I have a bad feeling that i may have a fight on my hands soon.
Just got a voice mail, after more then two weeks of my car sitting
down at Wasatch body shop, American Family insurance finally accepted
responsibility for the claim. That is the good news.
Bad news is they are calling it a total loss, which i can only assume
they are doing in order to pay me less then what the actual repair is
going to cost.
The quote from the shop was just over $4500, the loss department is
supposed to get back to me in a day or so with what their offer is,
and at this point i am scared to know. Knowing what i have invested in
the car, even $4500 would not come close to cover the cost of
replacing it.
I bought that car when i was 19. It was the first Porsche I ever
owned, and the first car i ever bought with my own money. I have a
lot of history with that car and would hate to lose it, especially
over something as stupid as getting rear ended at a stop sign
You are not in too bad a place actually. Since the Insurance Company has accepted responsibility for the claim, you are now just getting a value assigned for your car. The PCA Valuation committee can help you with a value for your car. I think this is your 914 isn't it?
After you come to an agreement on the value of the car, then you will get that check for the value of the car that is "totaled". You can now buy the car back from the Insurance Company for some small amount. I have heard of it being as little as $15.00! I don't know what is a typical amount, but it would be a small amount, whatever a salvage yard would pay for it. You will have a "branded title" on the car, but it is still your car and you can now fix it yourself, part it out, whatever.
----- Original Message ----- From: "James Morris" <wuzz...@hotmail.com>
To: "IRPCA" <irpca@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 3:19 PM
Subject: I have a real bad feeling....
> I have a bad feeling that i may have a fight on my hands soon.
> Just got a voice mail, after more then two weeks of my car sitting
> down at Wasatch body shop, American Family insurance finally accepted
> responsibility for the claim. That is the good news.
> Bad news is they are calling it a total loss, which i can only assume
> they are doing in order to pay me less then what the actual repair is
> going to cost.
> The quote from the shop was just over $4500, the loss department is
> supposed to get back to me in a day or so with what their offer is,
> and at this point i am scared to know. Knowing what i have invested in
> the car, even $4500 would not come close to cover the cost of
> replacing it.
> I bought that car when i was 19. It was the first Porsche I ever
> owned, and the first car i ever bought with my own money. I have a
> lot of history with that car and would hate to lose it, especially
> over something as stupid as getting rear ended at a stop sign
The sentimental value in compensable, but is a hard concept
to sell to an insurance company. You must prove what it is
worth to a serious buyer, not you. I had a 69 Volvo that
was worth at least $12k at the time (the world's only Volvo
hotrod. We called it the "Warmrod"), for which they offered
me $1500. I got the car repaired: $10,000.
The car is only a "total" when it's FMV is less than the
cost of repair. You need to show the insurance company what
the FMV is on YOUR car, not just a "typical" 19XX Porsche.
"Replacement value" is a different concept, and is contract
specific. My garage burned down a few years ago, and with
it 26 pair of skis going back to the 60's. FMV, $26.
Replacement value, $26,000,. I had replacement value
insurance (and my wife, I and all of our friends got new
skis).
Call me. I can help. In the meantime, carefully list what
you have put in to the car so that we can determine what it
is really worth. There is no meaningful "book" on an old
car. As you know, one 19XX Porsche is not the same as
another. Maintenance totals are irrelevant, but the level
of maintenance, meaning, the condition of the car, is
important. Extras, such as new wheels, stereo, supercharger
and Confederate flag painted on hood are compensable.
I am very busy. Please expect a response from me at my
earliest availability.
Carl R. Buckland, Attorney at Law
420 East South Temple, Suite 480
Salt Lake City, Utah 84111
801-531-6686
Fax 531-6690
buckl...@xmission.com
On Behalf Of James Morris
Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 3:19 PM
To: IRPCA
Subject: I have a real bad feeling....
I have a bad feeling that i may have a fight on my hands
soon.
Just got a voice mail, after more then two weeks of my car
sitting
down at Wasatch body shop, American Family insurance finally
accepted
responsibility for the claim. That is the good news.
Bad news is they are calling it a total loss, which i can
only assume
they are doing in order to pay me less then what the actual
repair is
going to cost.
The quote from the shop was just over $4500, the loss
department is
supposed to get back to me in a day or so with what their
offer is,
and at this point i am scared to know. Knowing what i have
invested in
the car, even $4500 would not come close to cover the cost
of
replacing it.
I bought that car when i was 19. It was the first Porsche I
ever
owned, and the first car i ever bought with my own money.
I have a
lot of history with that car and would hate to lose it,
especially
over something as stupid as getting rear ended at a stop
sign
I just read Darrell's response, which is excellent advice.
However, IMHO, leaving the FMV in the hands of the PCA
Valuation committee is like letting the fox tend the
chickens.
You need to be very proactive.
Carl R. Buckland, Attorney at Law
420 East South Temple, Suite 480
Salt Lake City, Utah 84111
801-531-6686
Fax 531-6690
buckl...@xmission.com
On Behalf Of Darrell Troester
Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 4:16 PM
To: James Morris; IRPCA@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: I have a real bad feeling....
You are not in too bad a place actually. Since the
Insurance Company has accepted responsibility for the claim, you are now just
getting a value assigned for your car. The PCA Valuation committee can help
you with a value for your car. I think this is your 914 isn't it?
After you come to an agreement on the value of the car, then
you will get that check for the value of the car that is "totaled". You
can now buy the car back from the Insurance Company for some small amount.
I have heard of it being as little as $15.00! I don't know what is a
typical amount, but it would be a small amount, whatever a salvage yard would pay
for it. You will have a "branded title" on the car, but it is still your car
and you can now fix it yourself, part it out, whatever.
Darrell
----- Original Message ----- From: "James Morris" <wuzz...@hotmail.com>
To: "IRPCA" <irpca@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 3:19 PM
Subject: I have a real bad feeling....
> I have a bad feeling that i may have a fight on my hands
soon.
> Just got a voice mail, after more then two weeks of my car
sitting
> down at Wasatch body shop, American Family insurance
finally accepted
> responsibility for the claim. That is the good news.
> Bad news is they are calling it a total loss, which i can
only assume
> they are doing in order to pay me less then what the
actual repair is
> going to cost.
> The quote from the shop was just over $4500, the loss
department is
> supposed to get back to me in a day or so with what their
offer is,
> and at this point i am scared to know. Knowing what i have
invested in
> the car, even $4500 would not come close to cover the cost
of
> replacing it.
> I bought that car when i was 19. It was the first Porsche
I ever
> owned, and the first car i ever bought with my own money.
I have a
> lot of history with that car and would hate to lose it,
especially
> over something as stupid as getting rear ended at a stop
sign
Carl is right, don't leave it to any one group. Get the info yourself and all the details you can. The PCA Valuation committee does give you some good info and ammunition to present to the Insurance company. If you have the opportunity to have an Attorney represent you, you are way ahead! The Attorney can make sure you don't forget anything! The Attorney would also know how to work the rules that apply. I have heard, but don't know for sure, that the way that FMV is established, in the beginning, is to look at sales of comparable cars in the market in the last 90 days. This will be quite the challenge for them with your car. If you gather the facts and the comparables, they are a lot more receptive when you ask for lots more than they are initially thinking! This is how another local guy got a decent settlement from an Insurance Company for a '74 914 2.0 that was "totaled" and they initially offered some low ball amount.
I would defer to Carl's experience as well - It is what he does for a living! :)
----- Original Message ----- From: "Carl Buckland" <buckl...@xmission.com>
To: "'Darrell Troester'" <dst...@comcast.net>; "'James Morris'"
<wuzz...@hotmail.com>; <IRPCA@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 11, 2009 9:44 AM
Subject: RE: I have a real bad feeling....
>I just read Darrell's response, which is excellent advice.
> However, IMHO, leaving the FMV in the hands of the PCA
> Valuation committee is like letting the fox tend the
> chickens.
> You need to be very proactive.
> Carl R. Buckland, Attorney at Law
> 420 East South Temple, Suite 480
> Salt Lake City, Utah 84111
> 801-531-6686
> Fax 531-6690
> buckl...@xmission.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: irpca@googlegroups.com [mailto:irpca@googlegroups.com]
> On Behalf Of Darrell Troester
> Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 4:16 PM
> To: James Morris; IRPCA@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: I have a real bad feeling....
> You are not in too bad a place actually. Since the
> Insurance Company has
> accepted responsibility for the claim, you are now just
> getting a value
> assigned for your car. The PCA Valuation committee can help
> you with a
> value for your car. I think this is your 914 isn't it?
> After you come to an agreement on the value of the car, then
> you will get
> that check for the value of the car that is "totaled". You
> can now buy the
> car back from the Insurance Company for some small amount.
> I have heard of
> it being as little as $15.00! I don't know what is a
> typical amount, but it
> would be a small amount, whatever a salvage yard would pay
> for it. You will
> have a "branded title" on the car, but it is still your car
> and you can now
> fix it yourself, part it out, whatever.
> Darrell
> ----- Original Message ----- > From: "James Morris" <wuzz...@hotmail.com>
> To: "IRPCA" <irpca@googlegroups.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 3:19 PM
> Subject: I have a real bad feeling....
>> I have a bad feeling that i may have a fight on my hands
> soon.
>> Just got a voice mail, after more then two weeks of my car
> sitting
>> down at Wasatch body shop, American Family insurance
> finally accepted
>> responsibility for the claim. That is the good news.
>> Bad news is they are calling it a total loss, which i can
> only assume
>> they are doing in order to pay me less then what the
> actual repair is
>> going to cost.
>> The quote from the shop was just over $4500, the loss
> department is
>> supposed to get back to me in a day or so with what their
> offer is,
>> and at this point i am scared to know. Knowing what i have
> invested in
>> the car, even $4500 would not come close to cover the cost
> of
>> replacing it.
>> I bought that car when i was 19. It was the first Porsche
> I ever
>> owned, and the first car i ever bought with my own money.
> I have a
>> lot of history with that car and would hate to lose it,
> especially
>> over something as stupid as getting rear ended at a stop
> sign
As far as the condition of the car, anyone that has seen it would say
it is not a show car by any means however as this was my dedicated
autocross car, appearance was secondary and I still have quite a bit
of money and even more time invested in it.
I think at one point or another i have either replaced or upgraded
just about everything on the car, i will do my best to list everything
i can think of off the top of my head.
The car is built on a 72 chassis (the latest year you can get before
they started adding weight to them) It is a California car still has
Cali plates. It was garaged the entire time i owned it there as well
as in Utah, so as far as 914 structural rust is was a really solid
tub. It currently has most of the carpet/interior removed for
autocross however i have it all in my garage.
Chassis:
-Fiberglass GT fender flares
-916 bumpers (front and rear)
-3 point roll bar with mount for fire extinguisher
-Halon fire extinguisher
-Metal center tunnel fuel lines
-911 style rear reflector (I believe NLA)
-Hood pins on rear trunk and engine lid
-Momo steering wheel and adapter
-Added head temp/oil temp/ and O2 gauges
-Optima battery
Motor and trans:
-converted to a fuel injected 73 2.0L and side shifter trans
-Motor rebuilt ~30,000 miles ago (i need to check the paperwork to be
exact)
-At the time I had the motor built I replaced EVERY fuel injection
component that was still available new.i need to check My receipts but
i remember all this being somewhere around $5k
-Terry cable clutch cable
-RES systems wiring harness (this is a very nice part and NLA)
Suspension:
-Bilstein shocks front and rear
-All suspension bushing front and rear replaced and upgraded to poly
-21mm adjustable front sway bar
-180# rear springs
-Lemforder 911 turbo tie rods
-16x8 inch wheels (unsure of the source, i have never been able to
find another set like them
More recently i converted the car to run with Megasquirt using the
existing d-jet components and upgraded a few other things
-Megasquirt brain
-Megasquirt relay board
-Pertronix ignitor
-advance locked distributor
-Mallory HI6-digital CD ignition
-Crane PS91 coil
-MSD fuel pump relocated to front trunk
-Innovate LC-1 Wideband O2 controller and wideband sensor
-Eurorace headers with muffler/megaphone JET-HOT coated ~$1000
I am not sure how much of these are considered maintenance/consumable
however these were all done in the last 500 miles as well,
-new clutch disk and pressure plate
-new brake rotors front and rear
-new brake pads front and rear
-new front wheel bearings
-Falken RT-615 215/45/16 front and rear
-Sweepco 201 gear oil
I have a feeling a may have forgot some little bits but off the top of
my head that is the bulk of the modifications to the car.
Another place to look is Excellence Magazine. Every month they do a "Market
Report" for used Porsches. November 2009 they did Mid-engine cars. They
break market values down by year, engine type and condition. It is an
excellent series (each month they do a different model) written by Bruce
Anderson. I think he also does individual valuations much like PCA does
(PCA may even use him...).
I have the November issue - you can have it if you'd like.
To give you an idea of the range, they list the market value of a 1970-71
1.7L in so-so condition at $8418, to a 1973-1974 2.0L in excellent at
$19263.
Any modifications are very difficult to quantify, as they are usually worth
a lot to the right buyer, but diminish the car's value to a collector...
That is where an individual market valuation might be warranted.
-----Original Message-----
From: irpca@googlegroups.com [mailto:irpca@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of
James Morris
Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 3:19 PM
To: IRPCA
Subject: I have a real bad feeling....
I have a bad feeling that i may have a fight on my hands soon.
Just got a voice mail, after more then two weeks of my car sitting
down at Wasatch body shop, American Family insurance finally accepted
responsibility for the claim. That is the good news.
Bad news is they are calling it a total loss, which i can only assume
they are doing in order to pay me less then what the actual repair is
going to cost.
The quote from the shop was just over $4500, the loss department is
supposed to get back to me in a day or so with what their offer is,
and at this point i am scared to know. Knowing what i have invested in
the car, even $4500 would not come close to cover the cost of
replacing it.
I bought that car when i was 19. It was the first Porsche I ever
owned, and the first car i ever bought with my own money. I have a
lot of history with that car and would hate to lose it, especially
over something as stupid as getting rear ended at a stop sign
Stu's link is the best yet! This gives a good idea of FMV.
If Excellence (which tends to be conservative; they don't
over rate) gives it a range of $8418 to $19262, you are, as
they say, in the driver's seat. Selling this to the Ins Co
is another story, but this is looking good.
Great Club effort. Lots of brains.
Carl R. Buckland, Attorney at Law
420 East South Temple, Suite 480
Salt Lake City, Utah 84111
801-531-6686
Fax 531-6690
buckl...@xmission.com
On Behalf Of Stu Hamilton
Sent: Wednesday, November 11, 2009 12:56 PM
To: 'James Morris'; 'IRPCA'
Subject: RE: I have a real bad feeling....
Carl and Darrell give great advice.
Another place to look is Excellence Magazine. Every month
they do a "Market
Report" for used Porsches. November 2009 they did
Mid-engine cars. They
break market values down by year, engine type and condition.
It is an
excellent series (each month they do a different model)
written by Bruce
Anderson. I think he also does individual valuations much
like PCA does
(PCA may even use him...).
I have the November issue - you can have it if you'd like.
To give you an idea of the range, they list the market value
of a 1970-71
1.7L in so-so condition at $8418, to a 1973-1974 2.0L in
excellent at
$19263.
Any modifications are very difficult to quantify, as they
are usually worth
a lot to the right buyer, but diminish the car's value to a
collector...
That is where an individual market valuation might be
warranted.
Stu Hamilton
-----Original Message-----
From: irpca@googlegroups.com [mailto:irpca@googlegroups.com]
On Behalf Of
James Morris
Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 3:19 PM
To: IRPCA
Subject: I have a real bad feeling....
I have a bad feeling that i may have a fight on my hands
soon.
Just got a voice mail, after more then two weeks of my car
sitting
down at Wasatch body shop, American Family insurance finally
accepted
responsibility for the claim. That is the good news.
Bad news is they are calling it a total loss, which i can
only assume
they are doing in order to pay me less then what the actual
repair is
going to cost.
The quote from the shop was just over $4500, the loss
department is
supposed to get back to me in a day or so with what their
offer is,
and at this point i am scared to know. Knowing what i have
invested in
the car, even $4500 would not come close to cover the cost
of
replacing it.
I bought that car when i was 19. It was the first Porsche I
ever
owned, and the first car i ever bought with my own money.
I have a
lot of history with that car and would hate to lose it,
especially
over something as stupid as getting rear ended at a stop
sign
One other thing you may want to consider is the potential for winning
the battle with your insurance company but ultimately loosing the war.
I had a similar experience with State Farm a number of years ago with
a 914 (small world) that was damaged when I hit 2 deer. They planned
on totalling the car and settling for less that I believed the car was
worth. I fought the good fight, they fixed the car and then proceeded
to kill me with huge premium jumps. I'm not sure how the insurance
world works today on contested issues but it surprised me at the time
so there you go.
On Nov 10, 3:19 pm, James Morris <wuzz...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> I have a bad feeling that i may have a fight on my hands soon.
> Just got a voice mail, after more then two weeks of my car sitting
> down at Wasatch body shop, American Family insurance finally accepted
> responsibility for the claim. That is the good news.
> Bad news is they are calling it a total loss, which i can only assume
> they are doing in order to pay me less then what the actual repair is
> going to cost.
> The quote from the shop was just over $4500, the loss department is
> supposed to get back to me in a day or so with what their offer is,
> and at this point i am scared to know. Knowing what i have invested in
> the car, even $4500 would not come close to cover the cost of
> replacing it.
> I bought that car when i was 19. It was the first Porsche I ever
> owned, and the first car i ever bought with my own money. I have a
> lot of history with that car and would hate to lose it, especially
> over something as stupid as getting rear ended at a stop sign
I've had experience recently with premium jumps. It always works against the insured. My son's nearly new car was T-boned on the driver's side by a woman who ran a red light. There were witnesses. Her company fought it and it went to "subrogation." Eventually they admitted her being at fault and paid up in full. In the mean time, to get my son back on the road, I paid our company's deductible and had my insurance cover the very extensive (car almost totalled, but thanks to today's safety systems son unhurt) repairs.
When it was all done, I got my deductible back (The woman's company paid all.), and THEN my company, perhaps to cover their costs in the arbitration, raised my insurance premium. Of course, I don't do business with them anymore. They had intended to make thousands of dollars from the victim of a not-at-fault accident.
It's time to either pass laws forcing insurance companies to disclose their actuarial data and profit basis, or do away with mandatory insurance requirements. We're all being raped every day by insurance firms.
----- Original Message ----- From: "harry" <a...@companionsystems.com> To: "IRPCA" <irpca@googlegroups.com> Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2009 2:42:50 PM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain Subject: Re: I have a real bad feeling....
One other thing you may want to consider is the potential for winning the battle with your insurance company but ultimately loosing the war. I had a similar experience with State Farm a number of years ago with a 914 (small world) that was damaged when I hit 2 deer. They planned on totalling the car and settling for less that I believed the car was worth. I fought the good fight, they fixed the car and then proceeded to kill me with huge premium jumps. I'm not sure how the insurance world works today on contested issues but it surprised me at the time so there you go.
On Nov 10, 3:19 pm, James Morris <wuzz...@hotmail.com> wrote: > I have a bad feeling that i may have a fight on my hands soon.
> Just got a voice mail, after more then two weeks of my car sitting > down at Wasatch body shop, American Family insurance finally accepted > responsibility for the claim. That is the good news.
> Bad news is they are calling it a total loss, which i can only assume > they are doing in order to pay me less then what the actual repair is > going to cost.
> The quote from the shop was just over $4500, the loss department is > supposed to get back to me in a day or so with what their offer is, > and at this point i am scared to know. Knowing what i have invested in > the car, even $4500 would not come close to cover the cost of > replacing it.
> I bought that car when i was 19. It was the first Porsche I ever > owned, and the first car i ever bought with my own money. I have a > lot of history with that car and would hate to lose it, especially > over something as stupid as getting rear ended at a stop sign
-- You are subscribed to Intermountain Region Porsche Club of America at Google Groups and have requested messages to be sent via email. To change your options or to visit the message board follow this link: http://groups.google.com/group/IRPCA/
|
