Flexible electronics, conductive fabric, transparent boards?

[Simon Howes]

Hi peeps,

I remember hearing somewhere about lillipad and people making clothes with working bits sewn into them. I think I may have even asked a while back about transparent, flexible pcb-process friendly materials.

Lend me your mindtime HaxSpaceHiveMind.

What cool stuff is there out there now? Good flexible conductive thread? Is it possible to make a transparent flexible pcb (like a keyboard membrane) with hackable tools? Can you glue smt's to them? Is this workable? How well does this live in the wild? Can I have leds all over my arms with address decoders interspersed in them indexable like a display? Is there a way to pcb that so I dont spent the next 2 years making it and 10 resoldering it?

What about hard/clear pcbs? 

And other just cool light, smoke, mirrors and magics tricks?

ThanksHax
Thax

[Nigel Worsley]

> Is it possible to make a transparent flexible pcb (like a keyboard membrane)

I don't think so, I can't think of anything flexible and transparent that would cope
with the heat of soldering.

> Can you glue smt's to them? Is this workable?

Yes, but soldering should be sufficient.

> How well does this live in the wild?

Probably not too good, I would expect the solder joints to crack after a while. Glueing
a stiffener to the back of the PCB under the chip would probably fix this.

> Can I have leds all over my arms with address decoders interspersed in them indexable
like a display?

Don't see why not.

>Is there a way to pcb that so I dont spent the next 2 years making it and 10 resoldering it?

The hackspace has PCB making equipment, and the flexible PCB material is on ebay:
www.ebay.com/itm/180907569879

> What about hard/clear pcbs?

Same problem as flexible ones, clear plastics won't take the heat. I guess you could use
glass, no idea how you would go about bonding the copper to it though.

> And other just cool light, smoke, mirrors and magics tricks?

Optical fibres are nice and flexible. Electroluminescent tape is too:
http://www.seeedstudio.com/depot/el-tape-blue-1m-p-1183.html?cPath=207

Nigle

[Ben Barwise]

You can but flexible RGB LED tape designed for shop displays etc etc

there is even more expensive addressable versions

https://www.adafruit.com/products/306

of course you can get it cheaper on ebay, if you search "LED dream
color" or "LED HL1606"

it comes up

-Ben

[Simon Howes]

Dude. Thankyou.
That is Godly and will be assimilated into my next costume :)

[Yuan Gao]

Flexible PCBs are available actually, they don't have the flexibility of say a keyboard membrane, and you probably don't want to be flexing them that much so I don't know how useful this is to you, but google for "Flexible Circuit Assembly"

[DomK]

i just got some bare paint from recomendation of a friend. could paint on teh circuits on the fabric in the pattern of your circuit

[Aaron Oliver-Taylor]

A few years ago I managed to get an A0 sample of copper clad kapton from dupont,  which is very flexible,  much more so than 0.2mm fr4. Plus it's fine to solder on and you can etch it easily.  However it isn't photosensitive,  so more suited to toner transfer methods.

Aaron

[tom]

Try etching mylar using sharpies as a resist, it worked-ish when i tried it last

On Thursday, June 21, 2012 11:44:37 AM UTC+1, Simon Howes wrote:

[Dirk-Willem van Gulik]

On 25 jun. 2012, at 10:29, tom <bollo...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Thursday, June 21, 2012 11:44:37 AM UTC+1, Simon Howes wrote:

Hi peeps,

I remember hearing somewhere about lillipad and people making clothes with working bits sewn into them. I think I may have even asked a while back about transparent, flexible pcb-process friendly materials.

Lend me your mindtime HaxSpaceHiveMind.

What cool stuff is there out there now? Good flexible conductive thread? Is it possible to make a transparent flexible pcb (like a keyboard membrane) with hackable tools? Can you glue smt's to them? Is this workable? How well does this live in the wild? Can I have leds all over my arms with address decoders interspersed in them indexable like a display? Is there a way to pcb that so I dont spent the next 2 years making it and 10 resoldering it?

> Try etching mylar using sharpies as a resist, it worked-ish when i tried it last

Have a look at http://www.pcbuniverse.com/flex-circuit-boards.php and http://www.rigiflex.com/productsandservices.html. Spec clearly what you want (i.e. in particular if the board needs to be washable (and how often/at what temperature). You can have them very thin and flexible. The only issue is cap's - they tend to be rather brittle.

If it is just LED's you are after - the illypad their approach is solid - and if you want it a bit more light/flexible - consider using el-wire (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electroluminescent_wire) and simply black out the bits you do not want to shine. 

Dw