UPDATE - Good cell phone to use as modem with Debian? cable? bluetooth?
A. F. Cano
I'm starting a new thread on this since the old one ended up
concentrating on the relative merits of different providers.
Faced with the many decisions regarding phones, cables, bluetooth,
etc... The last thing I needed was the additional set of decisions
that switching providers would add, so I stayed with Verizon. I might
regret it, but I guess they realized that there was nothing preventing
me from jumping ship when I made all the calls seeking information and
they were pretty nice and helpful. Whether the info given was
correct I'll find out soon enough I suspect.
In any case, I ended up getting a Motorola E815 phone. The list of
features is quite impressive and with the Verizon discounts it only
cost me $50. I'm happy with the reception I get as the importance
is quality as a phone first and data second. I had read that the LG
phones tend to drop calls in marginal reception areas.
Given that I knew bluetooth was going to be a long-term proposition
due to Verizon's crippling of OBEX, I decided to get a usb cable
anyway. I got one just like this, from the same vendor.
I specifically bought this because it said "Built in Charge function"
and I knew how important this is to reinitialize the phone if I end up
messing it up. So I get it and surprise! there's no place to plug the
charger into the cable. A note to the seller about this tells me that
the charging occurs from the usb port itself. This sounds strange to
me. I know that (some?) USB interfaces can provide power, but enough to
charge a phone? Have I been ripped off?
So I try it. Upon plugging the phone in two separate computers (a
Thinkpad 600E with USB 1/sarge and a Dell 8600 with USB2/woody) the
phone beeps like this: two ascending tones, 4 ascending tones and two
desceding tones. Is the latter sign of trouble?
On the Thinkpad/sarge/USB1, lsusb doesn't even report the phone. On the
Dell/woody/USB2, the following error messages are output to stderr:
cannot get string descriptor 1, error = Invalid or incomplete multibyte or wide
character(84)
cannot get string descriptor 2, error = Invalid or incomplete multibyte or wide
character(84)
And the relevant output of lsusb is:
Bus 001 Device 003: ID 22b8:2a62 Motorola PCS
Language IDs: none (cannot get min. string descriptor; got len=-1, error=84:Invalid or incomplete multibyte or wide character)
Device Descriptor:
bLength 18
bDescriptorType 1
bcdUSB 1.10
bDeviceClass 2 Communications
bDeviceSubClass 0
bDeviceProtocol 0
bMaxPacketSize0 64
idVendor 0x22b8 Motorola PCS
idProduct 0x2a62
bcdDevice 0.01
iManufacturer 1
iProduct 2
iSerial 0
bNumConfigurations 1
cannot get config descriptor 0, Invalid or incomplete multibyte or wide character (84)
Language IDs: none (cannot get min. string descriptor; got len=-1, error=84:Invalid or incomplete multibyte or wide character)
Furthermore the hubs report: ("lsusb | grep Power" on the
Dell/woody/USB2)
MaxPower 0mA
MaxPower 0mA
MaxPower 0mA
This seems to me to indicate that the USB hubs are not capable of
providing power and thus my cable is useless for the purpose of
charging while connected. Am I mistaken here?
There are also no apparent serial devices created by plugging in the
phone. This is on woody. I have yet to try sarge/kernel 2.6.8 on the
Dell/USB2.
Finally, there are two apps out there that deal with cell phones:
moto4lin (specifically for motorola phones) and bitpim. At the very
least, I should see the phone as a storage device, the web site says.
BUT! a usb memory key I have, when plugged in reports (partial output):
MaxPower 90mA
Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 4
bInterfaceNumber 0
bAlternateSetting 0
bNumEndpoints 2
bInterfaceClass 8 Mass Storage
bInterfaceSubClass 6 SCSI
bInterfaceProtocol 80 Bulk (Zip)
So right away, interfaceClass is different. Can someone that knows the
details of the USB protocols tell me if in fact the phone is not
following the standards? shouldn't I see something about the internal
memory reflected as "Mass Storage"?
If the phone were able to charge from the USB port, shouldn't it report
the MaxPower that it could use? What is the maximum power that a USB
hub can provide? I suspect that it would be much less than an empty
battery would need.
So far I haven't tried either application. I would like to know why
nothing at all shows up in the output of lsusb on the thinkpad. I
thought usb 1 and usb 2 were supposed to be somewhat compatible?
So far all this is not very encouraging. The next step is loading up
my address book from the palm pda (also synced with kpilot). It appears
that the easiest solution might be to get a transflash card (already
on order, the best deal I found was at pricegrabber.com). I don't
know yet if it is possible to copy the address book directly from the
PDA (it has an SD slot) to the transflash and copy it into its proper
place inside the phone by inserting the transflash card in it, thus
completely bypassing the computer. Has anyone done something like this?
I suspect there might have to be some format conversion in between.
Thanks for any insight on the mysteries of interfacing debian with cell
phones... I'll keep everyone updated on whatever progress I make.
Augustine
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-lap...@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listm...@lists.debian.org
Nate Duehr
> I specifically bought this because it said "Built in Charge function"
> and I knew how important this is to reinitialize the phone if I end up
> messing it up. So I get it and surprise! there's no place to plug the
> charger into the cable. A note to the seller about this tells me that
> the charging occurs from the usb port itself. This sounds strange to
> me. I know that (some?) USB interfaces can provide power, but enough to
> charge a phone? Have I been ripped off?
No, most phones are using battery technology and lower voltages these
days that allows for charging from USB. My Motorola RAZR charges from
its USB cable, no problems. The only issue I've run into is some
mini-USB cables I had were "four pin" and others were "five pin" and the
phone needed the five to charge, and only four for data-only.
> So I try it. Upon plugging the phone in two separate computers (a
> Thinkpad 600E with USB 1/sarge and a Dell 8600 with USB2/woody) the
> phone beeps like this: two ascending tones, 4 ascending tones and two
> desceding tones. Is the latter sign of trouble?
Yes. The phone didn't negotiate properly with the PC.
> So right away, interfaceClass is different. Can someone that knows the
> details of the USB protocols tell me if in fact the phone is not
> following the standards? shouldn't I see something about the internal
> memory reflected as "Mass Storage"?
Not necessarily. It's completely up to the manufacturer how they
implement "getting to" the memory. Many phones seem to use a
proprietary serial stream to the serial USB "interface" to retrieve/set
data in their memory.
I'd be more worried that Verizon has done something wonky to that
phone's USB stuff to disable data use, really.
> If the phone were able to charge from the USB port, shouldn't it report
> the MaxPower that it could use? What is the maximum power that a USB
> hub can provide? I suspect that it would be much less than an empty
> battery would need.
Yes. USB devices are supposed to negotiate how much power they wish to
use from the bus, in case too many devices are attached for the computer
to service with power. Really cheesy devices like the little USB fans
and coffee cup warmers (eeek...) sometimes don't do this properly.
> So far all this is not very encouraging. The next step is loading up
> my address book from the palm pda (also synced with kpilot). It appears
> that the easiest solution might be to get a transflash card (already
> on order, the best deal I found was at pricegrabber.com). I don't
> know yet if it is possible to copy the address book directly from the
> PDA (it has an SD slot) to the transflash and copy it into its proper
> place inside the phone by inserting the transflash card in it, thus
> completely bypassing the computer. Has anyone done something like this?
> I suspect there might have to be some format conversion in between.
>
> Thanks for any insight on the mysteries of interfacing debian with cell
> phones... I'll keep everyone updated on whatever progress I make.
All I can share at this point is that I haven't even attempted to sync
the Motorola RAZR with Linux yet... the Motorola tools CD and a USB
cable appears to work under Windows to Outlook (ugh!).
If/when I get time to fiddle with it, I'll send an update here, but it
may not help with your particular phone...?
All I've done so far is plug the phone into a Linux box running Sarge,
and it recognized it (I don't have the kernel output with me here at
this location) and the phone was able to charge. I didn't see any
indication that serial or mass storage came up, however. Just a "device
number" that the USB subsystem "recognized".
Nate
A. F. Cano
> >[about the charge function in usb cables ]
>
> No, most phones are using battery technology and lower voltages these
> days that allows for charging from USB. My Motorola RAZR charges from
> its USB cable, no problems. The only issue I've run into is some
It turns out that when plugged into the Dell laptop (usb2) the phone
actually charges. After a while the battery meter starts going up
again. At first, and this was puzzling, the battery meter went down
(from 4 when unplugged to 2 when plugged). After a while it went back
up. So it looks like this function works.
> mini-USB cables I had were "four pin" and others were "five pin" and the
> phone needed the five to charge, and only four for data-only.
This cable has 4 pins at the computer end. Aren't all USB cables 4
conductor (at the computer end) plus the shield/plug frame?
> >So I try it. Upon plugging the phone in two separate computers (a
> >Thinkpad 600E with USB 1/sarge and a Dell 8600 with USB2/woody) the
> >phone beeps like this: two ascending tones, 4 ascending tones and two
> >desceding tones. Is the latter sign of trouble?
>
> Yes. The phone didn't negotiate properly with the PC.
Well, that still happens but sometimes I get a more complete lsusb report:
Bus 001 Device 011: ID 22b8:2a62 Motorola PCS
Device Descriptor:
bLength 18
bDescriptorType 1
bcdUSB 1.10
bDeviceClass 2 Communications
bDeviceSubClass 0
bDeviceProtocol 0
bMaxPacketSize0 64
idVendor 0x22b8 Motorola PCS
idProduct 0x2a62
bcdDevice 0.01
iManufacturer 1 Motorola, Inc.
iProduct 2 Motorola E815
iSerial 0
bNumConfigurations 1
Configuration Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 2
wTotalLength 67
bNumInterfaces 2
bConfigurationValue 1
iConfiguration 0
bmAttributes 0xc0
Self Powered
MaxPower 20mA
Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 4
bInterfaceNumber 0
bAlternateSetting 0
bNumEndpoints 1
bInterfaceClass 2 Communications
bInterfaceSubClass 2 Abstract (modem)
bInterfaceProtocol 1 AT-commands
iInterface 3 Motorola Communication Interface
unknown descriptor type: 05 24 00 09 01
unknown descriptor type: 05 24 01 03 01
unknown descriptor type: 04 24 02 0f
unknown descriptor type: 05 24 06 00 01
Endpoint Descriptor:
bLength 7
bDescriptorType 5
bEndpointAddress 0x81 EP 1 IN
bmAttributes 3
Transfer Type Interrupt
Synch Type none
wMaxPacketSize 16
bInterval 32
Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 4
bInterfaceNumber 1
bAlternateSetting 0
bNumEndpoints 2
bInterfaceClass 10
bInterfaceSubClass 0
bInterfaceProtocol 0
iInterface 3 Motorola Communication Interface
Endpoint Descriptor:
bLength 7
bDescriptorType 5
bEndpointAddress 0x82 EP 2 IN
bmAttributes 2
Transfer Type Bulk
Synch Type none
wMaxPacketSize 64
bInterval 0
Endpoint Descriptor:
bLength 7
bDescriptorType 5
bEndpointAddress 0x02 EP 2 OUT
bmAttributes 2
Transfer Type Bulk
Synch Type none
wMaxPacketSize 64
bInterval 0
Language IDs: (length=4)
0409 English(US)
Once in a while the phone beeps, like it just tried to re-negotiate
the connection and then I get the very incomplete usb report I posted
previously.
I've read at www.bitpim.org that a driver called acm handles the usb
serial port in cell phones, but I don't seem to have it in either
kernel 2.4.22 (woody) or 2.6.8 (sarge). Bitpim won't install in
woody (dependencies) and fails to run in sarge. I'll have to
investigate this further, but it seems that first the phone's devices
(serial port, memory) have to be seen at the usb layer if any other
software is to use them. For now I'd be happy to have /dev/acm0
(or whatever) so I can use ppp with the phone. Can anyone tell me
what I'm missing? what the unknown descriptor types mean? Where to
find the driver that would talk usb and give me the serial device?
> >[ about getting to the internal memory ]
>
> Not necessarily. It's completely up to the manufacturer how they
> implement "getting to" the memory. Many phones seem to use a
> proprietary serial stream to the serial USB "interface" to retrieve/set
> data in their memory.
I guess that's the case. Mount -t msdos /dev/sda1 /mnt doesn't work
(not a valid block device) even though the same card (sandisk 512M
transflash) is seen perfectly in the pda (when inserted in its SD carrier)
> I'd be more worried that Verizon has done something wonky to that
> phone's USB stuff to disable data use, really.
I'm afraid that I'll have to navigate Verizon's tech support soon...
> >[ about reporting power needs of a usb device ]
>
> Yes. USB devices are supposed to negotiate how much power they wish to
> use from the bus, ...
There's something not quite stable in the usb connection. I'm not sure
if it's the phone or woody but the phone has been charging on the usb
cable as I typed. It's now charged and it hasn't beeped in a while.
In any case, as seen above, it gets 20ma which is also reflected in the
power meter into which the laptop is plugged in: about 4 Watts.
> >[ about loading the palmos address book into the phone ]
>
> All I can share at this point is that I haven't even attempted to sync
> the Motorola RAZR with Linux yet... the Motorola tools CD and a USB
> cable appears to work under Windows to Outlook (ugh!).
I don't run windows at all and of course I don't have any phone
numbers/addresses in outlook, so my only option is to get the palmos
address book somehow imported.
I first tried to copy the address book from within palmos to the
transflash card after it was in the SD slot. There doesn't seem to
be a way to do this. Next, after a sync with kpilot, I exported
the address book. The result is a comma-separated list of fields,
one record per line. Some comparison with the palmos screens reveals
that this is the format:
LastName,FirstName,Company,WorkPH,HomePH,FaxPH,OtherPH,Email,Address,
City,State,Zip,Country,Title,Custom1,Custom2,Custom3,Custom4
The phone itself has 3 types of records: Phone No., Email Addr and
Mailing List.
Phone no. has these fields:
Name
Category - Business, Persoal, General, VIP
Number
Type - Work, Home, Main, Mobile, Fax, Pager
Speed No - 1, 2, 3
Ringer - All the ring tones available
Picture - The available pictures
More - this field allows adding more phone numbers or email addresses
So it looks like some data massaging is going to be needed here.
Does anyone have some script to do this so I don't reinvent the
wheel? Of course I need to know the internal data structure that
these records would go into and where. The manual of the phone is
totally useless for this. With any luck the same format is used
on all motorola phones...
> If/when I get time to fiddle with it, I'll send an update here, but it
> may not help with your particular phone...?
>
> All I've done so far is plug the phone into a Linux box running Sarge,
> and it recognized it (I don't have the kernel output with me here at
> this location) and the phone was able to charge. I didn't see any
Well, it seems that I've gotten just this far with woody.
> indication that serial or mass storage came up, however. Just a "device
> number" that the USB subsystem "recognized".
Try enabling "Dial Up Networking", that might make the "modem" interface
visible. On my phone I did it by typing ##DIALUP. You have to do it
quite fast for it to take. Of course that was still not enough to
get a serial device on the computer, unless it's somewhere that I've
missed. It's not in /dev/usb/ (kernel 2.4.22).
Does anyone who knows usb/hotplug think that maybe some configuration
with the specific product codes might help? Anyone else has this
phone?
Augustine
A. F. Cano
On Thu, Jan 05, 2006 at 09:28:53PM -0500, I wrote:
> ...
> I've read at www.bitpim.org that a driver called acm handles the usb
> serial port in cell phones, but I don't seem to have it in either
> kernel 2.4.22 (woody) or 2.6.8 (sarge). Bitpim won't install in
> woody (dependencies) and fails to run in sarge. I'll have to
> investigate this further, but it seems that first the phone's devices
> (serial port, memory) have to be seen at the usb layer if any other
> software is to use them. For now I'd be happy to have /dev/acm0
> (or whatever) so I can use ppp with the phone. Can anyone tell me
> what I'm missing? what the unknown descriptor types mean? Where to
> find the driver that would talk usb and give me the serial device?
Obviously, what I'm missing is that CONFIG_USB_ACM is not defined
in the current woody custom kernel. However, it is defined in the
sarge/thinkpad kernel (2.6.8) but the phone is not recognized there
at all. All that happens is a long delay after running lsusb and
then nothing at all is displayed. I'll have to keep working at this.
A. F. Cano
Oh well, I keep posting followups to my own questions...
I'm finding more info:
1 - the thinkpad apparently has a hw problem with the USB port, so
even though it has the latest OS, it never sees the phone.
2 - The 8600 has good hardware but the OS (woody) is too old. That's
the reason for the "unknown descriptor type" errors.
3 - A third (desktop) computer with USB and sarge (kernel 2.6.8 with
CONFIG_USB_ACM) gives the following:
Bus 001 Device 002: ID 22b8:2a62 Motorola PCS
bInterfaceProtocol 1 AT-commands (v.25ter)
iInterface 3 Motorola Communication Interface
CDC Header:
bcdCDC 1.09
CDC Call Management:
bmCapabilities 0x03
call management
use DataInterface
bDataInterface 1
CDC ACM:
bmCapabilities 0x0f
connection notifications
sends break
line coding and serial state
get/set/clear comm features
CDC Union:
bMasterInterface 0
bSlaveInterface 1
Endpoint Descriptor:
bLength 7
bDescriptorType 5
bEndpointAddress 0x81 EP 1 IN
bmAttributes 3
Transfer Type Interrupt
Synch Type None
Usage Type Data
wMaxPacketSize 0x0010 1x 16 bytes
bInterval 32
Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 4
bInterfaceNumber 1
bAlternateSetting 0
bNumEndpoints 2
bInterfaceClass 10 Data
bInterfaceSubClass 0 Unused
bInterfaceProtocol 0
iInterface 3 Motorola Communication Interface
Endpoint Descriptor:
bLength 7
bDescriptorType 5
bEndpointAddress 0x82 EP 2 IN
bmAttributes 2
Transfer Type Bulk
Synch Type None
Usage Type Data
wMaxPacketSize 0x0040 1x 64 bytes
bInterval 0
Endpoint Descriptor:
bLength 7
bDescriptorType 5
bEndpointAddress 0x02 EP 2 OUT
bmAttributes 2
Transfer Type Bulk
Synch Type None
Usage Type Data
wMaxPacketSize 0x0040 1x 64 bytes
bInterval 0
So no more USB errors. Furthermore, the device /dev/ttyACM0
appears after manually loading cdc-acm. I still can't get anything out
that device with minicom so I can't really talk to the modem.
Maybe wrong baud rate or other parameter. Or maybe this driver is still
not the right one. I'll keep investigating tomorrow.
Chris
from wihich I can transfer images to my Debian box in KDE with KBluetoothD.
I synch my phone with outlook from my computer at work: calender, phone list,
and to-do. I'd also like to do the same with my Debian box (Kmail, and
Kaddressbook) but havn't found any way to do it. If someone has a suggestion
here I'd really appreciate it! I did experiment with Evolution and some tool
for synching that, the name of which I can't remember, but that didn't work
so well (double entries and other headaches).
Chris
--
C. Hurschler