Hence, the attitude to challenging potential bicycle thieves, or
'negotiating' with them (!), could spread like fungus once such
technologies get implemented into urban bicycle security.
My snail-pace (Warp Factor One) prototype development of such a device
could be much helped by an enthusiastic electronics competent HackSpacer,
so if anybody fancies getting involved with prototype building, please get
in touch.
(got all the bits: Bluetooth Ardurino, Bluetooth chip, RF, sensors, shields
etc!)
Howard
On 23 August 2012 15:55, Nick Leaton <nic...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Some of us will. I challenged someone in the street stealing a bike after
> calling the police. They ran off. The police never turned up.
> Then yesterday, someone was loading a bike in the work's car park, in the
> back of a van. Told security, and they checked the CCTV. The bike had
> arrived in the van so no problems.
> More people should challenge people.
> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim.ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Great ideas all round!
>> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and electrifying the bike.
>> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to something that
>> kills the thief - shame really!
>> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the job - they
>> demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in public view. No-one did
>> anything. Even when it was clear they were simply helping themselves with
>> their massive pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
>> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical and, during the
>> intro event I attended, they said they'll do a timed removal of each bike
>> as part of the test. So, a big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the bike
>> would fail (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
>> Happy to collaborate.
>> Ping me if interested.
>> w
>> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arach...@notdot.net> wrote:
>>> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at
>>> preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert
>>> someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet
>>> the requirements of the contest?
>>> -Nick
>>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>>> Yup,
>>>> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
>>>> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
>>>> {ongoing!}
>>>> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
>>>>> On a non-trolling note, Howard<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm
>>>>> helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space
>>>>> for collaboration?
>>>>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what they're
>>>>> looking for in a successful application. They also made a few suggestions
>>>>> on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a waste of
>>>>> time.
>>>>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to
>>>>> apply. Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one
>>>>> out of a locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I
>>>>> get very attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new
>>>>> and better ways to prevent bike theft.
>>>>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are Hackspacers
>>>>> interested in joining up and making an application, let me know.
>>>>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview of
>>>>> the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>>>>> Wasim
> --
> Nick
-- (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
The reason why I like the idea of kevlar, is that ages ago I made a small
kevlar/carbon fibre bracket for a camera. To trim it up afterwards was
unbelieveably hard. Angle grinders will go through glass fiber and carbon
like its nothing there. Kevlar? It's tough. You can take the matrix out,
but that still leaves the threads. Now the other part is that its light. A
light bike chain would be heaven.
However, making a bike chain out of composites isn't easy. I can't think of
an easy way of manufacturing it. First you make half the number of
individual links. That's the easy bit. Now you have to make links that join
them together. That's far harder.
If you've any clever ideas, I'm interested.
On 23 August 2012 16:19, Howard Alistair Mitchell <
> to be clear, the idea of Project Fungus, is that the cyclist themselves is
> *alerted* (via a buzzer or a noise), so they have a chance to investigate
> the cause of their bicycle moving;
> i agree, an alarm in my view is unhelpful as it would go off when another
> cyclist just happens to be innocently moving a bicycle to aid parking
> theirs (!);
> would be good to see some other ideas being entered into the competition
> as well, i like the idea of secure bicycle parking, e.g. an Oyster-card
> operated bicycle clamp (a modified Cycle Hoop!);
> Howard
> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim.ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Great ideas all round!
>> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and electrifying the bike.
>> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to something that
>> kills the thief - shame really!
>> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the job - they
>> demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in public view. No-one did
>> anything. Even when it was clear they were simply helping themselves with
>> their massive pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
>> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical and, during the
>> intro event I attended, they said they'll do a timed removal of each bike
>> as part of the test. So, a big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the bike
>> would fail (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
>> Happy to collaborate.
>> Ping me if interested.
>> w
>> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arach...@notdot.net> wrote:
>>> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at
>>> preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert
>>> someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet
>>> the requirements of the contest?
>>> -Nick
>>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>>> Yup,
>>>> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
>>>> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
>>>> {ongoing!}
>>>> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
>>>>> On a non-trolling note, Howard<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm
>>>>> helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space
>>>>> for collaboration?
>>>>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what they're
>>>>> looking for in a successful application. They also made a few suggestions
>>>>> on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a waste of
>>>>> time.
>>>>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to
>>>>> apply. Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one
>>>>> out of a locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I
>>>>> get very attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new
>>>>> and better ways to prevent bike theft.
>>>>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are Hackspacers
>>>>> interested in joining up and making an application, let me know.
>>>>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview of
>>>>> the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>>>>> Wasim
> --
> (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
> Hence, the attitude to challenging potential bicycle thieves, or
> 'negotiating' with them (!), could spread like fungus once such
> technologies get implemented into urban bicycle security.
> My snail-pace (Warp Factor One) prototype development of such a device
> could be much helped by an enthusiastic electronics competent HackSpacer,
> so if anybody fancies getting involved with prototype building, please get
> in touch.
> (got all the bits: Bluetooth Ardurino, Bluetooth chip, RF, sensors,
> shields etc!)
> Howard
> On 23 August 2012 15:55, Nick Leaton <nic...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Some of us will. I challenged someone in the street stealing a bike after
>> calling the police. They ran off. The police never turned up.
>> Then yesterday, someone was loading a bike in the work's car park, in the
>> back of a van. Told security, and they checked the CCTV. The bike had
>> arrived in the van so no problems.
>> More people should challenge people.
>> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim.ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Great ideas all round!
>>> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and electrifying the bike.
>>> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to something that
>>> kills the thief - shame really!
>>> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the job - they
>>> demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in public view. No-one did
>>> anything. Even when it was clear they were simply helping themselves with
>>> their massive pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
>>> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical and, during the
>>> intro event I attended, they said they'll do a timed removal of each bike
>>> as part of the test. So, a big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the bike
>>> would fail (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
>>> Happy to collaborate.
>>> Ping me if interested.
>>> w
>>> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arach...@notdot.net> wrote:
>>>> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at
>>>> preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert
>>>> someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet
>>>> the requirements of the contest?
>>>> -Nick
>>>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>> Yup,
>>>>> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
>>>>> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
>>>>> {ongoing!}
>>>>> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
>>>>>> On a non-trolling note, Howard<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm
>>>>>> helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space
>>>>>> for collaboration?
>>>>>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what they're
>>>>>> looking for in a successful application. They also made a few suggestions
>>>>>> on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a waste of
>>>>>> time.
>>>>>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to
>>>>>> apply. Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one
>>>>>> out of a locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I
>>>>>> get very attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new
>>>>>> and better ways to prevent bike theft.
>>>>>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are
>>>>>> Hackspacers interested in joining up and making an application, let me know.
>>>>>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview
>>>>>> of the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>>>>>> Wasim
>> --
>> Nick
> --
> (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
I always though an armoured guard with a spike on it, and designed that it
clamped over the seat and held onto the saddle with a locking collet would
be effective :)
It'd stop the seat being nicked too, and look quite comical
On Aug 23, 2012 4:31 PM, "Nick Leaton" <nic...@gmail.com> wrote:
> The reason why I like the idea of kevlar, is that ages ago I made a small
> kevlar/carbon fibre bracket for a camera. To trim it up afterwards was
> unbelieveably hard. Angle grinders will go through glass fiber and carbon
> like its nothing there. Kevlar? It's tough. You can take the matrix out,
> but that still leaves the threads. Now the other part is that its light. A
> light bike chain would be heaven.
> However, making a bike chain out of composites isn't easy. I can't think
> of an easy way of manufacturing it. First you make half the number of
> individual links. That's the easy bit. Now you have to make links that join
> them together. That's far harder.
> If you've any clever ideas, I'm interested.
> On 23 August 2012 16:19, Howard Alistair Mitchell <
> ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> hey Wasim,
>> to be clear, the idea of Project Fungus, is that the cyclist themselves
>> is *alerted* (via a buzzer or a noise), so they have a chance to
>> investigate the cause of their bicycle moving;
>> i agree, an alarm in my view is unhelpful as it would go off when another
>> cyclist just happens to be innocently moving a bicycle to aid parking
>> theirs (!);
>> would be good to see some other ideas being entered into the competition
>> as well, i like the idea of secure bicycle parking, e.g. an Oyster-card
>> operated bicycle clamp (a modified Cycle Hoop!);
>> Howard
>> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim.ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Great ideas all round!
>>> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and electrifying the bike.
>>> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to something that
>>> kills the thief - shame really!
>>> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the job - they
>>> demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in public view. No-one did
>>> anything. Even when it was clear they were simply helping themselves with
>>> their massive pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
>>> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical and, during the
>>> intro event I attended, they said they'll do a timed removal of each bike
>>> as part of the test. So, a big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the bike
>>> would fail (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
>>> Happy to collaborate.
>>> Ping me if interested.
>>> w
>>> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arach...@notdot.net> wrote:
>>>> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at
>>>> preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert
>>>> someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet
>>>> the requirements of the contest?
>>>> -Nick
>>>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>> Yup,
>>>>> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
>>>>> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
>>>>> {ongoing!}
>>>>> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
>>>>>> On a non-trolling note, Howard<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm
>>>>>> helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space
>>>>>> for collaboration?
>>>>>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what they're
>>>>>> looking for in a successful application. They also made a few suggestions
>>>>>> on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a waste of
>>>>>> time.
>>>>>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to
>>>>>> apply. Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one
>>>>>> out of a locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I
>>>>>> get very attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new
>>>>>> and better ways to prevent bike theft.
>>>>>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are
>>>>>> Hackspacers interested in joining up and making an application, let me know.
>>>>>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview
>>>>>> of the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>>>>>> Wasim
>> --
>> (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
The winning innovation will be the one that results in the longest time to
> steal the bike with a minimum threshold of five minutes.
I don't think they'll allow you to come running out and tackle the person
attempting to 'steal' the bike for the test as a preventative measure,
somehow.
-Nick
On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 4:14 PM, Howard Alistair Mitchell <
> *The challenge is open to any UK legal resident aged 14 or over or
> organisation with a UK base that comes up with an innovation to make it
> more difficult to steal bikes.*
> by a cyclist being alerted that their bicycle is moving, thereby giving
> them a prompt to investigate what's causing the movement, a cycle-thief
> will find it harder to steal bicycles as a cyclist has the opportunity to
> defend their bicycle in such a scenario (e.g. vocally, 'THIEF!!!', or say
> by 'negotiation' if necessary!);
> Howard
> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arach...@notdot.net> wrote:
>> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at
>> preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert
>> someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet
>> the requirements of the contest?
>> -Nick
>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>> Yup,
>>> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
>>> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
>>> {ongoing!}
>>> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
>>>> On a non-trolling note, Howard<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm
>>>> helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space
>>>> for collaboration?
>>>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what they're
>>>> looking for in a successful application. They also made a few suggestions
>>>> on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a waste of
>>>> time.
>>>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to apply.
>>>> Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one out of a
>>>> locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I get very
>>>> attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new and
>>>> better ways to prevent bike theft.
>>>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are Hackspacers
>>>> interested in joining up and making an application, let me know.
>>>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview of
>>>> the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>>>> Wasim
> --
> (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
Why is there no standard plugin to frame sat tracking, its done with cars
and just needs to be built into the frame and with a charging port, how
much battery can you get into a bike frame, lots it would last a year maybe?
On 23 August 2012 16:19, Howard Alistair Mitchell <
> to be clear, the idea of Project Fungus, is that the cyclist themselves is
> *alerted* (via a buzzer or a noise), so they have a chance to investigate
> the cause of their bicycle moving;
> i agree, an alarm in my view is unhelpful as it would go off when another
> cyclist just happens to be innocently moving a bicycle to aid parking
> theirs (!);
> would be good to see some other ideas being entered into the competition
> as well, i like the idea of secure bicycle parking, e.g. an Oyster-card
> operated bicycle clamp (a modified Cycle Hoop!);
> Howard
> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim.ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Great ideas all round!
>> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and electrifying the bike.
>> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to something that
>> kills the thief - shame really!
>> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the job - they
>> demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in public view. No-one did
>> anything. Even when it was clear they were simply helping themselves with
>> their massive pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
>> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical and, during the
>> intro event I attended, they said they'll do a timed removal of each bike
>> as part of the test. So, a big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the bike
>> would fail (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
>> Happy to collaborate.
>> Ping me if interested.
>> w
>> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arach...@notdot.net> wrote:
>>> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at
>>> preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert
>>> someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet
>>> the requirements of the contest?
>>> -Nick
>>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>>> Yup,
>>>> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
>>>> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
>>>> {ongoing!}
>>>> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
>>>>> On a non-trolling note, Howard<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm
>>>>> helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space
>>>>> for collaboration?
>>>>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what they're
>>>>> looking for in a successful application. They also made a few suggestions
>>>>> on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a waste of
>>>>> time.
>>>>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to
>>>>> apply. Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one
>>>>> out of a locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I
>>>>> get very attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new
>>>>> and better ways to prevent bike theft.
>>>>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are Hackspacers
>>>>> interested in joining up and making an application, let me know.
>>>>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview of
>>>>> the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>>>>> Wasim
> --
> (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
-- *Paul Randle-Jolliffe Esq*
*Practicing Principal (*Advocate & Public Interest Intervener)
Patrocinium Interventus
Isle of Wight, England.
www.patrocinium.eu Land Line: +44 (0) 203-318 2582 Extn 473
Mbl: +44 (0) 7 411 99 6893
*"Justice is itself the great standing policy of civil society; and any
eminent departure from it, under any circumstances, lies under the
suspicion of being no policy at all." Edmund Burke*
Warning: This message is for the named recipient only. Dissemination
prohibited without prior written authorisation. If you are not the named
recipient, please disregard this entire message, inform the sender then
destroy.
This message may contain material or opinion that does not necessarily
reflect the policy or opinion of the parent organisation, Patrocinium
Interventus* *. Copyright (C) 2010 Patrocinium Interventus.
> Why is there no standard plugin to frame sat tracking, its done with cars
> and just needs to be built into the frame and with a charging port, how
> much battery can you get into a bike frame, lots it would last a year maybe?
> On 23 August 2012 16:19, Howard Alistair Mitchell <
> ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> hey Wasim,
>> to be clear, the idea of Project Fungus, is that the cyclist themselves
>> is *alerted* (via a buzzer or a noise), so they have a chance to
>> investigate the cause of their bicycle moving;
>> i agree, an alarm in my view is unhelpful as it would go off when another
>> cyclist just happens to be innocently moving a bicycle to aid parking
>> theirs (!);
>> would be good to see some other ideas being entered into the competition
>> as well, i like the idea of secure bicycle parking, e.g. an Oyster-card
>> operated bicycle clamp (a modified Cycle Hoop!);
>> Howard
>> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim.ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Great ideas all round!
>>> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and electrifying the bike.
>>> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to something that
>>> kills the thief - shame really!
>>> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the job - they
>>> demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in public view. No-one did
>>> anything. Even when it was clear they were simply helping themselves with
>>> their massive pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
>>> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical and, during the
>>> intro event I attended, they said they'll do a timed removal of each bike
>>> as part of the test. So, a big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the bike
>>> would fail (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
>>> Happy to collaborate.
>>> Ping me if interested.
>>> w
>>> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arach...@notdot.net> wrote:
>>>> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at
>>>> preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert
>>>> someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet
>>>> the requirements of the contest?
>>>> -Nick
>>>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>> Yup,
>>>>> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
>>>>> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
>>>>> {ongoing!}
>>>>> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
>>>>>> On a non-trolling note, Howard<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm
>>>>>> helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space
>>>>>> for collaboration?
>>>>>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what they're
>>>>>> looking for in a successful application. They also made a few suggestions
>>>>>> on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a waste of
>>>>>> time.
>>>>>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to
>>>>>> apply. Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one
>>>>>> out of a locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I
>>>>>> get very attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new
>>>>>> and better ways to prevent bike theft.
>>>>>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are
>>>>>> Hackspacers interested in joining up and making an application, let me know.
>>>>>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview
>>>>>> of the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>>>>>> Wasim
>> --
>> (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
> *"Justice is itself the great standing policy of civil society; and any
> eminent departure from it, under any circumstances, lies under the
> suspicion of being no policy at all." Edmund Burke*
> Warning: This message is for the named recipient only. Dissemination
> prohibited without prior written authorisation. If you are not the named
> recipient, please disregard this entire message, inform the sender then
> destroy.
> This message may contain material or opinion that does not necessarily
> reflect the policy or opinion of the parent organisation, Patrocinium
> Interventus* *. Copyright (C) 2010 Patrocinium Interventus.
I've seen a bike that has front and tail lights with battery integrated
into the tubes. You could fit a fair bit in, but GPSes use a lot of power.
Also, anything with a GPS and a cellular modem is going to be pretty
expensive, especially in small quantities.
Honestly, the best prototyping platform is probably a cheap Android phone.
It's got accelerometers and gyros built in, has a GPS, a cellular radio and
a battery, and runs your own code.
-Nick
On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 4:45 PM, Paul Randle-Jolliffe
<p...@patrocinium.eu>wrote:
> Why is there no standard plugin to frame sat tracking, its done with cars
> and just needs to be built into the frame and with a charging port, how
> much battery can you get into a bike frame, lots it would last a year maybe?
> On 23 August 2012 16:19, Howard Alistair Mitchell <
> ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> hey Wasim,
>> to be clear, the idea of Project Fungus, is that the cyclist themselves
>> is *alerted* (via a buzzer or a noise), so they have a chance to
>> investigate the cause of their bicycle moving;
>> i agree, an alarm in my view is unhelpful as it would go off when another
>> cyclist just happens to be innocently moving a bicycle to aid parking
>> theirs (!);
>> would be good to see some other ideas being entered into the competition
>> as well, i like the idea of secure bicycle parking, e.g. an Oyster-card
>> operated bicycle clamp (a modified Cycle Hoop!);
>> Howard
>> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim.ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Great ideas all round!
>>> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and electrifying the bike.
>>> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to something that
>>> kills the thief - shame really!
>>> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the job - they
>>> demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in public view. No-one did
>>> anything. Even when it was clear they were simply helping themselves with
>>> their massive pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
>>> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical and, during the
>>> intro event I attended, they said they'll do a timed removal of each bike
>>> as part of the test. So, a big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the bike
>>> would fail (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
>>> Happy to collaborate.
>>> Ping me if interested.
>>> w
>>> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arach...@notdot.net> wrote:
>>>> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at
>>>> preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert
>>>> someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet
>>>> the requirements of the contest?
>>>> -Nick
>>>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>> Yup,
>>>>> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
>>>>> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
>>>>> {ongoing!}
>>>>> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
>>>>>> On a non-trolling note, Howard<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm
>>>>>> helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space
>>>>>> for collaboration?
>>>>>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what they're
>>>>>> looking for in a successful application. They also made a few suggestions
>>>>>> on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a waste of
>>>>>> time.
>>>>>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to
>>>>>> apply. Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one
>>>>>> out of a locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I
>>>>>> get very attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new
>>>>>> and better ways to prevent bike theft.
>>>>>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are
>>>>>> Hackspacers interested in joining up and making an application, let me know.
>>>>>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview
>>>>>> of the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>>>>>> Wasim
>> --
>> (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
> *"Justice is itself the great standing policy of civil society; and any
> eminent departure from it, under any circumstances, lies under the
> suspicion of being no policy at all." Edmund Burke*
> Warning: This message is for the named recipient only. Dissemination
> prohibited without prior written authorisation. If you are not the named
> recipient, please disregard this entire message, inform the sender then
> destroy.
> This message may contain material or opinion that does not necessarily
> reflect the policy or opinion of the parent organisation, Patrocinium
> Interventus* *. Copyright (C) 2010 Patrocinium Interventus.
It will take a while for a GPS to get a lock from a cold start, though.
Unless you stop the thief the moment they start moving it, it's too late.
If it's gone 5 meters, they're probably already _on_ the bike, and thus
able to outdistance you anyway.
On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 4:51 PM, Nick Leaton <nic...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hence you need to not track until you get movement. That way your power
> consumption is down.
> On 23 August 2012 16:45, Paul Randle-Jolliffe <p...@patrocinium.eu> wrote:
>> Why is there no standard plugin to frame sat tracking, its done with cars
>> and just needs to be built into the frame and with a charging port, how
>> much battery can you get into a bike frame, lots it would last a year maybe?
>> On 23 August 2012 16:19, Howard Alistair Mitchell <
>> ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> hey Wasim,
>>> to be clear, the idea of Project Fungus, is that the cyclist themselves
>>> is *alerted* (via a buzzer or a noise), so they have a chance to
>>> investigate the cause of their bicycle moving;
>>> i agree, an alarm in my view is unhelpful as it would go off when
>>> another cyclist just happens to be innocently moving a bicycle to aid
>>> parking theirs (!);
>>> would be good to see some other ideas being entered into the competition
>>> as well, i like the idea of secure bicycle parking, e.g. an Oyster-card
>>> operated bicycle clamp (a modified Cycle Hoop!);
>>> Howard
>>> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim.ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Great ideas all round!
>>>> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and electrifying the bike.
>>>> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to something that
>>>> kills the thief - shame really!
>>>> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the job - they
>>>> demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in public view. No-one did
>>>> anything. Even when it was clear they were simply helping themselves with
>>>> their massive pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
>>>> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical and, during the
>>>> intro event I attended, they said they'll do a timed removal of each bike
>>>> as part of the test. So, a big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the bike
>>>> would fail (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
>>>> Happy to collaborate.
>>>> Ping me if interested.
>>>> w
>>>> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arach...@notdot.net> wrote:
>>>>> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at
>>>>> preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert
>>>>> someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet
>>>>> the requirements of the contest?
>>>>> -Nick
>>>>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>> Yup,
>>>>>> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
>>>>>> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
>>>>>> {ongoing!}
>>>>>> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
>>>>>>> On a non-trolling note, Howard<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm
>>>>>>> helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space
>>>>>>> for collaboration?
>>>>>>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what
>>>>>>> they're looking for in a successful application. They also made a few
>>>>>>> suggestions on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a
>>>>>>> waste of time.
>>>>>>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to
>>>>>>> apply. Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one
>>>>>>> out of a locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I
>>>>>>> get very attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new
>>>>>>> and better ways to prevent bike theft.
>>>>>>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are
>>>>>>> Hackspacers interested in joining up and making an application, let me know.
>>>>>>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview
>>>>>>> of the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>>>>>>> Wasim
>>> --
>>> (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
>> *"Justice is itself the great standing policy of civil society; and any
>> eminent departure from it, under any circumstances, lies under the
>> suspicion of being no policy at all." Edmund Burke*
>> Warning: This message is for the named recipient only. Dissemination
>> prohibited without prior written authorisation. If you are not the named
>> recipient, please disregard this entire message, inform the sender then
>> destroy.
>> This message may contain material or opinion that does not necessarily
>> reflect the policy or opinion of the parent organisation, Patrocinium
>> Interventus* *. Copyright (C) 2010 Patrocinium Interventus.
It differs allot from bikes to bikes as bikes come in all shapes and sizes.
I think alarms as such are pointless as even if it was ditched it would be
going off say when im abroad and wont fix the problem. Also id say that the
aduino with bt to a phone is not that great as i usually have it locked in
an area and walk way away from it... say work or shopping or somewhere in a
park someplace, i wont allways have phone battery or be able to be in
reaching distance.
Can we not use RF/CB something along those lines which has a far longer
range and more practical to work with to alert the user?
On 23 August 2012 16:45, Paul Randle-Jolliffe <p...@patrocinium.eu> wrote:
> Why is there no standard plugin to frame sat tracking, its done with cars
> and just needs to be built into the frame and with a charging port, how
> much battery can you get into a bike frame, lots it would last a year maybe?
> On 23 August 2012 16:19, Howard Alistair Mitchell <
> ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> hey Wasim,
>> to be clear, the idea of Project Fungus, is that the cyclist themselves
>> is *alerted* (via a buzzer or a noise), so they have a chance to
>> investigate the cause of their bicycle moving;
>> i agree, an alarm in my view is unhelpful as it would go off when another
>> cyclist just happens to be innocently moving a bicycle to aid parking
>> theirs (!);
>> would be good to see some other ideas being entered into the competition
>> as well, i like the idea of secure bicycle parking, e.g. an Oyster-card
>> operated bicycle clamp (a modified Cycle Hoop!);
>> Howard
>> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim.ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Great ideas all round!
>>> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and electrifying the bike.
>>> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to something that
>>> kills the thief - shame really!
>>> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the job - they
>>> demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in public view. No-one did
>>> anything. Even when it was clear they were simply helping themselves with
>>> their massive pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
>>> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical and, during the
>>> intro event I attended, they said they'll do a timed removal of each bike
>>> as part of the test. So, a big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the bike
>>> would fail (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
>>> Happy to collaborate.
>>> Ping me if interested.
>>> w
>>> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arach...@notdot.net> wrote:
>>>> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at
>>>> preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert
>>>> someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet
>>>> the requirements of the contest?
>>>> -Nick
>>>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>> Yup,
>>>>> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
>>>>> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
>>>>> {ongoing!}
>>>>> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
>>>>>> On a non-trolling note, Howard<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm
>>>>>> helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space
>>>>>> for collaboration?
>>>>>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what they're
>>>>>> looking for in a successful application. They also made a few suggestions
>>>>>> on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a waste of
>>>>>> time.
>>>>>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to
>>>>>> apply. Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one
>>>>>> out of a locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I
>>>>>> get very attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new
>>>>>> and better ways to prevent bike theft.
>>>>>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are
>>>>>> Hackspacers interested in joining up and making an application, let me know.
>>>>>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview
>>>>>> of the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>>>>>> Wasim
>> --
>> (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
> *"Justice is itself the great standing policy of civil society; and any
> eminent departure from it, under any circumstances, lies under the
> suspicion of being no policy at all." Edmund Burke*
> Warning: This message is for the named recipient only. Dissemination
> prohibited without prior written authorisation. If you are not the named
> recipient, please disregard this entire message, inform the sender then
> destroy.
> This message may contain material or opinion that does not necessarily
> reflect the policy or opinion of the parent organisation, Patrocinium
> Interventus* *. Copyright (C) 2010 Patrocinium Interventus.
> From the electronics side, there are two options.
> 1. The alarm when the bike is moved.
> How about low power, turns on with a tilt switch. Then checks via gps if
> moved, and triggers an alarm.
> 2. The same, but passive. Same as a car tracker. Wifi or text with the
> location, but no alarm. Might not deter, but might get you the bike back.
> On 23 August 2012 16:28, Howard Alistair Mitchell <
> ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> hey Nick,
>> Completely agree.
>> Hence, the attitude to challenging potential bicycle thieves, or
>> 'negotiating' with them (!), could spread like fungus once such
>> technologies get implemented into urban bicycle security.
>> My snail-pace (Warp Factor One) prototype development of such a device
>> could be much helped by an enthusiastic electronics competent HackSpacer,
>> so if anybody fancies getting involved with prototype building, please get
>> in touch.
>> (got all the bits: Bluetooth Ardurino, Bluetooth chip, RF, sensors,
>> shields etc!)
>> Howard
>> On 23 August 2012 15:55, Nick Leaton <nic...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Some of us will. I challenged someone in the street stealing a bike
>>> after calling the police. They ran off. The police never turned up.
>>> Then yesterday, someone was loading a bike in the work's car park, in
>>> the back of a van. Told security, and they checked the CCTV. The bike had
>>> arrived in the van so no problems.
>>> More people should challenge people.
>>> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim.ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Great ideas all round!
>>>> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and electrifying the bike.
>>>> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to something that
>>>> kills the thief - shame really!
>>>> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the job - they
>>>> demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in public view. No-one did
>>>> anything. Even when it was clear they were simply helping themselves with
>>>> their massive pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
>>>> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical and, during the
>>>> intro event I attended, they said they'll do a timed removal of each bike
>>>> as part of the test. So, a big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the bike
>>>> would fail (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
>>>> Happy to collaborate.
>>>> Ping me if interested.
>>>> w
>>>> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arach...@notdot.net> wrote:
>>>>> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at
>>>>> preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert
>>>>> someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet
>>>>> the requirements of the contest?
>>>>> -Nick
>>>>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>> Yup,
>>>>>> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
>>>>>> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
>>>>>> {ongoing!}
>>>>>> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
>>>>>>> On a non-trolling note, Howard<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm
>>>>>>> helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space
>>>>>>> for collaboration?
>>>>>>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what
>>>>>>> they're looking for in a successful application. They also made a few
>>>>>>> suggestions on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a
>>>>>>> waste of time.
>>>>>>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to
>>>>>>> apply. Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one
>>>>>>> out of a locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I
>>>>>>> get very attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new
>>>>>>> and better ways to prevent bike theft.
>>>>>>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are
>>>>>>> Hackspacers interested in joining up and making an application, let me know.
>>>>>>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview
>>>>>>> of the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>>>>>>> Wasim
>>> --
>>> Nick
>> --
>> (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
reckon to make the sensor unit as small as possible with a decent power source, then give it to the cyclist to attach wherever they fancy (using tape /Velcro), say under the seat might be the best hiding place,
On Thursday, 23 August 2012 16:45:55 UTC+1, Paul Randle-Jolliffe wrote:
> Why is there no standard plugin to frame sat tracking, its done with cars > and just needs to be built into the frame and with a charging port, how > much battery can you get into a bike frame, lots it would last a year maybe?
> On 23 August 2012 16:19, Howard Alistair Mitchell <ha.mitche...@gmail.com<javascript:> > > wrote:
>> hey Wasim,
>> to be clear, the idea of Project Fungus, is that the cyclist themselves >> is *alerted* (via a buzzer or a noise), so they have a chance to >> investigate the cause of their bicycle moving;
>> i agree, an alarm in my view is unhelpful as it would go off when another >> cyclist just happens to be innocently moving a bicycle to aid parking >> theirs (!);
>> would be good to see some other ideas being entered into the competition >> as well, i like the idea of secure bicycle parking, e.g. an Oyster-card >> operated bicycle clamp (a modified Cycle Hoop!);
>> Howard
>> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim...@gmail.com <javascript:>>wrote:
>>> Great ideas all round!
>>> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and electrifying the bike. >>> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to something that >>> kills the thief - shame really!
>>> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the job - they >>> demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in public view. No-one did >>> anything. Even when it was clear they were simply helping themselves with >>> their massive pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
>>> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical and, during the >>> intro event I attended, they said they'll do a timed removal of each bike >>> as part of the test. So, a big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the bike >>> would fail (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
>>> Happy to collaborate. >>> Ping me if interested.
>>> w
>>> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arac...@notdot.net <javascript:>>wrote:
>>>> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at >>>> preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert >>>> someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet >>>> the requirements of the contest?
>>>> -Nick
>>>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitche...@gmail.com<javascript:> >>>> > wrote:
>>>>> Yup, >>>>> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
>>>>> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
>>>>> {ongoing!}
>>>>> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
>>>>>> On a non-trolling note, Howard<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm >>>>>> helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space >>>>>> for collaboration?
>>>>>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what they're >>>>>> looking for in a successful application. They also made a few suggestions >>>>>> on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a waste of >>>>>> time.
>>>>>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to >>>>>> apply. Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one >>>>>> out of a locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I >>>>>> get very attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new >>>>>> and better ways to prevent bike theft.
>>>>>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are >>>>>> Hackspacers interested in joining up and making an application, let me know. >>>>>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview >>>>>> of the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>>>>>> Wasim
>> -- >> (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
> *"Justice is itself the great standing policy of civil society; and any > eminent departure from it, under any circumstances, lies under the > suspicion of being no policy at all." Edmund Burke*
> Warning: This message is for the named recipient only. Dissemination > prohibited without prior written authorisation. If you are not the named > recipient, please disregard this entire message, inform the sender then > destroy.
> This message may contain material or opinion that does not necessarily > reflect the policy or opinion of the parent organisation, Patrocinium > Interventus* *. Copyright (C) 2010 Patrocinium Interventus.
hmm, interesting, so say an Android phone is used as the sensor-unit (instead of Ardurino+sensors+BT), how would the program be built - using an app - via the Android Developer Toolkit thing?
you reckon that's easier than the Arduino route?!
from a conversation at the weekend, it was suggested that using a Raspberry Pi could be easier (more plug+play!) than Arduino,
On Thursday, 23 August 2012 16:52:19 UTC+1, Nick Johnson wrote:
> I've seen a bike that has front and tail lights with battery integrated > into the tubes. You could fit a fair bit in, but GPSes use a lot of power. > Also, anything with a GPS and a cellular modem is going to be pretty > expensive, especially in small quantities.
> Honestly, the best prototyping platform is probably a cheap Android phone. > It's got accelerometers and gyros built in, has a GPS, a cellular radio and > a battery, and runs your own code.
> -Nick
> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 4:45 PM, Paul Randle-Jolliffe < > pa...@patrocinium.eu <javascript:>> wrote:
>> Why is there no standard plugin to frame sat tracking, its done with cars >> and just needs to be built into the frame and with a charging port, how >> much battery can you get into a bike frame, lots it would last a year maybe?
>> On 23 August 2012 16:19, Howard Alistair Mitchell <ha.mitche...@gmail.com<javascript:> >> > wrote:
>>> hey Wasim,
>>> to be clear, the idea of Project Fungus, is that the cyclist themselves >>> is *alerted* (via a buzzer or a noise), so they have a chance to >>> investigate the cause of their bicycle moving;
>>> i agree, an alarm in my view is unhelpful as it would go off when >>> another cyclist just happens to be innocently moving a bicycle to aid >>> parking theirs (!);
>>> would be good to see some other ideas being entered into the competition >>> as well, i like the idea of secure bicycle parking, e.g. an Oyster-card >>> operated bicycle clamp (a modified Cycle Hoop!);
>>> Howard
>>> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim...@gmail.com <javascript:>>wrote:
>>>> Great ideas all round!
>>>> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and electrifying the bike. >>>> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to something that >>>> kills the thief - shame really!
>>>> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the job - they >>>> demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in public view. No-one did >>>> anything. Even when it was clear they were simply helping themselves with >>>> their massive pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
>>>> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical and, during the >>>> intro event I attended, they said they'll do a timed removal of each bike >>>> as part of the test. So, a big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the bike >>>> would fail (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
>>>> Happy to collaborate. >>>> Ping me if interested.
>>>> w
>>>> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arac...@notdot.net <javascript:> >>>> > wrote:
>>>>> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at >>>>> preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert >>>>> someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet >>>>> the requirements of the contest?
>>>>> -Nick
>>>>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitche...@gmail.com<javascript:> >>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>> Yup, >>>>>> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
>>>>>> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
>>>>>> {ongoing!}
>>>>>> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
>>>>>>> On a non-trolling note, Howard<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm >>>>>>> helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space >>>>>>> for collaboration?
>>>>>>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what >>>>>>> they're looking for in a successful application. They also made a few >>>>>>> suggestions on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a >>>>>>> waste of time.
>>>>>>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to >>>>>>> apply. Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one >>>>>>> out of a locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I >>>>>>> get very attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new >>>>>>> and better ways to prevent bike theft.
>>>>>>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are >>>>>>> Hackspacers interested in joining up and making an application, let me know. >>>>>>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview >>>>>>> of the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>>>>>>> Wasim
>>> -- >>> (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
>> *"Justice is itself the great standing policy of civil society; and any >> eminent departure from it, under any circumstances, lies under the >> suspicion of being no policy at all." Edmund Burke*
>> Warning: This message is for the named recipient only. Dissemination >> prohibited without prior written authorisation. If you are not the named >> recipient, please disregard this entire message, inform the sender then >> destroy.
>> This message may contain material or opinion that does not necessarily >> reflect the policy or opinion of the parent organisation, Patrocinium >> Interventus* *. Copyright (C) 2010 Patrocinium Interventus.
It was a bit naff/rubbish, but the range was very impressive, eg. it alerted me of anybody going near my bicycle whilst I was inside Hackspace, with my bicycle parked outside Hackspace on those metal bars.
My view is that an alerter is only useful if you're within close enough distance to get to the bicycle quickly, hence BT might actually be good enough, especially if it gets longer range in new iterations (e.g. the new iPhone i've heard),
On Thursday, 23 August 2012 16:54:06 UTC+1, VinnyFox wrote:
> It differs allot from bikes to bikes as bikes come in all shapes and sizes.
> I think alarms as such are pointless as even if it was ditched it would be > going off say when im abroad and wont fix the problem. Also id say that the > aduino with bt to a phone is not that great as i usually have it locked in > an area and walk way away from it... say work or shopping or somewhere in a > park someplace, i wont allways have phone battery or be able to be in > reaching distance.
> Can we not use RF/CB something along those lines which has a far longer > range and more practical to work with to alert the user?
> On 23 August 2012 16:45, Paul Randle-Jolliffe <pa...@patrocinium.eu<javascript:> > > wrote:
>> Why is there no standard plugin to frame sat tracking, its done with cars >> and just needs to be built into the frame and with a charging port, how >> much battery can you get into a bike frame, lots it would last a year maybe?
>> On 23 August 2012 16:19, Howard Alistair Mitchell <ha.mitche...@gmail.com<javascript:> >> > wrote:
>>> hey Wasim,
>>> to be clear, the idea of Project Fungus, is that the cyclist themselves >>> is *alerted* (via a buzzer or a noise), so they have a chance to >>> investigate the cause of their bicycle moving;
>>> i agree, an alarm in my view is unhelpful as it would go off when >>> another cyclist just happens to be innocently moving a bicycle to aid >>> parking theirs (!);
>>> would be good to see some other ideas being entered into the competition >>> as well, i like the idea of secure bicycle parking, e.g. an Oyster-card >>> operated bicycle clamp (a modified Cycle Hoop!);
>>> Howard
>>> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim...@gmail.com <javascript:>>wrote:
>>>> Great ideas all round!
>>>> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and electrifying the bike. >>>> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to something that >>>> kills the thief - shame really!
>>>> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the job - they >>>> demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in public view. No-one did >>>> anything. Even when it was clear they were simply helping themselves with >>>> their massive pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
>>>> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical and, during the >>>> intro event I attended, they said they'll do a timed removal of each bike >>>> as part of the test. So, a big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the bike >>>> would fail (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
>>>> Happy to collaborate. >>>> Ping me if interested.
>>>> w
>>>> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arac...@notdot.net <javascript:> >>>> > wrote:
>>>>> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at >>>>> preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert >>>>> someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet >>>>> the requirements of the contest?
>>>>> -Nick
>>>>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitche...@gmail.com<javascript:> >>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>> Yup, >>>>>> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
>>>>>> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
>>>>>> {ongoing!}
>>>>>> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
>>>>>>> On a non-trolling note, Howard<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm >>>>>>> helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space >>>>>>> for collaboration?
>>>>>>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what >>>>>>> they're looking for in a successful application. They also made a few >>>>>>> suggestions on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a >>>>>>> waste of time.
>>>>>>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to >>>>>>> apply. Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one >>>>>>> out of a locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I >>>>>>> get very attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new >>>>>>> and better ways to prevent bike theft.
>>>>>>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are >>>>>>> Hackspacers interested in joining up and making an application, let me know. >>>>>>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview >>>>>>> of the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>>>>>>> Wasim
>>> -- >>> (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
>> *"Justice is itself the great standing policy of civil society; and any >> eminent departure from it, under any circumstances, lies under the >> suspicion of being no policy at all." Edmund Burke*
>> Warning: This message is for the named recipient only. Dissemination >> prohibited without prior written authorisation. If you are not the named >> recipient, please disregard this entire message, inform the sender then >> destroy.
>> This message may contain material or opinion that does not necessarily >> reflect the policy or opinion of the parent organisation, Patrocinium >> Interventus* *. Copyright (C) 2010 Patrocinium Interventus.
Bluetooth range is too puny, I tried the nordic nRF24 modules on tuesday running at 250Kbps and 8bit CRC and I didn't even manage to walk half way to the stairwell from the hackspace door before the signal was cut (hackspace is possibly the worst environment for 2.4Ghz signal, but still a good test).
I want to try one of those 433Mhz modules to see how much range I could get out of them even 300bps is more than sufficient as all that's needed is a keep-alive and basic signal if it's being stolen or not.. Sol mentioned he got to the edge of the car park with it without much optimisation so it looks promising (if anyone have a pair I can use to test please let me know!)
I think the GPS, Android, Pi solutions are an overkill to be honest and I think it makes sense to get a simplest prototype that does the job well. A mate of mine had a motorbike stolen with a tracker fitted and police did nothing (was in a dodgy area apparently), I doubt they will even bother with a push bike!
> It differs allot from bikes to bikes as bikes come in all shapes and > sizes.
> I think alarms as such are pointless as even if it was ditched it > would be going off say when im abroad and wont fix the problem. Also > id say that the aduino with bt to a phone is not that great as i > usually have it locked in an area and walk way away from it... say > work or shopping or somewhere in a park someplace, i wont allways have > phone battery or be able to be in reaching distance.
> Can we not use RF/CB something along those lines which has a far > longer range and more practical to work with to alert the user?
> On 23 August 2012 16:45, Paul Randle-Jolliffe <p...@patrocinium.eu > <mailto:p...@patrocinium.eu>> wrote:
> Why is there no standard plugin to frame sat tracking, its done
> with cars and just needs to be built into the frame and with a
> charging port, how much battery can you get into a bike frame,
> lots it would last a year maybe?
> On 23 August 2012 16:19, Howard Alistair Mitchell
> <ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com
> <mailto:ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> hey Wasim,
> to be clear, the idea of Project Fungus, is that the cyclist
> themselves is /*alerted*/ (via a buzzer or a noise), so they
> have a chance to investigate the cause of their bicycle moving;
> i agree, an alarm in my view is unhelpful as it would go off
> when another cyclist just happens to be innocently moving a
> bicycle to aid parking theirs (!);
> would be good to see some other ideas being entered into the
> competition as well, i like the idea of secure bicycle
> parking, e.g. an Oyster-card operated bicycle clamp (a
> modified Cycle Hoop!);
> Howard
> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim.ju...@gmail.com
> <mailto:wasim.ju...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> Great ideas all round!
> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and
> electrifying the bike.
> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to
> something that kills the thief - shame really!
> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the
> job - they demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in
> public view. No-one did anything. Even when it was clear
> they were simply helping themselves with their massive
> pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical
> and, during the intro event I attended, they said they'll
> do a timed removal of each bike as part of the test. So, a
> big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the bike would fail
> (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
> Happy to collaborate.
> Ping me if interested.
> w
> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arach...@notdot.net
> <mailto:arach...@notdot.net>> wrote:
> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's
> aimed squarely at preventing removal of a bike. An
> alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert someone to
> the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it
> fail to meet the requirements of the contest?
> -Nick
> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard
> <ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com
> <mailto:ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the
> phone..
> {ongoing!}
> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar
> wrote:
> On a non-trolling note, Howard
> <http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>
> has started a project to help solve the
> problem with bike theft, I'm helping him a bit
> with the electronics side of things. Maybe
> there's space for collaboration?
>> They explained details about the prize, the
>> timeline and what they're looking for in a
>> successful application. They also made a few
>> suggestions on things worth investigating and
>> stuff they thought would be a waste of time.
>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story
>> short, I'd like to apply. Mainly 'cos I've
>> had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including
>> one out of a locked garden shed behind a six
>> foot wall with a padlocked gate. I get very
>> attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the
>> idea of figuring out new and better ways to
>> prevent bike theft.
>> It's not something I can do by myself but if
>> there are are Hackspacers interested in
>> joining up and making an application, let me
>> know.
>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up -
>> I'll give an overview of the Challenge and we
>> can take it from there.
>> Wasim
> -- > (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
> *"Justice is itself the great standing policy of civil society;
> and any eminent departure from it, under any circumstances, lies
> under the suspicion of being no policy at all." Edmund Burke*
> Warning: This message is for the named recipient only.
> Dissemination prohibited without prior written authorisation. If
> you are not the named recipient, please disregard this entire
> message, inform the sender then destroy.
> This message may contain material or opinion that does not
> necessarily reflect the policy or opinion of the parent
> organisation, Patrocinium Interventus**. Copyright (C) 2010
> Patrocinium Interventus.
Has anybody considered powering the device from a battery charged by a small dynamo attached to one of the wheels? It's the same way they used to power the old incandescent bike headlights.
On 23 Aug 2012, at 17:14, Howard <ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com> wrote:
> It was a bit naff/rubbish, but the range was very impressive, eg. it alerted me of anybody going near my bicycle whilst I was inside Hackspace, with my bicycle parked outside Hackspace on those metal bars.
> My view is that an alerter is only useful if you're within close enough distance to get to the bicycle quickly, hence BT might actually be good enough, especially if it gets longer range in new iterations (e.g. the new iPhone i've heard),
> Howard
> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 16:54:06 UTC+1, VinnyFox wrote:
> It differs allot from bikes to bikes as bikes come in all shapes and sizes.
> I think alarms as such are pointless as even if it was ditched it would be going off say when im abroad and wont fix the problem. Also id say that the aduino with bt to a phone is not that great as i usually have it locked in an area and walk way away from it... say work or shopping or somewhere in a park someplace, i wont allways have phone battery or be able to be in reaching distance.
> Can we not use RF/CB something along those lines which has a far longer range and more practical to work with to alert the user?
> On 23 August 2012 16:45, Paul Randle-Jolliffe <pa...@patrocinium.eu> wrote:
> Why is there no standard plugin to frame sat tracking, its done with cars and just needs to be built into the frame and with a charging port, how much battery can you get into a bike frame, lots it would last a year maybe?
> On 23 August 2012 16:19, Howard Alistair Mitchell <ha.mitche...@gmail.com> wrote:
> hey Wasim,
> to be clear, the idea of Project Fungus, is that the cyclist themselves is alerted (via a buzzer or a noise), so they have a chance to investigate the cause of their bicycle moving;
> i agree, an alarm in my view is unhelpful as it would go off when another cyclist just happens to be innocently moving a bicycle to aid parking theirs (!);
> would be good to see some other ideas being entered into the competition as well, i like the idea of secure bicycle parking, e.g. an Oyster-card operated bicycle clamp (a modified Cycle Hoop!);
> Howard
> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Great ideas all round!
> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and electrifying the bike.
> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to something that kills the thief - shame really!
> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the job - they demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in public view. No-one did anything. Even when it was clear they were simply helping themselves with their massive pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical and, during the intro event I attended, they said they'll do a timed removal of each bike as part of the test. So, a big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the bike would fail (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
> Happy to collaborate. > Ping me if interested.
> w
> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arac...@notdot.net> wrote:
> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet the requirements of the contest? > -Nick
> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitche...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Yup,
> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
> project page here
> more collaborators welcome - especially those that can assist with building the (so far illusive!) working prototype,
> current effort is to make an Ardurino detect movement then notify an Android mobile phone via BT,
> so far paired up a Bluetooth-chip and an Android phone:
> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
> {ongoing!}
> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
> On a non-trolling note, Howard has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space for collaboration?
>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what they're looking for in a successful application. They also made a few suggestions on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a waste of time.
>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to apply. Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one out of a locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I get very attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new and better ways to prevent bike theft.
>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are Hackspacers interested in joining up and making an application, let me know.
>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview of the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>> Wasim
> -- > (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
> -- > Paul Randle-Jolliffe Esq
> Practicing Principal (Advocate & Public Interest Intervener)
> PATROCINIUM INTERVENTUS > Isle of Wight, England.
> www.patrocinium.eu > Land Line: +44 (0) 203-318 2582 Extn 473
> Mbl: +44 (0) 7 411 99 6893
> "Justice is itself the great standing policy of civil society; and any eminent departure from it, under any circumstances, lies under the suspicion of being no policy at all." Edmund Burke
> Warning: This message is for the named recipient only. Dissemination prohibited without prior written authorisation. If you are not the named recipient, please disregard this entire message, inform the sender then destroy.
> This message may contain material or opinion that does not necessarily reflect the policy or opinion of the parent organisation, PATROCINIUM INTERVENTUS . Copyright (C) 2010 PATROCINIUM INTERVENTUS.
On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 5:08 PM, Howard <ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com>wrote:
> hmm, interesting, so say an Android phone is used as the sensor-unit
> (instead of Ardurino+sensors+BT), how would the program be built - using an
> app - via the Android Developer Toolkit thing?
> you reckon that's easier than the Arduino route?!
Given that you want an accelerometer, GPS, battery and cellular(?) radio,
you're not going to find those in a package anywhere cheaper than a cheap
Android cellphone.
And yes, you'd simply write an app in Java using the ADK that does what you
want it to.
> from a conversation at the weekend, it was suggested that using a
> Raspberry Pi could be easier (more plug+play!) than Arduino,
> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 16:52:19 UTC+1, Nick Johnson wrote:
>> I've seen a bike that has front and tail lights with battery integrated
>> into the tubes. You could fit a fair bit in, but GPSes use a lot of power.
>> Also, anything with a GPS and a cellular modem is going to be pretty
>> expensive, especially in small quantities.
>> Honestly, the best prototyping platform is probably a cheap Android
>> phone. It's got accelerometers and gyros built in, has a GPS, a cellular
>> radio and a battery, and runs your own code.
>> -Nick
>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 4:45 PM, Paul Randle-Jolliffe <
>> pa...@patrocinium.eu> wrote:
>>> Why is there no standard plugin to frame sat tracking, its done with
>>> cars and just needs to be built into the frame and with a charging port,
>>> how much battery can you get into a bike frame, lots it would last a year
>>> maybe?
>>> On 23 August 2012 16:19, Howard Alistair Mitchell <
>>> ha.mitche...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> hey Wasim,
>>>> to be clear, the idea of Project Fungus, is that the cyclist themselves
>>>> is *alerted* (via a buzzer or a noise), so they have a chance to
>>>> investigate the cause of their bicycle moving;
>>>> i agree, an alarm in my view is unhelpful as it would go off when
>>>> another cyclist just happens to be innocently moving a bicycle to aid
>>>> parking theirs (!);
>>>> would be good to see some other ideas being entered into the
>>>> competition as well, i like the idea of secure bicycle parking, e.g. an
>>>> Oyster-card operated bicycle clamp (a modified Cycle Hoop!);
>>>> Howard
>>>> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Great ideas all round!
>>>>> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and electrifying the bike.
>>>>> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to something that
>>>>> kills the thief - shame really!
>>>>> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the job - they
>>>>> demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in public view. No-one did
>>>>> anything. Even when it was clear they were simply helping themselves with
>>>>> their massive pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
>>>>> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical and, during
>>>>> the intro event I attended, they said they'll do a timed removal of each
>>>>> bike as part of the test. So, a big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the
>>>>> bike would fail (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
>>>>> Happy to collaborate.
>>>>> Ping me if interested.
>>>>> w
>>>>> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arac...@notdot.net> wrote:
>>>>>> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at
>>>>>> preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert
>>>>>> someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet
>>>>>> the requirements of the contest?
>>>>>> -Nick
>>>>>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitche...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>>> Yup,
>>>>>>> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
>>>>>>> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
>>>>>>> {ongoing!}
>>>>>>> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
>>>>>>>> On a non-trolling note, Howard<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm
>>>>>>>> helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space
>>>>>>>> for collaboration?
>>>>>>>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what
>>>>>>>> they're looking for in a successful application. They also made a few
>>>>>>>> suggestions on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a
>>>>>>>> waste of time.
>>>>>>>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to
>>>>>>>> apply. Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one
>>>>>>>> out of a locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I
>>>>>>>> get very attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new
>>>>>>>> and better ways to prevent bike theft.
>>>>>>>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are
>>>>>>>> Hackspacers interested in joining up and making an application, let me know.
>>>>>>>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview
>>>>>>>> of the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>>>>>>>> Wasim
>>>> --
>>>> (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
>>> *"Justice is itself the great standing policy of civil society; and any
>>> eminent departure from it, under any circumstances, lies under the
>>> suspicion of being no policy at all." Edmund Burke*
>>> Warning: This message is for the named recipient only. Dissemination
>>> prohibited without prior written authorisation. If you are not the named
>>> recipient, please disregard this entire message, inform the sender then
>>> destroy.
>>> This message may contain material or opinion that does not necessarily
>>> reflect the policy or opinion of the parent organisation, Patrocinium
>>> Interventus* *. Copyright (C) 2010 Patrocinium Interventus.
> I should think a good way to stop a bike getting nicked, is to put > effectively a plank of something alongside the bike, which has the required > grooves to allow the bike bits to fit inside it and get stuck in a > stationary position.
Then the plank had bits of the edges/outer sides to allow it to get stuck when it is taken off the bike rack. Ti neutralise the lock mechanism, turn a key inside it and all the locking mechanisms are released and also it can now shrink down inside itself to become about 6 inches long and be transportable.
No electronics, just a series of mechanical levers.
> Bluetooth range is too puny, I tried the nordic nRF24 modules on tuesday
> running at 250Kbps and 8bit CRC and I didn't even manage to walk half way
> to the stairwell from the hackspace door before the signal was cut
> (hackspace is possibly the worst environment for 2.4Ghz signal, but still a
> good test).
> I want to try one of those 433Mhz modules to see how much range I could
> get out of them even 300bps is more than sufficient as all that's needed is
> a keep-alive and basic signal if it's being stolen or not.. Sol mentioned
> he got to the edge of the car park with it without much optimisation so it
> looks promising (if anyone have a pair I can use to test please let me
> know!)
> I think the GPS, Android, Pi solutions are an overkill to be honest and I
> think it makes sense to get a simplest prototype that does the job well. A
> mate of mine had a motorbike stolen with a tracker fitted and police did
> nothing (was in a dodgy area apparently), I doubt they will even bother
> with a push bike!
I'm just responding to people who want something with a GPS in it - once
you start adding more sensors, it quickly becomes cheaper to use a phone as
your prototyping platform. In fact, even if you want a more basic system
such as you're suggesting, using a phone is probably a good and cheap way
to build initial prototypes anyway.
> It differs allot from bikes to bikes as bikes come in all shapes and sizes.
> I think alarms as such are pointless as even if it was ditched it would be
> going off say when im abroad and wont fix the problem. Also id say that the
> aduino with bt to a phone is not that great as i usually have it locked in
> an area and walk way away from it... say work or shopping or somewhere in a
> park someplace, i wont allways have phone battery or be able to be in
> reaching distance.
> Can we not use RF/CB something along those lines which has a far longer
> range and more practical to work with to alert the user?
> On 23 August 2012 16:45, Paul Randle-Jolliffe <p...@patrocinium.eu> wrote:
>> Why is there no standard plugin to frame sat tracking, its done with cars
>> and just needs to be built into the frame and with a charging port, how
>> much battery can you get into a bike frame, lots it would last a year
>> maybe?
>> On 23 August 2012 16:19, Howard Alistair Mitchell <
>> ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> hey Wasim,
>>> to be clear, the idea of Project Fungus, is that the cyclist
>>> themselves is *alerted* (via a buzzer or a noise), so they have a
>>> chance to investigate the cause of their bicycle moving;
>>> i agree, an alarm in my view is unhelpful as it would go off when
>>> another cyclist just happens to be innocently moving a bicycle to aid
>>> parking theirs (!);
>>> would be good to see some other ideas being entered into the
>>> competition as well, i like the idea of secure bicycle parking, e.g. an
>>> Oyster-card operated bicycle clamp (a modified Cycle Hoop!);
>>> Howard
>>> On 23 August 2012 15:52, Wasim Juned <wasim.ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Great ideas all round!
>>>> My first few ideas on this were a bike spike and electrifying the bike.
>>>> Unfortunately it turns out they won't award a prize to something that
>>>> kills the thief - shame really!
>>>> Also, something that just alerts the public won't do the job - they
>>>> demo'ed a video of someone stealing a bike in public view. No-one did
>>>> anything. Even when it was clear they were simply helping themselves with
>>>> their massive pair of bolt cutters. So, yes, an alarm won't do the job.
>>>> Tricky problem. It has to be something that's practical and, during the
>>>> intro event I attended, they said they'll do a timed removal of each bike
>>>> as part of the test. So, a big 5 ton metal cage over the top of the bike
>>>> would fail (even though it would probably win the timed challenge).
>>>> Happy to collaborate.
>>>> Ping me if interested.
>>>> w
>>>> On 23 August 2012 15:42, Nick Johnson <arach...@notdot.net> wrote:
>>>>> The way I read the rules of the competition, it's aimed squarely at
>>>>> preventing removal of a bike. An alarm won't prevent removal, it'll alert
>>>>> someone to the fact that it's been removed. As such, won't it fail to meet
>>>>> the requirements of the contest?
>>>>> -Nick
>>>>> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Howard <ha.mitchell.mob...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>> Yup,
>>>>>> progress has been slow, but steady, :-)
>>>>>> now need to get the Gadget Shield to speak to the phone..
>>>>>> {ongoing!}
>>>>>> On Thursday, 23 August 2012 15:00:00 UTC+1, mentar wrote:
>>>>>>> On a non-trolling note, Howard<http://wiki.london.hackspace.org.uk/view/User:Howard>has started a project to help solve the problem with bike theft, I'm
>>>>>>> helping him a bit with the electronics side of things. Maybe there's space
>>>>>>> for collaboration?
>>>>>>> They explained details about the prize, the timeline and what
>>>>>>> they're looking for in a successful application. They also made a few
>>>>>>> suggestions on things worth investigating and stuff they thought would be a
>>>>>>> waste of time.
>>>>>>> Very interesting day but, to cut a long story short, I'd like to
>>>>>>> apply. Mainly 'cos I've had 3 bikes stolen over the years - including one
>>>>>>> out of a locked garden shed behind a six foot wall with a padlocked gate. I
>>>>>>> get very attached to my bikes so I'm stoked at the idea of figuring out new
>>>>>>> and better ways to prevent bike theft.
>>>>>>> It's not something I can do by myself but if there are are
>>>>>>> Hackspacers interested in joining up and making an application, let me know.
>>>>>>> If there's enough we can arrange to meet up - I'll give an overview
>>>>>>> of the Challenge and we can take it from there.
>>>>>>> Wasim
>>> --
>>> (sent from my mobile computer/phone, please excuse my brievty)
>> *"Justice is itself the great standing policy of civil society; and any
>> eminent departure from it, under any circumstances, lies under the
>> suspicion of being no policy at all." Edmund Burke*
>> Warning: This message is for the named recipient only. Dissemination
>> prohibited without prior written authorisation. If you are not the named
>> recipient, please disregard this entire message, inform the sender then
>> destroy.
>> This message may contain material or opinion that does not necessarily
>> reflect the policy or opinion of the parent organisation, Patrocinium
>> Interventus* *. Copyright (C) 2010 Patrocinium Interventus.
I rather think an immoblization device of some sort would work... If you could stop the pedals or the wheels from turning that would be a pretty good deterrant... In addition to a regular lock.
Obviously a solenoid would take too much power... However maybe a small motor driving a leadscrew or a rack-and pinion of some sort to extend a bar into the the spokes of the main pedal sprocket... It would still need to be charged from time to time, but I think it could be made to be fairly low power.
Have a usb-like connector (but not usb) with 4 pins. Two power and two data. The user carries a usb-like key that plugs into the bike's frame in a hidden spot. This key would have a ery small low power microcontroller in it. Upon powering up (by inserting it into the frame) it simply transmits a preprogrammed code over the comm lines. This unlocks the unit. So when the key is removed the device automatically extends the locking arm to immoblize the pedals. When the key is inserted the locking arm is retracted. If built into the frame solidly I think this locking arm would be difficult to defeat mechanically. Electronically you would need to know the unique number and program that into another microcontroller...
Obviously you would combine this with a normal lock. Power consumption would only be when locking or unlocking, so it could last quite a while on a charge, but still there is power to think about... Solar or wheel-generator based mechanisms could work...
I should think a good way to stop a bike getting nicked, is to put effectively a plank of something alongside the bike, which has the required grooves to allow the bike bits to fit inside it and get stuck in a stationary position.
Then the plank had bits of the edges/outer sides to allow it to get stuck when it is taken off the bike rack. Ti neutralise the lock mechanism, turn a key inside it and all the locking mechanisms are released and also it can now shrink down inside itself to become about 6 inches long and be transportable.
No electronics, just a series of mechanical levers.
> I rather think an immoblization device of some sort would work... If you
> could stop the pedals or the wheels from turning that would be a pretty
> good deterrant... In addition to a regular lock.
> Obviously a solenoid would take too much power... However maybe a small
> motor driving a leadscrew or a rack-and pinion of some sort to extend a bar
> into the the spokes of the main pedal sprocket... It would still need to
> be charged from time to time, but I think it could be made to be fairly low
> power.
> Have a usb-like connector (but not usb) with 4 pins. Two power and two
> data. The user carries a usb-like key that plugs into the bike's frame in a
> hidden spot. This key would have a ery small low power microcontroller in
> it. Upon powering up (by inserting it into the frame) it simply transmits a
> preprogrammed code over the comm lines. This unlocks the unit. So when the
> key is removed the device automatically extends the locking arm to
> immoblize the pedals. When the key is inserted the locking arm is
> retracted. If built into the frame solidly I think this locking arm would
> be difficult to defeat mechanically. Electronically you would need to know
> the unique number and program that into another microcontroller...
> Obviously you would combine this with a normal lock. Power consumption
> would only be when locking or unlocking, so it could last quite a while on
> a charge, but still there is power to think about... Solar or
> wheel-generator based mechanisms could work...
> I should think a good way to stop a bike getting nicked, is to put
>> effectively a plank of something alongside the bike, which has the required
>> grooves to allow the bike bits to fit inside it and get stuck in a
>> stationary position.
> Then the plank had bits of the edges/outer sides to allow it to get stuck
> when it is taken off the bike rack. Ti neutralise the lock mechanism, turn
> a key inside it and all the locking mechanisms are released and also it can
> now shrink down inside itself to become about 6 inches long and be
> transportable.
> No electronics, just a series of mechanical levers.
The problem with any solution like this is that bikes are light and
portable. A thief can pick up the bike, put it on their shoulder, and walk
off with it - or load it into the back of a van - and attack the security
mechanisms at their leisure.
I think any workable solution has to ultimately involve attaching your bike
to a stationary object.
-Nick
On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 5:49 PM, IrradiatedHaggis <hs_t...@codemaven.me>wrote:
> I rather think an immoblization device of some sort would work... If you
> could stop the pedals or the wheels from turning that would be a pretty
> good deterrant... In addition to a regular lock.
> Obviously a solenoid would take too much power... However maybe a small
> motor driving a leadscrew or a rack-and pinion of some sort to extend a bar
> into the the spokes of the main pedal sprocket... It would still need to
> be charged from time to time, but I think it could be made to be fairly low
> power.
> Have a usb-like connector (but not usb) with 4 pins. Two power and two
> data. The user carries a usb-like key that plugs into the bike's frame in a
> hidden spot. This key would have a ery small low power microcontroller in
> it. Upon powering up (by inserting it into the frame) it simply transmits a
> preprogrammed code over the comm lines. This unlocks the unit. So when the
> key is removed the device automatically extends the locking arm to
> immoblize the pedals. When the key is inserted the locking arm is
> retracted. If built into the frame solidly I think this locking arm would
> be difficult to defeat mechanically. Electronically you would need to know
> the unique number and program that into another microcontroller...
> Obviously you would combine this with a normal lock. Power consumption
> would only be when locking or unlocking, so it could last quite a while on
> a charge, but still there is power to think about... Solar or
> wheel-generator based mechanisms could work...
> I should think a good way to stop a bike getting nicked, is to put
>> effectively a plank of something alongside the bike, which has the required
>> grooves to allow the bike bits to fit inside it and get stuck in a
>> stationary position.
> Then the plank had bits of the edges/outer sides to allow it to get stuck
> when it is taken off the bike rack. Ti neutralise the lock mechanism, turn
> a key inside it and all the locking mechanisms are released and also it can
> now shrink down inside itself to become about 6 inches long and be
> transportable.
> No electronics, just a series of mechanical levers.
On Thursday, 23 August 2012, IrradiatedHaggis wrote:
> I rather think an immoblization device of some sort would work... If you
> could stop the pedals or the wheels from turning that would be a pretty
> good deterrant... In addition to a regular lock.
> Obviously a solenoid would take too much power... However maybe a small
> motor driving a leadscrew or a rack-and pinion of some sort to extend a bar
> into the the spokes of the main pedal sprocket... It would still need to
> be charged from time to time, but I think it could be made to be fairly low
> power.
> Have a usb-like connector (but not usb) with 4 pins. Two power and two
> data. The user carries a usb-like key that plugs into the bike's frame in a
> hidden spot. This key would have a ery small low power microcontroller in
> it. Upon powering up (by inserting it into the frame) it simply transmits a
> preprogrammed code over the comm lines. This unlocks the unit. So when the
> key is removed the device automatically extends the locking arm to
> immoblize the pedals. When the key is inserted the locking arm is
> retracted. If built into the frame solidly I think this locking arm would
> be difficult to defeat mechanically. Electronically you would need to know
> the unique number and program that into another microcontroller...
> Obviously you would combine this with a normal lock. Power consumption
> would only be when locking or unlocking, so it could last quite a while on
> a charge, but still there is power to think about... Solar or
> wheel-generator based mechanisms could work...
> Hmmm... Anyway, that's my thoughs.
> Cheers,
> Troy
> Sent from Samsung tablet
> Big Will <william.gilchri...@gmail.com <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml',
> 'william.gilchri...@gmail.com');>> wrote:
> I should think a good way to stop a bike getting nicked, is to put
>> effectively a plank of something alongside the bike, which has the required
>> grooves to allow the bike bits to fit inside it and get stuck in a
>> stationary position.
> Then the plank had bits of the edges/outer sides to allow it to get stuck
> when it is taken off the bike rack. Ti neutralise the lock mechanism, turn
> a key inside it and all the locking mechanisms are released and also it can
> now shrink down inside itself to become about 6 inches long and be
> transportable.
> No electronics, just a series of mechanical levers.
--
Many Thanks,
Vincent
Loophole Studios
+44(0)2070431814 | +44(0)7708215323
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disclose the contents to anyone or make copies thereof.
Which is where a lot of the bikeoff.org work concentrated on. Making the
bikes more reliant on complex tech does not work so well when you can
easily move it and work on the mechanisms.
The Vexed/Biomega folding bike was interesting, the lock was part of the
bike frame, if it was cut it made the bike essentially useless. You could
get it fixed, but only at certain places and had to prove ownership etc..
again, still flaws...
On 23 August 2012 17:55, Nick Johnson <arach...@notdot.net> wrote:
> The problem with any solution like this is that bikes are light and
> portable. A thief can pick up the bike, put it on their shoulder, and walk
> off with it - or load it into the back of a van - and attack the security
> mechanisms at their leisure.
> I think any workable solution has to ultimately involve attaching your
> bike to a stationary object.
> -Nick
> On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 5:49 PM, IrradiatedHaggis <hs_t...@codemaven.me>wrote:
>> I rather think an immoblization device of some sort would work... If you
>> could stop the pedals or the wheels from turning that would be a pretty
>> good deterrant... In addition to a regular lock.
>> Obviously a solenoid would take too much power... However maybe a small
>> motor driving a leadscrew or a rack-and pinion of some sort to extend a bar
>> into the the spokes of the main pedal sprocket... It would still need to
>> be charged from time to time, but I think it could be made to be fairly low
>> power.
>> Have a usb-like connector (but not usb) with 4 pins. Two power and two
>> data. The user carries a usb-like key that plugs into the bike's frame in a
>> hidden spot. This key would have a ery small low power microcontroller in
>> it. Upon powering up (by inserting it into the frame) it simply transmits a
>> preprogrammed code over the comm lines. This unlocks the unit. So when the
>> key is removed the device automatically extends the locking arm to
>> immoblize the pedals. When the key is inserted the locking arm is
>> retracted. If built into the frame solidly I think this locking arm would
>> be difficult to defeat mechanically. Electronically you would need to know
>> the unique number and program that into another microcontroller...
>> Obviously you would combine this with a normal lock. Power consumption
>> would only be when locking or unlocking, so it could last quite a while on
>> a charge, but still there is power to think about... Solar or
>> wheel-generator based mechanisms could work...
>> I should think a good way to stop a bike getting nicked, is to put
>>> effectively a plank of something alongside the bike, which has the required
>>> grooves to allow the bike bits to fit inside it and get stuck in a
>>> stationary position.
>> Then the plank had bits of the edges/outer sides to allow it to get
>> stuck when it is taken off the bike rack. Ti neutralise the lock
>> mechanism, turn a key inside it and all the locking mechanisms are released
>> and also it can now shrink down inside itself to become about 6 inches long
>> and be transportable.
>> No electronics, just a series of mechanical levers.
I agree. You will never make a bike unstealable... But you can make it not worth the effort. If a person needs to have a vehicle to load it on to then they're a serious organsized theif and not an opportunist. Those organised theives are going to target expensive high-value bikes and probably collect a few in a day and then take them back to work on.... But if they have to spend hours 'hacking' a bike, is it worth it? I think 90% of your theifs are opportunits who will give up if a bike doesn't move.... And those serious theives are going to be looking at whether something is worth their time to attack, or move on... Chances are they might grab the bike, take it away, and realize that they can't easily 'fix' it and so just dump it somewhere.... But I think ultimately they'd look for easy targets and skip ones that they know will take effort.
It needs a blinking LED to indicate when the immmobilier is engaged.
The problem with any solution like this is that bikes are light and portable. A thief can pick up the bike, put it on their shoulder, and walk off with it - or load it into the back of a van - and attack the security mechanisms at their leisure.
I think any workable solution has to ultimately involve attaching your bike to a stationary object.
-Nick
On Thu, Aug 23, 2012 at 5:49 PM, IrradiatedHaggis <hs_t...@codemaven.me> wrote:
I rather think an immoblization device of some sort would work... If you could stop the pedals or the wheels from turning that would be a pretty good deterrant... In addition to a regular lock.
Obviously a solenoid would take too much power... However maybe a small motor driving a leadscrew or a rack-and pinion of some sort to extend a bar into the the spokes of the main pedal sprocket... It would still need to be charged from time to time, but I think it could be made to be fairly low power.
Have a usb-like connector (but not usb) with 4 pins. Two power and two data. The user carries a usb-like key that plugs into the bike's frame in a hidden spot. This key would have a ery small low power microcontroller in it. Upon powering up (by inserting it into the frame) it simply transmits a preprogrammed code over the comm lines. This unlocks the unit. So when the key is removed the device automatically extends the locking arm to immoblize the pedals. When the key is inserted the locking arm is retracted. If built into the frame solidly I think this locking arm would be difficult to defeat mechanically. Electronically you would need to know the unique number and program that into another microcontroller...
Obviously you would combine this with a normal lock. Power consumption would only be when locking or unlocking, so it could last quite a while on a charge, but still there is power to think about... Solar or wheel-generator based mechanisms could work...
I should think a good way to stop a bike getting nicked, is to put effectively a plank of something alongside the bike, which has the required grooves to allow the bike bits to fit inside it and get stuck in a stationary position.
Then the plank had bits of the edges/outer sides to allow it to get stuck when it is taken off the bike rack. Ti neutralise the lock mechanism, turn a key inside it and all the locking mechanisms are released and also it can now shrink down inside itself to become about 6 inches long and be transportable.
No electronics, just a series of mechanical levers.
