys while in Object navigation will navigate by table cell.
> I am not sure if dom/group works in Chomebox. In Safari and Webkit, DOM mode navigates much like a windows browser with speech. Group mode combines major clusters of information and will navigate as things are layed out on the screen to the most part.
> Jonathan C. Cohn
> jonc...@cox.net
> On Apr 29, 2012, at 8:21 AM, Alex Hall wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> I am using Chrome for a web browser, and I have a few questions about reading and navigating web pages.
>> 1. In the vo utility, you can choose either DOM order or grouping. Which is better?
>> 2. Is there a way to disable the web rotor, so the arrows will act like they do in text reading or editing? With letter navigation, I see the web rotor as redundant and I'd rather use the arrow keys in the usual text navigation way.
>> Thanks in advance.
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group.
>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
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> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
I haven't had much luck with chrome vox. All it does is crash chrome on my machine. If you want to just navigate with arrows, you should just turn on quick nav by pressing the left and right arrow keys at the same time.
> I've heard of Chromevox and I even tried it a while back, but I found it confusing and difficult to work with. Still, if I can arrow around, it might be worth looking into again. Are there any podcasts on it?
> On 29 Apr 2012, at 20:49, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
>> You might want to try using chrome vox. If you hit the command key twice while in chromevox then all the shortcuts are able to be done without holding down command-control. Chrome Vox does do things a bit different for arrows. Up/Down is your primary navigator and left / right navigates at a smaller incrment.
>> So if up/down is reading sentences then left / right will navigate by word. In a table however all four arrow keys while in Object navigation will navigate by table cell.
>> I am not sure if dom/group works in Chomebox. In Safari and Webkit, DOM mode navigates much like a windows browser with speech. Group mode combines major clusters of information and will navigate as things are layed out on the screen to the most part.
>> Jonathan C. Cohn
>> jonc...@cox.net
>> On Apr 29, 2012, at 8:21 AM, Alex Hall wrote:
>>> Hi all,
>>> I am using Chrome for a web browser, and I have a few questions about reading and navigating web pages.
>>> 1. In the vo utility, you can choose either DOM order or grouping. Which is better?
>>> 2. Is there a way to disable the web rotor, so the arrows will act like they do in text reading or editing? With letter navigation, I see the web rotor as redundant and I'd rather use the arrow keys in the usual text navigation way.
>>> Thanks in advance.
>>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group.
>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group.
>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group.
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> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
I have quick nav on. However, the left/right arrows don't seem to
navigate reliably (I ended up at the bottom of a page, and you can't
read by smaller chunks inside, say, a paragraph of text). Say you're
reading an article and aren't sure how an oddly spoken phrase is
spelled. On Windows, or in an edit area on Mac, you'd arrow to the
line, then move word by word to the phrase, then read word by word or
character by character. How would you do this (efficiently, not by
moving the rotor all over the place and hoping you don't hit the wrong
key and jump out of the entire article) in Chrome or Safari? Even the
"lines" setting on the rotor is not very useful - I still have no idea
what it thinks a "line" is, and it never seems to move me anywhere.
On 4/29/12, Ricardo Walker <rwalker...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I haven't had much luck with chrome vox. All it does is crash chrome on my
> machine. If you want to just navigate with arrows, you should just turn on
> quick nav by pressing the left and right arrow keys at the same time.
> On Apr 29, 2012, at 8:52 PM, Alex Hall <mehg...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I've heard of Chromevox and I even tried it a while back, but I found it
>> confusing and difficult to work with. Still, if I can arrow around, it
>> might be worth looking into again. Are there any podcasts on it?
>> On 29 Apr 2012, at 20:49, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
>>> You might want to try using chrome vox. If you hit the command key twice
>>> while in chromevox then all the shortcuts are able to be done without
>>> holding down command-control. Chrome Vox does do things a bit different
>>> for arrows. Up/Down is your primary navigator and left / right navigates
>>> at a smaller incrment.
>>> So if up/down is reading sentences then left / right will navigate by
>>> word. In a table however all four arrow keys while in Object navigation
>>> will navigate by table cell.
>>> I am not sure if dom/group works in Chomebox. In Safari and Webkit, DOM
>>> mode navigates much like a windows browser with speech. Group mode
>>> combines major clusters of information and will navigate as things are
>>> layed out on the screen to the most part.
>>> Jonathan C. Cohn
>>> jonc...@cox.net
>>> On Apr 29, 2012, at 8:21 AM, Alex Hall wrote:
>>>> Hi all,
>>>> I am using Chrome for a web browser, and I have a few questions about
>>>> reading and navigating web pages.
>>>> 1. In the vo utility, you can choose either DOM order or grouping. Which
>>>> is better?
>>>> 2. Is there a way to disable the web rotor, so the arrows will act like
>>>> they do in text reading or editing? With letter navigation, I see the
>>>> web rotor as redundant and I'd rather use the arrow keys in the usual
>>>> text navigation way.
>>>> Thanks in advance.
>>>> --
>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group.
>>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>>>> macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>>>> For more options, visit this group at
>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>>> macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>>> For more options, visit this group at
>>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
>> --
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>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>> macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>> For more options, visit this group at
>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
> --
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> I've heard of Chromevox and I even tried it a while back, but I found it confusing and difficult to work with. Still, if I can arrow around, it might be worth looking into again. Are there any podcasts on it?
> On 29 Apr 2012, at 20:49, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
>> You might want to try using chrome vox. If you hit the command key twice while in chromevox then all the shortcuts are able to be done without holding down command-control. Chrome Vox does do things a bit different for arrows. Up/Down is your primary navigator and left / right navigates at a smaller incrment.
>> So if up/down is reading sentences then left / right will navigate by word. In a table however all four arrow keys while in Object navigation will navigate by table cell.
>> I am not sure if dom/group works in Chomebox. In Safari and Webkit, DOM mode navigates much like a windows browser with speech. Group mode combines major clusters of information and will navigate as things are layed out on the screen to the most part.
>> Jonathan C. Cohn
>> jonc...@cox.net
>> On Apr 29, 2012, at 8:21 AM, Alex Hall wrote:
>>> Hi all,
>>> I am using Chrome for a web browser, and I have a few questions about reading and navigating web pages.
>>> 1. In the vo utility, you can choose either DOM order or grouping. Which is better?
>>> 2. Is there a way to disable the web rotor, so the arrows will act like they do in text reading or editing? With letter navigation, I see the web rotor as redundant and I'd rather use the arrow keys in the usual text navigation way.
>>> Thanks in advance.
>>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group.
>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group.
>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
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> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
Perhaps, but, if it was there, I couldn't figure out how to use it
(the tutorial) and couldn't remember everything it threw at me. I know
I managed ot pull up a help file once, but am not sure where that was.
I eventually gave up on it as it was so confusing and didn't work any
better. However, I now have a monitor, making performance immensely
better, and Chromevox has had time to update, so who knows...
On 4/29/12, Jonathan C. Cohn <jonc...@cox.net> wrote:
>> I've heard of Chromevox and I even tried it a while back, but I found it
>> confusing and difficult to work with. Still, if I can arrow around, it
>> might be worth looking into again. Are there any podcasts on it?
>> On 29 Apr 2012, at 20:49, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
>>> You might want to try using chrome vox. If you hit the command key twice
>>> while in chromevox then all the shortcuts are able to be done without
>>> holding down command-control. Chrome Vox does do things a bit different
>>> for arrows. Up/Down is your primary navigator and left / right navigates
>>> at a smaller incrment.
>>> So if up/down is reading sentences then left / right will navigate by
>>> word. In a table however all four arrow keys while in Object navigation
>>> will navigate by table cell.
>>> I am not sure if dom/group works in Chomebox. In Safari and Webkit, DOM
>>> mode navigates much like a windows browser with speech. Group mode
>>> combines major clusters of information and will navigate as things are
>>> layed out on the screen to the most part.
>>> Jonathan C. Cohn
>>> jonc...@cox.net
>>> On Apr 29, 2012, at 8:21 AM, Alex Hall wrote:
>>>> Hi all,
>>>> I am using Chrome for a web browser, and I have a few questions about
>>>> reading and navigating web pages.
>>>> 1. In the vo utility, you can choose either DOM order or grouping. Which
>>>> is better?
>>>> 2. Is there a way to disable the web rotor, so the arrows will act like
>>>> they do in text reading or editing? With letter navigation, I see the
>>>> web rotor as redundant and I'd rather use the arrow keys in the usual
>>>> text navigation way.
>>>> Thanks in advance.
>>>> --
>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group.
>>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>>>> macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>>>> For more options, visit this group at
>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>>> macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>>> For more options, visit this group at
>>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
>> --
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> --
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Even with Quick Nav on, you can still use the normal VO commands to navigate by character, word, line, sentence, etc. You can also lock the VO keys to minimise the number of keys to be pressed.
> I have quick nav on. However, the left/right arrows don't seem to
> navigate reliably (I ended up at the bottom of a page, and you can't
> read by smaller chunks inside, say, a paragraph of text). Say you're
> reading an article and aren't sure how an oddly spoken phrase is
> spelled. On Windows, or in an edit area on Mac, you'd arrow to the
> line, then move word by word to the phrase, then read word by word or
> character by character. How would you do this (efficiently, not by
> moving the rotor all over the place and hoping you don't hit the wrong
> key and jump out of the entire article) in Chrome or Safari? Even the
> "lines" setting on the rotor is not very useful - I still have no idea
> what it thinks a "line" is, and it never seems to move me anywhere.
How, on both counts? arrowing, even in text areas, never has seemed
very consistent; I find myself guessing until I find what I want.
Maybe quick nav complicates things, I don't know. I didn't know you
could lock the vo keys, that sounds useful. I think I need to find a
complete keyboard reference for vo, as huge as that may be. Does such
a thing exist?
On 4/30/12, Anne Robertson <a...@anarchie.org.uk> wrote:
> Even with Quick Nav on, you can still use the normal VO commands to navigate
> by character, word, line, sentence, etc. You can also lock the VO keys to
> minimise the number of keys to be pressed.
> Cheers,
> Anne
> On 30 Apr 2012, at 03:15, Alex Hall wrote:
>> I have quick nav on. However, the left/right arrows don't seem to
>> navigate reliably (I ended up at the bottom of a page, and you can't
>> read by smaller chunks inside, say, a paragraph of text). Say you're
>> reading an article and aren't sure how an oddly spoken phrase is
>> spelled. On Windows, or in an edit area on Mac, you'd arrow to the
>> line, then move word by word to the phrase, then read word by word or
>> character by character. How would you do this (efficiently, not by
>> moving the rotor all over the place and hoping you don't hit the wrong
>> key and jump out of the entire article) in Chrome or Safari? Even the
>> "lines" setting on the rotor is not very useful - I still have no idea
>> what it thinks a "line" is, and it never seems to move me anywhere.
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "MacVisionaries" group.
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> macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit this group at
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All the VO commands are shown in the commands menus which you get to by pressing VO-h-h.
When in a text area, you need to interact for VO commands to work. However, usually, you can navigate using just the arrow keys. As for editing text, the insertion point is always between two characters, so if you're navigating to the right, the insertion point is immediately after the last thing VoiceOver spoke. If you're navigating to the left, it's before the last thing VO said. If you press VO-F4, VO will tell you exactly where the insertion point is.
> How, on both counts? arrowing, even in text areas, never has seemed
> very consistent; I find myself guessing until I find what I want.
> Maybe quick nav complicates things, I don't know. I didn't know you
> could lock the vo keys, that sounds useful. I think I need to find a
> complete keyboard reference for vo, as huge as that may be. Does such
> a thing exist?
> I have quick nav on. However, the left/right arrows don't seem to
> navigate reliably (I ended up at the bottom of a page, and you can't
> read by smaller chunks inside, say, a paragraph of text). Say you're
> reading an article and aren't sure how an oddly spoken phrase is
> spelled. On Windows, or in an edit area on Mac, you'd arrow to the
> line, then move word by word to the phrase, then read word by word or
> character by character. How would you do this (efficiently, not by
> moving the rotor all over the place and hoping you don't hit the wrong
> key and jump out of the entire article) in Chrome or Safari? Even the
> "lines" setting on the rotor is not very useful - I still have no idea
> what it thinks a "line" is, and it never seems to move me anywhere.
> On 4/29/12, Ricardo Walker <rwalker...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi,
>> I haven't had much luck with chrome vox. All it does is crash chrome on my
>> machine. If you want to just navigate with arrows, you should just turn on
>> quick nav by pressing the left and right arrow keys at the same time.
>> On Apr 29, 2012, at 8:52 PM, Alex Hall <mehg...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> I've heard of Chromevox and I even tried it a while back, but I found it
>>> confusing and difficult to work with. Still, if I can arrow around, it
>>> might be worth looking into again. Are there any podcasts on it?
>>> On 29 Apr 2012, at 20:49, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
>>>> You might want to try using chrome vox. If you hit the command key twice
>>>> while in chromevox then all the shortcuts are able to be done without
>>>> holding down command-control. Chrome Vox does do things a bit different
>>>> for arrows. Up/Down is your primary navigator and left / right navigates
>>>> at a smaller incrment.
>>>> So if up/down is reading sentences then left / right will navigate by
>>>> word. In a table however all four arrow keys while in Object navigation
>>>> will navigate by table cell.
>>>> I am not sure if dom/group works in Chomebox. In Safari and Webkit, DOM
>>>> mode navigates much like a windows browser with speech. Group mode
>>>> combines major clusters of information and will navigate as things are
>>>> layed out on the screen to the most part.
>>>> Jonathan C. Cohn
>>>> jonc...@cox.net
>>>> On Apr 29, 2012, at 8:21 AM, Alex Hall wrote:
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>> I am using Chrome for a web browser, and I have a few questions about
>>>>> reading and navigating web pages.
>>>>> 1. In the vo utility, you can choose either DOM order or grouping. Which
>>>>> is better?
>>>>> 2. Is there a way to disable the web rotor, so the arrows will act like
>>>>> they do in text reading or editing? With letter navigation, I see the
>>>>> web rotor as redundant and I'd rather use the arrow keys in the usual
>>>>> text navigation way.
>>>>> Thanks in advance.
>>>>> --
>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>>>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group.
>>>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>>>>> macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>>>>> For more options, visit this group at
>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
>>>> --
>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>>>> macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>>>> For more options, visit this group at
>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
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>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
>>> macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
>>> For more options, visit this group at
>>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
>> --
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>> macvisionaries+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
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I've tried both, but I have no idea which is better, or even what the
difference really is. I have read the help for it, and I am very
familiar with what a DOM is, but i can't see a difference between the
functionality of both modes when I'm using either one.
Yes, I have the arrow keys down well enough. However, back to my
original question: if there's a long p element (paragraph), how do I
read line by line, word by word, and so on? Right arrowing will just
skip the whole thing, or jump to the top of it if I move back to it.
On 5/1/12, Jonathan C. Cohn <jonc...@cox.net> wrote:
>> I have quick nav on. However, the left/right arrows don't seem to
>> navigate reliably (I ended up at the bottom of a page, and you can't
>> read by smaller chunks inside, say, a paragraph of text). Say you're
>> reading an article and aren't sure how an oddly spoken phrase is
>> spelled. On Windows, or in an edit area on Mac, you'd arrow to the
>> line, then move word by word to the phrase, then read word by word or
>> character by character. How would you do this (efficiently, not by
>> moving the rotor all over the place and hoping you don't hit the wrong
>> key and jump out of the entire article) in Chrome or Safari? Even the
>> "lines" setting on the rotor is not very useful - I still have no idea
>> what it thinks a "line" is, and it never seems to move me anywhere.
>> On 4/29/12, Ricardo Walker <rwalker...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>> I haven't had much luck with chrome vox. All it does is crash chrome on
>>> my
>>> machine. If you want to just navigate with arrows, you should just turn
>>> on
>>> quick nav by pressing the left and right arrow keys at the same time.
>>> On Apr 29, 2012, at 8:52 PM, Alex Hall <mehg...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> I've heard of Chromevox and I even tried it a while back, but I found it
>>>> confusing and difficult to work with. Still, if I can arrow around, it
>>>> might be worth looking into again. Are there any podcasts on it?
>>>> On 29 Apr 2012, at 20:49, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
>>>>> You might want to try using chrome vox. If you hit the command key
>>>>> twice
>>>>> while in chromevox then all the shortcuts are able to be done without
>>>>> holding down command-control. Chrome Vox does do things a bit
>>>>> different
>>>>> for arrows. Up/Down is your primary navigator and left / right
>>>>> navigates
>>>>> at a smaller incrment.
>>>>> So if up/down is reading sentences then left / right will navigate by
>>>>> word. In a table however all four arrow keys while in Object
>>>>> navigation
>>>>> will navigate by table cell.
>>>>> I am not sure if dom/group works in Chomebox. In Safari and Webkit,
>>>>> DOM
>>>>> mode navigates much like a windows browser with speech. Group mode
>>>>> combines major clusters of information and will navigate as things are
>>>>> layed out on the screen to the most part.
>>>>> Jonathan C. Cohn
>>>>> jonc...@cox.net
>>>>> On Apr 29, 2012, at 8:21 AM, Alex Hall wrote:
>>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>> I am using Chrome for a web browser, and I have a few questions about
>>>>>> reading and navigating web pages.
>>>>>> 1. In the vo utility, you can choose either DOM order or grouping.
>>>>>> Which
>>>>>> is better?
>>>>>> 2. Is there a way to disable the web rotor, so the arrows will act
>>>>>> like
>>>>>> they do in text reading or editing? With letter navigation, I see the
>>>>>> web rotor as redundant and I'd rather use the arrow keys in the usual
>>>>>> text navigation way.
>>>>>> Thanks in advance.
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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I have another question for this subject; I thought I had read that
the modes (DOM or Groups) could be selected for each site you go to
and VO would remember that preference when you go back to a given
site. Did I read this wrong? I do not observe that aspect to be
working on my setup.
The difference I see between DOM and Groups mode is quicker navigation
on those sites where several links are grouped into a single object.
This is especially nice with those navigation links so you don't have
to VO-Right for every single link. But I have also run into
situations where groups are nested within groups which are also nested
in yet another group so I end up having to interact maybe 3 levels
down before I can get to focus on the desired link. So it goes both
ways and I'm glad we have the choice.
As was answered, use the rotor to change to different navigation
levels like Character, Worde, Line, Form field, Heading, and several
others.
> I've tried both, but I have no idea which is better, or even what the
> difference really is. I have read the help for it, and I am very
> familiar with what a DOM is, but i can't see a difference between the
> functionality of both modes when I'm using either one.
> Yes, I have the arrow keys down well enough. However, back to my
> original question: if there's a long p element (paragraph), how do I
> read line by line, word by word, and so on? Right arrowing will just
> skip the whole thing, or jump to the top of it if I move back to it.
> On 5/1/12, Jonathan C. Cohn <jonc...@cox.net> wrote:
>> Up / down arrows will move the web rotar selection and left right will
>> move
>> by chunks. Do you use Group or Dom navigation?
>>> I have quick nav on. However, the left/right arrows don't seem to
>>> navigate reliably (I ended up at the bottom of a page, and you can't
>>> read by smaller chunks inside, say, a paragraph of text). Say you're
>>> reading an article and aren't sure how an oddly spoken phrase is
>>> spelled. On Windows, or in an edit area on Mac, you'd arrow to the
>>> line, then move word by word to the phrase, then read word by word or
>>> character by character. How would you do this (efficiently, not by
>>> moving the rotor all over the place and hoping you don't hit the wrong
>>> key and jump out of the entire article) in Chrome or Safari? Even the
>>> "lines" setting on the rotor is not very useful - I still have no idea
>>> what it thinks a "line" is, and it never seems to move me anywhere.
>>> On 4/29/12, Ricardo Walker <rwalker...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Hi,
>>>> I haven't had much luck with chrome vox. All it does is crash chrome on
>>>> my
>>>> machine. If you want to just navigate with arrows, you should just turn
>>>> on
>>>> quick nav by pressing the left and right arrow keys at the same time.
>>>> On Apr 29, 2012, at 8:52 PM, Alex Hall <mehg...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> I've heard of Chromevox and I even tried it a while back, but I found
>>>>> it
>>>>> confusing and difficult to work with. Still, if I can arrow around, it
>>>>> might be worth looking into again. Are there any podcasts on it?
>>>>> On 29 Apr 2012, at 20:49, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
>>>>>> You might want to try using chrome vox. If you hit the command key
>>>>>> twice
>>>>>> while in chromevox then all the shortcuts are able to be done without
>>>>>> holding down command-control. Chrome Vox does do things a bit
>>>>>> different
>>>>>> for arrows. Up/Down is your primary navigator and left / right
>>>>>> navigates
>>>>>> at a smaller incrment.
>>>>>> So if up/down is reading sentences then left / right will navigate by
>>>>>> word. In a table however all four arrow keys while in Object
>>>>>> navigation
>>>>>> will navigate by table cell.
>>>>>> I am not sure if dom/group works in Chomebox. In Safari and Webkit,
>>>>>> DOM
>>>>>> mode navigates much like a windows browser with speech. Group mode
>>>>>> combines major clusters of information and will navigate as things are
>>>>>> layed out on the screen to the most part.
>>>>>> Jonathan C. Cohn
>>>>>> jonc...@cox.net
>>>>>> On Apr 29, 2012, at 8:21 AM, Alex Hall wrote:
>>>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>>> I am using Chrome for a web browser, and I have a few questions about
>>>>>>> reading and navigating web pages.
>>>>>>> 1. In the vo utility, you can choose either DOM order or grouping.
>>>>>>> Which
>>>>>>> is better?
>>>>>>> 2. Is there a way to disable the web rotor, so the arrows will act
>>>>>>> like
>>>>>>> they do in text reading or editing? With letter navigation, I see the
>>>>>>> web rotor as redundant and I'd rather use the arrow keys in the usual
>>>>>>> text navigation way.
>>>>>>> Thanks in advance.
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> I thought I had read that
> the modes (DOM or Groups) could be selected for each site you go to
Maybe if you create an ativity it could be done. I've never bothered because I have a keyboard commander shortcut and a Quick Nav shortcut to switch modes. I usually use groups, but for reading a big chunk of a page, I use DOM.
I also use the Safari Reader for reading articles.
Safari Reader is a normal part of Safari. You press Cmd-Shift-r, wait a second or two, and VoiceOver starts reading the article. The beauty of it is that it brings together all the pages without you having to click on "Next page".
I have always been able to download books from Bard and copy them to an SD card.I can no longer do this. I press the past command and my mac bonks. I am not an expert Mac user, but this seems like a rather simple thing. I have no clue what I'm doing wrong.
> I have always been able to download books from Bard and copy them to an SD card.I can no longer do this. I press the past command and my mac bonks. I am not an expert Mac user, but this seems like a rather simple thing. I have no clue what I'm doing wrong.
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The way you've described it is exactly the way I used to do it. I am beginning to think there is a problem with the card.
On May 2, 2012, at 5:49 PM, Ray Foret Jr wrote:
> Neither do I. Perhaps we can help if maybe you describe what you did before and what you're doing now?
> 1. Download the book.
> 2. Go to the downloads folder off your home folder.
> 3. Find the book.
> 4. When focused on the book, press command+c to copy.
> 5. Now, navigate to the new location you want to move the book to and use command+v to paste or shift+command+v to move.
> Of course, it goes without saying that you should make sure you are moving the unzipped version of the book.
> Sincerely,
> The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
> Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!
> Skype name:
> barefootedray
> Facebook:
> facebook.com/ray.foretjr.1
> On May 2, 2012, at 5:02 PM, Richard Ring wrote:
>> I have always been able to download books from Bard and copy them to an SD card.I can no longer do this. I press the past command and my mac bonks. I am not an expert Mac user, but this seems like a rather simple thing. I have no clue what I'm doing wrong.
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group.
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> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group.
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> The way you've described it is exactly the way I used to do it. I am beginning to think there is a problem with the card.
> On May 2, 2012, at 5:49 PM, Ray Foret Jr wrote:
>> Neither do I. Perhaps we can help if maybe you describe what you did before and what you're doing now?
>> 1. Download the book.
>> 2. Go to the downloads folder off your home folder.
>> 3. Find the book.
>> 4. When focused on the book, press command+c to copy.
>> 5. Now, navigate to the new location you want to move the book to and use command+v to paste or shift+command+v to move.
>> Of course, it goes without saying that you should make sure you are moving the unzipped version of the book.
>> Sincerely,
>> The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>> Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!
>> Skype name:
>> barefootedray
>> Facebook:
>> facebook.com/ray.foretjr.1
>> On May 2, 2012, at 5:02 PM, Richard Ring wrote:
>>> I have always been able to download books from Bard and copy them to an SD card.I can no longer do this. I press the past command and my mac bonks. I am not an expert Mac user, but this seems like a rather simple thing. I have no clue what I'm doing wrong.
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This was very useful information but I have a question about it. We were on a web page that had several headings, all of which had a read more link. This worked on the first header level but when we tried it on the second or third level it would only open up and read the article on the first level. Any ideas?
Thank you, Dawn
________________________________ From: Anne Robertson <a...@anarchie.org.uk> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com Sent: Wednesday, May 2, 2012 5:46 PM Subject: Re: web navigation?
Hello Steve,
Safari Reader is a normal part of Safari. You press Cmd-Shift-r, wait a second or two, and VoiceOver starts reading the article. The beauty of it is that it brings together all the pages without you having to click on "Next page".
Cheers,
Anne
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