A test for Crowley: Guess which signer was illiterate

Tom Reedy

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Mar 19, 2012, 5:30:12 PM3/19/12

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We're having a discussion--bloodbath is more like it--over at the
Fellowship and I thought Crowley might want to get in on this.

Here are some signatures: http://i.imgur.com/NZp3p.jpg

If anybody can give us the details on how they can tell which signer
went to Oxford and which one was probably illiterate, we'd all be
grateful. I'm sure Crowley can use the well-known "at a glance" method
and come up with the answer in a flash.

TR

frode

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Mar 20, 2012, 6:55:16 AM3/20/12

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Additional: Try also to guess which of the signers (if any) wrote
thousands of pages of readable manuscripts.

Tom Reedy

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Mar 20, 2012, 10:50:24 AM3/20/12

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A. None of them.
B. One of them.
C. Two of them.
D. All three of them.

D is the correct answer.

TR

frode

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Mar 20, 2012, 1:23:51 PM3/20/12

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> TR- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

I guess you're right, at least about two of them. Who are they?

Tom Reedy

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Mar 20, 2012, 1:44:12 PM3/20/12

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The six on the left are by William Shakespeare. The top right
signature is by John Bretchgirdle, the vicar who christened
Shakespeare. He received a BA and MA from Christ's College, Oxford,
and he was also a grammar school master at Witton. The bottom right is
by John Brownsword, who was one of the grammar school masters for the
Stratford grammar school. He went to grammar school under Bretchgirdle
at Witton, and he was also a well-known and published Latin poet.

marc hanson

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Mar 20, 2012, 2:33:14 PM3/20/12

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what was that play,
or part of a play,
that some thought Might be in WS's hand?
What I was wondering was, are there
any spelling differences within this play?

Or for that matter, any play, non WS?
Did other playwrights sometimes spell a
word differently? [maybe not
playwrights, that went to a University]

marc

Bob Grumman

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Mar 20, 2012, 3:56:02 PM3/20/12

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All three names are obvious faked--although I'm too lazy to find out
what a "bretch" is. Something to do with sex or defecation, I'm
sure. Amazin how thorough the conspiracy that wasn't a conspiracy
was: making up illiterate signatures by other men of the time to keep
Shakespeare's from being the give-away it is.

--Bob

Tom Reedy

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Mar 20, 2012, 5:08:54 PM3/20/12

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"Brown-sword?" ->snicker<-

And "Bretch-girdle?" As in "Once more Into the breach" (britches), no
doubt.

This should be right up Crowley's "alley" (if you catch my drift).

TR

Paul Crowley

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Mar 20, 2012, 6:33:31 PM3/20/12

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I agree that Bretchgirdle's and Brownsword's
signatures are not up to the usual standard
of Elizabethan gentlemen. But then I don't
know the conditions under which they were
written. ? On their wills? One thing I'm sure
about is that Reedy will have selected the
worst possible examples.

However, no one would question that either
was literate. Hold a straight edge under them
and you can see that they were perfectly
familiar with where the writing line should be,
and knew where to draw ascenders and
descenders. The names are written in full,
with each letter being quite adequate; some
show typical Elizabethan flourishes, even if
the execution of a few might seem a little
erratic.

Whereas . . . . the Stratman's signatures are
ridiculous -- and we have a 'full complement'.
He does not know what letters should be in
his surname. He clearly is not comfortable
holding a pen. Hold a ruler up to each name
for the 'writing line', and you are quite unsure
where it might best be placed. The Stratman
probably once knew that there should be one,
but he's forgotten about it since, as well as
invariably getting lost about half-way through
his surname.

You really have to be a half-wit to think that
this guy was literate; and you have to be close
to insane to believe that he was the famous
writer.

Paul.