I'm currently playing around with Froth and I'm very interested to get something basic up and running as a proof of concept, ideally just on my mac. I'm put off by the ties to EC2 unfortunately, as I suspect many other people will be. As a web developer I'm used to testing locally (either on my Mac or in a Linux VM that is running on my Mac) and would like to do that with FrothKit, since really I'm just playing right now. We pretty much want something we can just download and click "Build" out of the box to see a Hello World! running on a Mac to start with.
So my questions are:
1) When you say mac deployment is not supported, is it just because it doesn't work out of the box, or is it a huge problem to solve? What is my mac (10.6.3) missing that Froth would need in order to work?
2) If I can't deploy directly to my Mac, I have a VM running Ubuntu. I understand I can deploy to this but don't find any documentation explaining what I'd need to do. Are you able to outline very briefly what I'd need? I'm pretty comfortable with configuring servers etc so I don't need anything in great detail, more or less a list of dependencies and some basic configuration/environment requirements would suffice.
3) Are you looking for any support for existing web developers coming from other environments?
> 1) When you say mac deployment is not supported, is it just because > it doesn't work out of the box, or is it a huge problem to solve? > What is my mac (10.6.3) missing that Froth would need in order to > work?
Their is no technical reason that Froth wont run on mac. My initial development efforts had it building and running on Mac via Apache and mod_fastcgi. Its really just a matter of resolving all the dependancies then setting up apache and fastcgi. I do plan on making mac deployments more seamless, however I have a lot on my plate at the moment so haven't been able to get to it. Their has been some work from another person on this as well. Along with the mod_fastcgi setup you would also need to locate your webapp resource either in a served folder, or setup apache to include your webApp's 'Static' folder.
I've also considered integrating Froth with one of the many cocoa http server projects, and in the end this may be the best way for local deployments. With this approach froth could be integrated into a regular mac application, illuminating the need for complicated apache configurations.
Also it may be easier to install lighttpd on mac, as froth has been tailored for use with lighttpd. Then install all the other dependancies possibly with MacPorts or Fink (See below for dependancies).
> 2) If I can't deploy directly to my Mac, I have a VM running Ubuntu. > I understand I can deploy to this but don't find any documentation > explaining what I'd need to do. Are you able to outline very briefly > what I'd need? I'm pretty comfortable with configuring servers etc so > I don't need anything in great detail, more or less a list of > dependencies and some basic configuration/environment requirements > would suffice.
Local vm setup is also possible, and probably a quicker short term solution for local testing. I just haven't had the time to provide any documentation on the process. Some of the steps I know will have to be taken for linux vm setup are...
1. Use apt-get to install all froth dependancies. The following list assumes you are using Ubuntu or a Debian based distro, some of the following may already be installed or get installed with a previous package. apt-get will inform of any additional packages needed for each.
2. Once the dependancies are installed, its best to setup ssh on your virtual box so you can build and deploy to the machine from xcode. The steps to do that can be found here.
3 Deploy fmtools and frothkit to your virtual machine from Xcode.
3.1 Build and deploy froth framework. A. Launch Xcode, then open the FrothKit project. B. Expand the 'Targets' section from the Groups & Files source list. C. Double click on the 'FrothLinux' target. D. Under the "Configuration:" popup, select the 'Deploy' configuration. E. Scroll to the User-Defined section of the configuration settings. F. Under FROTH_HOST, enter the ip address of your local virtual linux machine. G. Under FROTH_IDENTITY, enter the path to your private key generated under step 2. (or double click on the setting, and drag the private key to the window) H. Close the target settings window. F. Select the 'Deploy' target as the active target from the project window. G. Select 'Build' H. It should build with no errors (however their will be lots of warnings...)
3.1 Build and deploy fmtools A. Launch Xcode, then open the FrothKit project. B. Expand the 'External Tool Projects' folder from the Groups & Files source list. C. Double click on the 'fmtool.xcodeproj' to open that project in xcode. D. Expand the 'Targets' section from the Groups & Files source list. E. Double click on the 'fmtool-lighttpd1.4' target. F. Scroll to the User-Defined section of the configuration settings. G. Under FROTH_HOST, enter the ip address of your local virtual linux machine. H. Under FROTH_IDENTITY, enter the path to your private key generated under step 2. (or double click on the setting, and drag the private G. Select 'Build'
This *should* work, however, let me know and I will correct any procedures if this fails.
> 3) Are you looking for any support for existing web developers coming > from other environments?
Absolutely! It would be great if more developers can get involved with Froth.
Thanks for the in-depth response, I appreciate your time. I will definitely give this a go over the weekend if not today. I'm glad that I have found Froth since it looks like a project in its infancy that could grow into a big contributor in the web development world. I think some web developers have reservations about compiled languages on the web, but I think it's all about the power of the framework behind it in the end. People are becoming more open to the idea of compiling their source before deploying it. I mean, we always had Java (ugh!), and recently the Facebook devs released Hip-Hop which compiles PHP into equivalent C code.
I also looked at Bombax which seems to be the only other "modern" ObjC framework and I don't like the approach taken anywhere near as much as with FrothKit.
I'll let you know my thoughts after a little play around. I'm guessing not at this stage, but do you know if live sites using this? Just curious, I understand how young the project is.
Cheers,
Chris
Il giorno 16/apr/2010, alle ore 03.16, Allan ha scritto:
>> 1) When you say mac deployment is not supported, is it just because
>> it doesn't work out of the box, or is it a huge problem to solve?
>> What is my mac (10.6.3) missing that Froth would need in order to
>> work?
> Their is no technical reason that Froth wont run on mac. My initial
> development efforts had it building and running on Mac via Apache and
> mod_fastcgi. Its really just a matter of resolving all the
> dependancies then setting up apache and fastcgi. I do plan on making
> mac deployments more seamless, however I have a lot on my plate at the
> moment so haven't been able to get to it. Their has been some work
> from another person on this as well. Along with the mod_fastcgi setup
> you would also need to locate your webapp resource either in a served
> folder, or setup apache to include your webApp's 'Static' folder.
> I've also considered integrating Froth with one of the many cocoa http
> server projects, and in the end this may be the best way for local
> deployments. With this approach froth could be integrated into a
> regular mac application, illuminating the need for complicated apache
> configurations.
> Also it may be easier to install lighttpd on mac, as froth has been
> tailored for use with lighttpd. Then install all the other
> dependancies possibly with MacPorts or Fink (See below for
> dependancies).
>> 2) If I can't deploy directly to my Mac, I have a VM running Ubuntu.
>> I understand I can deploy to this but don't find any documentation
>> explaining what I'd need to do. Are you able to outline very briefly
>> what I'd need? I'm pretty comfortable with configuring servers etc so
>> I don't need anything in great detail, more or less a list of
>> dependencies and some basic configuration/environment requirements
>> would suffice.
> Local vm setup is also possible, and probably a quicker short term
> solution for local testing. I just haven't had the time to provide any
> documentation on the process. Some of the steps I know will have to be
> taken for linux vm setup are...
> 1. Use apt-get to install all froth dependancies.
> The following list assumes you are using Ubuntu or a Debian based
> distro, some of the following may already be installed or get
> installed with a previous package. apt-get will inform of any
> additional packages needed for each.
> 2. Once the dependancies are installed, its best to setup ssh on your
> virtual box so you can build and deploy to the machine from xcode. The
> steps to do that can be found here.
> 3 Deploy fmtools and frothkit to your virtual machine from Xcode.
> 3.1 Build and deploy froth framework.
> A. Launch Xcode, then open the FrothKit project.
> B. Expand the 'Targets' section from the Groups & Files source list.
> C. Double click on the 'FrothLinux' target.
> D. Under the "Configuration:" popup, select the 'Deploy'
> configuration.
> E. Scroll to the User-Defined section of the configuration settings.
> F. Under FROTH_HOST, enter the ip address of your local virtual linux
> machine.
> G. Under FROTH_IDENTITY, enter the path to your private key generated
> under step 2. (or double click on the setting, and drag the private
> key to the window)
> H. Close the target settings window.
> F. Select the 'Deploy' target as the active target from the project
> window.
> G. Select 'Build'
> H. It should build with no errors (however their will be lots of
> warnings...)
> 3.1 Build and deploy fmtools
> A. Launch Xcode, then open the FrothKit project.
> B. Expand the 'External Tool Projects' folder from the Groups & Files
> source list.
> C. Double click on the 'fmtool.xcodeproj' to open that project in
> xcode.
> D. Expand the 'Targets' section from the Groups & Files source list.
> E. Double click on the 'fmtool-lighttpd1.4' target.
> F. Scroll to the User-Defined section of the configuration settings.
> G. Under FROTH_HOST, enter the ip address of your local virtual linux
> machine.
> H. Under FROTH_IDENTITY, enter the path to your private key generated
> under step 2. (or double click on the setting, and drag the private
> G. Select 'Build'
> This *should* work, however, let me know and I will correct any
> procedures if this fails.
>> 3) Are you looking for any support for existing web developers coming
>> from other environments?
> Absolutely! It would be great if more developers can get involved with
> Froth.
> Cheers,
> Allan
> -- > To unsubscribe, reply using "remove me" as the subject.
Pretty much just our internal apps are running on it. I'm in the process of developing two major web apps on the framework, and they have been the driving force behind the framework.
Whats public now.
http://www.dejumble.com -> just an informational site, so doesn't really do the kit justice.
I am really open to input from seasoned web developers on this kit. So by all means feel free to let me know what works, and what doesn't as far as the api goes. And feel free to contribute any patches or improvements. I'd like to see froth's api spec finalized, then we can work on fine tuning and enhancements.
I think I will shoot for the next release to include native mac deployments. After thinking about this more from your questions, It makes a lot of sense and will help drive the kit forward.
> Thanks for the in-depth response, I appreciate your time. I will definitely give this a go over the weekend if not today. I'm glad that I have found Froth since it looks like a project in its infancy that could grow into a big contributor in the web development world. I think some web developers have reservations about compiled languages on the web, but I think it's all about the power of the framework behind it in the end. People are becoming more open to the idea of compiling their source before deploying it. I mean, we always had Java (ugh!), and recently the Facebook devs released Hip-Hop which compiles PHP into equivalent C code.
> I also looked at Bombax which seems to be the only other "modern" ObjC framework and I don't like the approach taken anywhere near as much as with FrothKit.
> I'll let you know my thoughts after a little play around. I'm guessing not at this stage, but do you know if live sites using this? Just curious, I understand how young the project is.
> Cheers,
> Chris
> Il giorno 16/apr/2010, alle ore 03.16, Allan ha scritto:
>> Chris,
>>> 1) When you say mac deployment is not supported, is it just because
>>> it doesn't work out of the box, or is it a huge problem to solve?
>>> What is my mac (10.6.3) missing that Froth would need in order to
>>> work?
>> Their is no technical reason that Froth wont run on mac. My initial
>> development efforts had it building and running on Mac via Apache and
>> mod_fastcgi. Its really just a matter of resolving all the
>> dependancies then setting up apache and fastcgi. I do plan on making
>> mac deployments more seamless, however I have a lot on my plate at the
>> moment so haven't been able to get to it. Their has been some work
>> from another person on this as well. Along with the mod_fastcgi setup
>> you would also need to locate your webapp resource either in a served
>> folder, or setup apache to include your webApp's 'Static' folder.
>> I've also considered integrating Froth with one of the many cocoa http
>> server projects, and in the end this may be the best way for local
>> deployments. With this approach froth could be integrated into a
>> regular mac application, illuminating the need for complicated apache
>> configurations.
>> Also it may be easier to install lighttpd on mac, as froth has been
>> tailored for use with lighttpd. Then install all the other
>> dependancies possibly with MacPorts or Fink (See below for
>> dependancies).
>>> 2) If I can't deploy directly to my Mac, I have a VM running Ubuntu.
>>> I understand I can deploy to this but don't find any documentation
>>> explaining what I'd need to do. Are you able to outline very briefly
>>> what I'd need? I'm pretty comfortable with configuring servers etc so
>>> I don't need anything in great detail, more or less a list of
>>> dependencies and some basic configuration/environment requirements
>>> would suffice.
>> Local vm setup is also possible, and probably a quicker short term
>> solution for local testing. I just haven't had the time to provide any
>> documentation on the process. Some of the steps I know will have to be
>> taken for linux vm setup are...
>> 1. Use apt-get to install all froth dependancies.
>> The following list assumes you are using Ubuntu or a Debian based
>> distro, some of the following may already be installed or get
>> installed with a previous package. apt-get will inform of any
>> additional packages needed for each.
>> 2. Once the dependancies are installed, its best to setup ssh on your
>> virtual box so you can build and deploy to the machine from xcode. The
>> steps to do that can be found here.
>> 3 Deploy fmtools and frothkit to your virtual machine from Xcode.
>> 3.1 Build and deploy froth framework.
>> A. Launch Xcode, then open the FrothKit project.
>> B. Expand the 'Targets' section from the Groups & Files source list.
>> C. Double click on the 'FrothLinux' target.
>> D. Under the "Configuration:" popup, select the 'Deploy'
>> configuration.
>> E. Scroll to the User-Defined section of the configuration settings.
>> F. Under FROTH_HOST, enter the ip address of your local virtual linux
>> machine.
>> G. Under FROTH_IDENTITY, enter the path to your private key generated
>> under step 2. (or double click on the setting, and drag the private
>> key to the window)
>> H. Close the target settings window.
>> F. Select the 'Deploy' target as the active target from the project
>> window.
>> G. Select 'Build'
>> H. It should build with no errors (however their will be lots of
>> warnings...)
>> 3.1 Build and deploy fmtools
>> A. Launch Xcode, then open the FrothKit project.
>> B. Expand the 'External Tool Projects' folder from the Groups & Files
>> source list.
>> C. Double click on the 'fmtool.xcodeproj' to open that project in
>> xcode.
>> D. Expand the 'Targets' section from the Groups & Files source list.
>> E. Double click on the 'fmtool-lighttpd1.4' target.
>> F. Scroll to the User-Defined section of the configuration settings.
>> G. Under FROTH_HOST, enter the ip address of your local virtual linux
>> machine.
>> H. Under FROTH_IDENTITY, enter the path to your private key generated
>> under step 2. (or double click on the setting, and drag the private
>> G. Select 'Build'
>> This *should* work, however, let me know and I will correct any
>> procedures if this fails.
>>> 3) Are you looking for any support for existing web developers coming
>>> from other environments?
>> Absolutely! It would be great if more developers can get involved with
>> Froth.
>> Cheers,
>> Allan
>> -- >> To unsubscribe, reply using "remove me" as the subject.
/Users/chris/frothkit-read-only/froth-sdk-source/corekit/NSURLConnection+Fo undationCompletions.m:31:0 /Users/chris/frothkit-read-only/froth-sdk-source/corekit/NSURLConnection+Fo undationCompletions.m:31:41: error: Foundation/NSHTTPURLResponse.h: No such file or directory
/Users/chris/frothkit-read-only/froth-sdk-source/corekit/NSDateTests.m:12:0 /Users/chris/frothkit-read-only/froth-sdk-source/corekit/NSDateTests.m:12:3 4: error: Foundation/NSPlatform.h: No such file or directory
>> 1) When you say mac deployment is not supported, is it just because
>> it doesn't work out of the box, or is it a huge problem to solve?
>> What is my mac (10.6.3) missing that Froth would need in order to
>> work?
> Their is no technical reason that Froth wont run on mac. My initial
> development efforts had it building and running on Mac via Apache and
> mod_fastcgi. Its really just a matter of resolving all the
> dependancies then setting up apache and fastcgi. I do plan on making
> mac deployments more seamless, however I have a lot on my plate at the
> moment so haven't been able to get to it. Their has been some work
> from another person on this as well. Along with the mod_fastcgi setup
> you would also need to locate your webapp resource either in a served
> folder, or setup apache to include your webApp's 'Static' folder.
> I've also considered integrating Froth with one of the many cocoa http
> server projects, and in the end this may be the best way for local
> deployments. With this approach froth could be integrated into a
> regular mac application, illuminating the need for complicated apache
> configurations.
> Also it may be easier to install lighttpd on mac, as froth has been
> tailored for use with lighttpd. Then install all the other
> dependancies possibly with MacPorts or Fink (See below for
> dependancies).
>> 2) If I can't deploy directly to my Mac, I have a VM running Ubuntu.
>> I understand I can deploy to this but don't find any documentation
>> explaining what I'd need to do. Are you able to outline very briefly
>> what I'd need? I'm pretty comfortable with configuring servers etc so
>> I don't need anything in great detail, more or less a list of
>> dependencies and some basic configuration/environment requirements
>> would suffice.
> Local vm setup is also possible, and probably a quicker short term
> solution for local testing. I just haven't had the time to provide any
> documentation on the process. Some of the steps I know will have to be
> taken for linux vm setup are...
> 1. Use apt-get to install all froth dependancies.
> The following list assumes you are using Ubuntu or a Debian based
> distro, some of the following may already be installed or get
> installed with a previous package. apt-get will inform of any
> additional packages needed for each.
> 2. Once the dependancies are installed, its best to setup ssh on your
> virtual box so you can build and deploy to the machine from xcode. The
> steps to do that can be found here.
> 3 Deploy fmtools and frothkit to your virtual machine from Xcode.
> 3.1 Build and deploy froth framework.
> A. Launch Xcode, then open the FrothKit project.
> B. Expand the 'Targets' section from the Groups & Files source list.
> C. Double click on the 'FrothLinux' target.
> D. Under the "Configuration:" popup, select the 'Deploy'
> configuration.
> E. Scroll to the User-Defined section of the configuration settings.
> F. Under FROTH_HOST, enter the ip address of your local virtual linux
> machine.
> G. Under FROTH_IDENTITY, enter the path to your private key generated
> under step 2. (or double click on the setting, and drag the private
> key to the window)
> H. Close the target settings window.
> F. Select the 'Deploy' target as the active target from the project
> window.
> G. Select 'Build'
> H. It should build with no errors (however their will be lots of
> warnings...)
> 3.1 Build and deploy fmtools
> A. Launch Xcode, then open the FrothKit project.
> B. Expand the 'External Tool Projects' folder from the Groups & Files
> source list.
> C. Double click on the 'fmtool.xcodeproj' to open that project in
> xcode.
> D. Expand the 'Targets' section from the Groups & Files source list.
> E. Double click on the 'fmtool-lighttpd1.4' target.
> F. Scroll to the User-Defined section of the configuration settings.
> G. Under FROTH_HOST, enter the ip address of your local virtual linux
> machine.
> H. Under FROTH_IDENTITY, enter the path to your private key generated
> under step 2. (or double click on the setting, and drag the private
> G. Select 'Build'
> This *should* work, however, let me know and I will correct any
> procedures if this fails.
>> 3) Are you looking for any support for existing web developers coming
>> from other environments?
> Absolutely! It would be great if more developers can get involved with
> Froth.
> Cheers,
> Allan
> -- > To unsubscribe, reply using "remove me" as the subject.
DDXMLElementAdditions/NSURLConnection+FoundationCompletions/etc are
for none mac targets. Looks like their being included with the mac
target for some reason. I'll have a peek and let you know should be
done, once I figure it out.
-Allan
On Apr 17, 7:44 am, Chris Corbyn <ch...@w3style.co.uk> wrote:
> /Users/chris/frothkit-read-only/froth-sdk-source/corekit/NSURLConnection+Fo undationCompletions.m:31:0 /Users/chris/frothkit-read-only/froth-sdk-source/corekit/NSURLConnection+Fo undationCompletions.m:31:41: error: Foundation/NSHTTPURLResponse.h: No such file or directory
> /Users/chris/frothkit-read-only/froth-sdk-source/corekit/NSDateTests.m:12:0 /Users/chris/frothkit-read-only/froth-sdk-source/corekit/NSDateTests.m:12:3 4: error: Foundation/NSPlatform.h: No such file or directory
> Il giorno 16/apr/2010, alle ore 03.16, Allan ha scritto:
> > Chris,
> >> 1) When you say mac deployment is not supported, is it just because
> >> it doesn't work out of the box, or is it a huge problem to solve?
> >> What is my mac (10.6.3) missing that Froth would need in order to
> >> work?
> > Their is no technical reason that Froth wont run on mac. My initial
> > development efforts had it building and running on Mac via Apache and
> > mod_fastcgi. Its really just a matter of resolving all the
> > dependancies then setting up apache and fastcgi. I do plan on making
> > mac deployments more seamless, however I have a lot on my plate at the
> > moment so haven't been able to get to it. Their has been some work
> > from another person on this as well. Along with the mod_fastcgi setup
> > you would also need to locate your webapp resource either in a served
> > folder, or setup apache to include your webApp's 'Static' folder.
> > I've also considered integrating Froth with one of the many cocoa http
> > server projects, and in the end this may be the best way for local
> > deployments. With this approach froth could be integrated into a
> > regular mac application, illuminating the need for complicated apache
> > configurations.
> > Also it may be easier to install lighttpd on mac, as froth has been
> > tailored for use with lighttpd. Then install all the other
> > dependancies possibly with MacPorts or Fink (See below for
> > dependancies).
> >> 2) If I can't deploy directly to my Mac, I have a VM running Ubuntu.
> >> I understand I can deploy to this but don't find any documentation
> >> explaining what I'd need to do. Are you able to outline very briefly
> >> what I'd need? I'm pretty comfortable with configuring servers etc so
> >> I don't need anything in great detail, more or less a list of
> >> dependencies and some basic configuration/environment requirements
> >> would suffice.
> > Local vm setup is also possible, and probably a quicker short term
> > solution for local testing. I just haven't had the time to provide any
> > documentation on the process. Some of the steps I know will have to be
> > taken for linux vm setup are...
> > 1. Use apt-get to install all froth dependancies.
> > The following list assumes you are using Ubuntu or a Debian based
> > distro, some of the following may already be installed or get
> > installed with a previous package. apt-get will inform of any
> > additional packages needed for each.
> > 2. Once the dependancies are installed, its best to setup ssh on your
> > virtual box so you can build and deploy to the machine from xcode. The
> > steps to do that can be found here.
> > 3 Deploy fmtools and frothkit to your virtual machine from Xcode.
> > 3.1 Build and deploy froth framework.
> > A. Launch Xcode, then open the FrothKit project.
> > B. Expand the 'Targets' section from the Groups & Files source list.
> > C. Double click on the 'FrothLinux' target.
> > D. Under the "Configuration:" popup, select the 'Deploy'
> > configuration.
> > E. Scroll to the User-Defined section of the configuration settings.
> > F. Under FROTH_HOST, enter the ip address of your local virtual linux
> > machine.
> > G. Under FROTH_IDENTITY, enter the path to your private key generated
> > under step 2. (or double click on the setting, and drag the private
> > key to the window)
> > H. Close the target settings window.
> > F. Select the 'Deploy' target as the active target from the project
> > window.
> > G. Select 'Build'
> > H. It should build with no errors (however their will be lots of
> > warnings...)
> > 3.1 Build and deploy fmtools
> > A. Launch Xcode, then open the FrothKit project.
> > B. Expand the 'External Tool Projects' folder from the Groups & Files
> > source list.
> > C. Double click on the 'fmtool.xcodeproj' to open that project in
> > xcode.
> > D. Expand the 'Targets' section from the Groups & Files source list.
> > E. Double click on the 'fmtool-lighttpd1.4' target.
> > F. Scroll to the User-Defined section of the configuration settings.
> > G. Under FROTH_HOST, enter the ip address of your local virtual linux
> > machine.
> > H. Under FROTH_IDENTITY, enter the path to your private key generated
> > under step 2. (or double click on the setting, and drag the private
> > G. Select 'Build'
> > This *should* work, however, let me know and I will correct any
> > procedures if this fails.
> >> 3) Are you looking for any support for existing web developers coming
> >> from other environments?
> > Absolutely! It would be great if more developers can get involved with
> > Froth.
> > Cheers,
> > Allan
> > --
> > To unsubscribe, reply using "remove me" as the subject.
