Tag questions after "may"
Enrico C
In brackets, what I would possibly use (very likely to be wrong!)
You may kiss me now...
(will you?)
I guess we may go now...
(shall we?)
Trespassers may be shot...
(couldn't they? / isn't it?)
Your boss may be monitoring your e-mail...
(mightn't he? / wouldn't he?)
In the future, astronauts may eat insects...
(won't they? / couldn't they?)
I've just read the luggage regulations: international passengers may
check two and carry on one...
(isn't it? / may they not?)
Children may express a strong knowledge of grammar at any point in
time from the two word stage onwards...
(can't they? / don't they?)
--
Enrico C
Do Something Amazing Today
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Adam Atkinson
news:4qumzd478k6w$.d...@news.lillathedog.net
> How would you complete the following sentences using a tag question?
> In brackets, what I would possibly use (very likely to be wrong!)
>
> You may kiss me now...
> (will you?)
may you not?
("mayn't you" feels a bit like "pel" or "collo")
Maybe I don't understand the exercise. I don't think I'd
change the verb from may to something else, the way you
seem to be doing. Is this what they're expecting you to do?
--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG
Mary Cassidy
Enrico C wrote:
>
> How would you complete the following sentences using a tag question?
None of these sentences are suitable for question tags; I'm trying to
think of a rule to explain why, but I haven't worked it out yet.
> You may kiss me now...
Especially this one, which means "ti permetto di baciarmi ora".
The question tag that goes with "he may" is "mayn't he?", but it's
obsolete.
--
Mary
Adam Atkinson
news:3F15556C...@privacy.net
> The question tag that goes with "he may" is "mayn't he?", but it's
> obsolete.
You could use "may he not?", not that this sounds _much_ better.
Mary Cassidy
Adam Atkinson wrote:
>
> You could use "may he not?", not that this sounds _much_ better.
True, but it's very formal, and question tags are generally used in
informal conversation. If you really need something, you'd be better off
with "don't you think?" or "don't you agree?".
A native speaker would not be likely to say "trespassers may be shot,
may they not?"; it would be more idiomatic to say "is it true that
trespassers may be shot?"
--
Mary
Adam Atkinson
> > You could use "may he not?", not that this sounds _much_ better.
>
> True, but it's very formal, and question tags are generally used in
> informal conversation. If you really need something, you'd be better off
> with "don't you think?" or "don't you agree?".
Oh, I agree. I can't imagine using a question tag after "may"
at all. But if forced to do so, I suppose it would have to
be "may ... not?" Your suggestions seem reasonable as well.
I'd be curious to see the official answers to these questions.
> A native speaker would not be likely to say "trespassers may be shot,
> may they not?"; it would be more idiomatic to say "is it true that
> trespassers may be shot?"
They shoot hors^H^H^H^Htrespassers, don't they?
Mary Cassidy
Adam Atkinson wrote:
>
> I'd be curious to see the official answers to these questions.
I suspect they weren't questions from English exercises at all, but
examples invented by Enrico while studying question tags.
>
>
> They shoot hors^H^H^H^Htrespassers, don't they?
:-))
--
Mary
Enrico C
> "Enrico C" <enri...@spamcop.net> wrote in message
> news:4qumzd478k6w$.d...@news.lillathedog.net
>
>> How would you complete the following sentences using a tag question?
>> In brackets, what I would possibly use (very likely to be wrong!)
>>
>> You may kiss me now...
>> (will you?)
>
> may you not?
> ("mayn't you" feels a bit like "pel" or "collo")
Mayn't...? Gosh! I didn't even know it existed! It marks 7,250 hits on
the Google-meter, BTW.
>
> Maybe I don't understand the exercise. I don't think I'd
> change the verb from may to something else, the way you
> seem to be doing.
I'm asking it because I couldn't find examples of tag questions after
"may".
The appropriate tag question in such a case - I conjectured - might
depend on the exact meaning of "may" in each sentence...
A bit like "shall we?" after "Let's...!, you know...
Now I learn I was dead wrong! :(
Anyway, do you believe that all the tag questions I thought of are
completely unlikely? Or they could be used, to express particular
meanings?
> Is this what they're expecting you to do?
They who? Whatever "they" you were thinking of, the answer is "No, I
did all the mess by myself!" :)
Enrico C
So, "will you?" after "You may kiss me now...", is not a question tag,
it's just a plain question, right?
>> I guess we may go now... (shall we?)
In this case, I was thinking at the "Let's party, shall we?" pattern.
FB
"Enrico C" <enri...@spamcop.net> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:1ryjn7sxfo0y4$.dlg@news.lillathedog.net...
> So, "will you?" after "You may kiss me now...", is not a question tag,
> it's just a plain question, right?
>
>
> >> I guess we may go now... (shall we?)
>
> In this case, I was thinking at the "Let's party, shall we?" pattern.
As far as I know, I don't think so. The question tag is built reversing the
subject and the verb of the sentence it relates to. "Let's... shall we?"
isn't far from a question tag, even so I think that in theory it is not.
Bye, FB
Enrico C
>> I'd be curious to see the official answers to these questions.
>
> I suspect they weren't questions from English exercises at all, but
> examples invented by Enrico while studying question tags.
Yep! And I must admit some of them were quite unlikely! How do you say
"tirate per i capelli"? :)
But what about
Your boss may be monitoring your e-mail... (couldn't he? / may he
not?)
or
In the future, astronauts may eat insects... (mightn't they? / may
they not?)
???
Adam Atkinson
> Your boss may be monitoring your e-mail... (couldn't he? / may he
> not?)
may he not?
> In the future, astronauts may eat insects... (mightn't they? / may
> they not?)
may he not?
As far as I know, the verbs need to match, unless the tag uses
"do"?
Enrico C
> may he not?
>
> As far as I know, the verbs need to match, unless the tag uses
> "do"?
Ta! That makes perfect logic! I surrender! :)
So, I think, the only exceptions are those reported in SWAN
[QUOTE]
Let's have a party, shall we?
Give me a hand, will you?
Do sit down, won't you? (GB)
Open a window, would you?
Shut up, can't you?
Don't forget, will you?
[UNQUOTE]
I also noticed there is a colloquial "isn't it?" form, though.
"Mom recently started listening to Donovan again, isn't it?"
Alan Lothian
<m...@privacy.net> wrote:
<snip>
>
> A native speaker would not be likely to say "trespassers may be shot,
> may they not?";
Scene: a wooded park near a Very Grand country house, circa 1900.
Guest, in plus-fours (ciu piu' ciu) observes a movement, then breaks
and loads his shotgun. Turns to elderly gamekeeper.
"Trespassers may be shot, may they not?"
"Certainly, your Lordship."
BANG
> it would be more idiomatic to say "is it true that
> trespassers may be shot?"
--
"The past resembles the future as water resembles water" Ibn Khaldun
My .mac.com address is a spam sink.
If you wish to email me, try alan dot lothian at blueyonder dot co dot uk
Adam Atkinson
>So, I think, the only exceptions are those reported in SWAN
>[QUOTE]
>Let's have a party, shall we?
>Give me a hand, will you?
>Do sit down, won't you? (GB)
>Open a window, would you?
>Shut up, can't you?
>Don't forget, will you?
>[UNQUOTE]
Well, those all start with imperatives. I hadn't considered those.
I'm not _quite_ sure these are the same thing.
>I also noticed there is a colloquial "isn't it?" form, though.
>"Mom recently started listening to Donovan again, isn't it?"
Only if you're from Wales.
--
Adam Atkinson (gh...@mistral.co.uk)
It's another notch in the first rung on the slippery slope
towards fascism.
Mary Cassidy
Adam Atkinson wrote:
>
>
> >I also noticed there is a colloquial "isn't it?" form, though.
>
> >"Mom recently started listening to Donovan again, isn't it?"
>
> Only if you're from Wales.
>
There seems to be a modern trend towards using "innit" as an all-purpose
question tag (to go with any verb), but it sounds so awful I refuse to
use it.
--
Mary
Adam Atkinson
>> >"Mom recently started listening to Donovan again, isn't it?"
>>
>> Only if you're from Wales.
>There seems to be a modern trend towards using "innit" as an all-purpose
>question tag (to go with any verb), but it sounds so awful I refuse to
>use it.
Ah. I'd heard this on "Goodness Gracious Me", but assumed it was an
Asian youth thing in the UK. Is it in more general use than that?
Hideous.
Cockney listen and repeat:
It's a little metal bottle of butter, isn't it?
Issa li'u me'u bo'u o bu'u, inni'?
--
Adam Atkinson (gh...@mistral.co.uk)
Libri e altro per matematici piu' o meno ricreativi:
http://www.mistral.co.uk/ghira/recmathslibri.html
Mary Cassidy
Alan Lothian wrote:
>
> Scene: a wooded park near a Very Grand country house, circa 1900.
> Guest, in plus-fours (ciu piu' ciu) observes a movement, then breaks
> and loads his shotgun. Turns to elderly gamekeeper.
> "Trespassers may be shot, may they not?"
> "Certainly, your Lordship."
> BANG
OK, I give up, innit?
--
Mary
Enrico C
> "Trespassers may be shot, may they not?"
> "Certainly, your Lordship."
> BANG
ROTFL !
Enrico C
> Well, those all start with imperatives. I hadn't considered those.
> I'm not _quite_ sure these are the same thing.
Neither am I.
I suppose they are a different sort of question tags.
>>"Mom recently started listening to Donovan again, isn't it?"
>
> Only if you're from Wales.
Let me think... Mmmmh... No, I'm definitely not! :)
Enrico C
> Issa li'u me'u bo'u o bu'u, inni'?
Hey! This is not it.cultura.linguistica.eschimese ;)
Enrico C
> There seems to be a modern trend towards using "innit" as an all-purpose
> question tag (to go with any verb),
Quick and dirty, eh?
> but it sounds so awful I refuse to
> use it.
Good to know :)
GFCARRERA
> "Enrico C" <enri...@spamcop.net> wrote in message
> news:4qumzd478k6w$.d...@news.lillathedog.net
>
> > How would you complete the following sentences using a tag question?
> > In brackets, what I would possibly use (very likely to be wrong!)
> >
> > You may kiss me now...
> > (will you?)
>
> may you not?
> ("mayn't you" feels a bit like "pel" or "collo")
>
> Maybe I don't understand the exercise. I don't think I'd
> change the verb from may to something else, the way you
> seem to be doing. Is this what they're expecting you to do?
I've never seen may follwed by a tag question (but that of course does
not mean that it's not possible)
bye
ari
Enrico C
> I've never seen may follwed by a tag question (but that of course does
> not mean that it's not possible)
That's why I couldn't find any explanation about it!
In grammars, I mean.
Adam Atkinson
>> I've never seen may follwed by a tag question (but that of course does
>> not mean that it's not possible)
>That's why I couldn't find any explanation about it!
>In grammars, I mean.
There's not much special to say. Swan says "mayn't is very unusual" so
one can deduce that if you insist on using a tag question, it has to
me "may I not?" etc. However, you should notice quite quickly that
no-one really says this.
"May I eat three doughnuts?" is far more likely than "I may eat three
doughnuts, may I not?"
--
Adam Atkinson (gh...@mistral.co.uk)
You've got to get a hat if you want to get ahead.
Enrico C
> However, you should notice quite quickly that
> no-one really says this.
>
> "May I eat three doughnuts?" is far more likely than "I may eat three
> doughnuts, may I not?"
That's pretty reasonable. In this sentence, "may" is for asking in a
kind or formal way permission to do something. And I agree it wouldn't
make much sense to say something like "I am kindly allowed by you,
Lord Edmund, to eat three doughnuts, aren't I?"
Nevertheless, the word "may" has other shades, too, so to express
"permission, liberty, probability, or possibility", as I read in
grammars.
"If we don't let little Susie eat her doughnuts right now, she may
burst into tears!".
That's something that may happen or may not. Someone could ask it,
after saying such a sentence, couldn't they?
Adam Atkinson
>That's pretty reasonable. In this sentence, "may" is for asking in a
>kind or formal way permission to do something. And I agree it wouldn't
>make much sense to say something like "I am kindly allowed by you,
>Lord Edmund, to eat three doughnuts, aren't I?"
And, as previously discussed, "aren't I?" is a more important question
tag to know than those involving "may".
>"If we don't let little Susie eat her doughnuts right now, she may
>burst into tears!".
>That's something that may happen or may not. Someone could ask it,
>after saying such a sentence, couldn't they?
Yes. "mightn't" is allowed, though, so you could use "might" instead
of "may" and avoid having to use a contraction-free question tag.
--
Adam Atkinson (gh...@mistral.co.uk)
BRITISH LEFT WAFFLES ON FALKLANDS
Chris
gh...@mistral.co.uk says...
> On 17-Jul-03 09:23:30, Enrico C said:
>
> >> I've never seen may follwed by a tag question (but that of course does
> >> not mean that it's not possible)
>
> >That's why I couldn't find any explanation about it!
> >In grammars, I mean.
>
> There's not much special to say. Swan says "mayn't is very unusual" so
> one can deduce that if you insist on using a tag question, it has to
> me "may I not?" etc. However, you should notice quite quickly that
> no-one really says this.
>
> "May I eat three doughnuts?" is far more likely than "I may eat three
> doughnuts, may I not?"
>
>
"I may eat three doughnuts" (This is an announcement of possibility)
"mayn't I" (this is a request for permission to eat the three doughnuts)
It is a bit archaic but was prevalent in pre-1960's literature
particularly when children were making polite requests of adults.
I seem to remember this sort of phrasing used in "Alice-in-Wonderland"
Needless to say no child would use anything like this today. In fact one
doesn't often here an English child requesting anything politely!
--
Chris Notton
Replace "nospam" with my surname to reply by email
Sostituisca il "nospam" con il mio cognome per rispondere
}<////(*>
FB
"Adam Atkinson" <gh...@mistral.co.uk> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:872.328T674T...@mistral.co.uk...
> Yes. "mightn't" is allowed, though, so you could use "might" instead
> of "may" and avoid having to use a contraction-free question tag.
Non so. "Might" per chiedere il permesso ("Might I eat three doughnuts?") č
assurdo. La mia professoressa (la strega) mi diceva che non si puň dire
nemmeno al Presidente della Repubblica.
Ciao, FB
Enrico C
Mi sono imbattuto in un "may I not?". In un film, "Possession".
Ma lo dice un poeta vittoriano, anzi lo scrive in una lettera a
un'amica, anche lei poetessa.
Quindi non conta come esempio d'uso moderno :)
"My dear friend, for I may call myself a friend, may I not?"
FB
"Enrico C" <enri...@spamcop.net> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:1dt2wbvc6u5m0$.dlg@news.lillathedog.net...
> Mi sono imbattuto in un "may I not?". In un film, "Possession".
> Ma lo dice un poeta vittoriano, anzi lo scrive in una lettera a
> un'amica, anche lei poetessa.
> Quindi non conta come esempio d'uso moderno :)
>
> "My dear friend, for I may call myself a friend, may I not?"
Carina. Io mi sto facendo un'iniezione di poesia di questi tempi, spero che
non comincerņ a scrivere in un inglese improbabile.
Ciao, FB
FB
"Enrico C" <enri...@spamcop.net> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:1dt2wbvc6u5m0$.dlg@news.lillathedog.net...
> "My dear friend, for I may call myself a friend, may I not?"
Ma mi sembra strana: "Mio caro amico, perché posso chiamarmi amico, vero?".
Il senso ce l'ho, ma avrei ritenuto più logico:"Mio caro amico, perché posso
chiamarTI amico, vero?".
Ciao, FB
Enrico C
>
> "Enrico C" <enri...@spamcop.net> ha scritto nel messaggio
> news:1dt2wbvc6u5m0$.dlg@news.lillathedog.net...
>
>> "My dear friend, for I may call myself a friend, may I not?"
>
> Ma mi sembra strana: "Mio caro amico, perché posso chiamarmi amico, vero?".
> Il senso ce l'ho, ma avrei ritenuto piu` logico:"Mio caro amico, perché posso
> chiamarTI amico, vero?".
Mmmmh... a me suona meglio "myself".
"It's been nice meeting you, Sarah, and drinking pints of Guinnes at
your place, especially since I didn't have any money to spend in the
pub, you know. The moon is high and I must be going, though, my
friend! May I call myself your friend, my generous host?".
Enrico C
>
> "Enrico C" <enri...@spamcop.net> ha scritto nel messaggio
> news:1dt2wbvc6u5m0$.dlg@news.lillathedog.net...
>
>> Mi sono imbattuto in un "may I not?". In un film, "Possession".
>> Ma lo dice un poeta vittoriano, anzi lo scrive in una lettera a
>> un'amica, anche lei poetessa.
>> Quindi non conta come esempio d'uso moderno :)
>>
>> "My dear friend, for I may call myself a friend, may I not?"
>
> Carina. Io mi sto facendo un'iniezione di poesia di questi tempi, spero che
> non comincero` a scrivere in un inglese improbabile.
Il film in questione parla di due ricercatori (lei inglese, lui
amerciano a Londra) che attraverso lettere, poesie e diari di un poeta
(sposato) e di una poetessa (dichiaratamente lesbica) inglesi
dell'epoca vittoriana, scoprono una storia d'amore segreta di 150 anni
fa e ripercorrendola si innamorano a loro volta.
Forse un po' chick flick, forse qualche luogo comune sulle reciproche
ironie fra inglesi e americani (ma e` poi vero che gli americani in
England sono sistematicamente presi in giro?), ma nel complesso non
cosi` malvagio.
http://movie-reviews.colossus.net/movies/p/possession.html
Enrico C
> http://movie-reviews.colossus.net/movies/p/possession.html
BTW, quanto e` convincente l'accento "inglese" di Gwyneth Paltrow per
un orecchio inglese?
FB
> Mmmmh... a me suona meglio "myself".
Eě vero. "Posso chiamarti amico" sembra che sottenda "perché sei mio amico,
non č che prima o poi mi freghi, vero?"; "posso chiamarmi amico" č invece
gentile.
Ciao, FB
FB
> "It's been nice meeting you, Sarah
Che, per caso la uccide subito dopo? Continuo a non capire.
Ciao, FB
Adam Atkinson
>> http://movie-reviews.colossus.net/movies/p/possession.html
>BTW, quanto e` convincente l'accento "inglese" di Gwyneth Paltrow per
>un orecchio inglese?
Per me, almeno in "Emma" e "Shakespeare in Love", abbastanza.
Quanto sono convincenti gli accenti americani di Emma Thompson e
Kenneth Branagh in "Dead Again"?
--
Adam Atkinson (gh...@mistral.co.uk)
In the new approach, as you know, the important thing is to understand
what you're doing, rather than to get the right answer. (T. Lehrer)
Mary Cassidy
knowing you" rende l'idea che fra poco morirai.
--
Mary
Enrico C
> amerciano a Londra) che attraverso lettere, poesie e diari di un poeta
> (sposato)
Mr Perfect Husband, viene definito.
Anche il nome e` tutto un programma: Randolph Henry Ash.
Ma poi si scoprira` che Mr Cenere, sotto sotto...!
> e di una poetessa (dichiaratamente lesbica) inglesi
> dell'epoca vittoriana,
Dichiaratamente e` eccessivo, data l'epoca, certo non lo poteva
dichiarare pubblicamente, credo. Pero` conviveva con un'altra donna.
In una lettera ad Ash si definisce "A woman living in shared
solitude".
> ironie fra inglesi e americani
Del tipo:
An English professor (Roland's "boss"): "He's an American, for God's
sake! He's probably trafficking drugs."
(Nel film, Roland is an American young researcher having a fellowship
in London)
An English collegue of Roland's: "Hello, Roland. What do you chaps
always say? How's it hanging?".
Roland: "We usually say Hey. I mean, unless you're gay".
A member of staff at British Library: "You're that American who's over
here?"
Roland: "I'm sure there are others. After all, you're our favorite
colony."
Enrico C
> amerciano a Londra) che attraverso lettere, poesie e diari di un poeta
> (sposato)
Mr Perfect Husband, viene definito.
Anche il nome e` tutto un programma: Randolph Henry Ash.
Ma poi si scoprira` che Mr Cenere, sotto sotto...!
> e di una poetessa (dichiaratamente lesbica) inglesi
> dell'epoca vittoriana,
Dichiaratamente e` eccessivo, data l'epoca, certo non lo poteva
dichiarare pubblicamente, credo. Pero` conviveva con un'altra donna.
In una lettera ad Ash si definisce "A woman living in shared
solitude".
> ironie fra inglesi e americani
Del tipo:
An English professor (Roland's "boss"): "He's an American, for God's
sake! He's probably trafficking drugs."
(Nel film, Roland is an American young researcher having a fellowship
in London)
An English colleague of Roland's: "Hello, Roland. What do you chaps
always say? How's it hanging?".
Roland: "We usually say Hey. I mean, unless you're gay".
A member of staff at British Library: "You're that American who's over
here?"
Roland: "I'm sure there are others. After all, you're our favorite
colony."
--
FB
"Mary Cassidy" <m...@privacy.net> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:3F1F06A3...@privacy.net...
> > Che, per caso la uccide subito dopo? Continuo a non capire.
>
> No, "it's been nice meeting you" è normale, mentre "it's been nice
> knowing you" rende l'idea che fra poco morirai.
Ah, o.k. Ciò che non capisco è perché la seconda frase fa questo effetto.
Ciao, FB
Mary Cassidy
FB wrote:
>
> Ah, o.k. Ciň che non capisco č perché la seconda frase fa questo effetto.
Boh, č un'idioma.
Originalmente forse era una citazione da un film o un libro.
--
Mary
FB
> Boh, č un'idioma.
>
> Originalmente forse era una citazione da un film o un libro.
Ah, grazie mille. La prendo come una frase fatta, perciň.
Ciao, FB
FB
"Enrico C" <enri...@spamcop.net> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:5kjwi6nl83wn$.dlg@news.lillathedog.net...
> Maybe the exact meaning depends on context.
>
> I found this in Swan #565.3
>
> "OK. that's it. I'm leaving. It was nice knowing you."
In che senso? Più tardi controllo il lemma sullo Swan.
Ciao, FB