The thousand faces of Dr. Rollett
Art Neuendorffer
>>>>>>> 1) Ezra (& 5 others) wrote the bible from memory in 40 days.
>>>
>>>>>>> 2) Sheldon translated Don Quixote in 40 days
>>>>>>(and then put it aside for years)
>>>
>>>>>>> 3) Rollett solved the Sonnets dedication riddle in 5 minutes
>>>>>> (and then put it aside for years)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Do you notice any similarites, Dave?????
>>>>>> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
>>>
>>>>> Yes, Art -- Rollett was rasher than Ezra or Sheldon,
>>>>>>> and the outcome of his effort suffered thereby.
>>>>> "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>You mean because the Grand Master forced him to renounce discoVERy
>>>> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
>>>>
>>>>> How would the Grand Master possibly
>>>>> "force" him to do anything of the kind?
>>> "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
>
>>>> Why would Rollett back off otherwise?
>> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
>>> I can think of seVERal reasons, Art. One is that he is a sane,
>>>rational man, and considered many of our reasonable criticisms.
> "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
>> Why would he defy the Grand Master to publish in the first place?
"David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> *THINK*, Art! Did it neVER occur to you that
> he was not a Templar when he made his discoVERy?
That doesn't wash, Dave.
Rollett's ER article is SO PHONEY in So, SO many ways:
-------------------------------------------------------
1) Rollett assigns himself 5 minutes before bed to solve
the Sonnets cipher or nEVER consider it again.
2) Rollett then proceeds to solve the Sonnets cipher
within the allotted time while counting off the minutes!
3) Rollett then gives us only the incomplete solution:
"These Sonnets all by ever...."
4) Rollett then simply ignores his solution for years.
(Why not another 5 minutes to figure what it means).
-------------------------------------------------------
Besides, no one has offered me Templar membership.
What am I...chopped liVERE?
>> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
>
>>> There is certainly no need to talk of anyone outside the Priory of
>>> Sion being "forced" by the Grand Master to do anything, Art; only we
>>> of the Bloodline are sworn to absolute obedience. Besides, the Grand
>>> Master has means that are equally persuasive and far less coercive;
>>>after all, he has at his disposal the entire resources of the Templar
>>> treasury -- all he need do is send someone to Oak Island to make
>>> a withdrawal.
> "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
>> That's just an Oak, right?
"David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
>Only partially, Art; he does have at his disposal the resources of
>the Templar treasury. Where that resides I am not going to tell you.
But that's not liquid assets! (Stolen paintings, etc.)
--------------------------------------------------------
{anagram}
M. ROLLETT
MET TROLL
TELL'M ROT
-------------------------------------------------------------
John M. Rollett THE OXFORDIAN Volume II 1999
http://www.oxfordian.com/99-Rollet-Dedication.pdf
<<If the [Sonnet's Dedication] was a cryptogram
(as Hotson had argued so strongly),
then it was clear to me that it must be concealing something else.
As it was so late, I decided to give myself five minutes to find the
solution, and if it didn?t work out, I would forget the whole thing.
ONE of the oddest features of the Dedication is the full-stops after
every word. Puzzling over this, at about 11.01, it suddenly occurred
to me that they suggest counting words.
One can imagine someone with a pen or pencil touching the point on
the paper after each word as it is counted. The stops and hyphens
tell one to count the two compound words separately, it would seem,
and that ?Mr. W. H.? counts as three items, not one.
If we have to count words, the obvious thing to do is
to see whether every 3rd word, or 4th or 5th and so on,
yields a message. It takes very little time to do this, and the
result in every case is rubbish. For example, every 5th word gives
this message: OF. W. THAT. EVER. WELL. FORTH., not very promising.
It was now about 11.02.
The next simplest thing to do, still sticking with counting words,
is to alternate two numbers, and for example to take the 3rd word,
followed by the 5th, and then the 3rd, and so on.
But if the scheme is like this,
trial and error would get us nowhere, as there are so many possible
combinations of two small numbers. Indeed, if we try and guess two
numbers, we might well end up with two or more possible messages, and
be unable to decide between them. If the cryptographer was working
along these lines, it would be obvious to him (just as it is obvious
to us) that he must tell us what the two numbers are, either directly,
or hidden in some simple fashion. It is now 11.03.
There are no numbers in the Dedication, and nothing to suggest
two numbers. But if we have to count words, there must be numbers
somewhere. Time was running out. I was about to give up. 11.04.
Then I suddenly focussed in on another peculiarity. The text is laid
out in three blocks, which might suggest three numbers. The number of
lines in each block is something that the cryptographer would have
had under his control. The lines in the three blocks give us the 3
numbers: 6-2-4. Perhaps this is the clue to the hidden information?
Remember, I was after ?Mr. W. H.? Counting through, using
these numbers as the key, I found the following:
THESE. SONNETS. ALL. BY. EVER....
This message started off in quite an interesting fashion, but sadly
it ended up as rubbish, just as the other attempts at a solution had.
I had never heard of any Elizabethan poet called EVER, and it sounded
very unlikely as a name anyway. Obviously the Dedication was not a
cryptogram, after all, so I put the book down, feeling a little
disappointed, and went off to sleep. In any case, like Hotson,
I was looking for a clue to the identity of ?Mr. W. H.,? and had
never doubted that the gentleman from Stratford was the author
of the Sonnets and everything else.
Incidentally, I would like to suggest that perhaps Hotson?s
heart was really in the right place, all along, since after
analyzing many of the sonnets, he says finally, ?If one had to
put the Sonnets into one word, that word would be Truth.?
I forgot all about this discovery, or rather non-discovery, for the
next 2 or 3 years, until having time to spare in a big library I
decided (on an impulse) to look at the article on Shakespeare in
the Encyclopedia Britannica.
I leafed idly through it until towards the end,
when I found a section headed ?Questions of Authorship.? I was rather
surprised to find anything on such a fringe topic (my apologies all
round), but duly read the general argument and a paragraph on Francis
Bacon, until I was amazed to come upon the following two sentences.
A theory that the author of the plays was Edward de Vere, 17th earl of
Oxford, receives some circumstantial support from the coincidence that
Oxford?s known poems apparently ceased just before Shakespeare?s works
began to appear. It is argued that Oxford assumed a pseudonym in order
to protect his family from the social stigma attached to the stage,
and also because extravagance had brought him into disrepute at Court.
I immediately recalled the rubbish message of a few years back, since
obviously EVER could now be read as E. VER or Edward Vere. A strange
coincidence, not to say a thought-provoking one. But I still remained
very skeptical, and was sure that chance was the most likely
explanation of this odd result.>>
-------------------------------------------------------------
Art Neuendorffer
David L. Webb
"Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
(amorondaf...@comicass.nut) wrote:
> The thousand faces of Dr. Rollett:
But Art -- didn't your last "thread count" post tally the many faeces
of Art Morondafter at well oVER 45,000? That figure easily oVERtakes
the thousand faces of Dr. Rollett by oVER an order of magnitude!
> >>>>>>> 1) Ezra (& 5 others) wrote the bible from memory in 40 days.
> >>>
> >>>>>>> 2) Sheldon translated Don Quixote in 40 days
> >>>>>>(and then put it aside for years)
> >>>
> >>>>>>> 3) Rollett solved the Sonnets dedication riddle in 5 minutes
> >>>>>> (and then put it aside for years)
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Do you notice any similarites, Dave?????
> >>>>>> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> >>>
> >>>>> Yes, Art -- Rollett was rasher than Ezra or Sheldon,
> >>>>>>> and the outcome of his effort suffered thereby.
> >>>>> "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>>>You mean because the Grand Master forced him to renounce discoVERy
> >>>> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> >>>>
> >>>>> How would the Grand Master possibly
> >>>>> "force" him to do anything of the kind?
> >>> "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
> >
> >>>> Why would Rollett back off otherwise?
This reminds one forcibly of the comic conjectures of Elizabeth
Weird: "Why else would a site on queer studies have a book on Southampton
listed in the biography?" I already suggested one plausible reason:
that Rollett is a sane, rational man, that he considered many of our
reasonable criticisms carefully, and that he therefore recognized and
acknowledged the justice of those criticisms. Not eVERyone is as
delusional as your Clueless Cretin persona is, Art.
> >> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
>
> >>> I can think of seVERal reasons, Art. One is that he is a sane,
> >>>rational man, and considered many of our reasonable criticisms.
> > "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
>
> >> Why would he defy the Grand Master to publish in the first place?
> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
>
> > *THINK*, Art! Did it neVER occur to you that
> > he was not a Templar when he made his discoVERy?
> That doesn't wash, Dave.
>
> Rollett's ER article is SO PHONEY in So, SO many ways:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> 1) Rollett assigns himself 5 minutes before bed to solve
> the Sonnets cipher or nEVER consider it again.
>
> 2) Rollett then proceeds to solve the Sonnets cipher
> within the allotted time while counting off the minutes!
>
> 3) Rollett then gives us only the incomplete solution:
> "These Sonnets all by ever...."
>
> 4) Rollett then simply ignores his solution for years.
> (Why not another 5 minutes to figure what it means).
Because, as I already told, "These sonnets all by ever" is
meaningless in English.
> -------------------------------------------------------
> Besides, no one has offered me Templar membership.
I already told you the reason for this too, Art: only those who are
intelligent and rational and who come close to discoVERing the truth
about Shakespeare authorship are offered membership in the conspiracy --
and if they don't accept it...well, I'd better stop here, as I've
already said too much. In any case, Art, you're certainly in no danger.
> What am I...chopped liVERE?
No, Art -- that only happens to those who *don't* accept membership
in the conspiracy when it is offered. As I already said, you are in no
danger, because of the requisites of intelligence and rationality.
> >> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> >
> >>> There is certainly no need to talk of anyone outside the Priory of
> >>> Sion being "forced" by the Grand Master to do anything, Art; only we
> >>> of the Bloodline are sworn to absolute obedience. Besides, the Grand
> >>> Master has means that are equally persuasive and far less coercive;
> >>>after all, he has at his disposal the entire resources of the Templar
> >>> treasury -- all he need do is send someone to Oak Island to make
> >>> a withdrawal.
> > "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
>
> >> That's just an Oak, right?
> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
>
> >Only partially, Art; he does have at his disposal the resources of
> >the Templar treasury. Where that resides I am not going to tell you.
> But that's not liquid assets! (Stolen paintings, etc.)
> --------------------------------------------------------
> {anagram}
> M. ROLLETT
> MET TROLL
> TELL'M ROT
INPNC score 0/8.
But Art -- "Arthur C. Nevendorffer" is a perfect anagram of
Nth run for de Ver farce.
Here N is at least 45,000, according to your last "thread count" post.
[...]
Art Neuendorffer
> > >>>
> > >>>>>>> 2) Sheldon translated Don Quixote in 40 days
> > >>>>>>(and then put it aside for years)
> > >>>
> > >>>>>>> 3) Rollett solved the Sonnets dedication riddle in 5 minutes
> > >>>>>> (and then put it aside for years)
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> Do you notice any similarites, Dave?????
>
> > >>>>>> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> > >>>
> > >>>>> Yes, Art -- Rollett was rasher than Ezra or Sheldon,
> > >>>>>>> and the outcome of his effort suffered thereby.
>
> > >>>>> "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>>>>You mean because the Grand Master forced him to renounce discoVERy
>
> > >>>> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> > >>>>
> > >>>>> How would the Grand Master possibly
> > >>>>> "force" him to do anything of the kind?
>
> > >>> "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
> > >
>>>>>> Why would Rollett back off otherwise?
David L. Webb wrote:
> I already suggested one plausible reason:
> that Rollett is a sane, rational man, that he considered many of our
> reasonable criticisms carefully, and that he therefore recognized and
> acknowledged the justice of those criticisms.
A sane, rational man, Dave?
<<Well, after several years, and many thousands of paragraphs,
probably well over 20 thousand, I have only found one sentence
that even remotely made any sense at all. >> -jmrollett
> > >> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> >
> > >>> I can think of seVERal reasons, Art. One is that he is a sane,
> > >>>rational man, and considered many of our reasonable criticisms.
>
> > > "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
> >
> > >> Why would he defy the Grand Master to publish in the first place?
>
> > "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> >
> > > *THINK*, Art! Did it neVER occur to you that
> > > he was not a Templar when he made his discoVERy?
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > That doesn't wash, Dave.
> >
> > Rollett's ER article is SO PHONEY in So, SO many ways:
David L. Webb wrote:
> That is indeed a VERy common shortcoming of many articles
> appearing in _Elizabeth Review_, Art; it has certainly
> taken you a long time to notice.
Its my natural gullibility to initially trust people like Rollett.
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > 1) Rollett assigns himself 5 minutes before bed to solve
> > the Sonnets cipher or nEVER consider it again.
> >
> > 2) Rollett then proceeds to solve the Sonnets cipher
> > within the allotted time while counting off the minutes!
> >
> > 3) Rollett then gives us only the incomplete solution:
> > "These Sonnets all by ever...."
> >
> > 4) Rollett then simply ignores his solution for years.
> > (Why not another 5 minutes to figure what it means).
David L. Webb wrote:
> Well, for one thing, "These sonnets all by ever"
> is meaningless in English -- meaningful sentences
> must generally have verbs (not VerB.S.).
--------------------------------------------------------
King Henry VI, Part ii Act 4, Scene 1
Captain: And all by thee.
--------------------------------------------------------
But "These sonnets all by ever the fourth" or
"These sonnets all by ever the fourth cross"
are pregnant with meaning in English.
--------------------------------------------------------
David L. Webb wrote:
> MoreoVER, "eVER" is not usually a noun, except
> in the VERy old, obsolete sense of "a wild boar,".
That's the sense!
David L. Webb wrote:
> Matters being so, it would be little wonder that
> Rollett abandoned the supposed "solution" as meaningless.
---------------------------------------------------------------
He could have saved himself a lot of work:
<<the message was found by counting through using the key 6-2-4,
derived from the layout, which produced a short but (dare I say)
intriguing message. When I first did this, I thought that it
must be quite common to find possible messages in this sort of
way, and that was why I was so ready to believe that the message
was simply a chance sequence of words. Eventually I decided to put
this to the test. I started counting through paragraphs of books
I happened to be reading, every now and then, in order to see how
often 6-2-4 turned up a meaningful 5-word sentence or remark, not
knowing whether it would be one in 10 or one in 100 or whatever.
Well, after several years, and many thousands of paragraphs,
probably well over 20 thousand, I have only found one sentence
that even remotely made any sense at all. >>
---------------------------------------------------------------
But nothing about Rollett surprises me anymore.
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > -------------------------------------------------------
> > Besides, no one has offered me Templar membership.
David L. Webb wrote:
> Templar membership is only offered to outsiders who come too close
>to discoVERing the truth, Art. There is scant danger of your eVER
>doing that, even with copious hints. You haven't even figured out
> the reason that the SACCC met in Tikal this year.
Not having received a postcard from anywhere
near Tikal, I only have your word on it, Dave.
-----------------------------------------------------------
Mayan Mayhem: Episode 3 - Terror In Tikal
http://www2.warnerbros.com/web/sd_brand/index.jsp
Will Scooby and Shaggy ever make it through
the mysterious maze of Tikal, and back to their chili?
-----------------------------------------------------------
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > What am I...chopped liVERE?
David L. Webb wrote:
> No, Art -- that only happens to those who *don't* accept membership
> in the conspiracy when it is offered. As I already said, you are in no
> danger, because of the requisites of intelligence and rationality.
>and if they don't accept it...well, I'd better stop here, as I've
>already said too much. In any case, Art, you're certainly in no danger.
My wife will be glad to here that.
(It's a VERy VERy long drop down those TIKAL steps!)
------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/jacktheripper.html
First, Jubela?"O that my throat had been cut across, my tongue torn
out,
and my body buried in the rough sands of the sea, at low water mark,
where the tide ebbs and flows twice in twenty-four hours, ere
I had been accessory to the death of so good a man
as our Grand Master, Hiram Abiff!"
The second, Jubelo?"O that my left breast had been torn open and my
heart and vitals taken from thence and thrown over my left shoulder,
carried into the valley of Jehosaphat, and there to become a prey
to the wild beasts of the field and vultures of the air, ere I had
conspired the death of so good a man as our Grand Master, Hiram Abiff!"
The third, Jubelum?"O that my body had been severed in two in the
midst,
and divided to the north and south, my bowels burnt to ashes in the
center, and the ashes scattered by the four winds of heaven, that there
might not the least track or remembrance remain among men, or Masons,
of so vile and perjured a wretch as I am; ah, Jubela and Jubelo,
it was I that struck him harder than you both. It was I that
gave him the fatal blow; it was I that killed him outright;"
------------------------------------------------------------------
One of the symbols used by Italian Freemasonry is a Black Friar...
------------------------------------------------------------------
'The Five Points of Fellowship'
Master Master Initiation Ritual
Brother,
foot to foot teaches you that you should, whenever asked, go
on a brother's errand, if within the length of your cable-tow,
even if you should have to go barefoot and bareheaded.
Knee to knee, that you should always remember a Master Mason
in your devotions to Almighty God.
Breast to breast, that you should keep the Master Mason's secrets,
when given to you in charge as such, as secure and inviolable in
your breast as they were in his own before communicated to you.
Hand to back, that you should support a Master Mason
behind his back as before his face.
Mouth to ear, that you should support his good name
as well behind his back as before his face.
> > >> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> > >
> > >>> There is certainly no need to talk of anyone outside the Priory of
> > >>> Sion being "forced" by the Grand Master to do anything, Art; only we
> > >>> of the Bloodline are sworn to absolute obedience. Besides, the Grand
> > >>> Master has means that are equally persuasive and far less coercive;
> > >>>after all, he has at his disposal the entire resources of the Templar
> > >>> treasury -- all he need do is send someone to Oak Island to make
> > >>> a withdrawal.
>
> > > "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
> >
> > >> That's just an Oak, right?
>
> > "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> >
> > >Only partially, Art; he does have at his disposal the resources of
> > >the Templar treasury. Where that resides I am not going to tell you.
>
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > But that's not liquid assets! (Stolen paintings, etc.)
David L. Webb wrote:
> The Templar treasury was already of incalculable value in 1312,
> and it has only been enhanced and augmented since then, Art.
Both enhanced AND augmented!
Art Neuendorffer
David L. Webb
"Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
(amorondaf...@comicass.nut) wrote:
> > > >>>>>>> 1) Ezra (& 5 others) wrote the bible from memory in 40 days.
> > > >>>
> > > >>>>>>> 2) Sheldon translated Don Quixote in 40 days
> > > >>>>>>(and then put it aside for years)
> > > >>>
> > > >>>>>>> 3) Rollett solved the Sonnets dedication riddle in 5 minutes
> > > >>>>>> (and then put it aside for years)
> > > >>>>>>>
> > > >>>>>>> Do you notice any similarites, Dave?????
> > > >>>>>> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> > > >>>
> > > >>>>> Yes, Art -- Rollett was rasher than Ezra or Sheldon,
> > > >>>>>>> and the outcome of his effort suffered thereby.
> > > >>>>> "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>>>>>You mean because the Grand Master forced him to renounce discoVERy
> > > >>>> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>> How would the Grand Master possibly
> > > >>>>> "force" him to do anything of the kind?
> > > >>> "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
> > > >
> >>>>>> Why would Rollett back off otherwise?
> David L. Webb wrote:
>
> > I already suggested one plausible reason:
> > that Rollett is a sane, rational man, that he considered many of our
> > reasonable criticisms carefully, and that he therefore recognized and
> > acknowledged the justice of those criticisms.
> A sane, rational man, Dave?
He acknowledged the justice of our criticisms, Art -- what better
indication of sanity and rationality could you desire?
> <<Well, after several years, and many thousands of paragraphs,
> probably well over 20 thousand, I have only found one sentence
> that even remotely made any sense at all. >> -jmrollett
> > > >> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> > >
> > > >>> I can think of seVERal reasons, Art. One is that he is a sane,
> > > >>>rational man, and considered many of our reasonable criticisms.
> > > > "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
> > >
> > > >> Why would he defy the Grand Master to publish in the first place?
> > > "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> > >
> > > > *THINK*, Art! Did it neVER occur to you that
> > > > he was not a Templar when he made his discoVERy?
> > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
>
> > > That doesn't wash, Dave.
> > >
> > > Rollett's ER article is SO PHONEY in So, SO many ways:
> David L. Webb wrote:
>
> > That is indeed a VERy common shortcoming of many articles
> > appearing in _Elizabeth Review_, Art; it has certainly
> > taken you a long time to notice.
> Its [sic] my natural gullibility to initially trust people like Rollett.
For once your credulity has no led you amiss, Art; you can trust
Rollett. After all, he acknowledged the justice of our criticisms, Art
-- what better indication of trustworthiness could you desire?
> > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > 1) Rollett assigns himself 5 minutes before bed to solve
> > > the Sonnets cipher or nEVER consider it again.
> > >
> > > 2) Rollett then proceeds to solve the Sonnets cipher
> > > within the allotted time while counting off the minutes!
> > >
> > > 3) Rollett then gives us only the incomplete solution:
> > > "These Sonnets all by ever...."
> > >
> > > 4) Rollett then simply ignores his solution for years.
> > > (Why not another 5 minutes to figure what it means).
> David L. Webb wrote:
>
> > Well, for one thing, "These sonnets all by ever"
> > is meaningless in English -- meaningful sentences
> > must generally have verbs (not VerB.S.).
> --------------------------------------------------------
> King Henry VI, Part ii Act 4, Scene 1
>
> Captain: And all by thee.
"Thee" makes sense in the context; "ever" does not.
> --------------------------------------------------------
> But "These sonnets all by ever the fourth" or
> "These sonnets all by ever the fourth cross"
> are pregnant with meaning in English.
And what on earth do you suppose that "These sonnets all by ever the
fourth cross" might mean, Art? Have you been taking English lessons
from Mr. Innes? Incidentally, the word "cross" does not appear; you
must be hallucinating again.
> David L. Webb wrote:
>
> > MoreoVER, "eVER" is not usually a noun, except
> > in the VERy old, obsolete sense of "a wild boar,".
> That's the sense!
The last recorded example of that sense in the OED is dated around
1230, Art. You are aware, are you not, that English underwent profound
changes during the ensuing three and a half centuries? Well, perhaps
you are not.
> David L. Webb wrote:
>
> > Matters being so, it would be little wonder that
> > Rollett abandoned the supposed "solution" as meaningless.
> He could have saved himself a lot of work:
>
> <<the message was found by counting through using the key 6-2-4,
> derived from the layout, which produced a short but (dare I say)
> intriguing message. When I first did this, I thought that it
> must be quite common to find possible messages in this sort of
> way, and that was why I was so ready to believe that the message
> was simply a chance sequence of words. Eventually I decided to put
> this to the test. I started counting through paragraphs of books
> I happened to be reading, every now and then, in order to see how
> often 6-2-4 turned up a meaningful 5-word sentence or remark, not
> knowing whether it would be one in 10 or one in 100 or whatever.
>
> Well, after several years, and many thousands of paragraphs,
> probably well over 20 thousand, I have only found one sentence
> that even remotely made any sense at all. >>
I found seVERal sentences in one evening that made at least as much
sense as "These sonnets all by ever."
> But nothing about Rollett surprises me anymore.
>
> > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > Besides, no one has offered me Templar membership.
> David L. Webb wrote:
>
> > Templar membership is only offered to outsiders who come too close
> >to discoVERing the truth, Art. There is scant danger of your eVER
> >doing that, even with copious hints. You haven't even figured out
> > the reason that the SACCC met in Tikal this year.
> Not having received a postcard from anywhere
> near Tikal, I only have your word on it, Dave.
Chichicastenango is not that far from Tikal, Art; Guatemala is not
that big a country. In any case, you might have observed that Tikal
features seVERal star y-pointing pyramids of magnificent proportions and
venerable antiquity. There is nothing comparable in Chichicastenango.
You really *are* slow on the uptake, Art!
Art Neuendorffer
> > > > >
> > >>>>>> Why would Rollett back off otherwise?
>
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
> > > I already suggested one plausible reason:
> > > that Rollett is a sane, rational man, that he considered many of our
> > > reasonable criticisms carefully, and that he therefore recognized and
> > > acknowledged the justice of those criticisms.
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > A sane, rational man, Dave?
> > <<Well, after several years, and many thousands of paragraphs,
> > probably well over 20 thousand, I have only found one sentence
> > that even remotely made any sense at all. >> -jmrollett
David L. Webb wrote:
> He acknowledged the justice of our criticisms, Art -- what
> better indication of sanity and rationality could you desire?
YOUR criticisms, Dave?
You mean like when you chastised Reedy for that Phantom letter?
> > > > >> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> > > >
> > > > >>> I can think of seVERal reasons, Art. One is that he is a sane,
> > > > >>>rational man, and considered many of our reasonable criticisms.
>
> > > > > "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >> Why would he defy the Grand Master to publish in the first place?
>
> > > > "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> > > >
> > > > > *THINK*, Art! Did it neVER occur to you that
> > > > > he was not a Templar when he made his discoVERy?
>
> > > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> >
> > > > That doesn't wash, Dave.
> > > >
> > > > Rollett's ER article is SO PHONEY in So, SO many ways:
>
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
> > > That is indeed a VERy common shortcoming of many articles
> > > appearing in _Elizabeth Review_, Art; it has certainly
> > > taken you a long time to notice.
>
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > It's my natural gullibility to initially trust people like Rollett.
David L. Webb wrote:
> For once your credulity has no led you amiss, Art; you can trust
> Rollett. After all, he acknowledged the justice of our criticisms, Art
> -- what better indication of trustworthiness could you desire?
YOUR criticisms, Dave?
You mean like when you chastised Reedy for that Phantom letter?
> > > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > 1) Rollett assigns himself 5 minutes before bed to solve
> > > > the Sonnets cipher or nEVER consider it again.
> > > >
> > > > 2) Rollett then proceeds to solve the Sonnets cipher
> > > > within the allotted time while counting off the minutes!
> > > >
> > > > 3) Rollett then gives us only the incomplete solution:
> > > > "These Sonnets all by ever...."
> > > >
> > > > 4) Rollett then simply ignores his solution for years.
> > > > (Why not another 5 minutes to figure what it means).
>
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
> > > Well, for one thing, "These sonnets all by ever"
> > > is meaningless in English -- meaningful sentences
> > > must generally have verbs (not VerB.S.).
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > --------------------------------------------------------
> > King Henry VI, Part ii Act 4, Scene 1
> >
> > Captain: And all by thee.
David L. Webb wrote:
> "Thee" makes sense in the context; "ever" does not.
But it MUST BE either: "ever the fourth"
or "ever the fourth cross"
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > --------------------------------------------------------
> > But "These sonnets all by ever the fourth" or
> > "These sonnets all by ever the fourth cross"
> > are pregnant with meaning in English.
David L. Webb wrote:
> And what on earth do you suppose that
> "These sonnets all by ever the fourth cross"
> might mean, Art?
CROSS is something Shake-speare used to
rhyme with LOSS (as in di*SSOL*vere)
---------------------------------------------
Sonnet 34
Nor can thy shame give physic to my grief;
Though thou repent, yet I have still the LOSS:
The offender's sorrow lends but weak relief
To him that bears the strong offence's CROSS.
Sonnet 42
If I lose thee, my loss is my love's gain,
And losing her, my friend hath found that LOSS;
Both find each other, and I lose both twain,
And both for my sake lay on me this CROSS:
The Passionate Pilgrim Sonnet 18
One silly CROSS
Wrought all my LOSS;
---------------------------------------------
David L. Webb wrote:
> Incidentally, the word "cross" does not appear;
> you must be hallucinating again.
-------------------------------------------------
Then make it "ever the fourth *T*" if you like:
"E.VER" is the fourth *T* in the '19' Rollett array:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
_ T O T__ __H E O N L ___ i __ <E> B ___ E G E T T E R O
_ F T H__ __E S E I n ______ s __ U <I> __ N G S O N N E T
_ S M__ (R) _W h a L L ___- h _ A P <P> _ I N E S____ S E A
_ N D__ (T) __h a t E__ T___- [e] - R N <I> __ T I E <P> R O M
___ I S__ (E) __D B Y O U _ [r] _E V <E> R L <I>__V I N G
_ {P} O_ (E) __t W I S_ H __ [e] _T H [T] H <E> W E L L W
__ {I} S__ (H) __I N G A _- [d V e] - N [T] U _____R E R I N S
__ {E} t__ (T) __I N G F O _ *R* T H [T] T
<= 19 =>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
ACTS 19:19: "And a NUMBER of those who practiced magic arts
brought their *books together & BURNED them* in the sight of all;"
--------------------------------------------------------------------
End of [Don Quixote's] First Sally & the book burning:
<<"I should have shed tears myself," said the curate when he heard the
title, "had I ordered that BOOK to be BURNED, for its author
was one of the famous poets of the world, not to say of Spain,
and was VERy happy in the translation of some of Ovid's fables.">>
----------------------------------------------------------------
JOHN 19:19: Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross.
And the writing was,
JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS.
[ IN*R*I ]
-------------------------------------------------------------
Thou hadst bin a companion for a King;.
And, beene A KING AMONG THE MEANER SORT.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
<<[Free]Masons read the [ IN*R*I ] inscription as:
[I]gne [N]atura [R]enovatur [I]ntegra
meaning: "Through FIRE, NATURE is reborn whole"
or: "By FIRE NATURE is renewed whole",
symbolizing Humankind's spiritual regeneration
by the sacred FIRE of TRUTH & love.>> - From Wikipedia
---------------------------------------------------------------
If one includes the "T.T." in the SONNETS dedication
then the Rollett 6-2-4 method generates:
THESE SONNETS ALL BY EVER THE FORTH "T"
-------------------------------------------------------------
Pat-a-cake, pat-a-cake, Baker's man!
Bake me a cake As fast as you can.
Pat it, and prick it, And mark it with a "T"
And put it in the oven, For peTer and me.
..................................................................
[The globe 'THEETR' burnt on St. peTer's day (1613)]
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
<= 19 =>
_ T O T__ __H E O N L ___ i __ <E> B ___ E G E T T E R O
_ F T H__ __E S E I n ______ s __ U <I> __ N G S O N N E T
_ S M__ (R) _W h a L L ___- h _ A P <P> _ I N E S____ S E A
_ N D__ (T) __h a t E__ T___- [e] - R N <I> __ T I E <P> R O M
___ I S__ (E) __D B Y O U _ [r] _E V <E> R L <I>__V I N G
_ {P} O_ (E) __t W I S_ H __ [e] _T H [T] H <E> W E L L W
__ {I} S__ (H) __I N G A _- [d V e] - N [T] U _____R E R I N S
__ {E} t__ (T) __I N G F O _ *R* T H [T] T
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Singe CAPons, or POOR PIGS, dropping their eyes;
Condemn'd me to the OVENs with the <PIES>;
And so, have kept me dying a whole age,
Nor ravish'd all hence in a minute's rage."
........................................................................
After his library FIRE of 1623 Ben Jonson
wrote of his loss in "An Execration upon Vulcan"
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
22 P**'s => 4 PIE's
(22*21*20*19)/(4*3*2*1)
14 I's: (14/145)*(13/144)*(12/143)*(11/142)
23 E's: (23/141)*(22/140)*(21/139)*(20/138)
Probability of 4 oven PIE's ~ 1/4,300
-----------------------------------------------------------
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
> > > MoreoVER, "eVER" is not usually a noun, except
> > > in the VERy old, obsolete sense of "a wild boar,".
>
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > That's the sense!
>
David L. Webb wrote:
> The last recorded example of that sense in the OED is dated around
> 1230, Art. You are aware, are you not, that English underwent profound
> changes during the ensuing three and a half centuries? Well, perhaps
> you are not.
Yes...they stopped being so explicit about what they wanted to say.
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
> > > Matters being so, it would be little wonder that
> > > Rollett abandoned the supposed "solution" as meaningless.
>
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > He could have saved himself a lot of work:
> >
> > <<the message was found by counting through using the key 6-2-4,
> > derived from the layout, which produced a short but (dare I say)
> > intriguing message. When I first did this, I thought that it
> > must be quite common to find possible messages in this sort of
> > way, and that was why I was so ready to believe that the message
> > was simply a chance sequence of words. Eventually I decided to put
> > this to the test. I started counting through paragraphs of books
> > I happened to be reading, every now and then, in order to see how
> > often 6-2-4 turned up a meaningful 5-word sentence or remark, not
> > knowing whether it would be one in 10 or one in 100 or whatever.
> >
> > Well, after several years, and many thousands of paragraphs,
> > probably well over 20 thousand, I have only found one sentence
> > that even remotely made any sense at all. >>
>
David L. Webb wrote:
> I found seVERal sentences in one evening that made at least
> as much sense as "These sonnets all by ever."
Do tell!!!
> > > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > Besides, no one has offered me Templar membership.
>
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
> > > Templar membership is only offered to outsiders who come too close
> > >to discoVERing the truth, Art. There is scant danger of your eVER
> > >doing that, even with copious hints. You haven't even figured out
> > > the reason that the SACCC met in Tikal this year.
>
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > Not having received a postcard from anywhere
> > near Tikal, I only have your word on it, Dave.
David L. Webb wrote:
> Chichicastenango is not that far from Tikal, Art; Guatemala is not
> that big a country. In any case, you might have observed that Tikal
> features seVERal star y-pointing pyramids of magnificent proportions and
> venerable antiquity. There is nothing comparable in Chichicastenango.
> You really *are* slow on the uptake, Art!
I haven't mentioned Milton's pyramids in a while.
Art Neuendorffer
David L. Webb
"Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
(amorondaf...@comicass.nut) wrote:
> > > > > >>> "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > >>>>>> Why would Rollett back off otherwise?
> > > David L. Webb wrote:
> > >
> > > > I already suggested one plausible reason:
> > > > that Rollett is a sane, rational man, that he considered many of our
> > > > reasonable criticisms carefully, and that he therefore recognized and
> > > > acknowledged the justice of those criticisms.
> > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
>
> > > A sane, rational man, Dave?
>
> > > <<Well, after several years, and many thousands of paragraphs,
> > > probably well over 20 thousand, I have only found one sentence
> > > that even remotely made any sense at all. >> -jmrollett
> David L. Webb wrote:
>
> > He acknowledged the justice of our criticisms, Art -- what
> > better indication of sanity and rationality could you desire?
> YOUR criticisms, Dave?
Of course, Art. I was among the group who initially read and
analyzed his argument, and upon whose conclusions Terry Ross reported in
this forum:
<http://groups.google.com/group/humanities.lit.authors.shakespeare/msg/19
512c2cb8d39665?dmode=source&hl=en>.
> You mean like when you chastised Reedy for that Phantom letter?
I? As I have said before, Art, one hesitates to explain a joke, as
its impact is thereby vitiated -- but sometimes, as in the case of a
moron like amorondaf...@comicass.nut, it cannot be helped.
> > > > > >> "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> > > > >
> > > > > >>> I can think of seVERal reasons, Art. One is that he is a sane,
> > > > > >>>rational man, and considered many of our reasonable criticisms.
> >
> > > > > > "Art Neuendorffer" wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > >> Why would he defy the Grand Master to publish in the first place?
> >
> > > > > "David L. Webb" <David.L.W...@Dartmouth.edu> wrote
> > > > >
> > > > > > *THINK*, Art! Did it neVER occur to you that
> > > > > > he was not a Templar when he made his discoVERy?
> >
> > > > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > >
> > > > > That doesn't wash, Dave.
> > > > >
> > > > > Rollett's ER article is SO PHONEY in So, SO many ways:
> >
> > > David L. Webb wrote:
> > >
> > > > That is indeed a VERy common shortcoming of many articles
> > > > appearing in Elizabeth Review , Art; it has certainly
> > > > taken you a long time to notice.
> >
> > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
>
> > > It's my natural gullibility to initially trust people like Rollett.
>
> David L. Webb wrote:
>
> > For once your credulity has no led you amiss, Art; you can trust
> > Rollett. After all, he acknowledged the justice of our criticisms, Art
> > -- what better indication of trustworthiness could you desire?
> YOUR criticisms, Dave?
Of course, Art. I was among the group who initially read and
analyzed his argument, and upon whose conclusions Terry Ross reported in
this forum:
<http://groups.google.com/group/humanities.lit.authors.shakespeare/msg/19
512c2cb8d39665?dmode=source&hl=en>.
You evidently have not been paying attention.
> You mean like when you chastised Reedy for that Phantom letter?
I? As I have said before, Art, one hesitates to explain a joke, as
its impact is thereby vitiated -- but sometimes, as in the case of a
moron like amorondaf...@comicass.nut, it cannot be helped. (If
Tom had *really* been chastised as you surmise, then he certainly would
not be posting to h.l.a.s., Art. Surely even you can put two and two
together, Art.)
> > > > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > > > > -------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > 1) Rollett assigns himself 5 minutes before bed to solve
> > > > > the Sonnets cipher or nEVER consider it again.
> > > > >
> > > > > 2) Rollett then proceeds to solve the Sonnets cipher
> > > > > within the allotted time while counting off the minutes!
> > > > >
> > > > > 3) Rollett then gives us only the incomplete solution:
> > > > > "These Sonnets all by ever...."
> > > > >
> > > > > 4) Rollett then simply ignores his solution for years.
> > > > > (Why not another 5 minutes to figure what it means).
> >
> > > David L. Webb wrote:
> > >
> > > > Well, for one thing, "These sonnets all by ever"
> > > > is meaningless in English -- meaningful sentences
> > > > must generally have verbs (not VerB.S.).
>
> > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
>
> > > --------------------------------------------------------
> > > King Henry VI, Part ii Act 4, Scene 1
> > >
> > > Captain: And all by thee.
>
> David L. Webb wrote:
>
> > "Thee" makes sense in the context; "ever" does not.
> But it MUST BE either: "ever the fourth"
> or "ever the fourth cross"
No, Art; there is no "must be" about it -- the supposed cipher simply
is not valid.
> > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
>
> > > --------------------------------------------------------
> > > But "These sonnets all by ever the fourth" or
> > > "These sonnets all by ever the fourth cross"
> > > are pregnant with meaning in English.
> David L. Webb wrote:
>
> > And what on earth do you suppose that
>
> > "These sonnets all by ever the fourth cross"
>
> > might mean, Art?
> CROSS is something Shake-speare used to
> rhyme with LOSS (as in di*SSOL*vere)
It also rhymes with "dross," Art.
[Lunatic logorrhea snipped]
> David L. Webb wrote:
>
> > Incidentally, the word "cross" does not appear;
> > you must be hallucinating again.
> -------------------------------------------------
> Then make it "ever the fourth *T*" if you like:
>
> "E.VER" is the fourth *T* in the '19' Rollett array:
And just what do you hallucinate that "These sonnets all by ever the
fourth T." means in English, Art? Not even Mr. Streitz or Mr. Innes
could write something that devoid of sense.
[Lunatic logorrhea snipped]
> <= 19 =>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> ACTS 19:19: "And a NUMBER of those who practiced magic arts
> brought their *books together & BURNED them* in the sight of all;"
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> End of [Don Quixote's] First Sally & the book burning:
>
> <<"I should have shed tears myself," said the curate when he heard the
> title, "had I ordered that BOOK to be BURNED, for its author
> was one of the famous poets of the world, not to say of Spain,
> and was VERy happy in the translation of some of Ovid's fables.">>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>
> JOHN 19:19: Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross.
> And the writing was,
> JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS.
>
> [ IN*R*I ]
I don't recall any mention of emphasis of "R" in the text, Art. Are
you misquoting again? In any case, what is your point, if any? That
Pilate was alluding to Rollett? If so, then your habitual chronological
cluelessness continues to astound, even after idiocies like Virgil
predating Herodotus, etc.
> -------------------------------------------------------------
> Thou hadst bin a companion for a King;.
> And, beene A KING AMONG THE MEANER SORT.
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> <<[Free]Masons read the [ IN*R*I ] inscription as:
>
> [I]gne [N]atura [R]enovatur [I]ntegra
>
> meaning: "Through FIRE, NATURE is reborn whole"
> or: "By FIRE NATURE is renewed whole",
>
> symbolizing Humankind's spiritual regeneration
> by the sacred FIRE of TRUTH & love.>> - From Wikipedia
So?
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
>
> If one includes the "T.T." in the SONNETS dedication
> then the Rollett 6-2-4 method generates:
>
> THESE SONNETS ALL BY EVER THE FORTH "T"
...which is just as meaningless as "There sonnets all by ever" or
"These sonnets all by ever the fourth cross."
> -------------------------------------------------------------
> Pat-a-cake, pat-a-cake, Baker's man!
> Bake me a cake As fast as you can.
> Pat it, and prick it, And mark it with a "T"
> And put it in the oven, For peTer and me.
Huh? Are you reVERting to childhood, Art?
> ..................................................................
> [The globe 'THEETR' burnt on St. peTer's day (1613)]
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
[Lunatic logorrhea snipped]
Who is "they," Art? The conspirators of your paranoid invention?
One must be grateful for small blessings.
> Art Neuendorffer
Art Neuendorffer
> > > >
>>>>> Rollett is a sane, rational man, that he considered many of our
>>>>> reasonable criticisms carefully, and that he therefore recognized and
>>>>> acknowledged the justice of those criticisms.
>
> > > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> >
> > > > A sane, rational man, Dave?
> >
> > > > <<Well, after several years, and many thousands of paragraphs,
> > > > probably well over 20 thousand, I have only found one sentence
> > > > that even remotely made any sense at all. >> -jmrollett
>
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
>>> He acknowledged the justice of our criticisms, Art -- what
>>> better indication of sanity and rationality could you desire?
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
>> YOUR criticisms, Dave?
David L. Webb wrote:
> Of course, Art. I was among the group who initially read and
> analyzed his argument, and upon whose conclusions
> Terry Ross reported in this forum:
>
> <http://groups.google.com/group/humanities.lit.authors.shakespeare/msg/19
> 512c2cb8d39665?dmode=source&hl=en>.
This was long before I myself took Rollett's
"THESE SONNETS ALL BY EVER" solution seriously
(for many of the same reasons enumerated by TROSS).
But then, "THESE SONNETS ALL BY EVER"
is NOT the correct solution, is it, Dave!
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
>> You mean like when you chastised Reedy for that Phantom letter?
David L. Webb wrote:
> I?
That's not a sentence, Dave.
David L. Webb wrote:
> (If Tom had *really* been chastised
> as you surmise, then he certainly would
> not be posting to h.l.a.s., Art.
Tom certainly would not dare attempt to respond
to your's TRULY EVER again. (Which he doesn't)
>> > > > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
>>>>> > -------------------------------------------------------
>>>>> > 1) Rollett assigns himself 5 minutes before bed to solve
>>>>> > the Sonnets cipher or nEVER consider it again.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > 2) Rollett then proceeds to solve the Sonnets cipher
>>>>> > within the allotted time while counting off the minutes!
>>>>> >
>>>>> > 3) Rollett then gives us only the incomplete solution:
>>>>> > "These Sonnets all by ever...."
>>>>> >
>>>>> > 4) Rollett then simply ignores his solution for years.
>>>>> > (Why not another 5 minutes to figure what it means).
> > >
> > > > David L. Webb wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Well, for one thing, "These sonnets all by ever"
> > > > > is meaningless in English -- meaningful sentences
> > > > > must generally have verbs (not VerB.S.).
> >
> > > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> >
> > > > --------------------------------------------------------
> > > > King Henry VI, Part ii Act 4, Scene 1
> > > >
> > > > Captain: And all by thee.
> >
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
> > > "Thee" makes sense in the context; "ever" does not.
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > But it MUST BE either: "ever the fourth"
> > or "ever the fourth cross"
David L. Webb wrote:
> No, Art; there is no "must be" about it
> -- the supposed cipher simply is not valid.
---------------------------------------------------------
3. How Do We Know When To Stop?
Rollett's proposed EVER cipher does have a rule for starting and
for proceeding but not for stopping. If we consider each string
that terminates in a period to be a word, and we pick the words
by using the 6-2-4 pattern, we get:
"THESE SONNETS ALL BY EVER THE FORTH T"
---------------------------------------------------------
> > > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> >
> > > > --------------------------------------------------------
> > > > But "These sonnets all by ever the fourth" or
> > > > "These sonnets all by ever the fourth cross"
> > > > are pregnant with meaning in English.
>
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
> > > And what on earth do you suppose that
> >
> > > "These sonnets all by ever the fourth cross"
> >
> > > might mean, Art?
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > CROSS is something Shake-speare used to
> > rhyme with LOSS (as in di*SSOL*vere)
David L. Webb wrote:
> It also rhymes with "dross," Art.
David ROSS? (A love child, perhaps?)
I admit no qualifying D.ROSS (or TROSS or Dwebb)!
----------------------------------------------------
Troilus and Cressida Act 4, Scene 4
CRESSIDA: My love admits no qualifying DROSS;
No more my grief, in such a precious LOSS.
----------------------------------------------------
Sonnet 146
Then soul, live thou upon thy servant's LOSS,
And let that pine to aggravate thy store;
Buy terms divine in selling hours of DROSS;
Within be fed, without be rich no more:
----------------------------------------------------
The Comedy of Errors Act 2, Scene 2
ADRIANA: If aught possess thee from me, it is DROSS,
Usurping ivy, brier, or idle MOSS;
Who, all for want of pruning, with intrusion
Infect thy sap and live on thy confusion.
----------------------------------------------------
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
> > > Incidentally, the word "cross" does not appear;
> > > you must be hallucinating again.
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > -------------------------------------------------
> > Then make it "ever the fourth *T*" if you like:
> >
> > "E.VER" is the fourth *T* in the '19' Rollett array:
David L. Webb wrote:
> And just what do you hallucinate that
> "These sonnets all by ever the fourth T."
> means in English, Art?
It refers to someone who might join Jesus & the two thieves:
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tunc crucifixerant
- Crucifixion from St. Matthew's Gospel (Figure 31)
Book of Kells - Its History, Construction and Knotwork
http://pcssd.org/nwoodart/book_of_kells%20WRITTEN%20REPORT.htm
<<This page contains the words
"Tunk crucifixerant christum cum ao dous lettromes",
"Then they had crucified two thieves with him Christ".
There is no image of the crucifixion in the Book of Kells but
most likely the facing blank page was intended for this purpose.
This theory would explain the three groups of onlookers included
in the decorative scheme for the page. This page also contains
two roaring LIONS which provides a counter point to the restrained
and formal composition. There is knotwork within the 'T' of Tunk
and interlacing inside the counter space of the 'T' surrounding
the LION's head. Key patterns and knot patterns alternately
fill the interior border's blocks.>>
-----------------------------------------------------------------
_ T O T__ __H E O N L ___ i __ <E> B ___ E G E T T E R O
_ F T H__ __E S E I n ______ s __ U <I> __ N G S O N N E T
_ S M__ (R) _W h a L L ___- h _ A P <P> _ I N E S____ S E A
_ N D__ (T) __h a t E__ T___- [e] - R N <I> __ T I E <P> R O M
___ I S__ (E) __D B Y O U _ [r] _E V <E> R L <I>__V I N G
_ {P} O_ (E) __t W I S_ H __ [e] _T H [T] H <E> W E L L W
__ {I} S__ (H) __I N G A _- [d V e] - N [T] U _____R E R I N S
__ {E} t__ (T) __I N G F O _ *R* T H [T] T
<= 19 =>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
>> ACTS 19:19: "And a NUMBER of those who practiced magic arts
>> brought their *books together & BURNED them* in the sight of all;"
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> > End of [Don Quixote's] First Sally & the book burning:
> >
>> <<"I should have shed tears myself," said the curate when he heard
>> the title, "had I ordered that BOOK to be BURNED, for its author
>> was one of the famous poets of the world, not to say of Spain,
>> and was VERy happy in the translation of some of Ovid's fables.">>
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------
> > JOHN 19:19: Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross.
> > And the writing was,
> > JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS.
> >
> > [ IN*R*I ]
David L. Webb wrote:
> I don't recall any mention of emphasis of "R" in the text, Art.
> Are you misquoting again? In any case, what is your point, if any?
My point is that there is a tremendous amount of crucifixion imagery:
---------------------------------------------------------------
"CLAMBERING TO HAN(G, AN E)NVIOUS SLIVER BROKE"
V E R O N I L V E R I U S
_________ L
_________ E
_________ N
_________ K
_________ C
_________ N
_________ I
_________ R
_________ B
__ (A G N E)S B O G A
_________ A
_________ M
_________ O
_________ H
_________ T
http://www.webpages.free-online.co.uk/portcull/templar.gif
http://www.webpages.free-online.co.uk/portcull/hospital.gif
http://www.webpages.free-online.co.uk/portcull/jdemolay.gif
--------------------------------------------------------------------
<<On 23 July 1567, while practicing fencing with Edward Baynam,
a TAILOR, in the backyard of Cecil's house in the Strand, the
seventeen-year-old Oxford killed an unarmed undercook named
THOMAS BRINCKNELL
with a thrust to the thigh. A packed jury instructed by CECIL
found that Brincknell had caused his own death by wilfully
hurling himself on Oxford's rapier.
Condemned as a suicide, Brincknell was denied Christian burial,
and his pregnant widow AGNES & three-year-old son QUYNTYN
were stripped of their assets and abandoned to her relatives
and the parish church.>> -- Prof. Alan Nelson
Coroner's Inquest <<Inquisition taken in the parish of St. Martin's in
the Fields 24 July 1567 before Richard Vale, coroner, upon a viewing
of the body of Thomas Brincknell, of Westminster, yeoman, lying dead,
by seventeen named jurymen,
----------------------------------------------------------- ---
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
>> -------------------------------------------------------------
>> Thou hadst bin a companion for a King;.
>> And, beene A KING AMONG THE MEANER SORT.
>> --------------------------------------------------------------
>> <<[Free]Masons read the [ IN*R*I ] inscription as:
>>
>> [I]gne [N]atura [R]enovatur [I]ntegra
>>
>> meaning: "Through FIRE, NATURE is reborn whole"
>> or: "By FIRE NATURE is renewed whole",
>>
>> symbolizing Humankind's spiritual regeneration
>> by the sacred FIRE of TRUTH & love.>> - From Wikipedia
David L. Webb wrote:
> So?
My point is that there is a tremendous amount of book burning imagery.
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> If one includes the "T.T." in the SONNETS dedication
>> then the Rollett 6-2-4 method generates:
>>
>> THESE SONNETS ALL BY EVER THE FORTH "T"
David L. Webb wrote:
> ...which is just as meaningless as "There sonnets all by ever"
> or "These sonnets all by ever the fourth cross."
Only when you snip the Rollett array:
------------------------------------------------------------------
<= 19 =>
_ T O T__ __H E O N L ___ i __ <E> B ___ E G E T T E R O
_ F T H__ __E S E I n ______ s __ U <I> __ N G S O N N E T
_ S M__ (R) _W h a L L ___- h _ A P <P> _ I N E S____ S E A
_ N D__ (T) __h a t E__ T___- [e] - R N <I> __ T I E <P> R O M
___ I S__ (E) __D B Y O U _ [r] _E V <E> R L <I>__V I N G
_ {P} O_ (E) __t W I S_ H __ [e] _T H [T] H <E> W E L L W
__ {I} S__ (H) __I N G A _- [d V e] - N [T] U _____R E R I N S
__ {E} t__ (T) __I N G F O _ *R* T H [T] T
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Singe CAPons, or POOR PIGS, dropping their eyes;
Condemn'd me to the OVENs with the <PIES>;
And so, have kept me dying a whole age,
Nor ravish'd all hence in a minute's rage."
........................................................................
After his library FIRE of 1623 Ben Jonson
wrote of his loss in "An Execration upon Vulcan"
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
22 P**'s => 4 PIE's
(22*21*20*19)/(4*3*2*1)
14 I's: (14/145)*(13/144)*(12/143)*(11/142)
23 E's: (23/141)*(22/140)*(21/139)*(20/138)
Probability of 4 oven PIE's ~ 1/4,300
---------------------------------------------------------
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > ------------------------------------------------------
> > Pat-a-cake, pat-a-cake, Baker's man!
> > Bake me a cake As fast as you can.
> > Pat it, and prick it, And mark it with a "T"
> > And put it in the oven, For peTer and me.
David L. Webb wrote:
> Huh? Are you reVERting to childhood, Art?
Prick it, Dave.
>>>> David L. Webb wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> MoreoVER, "eVER" is not usually a noun, except
>>>>> in the VERy old, obsolete sense of "a wild boar,".
>
>>> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> >
>>>> That's the sense!
>
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
>>> The last recorded example of that sense in the OED is dated
>>> around 1230, Art. You are aware, are you not, that English
>>> underwent profound changes during the ensuing three and a half
>>> centuries? Well, perhaps you are not.
>
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
>> Yes...they stopped being so explicit about what they wanted to say.
David L. Webb wrote:
> Who is "they," Art? The conspirators of your paranoid invention?
That's the they(i.e., you)!
>>>> David L. Webb wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > Matters being so, it would be little wonder that
>>>> > Rollett abandoned the supposed "solution" as meaningless.
>
> > > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> >
>>>> He could have saved himself a lot of work:
>>>>
>>>> <<the message was found by counting through using the key 6-2-4,
>>>> derived from the layout, which produced a short but (dare I say)
>>>> intriguing message. When I first did this, I thought that it
>>>> must be quite common to find possible messages in this sort of
>>>> way, and that was why I was so ready to believe that the message
>>>> was simply a chance sequence of words. Eventually I decided to put
>>>> this to the test. I started counting through paragraphs of books
>>>> I happened to be reading, every now and then, in order to see how
>>>> often 6-2-4 turned up a meaningful 5-word sentence or remark, not
>>>> knowing whether it would be one in 10 or one in 100 or whatever.
>>>>
>>>> Well, after several years, and many thousands of paragraphs,
>>>> probably well over 20 thousand, I have only found one sentence
>>>> that even remotely made any sense at all. >>
>
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
> > > I found seVERal sentences in one evening that made
> > > at least as much sense as "These sonnets all by ever."
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > Do tell!!!
I'm still waiting.............
>>>>> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>> Besides, no one has offered me Templar membership.
>>>
>>>> David L. Webb wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Templar membership is only offered to outsiders who come too close
>>>>>to discoVERing the truth, Art. There is scant danger of your eVER
>>>>>doing that, even with copious hints. You haven't even figured out
>>>>> the reason that the SACCC met in Tikal this year.
>
> > > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> >
> > > > Not having received a postcard from anywhere
> > > > near Tikal, I only have your word on it, Dave.
>
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
>>> Chichicastenango is not that far from Tikal, Art;
>>> Guatemala is not that big a country.
How long did it take you to go from Chichicastenango to Tikal?
>>> In any case, you might have observed that Tikal features seVERal
>>> star y-pointing pyramids of magnificent proportions and venerable
>>> antiquity. There is nothing comparable in Chichicastenango.
>>> You really *are* slow on the uptake, Art!
>
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > I haven't mentioned Milton's pyramids in a while.
David L. Webb wrote:
> One must be grateful for small blessings.
Like the 17th Earl of Oxford.
Art Neuendorffer
BCD
David L. Webb wrote:
> In article <1124276257.4...@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> >
> > "E.VER" is the fourth *T* in the '19' Rollett array:
>
> And just what do you hallucinate that "These sonnets all by ever the
> fourth T." means in English, Art?
***David, this could refer to the fourth tee at St. Andrews. Golf was
being played at St. Andrews by 1552 when Archbishop John Hamilton was
given permission by the burgh to establish a rabbit warren on the
links, with the charter confirming the rights of townspeople to play
golf on the links. "Rollett array" would seem to be a phrase from a
language close to English, and, given the obvious reference to golf in
the sentence, most probably means "rolled away." Now, "is" depends on
what "is" is, as a prominent American politician might tell us; I putt
it, um, put it to you that in this case, "is" is "at," making Art's
"'E.VER' is the fourth *T* in the '19' Rollett array," with our other
discoveries, actually read, "These sonnets all by E.VER at the fourth
tee in the '19' rolled away." The sense, as you must admit, begins to
emerge. Now, as nothing but a ball or ball-like object could roll
away, we may, extrapolating from the known data, conjecture with some
confidence that there is an elliptical "when his ball" beween "'19'"
and "rolled away." Art's sentence now reads, "These sonnets all by
E.VER at the fourth tee in the '19' when his ball rolled away," or,
expanded and written more idiomatically, and with E.VER transformed
into its equivalent, the more familiar Oxford, "These sonnets are all
by Oxford, who wrote them at the fourth tee in the '19' when his ball
rolled away." The sole mystery is how it came to be that he was
playing 19 holes rather than the more usual 18; but doubtless the
unsettled nature of the game at this time, and/or the unsettled nature
of his feelings at the moment, contributed to this seeming anomaly.
Best Wishes,
--BCD
Web Site: http://www.csulb.edu/~odinthor
Visit unknown Los Angeles: http://www.csulb.edu/~odinthor/socal1.html
BCD
BCD wrote:
>
> David L. Webb wrote:
> > And just what do you hallucinate that "These sonnets all by ever the
> > fourth T." means in English, Art?
>
***I should add that Art will doubtless be interested in the Masonic
connections of St. Andrews, which he will find mentioned at:
http://www.wiolawapress.com/andrews.htm
***Here's a small excerpt:
"First, notice the placement of St.Andrews, Scotland on the grid
lines....the latitude is 2.40 degrees W and the longitude 56.20 degrees
N....now if you add 2.40 and Al Jizah (Giza Pyramid) at 31.12 degrees
E...you have the 'maj'-ic 33.52 degrees of Masonic tradition....why is
this important for us to understand....well just as a sideline Hope,
Arkansas is also on the 33rd degree...in order to control, one must
stay on the grid lines relating to the 666...remember?"
Art Neuendorffer
>>> And just what do you hallucinate that
>>> "These sonnets all by ever the fourth T."
>>> means in English, Art?
BCD wrote:
**I should add that Art will doubtless be interested in the Masonic
connections of St. Andrews, which he will find mentioned at:
http://www.wiolawapress.com/andrews.htm
***Here's a small excerpt:
"First, notice the placement of St.Andrews, Scotland on the grid
lines...the latitude is 2.40 degrees W and the longitude 56.20 degrees
N...now if you add 2.40 and Al Jizah (Giza Pyramid) at 31.12 degrees
E...you have the 'maj'-ic 33.52 degrees of Masonic tradition...why is
this important for us to understand...well just as a sideline Hope,
Arkansas is also on the 33rd degree...in order to control,
one must stay on the grid lines relating to the 666...remember?">>
-----------------------------------------------------------------
<< St. Andrew, whose feast day is November 30th, is the patron saint
for fishermen. Andrew, like his brother, Simon Peter, was a fisherman.
He became a disciple of the great St. John the Baptist [patron saint
of Freemasonry!], but when John pointed to Jesus and said,
"Behold the LAMB OF GOD!"
From then on, he decided to follow Jesus. Andrew was thus the first
disciple of Christ. Next, Andrew brought his brother Simon (St. Peter)
to Jesus and Jesus received him, too, as His disciple. It is believed
that after Our Lord ascended into Heaven, St. Andrew went to Greece to
preach the gospel. He is said to have been put to death on a cross, to
which he was tied, not nailed [son of a ropemaker - Gabriel Harvey?].
Andrew lived two days in that state of suffering, still preaching to
the
people who gathered around their beloved Apostle.>>
---------------------------------------------------------------
"CLAMBERING TO HAN(G, AN E)NVIOUS SLIVER BROKE"
V E R O N I L V E R I U S
_________ L
_________ E
_________ N
_________ K
_________ C
_________ N
_________ I
_________ R
_________ B
__ (A G N E)S B O G A
_________ A
_________ M
_________ O
_________ H
_________ T
http://www.webpages.free-online.co.uk/portcull/templar.gif
http://www.webpages.free-online.co.uk/portcull/hospital.gif
http://www.webpages.free-online.co.uk/portcull/jdemolay.gif
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Dave Webb wrote:
> ("Boga" is the genitive singular of "Bog," "God" in Russian),
> A G N E S B O G A
> a phrase meaning "AGNES of GOD."
> Don't forget that Oxford displays first-hand knowledge of the
> visiting Russian delegation, so he probably spoke Russian as well.
> St. Andrew => patron saint of RUSSIA & SCOTLAND
> Note also the bilingual pun with
> "AGNUS DEI," the LAMB of GOD.
----------------------------------------------------------
Astrophil & Stella & Stella & Swift
----------------------------------------------------------
Jonathan Swift born on St. Andrew's Day, 1667.
Philip Sidney born on St. Andrew's Day, 1554
(on the very same day that Bloody Mary dragged
England kicking and screaming back to Catholicism).
----------------------------------------------------------
Motto of Scotland and of the Order of the Thistle
"nemo me impune lacessitne"
"no one attacks me with impunity"
--------------------------------------------------------------
Order of the Thistle in Scotland is made of alternating
sprigs of thistle and rue. Boutell's Heraldry:
the words "and rue" are a pun on "Andrew".
http://www.sirbacon.org/gallery/thistles.html
Ophelia: There's fennel for you, and columbines: there's RUE for you;
and here's some for me: we may call it herb-grace o' Sundays:
O you must wear your RUE with a difference.
------------------------------------------------------------
John VALENTIN ANDREA
---------------------------------------------------------
http://home.sol.no/~noetic/modg.htm
http://www.knight.org/advent/cathen/13193b.htm
<<In 1602 or 1603, Lutheran theologian of Würtemberg,
John VALENTIN ANDREA composed the ROSICRUCIAN book,
"Chymische Hochzeit Christiani Rosenkreuz 1459",
which appeared in 1616.>>
--------------------------------------------------------------
ANDREW W.(ise)
VALENTINE S.(ims)
------------------------------------------------------------------
THE KNIGHTS OF SAINT JOHN IN ENGLAND, SCOTLAND AND IRELAND
http://www.saintjohn.org/priory.htm
<<With the death of Edward VI and the accession of Mary I
permission was given for Cardinal-Legate Pole to re-instate the
Order in England, by Letters Patent of Philip and Mary dated
2 April 1557. On 6 May following Cardinal Pole issued a decree
recognizing the Grand Priory of England, restoring its ancient
dignities and ten commanderies while also re-instating
the Priory of Ireland.
FOUR NEW GRAND CROSSES were appointed
(two of whom were not actually professed at the time of their
appointment), of whom the Bailiff of Egle was a Spaniard, a
professed knight of the Langue of Castile, rewarded for his
assistance in the negotiations to restore the Grand Priory
(and causing great resentment among his fellow Castillians,
jealous of his preferment). Unfortunately, before the Auberge
could be revived in Malta, Queen Mary died and, although the
Order was not legally suppressed, its estates were confiscated
once again (in 1560). Elizabeth proved to be no less a scourge
of the knights than her father had been and several more knights
died for their faith in exile, on the scaffold or in her prisons.
By 1567 the only English knights remaining on Malta were the
titular Grand Prior Richard Shelley (who was an active participant
in several plots against Elizabeth) and Oliver Starkey (commander
of Quenington), later titular Bailiff of Egle (from 1569).
Starkey, who had been La Valette's Latin Secretary and was the
only Englishman at the Great Siege, died in 1588 and Shelley
in 1590, when a French knight was appointed to the titular
Grand Priory. This appointment was challenged by an Irish knight
resident in the convent, one ANDREW WISE from Waterford who,
after complaining, was appointed Bailiff of Egle but, still
unsatisfied, appealed to the Pope. In 1593 Wise was appointed
titular Grand Prior, a dignity he held until his death in 1631.
>From thenceforth the offices of Grand Prior of England,
Turcopilier, Bailiff of Egle and Prior or Grand Prior of
Ireland became honorifics given to knights whom the Grand
Master and Council wished to honor with the grand cross
and membership of the Chapter-General.>>
---------------------------------------------------------
Andrew Wise - Grand Prior 1593-1631
--------------------------------------------------------
1597, Richard III (Q1 STC 22314):
THE TRAGEDY OF / King Richard the third. Containing,
His teacherous Plots againft his brother Clarence:
the pittiefull murther of his iunocent nephewes:
his tyrannicall vfurpation: with the whole courfe
of his detefted life, and moft deferued death.
As it hath beene lately Acted by the
Right honourable the Lord Chamber-laine his feruants.
Printed by Valentine Sims, for ANDREW WISE,
dwelling in Paules Church-yard, at the
Signe of the Angell. 1597.
--------------------------------------------------
1600, Henry IV Part II (Q1 STC 22288a):
THE Second part of Henrie the fourth,
continuing to his death, and coronation of Henrie the fift.
With the humours of fir Iohn Fal-ftaffe, and fwaggering Piftoll.
As it hath been fundrie times publikely acted by
the right honourable, the Lord Chamberlaine his feruants.
Written by William Shakefpeare. LONDON
Printed by V.S. for ANDREW WISE, and William Aspley. 1600.
--------------------------------------------------
1600, Much Ado About Nothing (Q STC 22304):
Much adoe about Nothing. As it hath been fundrie times publikely
acted by the right honourable, the Lord Chamberlaine his feruants.
Written by William Shakespeare. LONDON
Printed by V.S. for ANDREW WISE, and William Aspley.1600.
--------------------------------------------------------
Art Neuendorffer
Art Neuendorffer
Twelfth Night Act 3, Scene 2
Fab. There is no way but this SIR ANDREW.
SIR ANDREW: Will either of you beare me a {CHALLENGE TO HIM}?
To. Go, write it in a martial hand, be curst and briefe:
it is no matter how wittie, so it bee eloquent, and full
of INUENTION: taunt him with the license of Inke: if thou
thou'st him some thrice, it shall not be amisse, and as ma-
ny LYES, as WILL LYE in thy sheete of paper, although the
sheete were bigge enough for the bedde of Ware in Eng-
land, set 'em downe, go about it. Let there bee gaulle e-
nough in thy inke, though thou write with a Goose-pen,
------------------------------------------------------------
Shakespeares POEMS (1640) To the Reader.
http://www.library.upenn.edu/etext/furness/poems/00a.html
<<I have beene somewhat solicitus to bring this FORTH to the perfect
view of all men; and in so doing, glad to be serviceable for the
continuance of glory to the DE(s)ERVED Author in these his Poems.
I.B.>>
---------------------------------------------------------------
(r)EVERE(n)D JOHN WARD, 1648-78, Diary.
<<Remember to peruse Shakespeare's plays; and bee much
VERsED in them, that I may not bee ignorant in that matter.
Whether Dr. Heylin does well, in reckoning up the dramatick poets
which have been famous in England, to [OMIT] Shakespeare.>>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
William Webbe,_A Discourse on English Poetry_ (1586):
<<I may not [OMIT] the DE(s)ERVED commendations of many honourable &
noble Lords & Gentlemen in Her Majesty's Court, which, in the rare
devices of poetry, have been and yet are most skilful; among whom
the right honourable Earl of Oxford may {CHALLENGE TO HIM}self
the title of most excellent among the rest."
David L. WEBB wrote:
<<I'm pleased to see you quoting my ancestors, Art...
Nobody doubts that Oxford was a poet -- of sorts.>>
------------------------------------------------------------
http://shakespeareauthorship.com/rep.html
<<The earliest printed praise of OXFORD as a poet is in
William Webbe's Discourse of English Poetry (1586).
For Webbe, the Shepheardes Calender was the finest poetry,
and its author was the finest poet in the English language.
After surveying English poets from Gower and Chaucer
down to his own time, he offers this judgment:
"This place I have purposely reserved for one, who if not only,
yet in my judgment principally DE(s)ERVEth the title of
the rightest English Poet, that ever I read: that is,
the Author of the Shepheardes Calender, . . .
In his discussion of pastoral poetry, Webbe again mentions
the Shepheardes Calender, whose author he considers
the equal of Theocritus and Virgil:
"But now yet at the last hath England hatched upon one Poet
of this sort, in my conscience comparable with the best in any
respect: even Master Sp: Author of the Shepheardes Calender...">>
------------------------------------------------------------
{anagrams}
"OMETTRAI" : French for "WILL OMIT"
"MERITATO" : Italian for "DE(s)ERVED"
"AMORETTI"
------------------------------------------------------------
SONNET II "AMORETTI" (1595) by EDMUND SPENSER
But if in presence of that fairest proud
thou chance to come, fall lowly at her feet:
and with meek humbless and afflicted mood,
pardon for thee, and grace for me intreat.
Which if she grant, then live and my love cherish,
if not, die soon, and I WITH THEE WILL PERISH.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
<<The skills of Shakespeare's mother have been unkown, but it is not
unlikely that she could read & write, and we have a sign of her hand.
When selling her share in a landholding to her nephew Robert
WEBBE, in 1579, she mad her 'marke' on a deed and on a bond.
Instead of drawing a stolid CROSS on the WEBBE deed,
Mary Shakespeare drew a small, NEAT, rather complex design...>>
----------------------------------------------------------
Harvey's Apostrophe ad eundem, lines 38-43:
Virtus fronte habitat: Mars occupat ora; Minerva
[I]n dextra latitat: Bellona in corpore regnat:
[M]artius ardor inest; scintillant lumina: vultus
[T]ela vibrat: quis non redivivum iuret Achillem?
[O] age, magne COMES,
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Gabriel Harvey and the Genesis of "William Shakespeare"
by Andrew Hannas
http://www.sourcetext.com/sourcebook/essays/harvey.html
(Originally printed in The Shakespeare Oxford Society Newsletter,
Winter 1993, Volume 29, No. 1B)
<<Harvey's description occurred in a 168-line poem composed in
dactylic hexameter verses which he styled an Apostrophe ad eundem
(Apostrophe to the same man, i.e. De Vere), printed
in Gratulationis Valdinensis Liber Quartus
(The Fourth Book of Walden Rejoicing), London, 1578, in September.
The Latin words in question end line 40 and begin line 41:
...vultus
Tela vibrat...
To cite Cooper's Thesaurus Linguae Romanae et Britannicae
(Thesaurus of the Roman and British Tongue), 1565 and 1573:
Vultus-- A countenaunce or cheere: a looke: a visage.
Telum-- All thinge that may be throwen with the hande, be it stone,
wood, or Iron: a darte: an arrow: a quarrell [i.e., metal arrowhead].
A weapon to fight with: a swoorde.
Vibro-- To shake a thyng: to make a thing to shake or quaver:
to brandish.
I am surmising that Harvey chose Tela (missiles) as a weakened form of
"spears" because he had in mind another word Tela, metrically identical
but quite different from telum-as-thing-thrown. This other word tela
is a noun in the feminine, nominative, singular, defined in Thomas:
Tela -- A WEB of cloth : also any enterprise, busines, or worke.>>
------------------------------------------------------------
<<The Sidhé was a transcendent intellect,
known to the Druids as the WEB of the Wise.>>
TARLaTAN => A kind of thin, transparent cotton muslin for dresses.
KEMP => Coarse, rough hair wool or fur, injuring its quality.
------------------------------------------------------------
Sir Philip Sidney was Godfather to Richard Tarlton's son
while 'coarse' Will KEMP was but a messenger boy:
<<I wrote to you a Letter by Will, my Lord of Lester's jesting plaier,
enclosed in a letter to my wife, and I never had answer thereof. . .
I since find that the knave deliver'd the letters to my ladi of Lester,
but whether she sent them yow or no I know not.>>
-- A (Utrecht/March, 1586) letter from Sidney
to his father-in-law Francis Walsingham.
------------------------------------------------------------
"vultus/Tela vibrat"
(Thy) Will Shakes Spears or (Thy) WEB Shakes WILLs.>>
---------------------------------------------------------------
WILLiam WEBBE's _A Discourse on English Poetry_ (1586)
"I may not omit the deserved commendations of many honorable and noble
Lords, and Gentlemen, in her Majesty's Court, which in the rare devices
of Poetry, have been and yet are most excellent skillful, among whom,
the right honorable Earle of Oxford may challenge to himself
the title of the most excellent among the rest."
http://shakespeareauthorship.com/rep.html
"Works by most of the poets in this passage (Vaux, Edwards, Churchyard,
Hunnis, Heywood, Hill, Oxford, and perhaps "Sand" and "S. Y.") appeared
in the 1575 Paradise of Dainty Devices, and WEBbe's praise of Oxford's
skill in the "rare devices of Poetry" is an obvious reference to the
title of the collection, which contained eight of Oxford's poems.
--------------------------------------------------------
St. Adrian [Patron Saint of BUTCHERS] : SEPT.8 & AUGUST 26
--------------------------------------------------------------------
[John (7th) Earl of Oxford at] Battle of Crécy on AUGUST 26, 1346
BUTCHER son-in-law Lope de Vega dies in Madrid on AUGUST 26, 1635
Mary Arden's sister, Margaret WEBBE, was buried on AUGUST 26, 1614
--------------------------------------------------------------------
_ Robert Arden of Wilmcote --- Agnes WEBBE (d.1580)
_______ | _______________ (sister) ____ Sir Thomas Wilson
(d.1581)
_______ | ________________ (of) _______________ | secretary of
Margaret Arden (b.1538) --- Alexander WEBBE(1534-73) | QE.I
_____ /------------------| _________________________ |
_____ | Alexander WEBBE II (1559-1630) -------- Mary Wilson
_____ | __________________________ |
Robert WEBBE __________________- |
_______________________________ |
_______________________________ |
_______________________ David L. WEBB?
David L. WEBB wrote:
<<I have no idea whether I'm related to that family of WEBBEs
or not. As far as I know, there is no relation (my connections
with the Templars, Rex Deus, and the Priory of Sion
come of course from the Scottish side of the family).
---------------------------------------------------------------
Art Neuendorffer
Art Neuendorffer
>> And just what do you hallucinate that
>> "These sonnets all by ever the fourth T." means in English, Art?
BCD wrote:
> ***David, this could refer to the fourth tee at St. Andrews. [blah, blah, blah] ...
>
> ***I should add that Art will doubtless be interested in the Masonic
> connections of St. Andrews, which he will find mentioned at:
>
> http://www.wiolawapress.com/andrews.htm
-------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.wiolawapress.com/andrews.htm
<<The Royal Coat of Arms of the city of St. Andrews is below:
http://www.wiolawapress.com/andrews/andrews_armscity170.jpg
The symbols on the city Coat of Arms:
1) [St. Andrew]
2) The Oak tree has a mount growing out of it at its base.
3) The Boar is a symbolism of heraldry which represents
a fierce combatant who will defend to his death his house.
"DUM SPERO SPIRO"
"whilst there is life there is hope">>
---------------------------------------------------------
{anagram}
"DUM SPERO SPIRO"
"PROUD PROMISES"
"PRORSUS IMPEDO"
PRORSUS: (Latin) forward, straight ahead, utterly
IMPEDO: ensnare, hinder, obstruct, prevent, to entangle
-------------------------------------------------------------------
_Robinson Crusoe_ by Daniel Defoe
<<I went on board in an evil hour, the 1st September 1659,
being the same day eight years that I went from
my father & mother at HuLL.>>
1st September 1659 - Jupiter/Venus conj. near REGULUS.
1st September 1651 - 8 yr. Venus cycle (near REGULUS).
--------------------------------------------------------------------
<<Two legends tell of the bringing of the relics of St Andrew the
Apostle to the pilgrimage center now called St Andrews. Both involve
the religious figure St Rule, or St REGULUS, who brought relics of the
Apostle to the local site then known as Cennrigmonaid or Kilrymont.
Both legends have St REGULUS establishing an area of consecrated
ground, presumably at modern KIRKhiLL, marked out with 12 crosses.
This ground was to become the new resting place for the relics
where REGULUS evangelized the Scots for three decades.>>
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Alexander SELKIRK was found in the desert island of Juan Fernandez,
where he had been left by Captain Stradling.
He remained on the island 52 months, when he was rescued
by Captain ROGERS (spearman), and brought to England.
The embryo of De Foe's _Robinson Crusoe_ may be seen
in Captain Burney's narrative.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Alexander SELKIRK handed his papers over to DANIEL Defoe
at the house of Mrs. Damaris DANIEL.
_The Life and Strange Surprizing Adventures of Robinson Crusoe_
was published April 25, 1719.
Daniel Defoe went into hiding the last year of his life &
died in Ropemaker's Alley, Moorfields on April 26, 1731.
Although Defoe was an incredibly productive & successful writer,
"he left no will, all his property having been previously assigned,
and letter of administration were taken out by a creditor."
----------------------------------------------------------------
SELKIRK <=> KIRKLEES
----------------------------------------------------------------
<<The traditional bow and arrow of Robin Hood are
religiously preserved at KIRKLEES Hall, Yorkshire.
Death of Robin Hood. He was bled to death treacherously
by a nun, instigated to the foul deed by his kinsman,
the prior of KIRKLEES, Yorkshire, near Halifax.>>
----------------------------------------------------------
R.C. DE(fo)E in BREMEN
-------------------------------------------------------------
ROSENKREUTZ => RO(bin)SON KREUTZnaer => Robinson Crusoe
<<I WAS born in the year 1632, in the city of York, of a good family,
though not of that country, my father being a foreigner of BREMEN,
who settled first at Hull. He got a good estate by merchandise,
and leaving off his trade, lived afterwards at York, from whence
he had married my mother, whose relations were named Robinson,
a very good family in that country, and from whom I was called
ROBINSON KREUTZNAER;
but, by the usual corruption of words in England, we are now
called - nay we call ourselves and write our name - Crusoe;
and so my companions always called me.>>
--------------------------------------------------------------
_The Chemical Wedding of Christian ROSENKREUTZ 1459_
Daniel Defoe was born in 1659
in CRIPPLEGATE to James Foe, a London BUTCHER.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
[John] DEE in BREMEN
-------------------------------------------------------------------
<<_Amphitheatrum Sapientiae Aeternae_ was first published in Prague
in 1598 under the "privilege and protection" of Rudolph II and
who stayed at the emperor's court as his physician for some time.
The work is described by Frances Yates as forming "a link between
a philosophy influenced by [John] DEE
and the philosophy of the ROSICRUCIAN manifestos".
Khunrath had met [John] DEE in BREMEN in the same year. . .>>
[ http://www.levity.com/alchemy/sendi.html ]
------------------------------------------------------------------
<<Counting forward from December 25 as Day One, we find that Day Forty
is February 2. A Jewish woman is in semi-seclusion for 40 days after
giving birth to a son, and accordingly it is on February 2 that we
celebrate the coming of Mary and Joseph with the infant Jesus to the
TEMPLE at Jerusalem to offer sacrifice, both on behalf of Mary and
on behalf of Jesus as a first-born male. As they did so, they were
greeted by the aged Simeon.>>
------------------------------------------------------------------
On Christmas Day, 1584, the planet Mars went into retrograde -
hovering extremely close to the star REGULUS ("the little king").
Forty days later (Feb.2, 1585) Shakspere's first-born male was
baptized and named for "neighbor" HAMNET Sadler.
------------------------------------------------------------------
35.5 years earlier - on St. VERONICA's Day (July 12) 1549,
the planet Mars passed extremely close to the star REGULUS
and Edward de Vere was conceived.
------------------------------------------------------------
St. VEROnica Feastday: July 12
<< Woman of Jerusalem who wiped the face of Christ with a VEIL
while he was on the way to Calvary. According to tradition,
the cloth was imprinted with the image of Christ's face.">>
12th July 1549 : Edward de Vere conceived (Mars/Regulus conj.)
12th July 1549 : Edward Manners born. (Mars/Regulus conj.)
Christmas 1584 : Hamnet Shakspere born. (Mars/Regulus conj.)
12th July 1607 : "Edward Shakesbye the sonne of Edward Shakesbye"
born, baptized & buried (Mars/Sun conj.)
12th July 1955 : American Shakespeare Festival Theatre
opens a building resembled The Globe.
------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.wiolawapress.com/andrews.htm
<<When the Dead Sea Scrolls were translated in 1956, the 'Copper
Scroll'
(which gives details of the fortune hidden beneath the Temple at
Jerusalem) revealed that, along with a vast stockpile of bullion and
valuables, an 'indeterminable treasure' was buried. French Masonic
ritual stemming from the Middle Ages states that the treasure was the
specific responsibility of the Templar Grand Knights of St. Andrew,
instituted by King Baldwin II of Jerusalem, who succeeded in 1118..
They were called the 'Guardian Princes of the Royal Secret', and
it was they who selected Scotland to be the place of refuge for
the Templar treasure. Furthermore, their chosen hiding-place was
said, in itself, to determine the very nature of the Royal Secret..
According to Masonic tradition, the Knights of St. Andrew were the
inheritors of an Order established in 586 BC. They were the Temple
Guard of Jerusalem who gathered by the High Priest Hilkiah before the
Temple of Solomon was destroyed by King Nebuchadnezzar of Babylon.
Their task at the time was to secrete the treasure from the invader,
and to carry away certain items of express significance. Now Jeremiah
in the old testament was apparently the son of Hilkiah, the very Zadok
High Priest who created the Order of the Temple Guard, the Order which
eventually became the Knights of St. Andrew.. Hilkiah was also the
High Priest who first discovered the Mosaic "Book of the Law" hidden
within the Temple. In 1307 fifty or so Knights Templars from France
settled on Scotland's Mull of Kintyre...because on October 13, 1307,
came the edict that hounded the Knights Templar, who had become the
wealthiest people in Europe to the consternation of the Pope and
Kings...the prevailing Grand Master Jacques de Molay was arrested
in France and killed....during the Papal Inquisition...
( the infamous Friday the 13th).
Also during this period, was the moving story of the life of Sir
William Wallace, and the day he died true Scottish nationalism
was born, and Robert the Bruce regained his nation's
independence in 1314. In 1317 the King of Scots was installed
as the hereditary Grand Master, and from that time,
whichever descending King held the office, he was
to be known simply as 'Saint Germain'.
A new Order was then formed, called the
elder Brothers of the Order of the Rosy Cross.>>
------------------------------------------------------------
<<1799: After conquering Egypt, Napoleon had a mysterious meeting
at the Great Pyramid with a man purporting to be the Count of
Saint-Germain, certainly a member of the Conspiracy -- possibly Joseph
Balsamo before his emigration to the United States. This encounter is
reported by no less than the reputable French historian G. Lenotre in
his Légendes Historiques under the title "Un Reveillon chez
Cambaceres"
and his attributed to Fouché, Duke of Otranto, the head of Napoleon's
secret police, who told it to a select group of people on 24 December
1814. In short, Napoleon met Saint-Germain inside the Great Pyramid;
the man of mystery outlined his great future, but warned him
to not step over the boundaries erected by his Masters.>>
---------------------------------------------------------------
FRANCE AND THE HUGUENOTS
The Huguenot movement began to take shape after 31st October 1517 with
the publication of MARTIN LUTHER's 95 theses against corruption in the
Roman Catholic Church - the only official Christian church in Europe at
the time. He soon had many supporters throughout Europe who became
known
as PROTESTANTS. JOHN CALVIN was a French Protestant who published his
Institutio Christianae Religionis in 1536. He was particularly well
supported by Protestants in Switzerland, France, Scotland and the
Netherlands. Known later on as HUGUENOTS, the French Protestants were
joined by the French Waldensians in 1562. The Roman Catholic Monarchy
oppressed the Huguenot movement, considering it to be a threat to
both the Church and the might of the King. The persecution of the
Huguenots began during the rule of FRANCIS I (1515-1547) and became
particularly bad while HENRY II (1547-1559) was on the throne.
THE WARS OF RELIGION
The next king was FRANCIS II (1559-1560) who was a minor, married
to Mary, Queen of Scots. After his sudden death he was succeded by his
brother CHARLES IX (1560-1574), also a minor, whose mother, CATHERINE
DE MEDICI acted as Regent. She tried to promote peace between the
Catholics & Protestants by granting certain privileges to the
Huguenots by means of the EDICT OF ST GERMAIN (17th January, 1561).
The peace became short-lived when on 1st March, 1562 a number of
Catholics descended on a large Huguenot assembly in Vassy, killing
30 & wounding about 200. The Wars of Religion which followed
(1562-1598), were a direct consequence of these VASSY MURDERS.
By August 1570, the Regent Catherine de Medici was forced to declare
the PEACE OF ST GERMAIN to prevent the Huguenots from taking Paris.
Their leader, Gaspard de Coligny, succeded in obtaining freedom
of religious practice in all cities except Paris.
GASPARD DE COLIGNY was an Admiral of France as well as Governor
of Picardy. He joined the Protestants in 1559, soon becoming
their leader and spokesman.
The PEACE OF ST GERMAIN had illustrated clearly just how much power
was vested in the Huguenots. The Catholics feared this power and it
was decided to eliminate the Huguenots, particularly their leaders.
With the marriage of Prince HENRY OF NAVARRE, a Huguenot, to Marguerite
de Valois (daughter of Catherine de Medici) on 23rd & 24th August,
1572 a golden opportunity presented itself. During this Feast of
ST BARTHOLOMEW, thousands of Huguenots, including De Coligny, were
massacred in Paris by the soldiers of the King. Henry of Navarre
escaped, but in the weeks following, murder & mayhem spread throughout
France. Many Huguenots fled to other European countries as a result.
Numerous Religious Wars followed under the leadership of Charles IX.
Charles IX was succeded by his brother HENRY III (1574-1589). As he was
childless, he was succeeded by Henry of Navarre as HENRY IV
(1589-1610).
Having adopted Catholicism for political reasons, Henry IV yet remained
well disposed towards the Huguenots. He was able to bring an end to the
Religious Wars through the PEACE OF VERVINS. On 13th April, 1598
through
the proclamation of the EDICT OF NANTES he provided the Huguenots with
more religious and political freedom than ever before. Under his
reign France became united and a period of peace followed.
In his attempt to impose an absolute monarchy (the divine right of
kings) in France, Cardinal RICHELIEU, Prime Minister to LOUIS XIII
(1610-1643) decided to deprive the Huguenots of all political freedom,
even in their fortified cities. In reaction the Huguenots decided
in 1621 to resume the Religious Wars. Despite Huguenot opposition,
Richelieu took their last fortified city, LA ROCHELLE on 28th October
1628. The MERCIFUL EDICT OF NîMES (1629) gave the Huguenots a certain
right of existence but their political power was permanently removed.
After the death of Louis XIII in 1643, his widow, ANNE OF AUSTRIA acted
as regent for their son. In the same year Cardinal MAZARIN succeeded
Richelieu who had died the previous year. Under their leadership there
was a certain measure of tolerance towards the Huguenots. During the
civil wars known as the FRONDE RESISTANCE (1648-1652) the Huguenots
were loyal to Mazarin and were duly rewarded by the DECLARATION OF ST
GERMAIN (1652) in which the King expressed his satisfaction with their
behaviour. Shortly after this, however, their privileges were further
limited and the last Protestant or Huguenot Synod met in Loudin in
1659.
After the death of Mazarin in 1661, LOUIS XIV (1643-1715) the Sun King,
began his reign. He went to great lengths to convert the Huguenots.
When even the billeting of dragoons in Huguenot households, the
infamous
DRAGONNADES, had no effect he proclaimed the EDICT OF FONTAINEBLEAU on
17th October, 1685. This revoked the Edict of Nantes and resulted in
the Huguenot persecutions being resumed. Once again the Huguenots
fled in large numbers (200,000+) to other countries in Europe
as well as England & America. The Netherlands received
a large number of refugees, some of whom came to the CAPE.>>
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Rosicrucian Benjamin Franklin was born on January 17, 1706, in Boston.
His father: Josiah Franklin, a tallow chandler with 17 children.
His mother: Abiah FOLGER Franklin
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.ntin.net/McDaniel/0117.htm
<<Charles Brockden Browne, the first American novelist, was born on
Jan.17, 1771 in Philadelphia. Wieland, or The Transformation, a Gothic
tale, was published in 1798. It involves a demented man who uses
ventriloquism to convince his brother to kill his wife and children.>>
<<On January 17, 1377, the Papal See was moved back to Rome by
Gregory XI. Located in France for 72 years, it had been moved to
Avignon by French pope Clement V in 1305, originally to escape
the political turmoil rampant within Italy at the time.>>
-------------------------------------------------------------------
CHARLES IX
http://www.museum.co.za/origins.htm
Original name: Charles-Maximilien de Valois; Duke d'Orléans
(duc d'Orléans) [from 27 Jun 1550]
b. 27 Jun 1550, Saint-Germain-en-Laye
d. 30 May 1574, Vincennes
Title: King of France (Roi de France)
Reign: 5 Dec 1560 - 30 May 1574
Accession: 5 Dec 1560, succeeded to his brother, François II
Coronation: 15 May 1561, Reims
<<The second son of Henri II and Catherine de Médicis, Charles
became king on the death of his brother François II & governed under
tutelage of his mother and the Council of government. After the king
reached the age of 13, he was legally entitled to proclaim himself
major
in lit de justice addressed to the Parlement de Rouen on 17 Aug 1563.
However, he remained under his mother's domination, being incapable of
choosing and following a policy of his own.
To strengthen the prestige of the crown, Catherine took Charles on a
tour of France from 1564 to 1566. The kingdom, however, was torn by the
hostility between the Catholics and the Huguenots. The victories of his
brother, the Duke of Anjou (later Henri III), over the Huguenots at
Jarnac and Moncontour in 1569 made Charles jealous, so that in 1571,
when the Huguenot Gaspard de Coligny came to court, Charles was
persuaded to favor a Huguenot plan for intervention against the Spanish
in the Netherlands; Charles sanctioned a defensive alliance with
England & Huguenot aid to the Dutch. All this came to nothing, however,
when Catherine, alarmed at the new policy and at Coligny's ascendancy,
and dismayed at the reaction to an unsuccessful attempt on Coligny's
life (22 Aug 1572), induced Charles to order the massacre of
St. Bartholomew's Day (23-24 Aug 1572).
The massacre apparently haunted Charles for the rest of his life.
His health deteriorated, and he became increasingly melancholy.>>
http://www.museum.co.za/origins.htm
---------------------------------------------------------------
January 17
http://www.mauihoops.com/~mjm/almanac2/january/0117.html
In 1536, Francois Rabelais absolved of apostasy by Pope Paul III
In 1562, Edict of St Germain recognizes Huguenots in France
In 1574, Robert Fludd (Hermetic philosopher) born
In 1584, Bohemia adopts Gregorian calendar
In 1600, Pedro Calderon de la Barca Spanish poet/dramatist born
In 1612, Thomas Lord Fairfax, English Parliamentary general born
In 1773, Capt James Cook becomes 1st to cross Antarctic Circle
In 1775, 9 old women burnt as witches for causing bad harvests, Poland
In 1775, R B Sheridan's "Rivals," premieres in London
In 1779, Capt Cooks last notation in ship's log Discovery
In 1820, Anne Bronte born
In 1860, Anton Chekhov born
In 1861, Flush toilet patented by Thomas Crapper
In 1904, Anton Chekhov's "Cherry Orchard" opens in Moscow
In 1910, Thomas Crapper dies
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
An entry occurs in the Stratford Church Register of a marriage?
between "WILLIAM WILLSONNE and ANNE HATHAWAY of SHOTterye."
[January 17, 1579]
---------------------------------------------------------------
January 17 St. Anthony's Day.
<<On this day in the age of Queen Elizabeth,
a sick pig would be led to the dung-heap
and was not allowed to be slaughtered.>>
http://www.nortexinfo.net/McDaniel/0117.htm
-----------------------------------------------------------
Art Neuendorffer
David L. Webb
"BCD" <odin...@csulb.edu> wrote:
I stand in awe of this magisterial display of scholarship -- I have
no doubt that you have hit upon the correct explanation. I mistakenly
assumed that the only balls that Oxford played with were Orazio Cogno's.
Incidentally, since the nineteenth hole is a common euphemism for the
clubhouse bar at which the players are apt to imbibe to excess after the
contest, Oxford's apparent penchant for writing poetry there may explain
anomalies like those execrable Oxford VERses on love and tennis.
David L. Webb
"BCD" <odin...@csulb.edu> wrote:
> BCD wrote:
> >
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> > > And just what do you hallucinate that "These sonnets all by ever the
> > > fourth T." means in English, Art?
> >
> > ***David, this could refer to the fourth tee at St. Andrews. [blah, blah,
> > blah] ...
> ***I should add that Art will doubtless be interested in the Masonic
> connections of St. Andrews, which he will find mentioned at:
>
> http://www.wiolawapress.com/andrews.htm
>
> ***Here's a small excerpt:
>
> "First, notice the placement of St.Andrews, Scotland on the grid
> lines....the latitude is 2.40 degrees W and the longitude 56.20 degrees
> N....now if you add 2.40 and Al Jizah (Giza Pyramid) at 31.12 degrees
> E...you have the 'maj'-ic 33.52 degrees of Masonic tradition....why is
> this important for us to understand....well just as a sideline Hope,
> Arkansas is also on the 33rd degree...in order to control, one must
> stay on the grid lines relating to the 666...remember?"
Excellent! That should keep Art busy happily pottering with his
habitual nutcase numerology for seVERal weeks.
Art Neuendorffer
> > > > Then make it "ever the fourth *T*" if you like:
> > > >
> > > > "E.VER" is the fourth *T* in the '19' Rollett array:
> > David L. Webb wrote:
>>> And just what do you hallucinate that
>>> "These sonnets all by ever the fourth T." means in English, Art?
David L. Webb wrote:
> I stand in awe of this magisterial display of scholarship -- I have
> no doubt that you have hit upon the correct explanation. I mistakenly
> assumed that the only balls that Oxford played with were Orazio Cogno's.
>
> Incidentally, since the nineteenth hole is a common euphemism for the
> clubhouse bar at which the players are apt to imbibe to excess after the
> contest, Oxford's apparent penchant for writing poetry there may explain
> anomalies like those execrable Oxford VERses on love and tennis.
----------------------------------------------------------
WHENAS the heart at TENNIS plays, and men to GAMING fall,
Love is the court, hope is the house, and favour SERVES the ball.
The ball itself is TRUE DESERT; the line ,which measure shows,
Is reason, whereon judgment looks how players win or lose.
The jetty is deceitful guile; the stopper, jealousy,
Which hath Sir Argus' hundred eyes wherewith to watch and pry.
The fault, wherewith fifteen is lost, is want of wit and sense,
And he that brings the racket in is double diligence.
And lo, the racket is freewill, which makes the ball rebound;
And noble beauty is the chase, of every game the ground.
But rashness strikes the ball awry, and where is oversight?
"A bandy ho," the people cry, and so the ball takes flight.
Now, in the end, good-liking proves content the game and gain.
Thus, in a TENNIS, knit I love, a pleasure mixed with pain.
-- Edward de Vere
----------------------------------------------------------
Much Ado About Nothing Act 3, Scene 2
CLAUDIO: No, but the barber's man hath been seen with him,
and the old ornament of his cheek hath already
stuffed TENNIS-balls.
----------------------------------------------------------
Pericles Prince of Tyre Act 2, Scene 1
PERICLES: A man whom both the waters and the wind,
In that vast TENNIS-court, have made the ball
For them to play upon, entreats you pity him:
He asks of you, that never used to beg.
----------------------------------------------------------
Hamlet, Prince of Denmark Act 2, Scene 1
LORD POLONIUS: At 'closes in the consequence,' ay, marry;
He closes thus: 'I know the gentleman;
I saw him yesterday, or t' other day,
Or then, or then; with such, or such; and, as you say,
There was a' GAMING; there o'ertook in's rouse;
There falling out at TENNIS:' or perchance,
'I saw him enter such a house of sale,'
Videlicet, a brothel, or so forth.
See you now;
Your bait of falsehood takes this carp of TRUTH:
And thus do we of wisdom and of reach,
With windlasses and with assays of bias,
By indirections find directions out:
----------------------------------------------------------
Art Neuendorffer
David L. Webb
"Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
(amorondaf...@comicass.nut) wrote:
> L
> E
> N
> K
> C
> N
> I
> R
> B
> (A G N E)S B O G A
> A
> M
> O
> H
> T
>
> http://www.webpages.free-online.co.uk/portcull/templar.gif
> http://www.webpages.free-online.co.uk/portcull/hospital.gif
> http://www.webpages.free-online.co.uk/portcull/jdemolay.gif
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Dave Webb wrote:
>
> > ("Boga" is the genitive singular of "Bog," "God" in Russian),
> > A G N E S B O G A
> > a phrase meaning "AGNES of GOD."
>
> > Don't forget that Oxford displays first-hand knowledge of the
> > visiting Russian delegation, so he probably spoke Russian as well.
One hesitates to explain a joke, Art, but sometimes -- as in the case
of a cretin like amorondaf...@comicass.nut -- it cannot be helped.
> > St. Andrew => patron saint of RUSSIA & SCOTLAND
Where did you get that idea, Art? Many authorities consider Saint
Nicholas the patron saint of Russia. How should a cowan like yourself
gainsay them?
> > Note also the bilingual pun with
> > "AGNUS DEI," the LAMB of GOD.
One hesitates to explain a joke, Art, but sometimes -- as in the case
of a cretin like amorondaf...@comicass.nut -- it cannot be helped.
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> Astrophil & Stella & Stella & Swift
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> Jonathan Swift born on St. Andrew's Day, 1667.
> Philip Sidney born on St. Andrew's Day, 1554
> (on the very same day that Bloody Mary dragged
> England kicking and screaming back to Catholicism).
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> Motto of Scotland and of the Order of the Thistle
> "nemo me impune lacessitne"
> "no one attacks me with impunity"
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> Order of the Thistle in Scotland is made of alternating
> sprigs of thistle and rue. Boutell's Heraldry:
> the words "and rue" are a pun on "Andrew".
>
> http://www.sirbacon.org/gallery/thistles.html
>
> Ophelia: There's fennel for you, and columbines: there's RUE for you;
"With rue my heart is laden," etc. (A. E. Housman). Was Housman a
Templar as well, Art?
I was right -- Brent's post will keep you happily occupied with
nutcase numerology and crackpot cryptography for seVERal weeks, Art.
Art Neuendorffer
>>> And just what do you hallucinate that
>>> "These sonnets all by ever the fourth T." means in English, Art?
> BCD wrote:
> > ***David, this could refer to the fourth tee at St. Andrews.
> > [blah, blah, blah] ...
> > ***I should add that Art will doubtless be interested in the Masonic
> > connections of St. Andrews, which he will find mentioned at:
> >
> > http://www.wiolawapress.com/andrews.htm
David L. Webb wrote:
> Excellent! That should keep Art busy happily pottering
> with his habitual nutcase numerology for seVERal weeks.
Tee'd off!!
----------------------------------------------------------
http://www33.brinkster.com/iiiii/inventions/tee-victor.gif
[St. Paul's Churchyard, London!!]
Date "tee" was first used in popular English literature ~ 1871
----------------------------------------------------------
Who invented the golf tee?
http://www33.brinkster.com/iiiii/inventions/tee.asp
<<In the early days of golf, players found the ball easier to hit if it
was elevated slightly above ground level, and so began a practice of
starting each hole with the ball poised atop a tiny mound of dirt or
sand. The messy inconvenience of scooping sand and sculpting it into
a "tee" before every drive eventually led some golfers to break with
tradition and experiment with portable manufactured tees, the earliest
known record of which is an 1889 British patent issued to two Scots,
William Bloxsom & Arthur Douglas. The patent describes a small rubber
plate with a raised ball support in the form of upright prongs
or a hollow cylinder. Most early tees were similar to this one
in that they lay flat on, but did not penetrate, the ground.
In the 1890s, British golf journals began to advertise peg-shaped tees
designed to be pushed into the ground. The first of these gadgets to
hit the market was the "Perfectum," a rubber-and-iron peg crowned with
a ring of upright rubber pins upon which the ball rested. Its inventor
was Percy Ellis of Surrey, England, who took out a British patent for
it in 1892. The related "Victor" tee, with a cup-shaped rubber head
and metal spike base, was patented in 1897 by PM Matthews of Scotland.
In these designs the upper portion was made flexible so as
to not damage the club or impede its swing.
Senat's tee (1895)The first American to secure a golf tee patent was
Prosper Senat, an artist from Philadelphia. His tee was a C-shaped
card joined at its ends to form a truncated cone. Along its edges
were notches and markings to help the golfer keep score.
An early tee designer who gets a lot of attention today in schools,
websites and the popular press is Dr. George Grant, one of the first
black graduates of Harvard's dental school. His version of the tee,
patented in 1899, consisted of a vertical rubber tube attached at its
base to a carrot-shaped piece of wood. It was not the first-ever golf
tee as is often claimed, and in fact did not differ much from the
earlier pegs that similarly combined a flexible ball rest and a rigid
ground anchor. Since Grant did not sell or advertise his handiwork,
it went unnoticed by the golfing public.
While the turn of the 19th-20th century saw many tee inventions of
various forms and materials, none of these novelties grew popular
enough to threaten the centuries-old tradition of the sand tee. That
situation began to change in the early 1920s, when New Jersey dentist
William Lowell patented and sold a tee that would eventually become
standard: the familiar one-piece wooden peg with a funnel-shaped head,
concave top surface, and narrow stem. The "Reddy Tee," as Lowell
called it, was easy & cheap to mass produce, but most important to
its success was Lowell's aggressive marketing campaign, which included
hiring golf great Walter Hagen to show off the tees while touring.
Because of the Reddy Tee's unprecedented acceptance at both the
professional and amateur levels, Lowell was for some time assumed to
have been the inventor of the golf tee. More recently, it has become
fashionable to call George Grant the true originator. Few people are
aware of the even earlier examples, and as of this writing, scant
reference to them can be found elsewhere on the Web. For a reasonably
complete history, find the book Singular History of the Golf Tee
by Irwin R. Valenta (Greensboro, N.C. : I.R. Valenta , c1995).
---------------------------------------------------
George Franklin Grant 1847-1910
http://www.innovationodyssey.com/grant.htm
<<The son of former slaves, George Franklin Grant apprenticed with a
local dentist for two years before entering Harvard Dental School in
1868. His appointment to the Harvard Department of Mechanical Dentistry
in 1871 made him the school's first African American faculty member.
Professor Grant invented the oblate palate, an innovative prosthetic
treatment for cleft palate, and was recognized internationally for
his expertise in dentistry. He was a founding member and president
of the Harvard Odontological Society and elected president
of the Harvard Dental Alumni Association in 1881.
An avid golfer, he maintained a homemade golf course near his home in
Belmont where he regularly golfed with friends, including abolitionist
Alexander Grimke. To tee off, golfers built a pyramid of dirt & rested
the ball on it. This produced unpredictable results as well as dirty
hands. In 1899, Grant designed and patented a wooden peg, the first
golf tee. Grant had the tees manufactured by a local firm and gave
them away by the handful. He never publicized his invention or sought
to gain from it. The idea was later adopted and developed by others.>>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Art Neuendorffer
Art Neuendorffer
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
David L. Webb wrote:
> One hesitates to explain a joke, Art,
Templars hardly ever explain their inside jokes.
(That's what makes it so tough.)
> > > St. Andrew => patron saint of RUSSIA & SCOTLAND
David L. Webb wrote:
> Where did you get that idea, Art? Many authorities consider Saint
> Nicholas the patron saint of Russia. How should a cowan like yourself
> gainsay them?
It's a dirty job but someone has to do it.
> > Dave Webb wrote:
> >
> > > Note also the bilingual pun with
> > > "AGNUS DEI," the LAMB of GOD.
David L. Webb wrote:
> One hesitates to explain a joke, Art,
Templars hardly ever explain their inside jokes.
(That's what makes it so tough.)
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > ----------------------------------------------------------
> > Astrophil & Stella & Stella & Swift
> > ----------------------------------------------------------
> > Jonathan Swift born on St. Andrew's Day, 1667.
> > Philip Sidney born on St. Andrew's Day, 1554
> > (on the very same day that Bloody Mary dragged
> > England kicking and screaming back to Catholicism).
> > ----------------------------------------------------------
> > Motto of Scotland and of the Order of the Thistle
> > "nemo me impune lacessitne"
> > "no one attacks me with impunity"
> > --------------------------------------------------------------
> > Order of the Thistle in Scotland is made of alternating
> > sprigs of thistle and rue. Boutell's Heraldry:
> > the words "and rue" are a pun on "Andrew".
> >
> > http://www.sirbacon.org/gallery/thistles.html
> >
> > Ophelia: There's fennel for you, and columbines: there's RUE for you;
David L. Webb wrote:
> "With rue my heart is laden," etc. (A. E. Housman).
> Was Housman a Templar as well, Art?
Probably. (A.E., I.O.U. -- Art)
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
David L. Webb wrote:
> I was right -- Brent's post will keep you happily occupied with
> nutcase numerology and crackpot cryptography for seVERal weeks, Art.
It already has, Dave.
Art Neuendorffer
BCD
> I was right -- Brent's post will keep you happily occupied with
> nutcase numerology and crackpot cryptography for seVERal weeks, Art.
***'Tis said that idle hands are the DeVere's playground...
David L. Webb
"Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
(aneuendor...@comicass.nut) wrote:
There is no "solution" because there is no cipher, Art.
> > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
>
> >> You mean like when you chastised Reedy for that Phantom letter?
[...]
> David L. Webb wrote:
>
> > (If Tom had *really* been chastised
> > as you surmise, then he certainly would
> > not be posting to h.l.a.s., Art.
> Tom certainly would not dare attempt to respond
> to your's [sic] TRULY
Is English your native tongue, Art? I begin to see why Lehigh
imposes a literacy test upon its applicants, even those "legacy"
applicants whose families are generous benefactors.
> EVER again. (Which he doesn't)
You might seek the explanation for that elsewhere, Art. Indeed, Tom
wrote:
"In the spirit of being helpful, here is my list of hlas participants
that I find to be complete wastes of time.
aneuendorffer114...@comcast.net
gunnar.tomas...@verizon.net
...."
<http://groups.google.com/group/humanities.lit.authors.shakespeare/msg/f4
5cecfb2dab83e1?dmode=source&hl=en>
I admit that your posts are an acquired taste, Art. And you're in good
company in Tom's blocked senders list!
...which is complete nonsense in English, and indeed in eVERy
language I know.
[Lunatic logorrhea snipped]
> David L. Webb wrote:
>
> > And just what do you hallucinate that
> > "These sonnets all by ever the fourth T."
> > means in English, Art?
> It refers to someone who might join Jesus & the two thieves:
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> Tunc crucifixerant
> - Crucifixion from St. Matthew's Gospel (Figure 31)
> Book of Kells - Its History, Construction and Knotwork
> http://pcssd.org/nwoodart/book of kells%20WRITTEN%20REPORT.htm
>
> <<This page contains the words
>
> "Tunk crucifixerant christum cum ao dous lettromes",
> "Then they had crucified two thieves with him Christ".
First, it does not say "These sonnets all by ever the forth cross" --
which is complete nonsense in any case -- but rather "These sonnets all
by ever the forth T.", which is, if possible, even more moronic and
meaningless than the former. Second, who is the fourth sufferer, Art?
Inquiring minds want to know.
>
> There is no image of the crucifixion in the Book of Kells
Huh?! What next? "I kell Edwasd de Vese"?!
[Lunatic logorrhea snipped]
> > > JOHN 19:19: Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross.
> > > And the writing was,
> > > JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS.
> > >
> > > [ IN*R*I ]
> David L. Webb wrote:
>
> > I don't recall any mention of emphasis of "R" in the text, Art.
> > Are you misquoting again? In any case, what is your point, if any?
> My point is that there is a tremendous amount of crucifixion imagery:
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
> "CLAMBERING TO HAN(G, AN E)NVIOUS SLIVER BROKE"
>
> V E R O N I L V E R I U S
> L
> E
> N
> K
> C
> N
> I
> R
> B
> (A G N E)S B O G A
> A
> M
> O
> H
> T
>
>
> http://www.webpages.free-online.co.uk/portcull/templar.gif
> http://www.webpages.free-online.co.uk/portcull/hospital.gif
> http://www.webpages.free-online.co.uk/portcull/jdemolay.gif
That's not "crucifixion imagery," Art -- it's cretinous crackpot
cryptography. "Agnes boga" means nothing whateVER in English.
[Lunatic logorrhea snipped]
> >> <<[Free]Masons read the [ IN*R*I ] inscription as:
> >>
> >> [I]gne [N]atura [R]enovatur [I]ntegra
> >>
> >> meaning: "Through FIRE, NATURE is reborn whole"
> >> or: "By FIRE NATURE is renewed whole",
> >>
> >> symbolizing Humankind's spiritual regeneration
> >> by the sacred FIRE of TRUTH & love.>> - From Wikipedia
> David L. Webb wrote:
>
> > So?
> My point is that there is a tremendous amount of book burning imagery.
That's not "book burning imagery," Art -- as above, it's cretinous
crackpot cryptography.
[Lunatic logorrhea snipped]
> >>>>> MoreoVER, "eVER" is not usually a noun, except
> >>>>> in the VERy old, obsolete sense of "a wild boar,".
> >>> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > >
> >>>> That's the sense!
> > > David L. Webb wrote:
> > >
> >>> The last recorded example of that sense in the OED is dated
> >>> around 1230, Art. You are aware, are you not, that English
> >>> underwent profound changes during the ensuing three and a half
> >>> centuries? Well, perhaps you are not.
> > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
>
> >> Yes...they stopped being so explicit about what they wanted to say.
> David L. Webb wrote:
>
> > Who is "they," Art? The conspirators of your paranoid invention?
> That's the they(i.e., you)!
Then you admit that the supposed conspirators are merely your own
paranoid invention? Gracefully conceded, Art!
[More fruits of Art's paranoia snipped]
Art Neuendorffer
> >
> > > > But it MUST BE either: "ever the fourth"
> > > > or "ever the fourth cross"
> >
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
> > > No, Art; there is no "must be" about it
> > > -- the supposed cipher simply is not valid.
> > ---------------------------------------------------------
> > 3. How Do We Know When To Stop?
> >
> > Rollett's proposed EVER cipher does have a rule for starting and
> > for proceeding but not for stopping. If we consider each string
> > that terminates in a period to be a word, and we pick the words
> > by using the 6-2-4 pattern, we get:
> >
> > "THESE SONNETS ALL BY EVER THE FORTH T"
David L. Webb wrote:
> ...which is complete nonsense in English,
> and indeed in eVERy language I know.
Count'em & weep:
-----------------------------------------------------------------
_ T O T__ __H E O N L ___ i __ <E> B ___ E G E T T E R O
_ F T H__ __E S E I n ______ s __ U <I> __ N G S O N N E T
_ S M__ (R) _W h a L L ___- h _ A P <P> _ I N E S____ S E A
_ N D__ (T) __h a t E__ T___- [e] - R N <I> __ T I E <P> R O M
___ I S__ (E) __D B Y O U _ [r] _E V <E> R L <I>__V I N G
_ {P} O_ (E) __t W I S_ H __ [e] _T H [T] H <E> W E L L W
__ {I} S__ (H) __I N G A _- [d V e] - N [T] U _____R E R I N S
__ {E} t__ (T) __I N G F O _ *R* T H [T] T
<= 19 =>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
> > > And just what do you hallucinate that
> > > "These sonnets all by ever the fourth T."
> > > means in English, Art?
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > It refers to someone who might join Jesus & the two thieves:
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Tunc crucifixerant
> > - Crucifixion from St. Matthew's Gospel (Figure 31)
> > Book of Kells - Its History, Construction and Knotwork
> > http://pcssd.org/nwoodart/book of kells%20WRITTEN%20REPORT.htm
> >
> > <<This page contains the words
> >
> > "Tunk crucifixerant christum cum ao dous lettromes",
> > "Then they had crucified two thieves with him Christ".
David L. Webb wrote:
> First, it does not say "These sonnets all by ever the forth cross" --
> which is complete nonsense in any case -- but rather "These sonnets all
> by ever the forth T.", which is, if possible, even more moronic and
> meaningless than the former. Second, who is the fourth sufferer, Art?
> Inquiring minds want to know.
---------------------------------------------------------
TALOS
---------------------------------------------------------
<<In GREEK mythology, TALOS was a man of [BRASS],
the work of Hephaestos (Vulcan), who went round
the island of CRETE thrice a day. Whenever he saw
a stranger draw near the island he either threw boulders
at them or he made himself red-hot, and embraced the stranger.
When Jason & the Argonauts escaped to CRETE with the Golden
Fleece Medea was able to remove the plug on TALOS' ANKLE
such that the ICHOR, his life force, FLOWED out of him.>>
-----------------------------------------------------------------
[T]o life againe, to heare thy BUSKIN tread,
[A]nd SHAKE a stage : Or, when thy SOCKES were on,
[L]eave thee alone, for the comparison
[O]f all, that INSOLENT GREECE, or haughtie Rome
[S]ent forth, or since did from their ashes come.
probability of *TALOS* (Greek: "SUFFERER") ~ 1/1,235
---------------------------------------------------------
TALUS: Latin for ANKLE
----------------------------------------------------------
<<In _Fairie Queene_ Edmund Spenser makes Sir Artegal's
iron man TALUS run continually round the island of CRETE
to chastise offenders with an iron flail. He represents
executive power- "SWift as a swallow & as lion strong.">>
---------------------------------------------------------
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > There is no image of the crucifixion in the Book of Kells
David L. Webb wrote:
> Huh?! What next? "I kell Edwasd de Vese"?!
-----------------------------------------------------------------
_ T O T__ __H E O N L ___ i __ <E> B ___ E G E T T E R O
_ F T H__ __E S E I n ______ s __ U <I> __ N G S O N N E T
_ S M__ (R) _W h a L L ___- h _ A P <P> _ I N E S____ S E A
_ N D__ (T) __h a t E__ T___- [e] - R N <I> __ T I E <P> R O M
___ I S__ (E) __D B Y O U _ [r] _E V <E> R L <I>__V I N G
_ {P} O_ (E) __t W I S_ H __ [e] _T H [T] H <E> W E L L W
__ {I} S__ (H) __I N G A _- [d V e] - N [T] U _____R E R I N S
__ {E} t__ (T) __I N G F O _ *R* T H [T] T
<= 19 =>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > JOHN 19:19: Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross.
> > > > And the writing was,
> > > > JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS.
> > > >
> > > > [ IN*R*I ]
>
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
> > > I don't recall any mention of emphasis of "R" in the text, Art.
> > > Are you misquoting again? In any case, what is your point, if any?
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > My point is that there is a tremendous amount of crucifixion imagery:
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------
> > "CLAMBERING TO HAN(G, AN E)NVIOUS SLIVER BROKE"
> >
> > V E R O N I L V E R I U S
> > L
> > E
> > N
> > K
> > C
> > N
> > I
> > R
> > B
> > (A G N E)S B O G A
> > A
> > M
> > O
> > H
> > T
> >
> >
> > http://www.webpages.free-online.co.uk/portcull/templar.gif
> > http://www.webpages.free-online.co.uk/portcull/hospital.gif
> > http://www.webpages.free-online.co.uk/portcull/jdemolay.gif
David L. Webb wrote:
> That's not "crucifixion imagery," Art -- it's cretinous crackpot
> cryptography. "Agnes boga" means nothing whateVER in English.
Agnes a gob then:
------------------------------------------------------------------
GOB, n. [OF. gob morsel; cf. F. gobe, gobbe,
a poisoned morsel, poison ball, gobet a piece swallowed]
-------------------------------------------------------------
(G)rooms (O)f the (B)edchamber.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
2 Samuel 21:19 RSV
And there was again war with the Philistines at GOB;
and Elha'nan the son of Ja'areor'egim, the Bethlehemite,
slew Goliath the Gittite,
the shaft of whose spear was like a weaver's beam.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
2 Samuel 21:19 KJV
And there was again a battle in GOB with the Philistines,
where Elhanan the son of Jaareoregim, a Bethlehemite,
slew THE BROTHER of Goliath the Gittite,
the staff of whose spear was like a weaver's beam.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Shakespeare opts for RSV/Geneva over KJV:
-----------------------------------------------------------------
THE MERRY WIVES OF WINDSOR Act 5, Scene 1
FALSTAFF I fear not Goliath with a weaver's beam;
because I know also life is a shuttle.
-------------------------------------------------------------
> [Lunatic logorrhea snipped]
>
> > >> <<[Free]Masons read the [ IN*R*I ] inscription as:
> > >>
> > >> [I]gne [N]atura [R]enovatur [I]ntegra
> > >>
> > >> meaning: "Through FIRE, NATURE is reborn whole"
> > >> or: "By FIRE NATURE is renewed whole",
> > >>
> > >> symbolizing Humankind's spiritual regeneration
> > >> by the sacred FIRE of TRUTH & love.>> - From Wikipedia
>
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
> > > So?
> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > My point is that there is a tremendous amount of book burning imagery.
David L. Webb wrote:
> That's not "book burning imagery," Art
-----------------------------------------------------------------
_ T O T__ __H E O N L ___ i __ <E> B ___ E G E T T E R O
_ F T H__ __E S E I n ______ s __ U <I> __ N G S O N N E T
_ S M__ (R) _W h a L L ___- h _ A P <P> _ I N E S____ S E A
_ N D__ (T) __h a t E__ T___- [e] - R N <I> __ T I E <P> R O M
___ I S__ (E) __D B Y O U _ [r] _E V <E> R L <I>__V I N G
_ {P} O_ (E) __t W I S_ H __ [e] _T H [T] H <E> W E L L W
__ {I} S__ (H) __I N G A _- [d V e] - N [T] U _____R E R I N S
__ {E} t__ (T) __I N G F O _ *R* T H [T] T
<= 19 =>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Singe CAPons, or POOR PIGS, dropping their eyes;
Condemn'd me to the OVENs with the <PIES>;
And so, have kept me dying a whole age,
Nor ravish'd all hence in a minute's rage."
........................................................................
After his library FIRE of 1623 Ben Jonson
wrote of his loss in "An Execration upon Vulcan"
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
22 P**'s => 4 PIE's
(22*21*20*19)/(4*3*2*1)
14 I's: (14/145)*(13/144)*(12/143)*(11/142)
23 E's: (23/141)*(22/140)*(21/139)*(20/138)
Probability of 4 oven PIE's ~ 1/4,300
---------------------------------------------------------
> > >>>>> MoreoVER, "eVER" is not usually a noun, except
> > >>>>> in the VERy old, obsolete sense of "a wild boar,".
>
> > >>> "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> > > >
> > >>>> That's the sense!
>
> > > > David L. Webb wrote:
> > > >
> > >>> The last recorded example of that sense in the OED is dated
> > >>> around 1230, Art. You are aware, are you not, that English
> > >>> underwent profound changes during the ensuing three and a half
> > >>> centuries? Well, perhaps you are not.
>
> > > "Art Neuendorffer" <aneuendor...@comcast.net>
> >
> > >> Yes...they stopped being so explicit about what they wanted to say.
>
> > David L. Webb wrote:
> >
> > > Who is "they," Art? The conspirators of your paranoid invention?
>
> > That's the they(i.e., you)!
David L. Webb wrote:
> Then you admit that the supposed conspirators
> are merely your own paranoid invention?
Oh, you're real alright.
Art Neuendorffer
David L. Webb
"BCD" <odin...@csulb.edu> wrote:
> David L. Webb wrote:
> > I was right -- Brent's post will keep you happily occupied with
> > nutcase numerology and crackpot cryptography for seVERal weeks, Art.
>
> ***'Tis said that idle hands are the DeVere's playground...
VERy true -- especially when the hands are incompetent.