Occult theories about Francis Bacon
art
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
<<A number of writers, some of whom were connected with Theosophy,
have claimed that Francis Bacon (22 January 1561 – 9 April 1626), the
English philosopher, statesman, scientist, and author, was a member of
secret societies; a smaller number claim that he was an Ascended
Master and was reincarnated.
Francis Bacon often gathered with the men at Gray's Inn to discuss
politics and philosophy, and to try out various theatrical scenes that
he admitted writing. Bacon's alleged connection to the Rosicrucians
and the Freemasons has been widely discussed by authors and scholars
in many books. However others, including Daphne du Maurier (in her
biography of Bacon), have argued there is no substantive evidence to
support claims of involvement with the Rosicrucians. Historian Dame
Frances Yates does not make the claim that Bacon was a Rosicrucian,
but presents evidence that he was nevertheless involved in some of the
more closed intellectual movements of his day. She argues that Bacon's
movement for the advancement of learning was closely connected with
the German Rosicrucian movement, while Bacon's The New Atlantis
portrays a land ruled by Rosicrucians. He apparently saw his own
movement for the advancement of learning to be in conformity with
Rosicrucian ideals.
In 1618 Francis Bacon decided to secure a lease for York House. This
had been his boyhood home in London next to the Queen's York Place
before the Bacon family had moved to Gorhambury in the countryside.
After Lord Egerton (Lord Keeper of the Great Seal of England) died, it
became available for Bacon to lease. During the next four years this
mansion on the Strand (so large that it had 40 fireplaces) served as
the home for Francis and Alice Bacon. Over the next four years Bacon
would host banquets at York House that were attended by the leading
men of the time, including poets, scholars, authors, scientists,
lawyers, diplomats, and foreign dignitaries. Within the banquet hall,
Francis gathered the greatest leaders in literature, art, law,
education, and social reform. On 22 January 1621 in honour of Sir
Francis Bacon's sixtieth birthday, a select group of men assembled in
the large banquet hall in York House without fanfare for what has been
described as a Masonic banquet. This banquet was to pay tribute to Sir
Francis Bacon. Only those of the Rosicrosse (Rosicrucians) and the
Masons who were already aware of Bacon's leadership role were invited.
The tables were T-tables with gleaming white drapery, silver, and
decorations of flowers. The poet Ben Jonson, a long-time friend of
Bacon, gave a Masonic ode to Bacon that day.
There was a depth of love by a large body of men toward Bacon, similar
to some degree in the manner that disciples love a Master. This is
especially true when taking into account his membership (and some say
leadership) of secret societies such as the Rosicrucians and
Freemasons. In the inner esoteric membership, which included Francis
Bacon, vows of celibacy for spiritual reasons were encouraged.
Faked death theory
Various authors have written that there were indications that Francis
Bacon had gone into debt while secretly funding the publishing of
materials for the Freemasons, Rosicrucians, "Spear-Shakers", "Knights
of the Helmet", as well as publishing, with the assistance of Ben
Jonson, a selection of the plays that they believe he had written
under the pen name of "Shake-Speare" in a "First Folio" in 1623.
Furthermore, they allege that Bacon faked his own death, crossed the
English Channel, and secretly traveled in disguise after 1626 through
France, Germany, Poland, Hungary, and other areas utilizing the secret
network of Freemasons and Rosicrucians that he was associated with. It
is alleged that he continued to write under pseudonyms, as he had done
before 1626, continuing to write as late as 1670 (using the pseudonym
"Comte De Gabalis"). Elinor Von Le Coq, wife of Professor Von Le Coq
in Berlin, stated that she had found evidence in the German Archives
that Francis Bacon stayed after 1626 with the family of Johannes
Valentinus Andreae in Germany.
Beginning early in the 20th century in the United States, a number of
Ascended Master Teachings organizations began making the claim that
Francis Bacon had never died. They believed that soon after completing
the "Shake-Speare" plays, he had feigned his own death on Easter
Sunday 1626 and then travelled extensively outside of England,
eventually attaining his physical Ascension to another plane on May 1,
1684 in the region of the Carpathian Mountains. Their belief is that
Bacon took on the name "Saint Germain" as an Ascended Master.>>
nordicskiv2
<274289aa-78cb-460e...@j8g2000yqd.googlegroups.com>,
art <acne...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
> Occult theories about Francis Bacon
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
"This article is an orphan, as few or no other articles link to
it."
No surprise there!
> <<A number of writers, some of whom were connected with Theosophy,
Following the link to Theosophy:
"Blavatsky [one of the founders of Theosophy] suggested that most
of present day humanity belongs to the fifth rootrace, the
Aryans[8], which originally developed on Atlantis,.[9] It was
her belief that the older races will eventually die out, as the
fifth rootrace in time will be replaced by the more advanced
peoples of the sixth root race which is set to develop on the
reemerging Lemurian continent.[10]"
Evidently geology was not among Mme. Blavatsky's areas of expertise.
But if you believe this, Art, then there's a book that I think that
you would find extremely congenial -- it's by a guy named Velikovsky.
> have claimed that Francis Bacon (22 January 1561 – 9 April 1626), the
> English philosopher, statesman, scientist, and author, was a member of
> secret societies; a smaller number claim that he was an Ascended
> Master and was reincarnated.
Really?! Are you among those who believe that he was reincarnated,
Art? If so, there's a guy named Michael Martin (the surname is an
anagram of "I'm Art N."!) whom you should meet -- you would be well
suited to be one of his disciples, Art.
> Francis Bacon often gathered with the men at Gray's Inn to discuss
> politics and philosophy, and to try out various theatrical scenes that
> he admitted writing.
Huh?
> Bacon's alleged connection to the Rosicrucians
> and the Freemasons has been widely discussed by authors and scholars
> in many books.
"...has been widely discussed by authors and scholars..."? *Which"
"authors and scholars"? Are you trying to emulate Elizabeth's style,
Art?
> However others, including Daphne du Maurier (in her
> biography of Bacon), have argued there is no substantive evidence to
> support claims of involvement with the Rosicrucians.
"No substantive evidence" is, if anything, an understatement.
> Historian Dame
> Frances Yates does not make the claim that Bacon was a Rosicrucian,
> but presents evidence that he was nevertheless involved in some of the
> more closed intellectual movements of his day. She argues that Bacon's
> movement for the advancement of learning was closely connected with
> the German Rosicrucian movement, while Bacon's The New Atlantis
> portrays a land ruled by Rosicrucians. He apparently saw his own
> movement for the advancement of learning to be in conformity with
> Rosicrucian ideals.
>
> In 1618 Francis Bacon decided to secure a lease for York House. This
> had been his boyhood home in London next to the Queen's York Place
> before the Bacon family had moved to Gorhambury in the countryside.
> After Lord Egerton (Lord Keeper of the Great Seal of England) died, it
> became available for Bacon to lease. During the next four years this
> mansion on the Strand (so large that it had 40 fireplaces) served as
> the home for Francis and Alice Bacon. Over the next four years Bacon
> would host banquets at York House that were attended by the leading
> men of the time, including poets, scholars, authors, scientists,
> lawyers, diplomats, and foreign dignitaries. Within the banquet hall,
> Francis gathered the greatest leaders in literature, art, law,
> education, and social reform. On 22 January 1621 in honour of Sir
> Francis Bacon's sixtieth birthday, a select group of men assembled in
> the large banquet hall in York House without fanfare for what has been
> described
"...has been described..."? By *whom*? Source? Are you trying to
emulate Elizabeth's style, Art?
> as a Masonic banquet. This banquet was to pay tribute to Sir
> Francis Bacon. Only those of the Rosicrosse (Rosicrucians) and the
> Masons who were already aware of Bacon's leadership role were invited.
> The tables were T-tables with gleaming white drapery, silver, and
> decorations of flowers. The poet Ben Jonson, a long-time friend of
> Bacon, gave a Masonic ode to Bacon that day.
>
> There was a depth of love by a large body of men toward Bacon,
Bacon must have enjoyed that!
> similar
> to some degree in the manner that disciples love a Master. This is
> especially true when taking into account his membership (and some say
> leadership)
"...some say..."? *Who* says? Source? Are you trying to emulate
Elizabeth's style, Art?
> of secret societies such as the Rosicrucians and
> Freemasons. In the inner esoteric membership, which included Francis
> Bacon, vows of celibacy for spiritual reasons were encouraged.
>
> Faked death theory
>
> Various authors
"Various authors"? *Which* authors? Source? Are you trying to
emulate Elizabeth's style, Art?
> have written that there were indications that Francis
> Bacon had gone into debt while secretly funding the publishing of
> materials for the Freemasons, Rosicrucians, "Spear-Shakers",
Francis Bacon secretly funded Stephanie Caruana's publication?!
> "Knights
> of the Helmet", as well as publishing, with the assistance of Ben
> Jonson, a selection of the plays that they believe he had written
> under the pen name of "Shake-Speare" in a "First Folio" in 1623.
> Furthermore, they allege
"They allege"? *Who* alleges? Are you trying to emulate
Elizabeth's style, Art?
> that Bacon faked his own death, crossed the
> English Channel, and secretly traveled in disguise after 1626 through
> France, Germany, Poland, Hungary, and other areas utilizing the secret
> network of Freemasons and Rosicrucians that he was associated with. It
> is alleged
"It is alleged"? By *whom*? Source? Are you trying to emulate
Elizabeth's style, Art?
> that he continued to write under pseudonyms, as he had done
> before 1626, continuing to write as late as 1670
Really?! In 1670, Bacon would have been 109 years old!
> (using the pseudonym
> "Comte De Gabalis"). Elinor Von Le Coq, wife of Professor Von Le Coq
> in Berlin, stated that she had found evidence in the German Archives
> that Francis Bacon stayed after 1626 with the family of Johannes
> Valentinus Andreae in Germany.
>
> Beginning early in the 20th century in the United States, a number of
> Ascended Master Teachings organizations began making the claim that
> Francis Bacon had never died.
Are you among those who believe that Bacon neVER died, Art?
> They believed that soon after completing
> the "Shake-Speare" plays, he had feigned his own death on Easter
> Sunday 1626 and then travelled extensively outside of England,
> eventually attaining his physical Ascension to another plane on May 1,
> 1684 in the region of the Carpathian Mountains.
But Art -- "Carpathian Mountains" is an anagram of
"Shit upon Art N., maniac."
> Their belief is that
> Bacon took on the name "Saint Germain"
But Art -- "Saint Germain" is an anagram of
"G: I'm insane. -- Art"
> as an Ascended Master.>>
That sounds more like Oxford, Art. Indeed, Arundel's accusations
about Oxford's unsavory activities with Orazio Cogno make it seem
quite plausible that Oxford was widely viewed as an ass-ended master.
art
>>
>> Occult theories about Francis Bacon
>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> "This article is an orphan, as few or no other articles link to it."
>
> No surprise there!
Orphan, n. [L. orphanus, Gr. , akin to L. orbus. Cf. Orb a blank
window.]
> art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>>
>> <<A number of writers, some of whom were connected with Theosophy,
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> Following the link to Theosophy:
>
> "Blavatsky [one of the founders of Theosophy] suggested that most
> of present day humanity belongs to the fifth rootrace, the
> Aryans[8], which originally developed on Atlantis,.[9] It was
> her belief that the older races will eventually die out, as the
> fifth rootrace in time will be replaced by the more advanced
> peoples of the sixth root race which is set to develop on the
> reemerging Lemurian continent.[10]"
>
> Evidently geology was not among Mme. Blavatsky's areas of expertise.
Evidently Mme. Blavatsky dismissed Wegener's
continental drift ideas along with all the experts.
-------------------------------
<<Lemuria is the name of a hypothetical "lost land" variously located
in the Indian and Pacific Oceans. The concept's 19th century origins
lie in attempts to account for discontinuities in biogeography,
however, the concept of Lemuria has been rendered obsolete by modern
understanding of plate tectonics.>>
-------------------------------
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Wegener
<<Alfred Lothar Wegener (1 November 1880 – November 1930) was a German
scientist, geophysicist, and meteorologist most notable for his theory
of continental drift (Kontinentalverschiebung), proposed in 1912,
which hypothesized that the continents were slowly drifting around the
Earth. In his work, Wegener *presented a large amount of
circumstantial evidence* in support of continental drift. The
hypothesis was generally met with skepticism. The one American edition
of Wegener's work, published in 1925, was received so poorly that the
American Association of Petroleum Geologists organized a symposium
specifically in opposition to the continental drift hypothesis. Also
its opponents could, as did the Leipziger geologist Franz Kossmat,
argue that the oceanic crust was too firm for the continents to
"simply plow through". In 1943 George Gaylord Simpson wrote a vehement
attack on the theory (as well as the rival theory of sunken land
bridges) and put forward his own permanentist views. Simpson's
influence was so powerful that even in countries previously
sympathetic towards continental drift, like Australia, Wegener's
hypothesis fell out of favour.>>
-----------------------------------------
> art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>>
>> have claimed that Francis Bacon (22 January 1561 – 9 April 1626), the
>> English philosopher, statesman, scientist, and author, was a member of
>> secret societies; a smaller number claim that he was an Ascended
>> Master and was reincarnated.
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> Really?!
> Are you among those who believe that he was reincarnated, Art?
No.
> art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>>
>> Francis Bacon often gathered with the men at Gray's Inn to discuss
>> politics and philosophy, and to try out various theatrical scenes
>> that he admitted writing.
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> Huh?
> art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>>
>> Bacon's alleged connection to the Rosicrucians and the Freemasons
>> has been widely discussed by authors and scholars in many books.
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> "...has been widely discussed by authors and scholars..."?
> *Which" "authors and scholars"?
They are too numerous to mention.
> art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>>
>> However others, including Daphne du Maurier (in her biography
>> of Bacon), have argued there is no substantive evidence to
>> support claims of involvement with the Rosicrucians.
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> "No substantive evidence" is, if anything, an understatement.
---------------------------------------------
http://www.sirbacon.org/windingstair.htm
<<The suggestion that the description of the voyage in New Atlantis
may have been based on The Principal Navigations, Voyages, Traffics
and Discoveries of the English Nation by Rev. Richard Hakluyt first
published in 1589 is new (and credible), since both men had shares in
the Virginia Company; and we were pleased to see the reminder that Dr.
Frances Yates in the Rosicrucian Enlightenment believed that Bacon
based his Utopian fable on the famous Manifestos. The comment that
there is no proof that Francis belonged to "any mystical or other
secret society" is less convincing, however, since "proof" was the
last thing he would have wanted. The raison d'etre of any secret
society particularly one devoted to the advancement of the human race
sub rosa would have been lost.>>
---------------------------------------------
Sink.
> art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>>
>> as a Masonic banquet. This banquet was to pay tribute to Sir
>> Francis Bacon. Only those of the Rosicrosse (Rosicrucians) and the
>> Masons who were already aware of Bacon's leadership role were invited.
>> The tables were T-tables with gleaming white drapery, silver, and
>> decorations of flowers. The poet Ben Jonson, a long-time friend of
>> Bacon, gave a Masonic ode to Bacon that day.
>
>> There was a depth of love by a large body of men toward Bacon,
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> Bacon must have enjoyed that!
You know that from personal experience, Dave?
> art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>>
>> similar to some degree
>>in the manner that disciples love a Master. This is
>> especially true when taking into account his membership
>> (and some say leadership)
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> "...some say..."? *Who* says? Source?
Sink.
> art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>>
>> of secret societies such as the Rosicrucians and
>> Freemasons. In the inner esoteric membership, which included Francis
>> Bacon, vows of celibacy for spiritual reasons were encouraged.
>
>> Faked death theory
>
>> Various authors
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> "Various authors"? *Which* authors? Source?
"A man so various, that he seemed to be Not one, but all mankind's
epitome."
- Dryden.
> art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>>
>> have written that there were indications that Francis
>> Bacon had gone into debt while secretly funding the publishing of
>> materials for the Freemasons, Rosicrucians, "Spear-Shakers",
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> Francis Bacon secretly funded Stephanie Caruana's publication?!
> art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>>
>> "Knights of the Helmet",
>> as well as publishing, with the assistance of Ben Jonson,
>> a selection of the plays that they believe he had written
>> under the pen name of "Shake-Speare" in a "First Folio" in 1623.
>> Furthermore, they allege
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> "They allege"? *Who* alleges?
Various authors.
Allege, v. t. [OE. aleggen to bring forward as evidence, fr.
an assumed LL. exlitigare; L. ex + litigare to quarrel, sue.]
> art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>>
>> that Bacon faked his own death, crossed the
>> English Channel, and secretly traveled in disguise after 1626 through
>> France, Germany, Poland, Hungary, and other areas utilizing the secret
>> network of Freemasons and Rosicrucians that he was associated with. It
>> is alleged
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> "It is alleged"? By *whom*? Source?
Sink?
> art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>>
>> that he continued to write under pseudonyms, as he had done
>> before 1626, continuing to write as late as 1670
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> Really?! In 1670, Bacon would have been 109 years old!
He was packed in snow most of that time.
> art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>>
>> (using the pseudonym
>> "Comte De Gabalis"). Elinor Von Le Coq, wife of Professor Von Le Coq
>> in Berlin, stated that she had found evidence in the German Archives
>> that Francis Bacon stayed after 1626 with the family of Johannes
>> Valentinus Andreae in Germany.
>
>> Beginning early in the 20th century in the United States,
>> a number of Ascended Master Teachings organizations
>> began making the claim that Francis Bacon had never died.
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> Are you among those who believe that Bacon neVER died, Art?
No. (That tomato Lettice Knollys neVER died though.)
> art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>>
>> They believed that soon after completing
>> the "Shake-Speare" plays, he had feigned his own death on Easter
>> Sunday 1626 and then travelled extensively outside of England,
>> eventually attaining his physical Ascension to another plane
>> on May 1, 1684 in the region of the Carpathian Mountains.
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> But Art -- "Carpathian Mountains" is an anagram of
>
> "Shit upon Art N., maniac."
INIPNC= (-1/19)
> art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>>
>> Their belief is that
>> Bacon took on the name "Saint Germain"
nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> But Art -- "Saint Germain" is an anagram of
> "G: I'm insane. -- Art"
INIPNC= (-1/12)
Art Neuendorffer
lackpurity
The longest word constructed: CONFABULATIONS
To me, it indicates that he was a teacher of the occult, and gave
satsangs (talks) on it quite frequently. He was one of Shakespeare's
successors.
For Shakespeare Occult
We have SPECTACULARS.
He was, indeed, a spectacular Master of the occult.
For Marlowe Occult
We have COLLECTOR.
Marlowe, like Christ, was collecting his sheep, as the Good Shepherd.
He collected them and took them to occult stages of consciousness.
Michael Martin
> -------------------------------http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Wegener
> ---------------------------------------------http://www.sirbacon.org/windingstair.htm
elizabeth weir
>
> read more »
elizabeth weir
> Occult theories about Francis Baconhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
>
> <<A number of writers, some of whom were connected with Theosophy,
> have claimed that Francis Bacon (22 January 1561 – 9 April 1626), the
> English philosopher, statesman, scientist, and author, was a member of
> secret societies; a smaller number claim that he was an Ascended
> Master and was reincarnated.
Art. The Theosophists were MODERNS. Like Looney,
they had no direct knowledge of any 16th century figures.
> Francis Bacon often gathered with the men at Gray's Inn to discuss
> politics and philosophy, and to try out various theatrical scenes that
> he admitted writing. Bacon's alleged connection to the Rosicrucians
> and the Freemasons has been widely discussed by authors and scholars
> in many books. However others, including Daphne du Maurier (in her
> biography of Bacon), have argued there is no substantive evidence to
> support claims of involvement with the Rosicrucians. Historian Dame
> Frances Yates does not make the claim that Bacon was a Rosicrucian,
> but presents evidence that he was nevertheless involved in some of the
> more closed intellectual movements of his day. She argues that Bacon's
> movement for the advancement of learning was closely connected with
> the German Rosicrucian movement, while Bacon's
WHAT?
Bacon's assignment, which he commenced at a
very young age, was to MAKE the English literary
movement which the Privy Council, at the behest of
Sir Nicholas Bacon (a member) adopted in 1558.
The resolution was sent to the Queen who ignored
it. Bacon writes two letters to Burghley attempting
to get Burghley to lobby the Queen (as Burghley had
promised years earlier) but noting comes of it except
for Bacon's threat to become "a mere seller of books,"
when threat Bacon in fact carries out.
As the Queen refused to patronize poets (including
her son Oxford), the Protestant coterie relocated
to Wilton where they were patronized by the Countess
of Pembroke.
In Pseudonymous Shakespeare, Penny McCarthy
situates a 15-year old Stratford butcher lad at Wilton
Upon Avon and makes him Mary's lover.
McCarthy is the best close reader of the text I've ever encountered
but she has one debilitating characteristic, SHE'S A STRAT.
Everything must be bent to the Strats.
[. . .]
elizabeth weir
>
> read more »
Bacon's mind turned toward science after he
was told to read Aristotle. Bacon was then only
14 years old and a student at Cambridge.
I was shocked to find how vehement Bacon was
on the subject of Aristotle (who promoted the
a priori over direct observation and experience)
I mean Bacon actually CURSED Aristotle. i was
shocked.
Bacon never turned back, all the destruction of the
Baconian claim to the Shakespeare works has been
done in the modern era by well, devotees, you might
say, to the Aristotelian view that your fantasies are
superior to direct knowledge.
Terrible irony.
lackpurity
I'll reply.
Bacon's mind turned toward science after he
was told to read Aristotle. Bacon was then only
14 years old and a student at Cambridge.
MM:
It's not surprising to me. Bacon was probably the reincarnation of
Aristotle.
Elizabeth:
I was shocked to find how vehement Bacon was
on the subject of Aristotle (who promoted the
a priori over direct observation and experience)
I mean Bacon actually CURSED Aristotle. i was
shocked.
MM:
He must have been young and inexperienced at the time. Aristotle was
really great. He was a foremost student of Plato, and was the Guru of
Alexander the Great. Alexander later reincarnated as Julius Caesar
and Shakespeare. Aristotle didn't make enough research by meditation
on the center of the solar system. Even on that, he was not totally
wrong, The center of the universe is everywhere, as the Creator is
omnipresent.
Elizabeth:
Bacon never turned back, all the destruction of the
Baconian claim to the Shakespeare works has been
done in the modern era by well, devotees, you might
say, to the Aristotelian view that your fantasies are
superior to direct knowledge.
MM:
Well, Aristotle was a spiritual Master. He was more that, than he was
a scientist, otherwise, perhaps he would have spent more time on it.
Terrible irony.
MM:
It had its reasons.
Michael Martin
lackpurity
Bacon's work started in earnest from 1616 forward.
> As the Queen refused to patronize poets (including
> her son Oxford), the Protestant coterie relocated
> to Wilton where they were patronized by the Countess
> of Pembroke.
Perhaps the Queen kept her patronizing of the Wilton Cult at a low
profile, at the request of Shakespeare?
> In Pseudonymous Shakespeare, Penny McCarthy
> situates a 15-year old Stratford butcher lad at Wilton
> Upon Avon and makes him Mary's lover.
Who knows?
> McCarthy is the best close reader of the text I've ever encountered
> but she has one debilitating characteristic, SHE'S A STRAT.
If she's a Strat, she gets credit for being correct.
> Everything must be bent to the Strats.
Param Sant Param Dayal Faqir Chand wrote a book titled, "Truth Always
Wins."
Michael Martin
nordicskiv2
<1cce719b-52cd-4b9c...@u38g2000prh.googlegroups.com>,
elizabeth weir <neon...@gmail.com> wrote:
[...]
> The resolution was sent to the Queen who ignored
> it. Bacon writes two letters to Burghley attempting
> to get Burghley to lobby the Queen (as Burghley had
> promised years earlier) but noting [sic] comes of it except
> for Bacon's threat to become "a mere seller of books,"
> when [sic] threat Bacon in fact carries out.
>
> As the Queen refused to patronize poets (including
> her son Oxford),
"...her son Oxford"??!! Of course, the Streitz/Beauclerk scenario
is completely demented, so who better to embrace it eagerly and
credulously than Elizabeth?
[...]
nordicskiv2
<87635dbd-0443-4d9d...@q21g2000prm.googlegroups.com>,
art <acne...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
[...]
> > art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
> >>
> >> have claimed that Francis Bacon (22 January 1561 – 9 April 1626), the
> >> English philosopher, statesman, scientist, and author, was a member of
> >> secret societies; a smaller number claim that he was an Ascended
> >> Master and was reincarnated.
> nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
> >
> > Really?!
> > Are you among those who believe that he was reincarnated, Art?
> No.
Well, that's a relief -- at least you're still saner than some,
although only just.
> > art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
> >>
> >> Francis Bacon often gathered with the men at Gray's Inn to discuss
> >> politics and philosophy, and to try out various theatrical scenes
> >> that he admitted writing.
> nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
Huh? What's that you've attributed to me, Art? It's not my style
-- I'm generally wordier than that.
> nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
> >
> > Huh?
> > art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
> >>
> >> Bacon's alleged connection to the Rosicrucians and the Freemasons
> >> has been widely discussed by authors and scholars in many books.
> nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
> >
> > "...has been widely discussed by authors and scholars..."?
> > *Which" "authors and scholars"?
> They are too numerous to mention.
I'm not asking you to mention *all* of them, Art; just a handful
will suffice. You must be adopting Elizabeth's "methods," Art!
> > art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
> >>
> >> However others, including Daphne du Maurier (in her biography
> >> of Bacon), have argued there is no substantive evidence to
> >> support claims of involvement with the Rosicrucians.
> nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
> >
> > "No substantive evidence" is, if anything, an understatement.
> ---------------------------------------------
> http://www.sirbacon.org/windingstair.htm
>
> <<The suggestion that the description of the voyage in New Atlantis
> may have been based on The Principal Navigations, Voyages, Traffics
> and Discoveries of the English Nation by Rev. Richard Hakluyt first
> published in 1589 is new (and credible), since both men had shares in
> the Virginia Company; and we were pleased to see the reminder that Dr.
> Frances Yates in the Rosicrucian Enlightenment believed that Bacon
> based his Utopian fable on the famous Manifestos. The comment that
> there is no proof that Francis belonged to "any mystical or other
> secret society" is less convincing, however, since "proof" was the
> last thing he would have wanted. The raison d'etre of any secret
> society particularly one devoted to the advancement of the human race
> sub rosa would have been lost.>>
You prove my point _ipso facto_, Art: "No substantive evidence" is,
if anything, an understatement.
> > art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
> Sink.
I see that you have no more idea what a credible source is than
Elizabeth does, Art. I recall your "A source is a source, of course,
of course" discussion with Dr. Stritmatter, in which you admitted not
knowing what a primary source was; now we find that you don't know
what a source is *period*, so your bafflement at the notion of a
primary source is thereby clarified.
> > art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
> >>
> >> as a Masonic banquet. This banquet was to pay tribute to Sir
> >> Francis Bacon. Only those of the Rosicrosse (Rosicrucians) and the
> >> Masons who were already aware of Bacon's leadership role were invited.
> >> The tables were T-tables with gleaming white drapery, silver, and
> >> decorations of flowers. The poet Ben Jonson, a long-time friend of
> >> Bacon, gave a Masonic ode to Bacon that day.
> >
> >> There was a depth of love by a large body of men toward Bacon,
> nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
> >
> > Bacon must have enjoyed that!
> You know that from personal experience, Dave?
Don't be absurd, Art; I am speculating based upon the available
information about Bacon's sexual orientation. (Oxford would not have
enjoyed such a gathering as much, since he reputedly preferred
underaged boys.)
> > art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
> >>
> >> similar to some degree
> >>in the manner that disciples love a Master. This is
> >> especially true when taking into account his membership
> >> (and some say leadership)
> nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
> >
> > "...some say..."? *Who* says? Source?
> Sink.
I see that you have no more idea what a credible source is than
Elizabeth does, Art. I recall your "A source is a source, of course,
of course" discussion with Dr. Stritmatter, in which you admitted not
knowing what a primary source was; now we find that you don't know
what a source is *period*, so your bafflement at the notion of a
primary source is thereby clarified.
> > art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
> >>
> >> of secret societies such as the Rosicrucians and
> >> Freemasons. In the inner esoteric membership, which included Francis
> >> Bacon, vows of celibacy for spiritual reasons were encouraged.
> >
> >> Faked death theory
> >
> >> Various authors
> nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
> >
> > "Various authors"? *Which* authors? Source?
> "A man so various, that he seemed to be Not one, but all mankind's
> epitome."
> - Dryden.
"I stood by the duke at the door, and I see that every man that
went in had his pockets bulging, or something muffled up under his
coat -- and I see it warn't no perfumery, neither, not by a long
sight. I smelt sickly eggs by the barrel, and rotten cabbages, and
such things; and if I know the signs of a dead cat being around, and I
bet I do, there was sixty-four of them went in. I shoved in there for
a minute, but it was too various for me; I couldn't stand it."
-Twain
More to the point, I see that you have no more idea what a credible
source is than Elizabeth does, Art. I recall your "A source is a
source, of course, of course" discussion with Dr. Stritmatter, in
which you admitted not knowing what a primary source was; now we find
that you don't know what a source is *period*, so your bafflement at
the notion of a primary source is thereby clarified.
> > art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
> >>
> >> have written that there were indications that Francis
> >> Bacon had gone into debt while secretly funding the publishing of
> >> materials for the Freemasons, Rosicrucians, "Spear-Shakers",
> nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
> >
> > Francis Bacon secretly funded Stephanie Caruana's publication?!
> > art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
> >>
> >> "Knights of the Helmet",
> >> as well as publishing, with the assistance of Ben Jonson,
> >> a selection of the plays that they believe he had written
> >> under the pen name of "Shake-Speare" in a "First Folio" in 1623.
> >> Furthermore, they allege
> nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
> >
> > "They allege"? *Who* alleges?
> Various authors.
"I stood by the duke at the door, and I see that every man that
went in had his pockets bulging, or something muffled up under his
coat -- and I see it warn't no perfumery, neither, not by a long
sight. I smelt sickly eggs by the barrel, and rotten cabbages, and
such things; and if I know the signs of a dead cat being around, and I
bet I do, there was sixty-four of them went in. I shoved in there for
a minute, but it was too various for me; I couldn't stand it."
-Twain
More to the point, I see that you have no more idea what a credible
source is than Elizabeth does, Art. I recall your "A source is a
source, of course, of course" discussion with Dr. Stritmatter, in
which you admitted not knowing what a primary source was; now we find
that you don't know what a source is *period*, so your bafflement at
the notion of a primary source is thereby clarified.
> Allege, v. t. [OE. aleggen to bring forward as evidence, fr.
> an assumed LL. exlitigare; L. ex + litigare to quarrel, sue.]
Yes, I know the meaning of the word, Art -- but congratulations
upon having looked it up yourself! You may learn something yet -- if
your memory is not too dysfunctional to retain it, as your amnesia in
the "Dames" thread ominously suggests.
> > art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
> >>
> >> that Bacon faked his own death, crossed the
> >> English Channel, and secretly traveled in disguise after 1626 through
> >> France, Germany, Poland, Hungary, and other areas utilizing the secret
> >> network of Freemasons and Rosicrucians that he was associated with. It
> >> is alleged
> nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
> >
> > "It is alleged"? By *whom*? Source?
> Sink?
I see that you have no more idea what a credible source is than
Elizabeth does, Art. I recall your "A source is a source, of course,
of course" discussion with Dr. Stritmatter, in which you admitted not
knowing what a primary source was; now we find that you don't know
what a source is *period*, so your bafflement at the notion of a
primary source is thereby clarified.
> > art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
> >>
> >> that he continued to write under pseudonyms, as he had done
> >> before 1626, continuing to write as late as 1670
> nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
> >
> > Really?! In 1670, Bacon would have been 109 years old!
> He was packed in snow most of that time.
Chicken might be presERVEd that way, but not bacon, Art.
> > art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
> >>
> >> (using the pseudonym
> >> "Comte De Gabalis"). Elinor Von Le Coq, wife of Professor Von Le Coq
> >> in Berlin, stated that she had found evidence in the German Archives
> >> that Francis Bacon stayed after 1626 with the family of Johannes
> >> Valentinus Andreae in Germany.
> >
> >> Beginning early in the 20th century in the United States,
> >> a number of Ascended Master Teachings organizations
> >> began making the claim that Francis Bacon had never died.
> nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
> >
> > Are you among those who believe that Bacon neVER died, Art?
> No.
Well, that's a relief, Art -- you remain saner than some, but only
just.
[...]
lackpurity
> In article
> <87635dbd-0443-4d9d-921f-e8ffaf19b...@q21g2000prm.googlegroups.com>,
> art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>
> [...]
>
> > > art <acneu...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
>
> > >> have claimed that Francis Bacon (22 January 1561 – 9 April 1626), the
> > >> English philosopher, statesman, scientist, and author, was a member of
> > >> secret societies; a smaller number claim that he was an Ascended
> > >> Master and was reincarnated.
> > nordicskiv2 <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote:
>
> > > Really?!
> > > Are you among those who believe that he was reincarnated, Art?
> > No.
> Well, that's a relief -- at least you're still saner than some,
> although only just.
Well, if David Webb can provide a better explanation for the different
destinies, with which we are born, let him post it. Otherwise, his
allegation is meaningless. Does Webb know from where he came, before
his mother's womb, for example? He acts like he has all the answers.
Let's see him deal with that one.
Michael Martin
> ...
>
> read more »- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
John W Kennedy
> Bacon never turned back, all the destruction of the
> Baconian claim to the Shakespeare works has been
> done in the modern era by well, devotees, you might
> say, to the Aristotelian view that your fantasies are
> superior to direct knowledge.
>
> Terrible irony.
Et ille respondens ait: Tu dicis.
--
John W Kennedy
"The grand art mastered the thudding hammer of Thor
And the heart of our lord Taliessin determined the war."
-- Charles Williams. "Mount Badon"
neonprose @ gmail.com
> In article
> elizabeth weir <neon...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> [...]
> > The resolution was sent to the Queen who ignored
> > it. Bacon writes two letters to Burghley attempting
> > to get Burghley to lobby the Queen (as Burghley had
So Bacon finally threatens to become "a mere seller of books."
What could that POSSIBLY MEAN Webb?
Here's a hint: The FF.
And I'm sorry you're so sic, maybe throat lozenges and a
really hot bath would help.
> > As the Queen refused to patronize poets (including
> > her son Oxford),
>
> "...her son Oxford"??!! Of course, the Streitz/Beauclerk scenario
> is completely demented, so who better to embrace it eagerly and
> credulously than Elizabeth?
her son Oxford.
> [...]
neonprose @ gmail.com
> In article
>
>
> [...]
> > The resolution was sent to the Queen who ignored
> > it. Bacon writes two letters to Burghley attempting
> > to get Burghley to lobby the Queen (as Burghley had
> > As the Queen refused to patronize poets (including
> > her son Oxford),
>
> "...her son Oxford"??!! Of course, the Streitz/Beauclerk scenario
> is completely demented, so who better to embrace it eagerly and
> credulously than Elizabeth?
post an opinion.
Elizabeth was impregnated by Thomas Seymour when
she was only fourteen. Her father Henry VIII had just
died and she was taken off to live with Henry's widow
Queen Katherine who had the bad luck to fall in love
and marry Thomas Seymour, the younger brother
of Edward Seymour the Lord Protector.
At first Katherine welcomed the young girl but as
time wore on she began to realize that the ambitious
Seymour wanted only to seduce and marry Elizabeth
who was obviously first in line for the throne of
England.
There were really outrageous episodes of sexual
teasing. Seymour would lay Elizabeth on the floor
and Katherine would join Seymour in tickling
Elizabeth until Elizabeth could stand no more.
The household help reported seeing Seymour
"laying under the covers on top of Elizabeth."
Katherine caught them holding hands and running
into the woods together. Seymour encouraged
Katherine to engage in "tickling matches" with
himself and Elizabeth.
On one occasion he made Elizabeth lie on the
floor and he cut her dress off in small pieces.
When it was apparent that Seymour had impregnated
the young girl, he was arrested and thrown into
The Tower. Seymour had the worst death on record.
He was determined to fight his way out so he grabbed
the weapons and fought on but was too exhausted
four hours later to go on.
The men who had been sent to the
Tower to arrest Seymour essentially hacked him to
pieces. There was blood and slippery gore all over
the floor.
Elizabeth felt responsible for Seymour's terrible
death.
During her pregnancy with the future Oxford, Elizabeth
was essentially in hiding. When she was ready to
deliver, Queen Katherine provided her with a midwife
and nurse.
The male infant was very small (I'm referring to the
new born Oxford) with pale freckles on his face and
neck. At the moment of delivery, the midwife handed
the red-haired male infant to the attending nurse who
immediately covered his face with the receiving blanket
and whisked him out of the room before the princess
could see him.
I think Queen Katherine had also been impregnated by
Seymour -- she certainly did everything she could
to get his attention. She also gave birth to an
infant, I think a male, but it may have been stillborn.
There's also a mystery associated with Katherine's
young daughter Mary by Seymour who would have
been young Oxford's half-sister.
I spent considerable time trying to track down young
Mary but she seems to have disappeared from the
record. She apparently did not figure in the High
Commission that spent some months investigating
this royal domestic mess.
Eventually the Commission voted out the official
Report but Elizabeth had already been sent with
Kate Ashby (her nurse in earliest childhood) until
the scandal blew over,
This horrible episode involving her would-be
lover Seymour (see his article and portrait on
Wikipedia) likely made her distrust men for
life, causing her to invent the title The Virgin
Queen as some kind of defense.
So that's the story of Oxford's conception and
birth. His father was never John De Vere.
De Vere was a wheeler and dealer, he received
an enormous amount of land from Elizabeth
as well as a continuous supply of cash. The
missing sister Mary seemed to have been sent
to Old Heddingham with Oxford but there was
only a glimpse of young Mary until she eventually
faded from the picture.
I was lucky enough to read an official account of
the pregnancy and delivery in papers then issued
by a High Commission looking into the matter
of the pregnancy of the Princess and Seymour's
role in things.
You can view the complete record by paying the
British Library some hundreds of pounds for a
reading room card. I was able to read a dozen
or so documents issued by the High Commission
(in the Tudor era) until the British Library discovered
that these records had been put online and took
them down.
One way or another, this was probably the most
traumatic episode of the young princess' life and
it is very well documented by testimony taken
from witnesses at Queen Katherine's estate.
Later on, Elizabeth found herself locked up in
the Tower of London with . . . Leicester. They
were both in their teens, they were in love and
Leicester could see a path to the throne.
There seems to be some uncertainty among Strats
that Leicester and Elizabeth were not legally married.
They definitely were legally married. The first
ceremony took place in the Great Hall at Penshurst
where to this day the marriage records are still
kept, I believe in a long glass case along the
wall (there are old photos online). The marriage
certificate was signed by forty or more guests.
Then the hugely pregnant Elizabeth (pregnant with
the infant Bacon, the kid born with a very big
cranium) and Leicester adjourned with the wedding
guests to a nearby chapel where they were
married again.
Bacon, the kid with the very big brain, was delivered
early in the following week.
Sadly Bacon the Genius was born with an oversized
head which did some damage to Elizabeth's uhhh
plumbing. She held it against Bacon all his life
because his oversized head had caused a tear in
the wall between her vagina and rectum which
caused the Throne Room to stink. A Dutch
surgeon who specialized in repair of this problem
happened to be visiting London. He offered to repair
the tear but the Queen was too afraid.
And of course I'm skipping past the problem
of Leicester's lawful wife, Amy Robsart who
was found at the bottom of the stairs with
a broken neck just about the time Leicester
was marrying Elizabeth at Penshurst. The
whole Court seemed to believe that Elizabeth
was an accessory to the crime. I think that
was a real possibility.
When her lawful husband Leicester set out on the
course of irregular marriages with much younger
and prettier women (Bacon was therefore provided
with additional handsome brothers -- I think four)
it broke Elizabeth's heart. Elizabeth was ready to
give birth to Bacon and therefore desperate. Scholars
think she colluded in the murder.
Well, they were Elizabethans and the Elizabethans
were kind of barbaric. Except Bacon. Bacon was
nEVERE cruel. He was kind like his foster brother
Anthony.
I guess Art was born to like Oxford. Nobody else
does. Maybe it's reincarnational.
One of the benefits that accrued to Bacon from
all this womanizing on the part of his father the
Earl of Leicester is that Bacon gained additional
brothers who bore a striking resemblance to
Bacon.
One of his brothers was given a fully-rigged
sailing ship by Leicester. This kid -- and he
was a kid, barely into his teens -- took off
across the Atlantic to investigate the east
coast of South America. He sailed up the
Oronoco and explored other rivers. When he
returned he and Bacon went into the business
of making beautiful maps, gorgeous maps,
the colours were wonderful, I've viewed photos
of these fabulous maps online..
>
> [...]
Arthur Neuendorffer
>
> Well, they were Elizabethans and the Elizabethans
> were kind of barbaric. Except Bacon. Bacon was nEVERE
> cruel. He was kind like his foster brother Anthony.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Bacon
<<Bacon soon became acquainted with Robert Devereux, 2nd Earl of
Essex, Queen Elizabeth's favourite. By 1591, he acted as the earl's
confidential adviser. When the Attorney-Generalship fell vacant in
1594, Lord Essex's influence was not enough to secure Bacon that
office. Likewise, Bacon failed to secure the lesser office of
Solicitor-General in 1595. To console him for these disappointments,
Essex presented him with a property at Twickenham, which he sold
subsequently for £1,800.
[In 1601] Bacon was appointed to investigate the charges against
Essex, *his former friend and benefactor* . A number of Essex's
followers confessed that Essex had planned a rebellion against the
Queen. Bacon was subsequently a part of the legal team headed by
Attorney General Sir Edward Coke at Essex's treason trial. After the
execution, the Queen ordered Bacon to write the official government
account of the trial, which was later published as _A DECLARATION of
the Practices and Treasons attempted and committed by Robert late
Earle of Essex and his Complices, against her Majestie and her
Kingdoms_.>>
--------------------------------------------------------
>
> I guess Art was born to like Oxford. Nobody else does.
*TOM CECIL* (1542-1622) - the onlie man
___ to vote for Oxford into the order of the Garter.
-------------------------------------------------------------
<<and Sancho, examining him more and more closely, exclaimed
. aloud in a voice of amazement, "Holy Mary be good to me!
.
. Isn't it *TOM CECIL*, my neighbour and gossip?"
.
"Why, to be sure I am!" returned the now unnosed squire;
. "TOM CECIL I am, gossip and friend Sancho Panza;
and I'll tell you presently the means & tricks & falsehoods
. by which I have been brought here;
. but in the meantime, beg and entreat of your master
. not to touch, maltreat, wound, or slay
. the Knight of the Mirrors whom he has at his feet;>>
--------------------------------------------------------
Presidents of the Council of the NORTH
..................................................
http://tudorhistory.org/calendar/gtitles.html
.
1530-1533 Cuthbert Tunstall, Bishop of Durham
.
1533-1536 Henry Percy, Earl of NORTHumberland
1536-1537 Thomas Howard, Duke of Norfolk
.
1537-1538 Cuthbert Tunstall, Bishop of Durham
1538-1540 Robert Holgate, Bishop of Llandaff
1550-1560 Francis Talbot, Earl of Shrewsbury
1561-1563 Henry Manners, Earl of Rutland
1564-1564 Ambrose Dudley, Earl of Warwick
1564-1568 Thomas Young, Archbishop of York
1568-1572 Thomas Radcliffe, Earl of Sussex
1572-1595 Henry Hastings, Earl of Huntingdon
1596-1599 Matthew Hutton, Archbishop of York
..........................................
1599-1603 *THOMAS CECIL* , Lord Burghley
---------------------------------------------------------
. Mary CHEKE --- William Cecil --- Mildred Cooke
. | {Burghley} | (Francis Bacon's aunt)
. | (1520-98) |
. | Anne Cecil---Edward deVere
. | {Oxford} (1550-1604)
. | (1st Cousin to Suffolk's dad)
. |
{Exeter} *TOM CECIL* --- Dorothy *NEVILLE*
. (1542-1622)
.
<<"Isn't it odd, senor, that I have still before my eyes
that *MONSTROUS enormous NOSE* of my gossip, Tom Cecial?"
"And dost thou, then, believe, Sancho," said Don Quixote,
"that the Knight of the Mirrors was the bachelor
Carrasco, and his squire Tom Cecial thy gossip?">>
........................................................
_____________ *THOMA(s) SNOUT* , tinker
_____________ {anagram}
_____________ *SOUTHAM(p)TON*
----------------------------------------------------
Art Neuendorffer
neonprose @ gmail.com
David L. Webb
<9a92598c-ae95-4c19...@f17g2000vbz.googlegroups.com>,
confident that Oxford would have been elected by unanimous acclamation
to the Order of the Farter.
> <<and Sancho, examining him more and more closely, exclaimed
> . aloud in a voice of amazement, "Holy Mary be good to me!
> .
> . Isn't it *TOM CECIL*, my neighbour and gossip?"
The two have nothing whateVER to do with one another (leaving aside the
glaring fact that one is a character of *fiction*, since you have proven
to be utterly unable to distinguish fiction from reality).
One would expect that after your Peter Gay fiasco you would have been
disabused of the notion that two persons who share the same name are in
some way connected -- not that Tomé Cecial and Tom Cecil share the same
name, of course, but then neither did Peter A. Gay and Peter J. Gay --
but you are ineducable, Art.
[Lunatic logorrhea snipped]
> ..................................................
> http://tudorhistory.org/calendar/gtitles.html
> .
> 1530-1533 Cuthbert Tunstall, Bishop of Durham
> .
> 1533-1536 Henry Percy, Earl of NORTHumberland
> 1536-1537 Thomas Howard, Duke of Norfolk
> .
> 1537-1538 Cuthbert Tunstall, Bishop of Durham
> 1538-1540 Robert Holgate, Bishop of Llandaff
> 1550-1560 Francis Talbot, Earl of Shrewsbury
> 1561-1563 Henry Manners, Earl of Rutland
> 1564-1564 Ambrose Dudley, Earl of Warwick
> 1564-1568 Thomas Young, Archbishop of York
> 1568-1572 Thomas Radcliffe, Earl of Sussex
> 1572-1595 Henry Hastings, Earl of Huntingdon
> 1596-1599 Matthew Hutton, Archbishop of York
> ..........................................
> 1599-1603 *THOMAS CECIL* , Lord Burghley
Art?
> . Mary CHEKE --- William Cecil --- Mildred Cooke
> . | {Burghley} | (Francis Bacon's aunt)
> . | (1520-98) |
> . | Anne Cecil---Edward deVere
> . | {Oxford} (1550-1604)
> . | (1st Cousin to Suffolk's dad)
> . |
> {Exeter} *TOM CECIL* --- Dorothy *NEVILLE*
> . (1542-1622)
> <<"Isn't it odd, senor, that I have still before my eyes
> that *MONSTROUS enormous NOSE* of my gossip, Tom Cecial?"
> "And dost thou, then, believe, Sancho," said Don Quixote,
> "that the Knight of the Mirrors was the bachelor
> Carrasco, and his squire Tom Cecial thy gossip?">>
is in any way relevant, or indeed what may you have in mind (such as it
is), but if you are intimating that the Knight of the Mirrors who
conceals his identity is Oxford, then you may have a point for once, Art
-- "ser de carrasca" is a Spanish idiom meaning "to be absolutely
awful", and contemporary accounts confirm that Oxford was absolutely
awful at pretty much eVERything he undertook.
> _____________ *THOMA(s) SNOUT* , tinker
> _____________ {anagram}
> _____________ *SOUTHAM(p)TON*
letter "s", while "Southampton" has only one. MoreoVER, "Southampton"
has an occurrence of the letter "p", while "Thomas Snout" has none.
This is not rocket science, Art -- all that is needed is the ability
to count to two; indeed, even the ability to count to one would have
sufficed in this instance, as counting occurrences of "p" refutes your
contention conclusively.
It's really extraordinary that you are so hopelessly incapable of
anagramming, Art -- as they say in Spanish, when it comes to anagrams,
eres de carrasca!
> Art Neuendorffer
David L. Webb
quoted material) surpasses her best efforts to date!
-
neonprose @ gmail.com
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
>
> <<A number of writers, some of whom were connected with Theosophy,
> have claimed that Francis Bacon (22 January 1561 – 9 April 1626), the
> English philosopher, statesman, scientist, and author, was a member of
> secret societies; a smaller number claim that he was an Ascended
> Master and was reincarnated.
We're having vicious weather out here, I'm now addicted
to NOAA. Do you know anything about an ejection from
the Sun that's supposed to have a dire effect on the
weather on Earth?
As far as the hocus pocus that surrounds Bacon is concerned,
it's not Bacon's fault that he was a singular genius (the Bacon's
took great care to educate their ward) but then the literacy
rate in the English of that era was probably impossible
to calculate.
Hence Bacon's interest in the theatre to educate the
public.
I have never been able to detect any evidence that
Oxford had some impulse to raise the English out
of illiteracy.
Oxford was shifted off to school where he could
only express his rage by throwing stones through the
irreplaceable glass windows at Cambridge (glass windows
whose glorious colors were made by monks from
secret formulas).
Oxford was furious from birth forward (this was entirely
justified considering the circumstances of his conception,
he really never thrived, he was small all his life).
Bacon had a early advantage in that an old Roman theatre
was just yards away from the ruined chimneys of Old
Gorhambury. Bacon and his brother Anthony would
scribble juvenile plays, then go down to the Roman
theatre to act them out. I don't doubt that Bacon added
the Roman plays to the First Folio due to his childhood
experiments with the theatre.
John W Kennedy
> Elizabeth's own factual contribution in this post (disregarding the
> quoted material) surpasses her best efforts to date!
too demented to paraphrase.
--
John W Kennedy
"Compact is becoming contract,
Man only earns and pays."
-- Charles Williams. "Bors to Elayne: On the King's Coins"
neonprose @ gmail.com
On Saturday, July 31, 2010 6:55:07 PM UTC-7, Arthur Neuendorffer wrote:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
NOT
> <<A number of writers, some of whom were connected with Theosophy,
> have claimed that Francis Bacon (22 January 1561 – 9 April 1626), the
> English philosopher, statesman, scientist, and author, was a member of
> secret societies; a smaller number claim that he was an Ascended
> Master and was reincarnated.
> Francis Bacon often gathered with the men at Gray's Inn to discuss
> politics and philosophy, and to try out various theatrical scenes that
> he admitted writing.
Jonson was the only one who was in on the game for the simple
reason that Jonson was Bacon's scribe. Jonson had elegant
handwriting (for a big fat guy) and lived with Bacon on a
property on the other side of the Thames.
There's a photo of one of the canals that fed into the
Thames just across from the theaters. Bacon and Jonson
would travel by boat.
> and the Freemasons has been widely discussed by authors and scholars
> in many books.
the Freemasons invented Bacon, you might say.
> However others, including Daphne du Maurier (in her
> biography of Bacon), have argued there is no substantive evidence to
> support claims of involvement with the Rosicrucians. Historian Dame
> Frances Yates does not make the claim that Bacon was a Rosicrucian,
> but presents evidence that he was nevertheless involved in some of the
> more closed intellectual movements of his day. She argues that Bacon's
> movement for the advancement of learning was closely connected with
> the German Rosicrucian movement, while Bacon's The New Atlantis
> portrays a land ruled by Rosicrucians. He apparently saw his own
> movement for the advancement of learning to be in conformity with
> Rosicrucian ideals.
Court of France for several years where he wrote poetry with the
last of La Pleiades and I believe he was part of the court that
traveled to Denmark to accompany Anne of Denmark to England
but Germany? I doubt it.
> In 1618 Francis Bacon decided to secure a lease for York House. This
> had been his boyhood home in London next to the Queen's York Place
> before the Bacon family had moved to Gorhambury in the countryside.
> After Lord Egerton (Lord Keeper of the Great Seal of England) died, it
> became available for Bacon to lease. During the next four years this
> mansion on the Strand (so large that it had 40 fireplaces) served as
> the home for Francis and Alice Bacon. Over the next four years Bacon
> would host banquets at York House that were attended by the leading
> men of the time, including poets, scholars, authors, scientists,
> lawyers, diplomats, and foreign dignitaries. Within the banquet hall,
> Francis gathered the greatest leaders in literature, art, law,
> education, and social reform. On 22 January 1621 in honour of Sir
> Francis Bacon's sixtieth birthday, a select group of men assembled in
> the large banquet hall in York House without fanfare for what has been
> described as a Masonic banquet. This banquet was to pay tribute to Sir
> Francis Bacon. Only those of the Rosicrosse (Rosicrucians) and the
> Masons who were already aware of Bacon's leadership role were invited.
> The tables were T-tables with gleaming white drapery, silver, and
> decorations of flowers. The poet Ben Jonson, a long-time friend of
> Bacon, gave a Masonic ode to Bacon that day.
> There was a depth of love by a large body of men toward Bacon, similar
> to some degree in the manner that disciples love a Master.
torment animals.
> This is
> especially true when taking into account his membership (and some say
> leadership) of secret societies such as the Rosicrucians and
> Freemasons. In the inner esoteric membership, which included Francis
> Bacon, vows of celibacy for spiritual reasons were encouraged.
to separate themselves from women and be manly men. That
occasionally results in secret societies that bore the crap out of
women. My stepfather was a 33 degree Mason, but to his credit
he never jumped into a clown car during a parade or drove one
down the sidewalk making women scream.
> Faked death theory
>
> Various authors have written that there were indications that Francis
> Bacon had gone into debt while secretly funding the publishing of
> materials for the Freemasons, Rosicrucians, "Spear-Shakers", "Knights
> of the Helmet", as well as publishing, with the assistance of Ben
> Jonson, a selection of the plays that they believe he had written
> under the pen name of "Shake-Speare" in a "First Folio" in 1623.
point, Jonson's plays were intended to out William Shappere.
I recall reading one of Jonson's plays which featured an
all-male cast. William Shappere was one of the characters.
I found the script boring but you can probably find it online.
> Furthermore, they allege that Bacon faked his own death, crossed the
> English Channel, and secretly traveled in disguise after 1626 through
> France, Germany, Poland, Hungary, and other areas utilizing the secret
> network of Freemasons and Rosicrucians that he was associated with. It
> is alleged that he continued to write under pseudonyms, as he had done
> before 1626, continuing to write as late as 1670 (using the pseudonym
> "Comte De Gabalis"). Elinor Von Le Coq, wife of Professor Von Le Coq
> in Berlin, stated that she had found evidence in the German Archives
> that Francis Bacon stayed after 1626 with the family of Johannes
> Valentinus Andreae in Germany.
> Beginning early in the 20th century in the United States, a number of
> Ascended Master Teachings organizations began making the claim that
> Francis Bacon had never died.
ho hos, twinkies, etc. I can't even imagine the Norwegians
going on about ding dongs, ho hos and twinkies.
> They believed that soon after completing
> the "Shake-Speare" plays, he had feigned his own death on Easter
> Sunday 1626 and then travelled extensively outside of England,
> eventually attaining his physical Ascension to another plane on May 1,
> 1684 in the region of the Carpathian Mountains. Their belief is that
> Bacon took on the name "Saint Germain" as an Ascended Master.>>
neo-Nazi cult.
We are having major flooding in Columbia County. The
Nehalem is rising . . . I gotta go look at NOAA -- it
has much improved graphics, have you taken a look?
neonprose @ gmail.com
> In article
>
neonprose @ gmail.com
> "neonprose @ gmail.com" <neonpr...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >
>
> > Well, they were Elizabethans and the Elizabethans
>
> > were kind of barbaric. Except Bacon. Bacon was nEVERE
>
> > cruel. He was kind like his foster brother Anthony.
>
> --------------------------------------------------------
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Bacon
>
>
>
> <<Bacon soon became acquainted with Robert Devereux, 2nd Earl of
>
> Essex, Queen Elizabeth's favourite.
Elizabeth was Bacon's mother. Leicester continued
to make Elizabeth weep by marrying a string of
women. So Bacon was a half-brother to Essex via
Leicester but Essex' mother was Lettice Knollys
who was much younger than the aging Queen.
I have to assume that Bacon's heart was broken
when Elizabeth executed Leicester's son Essex
on the block.
By 1591, he acted as the earl's confidential adviser.
episode in Ireland says it all.
When the Attorney-Generalship fell vacant in 1594,
Lord Essex's influence was not enough to secure
Bacon that office.
sort who wasn't inclined to try.
Bacon didn't get the office because Elizabeth
would have had to grant it and she couldn't
afford to give Bacon any favors because it
would stir up talk.
Likewise, Bacon failed to secure the lesser
office of Solicitor-General in 1595. To console
him for these disappointments, Essex presented
him with a property at Twickenham, which he sold
subsequently for £1,800.
a lease on Twickenham.
I just read that some relative leased Bacon the property
at Twickenham. I don't think Essex had anything to
do with it but really who cares. Bacon was able to live
(with Jonson his good pen) for probably eight or more
years. It was a beautiful property sited in the middle
of rolling apple orchards. It's now a blacktop parking
lot for the massive soccer field in London.
> [In 1601] Bacon was appointed to investigate the
charges against Essex, *his former friend and benefactor* .
Lettice Knollys.
A number of Essex's followers confessed that Essex had
planned a rebellion against the Queen.
full of plans that he never carried out.
His ambition knew no bounds so ultimately Elizabeth
had to execute Essex. <---< this sentence captures
it all.
Bacon was subsequently a part of the legal team headed
by Attorney General Sir Edward Coke at Essex's treason trial
of Bacon's legal brilliance so Chief Justice Coke made
Bacon cross-examine his own brother. Coke's style of
examination was to scream at the witness (Essex) at the
top of his lungs.
After the execution, the Queen ordered Bacon to write
the official government account of the trial, which was
later published as _A DECLARATION of the Practices and
Treasons attempted and committed by Robert late Earle of Essex
and his Complices, against her Majestie and her Kingdoms_.
sealed his own fate by ridiculing her in public, going
on about what an old bag she was, etc., etc..
>
> "neonprose @ gmail.com" <neonpr...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >
>
> > I guess Art was born to like Oxford. Nobody else does.
>
> ----------------------------------------------------
>
> *TOM CECIL* (1542-1622) - the onlie man
>
> ___ to vote for Oxford into the order of the Garter.
nonentity in English history.
at one point, knocked her teeth out.
I don't understand how you can be so smitten
with this midget, it is a terrible shame that
Elizabeth handed him over to John de Vere to
raise, and raise in the veritable hell hole at
castle Heddingham. This really raises questions
about the medieval mind.
neonprose @ gmail.com
> On Saturday, July 31, 2010 6:55:07 PM UTC-7, Arthur Neuendorffer wrote:
>
> > Occult theories about Francis Bacon
>
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
neonprose @ gmail.com
> On Saturday, July 31, 2010 6:55:07 PM UTC-7, Arthur Neuendorffer wrote:
>
> > Occult theories about Francis Bacon
>
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
>
>
for your benefit?
neonprose @ gmail.com
> Occult theories about Francis Bacon
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
>
> have claimed that Francis Bacon (22 January 1561 – 9 April 1626), the
> English philosopher, statesman, scientist, and author, was a member of
> secret societies; a smaller number claim that he was an Ascended
> Master and was reincarnated.
>
> politics and philosophy, and to try out various theatrical scenes that
> support claims of involvement with the Rosicrucians. Historian Dame
> Frances Yates does not make the claim that Bacon was a Rosicrucian,
> but presents evidence that he was nevertheless involved in some of the
> more closed intellectual movements of his day. She argues that Bacon's
> movement for the advancement of learning was closely connected with
> the German Rosicrucian movement, while Bacon's The New Atlantis
> portrays a land ruled by Rosicrucians. He apparently saw his own
> movement for the advancement of learning to be in conformity with
> Rosicrucian ideals.
>
> had been his boyhood home in London next to the Queen's York Place
> before the Bacon family had moved to Gorhambury in the countryside.
> After Lord Egerton (Lord Keeper of the Great Seal of England) died, it
> became available for Bacon to lease. During the next four years this
> mansion on the Strand (so large that it had 40 fireplaces) served as
> the home for Francis and Alice Bacon. Over the next four years Bacon
> would host banquets at York House that were attended by the leading
> men of the time, including poets, scholars, authors, scientists,
> lawyers, diplomats, and foreign dignitaries. Within the banquet hall,
> Francis gathered the greatest leaders in literature, art, law,
> education, and social reform. On 22 January 1621 in honour of Sir
> Francis Bacon's sixtieth birthday, a select group of men assembled in
> the large banquet hall in York House without fanfare for what has been
> described as a Masonic banquet. This banquet was to pay tribute to Sir
> Francis Bacon. Only those of the Rosicrosse (Rosicrucians) and the
> Masons who were already aware of Bacon's leadership role were invited.
> The tables were T-tables with gleaming white drapery, silver, and
> decorations of flowers. The poet Ben Jonson, a long-time friend of
> Bacon, gave a Masonic ode to Bacon that day.
>
> leadership) of secret societies such as the Rosicrucians and
> Freemasons. In the inner esoteric membership, which included Francis
> Bacon, vows of celibacy for spiritual reasons were encouraged.
>
>
> Various authors have written that there were indications that Francis
> Bacon had gone into debt while secretly funding the publishing of
> materials for the Freemasons, Rosicrucians, "Spear-Shakers", "Knights
> of the Helmet", as well as publishing, with the assistance of Ben
> Jonson, a selection of the plays that they believe he had written
> under the pen name of "Shake-Speare" in a "First Folio" in 1623.
> English Channel, and secretly traveled in disguise after 1626 through
> France, Germany, Poland, Hungary, and other areas utilizing the secret
> network of Freemasons and Rosicrucians that he was associated with. It
> is alleged that he continued to write under pseudonyms, as he had done
> before 1626, continuing to write as late as 1670 (using the pseudonym
> "Comte De Gabalis"). Elinor Von Le Coq, wife of Professor Von Le Coq
> in Berlin, stated that she had found evidence in the German Archives
> that Francis Bacon stayed after 1626 with the family of Johannes
> Valentinus Andreae in Germany.
>
> Ascended Master Teachings organizations began making the claim that
> Sunday 1626 and then travelled extensively outside of England,
> eventually attaining his physical Ascension to another plane on May 1,
neonprose @ gmail.com
> Occult theories about Francis Bacon
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
>
> <<A number of writers, some of whom were connected with Theosophy,
> have claimed that Francis Bacon (22 January 1561 – 9 April 1626), the
> English philosopher, statesman, scientist, and author, was a member of
> secret societies; a smaller number claim that he was an Ascended
> Master and was reincarnated.
>
> Francis Bacon often gathered with the men at Gray's Inn to discuss
> politics and philosophy, and to try out various theatrical scenes that
> he admitted writing.
it would have killed his "mother" Lady Anne Bacon who was rigid
in her Christianity.
> Bacon's alleged connection to the Rosicrucians
> and the Freemasons has been widely discussed by authors and scholars
> in many books.
he was ever tempted to drive a clown car in a Masonic
parade.
> However others, including Daphne du Maurier (in her
> biography of Bacon), have argued there is no substantive evidence to
> support claims of involvement with the Rosicrucians.
The Rosicrucian Thing was founded eons before Bacon
was ever conceived (by the Queen) so we have to stamp
it . . .
I R R E L E V A N T
> Historian Dame
> Frances Yates does not make the claim that Bacon was a Rosicrucian,
> but presents evidence that he was nevertheless involved in some of the
> more closed intellectual movements of his day.
how to keep an eye on the Spanish that swarmed around
the Elizabethan Court. For years Bacon's older half-brother
Anthony was an "intelligencer" on the Continent.
Bacon and Anthony devised a code which I believe was
used to some extent by the Allies in WWII.
I'll have to look that up, but I know that Bacon's
facility in inventing unbreakable codes was a real
asset to the English during the Armada. Kind of
a one if by land and two if by sea situation.
> She argues that Bacon's
> movement for the advancement of learning was closely connected with
> the German Rosicrucian movement, while Bacon's The New Atlantis
> portrays a land ruled by Rosicrucians.
produce? When I was in school I would read nothing
for pleasure except satires, parodies, etc., nearly all
of them done by English authors. Animal Farm eventually
pales but it's wonderful the first time through.
> He apparently saw his own
> movement for the advancement of learning to be in conformity with
> Rosicrucian ideals.
In no sense did Bacon try to advance learning through
"Rosicrucian ideals" whatever those were.
He was a straightforward genius in so many areas
of learning -- law, science, navigation for starters.
Bacon has never bored me.
> In 1618 Francis Bacon decided to secure a lease for York House. This
> had been his boyhood home in London next to the Queen's York Place
> before the Bacon family had moved to Gorhambury in the countryside.
> After Lord Egerton (Lord Keeper of the Great Seal of England) died, it
> became available for Bacon to lease. During the next four years this
> mansion on the Strand (so large that it had 40 fireplaces) served as
> the home for Francis and Alice Bacon. Over the next four years Bacon
> would host banquets at York House that were attended by the leading
> men of the time, including poets, scholars, authors, scientists,
> lawyers, diplomats, and foreign dignitaries. Within the banquet hall,
> Francis gathered the greatest leaders in literature, art, law,
> education, and social reform. On 22 January 1621 in honour of Sir
> Francis Bacon's sixtieth birthday, a select group of men assembled in
> the large banquet hall in York House without fanfare for what has been
> described as a Masonic banquet. This banquet was to pay tribute to Sir
> Francis Bacon. Only those of the Rosicrosse (Rosicrucians) and the
> Masons who were already aware of Bacon's leadership role were invited.
> The tables were T-tables with gleaming white drapery, silver, and
> decorations of flowers. The poet Ben Jonson, a long-time friend of
> Bacon, gave a Masonic ode to Bacon that day.
James I's favorite Buckingham kept pushing James to push
Bacon out of York House because he, Buckingham wanted
to play . . .
I N T E R I O R D E C O R A T O R
So James eventually gave Bacon the bad news that
his lease on York House would be prematurely
terminated and that Buckingham, who loved the
high windows and the statuary out back would be
moving in.
So Bacon took it like a man and moved back to
his prior quarters.
Buckingham went in and pulled down all the
velvet wallpaper which had been put up by . . .
I think it was the Archbishop of Canterbury.
Buckingham was running around holding
up paint chips and fabric samples and going
on and on about the tall high windows (one of
the best features of York House) and the
statuary on the lawn running down to the
Thames but when the interior had been redecorated
and the painters and carpenters left, the guests
were shocked by the color scheme Buckingham
had chosen, i.e., baby blue, orange, yellow,
etc.
> There was a depth of love by a large body of men toward Bacon, similar
> to some degree in the manner that disciples love a Master. This is
> especially true when taking into account his membership (and some say
> leadership) of secret societies such as the Rosicrucians and
> Freemasons. In the inner esoteric membership, which included Francis
> Bacon, vows of celibacy for spiritual reasons were encouraged.
habit of sleeping only with married women because
reliable birth control was at least three hundred years
away.
Bullcrap Alert:
neonprose @ gmail.com
> Occult theories about Francis Bacon
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
> <<A number of writers, some of whom were connected with Theosophy,
> have claimed that Francis Bacon (22 January 1561 – 9 April 1626), the
> English philosopher, statesman, scientist, and author, was a member of
> secret societies; a smaller number claim that he was an Ascended
> Master and was reincarnated.
>
> Francis Bacon often gathered with the men at Gray's Inn to discuss
> politics and philosophy, and to try out various theatrical scenes that
> but presents evidence that he was nevertheless involved in some of the
> the German Rosicrucian movement, while Bacon's The New Atlantis
> Rosicrucian ideals.
>
> had been his boyhood home in London next to the Queen's York Place
> before the Bacon family had moved to Gorhambury in the countryside.
> After Lord Egerton (Lord Keeper of the Great Seal of England) died, it
> became available for Bacon to lease. During the next four years this
> mansion on the Strand (so large that it had 40 fireplaces) served as
> the home for Francis and Alice Bacon. Over the next four years Bacon
> would host banquets at York House that were attended by the leading
> men of the time, including poets, scholars, authors, scientists,
> lawyers, diplomats, and foreign dignitaries. Within the banquet hall,
> Francis gathered the greatest leaders in literature, art, law,
> education, and social reform. On 22 January 1621 in honour of Sir
> Francis Bacon's sixtieth birthday, a select group of men assembled in
> the large banquet hall in York House without fanfare for what has been
> described as a Masonic banquet. This banquet was to pay tribute to Sir
> Francis Bacon. Only those of the Rosicrosse (Rosicrucians) and the
> Masons who were already aware of Bacon's leadership role were invited.
> The tables were T-tables with gleaming white drapery, silver, and
> decorations of flowers. The poet Ben Jonson, a long-time friend of
> Bacon, gave a Masonic ode to Bacon that day.
>
> to some degree in the manner that disciples love a Master. This is
> especially true when taking into account his membership (and some say
> leadership) of secret societies such as the Rosicrucians and
> Freemasons. In the inner esoteric membership, which included Francis
> Bacon, vows of celibacy for spiritual reasons were encouraged.
>
neonprose @ gmail.com
> In article
> > art <acne...@gmail.com> (aka Noonedafter) wrote:
HE KEEPS WRITING THE FOLLOWING, OVER AND OVER:
"...has been described..."? By *whom*? Source? Are you trying to
emulate Elizabeth's style, Art?>
perhaps you could go down to Dartmouth and
hit him between the shoulder blades with the
back of a wooden spoon. Not too hard, we don't
want to disorganize his thought processes which
have so entertained us over the years.
neon...@gmail.com
> > Occult theories about Francis Bacon
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
>
> it."
>
> No surprise there!
>
>
>
> "Blavatsky [one of the founders of Theosophy] suggested that most
> of present day humanity belongs to the fifth rootrace, the
> Aryans[8], which originally developed on Atlantis,.[9] It was
> her belief that the older races will eventually die out, as the
> fifth rootrace in time will be replaced by the more advanced
> peoples of the sixth root race which is set to develop on the
> reemerging Lemurian continent.[10]"
>
> Evidently geology was not among Mme. Blavatsky's areas of expertise.
> But if you believe this, Art, then there's a book that I think that
> you would find extremely congenial -- it's by a guy named Velikovsky.
>
> > English philosopher, statesman, scientist, and author, was a member of
> > secret societies; a smaller number claim that he was an Ascended
> > Master and was reincarnated.
>
> Art? If so, there's a guy named Michael Martin (the surname is an
> anagram of "I'm Art N."!) whom you should meet -- you would be well
> suited to be one of his disciples, Art.
>
> > politics and philosophy, and to try out various theatrical scenes that
> > he admitted writing.
>
> > Bacon's alleged connection to the Rosicrucians
> > and the Freemasons has been widely discussed by authors and scholars
> > in many books.
>
> "authors and scholars"? Are you trying to emulate Elizabeth's style,
> Art?
>
> > biography of Bacon), have argued there is no substantive evidence to
> > support claims of involvement with the Rosicrucians.
>
>
> > Frances Yates does not make the claim that Bacon was a Rosicrucian,
> > but presents evidence that he was nevertheless involved in some of the
> > more closed intellectual movements of his day. She argues that Bacon's
> > movement for the advancement of learning was closely connected with
> > the German Rosicrucian movement, while Bacon's The New Atlantis
> > portrays a land ruled by Rosicrucians. He apparently saw his own
> > movement for the advancement of learning to be in conformity with
> > Rosicrucian ideals.
> >
> > In 1618 Francis Bacon decided to secure a lease for York House. This
> > had been his boyhood home in London next to the Queen's York Place
> > before the Bacon family had moved to Gorhambury in the countryside.
> > After Lord Egerton (Lord Keeper of the Great Seal of England) died, it
> > became available for Bacon to lease. During the next four years this
> > mansion on the Strand (so large that it had 40 fireplaces) served as
> > the home for Francis and Alice Bacon. Over the next four years Bacon
> > would host banquets at York House that were attended by the leading
> > men of the time, including poets, scholars, authors, scientists,
> > lawyers, diplomats, and foreign dignitaries. Within the banquet hall,
> > Francis gathered the greatest leaders in literature, art, law,
> > education, and social reform. On 22 January 1621 in honour of Sir
> > Francis Bacon's sixtieth birthday, a select group of men assembled in
> > the large banquet hall in York House without fanfare for what has been
> > described
>
> emulate Elizabeth's style, Art?
>
> > Francis Bacon. Only those of the Rosicrosse (Rosicrucians) and the
> > Masons who were already aware of Bacon's leadership role were invited.
> > The tables were T-tables with gleaming white drapery, silver, and
> > decorations of flowers. The poet Ben Jonson, a long-time friend of
> > Bacon, gave a Masonic ode to Bacon that day.
> >
> > There was a depth of love by a large body of men toward Bacon,
>
>
> > to some degree in the manner that disciples love a Master. This is
> > especially true when taking into account his membership (and some say
> > leadership)
>
> Elizabeth's style, Art?
>
> > Freemasons. In the inner esoteric membership, which included Francis
> > Bacon, vows of celibacy for spiritual reasons were encouraged.
> >
> > Faked death theory
> >
> > Various authors
>
> emulate Elizabeth's style, Art?
>
> > Bacon had gone into debt while secretly funding the publishing of
> > materials for the Freemasons, Rosicrucians, "Spear-Shakers",
>
>
> > of the Helmet", as well as publishing, with the assistance of Ben
> > Jonson, a selection of the plays that they believe he had written
> > under the pen name of "Shake-Speare" in a "First Folio" in 1623.
> > Furthermore, they allege
>
> Elizabeth's style, Art?
>
> > English Channel, and secretly traveled in disguise after 1626 through
> > France, Germany, Poland, Hungary, and other areas utilizing the secret
> > network of Freemasons and Rosicrucians that he was associated with. It
> > is alleged
>
> Elizabeth's style, Art?
>
> > before 1626, continuing to write as late as 1670
>
>
> > "Comte De Gabalis"). Elinor Von Le Coq, wife of Professor Von Le Coq
> > in Berlin, stated that she had found evidence in the German Archives
> > that Francis Bacon stayed after 1626 with the family of Johannes
> > Valentinus Andreae in Germany.
> >
> > Beginning early in the 20th century in the United States, a number of
> > Ascended Master Teachings organizations began making the claim that
> > Francis Bacon had never died.
>
>
> > the "Shake-Speare" plays, he had feigned his own death on Easter
> > Sunday 1626 and then travelled extensively outside of England,
> > eventually attaining his physical Ascension to another plane on May 1,
> > 1684 in the region of the Carpathian Mountains.
>
>
> "Shit upon Art N., maniac."
>
> > Bacon took on the name "Saint Germain"
>
neonprose @ gmail.com
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
>
> English philosopher, statesman, scientist, and author, was a member of
> secret societies; a smaller number claim that he was an Ascended
> Master and was reincarnated.
>
> politics and philosophy, and to try out various theatrical scenes that
> but presents evidence that he was nevertheless involved in some of the
> more closed intellectual movements of his day. She argues that Bacon's
> movement for the advancement of learning was closely connected with
> the German Rosicrucian movement, while Bacon's The New Atlantis
> portrays a land ruled by Rosicrucians. He apparently saw his own
> movement for the advancement of learning to be in conformity with
> Rosicrucian ideals.
>
> In 1618 Francis Bacon decided to secure a lease for York House. This
> had been his boyhood home in London next to the Queen's York Place
> before the Bacon family had moved to Gorhambury in the countryside.
> After Lord Egerton (Lord Keeper of the Great Seal of England) died, it
> became available for Bacon to lease. During the next four years this
> mansion on the Strand (so large that it had 40 fireplaces) served as
> the home for Francis and Alice Bacon. Over the next four years Bacon
> would host banquets at York House that were attended by the leading
> men of the time, including poets, scholars, authors, scientists,
> lawyers, diplomats, and foreign dignitaries. Within the banquet hall,
> Francis gathered the greatest leaders in literature, art, law,
> education, and social reform. On 22 January 1621 in honour of Sir
> Francis Bacon's sixtieth birthday, a select group of men assembled in
> the large banquet hall in York House without fanfare for what has been
> Masons who were already aware of Bacon's leadership role were invited.
> The tables were T-tables with gleaming white drapery, silver, and
> decorations of flowers. The poet Ben Jonson, a long-time friend of
> Bacon, gave a Masonic ode to Bacon that day.
>
> especially true when taking into account his membership (and some say
> Bacon, vows of celibacy for spiritual reasons were encouraged.
>
> Faked death theory
>
> Jonson, a selection of the plays that they believe he had written
> under the pen name of "Shake-Speare" in a "First Folio" in 1623.
> France, Germany, Poland, Hungary, and other areas utilizing the secret
> network of Freemasons and Rosicrucians that he was associated with. It
> before 1626, continuing to write as late as 1670 (using the pseudonym
> in Berlin, stated that she had found evidence in the German Archives
> that Francis Bacon stayed after 1626 with the family of Johannes
> Valentinus Andreae in Germany.
>
> Beginning early in the 20th century in the United States, a number of
> Ascended Master Teachings organizations began making the claim that
> Sunday 1626 and then travelled extensively outside of England,
> eventually attaining his physical Ascension to another plane on May 1,
> Bacon took on the name "Saint Germain" as an Ascended Master.>>
neonprose @ gmail.com
neonprose @ gmail.com
> On Saturday, July 31, 2010 6:55:07 PM UTC-7, Arthur Neuendorffer wrote:
>
> > Occult theories about Francis Bacon
>
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
>
>
>
> NEONPROSE DID NOT WRITE THIS OR THE BELOW
write stuff below, feel free to post the disclaimer. :)
David L. Webb
> > Occult theories about Francis Bacon
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
> NEONPROSE DID NOT WRITE THIS OR THE BELOW
clearly. Besides, the Wikipedia article quoted, while it recounts
crackpot beliefs, is at least written mostly in correct English, so it
seems unlikely that even attributionally-challenged readers of h.l.a.s.
(Art, Crowley, etc.) would be apt to think that Elizabeth wrote it.
David L. Webb
> > Occult theories about Francis Bacon
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
>
> Right, Art. The founder of empirical science dabbled in the occult. . .
>
> NOT
>
> > <<A number of writers, some of whom were connected with Theosophy,
> > have claimed that Francis Bacon (22 January 1561 9 April 1626), the
> > English philosopher, statesman, scientist, and author, was a member of
> > secret societies; a smaller number claim that he was an Ascended
> > Master and was reincarnated.
> THE ABOVE WOULD BE TERMED . . . . BULL SHIT.
> > Francis Bacon often gathered with the men at Gray's Inn to discuss
> > politics and philosophy, and to try out various theatrical scenes that
> > he admitted writing.
> MORE BULLCRAP. Bacon never admitted that he wrote plays.
[...]
> Court of France for several years where he wrote poetry with the
> but Germany? I doubt it.
> Ben Jonson was too lazy to be a Mason, this is all apocrophal [sic] crap.
[...]
> point, Jonson's plays were intended to out William Shappere.
> I recall
-- e.g., Coppélia Kahn's paper "Remembering Shakespeare Imperially: The
1916 Tercentenary", G. B. Harrison's preface to Clara Longworth de
Chambrun's _Shakespeare Rediscovered By means of Public Records,
Secret Reports & Private Correspondence Newly Set Forth as Evidence on
His Life & Work_, the King of Navarre as a character in _As You Like
It_, Dave Kathman's essay "Dating _The Tempest_" that Elizabeth alleged
-- several times! -- mentioned Richard Field, etc. -- to repose any
confidence in the veracity of what Elizabeth "recalls"; a source will be
necessary.
> reading one of Jonson's plays which featured an
> all-male cast. William Shappere was one of the characters.
> I found the script boring but you can probably find it online.
all male does not identify it in any way, since *all* Elizabethan
theater companies were all male.
> > Furthermore, they allege that Bacon faked his own death, crossed the
> > English Channel, and secretly traveled in disguise after 1626 through
> > France, Germany, Poland, Hungary, and other areas utilizing the secret
> > network of Freemasons and Rosicrucians that he was associated with. It
> > is alleged that he continued to write under pseudonyms, as he had done
> > before 1626, continuing to write as late as 1670 (using the pseudonym
> > "Comte De Gabalis"). Elinor Von Le Coq, wife of Professor Von Le Coq
> > in Berlin, stated that she had found evidence in the German Archives
> > that Francis Bacon stayed after 1626 with the family of Johannes
> > Valentinus Andreae in Germany.
> Am I double posting? I read the above last night.
over and over and over cannot be very highly recommended as a practice
to emulate.
[...]
anti-Stratfordians are very much present.
> ho hos, twinkies, etc. I can't even imagine the Norwegians
> going on about ding dongs, ho hos and twinkies.
David L. Webb
> On 2012-11-18 19:47:39 +0000, David L. Webb said:
> > Elizabeth's own factual contribution in this post (disregarding the
> > quoted material) surpasses her best efforts to date!
> I'd put it on my website, but it's too verbose for direct citation and
> too demented to paraphrase.
produced many, many howlers that surely deserve mention at your website,
some of which are not too verbose (although perhaps too demented). In
particular, I nominate the following for consideration:
(1) Newton (who died in 1727) engaged in a rancorous priority dispute
with Hegel (who was born in 1770).
(2) Thomas Seymour (who was conveyed to the Tower in January of 1549
and executed in March of that year) fathered the Earl of Oxford (born
12 April 1550) on the young princess Elizabeth Tudor, thereby saddling
the future Virgin Queen with a pregnancy of over 14 months' duration.
(And it's even worse than that -- just this week, Elizabeth claimed that
Seymour was conveyed to the Tower *after* it became clear that he had
impregnated the girl, which lengthens the putative gestation period to
more like 16 months.)
(3) The emperor Claudius (whose reign began in 41 A.D.) banished Ovid
(dead by 18 A.D.) from Rome. Even more bizarre, Elizabeth believes that
Tomis, Ovid's place of exile on the Black Sea coast of what is now
Romania, is in Yugoslavia.
(4) Perhaps one of Elizabeth's funniest historical (and hysterical)
assertions is the following (it may be too verbose to quote and it is
certainly too demented to do justice to in a paraphrase, but as Dirac
said, one must try):
"Other than the guilds, nothing Masonic existed
until the English and their allies defeated the Ottoman
Empire in Vienna.
"About eight years later the Ottomans allowed the
first English tourists into Egypt where the English
saw things "masonic" for the VERy first time.
"Two rather unstable personalities, Newton and Milton,
got access to a few pieces of hieroglyphs and in trying
to translate them (the discovery of the Rosetta Stone
would have to wait for Napoleon) inadvertently invented
the RIDICULOUS Masonic Movement."
Those who are not blessed by Elizabeth's unshakeable confidence in her
own hallucinations have always been compelled to rely upon more mundane
conventional history, in which the English were not even among the
combatants in the siege of Vienna. The chronology in Elizabeth's
version is particularly funny, since Milton (who died in 1674) had
already been dead for nearly a decade when the Ottoman defeat at Vienna
took place (in 1683).
(5) The character Osric does not appear in the First Folio version of
_Hamlet_.
(6) Albert Michelson was awarded the first Nobel Prize in physics. (As
is both well known and easy to check, there were nine Nobel Laureates in
physics prior to Michelson.)
(7) Elizabeth claims that Aubrey was a "corroborative eye witness" to
the Earl of Oxford's sodomy of boys in his entourage -- yet Oxford died
(in 1604) some two decades *before* Aubrey was born (in 1626).
(8) Elizabeth claims, based upon having "read" Coppélia Kahn's paper
"Remembering Shakespeare Imperially: The 1916 Tercentenary", that the
volume _A Book of Homage to Shakespeare_ edited by Israel Gollancz was
to be presented to Queen Victoria at the Shakespeare tercentenary. Yet
the *very first sentence* in Kahn's paper describes how a group of men
met in 1914 to plan the tercentenary memorial volume -- over a decade
*after* Victoria's death in 1901.
(9) As an erudite Medieval historian, Elizabeth wrote:
"My point, Kennedy, is that medievals didn't know the difference
between lies and truth. Nobody did until the Renaissance genius
Francis Bacon overturned Aristotelian logic. Aristotelian logic
couldn't differentiate between truth and lies making the medieval
era into a virtual Liar's Culture."
Also, while it would be a Herculean task scarcely worth the effort,
it would be amusing if there were links to some of the original h.l.a.s.
posts that you paraphrase so delightfully. I could probably furnish
several such links if desired.
John W Kennedy
> Bacon never admitted to writing "various theatrical scenes" becauseit
> would have killed his "mother" Lady Anne Bacon who was rigidin her
> Christianity.
and Porrex"
--
John W Kennedy
"But now is a new thing which is very old--
that the rich make themselves richer and not poorer,
which is the true Gospel, for the poor's sake."
-- Charles Williams. "Judgement at Chelmsford"
marco
marc
John W Kennedy
> volume _A Book of Homage to Shakespeare_ edited by Israel Gollancz was
> to be presented to Queen Victoria at the Shakespeare tercentenary. Yet
> the *very first sentence* in Kahn's paper describes how a group of men
> met in 1914 to plan the tercentenary memorial volume -- over a decade
> *after* Victoria's death in 1901.
>
> (9) As an erudite Medieval historian, Elizabeth wrote:
>
> "My point, Kennedy, is that medievals didn't know the difference
> between lies and truth. Nobody did until the Renaissance genius
> Francis Bacon overturned Aristotelian logic. Aristotelian logic
> couldn't differentiate between truth and lies making the medieval
> era into a virtual Liar's Culture."
>
> Also, while it would be a Herculean task scarcely worth the effort,
> it would be amusing if there were links to some of the original h.l.a.s.
> posts that you paraphrase so delightfully. I could probably furnish
> several such links if desired.
that putting in pointers would require trusting Google Groups, the
responsibility for which Google seems to have turned over to their
freshmen-in-propellor-beanies department.
--
John W Kennedy
Read the remains of Shakespeare's lost play, now annotated!
http://www.SKenSoftware.com/Double%20Falshood
neonprose @ gmail.com
> Occult theories about Francis Bacon
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occult_theories_about_Francis_Bacon
>
> have claimed that Francis Bacon (22 January 1561 – 9 April 1626), the
> English philosopher, statesman, scientist, and author, was a member of
> secret societies; a smaller number claim that he was an Ascended
> Master and was reincarnated.
>
> politics and philosophy, and to try out various theatrical scenes that
> English Channel, and secretly traveled in disguise after 1626 through
> France, Germany, Poland, Hungary, and other areas utilizing the secret
> network of Freemasons and Rosicrucians that he was associated with. It
> is alleged that he continued to write under pseudonyms, as he had done
> before 1626, continuing to write as late as 1670 (using the pseudonym
> "Comte De Gabalis"). Elinor Von Le Coq, wife of Professor Von Le Coq
> in Berlin, stated that she had found evidence in the German Archives
> that Francis Bacon stayed after 1626 with the family of Johannes
> Valentinus Andreae in Germany.
>
David L. Webb
> > volume _A Book of Homage to Shakespeare_ edited by Israel Gollancz was
> > to be presented to Queen Victoria at the Shakespeare tercentenary. Yet
> > the *very first sentence* in Kahn's paper describes how a group of men
> > met in 1914 to plan the tercentenary memorial volume -- over a decade
> > *after* Victoria's death in 1901.
> >
> > (9) As an erudite Medieval historian, Elizabeth wrote:
> >
> > "My point, Kennedy, is that medievals didn't know the difference
> > between lies and truth. Nobody did until the Renaissance genius
> > Francis Bacon overturned Aristotelian logic. Aristotelian logic
> > couldn't differentiate between truth and lies making the medieval
> > era into a virtual Liar's Culture."
> >
> > Also, while it would be a Herculean task scarcely worth the effort,
> > it would be amusing if there were links to some of the original h.l.a.s.
> > posts that you paraphrase so delightfully. I could probably furnish
> > several such links if desired.
> responsibility for which Google seems to have turned over to their
> freshmen-in-propellor-beanies department.
any more; Google's Usenet archive has become a very hit-or-miss affair,
with more misses than hits.
But Elizabeth just keeps furnishing more material at a spectacular
rate. I hope that you didn't miss this gem, in a thread that she just
initiated:
"I was reading the Shakespeare Sonnets on an attractive
Sonnet site when I realized that the Poet of the Sonnets was
telling his son, William Herbert, to STOP MASTURBATING and
GET MARRIED. Stop wasting your sperm and start using it to
produce a son.
"That was a bit of a shock!
"Then I realized that if William Shappere of Stratford is the
Poet of the Sonnets, William Herbert cannot be his son.
"I don't know what happened to Hamnet (was that his name?)
but it would be very odd on the part of Shappere to lecture a son
so young to stop masturbating and GET MARRIED tp produce
another son. I think I read that boys don't even produce sperm
until they're in their teens, so why is Shappere harranging young
Hamnet in the Shakespeare Sonnets?
"Now we have to decide whether this advice is coming from
Shappere of Stratford or whether Bacon is the true author of
the Shakespeare Sonnets, using the Sonnets to urge his son
William to get married and produce a son of his own."
neonprose @ gmail.com
> On 2012-11-18 19:47:39 +0000, David L. Webb said:
>
> > Elizabeth's own factual contribution in this post (disregarding the
>
> > quoted material) surpasses her best efforts to date!
>
>
>
> I'd put it on my website, but it's too verbose for direct citation and
>
> too demented to paraphrase.
>