Last night's member meeting unanimously passed the official vote to
disburse the money from our bank account to the laser cutter company.

I am now handing off the process to Roger Slykhouse, and our friends
at Sector67, to place the order for two laser cutters: one for us, and
one for Sector67 in Madison, Wisconsin. Theirs was already fully
funded. Once the order is placed, we can expect delivery before the
end of 2012. A local business will provide us a forklift to get it off
the truck.

Now is a great time to reiterate my gratitude to the team involved in
the laser cutter project. Kristine Devine was very gracious toward my
requests for confirmation of each donation. It required a tremendous
amount of work above and beyond what should be required of a
treasurer. f00f stepped up to assist with some of those confirmations
also. Roger Slykhouse was on the other side of the process, as the
shopper and the money spender, due to his research of the available
products and shipping regulations. I would also like to thank Nate
Bezanson for his advice and consultation during that research.

And finally I would like to express how awesome the forty-two donors
are, by reminding you of the magnitude of what you have accomplished.
I don't mean just the technical specs-- doubled wattage, faster
gantry, auto-focusing, deeper cuts, or easier and more powerful
software. No, I mean this will be a community resource for a price
anyone can afford. We'll teach classes to make its availability as
broad as possible. It will be within the reach of anyone to fabricate
components for countless crafts and disciplines, or whole projects
using just this tool. It is a gateway into the rest of the world of
making things.

I've said the laser cutter was a flagship, and that is a very
appropriate term. A flagship draws attention all over the place.
Consider the little laser-cut runes and name tags and business card
holders sitting on my co-workers' desks right now, or the book stands
and figurines in the homes of my family and friends. After they
received these things and realized the usefulness and fascination of
making custom items, some of them toured our space. It will be like
traveling around with an i3Detroit flag to attract more people to join
or visit our community, to enrich their lives as they will enrich
ours.

-Eppcott

Any concrete plans for classes to actually run the thing?  Curious minds
want to know...

Or, he would've said something like that, if he was here to see the
state of things.

Anyway, yes there are lots of people barely able to contain
themselves, chomping at the bit to get the machine aligned and
configured, make sure the safety interlocks are operative, get the
software going and figure out a straightforward toolchain, and begin
teaching a bunch of classes. But seeing as how we don't even have a
ship date, much less an arrival estimate, that eagerness is fruitless
and premature. Sit tight. If you see the laser *actually sitting
there* for more than a week and there's no concrete progress towards
said classes, please, ask again!

-Nathaniel-

On Sep 6, 10:16 pm, "Dave A." <dalsquar...@gmail.com> wrote:

"Will there be classes?" Yes.

"Who will organize and teach classes?" I can tell you that I, for one,
definitely want to.

"Will the classes cost money?" I can see putting out a tip jar. I
would prefer not to deny access to this community resource based on
money-- I myself am usually shut out by such practices. I want
underprivileged urchins from undeveloped nations to be able to laser
cut the handles for their hobo bindles for free on this machine.
Provided they wash their hands first.

"How will you know it's time to teach classes?"
1. Align and configure the machine.
2. Confirm the safety interlocks work.
3. Determine the file formats and software that we recommend.

"How long will that take?" This is more of a Drake Equation than an
answer. I have laser-cut on a fairly regular basis for what seems to
me a long time now. However, each machine will have some unique
specifics of its operation-- first there is the small matter of
discovering those specifics to begin with. I speculate that the manual
is either non-extant or written in Chinese. Therefore, there are
several of us who are likely to be in the space a lot, either
tinkering with it or watching someone else do so. Perhaps this crowd,
that gathers daily to hover over the laser cutter, will feel like an
informal class, but one in which we learn through hands-on scientific
experimentation.

-Eppcott

We previously asked for $10 per hour of actual cutting time to fund
maintenance, including eventual replacement of the tube.  If we do not
recover the cost this way, how will we pay for replacement parts in the
future?

$10/hr worked out to pretty exactly break even on expected costs for
consumables like the laser tube. Given that most projects, even big ones
can easily be cut in under 20 min based on prior experience, you can cut
your part for just over the cost of a couple of taco bell tacos. That's an
insanely good deal.

I'm trying to find the thread where someone discussed ending the
$10-per-hour cost for laser cutting. Can you direct me to it? That's a
discussion I want to get in on. I think it was a good idea and should
remain in place. What were the arguments against it?

-Eppcott

I don't recall if there is one.  I was just going by your note.  It seems
to propose free access.

"Give away the razor for free and sell the blades." Training is the
razor. Nobody benefits from it directly-- rather, they benefit from
making their project. So if they're not even to the point of making
their project yet, they're thinking about a value proposition: "Do I
want to commit financially up front? Will it be too complicated or a
pain? Do I really want to make this project?" And so on. The class
should calm these anxieties, not introduce another one. It would be
like asking them to buy a novel when they haven't read the first
chapter as a free sample.

The actual time you should pay is when you are alone, on the honor
system. Nobody is there with his hand out. We want people's thoughts
to be on benefits, not social anxiety. "This is so awesome, I'll
support it".

-Eppcott

What about "I want underprivileged urchins from undeveloped nations to be
able to laser cut the handles for their hobo bindles for free on this
machine."  Do you envision classes for kids where we would have some things
ready to go, or generic classes where we would teach people how to use it
and then let them design something and cut it for free?  Not trying to pick
apart your post, just trying to understand where we're going with this.

I would also say that if there someone has a "starving hacker"
situation, I can probably work something out, such that the
appropriate money ends up in the collection box. Without going into
more detail right now, I have gotten reasonably good at sourcing that
kind of thing. It frustrates me to see interesting projects stall due
to a temporary financial traffic jam.

Of course the only person whose time I am volunteering for free is my
own. If somebody else wants to charge to teach, no problem. But it's
pretty clear the only reason we talk about payment is that we want to
make sure everything functions and can be perpetuated. I suggest that
it can be.

-Eppcott

However, time on the machine itself is *always* fixed-fee, that's a
consumable cost and just because someone's feeling fuzzy doesn't mean
the tube magically lasts longer when they use it. Even class time on
the machine has to result in $10/hr into the moneybox, which is
usually trivial to take out of the pile of voluntary contributions,
but it has to happen, every time. It's astonishingly affordable, but
that doesn't mean it can be ignored, ever.

I'll take the rest of this over to the members-only group, I'm sure
the 345 people on -public, most of whom never touched the old laser,
don't need the details.

-Nathaniel-

If you get into doing laser classes/events for kids...or even adults for
that matter, I strongly recommend limiting letting them "design" something
to get cut/etched. I've done these events and people get out of hand
quickly and complex designs take up a lot of time to configure. I suggest a
template that let's them enter custom text, with a set font. Otherwise,
time will get away from you.
I plan on helping with the planning of any classes or events, since I have
experience with it I can offer advice.
On Sep 7, 2012 11:31 AM, "Nathaniel Bezanson" <mys...@telcodata.us> wrote:

The owner of it sold it a few months ago.

-eric
On Sep 7, 2012 9:54 PM, "David McMillan" <skyef...@skyefire.org> wrote:

Don't forget that in addition to the laser, you need to also
reserve a few dollars more, for a FEW incidentals.  
I've included a checklist below.

Keith Mc.

Needed extra items, for laser installation
-- Additional wiring, conduit, boxes, and connectors, for safe installation.
-- the autostart negative pressure ventilation system
(which turns on whenever laser is on, see breakdown below) and
-- a dedicated fresh Halon fire extinguisher, to locate right next to the laser.

You may also want to think about how you will deal with
some self-fabbed, freebie, donated, or shared items, like:
-- needed cleaning supplies, for the laser optics (blowoff can, solvent, lens cloth, etc.)
(Do NOT share cleaning supplies that touch the optics, with other work areas!)
-- the common "alignment tool(s)" needed to keep things in tune
(if it didn't come with one, it is often easier to simply get a copy
of the "magic allen wrench", and keep it there with the machine...)
-- a small storage unit
(for tools, manuals, and maybe a touch of fresh material storage.
A donated bedroom dresser or a tall multi-drawer file cabinet works great!)
-- A "procedures" binder (eg 3-ring) for all docs and instructions.
-- an adjacent work table, for the associated DTP computer for it.
-- a "scraps bin", for leftovers from laser sessions that people can
rummage through, to use for small projects.  (Many laser projects
are pretty SMALL, and providing a place for scrap sharing saves everyone ##.)
-- a "materials test jig" - basically a simple heatable piece of wire
stuck into a wooden handle and a micro torch, for testing unknown
plastics before use in the laser.  (Heat up a thin wire on a handle
with the torch and touch it to the plastic to sample it.  Now hit
the wire with the torch again.  If the sampled burn-off glows
blue-green, do NOT use it in the laser, because it contains chlorine... :-)
-- Warning signs, such as "Don't use chlorine/flourine plastics in
this machine!", "How to sample unknown plastics", etc...

For the autovent fan system, you'll need:
-- An external motor duct fan
(like an inline, squirrel cage style - you don't want to expose the
motor to the vapors, esp if someone screws up and uses a
chlorinated or fluorinated plastic)
- metal duct work, to an exterior exit point
- a through-wall vent (it's not safe to piggyback on another vent)
- possibly a vertical outdoor vent chimney with a cap to raise
up the exit point away from people, if the external vent must
exit the wall too close to a sidewalk or other walk-by path.
- an autostart circuit, that turns on the fan whenever the laser
system is powered up.  

A CO2 or Halon style fire extinguisher should be located within reach
adjacent to the laser.  CO2 and Halon are both non-contaminating
extinguishers, but IMHO Halon is better, as it won't chill the optics.
for dealing with any minor paper and wood that ignites from the
laser before it has the chance to become a MAJOR fire, or
damage the laser system. **DO NOT** post a Dry Chem extinguisher!

These few items should complete your laser installation.
But SOME of them (esp the vent and the halon extinguisher...).
may require the input of a FEW additional dollars.

So you might as well plan for them NOW

Did I miss anything?

- Keith Mc.

Safety interlock on the lid.
Concealed (to avoid glare) lighting under the lid.

We have the existing "plumbing" that was used for venting the previous
laser.  The other stuff is good input.

As a note we have both a old (but functioning CO2) yhrt was frequently kept
at the laser. We also have a extra halon we can hang next to it. Eg use the
co2 if it will do, crack out the halon if you need it.
On Oct 7, 2012 11:41 AM, "Keith Mc" <a...@provide.net> wrote: