Family
John Cox
Does anyone have thoughts regarding family within the context of recovery?
For me the dilema lyes in the balance between not worrying them and being honest, needing their support and knowing it's not sustainable to relying on their support.
After much delay and unfortunatly embaressment which lead to conflict I am now commuted to NA once a week and I'm seeking one to one counselling.
I feel hope isn't enough to keep me clean from now until the day I die, hopefully of old age surrounded by happy healthy children n gradchildren.
I often feel like I'm being stalked across space and time, I'm never free of the fear of loosing everything..
This is the most imporatant year of my life so far, I get married in May and wanna have a family...,so I need insurance, I need this to get easier.
Coxy
Sent from my iPod
metalface from kent
differant to yours) and hope some of it may be of use.
My Ma and Pa have both passed on,my aunt and uncle,who I currently
live with,have both been in and out of hospital this year-and not with
minor stuff and I find myself having to take care of them more and
more,my older brother is currently more f*cked than I ever was (though
only marginally) and,to be honest-best avoided-he's just trouble and I
really have done everything I can for him! And My younger bro is doing
fine,but he's lived in Hong Kong since the mid-nineties (the sensible
one..the 'White Sheep' of the family),so dont see a great deal of him.
During my long addiction I put them all through 'Hell',in every
way,so my second Sajja at the Wat was to 'Take Care of my Family'.I
wont go into details,but to me that means much more than helping
out,shopping,caring ect.-but thats another story....
"...in the Kingdom of the Blind-The one-eyed man is King"
What I'm trying to say is that really I'm left with no option,but to
'straighten-up',sort things out as best I can and keep things
going.Its something I choose to do with a minimum of
distraction,retain a calm balanced mind as best I can-you can laugh if
you want :) ,and just take things slowly,methodically and operate as
best I can within the Present moment...and all without mentioning the
'B'-Word-howzat!?
I do my best and will continue to do so.
I will NOT EVER let that drug drag me down EVER again-of that I am
certain!!!
Its all in the Psychology,mate,at your stage!! I'm nearly 5 years now
and as I keep saying (and so do you on your better days!)-it does get
easier,slowly-slowly,but easier.
You've got a family and more on the way-your the Boss,mate!! There's
no question of letting them down (let alone yeself).
'Using' is an option you no longer have! Once is enough to screw the
whole thing up,believe!! (I've made that mistake in the past and so
have you).Heroin is not like other addictions,whereby there is a
'culture' ,within Western Treatments that appears to accept that re-
lapse is almost expected (..BOLLOX!).It cant work like that-the
journey out takes too much out of you,it takes too long and it just
doesn't work.
'Smackies' that say they're OK,but just 'dabbling' (how many times
have you heard that?) are merely at the brink of yet another major and
hopeless F*ck-up!!
Stay Positive-and dont let no-one 'Piss on your Carnival'!
..there aint enough of us 'clean-uns',John.You have a duty to set an
example and show them other poor sods it can be done-agreed?
Keep Well,Keep Strong,bro.
Mfk
P.s...The Middle Way is the Only Way.(for me)
Stuart B
The Family...a lot of my early problems after detox
was conflict with my family....trust...they did not trust me and i was
trying so hard to mend the broken bridges....where have you been???
who you been with??? the stare at the eyes...you know that eh!!! that
led to anger from me and then a lot of ear bending my supporters was
done on my part...then things changed the bridges were rebuilt, things
turned on there head..it was me who was now supporting them...like i
knew some secret to living life...i have a big family and we are
close, so calls come from family about talking to niece's, nephew's,
brothers,son, friends of brothers, friends of sister in laws who have
friends who have a son or daughter who are using...oh i gave them your
number is that ok YES was all i would reply early doors...now dont
give out my number til you ask me, now i can say NO i cant do
it...those occassions are rare although at times the time is for
me.Family? Once i started being honest with them, once they started to
realise i was changing, and would ask me first instead of vbeing angry
cause i never said yes now to everything, well the BALANCE was
struck...that took me minutes to type ha ha and a good few yearsin
practice and guess what? its on going.
John N.A. For me it was a good thing. As was counselling.
I dont know how long i will live, the thought of struggling and doing
a white knuckle ride for the next 30-40 years...well f--k that, i
might go in the next 40 mins, or tomorrow, i might get another 50
years, John sometimes it is scary, and on a bad day very scary...seems
a good drink would help sometimes....yep i do think like that at times
although i dont act on it...i use my support...i talk about it...guess
what they normally start talking about? the times they think like that
also, it does pass, i find its good to share that, after all iam
human. Some times its good to keep it in the day....yeah yeah yeah..a
day at a time...dont knock it i dont...it has and does help me....a
day at a time....when i first heard about if thats too much try an
hour....yeah right..these people are f---ing mad...iam too sane for
this lot ha ha ha geez em laughing loud now....A day..an hour...now i
try a half hour....got down to mins....oh oh this works! guess
what.....its now a breath at times and i can do this for 20-30
mins....meditation!!!! ha those nutters knew something!!! Think it
kinda sneaked up on me!!! much like my addiction did...was an expert
in that after 20 years plus....oh yeah that sneaked up on me big time
lol...rambling now..hope you can make sense of this as it makes
perfect sense to me.
John the stalked across space and time thing we discussed a few posts
back....i can only suggest a wee read of them again may be a good
idea. John i cant give out insurances, only my personal experience, of
my recovery. Hope it helps. Take care all.
Stuart
On Jan 7, 2:39 pm, John Cox <johncox2...@ymail.com> wrote:
Audrey Delaney
months. Its been a rough ride but I am on the other end of it (still
recovering) but in great spirits and only little pain at this stage. I have
improved my meditation skills and practiced and benefited immensely during
this time in my life. Things are going great. A special thanks to Brian H.
Vince for their thoughts support and love. To Brian Whelan who has been a
great practical help and also to you John for not forgetting me and sending
me messages. MFK and Stuart to. Then there is Jimmy, thanks for the phone
call from Thailand. and Tommy K, I never got round to that appointment for
the ear probe. I hope I have not forgot anyone I am sorry if I have.
Regarding Recovering and Family. Everyone has a completely different family
experience so you cannot generalize. However I think in any situation I
think its good to be honest to them in admitting your addictions if they do
not know. If they know then share the hope and achievement so far.
Remember they have their own issues and responsibilities in their lives and
it is not always possible both physically and mentally to take another on
board regardless of the love you may feel for that person.
If you have had negative experiences with your family in the past, perhaps
contributing to low self esteem issues, this could leave you in a vulnerable
position of them telling you how you have reached their expectations of
becoming an addict. You do not want to hand your power over to someone who
has a knack of putting you down.
I think relying on support can be a dangerous thing as if its not there as
expected then you feel let down again. NO safety net. It can be unfair to
expect family members to have reached your mind frame at the same time as
you have. We all in different places at different times.
I personally would treat any support from family members as a bonus and not
rely on it as part of my recovery. A beautiful extra if its there and don't
allow it to be hindrance if it is not. Recovery is about you and no one
else.
Here is something that you may find helpful. MOHA I have lived by this rule
for a long time now, though I did not know it had a name or other people
where aware of it until I was looking up articles on meditation and found it
only this week.
I will say good bye and before I leave you with it I also agree that
councelling and support from others who are not emotionally attached will
make you stronger. Remember your relationship is about two people, your
needs and wants and your partners needs and wants. You give and your share
what you can. Its not about your recovery, that's apart of you only.
Love and understanding always Audrey
MOHA DON'T PUT UP WITH PEOPLE WHO PUT YOU DOWN
Did you ever have a relative or so-called friend who consistently said
demeaning and critical things to you? "Are you going out dressed like that?"
"You'll never amount to anything!" "Why don't you go on a diet?" and so on,
and so on. Are you still going through this? If so, why are you letting this
go on? You are having your self-esteem, energy, and spirit be diminished or
extinguished. Even if it is claimed that these comments were being made "for
you own good", if you look at it objectively, you will see that they have
not brought you any benefit and in fact have caused you to suffer.
Understanding this is "Moha".
Technically, Moha translates from Sanskrit as "Delusion". Philosophically
though, it is much more. There are probably billions of people in the world
right now who understand the real meaning of Moha. Because of this, they
lead their lives in a much saner, rational, inner peace-producing manner
than we do in America and other countries where the concept of Moha is
virtually unknown. Basically, it means that you put up with stupid (although
not necessarily unintelligent), mean spirited, or negative people just
because you have some kind of nostalgic connection to them. So, if they
happen to be related to you, have known you for years, work with you, have
the same friends, or whatever, they feel entitled to bring suffering into
your life. Sometimes this comes in the form of physical, mental, emotional
or spiritual direct personal attacks, and sometimes just by their own
ongoing habit of expressing negativity about life and things in general. And
you continue to let them be part of your life. Pretty delusional reaction,
isn't it?
So, now that you know about Moha, you must, for your own well being, cut
these people out of your life. It is very much like the suggestions that AA,
NA, and other 12 step programs make - don't associate with people, places,
or things that will bring you down. It is really very simple. If something
brings you peace, it is "good" and should be encouraged. If something takes
your peace away, it is "bad" and must be eliminated from your life.
Sometimes, because of economic situations, like your job, or due to
relationships, like your in-laws, you must continue your physical contact
with the people who you realize are "bad" to and for you. You must then at
least divorce yourself mentally and emotionally from reacting to their
comments.
As a matter of fact, you can gain from seeing them for the pitiful beings
they are and feel compassion for them. After all, they have to wake up every
morning and spend all day in their own miserable company. But you must never
let them "get under your skin". You owe nothing but compassion to anyone
whose words or actions cause you to suffer. This will free you to create a
life full of those things that you have found to be "good" for you. And you
will live happily ever after
metalface from kent
obviously been using your time away wisely and doing your 'Spiritual
Homework'!!
Full Marks (with Distinction).
Mfk.x
> Sent from my iPod- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Audrey Delaney
my strength back and muscles working etc. So a daily walk is a must.
Though the frozen snow and ice on the paths over here is making that quite
difficult. I am actually wearing socks over my boots as no shoe grips at
all. This is one way not to slip as I did yesterday. Anyway is a walking
meditation done the same way as an ordinary one. I have never done one
before and was looking for some tips from those who have.
Cheers and warmest messages to each and everyone of you.
Audrey
metalface from kent
sort' when it comes to groups an' that(cant really say why??-guess I'm
just 'weird')-I've never had any formal instruction in
Meditation,outside of my own experience and reading.
I know Phra Hans 'promoted' a Walking Meditation (around the Grand
Buddha Circle at TKB),and wished I had been privy to his advice on
this,before his 'passing',but I will say that 'Walking',and lots of it
has/had assisted me no end.
In the early stages of my Heroin recovary,I found it helped to
'temper' and concentrate all them 'mad','mentally-charged' and
uncontrollable thoughts inside my head (..a lot of you guys know
exactly what I mean),as well as,of course building my strength and
health,slowly.I didn't really realise it at the time,but I was of
course,'Meditating',without even realising (quite often with
music).Just by keeping my head down,on an imaginary 'spot',down and a
few feet ahead of me,my breathing rhythmic (which,of course occurs
naturally if you keep the same pace),and at the same time being
surreptitiously 'aware' of anything oncoming-(people,traffic,dog-shit-
whatever),more from the corners of your 'field of vision' and NOT
reacting- and the head clear of thought,which is the ideal enviroment
to do so-This is Meditation!!.I usually keep/kept to a long circuit
which to begin with I'd extend daily or whatever (as it suited).
Later I (and now) I started cycling and doing exaxctly the same
thing,with exactly the same principles and something I try to do with
discipline-I quite often really dont feel like 'slogging' myself up
and around them hills,but I can assure you-I NEVER regret it (once I'm
done)!!-I ALWAYS feel really good for it! Probably as your still very
much in the early stages of recovering from you op/illness,obviously
this is probably irrelevant (to you at present)....there's always the
gym,when you're feeling better and at you own pace.
...having said all of this,I will admit to having gone through one of
my extremely unhealthy,'cant be bothered',,junk-foody,no excercise and
drinking too much (yes,I drink and definately dont condone it!-'judge'
me all you want(any or all of you),but at least I tell the Truth!-
Heroin was my BIG problem,NOT alcohol!-and I can assure you,compared
to the place I was in-I'm doin' just fine!)..-I blame the weather and
the seasonal 'obligations!!-but really there's 'no blame'-just me
being an 'ass-hole' (again)
...I've pulled back now (as I always do),reprimanded meself(!!!),
have had no alcohol at AT ALL for a few days (which I will continue
well into next week and as long as 'social obligation' allow- (..is my
usual excuse!).....maybe even longer,this time.I'm going well out of
my way to eat simply and well,plenty,plenty of water and getting back
into my reading (and I'm a 'documentary-junkie'-cant get enough of
them-allsorts!!) and leading the quiet unassuming life that I find so
rewarding.
....remembe,with Meditation (however you do it), regularity is most
important thing.Meditation is a great 'tool',but it will soon
'blunt',and become useless if it is not oiled,used and respected.
Hope this is of some use to you,Audrey(-dont worry 'bout the weather-
just wear the right clothes!! :)
Metta and Best Wishes (as always)
Mfk
P.s. I think its actually one of the easiest ways TO meditate,and time
and discipline can easilly be controlled by the circuit you set
yourself.
I'd love to know if any of you more experienced 'practioners' out
there agree (or especially disagree) on this as a method-it would be
of use (to me).
Audrey Delaney
concentrating on my breathing, feels good. Cause those thoughts in your head
never stop. So time out can allow them to consume you if you don’t take
control. The breathing technique is great. Otherwise the thinking and
imagination goes to deep. Any time any negative stuff comes into my head I
immediately turn it into something good and don’t let the bad thoughts take
seed. Works for me. I am in a good frame of mind. Even when bad things
happen I have learned to feel the anger or sadness or whatever the
situation. Allow time to Process the feelings and get over it in a couple of
days. In the "old days" I would have been taken over and we all know where
that led. When I found myself with time to think, (in the past) this
actually could be quite a dangerous time as we can head wreck ourselves
with what thoughts are allowed over power us. So I have all that under
control. You are dead right when you say practice and regularity. This
keeps me serviced.
Funny you should mention cycling. That’s my next plan. Though Im not great
on our country roads here. Nor long distances. But I have a bike. Perhaps
just even replace short distances that I would normally do in the car. I
will find a safe place to travel. Enjoying the walking now. Fab woods and
lakes and rivers where I live. Time goes quickly and an hour passes so fast.
I used to only think of walking as a form of exercise which in itself means
the word chore to me, indeed a negative way to look at it. Now its more of a
mental cleansing as well as the physical benefits. I also am drinking so
much more water now pints and pints of it. Just never bothered before.
Don’t honestly know what has come over me. Just more positive about things I
suppose. Have learnt to ignore or be rational about things I cannot control
and deal with and take charge of things I can. Must be my sajja. I took a
new one myself to be a better person physically and mentally. Then I forgot
about it and had the operation. After I started to do all the right things
that I never had the will power or motivation to do before, I remembered
making it. Thus reinforcing my thrust in it again.
I am connecting to my higher force what ever it is and it feels good. I have
conquered my demons and improving all the time. Using all the tools that
have been made available to me.
Warmest regards and thank you
Audrey
-----Original Message-----
From: friends-of-tham...@googlegroups.com
[mailto:friends-of-tham...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of
metalface from kent
Sent: 15 January 2010 22:22
To: Friends of Thamkrabok Monastery
Subject: [FOTM:2610] Re: looking for info on walking meditation
Hi Audrey,hope your slowly gaining strength and recovary and just
wanted to share my thoughts with you concerning 'Walking
Meditation',for what they're worth.
I've never had any formal instruction on Meditation,not being a great
one for formal 'Groups' or anything like that-but I guess I'm just a
bit 'weird' that way and I dont suppose it'll change soon,though I'm
certain it is of benefit to others.So I can only share with you what I
have found useful in my own experience.
Phra Hans,as I remember,had his own instruction on 'Walking
Meditation',around the Grand Buddha Circle at TKB,and something I wish
I'd been privy too before his passing-nevermind.
I found,sometime after my return from TKB (post Heroin-D-tox) that
walking assisted me no end,in 'burning-off' all those
'mental','charged',uncontrollable thoughts-lot of you guys know
exactly what I mean,and of course it assisted in slowly building my
health and strength-which was much needed.
...Just as relevant to you,now,I stuck to a circuit,and increased it
periodically,as it suited.The very action of keeping your head
slightly down,in concentration at a fixed spot a little way ahead of
you,being surreptiously 'aware' of anything on-coming
(traffic,people,dog-shit,whatever) but NOT 'reacting' ,with your
breathing becoming naturally rhythmic with your pace,is a perfect
condition to keep your mind 'clear' and of thought.This is,of course
Simple Meditation (and in the 'classic poise') !!.Its very easy to
discipline,with the time and length of the circuit you set,and I found/
find it very beneficifial-(as well as being a bloody good health
tip,as any GP will tell you-like any 'engine',if you dont give it a
'turn-over',keep the tubes clear and pistons greased and running,it
WILL 'clog-up' and give you problems-human body just the same.)
I have since transplanted exactly the same routine/method to
cycling,which I enjoy very much-but I guess it may be a little early
for your good self for that just yet.
Dont worry 'bout the weather,just wrap up proper and get out there.
...Meditation must be regular,like any 'tool',if it is not used
regular,'oiled' and respected it will rust and blunt and become
useless.
I'd be very interested to hear any of you more experienced practioners
thoughts on this subject,especially if you disagree at any point
(useful for me).
I will admit to having just been through one of my unhealthy,'junk-
foody',apathatic,lazy unhealthy 'stretches',-I blame the weather and
'seasonal obligations',but I guess its just me being an ass-hole (a
real speciality of mine!)
..I've since 'pulled-back' (always do!),going out of my way to eat
well and properly,plenty,plenty clean fresh water (best drink in the
world),NO alcohol AT ALL!, and got myself back into my
quiet,unassuming life of reading (ect...I'm a self-confessed
documentary-junkie!),that I find so rewarding.
Hope of some use,Audrey,
Metta and Best Wishes,
Get and Keep Well.
Mfk
On Jan 14, 8:22 am, "Audrey Delaney" <audreysde...@eircom.net> wrote:
Vince Cullen
In my limited experience walking meditation makes a welcome change from, and complements, sitting practice.
For those people that have not had the pleasure of a 10-day silent retreat at Wat Suan Mokkh, I won't give too much away, other than to say that from about day 8 you are given longer periods to meditate without instruction. So it is up to you to decide how long to sit, stand or walk. For me, it was at these times that walking meditation really 'saved the day'.
The traditional method is to find a clear path of about 20 to 40 paces that you can walk and turn round, walk back and turn round etc. The degree of concentration and mindfulness will vary as instructed by a teacher or decided by the meditator.
There is a very formal guide The Benefits of Walking Meditation on the Access To Insight website.
There is a much simpler 'walking meditation for dummies' video on YouTube.
Also, here is a link to a lesson on walking from the wonderful Vietnamese teacher Thich Nhat Hanh "...practising walking meditation is to practice meditation while you walk".
...just be mindful and happy!
Best wishes to all.
With Metta,
Vince
__________________________________
340
The streams of craving flow everywhere.
The wild creeper of craving
spreads and entangles.
Discerning this creeper with insight,
dig it out.
__________________________________
A DHAMMAPADA for CONTEMPLATION
http://aruno.org//index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=241&Itemid=80
Audrey Delaney
Hi Vince, You seem to be doing a lot of catching up. You are very busy. Just ask if you need help of any kind. I will do what ever I can. Thanks for this below. I am learning and getting so much better by the week. Enjoying it a lot.
Will admit a McDonalds but its was a lesser sin. I got a big Mac and told them not to put the cheese on. Aldo the cookery guro is probably squirming. It was gorgeous..
Great to hear from you Vince and I hope things are going your way. Someday I will get to a retreat.
xxAudrey
--
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metalface from kent
10 piece Family Feast....my Old Aunt gets I piece and 2 portions of
chips...and I get the Rest!...its a 'problem',I know....
...anyway,'back on track' now,despite the weather.
Spring has Sprung (..all but!)..
Best Wishes.
a.
On Feb 4, 11:01 pm, "Audrey Delaney" <audreysde...@eircom.net> wrote:
> Hi Vince, You seem to be doing a lot of catching up. You are very busy.
> Just ask if you need help of any kind. I will do what ever I can. Thanks
> for this below. I am learning and getting so much better by the week.
> Enjoying it a lot.
>
> Will admit a McDonalds but its was a lesser sin. I got a big Mac and told
> them not to put the cheese on. Aldo the cookery guro is probably squirming.
> It was gorgeous..
>
> Great to hear from you Vince and I hope things are going your way. Someday
> I will get to a retreat.
>
> xxAudrey
>
> _____
>
> From: friends-of-tham...@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:friends-of-tham...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Vince
> Cullen
> Sent: 04 February 2010 20:44
> To: friends-of-tham...@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: [FOTM:2644] Re: looking for info on walking meditation
>
> Hi Audrey, Aldo and All.
>
> In my limited experience walking meditation makes a welcome change from, and
> complements, sitting practice.
>
> For those people that have not had the pleasure of a 10-day silent retreat
> at Wat Suan Mokkh, I won't give too much away, other than to say that from
> about day 8 you are given longer periods to meditate without instruction.
> So it is up to you to decide how long to sit, stand or walk. For me, it was
> at these times that walking meditation really 'saved the day'.
>
> The traditional method is to find a clear path of about 20 to 40 paces that
> you can walk and turn round, walk back and turn round etc. The degree of
> concentration and mindfulness will vary as instructed by a teacher or
> decided by the meditator.
>
> There is a very formal guide The Benefits of Walking Meditation
> <http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/authors/silananda/bl137.html> on the
> Access To Insight website.
>
> There is a much simpler 'walking meditation for dummies'
> <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVvBI0s2Cww> video on YouTube.
>
> Also, here is a link to a lesson on walking from the wonderful Vietnamese
> teacher Thich Nhat Hanh <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdO1vZJgUu0>
> "...practising walking meditation is to practice meditation while you walk".
>
> ...just be mindful and happy!
>
> Best wishes to all.
>
> With Metta,
>
> Vince
> __________________________________
> 340
> The streams of craving flow everywhere.
> The wild creeper of craving
> spreads and entangles.
> Discerning this creeper with insight,
> dig it out.
> __________________________________
> A DHAMMAPADA for CONTEMPLATIONhttp://aruno.org//index.php?option=com_content
> <http://aruno.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=241&Itemid=80>
> &task=view&id=241&Itemid=80
>
> --
> The OFFICIAL Thamkrabok Monastery website ishttp://www.thamkrabok-monastery.org
> INDEPENDENT information can be found athttp://www.thamkrabok.net
metalface from kent
On Feb 5, 12:27 pm, metalface from kent <boswelia...@hotmail.co.uk>
wrote:
> > For more options, visit this group athttp://groups.google.com/group/Friends-of-Thamkrabok-Monastery- Hide quoted text -