Suggestion for the space: a small darkroom
Alex Pounds
Now we have Laboratory 23, we have three bathrooms in the space.
Presumably we don't need that many - I think two would be enough for our
sanitary needs - so I wanted to make a proposal: let's turn one of them
into a photographic darkroom.
Black and white development is really easy, and doesn't need much space.
Access to running water is strongly recommended (not a problem in a
bathroom). As well as 35mm photography a darkroom would let members
experiment with other formats (whether commercially produced, like medium
or large format cameras, or home-grown - either from paint-on emulsions or
mixing your own, if you're really hardcore). The rightmost bathroom would
also have space for an enlarger or two, allowing us to make prints and
photograms. I guess other people may have uses for a light-tight space
too.
I've spent a reasonable amount of time doing my own developing and
printing, so I'm happy to co-ordinate/take the lead on designing & kitting
out the space. I think the right bathroom would be best for it. I'd also
be pleased to share what I know, whether one-on-one with interested
members or by running shooting/developing/printing workshops.
However, I have two reservations:
1. Photography might be a bit too far removed from the engineering
generally done in the Hackspace, and thus having a dedicated space for
it would be wasteful (ie. not used enough by members, takes up space
that could be used for other things).
2. I don't know if anyone else is interested.
Off the top of my head, we could bodge a negatives-only darkroom for £50,
get quite a nice one for £100, and £250 would allow us to do negatives and
prints in a space that's fun to use.
So, if this is something you'd be interested in, or think would be a good
fit for the Hackspace, then please say so. Equally, if you think it's not
worth spending the time/money/space on, please say so too. If there's a
general consensus of "Let's do it," we can start more definite planning.
--
Alex Pounds .~. http://www.alexpounds.com/
/V\ http://www.ethicsgirls.com/
// \\
"Variables won't; Constants aren't" /( )\
^`~'^
Robert Leverington
Just some general points:
- It has been suggested already that one of the toilets be turned in to
a shower, we probably need to decide if two toilets is really enough
(there may be regulations we need to adhere to?).
- I'm not sure what the popularity of it would be like, as its not been
mentioned before - but at the same time it might attract members from
the photography community who would not have considered using the
hackspace for this.
- This isn't something that the hackspace would be able to fund right
now, so you'd need to set up pledges for purchasing the equipment.
Robert
Jonty Wareing
--jonty
Alex Pounds <al...@alexpounds.com> wrote:
Dirk-WIllem van Gulik
On 9 Jan 2011, at 19:51, Jonty Wareing wrote:
> Data point WRT popularity, Noisebridge has a darkroom that apparently gets quite a lot of use.
Aye - though their community currently has a different markup; and I could imagine there to be different drivers/money considerations involved here too - a larger class of people has little access/suitable space and little storage - while some money & used-to-travel - while in the UK it is perhaps slightly the other way round.
Dw.
Adrian Godwin
-adrian
Gilda Maurice
Lester Hawksby
I have some equipment I can donate, including at least an enlarging lens and a grain magnifier, quite possibly rather a lot more (it is all in boxes), certainly some paper, maybe even a basic enlarger...
Alex Pounds
> I would love a darkroom - I haven't used one since uni, but I loved doing
> rayograms (http://bit.ly/hzuysA) and I was hoping to get back to doing some
> :-)
> I'll pledge some money if need be!
I'm glad to know people are interested. :) One thing I forgot to mention:
if you *are* interested, it'd help to know what kind of thing you're
interested in. Darkrooms are pretty generic, but knowing where the
membership's interest lies is always useful during planning.
For my own part, I'm interested in developing black and white film,
producing contact prints from them, and doing larger art prints from the
negatives.
Mike Harrison
>On Sun, Jan 09, 2011 at 10:06:41PM +0000, Gilda Maurice wrote:
>> I would love a darkroom - I haven't used one since uni, but I loved doing
>> rayograms (http://bit.ly/hzuysA) and I was hoping to get back to doing some
>> :-)
>> I'll pledge some money if need be!
>
>I'm glad to know people are interested. :) One thing I forgot to mention:
>if you *are* interested, it'd help to know what kind of thing you're
>interested in. Darkrooms are pretty generic, but knowing where the
>membership's interest lies is always useful during planning.
>
>For my own part, I'm interested in developing black and white film,
>producing contact prints from them, and doing larger art prints from the
>negatives.
Considering how little film processing is going on these days, I'd surprised if this couldn't be
entirely fitted out with free donations - there must be a ton of this stuff sitting in lofts &
storage awaiting the skip.
X-Ray machine anyone....?
Laura
Been lurking on this list since roundabout day 1, too shy to join in
or appear at the space. But now you've gone and mention darkrooms...
So, I have studio space in Clapton that I've made into a photography
darkroom after I got fed up with digital photography, stock
photography and Photoshop in general. Return to old school making of
prints.
Few thoughts
1. You don't need a darkroom for negs, just changing bags and containers etc.
2. Temporary workbench is not great for enlargers (and really that's
the point of a darkroom); once you get them levelled and set up, you
don't want to be moving them. Actually, I couldn't move my enlarger
on my own.
3. I'd be surprised if you could get all you needed from free
donations. And you might be surprised at how much printing is going
on these days. Not on a commercial scale maybe, but lots all the same
4. I know a bloke who runs a darkroom and does kitting out for
brilliant prices. He sorted my enlarger (which does negs up to 5x4)
and various other bits of kit. Can pass details on if wanted
5. I can teach some of the basics if anyone's interested. Also lith
printing, which is fun. And I'd maybe like to experiment with some
more esoteric techniques with other people. I work alone WAY too
much. Or actually this winter, don't work enough :/. Might be good to
bounce ideas around with other people...
Gah, few glasses of wine and the mention of darkrooms and I'm out of my lurkzone
Laura
Chris 'Fish' Roberts
Also, I can think of a few uses for a dark room that are non-
photography based. Including impregnating your own photo-etch PCBs
(OK, so you don't *need* a dark room, but it certainly doesn't do any
harm). Also, potentially useful for calibrating light/colour sensors,
that sort of thing. Would be a good place to store light sensitive
materials. You could do other opticsy type things in there, too
(spectrometer, anyone?).
If you're really hardcore, you could even try doing a bit of silicon
etching. Pretty noxious chemicals involved, which would be a new
concern, but having a dark room could help?
http://vimeo.com/channels/26257
layer1gfx
what would be possible if someone would want to do some photographic
project? please keep me posted... ;)
George Buckenham
Alex Pounds
> I would be interested in maybe doing some stuff in colour - certainly I
> think it's worth keeping an eye out for a colour enlarger, as they can
> be used for black and white stuff also. It really depends on the price
> differential...
Colour processing is a real swine, though; personally, I think it's more
trouble than it's worth. It requires much tighter time and temperature
control than black and white, involves more (and more noxious) chemicals,
and both developing and printing have to be done in complete darkness (no
safelights when printing). In summary: tricky. But yes, a colour enlarger
would be nice and means members can mess with colour if they're so
inclined.
As for kitting out the room, I expect we can get most of what we need
second-hand (an enlarger and Paterson tanks, for instance), while more
utilitarian things (trays, tongs, blackout material) will end up being
bought new. If we can get a light-tight vent put in the window or wall
(eg.
http://www.firstcall-photographic.co.uk/products/642/ventaxia-solo-plus-p-extractor-fan)
then that gives us more options; most stuff is fine to breathe in, but if
you're doing (say) selenium toning you'll want the ventilation...
Colin Wright
Lester Hawksby
really enjoyed having access to a colour-head enlarger for black and
white work on multigrade paper.
The enlarger is the only part that needs to stay permanently set up.
The trays, drying space etc can stack quite small if the table space
needs to be reclaimed. In my last darkroom I had an enlarger on an old
computer desk, and absolutely everything else had to pack away
underneath it after every session, and it worked fine.
Unfortunately there's no single "right" enlarger. A 35mm one is cheap,
light and compact but it's pretty easy to get cheap and lovely medium
format cameras nowadays so it would be a shame to exclude MF work. A
6x6 or 6x7 enlarger is a good size. Above that they get incredibly
heavy, need more expensive lenses, and start to be too big to
comfortably work with 35mm... then there's the choice of condenser
versus colour. Super high contrast (but sensitive to dust and grain)
versus flexibility of contrast control. Can't really have both.
Here we get to the fun part: I have two enlargers and we only need one.
So if people are serious about this darkroom business I am prepared to EITHER
(a) GIVE the Hackspace a small, basic, lightly built Durst 35mm
enlarger with a colour head (it may be only a colour-for-B&W head, IE
missing a cyan filter, not sure - I can check at the weekend). May
need adjustment. This would be Hackspace's to keep for all time, give
away if there's a massive burst of enthusiasm and we buy a 4x5, borrow
parts for something involving frikkin' laser beams... and if it wears
out I'll shed no tears, just be happy it's being used.
OR
(b) LEND the Hackspace a decent, heavily built 6x7 Meopta with a
condenser head. I would want it to be looked after, kept in good nick,
and returned to me if unwanted. Worked superbly last time I used it.
Thoughts?
Lester.
PS I also have some chemicals for "alternative process" photography -
coat your own paper with 19th or early 20th century formulae and then
contact print large negs (or make photograms) using sunlight/a UV box.
Certainly including the stuff needed for the very easy Cyanotype
(blueprint) and lovely but hazardous Gum Dichromate (printing with
watercolour pigment!) processes. The potassium ferricyanide for the
blueprint process is also a great bleach for b&w silver gelatin. These
are all FREE TO GOOD HOME, defined as a home that promises not to tip
potassium dichromate down the sink. That would be bad.
clare greenhalgh
Clare Greenhalgh
Director
English Speech and Pronunciation Ltd
Company Registration Number 6984318
Tel 07801 732601
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Martin
I currently use a darkroom at the London Camera Club. I shoot 35mm,
120 and 5x4, black and white and colour. I dev my own black and
white, and send my colour away. Unless we do huge amounts of colour
development in house it won't be worth keeping the chemistry fresh -
we'd be better off sending it away individually or pooling film
together for a monthly bulk discount devfest. I'm happy to organise
that, I'm sending off monthly anyway.
I can teach B&W development and B&W and ilfochrome printing. Colour
printing is expensive, fiddly and tedious but the results are
magnificent. The major difficulty with colour printing is temperature
control. A temperature stabilised water bath would make a fantastic
hackspace project.
I've helped set up darkrooms before so I have some experience in
lightproofing, organising a dry side and a wet side, that sort of
thing. Ventilation is important too, doubly so with colour printing.
The suggestion of bulk-buying and selling film and paper is a great
one. We could do with a fridge at some point if we want to store
colour film. I'd suggest keeping chemistry around as well. London
Camera Club currently mix up paper dev, stop and fix in one-shot
bottles and sell those for 50p each. It seems we've got enough
competency on this list to run that system too. We could probably
keep a few big bottles of film chemistry around and ask for donations
to use those.
I can lend some dev tanks, measuring jugs, thermometer, squeegee
thingy and other bits and bobs I've got hanging around. I also have 2
5x4 cameras and plenty of sheet holders so if anybody wants to sample
the joys of large format we can give that a go. Could make some
spiffy hackspace darkcloths :D
On Jan 10, 10:20 am, Colin Wright <colinwrigh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Also interested :)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 9:21 AM, Alex Pounds <a...@alexpounds.com> wrote:
> > On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 09:05:24AM +0000, George Buckenham wrote:
> > > I would be interested in maybe doing some stuff in colour - certainly I
> > > think it's worth keeping an eye out for a colour enlarger, as they can
> > > be used for black and white stuff also. It really depends on the price
> > > differential...
>
> > Colour processing is a real swine, though; personally, I think it's more
> > trouble than it's worth. It requires much tighter time and temperature
> > control than black and white, involves more (and more noxious) chemicals,
> > and both developing and printing have to be done in complete darkness (no
> > safelights when printing). In summary: tricky. But yes, a colour enlarger
> > would be nice and means members can mess with colour if they're so
> > inclined.
>
> > As for kitting out the room, I expect we can get most of what we need
> > second-hand (an enlarger and Paterson tanks, for instance), while more
> > utilitarian things (trays, tongs, blackout material) will end up being
> > bought new. If we can get a light-tight vent put in the window or wall
> > (eg.
>
> > )
amx109
very interested in this - would love to learn how to develop 120 film, and be able to produce prints from them
Fuzzy Dunlop
Adrian Godwin
I would certainly use a darkroom.I also have some gear, including a b/w enlarger with a good lens (although it hasn't been used for 20yrs).There are only three darkrooms for hire in London, so you may find it a popular decision.Happy to get involved.Kevan.
It's in the space and can be hacked as required.
-adrian
Alex Pounds
> I found an enlarger and a few accessories at Haggerston market the other
> day. It doesn't have a lens but maybe that can be obtained. And the
> accessories (trays, print washer, clamps) might be useful.
That's awesome, thanks. I'd spotted it had appeared but didn't know who to
thank. :)
I've taken some measurements of the bathrooms, which I'll draw up in QCad
over the weekend and produce some proposals.