Hurdy Gurdy video - a response
3 views
Skip to first unread message
bighatlady
Dec 10, 2009, 12:59:24 PM12/10/09
to hurdygurdy
Wow. I didn't expect such a firestorm. To answer some people's
questions. The Hurdy-gurdy is not really cranked as hard as it looks
- most of the flailing is for comic affect -
I'm sorry you couldn't hear the HG, the video was filmed from the side
and the acoustics of the stage tend to project directly out.
Finally, I do apologize for offending some people with the
inauthentic sounds of my amateur band. We play renaissance and
medieval music largely for people who are not educated in music.
Amazingly, they don't care about the history or sanctity of a
particular piece - they just want to laugh and/ or clap along. I'm
sure audiences 500 years ago were very different in their sensibilties
- clapping, having been invented in the rock and roll age.
Unless we provide lively and raucous entertainment, the faire audience
tends to wander away pretty quickly and pay us nothing. Again, I'm
sure this is purely a modern problem. Lastly, the squawking,
imbalance of instruments is an embarrassing issue. Playing six shows
a day outside in rapid succession can lead to some slippage in tuning
and the lack of amplfication at that stage did unbalance the harmony
between the HG and rauschpfeife. Since authentic medieval and
renaissance music was always played inside in temperature controlled
environment on instruments that were perfectly balanced and
maintained, these "brown" notes as we like to call them never
actually happened in period. Anyone who doubts that should listen to
a CD of someone playing real medieval or renaissance music - there's
all the proof you need.
If anyone is curious to actually hear the HG - here's another video
of us at a faire from a previous year. Again, I have to warn you -
it's a silly corruption of a medieval song - completely inauthentic
because adding or changing lyrics was never done until the invention
of copyright law. Watch it if you can stand it. If you can't find
it, google youtube, diabolis in musica raven's ballade. Thanks all!
- Jocelyn
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O34l7BJPdBs
questions. The Hurdy-gurdy is not really cranked as hard as it looks
- most of the flailing is for comic affect -
I'm sorry you couldn't hear the HG, the video was filmed from the side
and the acoustics of the stage tend to project directly out.
Finally, I do apologize for offending some people with the
inauthentic sounds of my amateur band. We play renaissance and
medieval music largely for people who are not educated in music.
Amazingly, they don't care about the history or sanctity of a
particular piece - they just want to laugh and/ or clap along. I'm
sure audiences 500 years ago were very different in their sensibilties
- clapping, having been invented in the rock and roll age.
Unless we provide lively and raucous entertainment, the faire audience
tends to wander away pretty quickly and pay us nothing. Again, I'm
sure this is purely a modern problem. Lastly, the squawking,
imbalance of instruments is an embarrassing issue. Playing six shows
a day outside in rapid succession can lead to some slippage in tuning
and the lack of amplfication at that stage did unbalance the harmony
between the HG and rauschpfeife. Since authentic medieval and
renaissance music was always played inside in temperature controlled
environment on instruments that were perfectly balanced and
maintained, these "brown" notes as we like to call them never
actually happened in period. Anyone who doubts that should listen to
a CD of someone playing real medieval or renaissance music - there's
all the proof you need.
If anyone is curious to actually hear the HG - here's another video
of us at a faire from a previous year. Again, I have to warn you -
it's a silly corruption of a medieval song - completely inauthentic
because adding or changing lyrics was never done until the invention
of copyright law. Watch it if you can stand it. If you can't find
it, google youtube, diabolis in musica raven's ballade. Thanks all!
- Jocelyn
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O34l7BJPdBs
20...@simonwascher.info
Dec 10, 2009, 1:24:11 PM12/10/09
to hurdy...@googlegroups.com
Hello once more,
there is only one problem I sometimes see with the music on the medieval fairs. Usually the audience does not get the information that what they are presented with is a creative anachronism, that the performances are rather part the modern popular culture than a representation of the past.
As this audience are "people who are not educated in music" they cannot know the difference. They might go home beliving that this is how music was back then, as it was presented to them by event organizers pretending exactly this.
Cheers,
Simon
there is only one problem I sometimes see with the music on the medieval fairs. Usually the audience does not get the information that what they are presented with is a creative anachronism, that the performances are rather part the modern popular culture than a representation of the past.
As this audience are "people who are not educated in music" they cannot know the difference. They might go home beliving that this is how music was back then, as it was presented to them by event organizers pretending exactly this.
Cheers,
Simon
Cali and Alden Hackmann
Dec 10, 2009, 2:02:25 PM12/10/09
to hurdy...@googlegroups.com
Hey, you all -
I'm going to put on my moderator's hat for a moment and remind you all:
spirited discussion is fine. Insults are not. When having a spirited
discussion, always consider the feelings of the person you are replying to.
There's a broad spectrum of "authenticity" out there, and we each fall
somewhere along it. That's not a value judgement, just a statement.
At the end of the day, we do what we do because we love the music. Everything
else should come second. How we express that love varies from person to
person.
Any questions, please ask me off the list.
Alden the Listmaster
Cali and Alden Hackmann
Olympic Musical Instruments - hurdy-gurdies
A & C Embroidery - boutique embroidery
Bois de Mallorne - audio production and live sound
stained glass, laser art
"We have done the impossible, and that makes us mighty." - Mal Reynolds
Felicia Dale
Dec 10, 2009, 2:16:43 PM12/10/09
to hurdy...@googlegroups.com
Hi, all-
My experience in playing faires has been that the majority of folks
who attend them as patrons (paying customers) have little to no
interest in any kind of education whatsoever. They want turkey legs,
beer, cleavage and jousting. And shopping- lots and lots of
shopping. Music is part of the ambiance, the back ground, the
buildings and the costumes. The more cleavage a costume shows the
better and the same goes for the music. The louder, sillier and more
extravagant the music the more likely you are to draw a crowd, sell
some cds and make tips. If you are even remotely "authentic" people
will listen, at most, for a moment or two and then wander on. Ren
faires are not even a little bit about education but about
entertainment. That is why a group of shirtless, kilted men playing
Highland pipes and drums playing both traditional tunes and rock song
covers will draw a huge crowd where an authentic and correctly
presented group of excellent musicians will pull in maybe two or
three people.
I'm not saying it's right or good or anything like that, it's just
what ren faires are. I think most of the people who go there have an
idea that this is a fairy-land version of the Renaissance or Medieval
times and again, have no intention of learning anything. They don't
care a whit about what it was actually like "back in the day," they
just want to be distracted and entertained with sword fights,
cleavage, horses, shiny things and food.
On the other hand, there are folks who really get into it and are all
about the correct details and love every minute of the real stuff and
support it enthusiastically. It's just that there aren't as many of
them as of the other kind. These folks make a lot of effort to dress
correctly and even attempt to speak correctly (sometimes with less
success than others but points for trying) and they are the back bone
of the ren faires.
Ren faires are only about making money and anything that gets folks
in the gate and ready to part with their dough is what is going to
fly. Personally, I think Medieval paintball booths are heinous but
if it helps support the recorder consort tootling in that little
booth down the lane then whatever.
William and I have played faires on occasion and boy we are not even
close to authentic. We are loud and colorful and try to make people
sing along and laugh- but we're only moderately successful at it. I
blame my lack of cleavage. :) Of course, if there were five of us
with drums and shawms and could whirl around and be crazy that would
really help. We do make every attempt to sing songs and play tunes
that would have been appropriate for the time- in other words, no
rock song covers. We do our own modern interpretation of them
because we are not into the music for it's original shape and sound
but for what we can do with it. We tell people this when we talk
about our cds or the gurdy. I always point out that it's not a
correct instrument for the time, that it's based on an 18 cent.
instrument and go here on the internet for more information. I
figure anything that gets people interested in music other than the
general schlock that's on the airwaves is a good thing. My favorite
memories of interacting with patrons about the gurdy was after Jimmy
Page toured with Nigel Eaton (it was Nigel Eaton, wasn't it?) and I
had pierced, mohawked and/or gothed-out punk boys in their teens come
up to me and say, "I know what that is, it's a hurdy gurdy. They're
cool!" ANYTHING that gets boys of that age interested in music out
of the ordinary is a good thing.
Nice act, Jocelyn! I hope I get to hear you live someday.
Felicia.
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "hurdygurdy" group.
> To post to this group, send email to hurdy...@googlegroups.com
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> hurdygurdy+...@googlegroups.com
> For more options, visit this group at
> http://groups.google.com/group/hurdygurdy
>
> The rules of posting, courtesy, and other list information may be
> found at http://hurdygurdy.com/mailinglist/index.htm. To reduce
> spam, posts from new subscribers are held pending approval by the
> webmaster.
My experience in playing faires has been that the majority of folks
who attend them as patrons (paying customers) have little to no
interest in any kind of education whatsoever. They want turkey legs,
beer, cleavage and jousting. And shopping- lots and lots of
shopping. Music is part of the ambiance, the back ground, the
buildings and the costumes. The more cleavage a costume shows the
better and the same goes for the music. The louder, sillier and more
extravagant the music the more likely you are to draw a crowd, sell
some cds and make tips. If you are even remotely "authentic" people
will listen, at most, for a moment or two and then wander on. Ren
faires are not even a little bit about education but about
entertainment. That is why a group of shirtless, kilted men playing
Highland pipes and drums playing both traditional tunes and rock song
covers will draw a huge crowd where an authentic and correctly
presented group of excellent musicians will pull in maybe two or
three people.
I'm not saying it's right or good or anything like that, it's just
what ren faires are. I think most of the people who go there have an
idea that this is a fairy-land version of the Renaissance or Medieval
times and again, have no intention of learning anything. They don't
care a whit about what it was actually like "back in the day," they
just want to be distracted and entertained with sword fights,
cleavage, horses, shiny things and food.
On the other hand, there are folks who really get into it and are all
about the correct details and love every minute of the real stuff and
support it enthusiastically. It's just that there aren't as many of
them as of the other kind. These folks make a lot of effort to dress
correctly and even attempt to speak correctly (sometimes with less
success than others but points for trying) and they are the back bone
of the ren faires.
Ren faires are only about making money and anything that gets folks
in the gate and ready to part with their dough is what is going to
fly. Personally, I think Medieval paintball booths are heinous but
if it helps support the recorder consort tootling in that little
booth down the lane then whatever.
William and I have played faires on occasion and boy we are not even
close to authentic. We are loud and colorful and try to make people
sing along and laugh- but we're only moderately successful at it. I
blame my lack of cleavage. :) Of course, if there were five of us
with drums and shawms and could whirl around and be crazy that would
really help. We do make every attempt to sing songs and play tunes
that would have been appropriate for the time- in other words, no
rock song covers. We do our own modern interpretation of them
because we are not into the music for it's original shape and sound
but for what we can do with it. We tell people this when we talk
about our cds or the gurdy. I always point out that it's not a
correct instrument for the time, that it's based on an 18 cent.
instrument and go here on the internet for more information. I
figure anything that gets people interested in music other than the
general schlock that's on the airwaves is a good thing. My favorite
memories of interacting with patrons about the gurdy was after Jimmy
Page toured with Nigel Eaton (it was Nigel Eaton, wasn't it?) and I
had pierced, mohawked and/or gothed-out punk boys in their teens come
up to me and say, "I know what that is, it's a hurdy gurdy. They're
cool!" ANYTHING that gets boys of that age interested in music out
of the ordinary is a good thing.
Nice act, Jocelyn! I hope I get to hear you live someday.
Felicia.
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "hurdygurdy" group.
> To post to this group, send email to hurdy...@googlegroups.com
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> hurdygurdy+...@googlegroups.com
> For more options, visit this group at
> http://groups.google.com/group/hurdygurdy
>
> The rules of posting, courtesy, and other list information may be
> found at http://hurdygurdy.com/mailinglist/index.htm. To reduce
> spam, posts from new subscribers are held pending approval by the
> webmaster.
Kevin Hughes
Dec 10, 2009, 2:38:57 PM12/10/09
to hurdy...@googlegroups.com
My experience with playing at ren faires is similar to what others have said. People are there mostly for entertainment not education. I played bagpipes with a bagpipe\rauchpfeife\drum group for a couple of years. In one our sets 3 of 5 tunes had a 'musical quote' of a rock song somewhere in the tune, and the audiences seemed to love it.
cheers,
Kevin
cheers,
Kevin
Get gifts for them and cashback for you. Try Bing now.
Augusto de Ornellas Abreu
Dec 10, 2009, 2:42:07 PM12/10/09
to hurdy...@googlegroups.com
I second everything Felicia said
I play on the local equivalent of a ren fair and they are the same anywhere in the world...
Augusto
Brazil
james kruse
Dec 10, 2009, 2:26:30 PM12/10/09
to hurdy...@googlegroups.com
Does that include self-deprication?
|
|
|
|
Augusto de Ornellas Abreu
Dec 10, 2009, 2:49:35 PM12/10/09
to hurdy...@googlegroups.com
And that was an amazing version of this great ballad!
I particularly love lady Jocelyn's "intervention" in the end!
LOL
Augusto
Brazil
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
Groups "hurdygurdy" group.
To post to this group, send email to hurdy...@googlegroups.com
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
Marsbar
Dec 10, 2009, 5:19:16 PM12/10/09
to hurdy...@googlegroups.com
Great performance. Just needs a little more cleavage as Felicia suggests,
and maybe that monk could kilt up his robe so us "ladies" can see his knees.
Then it would be perfect <g>.
Fi
and maybe that monk could kilt up his robe so us "ladies" can see his knees.
Then it would be perfect <g>.
Fi
Hobgo...@aol.com
Dec 10, 2009, 6:59:55 PM12/10/09
to hurdy...@googlegroups.com
Omigod, that video is hilarious!!!! What a wonderful idea!
Wow,
Alice
Reply all
Reply to author
Forward
0 new messages