Questions about the Acres
dalen
I am writing from a small country within the European Union called
Hungary.
[Smack dab in the middle of Central Europe - with that accent you can
tell I was southern raised stateside.] ;)
My family and I have been looking at relocating stateside,
specifically to the Big Island of Hawaii, for the past two years.
[After having lived here for almost seven years.]
It has only been of this past August that we have had permission to
sell our house here, and so a move is imminent...
... well, depending on how fast the house can sell. :)
From all of our searching, we have basically narrowed it down to
Hawaiian Acres... mainly due to the amount of land available.
We are looking at doing a bit of farming, [well fruit and nut trees,
etc.], perhaps some chickens, but the land space is adequate.
I do have some questions which I would love to hear feedback on
concerning the Acres itself, life within.
- Firstly, am I correct that basically half of the year is cloudy/Vog
all day?
[Saw stats showing this to be the case, with only about a quarter of
the year really getting any proper sunshine]
- In lieu of that I take it that it does rain quite a bit, sometimes
days on end? [Read someones blog]
I have taken note of the 'flood zone' and was curious peoples
experience with roads G, 6, & 9.
Given the variety in the acres I was wondering if some of the roads
mentioned were more favorable in both terms of being cleaned up and
more traversable . [the former having seen that some areas have been
utilized to 'dump' items such as fridges, etc.]
Would love to hear back about peoples experiences in the Acres.
Perhaps expectations you had when coming and how that changed once
there.
Also any roads in particular that may be less desirable to look at due
to being impassable and/or has tons of trash that tends to pop up? [Im
taking it neighborhood dogs are loose in certain areas and not in
others - I realize that there is a problem throughout Puna apparently
with dogs running wild.]
Thank you for your time,
Best Regards
Dalen
Benedick Howard
As a board member of our Community Center we would very much welcome you and your family!
Now is a great time to purchase here, and lots are selling for under $20,000. I just bought one closer to the hi-way just off B road and 7 for $28,000 and bulldozed a long driveway to the back and have built some simple structures, and planting gardens - a very tough concern with little top soil that take a lot of work to establish.
The Vog issue is not of concern. The trade winds blow the vog south and only once or so time a year do we have even the slightest wiff or scent. Volcanoes, Eden Rock, Fern Acres and Hilo have lots more.
We have a good handle on the trash situation, (we just did a massive cleanup last month), and dogs are not the problem so much as the wild pigs that can tear up a garden in the matter of minutes unless fenced.
Personally and like a great majority of our residents, I am very opposed and saddened by the death of the trees from new people coming to the Acres who clear cut the land without any consideration of the beautiful natural wildlife we have. These low conscious flat landers desecrate the naturally established life sytems and water sheds - in fact there is one such example on 8 road between A and B. If however you want a flat land there are lots that have been bulldozed flat, and that the owners have abandoned so buy one of those and save the dollars of bulldozing and our natural beauty and have the weeds and trash trees dozed to one side for composting. The advantage of the dozed and ripped lot is that plants can establish themselves in the crushed rock better.
Talking bulldozing there are a few conscious operators, but for the main they will not follow any design/lanscpaing instructions and rip the whole lot flat. It is very important to carefully walk the land, sit with it and listen to what it offers, there a gems of natural features like cracks (for trees) mounds (for shelter and privacy) low areas with grasses (that will flood but drain) and the Guava that indicates wet, cracked areas. If the Ohias are short then the rock is very heard, if they are big, then it is old growth, majestic and has a good toe-hold in cracks. Then there are bubbles under the mounds sometimes with caves and then there are the lava tubes you have probably heard about.
Get an idea of how the lava can look by studying recent flows and flow patterns, before it has become overgrown and apply those models to the topography that you see on a lot.
Also, consider purchasing land already planted and with a home. There are terrific deals. Check craiglist for private sales as they are the best and saves you the often as not unscupulos dealings of our monopolistic self serving realtors.
We have a strong community of off grid sustainable conscious people in the Acres, and I teach Ashtanga yoga at the Saturday morning breakfast at the community center, and looking forward to welcoming you.
Blessings
Benedick
Dalen
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dalen
I actually wrote a response yesterday, but for some reason it seems
cyber-space has eaten up my message. :)
In case this does not go through, I sent a message via email as well,
as I definitely appreciate anyone from the Hawaiian Acres community
taking the time to respond to my queries.
Best Regards
Dalen
On Nov 16, 8:54 pm, Benedick Howard <benedickhow...@googlemail.com>
wrote:
dalen
button by accident with my first response.]
A question popped up as I was reading about some of the restructuring
going on in politics and the subsequent by-laws, as it were.
Apparently its illegal to have an un-permitted structure built on ones
own property, though thus far it has been tolerated.
But according to a few adjustments to the law it seems they want to
make it 'finable' by imprisonment?
That is rough seeing that there are numerous homes, or rather people,
throughout Puna that would be affected.
What has become of this new proposed ordinance?
There is only one valid argument to even have permitted structures and
that is for the safety of those who live in the houses.
However... building a house is not rocket science. [But then again I
built them in a past life, or rather my younger years. Its like
putting together a puzzle.]
I would assume, aside from the one legit concern, it has more to do
with a tightening of 'control', rather motivated from benevolent
reasons or not, this is a sticky situation.
A number of un-permitted cabins/houses are for sell, and some appear
to be quite fine.
In fact, seeing that it can take over a year to obtain a permit for a
new, custom home, this makes a good option for someone purchasing.
[Its what we are/were looking at actually.]
Makes me wonder though, many people build unique houses from a variety
of materials - from earthen houses, etc.
It appears that such creativity is a bit stifled, and worse
punishable? Just trying to get a clear picture of what we will be
walking into.
Each place is unique.
i.e.
Here we have a house with walls built of over a foot thick brick. The
houses, while built quite well and could withstand hurricanes,
earthquakes, [basically everything we dont have here... an irony if
you ask me in how things are done - seems its an insurance scam
stateside with how houses are built], the problem is that they are
affordable.
The problem with that is that once you get one, dont expect to get an
even trade if relocating anywhere outside of Hungary. [Even within
Hungary actually to the west as well] Its as if it was designed to
help keep people flowing in the weird economy where we will soon be
paying 27% tax as of January.
The one plus of not having property tax will soon be going by the way
side as well.
Point in all of this is that each place has their issues, and to be
honest I personally am a huge advocate of what I term "individual
sovereignty", yet I see even with acreage a tightening over what one
can and cannot do in order to help people confirm to a certain
standard that typically lines someones pocket book. ;)
Seeing that taxes are an interesting thing here... aside from the 27%
tax we will soon incur, about half of the paycheck goes toward
socialized healthcare, which does not work here as you have to pay
doctors under the table if you want good treatment, and even then it
cannot compare to what is stateside.
I personally know people who refuse to go to the hospital due to
horror stories of their treatment while there... [my late father-in-
law had his toe cut off without any anesthesia... of course he passed
out. And that was a lighter story of what happened to him.]
The school system here and roads are falling to pieces, Budapest may
be fine, but east of the capital is a sad joke. [In the great plains]
I constantly ask where taxes are going, and then as I look at Big
Island I ask the same.
Most of Puna has private roads, apparently due to the gov. not feeling
they could pave them years back.
They do not have sidewalks or lampost like toward the south of the
island, as I have read.
Emergency response services may be improving but for years it was
lacking. [Read about the Waa Waa 'district']
I have to ask myself, where do taxes go to? It appears that a group of
people are not seeing the full benefit.
But, again I look at these things, perhaps a bit sharply as I see the
corruption going on here at 'home' [what is our home now], while the
economy sinks and people crawl on each other in order to stand on the
drowned below. [Sorry if this seems a bit pessimistic]
Again, just giving a bit of background with what I have seen and
experienced, and how things appear over there from where I am.
I could be totally off and things may be fine... I realize the
community is working hard to clean up and love their area, but the
apparent intrusion to go as far as to want to make it an imprisonable
offense for living in an un-permitted structure... seems a bit far.
[even for where I live, and here we have to carry tons of papers
everytime we walk outside our gate for identification.]
Thank you in advance for your time, and I look forward to hearing
about your own personal experiences and take on the situation.
Perhaps its why so many 'houses' are up for sale, trying to get rid of
them as they cannot afford to make them permittable?
Best Regards
Dalen
diana
Dalen,
You are apparently a better typist than I am...seeing the length of your last 2 emails and the lack of typos. (I have history in typos..)
I have also traveled around Europe during my military service. I have worked with some Turkish military (among others) when I was on temporary duty in Kosovo at a NATO camp near Pristina.
Hawaii state recently adopted the international building code and each county is charged with coming up with a version of the IBC specific to their needs. I am not sure what the justification for Hawaii County to include some of what they did. A lot of their new code involved requiring structures to be hurricane resistant up to winds of 160mph. But, let's try not to think about the fact that it has been a long, long time since damaging hurricane winds have even affected this island. (Kauai had Hurricane Iniki in 1992.) Benedick is more informed about the alternative that are being proposed, but the bill that would have adopted the new code has been kicked back to County Council Committee (Public Works)...for more thought and modification, perhaps.
By the way, there are many, many people living in unpermitted structures here in Puna. I am not sure if they ever will go after the people living in them, but times are changing.
People do sell unpermitted structures and if you have cash or can work out owner-financing, there are some pretty good deals. Mortgages are not going to be available for these structures.
I believe the reason that most of the subdivisions have private roads is that when the subdivision were formed (as sort of a land scam in the 60s to 70s), the people who got permission to subdivide and establish subdivisions were never required to put in roads up to any (not even a low) standard. I do not believe the land was ever expected to be populated. Hawaiian Acres is mostly on a 400-500 year lava flow...and most areas have very little dirt. Since the area was generally not useful for sugar cane or other farming, the forest was left intact until subdivided in 1961. Hawaiian Acres is comprised of over 10,000 acres and most of our lots are 150 ft wide and 877 ft deep...thus minimizing the road (crappy roads, at that) when this subdivision was formed.
Most of us (and in most of the big subdivisions) enjoy not having street lights (There are actually stars visible out here at night..). The road easement in Hawaiian Acres is 40 ft wide and all property owners own a percentage of it. I enjoy living off of a unpaved road. I understand that I will never be able to drive a Prius or a low clearance car to my lot, but that's OK. I do not want to live in an urban area. There are not underground utilities here, besides cesspools, that is...(too much rock). Most of us do not want County water or County sewers, anyway. Sidewalks are also not needed or wanted here, in my opinion. This is an ag-zoned subdivision (as you already know.)
Electricity is available to most areas of the subdivision, but if you are seriously considering looking at property here, you should ask if the SSPP (Special Subdivision Power Program) has been paid. That is the cost that our local utility (whose KW cost is one of the highest in the nation) will charge you to hook up to their grid. SSPP generally ranges from $2K to 11K, not including the cost of poles. The greener solution (and maybe cheaper) is to stay off-grid (with a PV system....I did and it works for me.)
There are many ares of the subdivision that still have areas intact native rainforest. Our forests are unique to anywhere else in the world as the evolved here to be species only found naturally on this isolated Hawaiian Island chain. The most common native tree around here is the ohia lehua tree and a tree a foot in diameter is over a hundred years old....many larger trees in the subdivision are 400 plus years old. If your vision is to clear your lot pin to pin to do some kind of agriculture, as Benedick suggested, I'd ask you to look for a previously cleared lot or one that has already been taken over by one of the many invasive species introduced here in the past such as strawberry guava. (By the way, there are restrictions to the amount of land you can bulldoze without a permit.) There are stream running through many areas and you cannot divert the stream to a different location so that it exits a different spot on your property. There are flood zones and 100 - 140 inches of rain a year. The good news is that lava rock is porous, so most of the streams are seasonal.
Currently, because of the economic slumps in the US, land is cheap here in Hawaii. Our subdivision is cheaper than other areas mainly due to the condition of the roads, I think. Fern Acres (2 acres lots next to us) have much better roads (mandatory road dues). Orchidland, on the other side, has 2 and 3 acres lots, some of the roads are better, others not so much. Kopua Farm lots, up the hill a bit, has 20 acres lots and their price is coming down, too.
A lot of people have asked where our property taxes over the years have gone, since there are few parks, services, etc. Hilo is the local Budapest, I guess. They have pretty nice facilities there. (I still like the area the way it is here....I'd move to Hilo if I wanted the stuff they have. But, they could cut my taxes and I would not complain...)
I'd look closely at the area before you decide. I really like Hawaiian Acres. But, my version of paradise does not necessarily coincide with the next persons.
Well, I am all typed out.
cheers,
diana
-----Original Message-----
>From: dalen
>Sent: Nov 18, 2011 12:37 PM
>To: Hawaiian Acres info
>Subject: [hawaiian-acres-info:128] Re: Questions about the Acres
>
>I see that my last post made it though. [I suppose I hit the back
>button by accident with my first response.]
>
>A question popped up as I was reading about some of the restructuring
>going on in politics and the subsequent by-laws, as it were.
>
>Apparently its illegal to have an un-permitted structure built on ones
>own property, though thus far it has been tolerated.
>But according to a few adjustments to the law it seems they want to
>make it 'finable' by imprisonment?
>That is rough seeing that there are numerous homes, or rather people,
>throughout Puna that would be affected.
>
>What has become of this new proposed ordinance?
>
>There is only one valid argument to even have permitted structures and
>that is for the safety of those who live in the houses.
>However... building a house is not rocket science. [But then again I
>built them in a past life, or rather my younger years. Its like
>putting together a puzzle.]
>I would assume, aside from the one legit concern, it has more to do
>with a tightening of 'control', rather motivated from benevolent
>reasons or not, this is a sticky situation.
dalen
Again it truly is wonderful to hear from people who are actually
living in the Acres.
Wow, never have been to Turkey, though Istanbul is not too far...
truth is I have mainly 'hung' around the Germanic speaking countries,
[Austria, etc.], and in the last six years really just been 'stuck'
here. [Amazing how 'close' we are to places, but due to our location
within Hungary a days drive - where we can actually get back home the
same day - doesn't afford much luxury as far as what can be seen.] :)
As for international building codes I find it interesting that Florida
builds with 2x4s with "hurricane clips", [so it can blow away together
in one piece, I suppose],
While here many of the houses have walls build of walls over a foot
thick for less price than what a house even in the cheapest area
stateside would cost.
[The funny bit is that the material comes from an Austrian company, so
its not like we have 'cheap prices', especially with the cost of items
driving many people to actually purchase their goods in neighboring
Austria... which still isnt cheap. - well, for those lucky to not be
in the east part of the country.]
There is a caveat to all of this. They do have mud/straw 'blocks' that
they build houses with. If you do not properly maintain them each
year, the winters will destroy them fast. But, if you do maintain
them, they are better insulated than the brick houses and you truly
will not suffer in the summer when the week of high temps of 40
celsius pops ups. And in the winter the heat stays in better.
Typically older 'grandma' homes are built like this.
The other caveat, if you do not watch the builder, you will regret
it... We have more paper work than anyone can imagine, yet it does not
guarantee a proper job.
It truly is weird actually.
I suppose my hang up about this all is that I know that houses
stateside could be built to a higher quality, and truly last in
hurricane conditions, etc., yet I feel that the materials are not
offered due to Insurance companies becoming irrelevant with houses
that wont burn down, nor will hurricanes blow them away.
This is something I wish would change, as I see many stateside loosing
their house, houses which compared to here, are not worth the cost.
They actually have introduced the "American style" housing here. We
had to warn our friends not to get one of the kit homes.
After seeing hollywood movies everyone thinks the house are just
great, not realizing that your elbow could basically put a hole in the
drywall, etc.
Upon seeing pics of the actual structure, they declined. [The houses
here are not cheaper, but then again wood here is very expensive.]
We had the red sludge incident here, but that was a poor area, which
probably had mix of brick with mud brick. So the one pic you saw with
brick walls wiped out, it probably was that was the only brick they
had in their houses. It really was one of the poorest areas in the
country, to add to it, the sludge was not just some slow, low moving
force - I wont get into the whole incident, but there was a money scam
there to be certain.
Again, my apologies about going on about this, but it is to drive home
a point that I believe, to a degree, a lot of what is going on with
codes is about control vs actually wanting to help. [I could be wrong
so I will refrain from further judgement.]
I do find it interesting that the company who supplies bricks for us
here in Hungary, also supplies facebricks [decoration, exterior]
bricks stateside - but not the bricks used for the structure itself. I
asked them about this and they went as far as saying they would ship
me the bricks.
You know, I can imagine what would happen if I did order from them. I
would eventually get it permitted, as nothing would take it down, and
then my taxes would be beyond this world - all because I have a
'normal' house, despite the fact it does not cost more than what a
house there cost built of 2x4s. ;)
Enough of my rambling on this... I thank you, and whoever is reading
this, patience.
...
As far as the street lights and side walks, by no means am I
suggesting that the acres should have this.
I grew up for the best part of my teen years in rural GA. where most
people were farmers with 1k+ acres of land, and 'hobby' farmers had
100+ acres.
[We had a humble 27.9 acres with a creek.]
My only point with that is that I believe its a rip off paying taxes
when you get absolutely nothing in return.
I know this is an obvious statement, and many will quote that you have
a couple things for certain, "death and taxes",
though I think Ray Kurzweil and even Michio Kaku, may argue the former
is not a given anymore, and taxes if not benefiting anyone, may need
to be rethought.
But I will leave my 'hippie' protest for another time as well.
As for clearing the land, Dia [my wife] and myself are nature lovers.
We would not just go in and clear cut. The fact is we are almost
devastated when we see lots for sale that have been cleared, and then
advertised as if this were some bonus that nothing is left! The lots
look absolutely horrible, and all because its now 'level'.
True I would love to have a lot of agriculture, but there are plenty
of lots there that we have seen which have nicely been cleared
already, leaving a lot of the trees in tact.
The properties we are looking at in particular are on road 6. They
were owned by a person who has passed away and the land is in
'probate'. [Im not really familiar with the process, but I take it he
did not have a will and the state and his brother are apparently
taking care of the sales. He also has a place on road G with a cabin
that looks identical to the one on road 6.] So you may be familiar
with which property I refer to.
Our aim was to buy something that had some 'stable' shelter on it
while we build.
And with it taking a year to get permission to build i was not overly
anxious to get a permit... but seeing the issues with people not happy
that people can actually afford to live somewhere other than the
street, and want to put them in jail or have them tear down their
unpermitted structures, suppose we will have to be careful with how we
step. [Again this much talking into things when people in the area do
not even get kick backs, not that they want any, really is a bee in my
bonnet as it were. But that tends to be the way in the world
regardless of where you are, unless you have sea-fearing skills and
can live on a ship at sea.] ;)
Well, I do apologize if I have gone on for too long. Perhaps there
were some points of interest concerning house structure variations/
alternatives, etc.
One last note, while it is understandable that we should come look
around first, we do not have much flex room, so most of our ducks have
to be in a row before we leave.
We have set out certain criteria, and Hawaiian Acres happens to have
met everyone of those points. We do not have any issues with the Acres
as is.
The people seem fine, life there seems fine, I believe it is more the
politics that causes an eyebrow to be raised, but as mentioned, one is
hard pressed to escape politics anywhere on this earth unless you have
a ranch in texas... and then you do not even own rights to the oil
under your property, it has already been given away. ;)
Thank again you for your time and response Diana,
- Dalen
dalen
Here is a link to the Porotherm bricks we use here in Hungary, from
the Austrian company.
The first of the four options on the page show how our walls are
typically built.
[Varies structure to structure, my brother-in-law built his walls 2ft
thick, he is a maximalist, and it cost him about 50k dollars for a two
story house which looks like a castle.]
To explain things, with Hungarys entrance into the European Union a
few years back, the prices have gone up a bit - and owner/builder will
get you more bang for the buck, as well as better quality.
Even though we are in the E.U., you can still build top quality homes
like you see in the link above, which are hurricane and fire proof -
compared to what I saw on the beaches of Florida... destroyed despite
their 'hurricane clips.'
This is where I say something is up with 'International Codes' when
material like this is not even offered, to the best of my knowledge
stateside.
As mentioned the company, last I talked with them, only sell their
facebricks [decoration brick] stateside. Im calling an international
scam here. ;)
How does this affect you guys? Well, as mentioned there is nothing
wrong with wanting someones safety, but be sure that real options are
being given and not just lining someones pocket who will benefit by
pushing rules that appear to help. Again, build the house linked
above, and a hurricane 'resistant house' in Florida where we know they
will get a hurricane, and lets see which really stands up. [Again,
insurance companies wont be happy... nor will the companies selling
2x4s and dry wall.]
I had mentioned how the American style housing has made it way here
and is not cheaper, mainly due to price of wood. [In fairness it may
be slightly cheaper, but for what you get it should be practically
free.]
Well, I have seen banks built in this city using the new dry wall
method... [they have to be crazy with that.] I feel what we had will
become extinct.
While the link above wont necessarily help, as shipping cost may make
it prohibitively expensive to ship the material - it does give one a
glimpse into a true alternative and makes one ask what kind of scam
has been going on that in all of the 50 states, no one has taken up to
building with this kind of material. [Imagine Michigan where its cold,
Florida with the winds, etc.] But again, how would people react to
know they spent their entire lifes savings on something that cannot be
passed onto the next generation?
Its as if each generation is meant to struggle and start over again
and owe the system that is in place. [Here goes my 'hippie' speech. An
irony as Im not against tech. Im a video producer/director who happens
to enjoy the theories of "the singularity" and what tech can offer. Im
'against' the attitude which keeps the majority ignorant of the
something better that really is available.
"We now know that there is enough to go around.
If we could truly collaborate with our fellow man, there would be
enough to go around for the world. But none of us can break through
our own models of the way the game goes enough to do the things
necessary to bring about that realization." - Richard Alpert
To also loosely quote Richard Alpert, not the guy from LOST:
"If your ego has a vested interest in the ongoing game you are
frightened by anything that might change it."
Im sure on Big Island, as pretty much in every state and country in
the world - including where we are at now, especially, we face what I
quoted above.
Vested interest, which can be seen when it reaches into peoples
sovereign choices of how they are to live their life, conforming it to
a set standard meant to push another agenda. [Again, sometimes this is
benevolent, but i like to point out Michio Kakus point that we are a
baby civilization with only a 50/50 chance of making it... that 50
chance pulling us back is identification with the ego and its fears
and need to control, etc.
Well, no one asked for this little speech... so for those of you who
patiently read this, as well as my other post, thank you.
I wrote to find out your experiences, but am passionate about the
whole living bit as its my beliefe each person has a right to house
and food. And if I can show something that may help in this regards, I
will.
Instead of builders growing bamboo on other islands and then building
expensive kit homes on the Big Island and other places, it would be
cool to bring that project home.
[You get a higher profit margin doing business elsewhere, just like
Apple in China, etc.]
Same with the bricks, it would be a worthy endeavor to start a 'brick
factory' on the island...
You guys are on lava rock, now I do not know of the structural
integrity of using this as an alternative source, but from all the
lava flows it is renewable if its kept to those only on the island.
These are just ideas, and there are plenty of people there that could
make things safe, if that is a true concern, while making it
affordable... if they wanted to.
Again, its not about an outsider telling people how to do things
there. What is done there, surprisingly to some, is really no
different than anywhere else.
I have found that in any small area that people will do things how
they have always done things, or to quote LOTR "... where change
rarely happens, if at all".
Each area has their way of doing things, and only in international
cities do you get a hint of co-operation which is drowned out by
"stuff" as 'grandpa' George Carlin would say. ;)
Anyway, this whole post was to show another alternate to building and
that even in Europe, where we have the highest taxes on every item in
the stores, its still cheaper than building the same size house
stateside. [pretty much anywhere] And it goes back to saying, "what is
really going on" - and meant as encouragement to show there are real
alternatives.
Thanks for the listen
Dalen
p.s.
Diana, not sure about spelling mistakes, but Im sure words get mixed
up as I speed along with my typing and I miss them... so there may be
points that read awkwardly unfortunately. :)
diana
(Note: Internet connection is not always that great out here, so this long rambling email that I just typed was lost in cyberspace so I'll retype some of it....)
Interesting perspective in your notes.
I personally think that the County can have a building code for public structures and rentals, but if someone wants to build a house to live in, they should be able to build it to any standard that they chose. Many people cannot afford permitted structures so they building something that is not. To them it is an alternative to being homeless.
I am also a big-time "tree hugger" so I cringe every time I see a bulldozer enroute to flatten areas of native forest. I think there needs to be a balance between what humans take from the environment and what we leave untouched. I think biodiversity is a good thing and we (humans) seem to be plowing through the resources on this planet fairly quickly, causing the extinction of more species every year.
I hope this note goes through since my two typing fingers are getting tired.
cheers,
diana
trac...@gmail.com
Sent from my iPhone
dalen
to me a couple of times responding to people via private message on
FB...]
So I appreciate you taking the time to re-type and summarize your
thoughts.
[My wife relates to the two-finger typing, though she tries to
alternate fingers since she learned the piano for 7 years.] :)
Fortunately I picked up typing when I learned typography/print in
school many moons ago.
You hit the nail on the head concerning permitted structures as far as
Im concerned.
I really hope things work out with your communities voice, not only
being heard, but being listened to and acted upon concerning this new
law by the local council.
Yeah, my whole family is in love with nature... everywhere we walk
something sprouts.... so we should fit in fine. ;)
@Trace, just to clarify I understood your message 'ha' to be Hawaiian
Acres?
Peace
Dalen
On Nov 19, 7:44 pm, diana <diana...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> Dalen,
> (Note: Internet connection is not always that great out here, so this long rambling email that I just typed was lost in cyberspace so I'll retype some of it....)
>
> Interesting perspective in your notes.
> I personally think that the County can have a building code for public structures and rentals, but if someone wants to build a house to live in, they should be able to build it to any standard that they chose. Many people cannot afford permitted structures so they building something that is not. To them it is an alternative to being homeless.
>
> I am also a big-time "tree hugger" so I cringe every time I see a bulldozer enroute to flatten areas of native forest. I think there needs to be a balance between what humans take from the environment and what we leave untouched. I think biodiversity is a good thing and we (humans) seem to be plowing through the resources on this planet fairly quickly, causing the extinction of more species every year.
>
> I hope this note goes through since my two typing fingers are getting tired.
>
> cheers,
> diana
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: dalen <dalen.p...@gmail.com>
> >Sent: Nov 18, 2011 10:42 PM
> >To: Hawaiian Acres info <hawaiian-...@googlegroups.com>
> >Subject: [hawaiian-acres-info:132] Re: Questions about the Acres
>
> >p.s.
>
> >Here is a link to the Porotherm bricks we use here in Hungary, from
> >the Austrian company.
> >The first of the four options on the page show how our walls are
> >typically built.
> >[Varies structure to structure, my brother-in-law built his walls 2ft
> >thick, he is a maximalist, and it cost him about 50k dollars for a two
> >story house which looks like a castle.]
>
> >http://www.wienerberger.com/brands-products/porotherm-bricks-ceiling-...
dalen
You mentioned that you use a photovoltaic system for living off-grid.
In my search for Big Island Puna solar dealers, I ran across provision
tech:
http://www.provisiontechnologies.com
However, I was informed by them that they have not dealt with off-grid
systems for a few years now.
Suppose their system strictly hooks into Helco [interesting name for a
company who appears to have some of the highest rates in the
nation] ;)
What company would you recommend for panels?
I am curious with the amount of rain that the area receives, how well
that type of energy system works.
[Isnt it correct that you get about 33% of full capacity on cloudy
days?]
I realize that some people use wind-turbines in the south of the
island:
A tech which is catching on in the world apparently.
I have actually seen them in a neighborhood outside the city of
Debrecen, which is about an hour away from us. No noticeable 'noise'
issue at the time.
Any feedback as to alternative energy would be great, as I have no
desire in feeding Helco, even if getting kickbacks from hooking into
their system with my own.
[Again, call it the hippie protester in me, but their rates are as
about as insane as our gas rates here - though to be fair its only in
the winter months that one really takes note giving some relief for a
month or two.]
Jacobson
b
diana
I apologize for the delay in my response. I work 2 part-time jobs and do work around my properties and some days I have less computer time than others.
Yes, years ago when I was looking for a contractor to install my off-grid system, I went to Provision. I cannot remember if they did off-grid systems at the time, but they sure were advocating grid-tied. I was also told that Provision was originally started by HELCO with Federal dollars available at the time and they eventually separated to be an independent business. (This is unverified information.) Provision also has a pretty big office/store area in Hilo's industrial area.....which of course, means more overhead, which will be passed on to the customer, I assume.
When I look for contractors to do work, I generally try to find one that has less overhead (meaning no commercial office and minimal employees.) You might want to check out Craigslist for solar contractors. The cost of solar panels has gone done about 20-25 percent in the past few years. I decided to go the permitted way, but plenty of people have unpermitted PV systems. Also, many electrical contractors are going into the solar business. I'd get multiple bids for a system since it will cost a chunk of change even with the cost of panels going down.
I would not recommend the guy who put up the system on my residence to anyone. He took him 2 and a half years to get it done and permitted. I have heard good and bad about a couple of other contractors. I recently used Ernie Mattos (an electrician) to put a grid-tied system on my rental property....(I did not want to have tenants mess with batteries.) I was happy with his work.
If you are going t buy the supplies and put up your own system, I've been told that Solarman has pretty good prices. But, more people are getting into this business, so competition generally drives down the prices.
Solar is the most common alternative energy here in this area. Down towards the south end of the island (South Point) HELCO has many large wind turbine which seem to be providing a good amount of energy that they are able to sell to us at high costs. I've not heard of anyone utilizing wind for single family residences. On the Kona coast, they have an alternate energy research facility where they also use ocean waves to generate energy...as well as solar, but I am not all familiar with the details of that place. (I have not been to Kona side for 2 years or more.....too far to drive...)
Well, once again, I am all typed out.
happy holidays,
diana
-----Original Message-----
>From: dalen
>To: Hawaiian Acres info
dalen
'blockage' with the forest there - unlike the dessert area of the
south with no obstruction. :)
* And Diana, thank you for your thoughtful response, it is much
appreciated. [no need need for any apologies, I am very humbled that
you, [as well as others in the community], have taken the time to
respond to my queries... and moreover, had the patience to read my
lengthy ramblings, which I can only pray are somewhat coherent.
Permits, etc.:
I suppose I have spent too much time on-line reading about alternative
off-grid living - with the idea of having affordable, quality housing,
etc. - just to find that apparently in Puna the laws are not flexible
for such dwellings.
Even some subdivisions frown upon sustainable living:
[i.e., In some subdivisons within Puna, raising animals goes against
CC&Rs... despite the land being agriculturally zoned.]
Ah... what to do? :)
Well, first I must sell our house here!
It will be interesting to see how things go... I still feel like Im in
some weird twilight-zone movie concerning houses/living.
[Most expensive taxes in all of Europe, yet dirt as cheap quality
houses that, if sold, could barely get you the dirt on which to build
a new house... with permit.] ;)
Anyway, I feel Im getting a good 'grasp' of what to expect.. given we
are able to make the move.
It does not seem it will be as simple as just buying land and owner/
building as many off-grid alternative home-owners seem able to do...
but we will see.
Thank you again.
Dalen
dalen
Solar heater - more of interest where I currently live with our cold
weather, but who knows, may still be of interest the thought behind it
for those who love the off-grid lifestyle:
Philip Tait
an excellent investment here.
Philip
dalen
- D